Alba... after blue
Mick Fournier
news:YDUI3.1791$Y96....@news.rdc2.occa.home.com...
>
> <knis...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:7t12c3$vou$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> > Alba doesn't always mean white.
> > > The only thing that's fairly certain is that green is green... or is
> > it?
> >
> > I questioned someone recently about the "alba" issue and was directed
> > to p.75 of Rebecca Northern's Home Orchid Growing, Forth Ed. This says
> > that, although there was for a while a tendency to call white orchids
> > with purple lips "alba's", albas are, in fact, *all white* with no trace
> > of color. So, technically, *alba* does in fact mean white, although
> > everyone may not use the term correctly.
> >
> > Ok, I am now prepared for some of you experts to jump in :).
> > I do, however, agree with the statements concerning *red* and *green*.
> > Maybe we could have swatch parties for these colors when we're through
> > with *blue*...
> >
> > Karen
> >
> >
> > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> > Before you buy.
>
> Good idea Karen, but red could be dangerous! Green now here's a chance for
> all the novices. *grin* Cheers Wendy
>
>
-----------------------------------------
Karen and Wendy,
Alba is pure form... simple... clean... the essence of an orchid flower
representation. The virgin white gowned bride in a wedding. The highest
perfection of the species.
Phalaenopsis violacea var bowringiana alba "Misty". Awarded a silver medal
at South Florida Orchid Society 1997.
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/viobowalbamisty1.jpg
Phalaenopsis lueddemanniana var pulchra subvar alba. A rare accident of
nature.
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/pulchraalba2.jpg
Rhynchostylis coelestis var alba
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/rhyncoelalba.jpg
Phalaenopsis equestris var alba
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/equalba.jpg
Paphiopedilum FC Puddle (white). Let's talk about how to classify this icon
of a Paph colorwise.
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/fcpuddle1.jpg
Doritis pulcherrima var alba
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/doritisalba.jpg
Cattleya trianaei alba 'Aranka Germaske'
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/trianaeiaranka.jpg
Cattleya mossiae var alba.
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/mossalbah.jpg
Cattleya intermedia var alba plenas
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/interalplh.jpg
Cattleya guttata var alba
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/guttata_alba.jpg
Mick Fournier
HBI, Producer of Fine Orchids in Flask
www.OrchidFlask.com
---------------------------------------------
Al
called anthocyanin that reflects either a purple or red color depending on
the pH in the cell that contains it? Many of the flowers in the pictures
labeled as 'albas' have a yellow reflecting pigment and one or two had some
green reflecting ones.
Beautiful pictures, BTW. I hope some of these are in production.
Eventually somebody is going to ask some questions about flower color
pigments and the answer is going to shoot right over the heads of everybody
with a brain smaller than Aaron Hick's. (including mine). I went in search
of the answer to "What pigments are involved in flower color?" I typed
"Plant pigments" in my search engine after my botany book turned that
question into a university level course. I did find a really nifty link to
a page containing a master set of plant physiology links:
http://hoflink.com/~house/pltphys.html
On it, under a subsection called Structure and Function, I found a few links
to explain why leaves change color in the fall that answered the flower
pigment question more clearly than anything else I found. This one seemed
best to me:
Autumn Leaves: Chemistry
http://scifun.chem.wisc.edu/chemweek/fallcolr/fallcolr.html
I suggest we hold our swatch parties in different locations as we move
through the color spectrum. After the blue party on Maui the greenhouses
there will be pretty much picked clean. And just for the sake of more
swatch parties, I'll agree that there are more than eight colors even in the
crayola palette.
Al
http://www.orchidexchange.com
Mick Fournier wrote in message <7t1f2m$cgq$1...@news.gate.net>...
knis...@my-deja.com
pigment
> called anthocyanin that reflects either a purple or red color
depending on
> the pH in the cell that contains it? Many of the flowers in the
pictures
> labeled as 'albas' have a yellow reflecting pigment and one or two had
some
> green reflecting ones.
> through the color spectrum. After the blue party on Maui the
greenhouses
> there will be pretty much picked clean. And just for the sake of more
> swatch parties, I'll agree that there are more than eight colors even
in the
> crayola palette.
>
> Al
This just in, from what I consider a reliable, expert source, that
some albas can, in fact, be GREEN! Amazing, how complicated "WHITE" is
turning out to be!! I look forward to checking out those web sites and
learning more about the subject.
As to the swatch parties, "roving" is a great idea! Good for the
economy, spreading business around, no? Oh, BTW, I can complicate the
crayola palette as much as need be to keep the swatch parties going ad
infinatum :).
Mick Fournier
Yes, in real life many albas do have a slight tinge of green or yellow in
the throat. For me alba plenas is the "more" perfect creation.
On "lacking" color we're going to be faced with this figure 8 argument , "is
the glass half full of water, or half empty?" Is the flower full of full
color, or empty of full color?
Would you say the first light of creation from whence all was created was
nankeen yellow? Or, would you say it was a white light?
When people die and are shocked back to this plane of life do they say upon
revival, "My God, I saw a bright ball of magenta light encompassing me"....
or do they say "My God, I saw a bright ball of white light encompassing me".
I happen to believe that an alba flower holds all color possibilities within
itself in perfectly balanced amounts as God's white light does. All the
colors in an alba are held in suspension just waiting for one addition of a
color catalyst in a marriage to tip the scales in favor of the new color
instigator... hence my previously mentioned belief that the dark purple lip
(next step past a dark blue lip) as in Pat Brennan's division of Dtps
Kenneth Schubert "Fangtastic Violet" mated onto an alba Phal violacea might
work to produce (a few) very dark concolor offspring in the resulting swarm.
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/kenschub2.jpg
White-light alba orchids are special for me. Some people like floods of
color. I like the white flowers... they seem so serene, peaceful and calm
to me. Now take that desire for full/no color and combine it with the most
favorite orchids for all orchid lovers... Laelia purpurata var alba "Capps"
and Cattleya warscewiczii (gigas) var alba "Firmin Lambeau"... Ahhh.....
perfection!
The marriage of these two species produces LC Callistoglossa "Capp's
Lambeau"... the finest hybrid of all time. Perhaps I should have waited one
more day (to reach full open) to shoot this photo but you get the idea in
this picture:
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/cappslambeau.jpg
The lines are exquisite, the shape is smooth, the form can not be improved
upon, It's large like a real orchid should be...
I like alba orchids, but alas.... perhaps it's just me. I hope other people
like alba flowers.
------------------------
Al <A...@OrchidExchange.com> wrote in message
news:7t2ec6$ae7$1...@autumn.news.rcn.net...
> Isn't an alba plant one that is lacking/suppressing the specific pigment
> called anthocyanin that reflects either a purple or red color depending on
> the pH in the cell that contains it? Many of the flowers in the pictures
> labeled as 'albas' have a yellow reflecting pigment and one or two had
some
> green reflecting ones.
<CLIP>
WNeptune
>> > everyone may not use the term correctly. >>
In this thread on the term "alba", it is of interest that in Den kingianum,
alba is reserved for only those plants proven to be alba by selfing, in which
case all progeny are alba. In the case of white forms of Den kingianum, which
is actually common, and true alba is quite rare, selfing only produces about
15% white forms and the rest are colored forms.
knis...@my-deja.com
>
> I like alba orchids, but alas.... perhaps it's just me. I hope other
people
> like alba flowers.
>
> Mick
> www.OrchidFlask.com
>
Mick,
It's not just you :).
As to the description of that light you mentioned-the one associated
with near death experiences-I've never seen it, so I wouldn't know how
to describe it visually....
...but what are the odds that it tastes like chicken?
P.S. I like white orchids, too, maybe even better than blue ones.
Mick Fournier
And..... might we be lucky enough to see a picture of one of those "real"
alba beauts? I have never seen one.
Mick
---------------------------------
WNeptune <wnep...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19991001152133...@ng-fy1.aol.com...
Prem Subrahmanyam
>
> White-light alba orchids are special for me. Some people like floods of
> color. I like the white flowers... they seem so serene, peaceful and calm
> to me. Now take that desire for full/no color and combine it with the most
> favorite orchids for all orchid lovers... Laelia purpurata var alba "Capps"
> and Cattleya warscewiczii (gigas) var alba "Firmin Lambeau"... Ahhh.....
> perfection!
Well, then, if alba-form orchids are so calming to you, how about
going and staring at one next time you get the hankering to fire
off some half-cocked missive at members of r.g.o. Maybe the calming
effect will help you rethink your actions.
While, there are certain white flowers that I like (many Angraecum
flowers, for instance and white Neofinetia falcata flowers), I must
admit that the fascination with colorless forms of what are normally
brightly colored flowers mystifies me. It's like taking a stark white
canvas and passing that off as "art"...the mixes and swirls of colors
do far more for me than the absence of any color. I will admit, I
kinda like the alba form of Phaius tankervillae, and if I found a
white form of any of our bright pink native terrestrials, I might
dance a little jig. Imagine, on the other hand, what a chore it
has been to located a cultivated colored Encyclia tampensis--everyone
likes growing the albo-labia form. Even more baffling is how the
alba form of Paph. venustum has nearly replaced the dazzlingly
colored form of the same in cultivation...I know of only one
source (at least on the web) for the colored form of venustum,
and they charge an outrageous price for it.
In most cases, the alba form of a colored species is a mutant of
some sort, just like an albino human or animal. While I can
appreciate the rarity of such an occurence, and the general value
we humans attach to anything that's rare (imagine if common pebbles
were all made of gold, would it be so prized?) I don't have to think
it's desirable.
--> Prem
===================================================================
Prem Subrahmanyam <pr...@noblestar.net> or <pr...@nettally.com>
- Animator, programmer, and orchid and fossil nut extraordinaire...
- DNRC Title: Minister of Lightwave 3d Plugin Design Foolishness
- Home - http://www.PremDesign.com
"Insert witticism here..."
WNeptune
And..... might we be lucky enough to see a picture of one of those "real"
alba beauts? I have never seen one.
Mick >>
Actually they are impossible to tell apart, visually. I call all whites"white
form", and reserve alba for those which have been proven.
I'll send you a pic of Den kingianum var albescens 'Lansdown's White' CHM/AOS.
This plant had previously been proven alba in Australia; but note that on
identification as required re AOS for a CHM that it was called var albescens.
Mick Fournier
On the contrary... and this may sound a little corny... but staring at a
white flower helps me to pinpoint my thoughts much more clearly.
I have to disagree with your point on the albino human form as being the
shunned mutant. There are primitive cultures where such oddities were
regaled as minor gods... not so now, but thousands of years ago. Edgar
Winters may have been considered the last minor god in this era.
True about the Encyclia tampensis... you don't see many good colored ones
any more in Florida.
Mick
Mick Fournier
Wilford,
I think it is quite obvious by my website flask catalog that I am not a big
Dendrobium fan... the only Dendrobium I like is kingianum. I do very much
appreciate your picture of the alba form. A very nice gesture for all on
RGO to see.
Den kingianum var albescens 'Lansdown's White' CHM/AOS
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/kingianumalbachm.jpg
For an A to B comparison, click on the very red
Den kingianum "Inferno" AM/AOS
http://www.gate.net/~fourmick/flasks/denkinginferno.jpg
knis...@my-deja.com
I love white flowers! I have been sneered at for loving white
flowers-"I'll bet you like VANILLA ice cream, don't you?" and other such
comments...I think there's something about admiring the subtle beauties
in life. It's not that I don't really like colored orchids, either. To
each his own. (I hate brown and green spotted orchids-and I'll bet I've
just pushed a lot of buttons with that comment :)).
Vive' la differance!
Prem Subrahmanyam
>
> Prem!!!!
>
> I love white flowers! I have been sneered at for loving white
> flowers-"I'll bet you like VANILLA ice cream, don't you?" and other such
> comments...I think there's something about admiring the subtle beauties
> in life. It's not that I don't really like colored orchids, either. To
> each his own. (I hate brown and green spotted orchids-and I'll bet I've
> just pushed a lot of buttons with that comment :)).
> Vive' la differance!
>
I never said I didn't like white flowers...there are many white-
flowered species that I love. It's just the fascination of the
alba form of a species, almost to the exclusion of the "normal"
varieties of the same species that I don't get. Stick an all-green
Paph. venustum next to one with all the swirly tie-dye colors of
the standard form, and you'll see what I mean. The other day, I was
perusing through an acquaintance's orchid collection, and he had this
Epicatt that was a hybrid between the alba form of C. guttata and the
alba form of Enc. tampensis...this was apparently a highly prized
hybrid...I kinda looked at it like "so what?"...green petals and a white
lip...looked sickly to me. Now if you could get a hybrid between C.
guttata var. leopoldii (aka C. leopoldii) and the standard tampensis
that retained the green and brown spotted petals of the leopoldii,
that would rawk, IMHO.
Heh, you just pushed my button...spotted orchids are a particular
passion of mine. I just went wild over my newly acquired (in bud)
C. leopoldii when it flowered...greenish petals heavily spotted in
brownish-red with a deep fuschia lip, and a fragrance that filled
a room. Another favorite of mine is the diminutive Encyclia boothiana,
with (you guessed it) green petals spotted in maroonish brown (it's
also a Florida native, yet another passion of mine). I also love my
Gongora quinquenervis flowers, yellowish spotted in reddish-orange
that resemble little birds in flight...and a fragrance that nearly
fills an entire house (to the chagrin of my smell-sensitive wife).
What's cool about orchids, IMHO, is that many tastes can be satisfied
within the same family of plants. If you were, say, an african violet
fancier, there's a limited range of plant forms to choose from, but with
orchids, we all can say "I love orchids" and all mean very different
things at the same time.
knis...@my-deja.com
I pushed your button in fun :)-you are so right about the wonderful
variety of orchids. Truly something for everyone. I can appreciate the
green/brown spotted varieties, even though I'm not particularly fond of
them.... Funny you should mention African Violets-I got into orchids
AFTER becoming bored with them!
Venger's Orchids
Hurmph. The Judges in Denver obviously aren't impressed with spots.
Milt. Mem. Princess Diana 'Pastel Princess' only garnered a second in
class for the fall show. Thpthpthpthpthp! Thanks to Vigo for help in
coming up with the clonal name :) Thanks also to the Colorado Springs
Orchid Society for taking the plant up for me, as I was unable to.
Suzanne, would you pass that message along? -Rod-
Rod & Susan Venger, Venger's Orchids
http://www.vengers.com/
Current Listing: lis...@vengers.com
Our IRC (Chat info) http://www.vengers.com/page.htm
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