What is with Nintendo?
Ken Clarke
Are they going under like Mattel, Coleco, and Atari?? I see their
games for $9-$25. Very few are over $35 anymore. I can't believe that
new games like Skate or die 2 are only $18 at Electronic Boutique.
Also, everyone says they saw that Nintendo was coming out with the
16 bit Super Famcom in January. A video dealer here says it was in a trade
magazine. If this is even close to being true, why does Nintendo deny
any plans of a U.S.A. version? It seems that they would ad to the rumor so
prospective 16 bitters will not buy a Genesis but instead wait for the
SF. I say the hell with Nintendo, Genesis here I come
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Steve Reiser
Nintendo is probably trying to maintain large sale, posibble also to
sell off all the 8-bit games before unleashing the 16-bit stuff on the
market.
My impression (correct me if I'm wrong!) is that Nintendo is ahead of
all competitors in the diverse amount of software for it's system, but
it's way behind in hardware.
Since Super Famicom is incompatible with the current system, it will
require a lot of software development and fast to keep up with all the
other systems on the market.
Super Famicom will make the 8-bit system obsolete, but is still in a
disadvantaged position with other 16-bit systems due to lack of games.
The current 8-bit system still competitive due to a huge number of games
and good marketing.
1991 should be an interesting year for Nintendo, if they can market the
16-bit system in that year with a fast turnout of new games, they may
hang on. If they drag their feet and 16-bit competitor's crank out new
games fast, then Nintendo will probably be fading fast especially for
new consumers in this market.
Nintendo in '91 - do or die!
Steve
--
Steve Reiser (rei...@pmafire.UUCP or ...!uunet!pmafire!reiser)
Terrence A. Bygte
>Also, everyone says they saw that Nintendo was coming out with the
>16 bit Super Famcom in January. A video dealer here says it was in a trade
>magazine.
What is a Nintendo Famcom? I am only familar with the NES box.
Thanks.
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Terrence A. Bygate 803-791-6826 |
NCR E&M Columbia - NST Module Development| After all, even a fool may be thought
<terry....@Columbia.NCR.COM> | wise and intelligent if he stays
<...uunet!ncrlnk!ncrcae!terry.bygate> | quiet and keeps his mouth shut.
Eric Postpischil (Always mount a scratch monkey.)
(Ken Clarke) writes:
>Subject: What is with Nintendo?
. . .
>Are they going under like Mattel, Coleco, and Atari?? I see their
>games for $9-$25. Very few are over $35 anymore. I can't believe that
>new games like Skate or die 2 are only $18 at Electronic Boutique.
Huh? Is that really representative of the market in Cleveland? It is not the
case in New Hampshire or the Boston area. Several stores are carrying games
priced around $20, but these are older games. Child World was selling games off
more cheaply, but they have entered bankruptcy proceedings and are not
representative of the rest of the market.
I think the appearance of lower-priced games just indicates the pipeline is
full. Nintendo games essentially created a new market, and demand exceeded
supply by a large margin for a while. Now the market is filling, and lower
prices are coming out the other end. This isn't any sign of ill health for
Nintendo, just normal market development.
>Also, everyone says they saw that Nintendo was coming out with the
>16 bit Super Famcom in January. A video dealer here says it was in a trade
>magazine. If this is even close to being true, why does Nintendo deny
>any plans of a U.S.A. version? It seems that they would ad to the rumor so
>prospective 16 bitters will not buy a Genesis but instead wait for the
>SF. I say the hell with Nintendo, Genesis here I come
Nintendo does not deny plans of a US version. I don't think they have anything
to worry about in the 16-bit field. That's because Sega and NEC aren't really
taking advantage of their position -- they've got some flashy games, but they
haven't really developed quality or depth in the GAME play rather than the
GRAPHICS. There is more to a game than slick appearance, and Nintendo still has
the advantage in that area -- their game selection/variety and quality are ahead
of everybody else.
I would not be quick to jump ship from Nintendo to Genesis. To NEC, maybe, but
not Genesis -- think about what Sega did with the Sega Master System. As soon
as the Genesis was out, supported dropped radically for the SMS, and it has
never recovered. Sega abandoned its Master System customers and has produced
only a few lame games for the SMS since the Genesis came out. That's not a
company I would trust.
-- edp (Eric Postpischil)
"Always mount a scratch monkey."
e...@jareth.enet.dec.com
Jim Omura
>In article <901219055...@cwns2.INS.CWRU.Edu>, af...@cleveland.Freenet.Edu
>(Ken Clarke) writes:
>
>>Subject: What is with Nintendo?
>. . .
>>Are they going under like Mattel, Coleco, and Atari?? I see their
>>games for $9-$25. Very few are over $35 anymore. I can't believe that
>>new games like Skate or die 2 are only $18 at Electronic Boutique.
First, let me say that the information that I received when
I asked about the current situation with "Atari 8 bit technology"
is that it seems that only the 8 bit *computers* (ie things they
are calling computers) are defunct. It seems that both the 2600
and the 7800 are still current products. As for Mattel, it's a
bit more complex. Intellivision spun off and was marketted for a
while (confirmed because I saw them), but lately I haven't seen
any, so I *assume* they are finally out-of-production. Mattel,
of course, are *now* involved with Nintendo, so it's hard to say that
"Mattel is dead" or even out of the videogame market. Coleco on
the otherhand seems to be completely dead to the videogame market --
for now. But with nothing in the way of real money making toys
since the Cabbage Patch dolls best years, you never know. Certainly
a better videogame that would have been upgrade compatible with
the Colecovision was possible *even at the time they pulled out*.
Furthermore, there's a wealth of games that could easily be ported
from the Sega Master System and MSX2 worlds if they wanted to make
a come back.
...
>I think the appearance of lower-priced games just indicates the pipeline is
>full. Nintendo games essentially created a new market, and demand exceeded
>supply by a large margin for a while. Now the market is filling, and lower
>prices are coming out the other end. This isn't any sign of ill health for
>Nintendo, just normal market development.
Overall I agree with this, except it's an over simplification
of what's going on. The market is re-fragmentizing. Ie., Nintendo's
domination is diminishing just as Atari's did.
>>Also, everyone says they saw that Nintendo was coming out with the
>>16 bit Super Famcom in January. A video dealer here says it was in a trade
>>magazine. If this is even close to being true, why does Nintendo deny
>>any plans of a U.S.A. version? It seems that they would ad to the rumor so
I have not heard any recent denials of a US version. To the
contrary, I have heard rumoured prices offered, but not many companies
willing to buy in at the current rates. Nintendo is simply pricing
the Famicom out of scale with the expectations of the people who would
be importing the machines. This is most likely because they are
charging "what the market will bear" *in Japan*. The Japanese market
is more willing to pay high prices for new technology than we are
in North America. As such, a person with no current video game will
be able to "get into" Sega Genesis for about $200.00 US and even have
both Sega 8 bit and Genesis for under $300.00, but to have Nintendo
8 bit and Super Famicom looks like it'll cost more like $500.00 US.
>>prospective 16 bitters will not buy a Genesis but instead wait for the
>>SF. I say the hell with Nintendo, Genesis here I come
>
>Nintendo does not deny plans of a US version. I don't think they have anything
>to worry about in the 16-bit field. That's because Sega and NEC aren't really
>taking advantage of their position -- they've got some flashy games, but they
>haven't really developed quality or depth in the GAME play rather than the
>GRAPHICS. There is more to a game than slick appearance, and Nintendo still has
Well this is utter nonsense and insulting to the people on the
Net. I don't think we're quite as stupid as the people you seem
to be used to communicating with. The Genesis has many excellent
games. Nintendo has no superiority in the area of game play at
all. The selection has pretty much proven to be a crock because,
as with the Atari 2600, the vast majority of games have little
more to offer than cosmetic changes. So what does that really
leave? Well, adventure games, which are better played on "real
computers" and "gaming environment", which boils down to music
and graphics, and yes, the *minor* variations from scene to scene
which give the illusion of variety within a game. The last is
mainly limited by the bits-per-cartridge, and yes, a Nintendo
or a Sega Master System will keep up with a Genesis for the most
part anyway, but as most people who have had access to the PC-Engines
and Genesis machines over the last year will tell you, the superiority
of the graphics and sound of the latter two technologies give a
rich gaming environment that adds to enjoyment appreciably. This
year will see the frutition of the investment in these advanced
machines. The range of games available in North America (English
versions) of the latest games in Japan are so much better than
Nintendo that most people who have more than 1 system tend to put
aside the Nintendos. That's not to say that Nintendo or even 8 bit
Ataris will disappear. To the contrary, Sega has shown that after
the major push to "ramp up" the Genesis, they have *not* abandonned
the 8 bit world and have returned with some major new titles,
and similarly, the Atari 2600 and 7800 seem to be continuing efforts
(though I expect the 2600 may *finally* be dropped now that Sega
is going after it with the new Master System II).
>I would not be quick to jump ship from Nintendo to Genesis. To NEC, maybe, but
>not Genesis -- think about what Sega did with the Sega Master System. As soon
>as the Genesis was out, supported dropped radically for the SMS, and it has
>never recovered. Sega abandoned its Master System customers and has produced
>only a few lame games for the SMS since the Genesis came out. That's not a
>company I would trust.
This is pretty much proven wrong. It took a major effort to
ramp up the Genesis with a good array of titles, and that took a
couple of years of intensive development effort which focussed
the bulk of their programmers. Now it seems that with the Genesis
clearly dominating the 16 bit world, Sega has spread their efforts
out and returned the support to the Master System II with major
titles including Joe Montana Football and a version of Ghosts n Ghouls
which writers are saying rivals the 16 bit versions, and many other.
I think we're seeing the major companies realizing the value in
having a range of "upward compatible" machines to cover a range
of markets. Sega, and the others realize that you have a lot of
different types of potential game players who are willing to spend
different amounts of money and have different levels of expectations
and preferences. Sega's market break down seems to be something
like this:
Top Level: Genesis with CD-ROM (people willing to pay big bucks forr
the best)
Middle Level: Genesis, alone or w/8 bit adaptor (people willing to
spend moderate amounts but who want really good games
but balanced against a "reasonable budget". This
is the biggest profit market in North America right
now because it's the highest volume).
Low Level: Master System II (people who are not gamers particularly
and are only willing to spend amounts comparable to
general toys -- curiosity buyers. This is *my* group.
I may not play a videogame of *any* type for up to
6 months running!
NEC, Nintendo and Atari are similarly spread out, but only NEC
and Sega have the "right mix" of products currently on the market.
The problem with Nintendo is that the current Entertainment System
and cartridge design are not well suited for the future. They can't
"re-focus" the target market of the Entertainment System without
shrinking the cartridge in particular, or bringing out new adaptors
to take a cheaper cartridge design. Atari on the other hand has
run off in too many directions with too small a differentiation in
power between similar products. The 7800 system is powerwise, too
close to a potential "tabletop Lynx" without being compatible. To
save the situation "gracefully" they'd have to bring out a combined
"tabletop Lynx & 7800". This is probably technically feasible, but
the cost would be touchy.
NEC and Sega machine lineups have problems too, but not as big
as Nintendo or Atari.
--
Jim Omura, 2A King George's Drive, Toronto, (416) 652-3880
lsuc!jimomura
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