Crap Bandicoot - A complete gameplay failure...
The Mario Monks
We, The forthright Mario Monks, have just finished an extensive
playtesting of The PSX’s only hope of having a good game - Crash
Bandicoot. Crash has failed miserably. The game has many problems, and
being the unbiased monks that we are, we present Intelligent Gamer who
sums up the problems with Crash best in Issue 5 p. 58:
"...The odd camera angle, however, often makes Crash more difficult
than it needs to be;..."
"...The ability to ‘kill’ power-ups and items is a bothersome
feature given a number of the game’s situations..."
"...the ability to save only at the end of the bonus levels would be
fine if they didn’t become increasingly difficult to survive..."
"...every handful of levels is punctuated with an enormously easy
and unoriginal boss..."
As you can plainly see, The Mario Monks point of view has been
proven 100% correct by an industry publication. The review goes on to
state items such as; "scrolling can become confusing at times",
"lackluster music", and "extremely generic platform gameplay". These are
all flaws we knew would occur, as the SONY brand name ensures poor game
quality. You all didn’t actually expect Crap Bandicoot to be good enough
to challenge the greatest game ever created. It was made by Naughty "we
hope you haven’t seen Way of the Warrior" Dog for Mario’s sake.
We have also been witness to a lot of whining from you 32-bit
heathens about how much 32-bit wastes of plastic "games" have to have 600+
megabytes of storage. For what we ask? "Lackluster" music. If thats what
CDs are used for then you can have’em! The ONLY medium for real games is
the cart format. Crash proves that.
But, the most fascinating aspect of this review is the statement;
"Crash’s flaws pretty much end at the GAMEPLAY..." Once again we are
right. It is obvious that there will never be a good 32-bit title because
all of you 32-bit corpses have no clue on what makes a good game. Let us
state it for you in one simple word: GAMEPLAY. Something that Crap
Bandicoot clearly lacks. And something the greatest game ever created has
revolutionized. So, as we all enter a new dawn of video gaming, we have
one clear leader, our messiah Mario. He is the only one who will be able
to part the waters of this 32-bit pixely fog-covered polygon FMV crap and
lead us to the promised land; the land of Nintendo64 and true gameplay. It
is difficult being the guardians of higher video game culture. May Mario
bless you all on Sept. 29!
The Mario Monks
"Mario64 made Crash look like a barrel of sh*t!" - Drago
You Wish
On 24 Sep 1996 04:40:41 GMT, The Mario Monks <Wor...@theway.ofmario>
wrote:
> We, The forthright Mario Monks, have just finished an extensive
>playtesting of The PSX’s only hope of having a good game - Crash
>Bandicoot. Crash has failed miserably. The game has many problems, and
>being the unbiased monks that we are, we present Intelligent Gamer who
>sums up the problems with Crash best in Issue 5 p. 58:
>
> "...The odd camera angle, however, often makes Crash more difficult
>than it needs to be;..."
I have not found this to be a problem EVER and I'm 1 stage from the
end.
>
> "...The ability to ‘kill’ power-ups and items is a bothersome
>feature given a number of the game’s situations..."
If your a FUCKING IDIOT - this MIGHT BE a problem!
>
> "...the ability to save only at the end of the bonus levels would be
>fine if they didn’t become increasingly difficult to survive..."
If your a FUCKING IDIOT - this might be a problem! If you could just
hit the start button and SAVE - it would make it too easy. But being
the Smario GOD that you are - I'm sure Crash was a peice of cake for
you. Then again - have you even PLAYED the game?
>
> "...every handful of levels is punctuated with an enormously easy
>and unoriginal boss..."
The bosses were pretty original in my opinion. Atleast each boss was
COMPLETELY different.
>
> As you can plainly see, The Mario Monks point of view has been
mislead by the Juggernaut NinSmindo
> We have also been witness to a lot of whining from you 32-bit
>heathens about how much 32-bit wastes of plastic "games" have to have 600+
>megabytes of storage. For what we ask? "Lackluster" music. If thats what
>CDs are used for then you can have’em! The ONLY medium for real games is
>the cart format. Crash proves that.
Get real , buy a PSX - not some shit CART Box with a NinSmindo sticker
on it!
I'll be FIRST in line to buy my Nintendo64 - along with my $80 games -
FUCKING NOT!!
Freedom Baby - Gotta Love It!
Gabe White
First let me say that I like Crash a lot. There are some problems, though.
You Wish (you...@freedom.com) wrote:
: On 24 Sep 1996 04:40:41 GMT, The Mario Monks <Wor...@theway.ofmario>
: wrote:
: > "...The odd camera angle, however, often makes Crash more difficult
: >than it needs to be;..."
: I have not found this to be a problem EVER and I'm 1 stage from the
: end.
A couple stages, like High Road, and Road to Nowhere, would be a LOT
easier if they were side view... Many places in the game would be easier
if you could change views, as you can in Mario 64.
: > "...The ability to ‘kill’ power-ups and items is a bothersome
: >feature given a number of the game’s situations..."
: If your a F*CKING IDIOT - this MIGHT BE a problem!
I didn't find this a big problem, either. It's not like 1-ups are scarce
or anything..
: > "...the ability to save only at the end of the bonus levels would be
: >fine if they didn’t become increasingly difficult to survive..."
: If your a F*CKING IDIOT - this might be a problem! If you could just
: hit the start button and SAVE - it would make it too easy. But being
: the Smario GOD that you are - I'm sure Crash was a peice of cake for
: you. Then again - have you even PLAYED the game?
I thought a normal save feature would of made the game a little more fun.
Face it, it's not fun continue and have to play the same levels again. It
does make the game a bit harder, though.
: > "...every handful of levels is punctuated with an enormously easy
: >and unoriginal boss..."
: The bosses were pretty original in my opinion. Atleast each boss was
: COMPLETELY different.
Maybe original... But, uh... They were VERY easy. Even the last boss was
insanely easy.
: > We have also been witness to a lot of whining from you 32-bit
: >heathens about how much 32-bit wastes of plastic "games" have to have 600+
: >megabytes of storage. For what we ask? "Lackluster" music. If thats what
: >CDs are used for then you can have’em! The ONLY medium for real games is
: >the cart format. Crash proves that.
: Get real , buy a PSX - not some sh*t CART Box with a NinSmindo sticker
: on it!
: I'll be FIRST in line to buy my Nintendo64 - along with my $80 games -
: F*CKING NOT!!
Grow up. Both systems are great. Nintendo just happens to have a lot of
games that I like. And PSX doesn't.
--
"I don't mind if you don't like my manners. I don't like them myself.
They're pretty bad. I grieve over them on long winter evenings."
-Philip Marlowe, The Big Sleep
David Blume
Gabe White wrote:
> A couple stages, like High Road, and Road to Nowhere, would be a LOT
> easier if they were side view... Many places in the game would be easier
> if you could change views, as you can in Mario 64.
True. The game would also be a LOT easier if it didn't have enemies and
obstacles.
The view perspective is an element of gameplay in Crash. So is the
save feature. I'm not a hard core game player, and so far, nothing's
been too frustrating yet. (I'm mid-way into the third island, but I only
bothered to collect 3 white gems on the first island.)
--David
Matt White
You Wish (you...@freedom.com) wrote:
: If your a FUCKING IDIOT - this might be a problem! If you could just
: hit the start button and SAVE - it would make it too easy. But being
: the Smario GOD that you are - I'm sure Crash was a peice of cake for
: you. Then again - have you even PLAYED the game?
I have beaten both games-- and I can testify that Mario 64 has more
depth, more secrets, and is more difficult. Crash is a cool game in its
own respect, but it just doesn't stand up to Mario 64.
: The bosses were pretty original in my opinion. Atleast each boss was
: COMPLETELY different.
So what if they were completely different-- they were generally
unorigional and VERY easy to beat.
: Freedom Baby - Gotta Love It!
Uh, hehe... Then why do you insist Crash is better than M64? Mario 64
gives you freedom, baby! Gotta love it! You know what Crash gives you? Uh,
well, not much.
--
Matt White
----------->
"Give me liberty, or give me warm Pepsi."
<-----------
Fred Bliss
On 24 Sep 1996 11:12:31 -0400, gwh...@freenet.columbus.oh.us (Gabe
White) wrote:
>: > "...every handful of levels is punctuated with an enormously easy
>: >and unoriginal boss..."
>
>: COMPLETELY different.
>
>insanely easy.
Heh...and BOWSER was easy? <g>
Gabe White
David Blume (dbl...@pnclsys.com) wrote:
Oh, I'm not saying the game is too hard (actually, if anything, it's too
easy)... I just wish they'd rely on something other than camera views and
a strange save feature for challenge.
Gabe White
Fred Bliss (sh...@bbs.iaonline.com) wrote:
: On 24 Sep 1996 11:12:31 -0400, gwh...@freenet.columbus.oh.us (Gabe
The final Bowser is actually kind of hard.
Wor...@theway.ofmario
> We, The forthright Mario Monks, have just finished an extensive
>playtesting of The PSX’s only hope of having a good game - Crash
>Bandicoot. Crash has failed miserably. The game has many problems, and
>being the unbiased monks that we are, we present Intelligent Gamer who
>sums up the problems with Crash best in Issue 5 p. 58:
>
>than it needs to be;..."
>
>feature given a number of the game’s situations..."
>
>fine if they didn’t become increasingly difficult to survive..."
>
>and unoriginal boss..."
>
>state items such as; "scrolling can become confusing at times",
>"lackluster music", and "extremely generic platform gameplay". These are
>all flaws we knew would occur, as the SONY brand name ensures poor game
>quality. You all didn’t actually expect Crap Bandicoot to be good enough
>to challenge the greatest game ever created. It was made by Naughty "we
>hope you haven’t seen Way of the Warrior" Dog for Mario’s sake.
>heathens about how much 32-bit wastes of plastic "games" have to have 600+
>megabytes of storage. For what we ask? "Lackluster" music. If thats what
>CDs are used for then you can have’em! The ONLY medium for real games is
>the cart format. Crash proves that.
>"Crash’s flaws pretty much end at the GAMEPLAY..." Once again we are
>right. It is obvious that there will never be a good 32-bit title because
>all of you 32-bit corpses have no clue on what makes a good game. Let us
>state it for you in one simple word: GAMEPLAY. Something that Crap
>Bandicoot clearly lacks. And something the greatest game ever created has
>revolutionized. So, as we all enter a new dawn of video gaming, we have
>one clear leader, our messiah Mario. He is the only one who will be able
>to part the waters of this 32-bit pixely fog-covered polygon FMV crap and
>lead us to the promised land; the land of Nintendo64 and true gameplay. It
>is difficult being the guardians of higher video game culture. May Mario
>bless you all on Sept. 29!
One other thing....all of you PSX users out there who havent been
enlightened can lick my shoes and rub my feet because We The Mario
Monks are much better than all of YOU. Our mother was a human, while
your mother was the son of a motherless goat! You can eat all the
breath mints you want but you will still SUCK SHIT! We also enjoy the
fact that while you are busy jacking off/playing PSX we are busy
jacking off/playing Super mario bros 2. So suck our bottom, you are
the wretched and the weak while we are the better and the unbelievably
wise and wonderful. May Mario bless your PSX!
Matt White
Wor...@theway.ofmario wrote:
: One other thing....all of you PSX users out there who havent been
: enlightened can lick my shoes and rub my feet because We The Mario
: Monks are much better than all of YOU. Our mother was a human, while
: your mother was the son of a motherless goat! You can eat all the
: breath mints you want but you will still SUCK SHIT! We also enjoy the
: fact that while you are busy jacking off/playing PSX we are busy
: jacking off/playing Super mario bros 2. So suck our bottom, you are
: the wretched and the weak while we are the better and the unbelievably
: wise and wonderful. May Mario bless your PSX!
I smell an imposter!!
KomoDath
Gabe White wrote:
>snip<
>
> : F*CKING NOT!!
>
> Grow up. Both systems are great. Nintendo just happens to have a lot of
> games that I like. And PSX doesn't.
>
"Why, the same thing we do every night, Pinky."-Brain
Fred Bliss
On 24 Sep 1996 16:20:50 -0400, gwh...@freenet.columbus.oh.us (Gabe
White) wrote:
>: Heh...and BOWSER was easy? <g>
>
> The final Bowser is actually kind of hard.
Nah, I found him to be pretty easy. What I've found lately in games
is that the bosses seem to be -so- easy. The only game I've recently
played (within the last few months) that had some -hard- bosses was
Time Commando. But what I've found is that hard bosses tend to
irritate me. For instance, say you spend 30 minutes on a level.
You're thinking to yourself, "Yes! I've almost beaten the level!"
Then you see this huge boss, and you've got only a few pieces of
energy left. So you take a deep breath, and attack him. Seconds
later, you're dead. So you just wasted all that time on the
incredibly hard level, only to die to a cheap boss. It's
disappointing. So, what I've been trying to say - I prefer bosses to
be slightly easy, unless they have their own stage (a la crash, etc).
Anyone agree with me here? :)
-Fred Bliss-
-sh...@hotmail.com-
The Mario Monks
>: One other thing....all of you PSX users out there who havent been
>: enlightened can lick my shoes and rub my feet because We The Mario
>: Monks are much better than all of YOU. Our mother was a human, while
>: your mother was the son of a motherless goat! You can eat all the
>: breath mints you want but you will still SUCK SHIT! We also enjoy the
>: fact that while you are busy jacking off/playing PSX we are busy
>: jacking off/playing Super mario bros 2. So suck our bottom, you are
>: the wretched and the weak while we are the better and the unbelievably
wise and wonderful. May Mario bless your PSX!
We, The real Mario Monks, are honoured that there are gamers out
there who are willing to join us in our holy crusade to cleanse the video
gaming world from this sub-standard 32-bit gaming rash, but please do it
without the mindless vulgarity and ignorance. It will only hinder our
cause. May Mario bless you all on Sept. 29!
The Mario Monks
Siegfried
>One other thing....all of you PSX users out there who havent been
>enlightened can lick my shoes and rub my feet because We The Mario
>Monks are much better than all of YOU. Our mother was a human, while
>your mother was the son of a motherless goat! You can eat all the
>breath mints you want but you will still SUCK SHIT! We also enjoy the
>fact that while you are busy jacking off/playing PSX we are busy
>jacking off/playing Super mario bros 2. So suck our bottom, you are
>the wretched and the weak while we are the better and the unbelievably
>wise and wonderful. May Mario bless your PSX!
Please, don't pretend to be the Mario Monks!
(Notice, observers, that this message wasn't posted to cabernet. The REAL
Mario Monks post on cabernet.)
Brandon Fisher
> We, The real Mario Monks, are honoured that there are gamers out
> there who are willing to join us in our holy crusade to cleanse the video
> gaming world from this sub-standard 32-bit gaming rash, but please do it
> without the mindless vulgarity and ignorance. It will only hinder our
> cause. May Mario bless you all on Sept. 29!
>
> The Mario Monks
Yeah, just do it with the ignorance from now on!
>
>
Aidix
The Mario Monks wrote:
>
> We, The forthright Mario Monks, have just finished an extensive
> playtesting of The PSX’s only hope of having a good game - Crash
> We have also been witness to a lot of whining from you 32-bit
> heathens about how much 32-bit wastes of plastic "games" have to have 600+
> megabytes of storage. For what we ask? "Lackluster" music. If thats what
> all of you 32-bit corpses have no clue on what makes a good game. Let we have
> one clear leader, our messiah Mario. He is the only one who will be able
> to part the waters of this 32-bit pixely fog-covered polygon FMV crap and
> lead us to the promised land; the land of Nintendo64 and true gameplay. It
SOme people really are stupid. THE N^$ I mean n64 is nOt a 64 bit
machine. If Nintendo were smart enough to bring us a 64 bit machine
they would also have the necessary IQ to make it a CD based system.
-The average Neat looking Hi-res picture is 500Kb - Were talking BYTES
not bits. You know why Nintendo uses bits for their crappy cart based
systems? Bcoz 8 Mbyte sounds like a loada crap.
-The average 16Bit piece of computer music(FT2) is al least 1 Mbyte
-The average Saturn game has loadsa nice piccies and even more
great music.
This would never fit in 8megs.
I heard some lamers talking crap like "The Saturn and/or PSX can't
handle games(?) like Mario8 (Yes 8) Bcoz they would need constant
reloading blablabla....." Geez.... Mario8 is 8 megz. The my Saturn has
2.5 MegabYtes internal memory. Since Mario8 has about 6 levels and 8div6
is 1.2(MB) I can't see why not.
But... Let's not forget that the N32 is a kiddy system.
The REAL 32 bit CD systems are for the more mature gamers.
Besides, you stupid Mario Goons wouldn't even know where to put the
CD.
Aidix
Crisis
(Part of what) Aidix wrote:
> SOme people really are stupid. THE N^$ I mean n64 is nOt a 64 bit
> machine. If Nintendo were smart enough to bring us a 64 bit machine
> they would also have the necessary IQ to make it a CD based system.
> The REAL 32 bit CD systems are for the more mature gamers.
> Besides, you stupid Mario Goons wouldn't even know where to put the
> CD.
Okay, okay, carts SUCK!!! THERE! I SAID IT!!! CARTS ***SUCK!!!**** CDs are
BETTER! If it weren't for load time, carts would be WORTHLESS!!! With that
out of the way, let's get to parts of this post that bear resembelence to
rotting beef carcasses...First, let me say something, and while I'm beating
a dead horse, so are you, so why shouldn't I? The N64 is NOT a kiddy system!
It may have overly cutesy games (Kirby's air ride comes to mind), but call
Doom 64 a kiddy game and I will lose all respect for you.
/ |\ | / | / "I find life a lot easier the lower I keep everyone's
\ |\ | / | / expectations." -Calvin and Hobbes
Hanson
you...@freedom.com (You Wish) wrote:
>On 24 Sep 1996 04:40:41 GMT, The Mario Monks <Wor...@theway.ofmario>
>wrote:
>
>> We, The forthright Mario Monks, have just finished an extensive
>>playtesting of The PSX’s only hope of having a good game - Crash
>>Bandicoot. Crash has failed miserably. The game has many problems, and
>>being the unbiased monks that we are, we present Intelligent Gamer who
>>sums up the problems with Crash best in Issue 5 p. 58:
>>
>> "...The odd camera angle, however, often makes Crash more difficult
>>than it needs to be;..."
>
>I have not found this to be a problem EVER and I'm 1 stage from the
>end.
>>
>> "...The ability to ‘kill’ power-ups and items is a bothersome
>>feature given a number of the game’s situations..."
>
>If your a FUCKING IDIOT - this MIGHT BE a problem!
>>
>> "...the ability to save only at the end of the bonus levels would be
>>fine if they didn’t become increasingly difficult to survive..."
>
>If your a FUCKING IDIOT - this might be a problem! If you could just
>hit the start button and SAVE - it would make it too easy. But being
>the Smario GOD that you are - I'm sure Crash was a peice of cake for
>you. Then again - have you even PLAYED the game?
I'm pretty sure that the IG reviewer played the game :-)
>> "...every handful of levels is punctuated with an enormously easy
>>and unoriginal boss..."
>
>The bosses were pretty original in my opinion. Atleast each boss was
>COMPLETELY different.
I actually pretty funny that you're so incensed at the Monks that you
fail to realize that you're cursing out IG for their review comments.
I'm sure they were taken out of context, but really...
Hanson
"Leave the gun. Take the cannoli"
- Clemenza
Heathman
I know that the N64 is not a 64 bit machine. I read a magazine where
they had an interview from silicon graphics. He said it was 128 bit! Ha!
In your face playstation lover!! Eat it!!! You are an idiot!!! You suck
your moms dick!!! Have you played the N64!!! I have and crash bandicoot
was right beside it. Crash looked so primitive beside mario it was
pathetic!!! You playstation lovers are idiots. That goes for saturn lovers
too!
> Crisis <jsp...@pacbell.net> wrote in article
<3248EF...@pacbell.net>...
Ryan
Aidix wrote:
> SOme people really are stupid. THE N^$ I mean n64 is nOt a 64 bit
> machine. If Nintendo were smart enough to bring us a 64 bit machine
> they would also have the necessary IQ to make it a CD based system.
> not bits. You know why Nintendo uses bits for their crappy cart based
> systems? Bcoz 8 Mbyte sounds like a loada crap.
> -The average 16Bit piece of computer music(FT2) is al least 1 Mbyte
> -The average Saturn game has loadsa nice piccies and even more
> great music.
> This would never fit in 8megs.
> I heard some lamers talking crap like "The Saturn and/or PSX can't
> handle games(?) like Mario8 (Yes 8) Bcoz they would need constant
> reloading blablabla....." Geez.... Mario8 is 8 megz. The my Saturn has
> 2.5 MegabYtes internal memory. Since Mario8 has about 6 levels and 8div6
> is 1.2(MB) I can't see why not.
>
> The REAL 32 bit CD systems are for the more mature gamers.
> Besides, you stupid Mario Goons wouldn't even know where to put the
> CD.
hmmm... I have a list of the next 162 games for the PSX which will be
coming out in the next 4 months and guess what, out of those 162 games,
TEN of them are actually GOOD. Face it... Sony is just coming out with
garbage. I'm a PSX owner and only have 4 games. WHY? Cause all of the
games suck! There are exceptions but Sony is just going overboard
flooding the market with all of this garbage. You might ask: "where
did you get that list of 162 games??". Well, I got it from Electronics
Boutique. Another thing. Why do you think N64 games are childish and
silly? Do you find Mortal Kombat Trilogy childish?? How about Killer
Instinct Gold, War Gods, Castlevania 64, or Legend of Zelda 64?? Are
they also childish?? if they are, I might have to look up the
definition of "Child(ish)" in the dictionary. I can tell by the quality
of your message that you must be no older than 15. Pathetic.
Inexperienced poor little boy.
Crisis
Heathman wrote:
>
> I know that the N64 is not a 64 bit machine. I read a magazine where
> they had an interview from silicon graphics. He said it was 128 bit! Ha!
> In your face playstation lover!! Eat it!!! You are an idiot!!! You suck
> your moms dick!!! Have you played the N64!!! I have and crash bandicoot
> was right beside it. Crash looked so primitive beside mario it was
> pathetic!!! You playstation lovers are idiots. That goes for saturn lovers
> too!
talking to me, why wouldn't you delete my text? Anyway, what the hell
are you talking about?! 128-BIT?! Not even Nintendo Power made claims
like that, and they're notorious for self-promotion! And yes, I have
played N64, Mario 64 to be specific, and I think it RULES! I haven't
played Crash, they (TRU) didn't even have it running at my location,
so I don't know what I'm missing out on (or not missing out on,
according to you), but I imagine it's worth a play or two or ten. Oh,
and why the hell are you calling me a Playstation lover? I said carts
suck and all of a sudden I'm some kind of heretic? (Not that PSX fans
ar heretics IMO (or saturn fans for that matter), just that you do like
treating me like one. It's meaningless to directly call you ignorant-the
fact that you seem to think women have dicks speaks for itself.
/ |\ | / | / "Does anybody have any unproductive yet insightful
\ |\ | / | / comments to show how smart they are?" -Dilbert
Richard T Jordan
>One other thing....all of you PSX users out there who havent been
>enlightened can lick my shoes and rub my feet because We The Mario
>Monks are much better than all of YOU. Our mother was a human, while
>your mother was the son of a motherless goat! You can eat all the
>breath mints you want but you will still SUCK SHIT! We also enjoy the
>fact that while you are busy jacking off/playing PSX we are busy
>jacking off/playing Super mario bros 2. So suck our bottom, you are
>the wretched and the weak while we are the better and the unbelievably
>wise and wonderful. May Mario bless your PSX!
Nice FAKE Mario Monks post. You know very well they don't swear
and cuss like that. If you want to attack them, do it in a
debate...not sneaking around like a wolf in sheeps clothing.
Greg Sewart
The Mario Monks wrote:
>
> >: One other thing....all of you PSX users out there who havent been
> >: enlightened can lick my shoes and rub my feet because We The Mario
> >: Monks are much better than all of YOU. Our mother was a human, while
> >: your mother was the son of a motherless goat! You can eat all the
> >: breath mints you want but you will still SUCK SHIT! We also enjoy the
> >: fact that while you are busy jacking off/playing PSX we are busy
> >: jacking off/playing Super mario bros 2. So suck our bottom, you are
> >: the wretched and the weak while we are the better and the unbelievably
> wise and wonderful. May Mario bless your PSX!
>
> there who are willing to join us in our holy crusade to cleanse the video
> gaming world from this sub-standard 32-bit gaming rash, but please do it
> without the mindless vulgarity and ignorance. It will only hinder our
> cause. May Mario bless you all on Sept. 29!
>
> The Mario Monks
Noticed you dropped the vulgar quote at the bottom of your posts.
Good move, wouldn't want to look like hypocrites, would we?:)
Greg
"Honor is a man's gift to himself."
-Liam Neeson
Saturn/Genesis/SegaCD
Chris Underdrive
> We, The forthright Mario Monks, have just finished an extensive
> playtesting of The PSX’s only hope of having a good game
Yeah? How did you like Resident Evil? I'm glad you played it! I
myself love it to bits.
> - Crash
> Bandicoot.
Oh. You played that game.
> Crash has failed miserably. The game has many problems, and
> being the unbiased monks that we are
I cannot ignore any message with a comedy element...
> we present Intelligent Gamer who
> sums up the problems with Crash best in Issue 5 p. 58:
I love selective quoting as much as the next guy, but I'll let you quote
away, as long as I can quote from pg. 666 of the Underdrive News:
"I cannot help but respond to the super-annoying Mario Monks, even
though
the 'troll content' of their messages goes right of the scale..."
"Something makes me want to refute their insanity, even though I know
they
are on the Nintendo payroll, and this is pointless..."
Seriously though -- four bad points about a game and that makes it a
failure? Any serious video game player (oxymoron?) could point out four
faults of ANY game, even your precious Mario64...
> As you can plainly see, The Mario Monks point of view has been
> proven 100% correct by an industry publication.
Interesting math.
> CDs are used for then you can have’em! The ONLY medium for real games is
> the cart format. Crash proves that.
Crash proves that the only medium for real games is the cartridge
format.
I just wanted to type that again, to see it, and read it, and have my
mind boggle.
> But, the most fascinating aspect of this review is the statement;
> "Crash’s flaws pretty much end at the GAMEPLAY..."
That means that the graphics, and sound were flawLESS. If the gameplay
sucks, it's not the fault of the platform..
(oh geez, I didn't mean to argue insanity with logic... I'll go back to
humour...)
> right. It is obvious that there will never be a good 32-bit title because
> all of you 32-bit corpses have no clue on what makes a good game.
Hey, speaking of corpses -- did you see those corpses in Resident Evil?
Man, they were scary, eh? Geez, and those police-corpses in BioHazard
2! Geez! Freaked me right out. Too bad the 32-bit systems can't
handle it... Oh, wait...
> to part the waters of this 32-bit pixely fog-covered polygon FMV crap and
> lead us to the promised land; the land of Nintendo64 and true gameplay. It
> is difficult being the guardians of higher video game culture. May Mario
> bless you all on Sept. 29!
Seriously, I haven't played a game that has more that 5 seconds of FMV
in like a year. You should visit Toys R Us more often, man. Whoops,
"men".
> "Mario64 made Crash look like a barrel of sh*t!" - Drago
Crash LOOKS better than Mario64.
Chris Underdrive
Mario Monk Hater
Nintendo64 Owner
Brandon Fisher
> hmmm... I have a list of the next 162 games for the PSX which will be
> coming out in the next 4 months and guess what, out of those 162 games,
> TEN of them are actually GOOD.
Really? You've played all 162 games that are coming out in the next 4
months? How far did you get in Contra? Or Wipeout XL? Oh, how was
Castlevania? Was Reloaded any better then Loaded? You are so lucky.
You moron.
Face it... Sony is just coming out with
> garbage. I'm a PSX owner and only have 4 games. WHY? Cause all of the
> games suck! There are exceptions but Sony is just going overboard
> flooding the market with all of this garbage. You might ask: "where
> did you get that list of 162 games??". Well, I got it from Electronics
> Boutique.
Actually, I was gonna ask where you played them.
Another thing. Why do you think N64 games are childish and
> silly? Do you find Mortal Kombat Trilogy childish??
Uh...yeah. I'm still gonna get it though. But 6 year olds love that
game.
Blood. Hee hee. Cool.
How about Killer
> Instinct Gold,
Is there a pattern here? Fighting games=Mature
War Gods,
Release date?
Castlevania 64,
Well, maybe not childish, but by the time it gets released, anyone who is
a child now will certainly be all grown up
or Legend of Zelda 64??
You just mentioned 5 games. 2.5 times as many then are even available for
the N64 right now. And you say there are 10 good ones for the Playstation?
Are
> they also childish?? if they are, I might have to look up the
> definition of "Child(ish)" in the dictionary.
Then look up the definition of Maturity and see if it says "A game that
contains graphic violence and lots of blood"
Oh, look up child in the dictionary and PLEASE repost what it does say.
We are dying to know.
I can tell by the quality
> of your message that you must be no older than 15. Pathetic.
> Inexperienced poor little boy.
uh huh. Good job on yours, too.
While I will be first in line to get an N64 (I don't find it to be
childish, just fun - your comments on the other hand...) your defense isn't
doing anyone any favors. I'm glad I still have the Playstation also - 2
games may not be enough to variety to get through the month.
>
TUFFY LANGENBERGER
The Mario Monks (Wor...@theway.ofmario) wrote:
: The ONLY medium for real games is
What a game comes on doesn't affect how it plays. But CDs offer the same
gameplay at less cost. Only Nintendo gaming fanatics believe otherwise.
: all of you 32-bit corpses have no clue on what makes a good game.
I know what makes a good game. Depth and replayability make a good game.
And when Mario64 gets some replayability, maybe I'll consider it. But,
like nearly all platformers, once you find everything, there's no reason
to go back.
: Let us state it for you in one simple word: GAMEPLAY. Something that Crap
: Bandicoot clearly lacks. And something the greatest game ever created has
: revolutionized.
In 12 months, I'll still be playing and re-playing Nethack.
Will anybody still be playing Mario? Don't bet on it.
Michael Mullis
The Mario Monks <Wor...@theway.ofmario> wrote in article
<527oo9$2...@cabernet.niagara.com>...
> We, The forthright Mario Monks, have just finished an extensive
> Bandicoot. Crash has failed miserably. The game has many problems, and
> being the unbiased monks that we are, we present Intelligent Gamer who
What the hell is this??? Did the Vega Bros decided to change names or
something???
--
Michael Mullis
"There are probably people in this room that are
still mad at me because they think I raised their
taxes too much. It will surprise you to know I think
I raised them too much too."
- President Bill Clinton
Houston Press Conference - 10/93
Gumby Damnit!
Heathman <mhe...@indy.tds.net> wrote in article
<01bbab23.1e14b820$830e...@mypc.tdsnet.com>...
> I know that the N64 is not a 64 bit machine. I read a magazine where
> they had an interview from silicon graphics. He said it was 128 bit! Ha!
> In your face playstation lover!! Eat it!!! You are an idiot!!! You suck
> your moms dick!!! Have you played the N64!!! I have and crash bandicoot
> was right beside it. Crash looked so primitive beside mario it was
> pathetic!!! You playstation lovers are idiots. That goes for saturn
lovers
> too!
I don't know why I'm bothering to reply to this but....
1. Can't you make your point without using infantile profanity?
2. Can't you make your point without insulting the previous poster?
3. I have a Playstation, a Saturn, and a Nintendo 64. so, when I speak on
these subjects,
I am speaking from my own experience (it's all just opinions)
4. Crash Bandicoot is an excellent game with it's roots with platforms
games, but with
incredible graphics, terrific 3d"ish" environment, and great, evolving and
changing
play mechanics.
5. After 3 days of playing Super Mario 64, I find it more a showcase of
the N64's graphic
powers than gameplay. I have no doubt that better and more interesting
games
will arrive the N64. Mario 64 is more like an interactive demo than a
game. I
am also waiting for third party controllers as I don't like the stock
controller. The
center joystick is way too loose and makes maneuvering through Mario
difficult
and unpleasant.
6. I have to say, from the standpoint of owning both games, that **TO ME**
Crash is
the better of the 2. Although it is not as 3D is Mario, ultimately, its
gameplay
is much more fun than Mario.
KeFKa
In article <527oo9$2...@cabernet.niagara.com>,
The Mario Monks <Wor...@theway.ofmario> wrote:
> We, The forthright Mario Monks, have just finished an extensive
>playtesting of The PSX’s only hope of having a good game - Crash
>Bandicoot. Crash has failed miserably. The game has many problems, and
>being the unbiased monks that we are, we present Intelligent Gamer who
>sums up the problems with Crash best in Issue 5 p. 58:
>
>than it needs to be;..."
>
>feature given a number of the game’s situations..."
>
>fine if they didn’t become increasingly difficult to survive..."
>
>and unoriginal boss..."
>
>state items such as; "scrolling can become confusing at times",
>"lackluster music", and "extremely generic platform gameplay". These are
>all flaws we knew would occur, as the SONY brand name ensures poor game
>quality. You all didn’t actually expect Crap Bandicoot to be good enough
>to challenge the greatest game ever created. It was made by Naughty "we
>hope you haven’t seen Way of the Warrior" Dog for Mario’s sake.
>heathens about how much 32-bit wastes of plastic "games" have to have 600+
>megabytes of storage. For what we ask? "Lackluster" music. If thats what
>Bandicoot clearly lacks. And something the greatest game ever created has
>lead us to the promised land; the land of Nintendo64 and true gameplay. It
>is difficult being the guardians of higher video game culture. May Mario
>bless you all on Sept. 29!
>
>
> "Mario64 made Crash look like a barrel of sh*t!" - Drago
>
>
>
>
scharff
In article <527oo9$2...@cabernet.niagara.com>, Wor...@theway.ofmario says...
Hmm. Oh ya the N64 is out and seems no-one wants one now. Amazing! And Sony
has dropped the price of most older games to 39.00 or less. Looks bad for
the Monk(ees) and N64! Better luck next generation.
JGQ
Matt White wrote:
> I have beaten both games-- and I can testify that Mario 64 has more
> depth, more secrets, and is more difficult. Crash is a cool game in its
> own respect, but it just doesn't stand up to Mario 64.
I have also finished both games-- and I think crash is better than
mario64. Crash is more fun and exciting to play than Mario, and it keeps
you glued to the TV set while Mario don't have that feel. Mario tends to
be more of a eye-candy explore game rather than a fun game.
Patrick Horio
I've played both games and I really don't see how anyone can say Crash
Bandicoot is better than Mario 64. For the record, I don't have a N64
and don't plan to buy one in the near future - not until they have at
least a decent software lineup.
I played Mario 64 at TRS and was hooked for a pretty long time. I was
surprised as I'm not a fan of platform games and did not like any of
the Mario games on the SNES.
I played Crash Bandicoot after playing Mario64 for a while and found
it to be extremely limited in comparison. The freedom of movement is
no where near the amount of freedom in Mario64. I found Mario much
more fun to play - there's simply way more stuff you can do in Mario64
than in CB. And as for the statement that Mario64 isn't "exciting", I
really think the poster only played the first 1 or 2 levels of the
game. The game does start out slow - for the first couple of levels,
it does seem like you're just wondering around. But trust me, the
game does get a lot more exciting and cooler as you go along. CB does
have nice graphics, but gameplay is no where as deep as Mario64. I'm
not saying CB is a bad game -- it just doesn't stack up to Mario64.
As I said before, I'm not a Nintendo advocate by any means (I
currently own a Saturn), but in my most honest opinion, I don't see
how an "unbiased" VG player can say that CB is better than Mario64.
I know that there are a lot of games which use nice graphics to hide
mediocre gameplay, but this is not one of them. Mario64 just happens
to be one of the rare games which have succeeded in providing both
good graphics and good gameplay.
Just my 2 cents....
Daryn Brown
In article 2...@cabernet.niagara.com, The Mario Monks <Wor...@theway.ofmario> () writes:
> We, The forthright Mario Monks, have just finished an extensive
> playtesting of The PSX’s only hope of having a good game - Crash
> Bandicoot.
THEN THOU HATH BLASPHEMED!!! FOUL AND LOATHESOME DEFILERS. MONKS YOU ARE NO MORE.
THOU ART HERETICS!!! IF YOU HATH SULLIED YOUR HANDS ON ANY OTHER GAME THAN MARIO
64 YOU HAVE SINNED MOST GREATLY. IT IS WRITTEN IN THE SACRED N64 MANUAL THE 23
CHAPTER VERSE 14...THOU SHALT NOT HAVE ANY OTHER GAME THAN MARIO NAY THOU SHALT
NOT EVEN MENTION THEM AMONGST THINESELF. DID'ST THOU NOT HEED THE WARNING OF THE
SACRED MARIO?!! MONKS NO LONGER, THOU ART EXCOMMUNICATED. HEATHENS...INFIDELS
DEFILE NO MORE THOSE SACRED ROBES AND BE BANISHED FROM THIS GROUP FOREVER. THOU
SHALL HAVE NO REWARD BUT TO PLAY MATTEL HANDHELD FOOTBALL FOR ALL ETERNITY IN
ATARI HELL.
MAY MARIO HAVE MERCY ON YOUR SOULS....
LUIGIMADA
HIGH GRAND INQUISITOR
INQUISITE NINTENORUS
OUR SACRED LADY OF THE MUSHROOM
Killtaker
>I have also finished both games-- and I think crash is better than
>mario64. Crash is more fun and exciting to play than Mario, and it keeps
>you glued to the TV set while Mario don't have that feel. Mario tends to
>be more of a eye-candy explore game rather than a fun game.
Well, I own both games and I have to say that Crash is ultimately just a
Donkey Kong Country clone with less options and different camera angles. True,
there are good graphics (nice texture mapping) but unfortuantaley you're
ususally moving so fast they just dissolve into a blur of Blue, Brown and
Green. It's fun, but just doesn't have the magic that accompanies Mario 64,
nor does it have the depth or sense of discovery that a 3-d world offers.
Maybe they'll get it better in Crash 2, but by then Mario 64-2 should be on
the way and I may not care...
Crisis
(Much removed)
> > But, the most fascinating aspect of this review is the statement;
> >"Crash’s flaws pretty much end at the GAMEPLAY..." Once again we are
> >right. It is obvious that there will never be a good 32-bit title because
> >all of you 32-bit corpses have no clue on what makes a good game. Let us
> >state it for you in one simple word: GAMEPLAY. Something that Crap
> >Bandicoot clearly lacks. And something the greatest game ever created has
> >revolutionized. So, as we all enter a new dawn of video gaming, we have
> >one clear leader, our messiah Mario. He is the only one who will be able
> >to part the waters of this 32-bit pixely fog-covered polygon FMV crap and
> >lead us to the promised land; the land of Nintendo64 and true gameplay. It
> >is difficult being the guardians of higher video game culture. May Mario
> >bless you all on Sept. 29!
> >
> > The Mario Monks
> Is this so? The game that is out-selling Mario64 by a margin of 80 to 1?
> Hmm. Oh ya the N64 is out and seems no-one wants one now. Amazing! And Sony
> has dropped the price of most older games to 39.00 or less. Looks bad for
> the Monk(ees) and N64! Better luck next generation.
Oh, get a life. The only reason Crash is out-selling SM64 is because it hasn't
even been released legally in the U.S.. Come the 29th, You're little statement
won't have much truth to it anymore. And I sure know I ain't into buying
systems because a few games cost $10 less. As for nobody wanting an N64, well,
I just don't know what to say. I mean, it sells out in Japan in a week, It
breaks records for volume of pre-sells, virtually EVERYONE who subscribes to
Nintendo Power (myself included) wants one (that's about a hundred thousand
people, BTW), and then you have the nerve and ignorance to say that there's
no demand. Okey dokey, whatever you say.
/ |\ | / | / "Does anybody have any unproductive yet insightful comments
\ |\ | / | / to show how smart they are?" -Dilbert
Charles Miller
Well, someone let the gimps out.
Crash Bandicoot is a very solid game.
The graphics are better, you don;t
have to sit and f*&k around with getting
the camera in the right spot, which of
course there is ONLY ONE AT A TIME.
Why don't you loosers go back and
polish you carts and make little sound
effects as you run on your power pad while
jabbing with your power glove. Hold
on BETTER YET!!!! I think Wizard is on
Life Time tonight!!! Set your VCR QUICK!
Mark Tseytlin
In <52gj9u$l...@news1.sunbelt.net> chg...@infoave.net (Killtaker)
writes:
However, I feel that if you used the smae objectivity towards Mario 64
you would realize that it is nothing more than an N64 graphical demo!
MISHA
Casey Rhee
Fred Bliss wrote:
>
> On 24 Sep 1996 16:20:50 -0400, gwh...@freenet.columbus.oh.us (Gabe
> White) wrote:
>
> >: Heh...and BOWSER was easy? <g>
> >
> > The final Bowser is actually kind of hard.
>
> Nah, I found him to be pretty easy. What I've found lately in games
> is that the bosses seem to be -so- easy. The only game I've recently
> played (within the last few months) that had some -hard- bosses was
> Time Commando. But what I've found is that hard bosses tend to
> irritate me. For instance, say you spend 30 minutes on a level.
> You're thinking to yourself, "Yes! I've almost beaten the level!"
> Then you see this huge boss, and you've got only a few pieces of
> energy left. So you take a deep breath, and attack him. Seconds
> later, you're dead. So you just wasted all that time on the
> incredibly hard level, only to die to a cheap boss. It's
> disappointing. So, what I've been trying to say - I prefer bosses to
> be slightly easy, unless they have their own stage (a la crash, etc).
> Anyone agree with me here? :)
>
> -Fred Bliss-
> -sh...@hotmail.com-
Actually, I like being replenished with health just before very
difficult bosses. Super Castlevania IV for SuperNES is a very good
example. I remember the first time I killed Dracula, it must have taken
like a freakin two hours of constantly trying to find his pattern.
However, everytime I died, there was always somewhere you could at least
replenish a little before fighting the tough bosses. Easy bosses don't
give you a sense of accomplishment.
gquan
Gabe White (gwh...@freenet.columbus.oh.us) wrote:
: Grow up. Both systems are great. Nintendo just happens to have a lot of
: games that I like. And PSX doesn't.
--
Two is a lot?
---------
Gordie
gquan
Fred Bliss (sh...@bbs.iaonline.com) wrote:
: On 24 Sep 1996 16:20:50 -0400, gwh...@freenet.columbus.oh.us (Gabe
: White) wrote:
: >: Heh...and BOWSER was easy? <g>
: >
: > The final Bowser is actually kind of hard.
: Nah, I found him to be pretty easy. What I've found lately in games
: is that the bosses seem to be -so- easy. The only game I've recently
: played (within the last few months) that had some -hard- bosses was
: Time Commando. But what I've found is that hard bosses tend to
: irritate me. For instance, say you spend 30 minutes on a level.
: You're thinking to yourself, "Yes! I've almost beaten the level!"
: Then you see this huge boss, and you've got only a few pieces of
: energy left. So you take a deep breath, and attack him. Seconds
: later, you're dead. So you just wasted all that time on the
: incredibly hard level, only to die to a cheap boss. It's
: disappointing. So, what I've been trying to say - I prefer bosses to
: be slightly easy, unless they have their own stage (a la crash, etc).
: Anyone agree with me here? :)
: -Fred Bliss-
: -sh...@hotmail.com-
--
Couldn't have said it better myself...
---------
Gordie
Michael Mullis
Daryn Brown <d...@ElSegundoCA.NCR.COM> wrote in article
<52g6s0$k...@rap.SanDiegoCA.NCR.COM>...
Ummmm, is it time to be scared yet????
--
Michael Mullis
"Power without perception is spiritually useless,
and therefore of no true value."
Jeter
Yeah 2 is much better then a 150 that aren't worth the $2 cd there pressed
on.... I much rather have 13 games that blow you away then 150 that
suck.... I didn't get a PSX so how many games came out when it was released
? I don't know i am askin... and oh and was it released with the #1 game of
all time ? ?
William
--
=================================
emmit...@geocities.com
=================================
gquan <tek...@vcn.bc.ca> wrote in article <52jljq$5...@milo.vcn.bc.ca>...
Matt White
gquan (tek...@vcn.bc.ca) wrote:
: Two is a lot?
Hardy-har-har-har. You guys are soooooo funny, and soooo _creative_, I
think I'm gonna be sick.
--
Charles Doane
Casey Rhee wrote:
> difficult bosses. Super Castlevania IV for SuperNES is a very good
> example. I remember the first time I killed Dracula, it must have taken
> like a freakin two hours of constantly trying to find his pattern.
> However, everytime I died, there was always somewhere you could at least
> replenish a little before fighting the tough bosses. Easy bosses don't
> give you a sense of accomplishment.
My preference is for bosses to have their 'own' levels, and a 'save'
level right before them, with the ability to go back and play conquered
levels over again to build up for the match. I also liked the idea
(ideya?) in NiGHTS about giving hints when you lose. That is very good
game design. I never get madder at a game than when I lose and don't know
why. Crash's bosses are too easy, IMHO, but I've only gotten to Pinstripe
Poteroo so far. Gotta like a boss with a Tommy gun that jams.
--
eppur si muove... 'and yet it does move'... Galileo,
after recanting his assertion of the Earth's motion.
James Arguello
Josh Straub wrote:
>
> JGQ <James_...@ccMail.bms.com> wrote in article
> <324BD2...@ccMail.bms.com>...
> > Matt White wrote:
> >
> > > I have beaten both games-- and I can testify that Mario 64 has more
> > > depth, more secrets, and is more difficult. Crash is a cool game in its
> > > own respect, but it just doesn't stand up to Mario 64.
> >
> > mario64. Crash is more fun and exciting to play than Mario, and it keeps
> > you glued to the TV set while Mario don't have that feel. Mario tends to
> > be more of a eye-candy explore game rather than a fun game.
> >
>
> I have to agree completely the SM64 is an "explore game" whereas in Crap
> Bandicoot you CANNOT explore whether you want to or not! How can anyone
> play this game? I played it and i seriously thought that Super Mario Bros.
> was more fun than that! You have to follow a pre-determined path, no left,
> no right. only forward/backward. I just want to be able to understand HOW
> that can POSSIBLY be better than SM64?!?!
>
> ]3ayleeper
>
I agree mister! Also why do you just have two attacks?!? Jump and spin?
Sounds like one big ol' rip-off of Tazmania! Yeah Nights may be on rails,
but you got neat new gameplay to back it up(and a neato pad). Actually I
consider Crash to be more of a 2-D except with 3-D graphics. Still Tomb
Raiders will kill Crash(at least you have 3-D movement in that, hope the
Sega analog pad is supported).
Josh Straub
Josh Straub
> >Is this so? The game that is out-selling Mario64 by a margin of 80 to 1?
> Hmm. Oh ya the N64 is out and seems no-one wants one now. Amazing! And
Sony
> has dropped the price of most older games to 39.00 or less. Looks bad
for
> the Monk(ees) and N64! Better luck next generation.
Well you will have to excuse this guy ^, because he does not understand
that we come from EARTH, not Jupiter like he obviously does. Here on
EARTH mario64 does sell and crap bandicoot does not. Althought even on
earth the prices for spacestation have dropped (how else are they gonna
make people by the games!). Oh, and also here on earth, the n64 was
released in japan and sold as many units as spacestation did in HALF the
time. spacestation sells X units in 18 weeks and n64 sells the same X
units in 9 weeks. I don't know what the story is on Jupiter, however.
]3ayleeper
Torbjorn
"Jeter " <emmit...@geocities.com> wrote:
>Yeah 2 is much better then a 150 that aren't worth the $2 cd there pressed
>on.... I much rather have 13 games that blow you away then 150 that
>suck.... I didn't get a PSX so how many games came out when it was released
>? I don't know i am askin... and oh and was it released with the #1 game of
>all time ? ?
Well, I guess you are one of the few going to actually buy The Jap
Chess game cart for N64 :-).
Quiz. Which game do you think is most and least popular Tekken 2, VF 2
or PilotWings 64???
/TJ
Brandon Fisher
Josh Straub <took...@nconnect.net> wrote in article
<01bbad9e$3ef80420$f3e3...@apollo.nconnect.net>...
> > >Is this so? The game that is out-selling Mario64 by a margin of 80 to
1?
>
> > Hmm. Oh ya the N64 is out and seems no-one wants one now. Amazing!
And
> Sony
> > has dropped the price of most older games to 39.00 or less. Looks bad
> for
> > the Monk(ees) and N64! Better luck next generation.
>
>
> Well you will have to excuse this guy ^, because he does not understand
> that we come from EARTH, not Jupiter like he obviously does. Here on
> EARTH mario64 does sell and crap bandicoot does not.
Really? Crash Bandicoot didn't sell well? Prove it.
Jeter
Question when are you going to stop asking questions about 2 other systems
#1 games and a new system 2nd best game thats been out for 2 days ????
--
William
=================================
emmit...@geocities.com
=================================
*N64 and Nothing more*
Torbjorn <m-1...@mailbox.swipnet.se> wrote in article
<52kj4p$6...@mn5.swip.net>...
Terry Lin
In article <01bbad9c$07315e80$f3e3...@apollo.nconnect.net>, "Josh Straub" <took...@nconnect.net> wrote:
>I have to agree completely the SM64 is an "explore game" whereas in Crap
>Bandicoot you CANNOT explore whether you want to or not! How can anyone
>play this game? I played it and i seriously thought that Super Mario Bros.
>was more fun than that! You have to follow a pre-determined path, no left,
>no right. only forward/backward. I just want to be able to understand HOW
>that can POSSIBLY be better than SM64?!?!
It isn't better, but neither it is a "Crappy" game. It's a pretty good game
compared to other PSX games. If Crash came out sometime in July, it would be
a killer. But now, with direct competition with Mario 64, it just doesn't
stack up.
By your logic, the entire Donkey Kong Series, Super Mario World and any
side-scroller game is crappy. They aren't... they just aren't as good as M64.
Terry Lin
<tl...@servtech.com>
manfrommars
Crap Bandicoot.
Now that's a good one. I like it.
Torbjorn
"Jeter " <emmit...@geocities.com> wrote:
>Question when are you going to stop asking questions about 2 other systems
>#1 games and a new system 2nd best game thats been out for 2 days ????
Did I ever say Those 2 fighters where the number one games on those
system?...I just picked a couple examples...I could have picked Rally,
RRR, Wipeout, F1, RE, Crash, Nights, Mootrotoon GP, Arc The Lad, PDZ
II, Tobal 1 etc etc etc all better than PW imop...
/TJ
Casey Rhee
> Well, I guess you are one of the few going to actually buy The Jap
> Chess game cart for N64 :-).
> Quiz. Which game do you think is most and least popular Tekken 2, VF 2
> or PilotWings 64???
> /TJ
Torbman,
Now I see your true colors. To say you are unbiased, please. I've
been reading a lot of your posts to see what "intelligent" things you
have to say, and you just sound desperate. You know, I bought a
Playstation recently (actually traded a SNES + a bunch of games for it),
and no matter what you say, the only advantage that CDs have over carts
is that it can play nice FMV and "CD" quality music. I bought Tekken2
and it does kick ass, but so does Mario64. Why the hell are you
comparing Tekken2 and VF2 with frikkin Pilotwings for God's sake? Are
they in the same genre? No. Do they have any resemblance with each
other? No. Was Pilotwings released in Japan to dethrone the mighty
Tekken2 and VF2? No. It's just funny that you are the advocate of the
"give me the most updated systems NOW", and you bash the N64 against
Sony and Sega. Anyway, I am going to enjoy Sony games like Soul Edge,
FFIV, RE2, but I'm also going to enjoy N64 games like WaveRace, Turok,
SMKR, Metroid 64. I guess what I really can't believe is that you are
so skeptical about the success of the N64 when (if I'm not mistaken) you
have pretty much bought every system on the market.
Let's now go to your tired arguments, again. You have made many points,
especially the cart format being so shitty. Well, I ask you? Where is
the loss in quality? How do you know Mario can be faithfully done on a
CD without compromise? Why do you think Nintendo chose carts? Do you
think they are stupid? Are you arrogant enough to say that you know a
lot more than the engineers at Nintendo and Silicon Graphics that
developed the machine and the business people at Nintendo that together
decided to go with the cart format? Don't you think that it would have
been easier, less risky, and much more profitable for Nintendo to go
with the CD format? Why the hell do you think they went with the cart
then? Of course, Nintendo controls the cart manufacturing, and you can
say that they will make a killing because of this, but then why did Sega
leave the cart market for the Cd market? I'm sure Nintendo thought this
through and came to the conclusion that carts were better, at least for
Nintendo. Nintendo is anal about everything. Do you honestly think
that Nintendo thought up everything about the N64, developed it, and
said "Holy Shit, this is a cart system. Damn we made a monumental
mistake. We can't turn back now. We better just release it." ? They
leave no stones unturned, especially when it concerns major system
upgrades. The way I see it, carts are going to let the N64 do stuff
that can't be done on Playstations and Saturns, as CDs will enable PSXs
and Saturns to do stuff that the N64 can't do (like play FFIV).
Also, you're other argument that there won't be many games for the
system is SUCH A TIRED AND OVERUSED ARGUMENT. How do you know that the
N64 won't have a lot of games? What other company do you need
supporting the system? Namco officially announced two games. Konami
announced at least five games. Capcom hasn't officially to my
knowledge, but you know they are going to jump in (if they haven't
already). What other companies that are worthy in the same breath as
these companies haven't I mentioned. You think of one, and I bet they
they either have or intend to jump in, or Nintendo refused them a
license. The only one that is a question mark that I can think of is
Square. Anyways, there will be a crap load of games (maybe not as much
as Sony or Sega, but the N64 will have its fair share).
Last argument, N64 carts are going to be expensive. You are right,
but I have yet to see a hot PSX title go for less than 50 bucks. The
big money makers that bring people in the store (like Tekken 2) may be
an exception. But most of the new releases are $50 or more anywhere you
go. Even the big volume discount stores are $50 or more. I have seen
the prices for the N64 games coming this year and most of them are $70
at TRU (they have presell tags). I agree that the 20-30 bucks
difference is a lot, but it's not the "Sony games are $35 and Nintendo
games are $90" crap I hear.
Nintendo 64 is going to kick ass, and I'm not a biased boy like you
since I now also have a Playstation.
Why did I get a Playstation, if I also bought a N64, you ask? As I
have said before, I sold my Super Nintendo + a bunch of games and ended
up paying the store a measily $15 bucks for my new Playstation. I may
have been able to get a N64 with the store credit, but I didn't want to
chance it with this store probably not carrying N64 at launch. Oh well.
Anyways, quit complaining and enjoy your Playstation, 3DO and all the
other stuff you have.
-Casey
Adam Marshall
Josh Straub wrote:
>
> > >Is this so? The game that is out-selling Mario64 by a margin of 80 to 1?
>
> > Hmm. Oh ya the N64 is out and seems no-one wants one now. Amazing! And
> Sony
> > has dropped the price of most older games to 39.00 or less. Looks bad
> for
> > the Monk(ees) and N64! Better luck next generation.
>
> Well you will have to excuse this guy ^, because he does not understand
> that we come from EARTH, not Jupiter like he obviously does. Here on
> earth the prices for spacestation have dropped (how else are they gonna
> make people by the games!). Oh, and also here on earth, the n64 was
> released in japan and sold as many units as spacestation did in HALF the
> time. spacestation sells X units in 18 weeks and n64 sells the same X
> units in 9 weeks. I don't know what the story is on Jupiter, however.
>
> ]3ayleeper
Well, here on earth, in Japan, video gamers are very easy to manipulate
with sesational advertising lies. Now the sales are back to normal. In
the US, N64 is doing.... OK. Nothing record breaking. The guy I asked at
circus world has 30 units in stock and has sold.... 2. Crash is, however
selling very well.
--
kul...@citynet.net >Tenchi Muyo * Dragon Ball * Ranma½<
>>>>>>>>>>>Adam Marshall<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
>Evangelion * GunSmith Cats *< DB/DBZ/DBGT LF
Torbjorn
Casey Rhee <cr...@enteract.com> wrote:
>> Well, I guess you are one of the few going to actually buy The Jap
>> Chess game cart for N64 :-).
>> Quiz. Which game do you think is most and least popular Tekken 2, VF 2
>> or PilotWings 64???
>> /TJ
>Torbman,
> Now I see your true colors. To say you are unbiased, please. I've
>been reading a lot of your posts to see what "intelligent" things you
>have to say, and you just sound desperate.
Maybe that's just because enghlish isn't my first language :-)
ANyway..I'm not "unbiassed" (who is?). But I don't have any emotional
attachment to a particular brand of hardware ...
>You know, I bought a
>Playstation recently (actually traded a SNES + a bunch of games for it),
>and no matter what you say, the only advantage that CDs have over carts
>is that it can play nice FMV and "CD" quality music.
To say that the *only* advantage is FMV and CD-music is VERY WRONG...
What about COST? Isn't nice to get demo-disks with the
magazines...(when will you get a Demo-cart included in Nintendo
power)...What about inclusion of extra levels, add-on disks with more
golf-courses, tracks etc...Multi-game collection (classics etc on one
single CD. etc etc. FMV and CD music may be the only advantages you
consider important with CD..Personally I feel those are nice options
but hardly the most important advantage of CD's!!
>I bought Tekken2 and it does kick ass, but so does Mario64.
Couldn't agree with oyu more!!
>Why the hell are you comparing Tekken2 and VF2 with frikkin Pilotwings for God's sake?
Simply becuase I'm getting tired of this Quality over Quantity
bullshit some people keep throwing in all the time...It's the amount
of quality titles that is important (if there also is a lot of
crap...so what...nobody is forcing us to buy crap...)
And currently and for a long time the 32-bitters seem to get more
kick-ass games!
>Are they in the same genre? No. Do they have any resemblance with each
>other? No. Was Pilotwings released in Japan to dethrone the mighty
>Tekken2 and VF2? No.
Well some people compare Mario 64 to Crach and Nights ...What's the
problem to compare different game-genres? Most people could easilly
have an opionion which game (and category) they prefer...Of course it
would be even more interesting if War Gods and Killer Instinct would
have been out (any dates yet???? no? so) we could make a Fighting-game
comparison...but I'm not totally convinced that that comparison would
be more advantageous for N64...
>It's just funny that you are the advocate of the
>"give me the most updated systems NOW", and you bash the N64 against
>Sony and Sega.
Actually You are right...This is a bit stupid (and inconsistent) of
me...Becuase I really would like "to keep the cake but eat it" . I
would like new more powerful hardware...and of course if that gets
introduced it'll take some time for software to catch up with the
hardware...But my problem with Nintendo is that they are prolonging
the software problems (or even making them permanent) by choosing a
silly storage device for their console...So I guess I'm really bitchin
about that I am pessimistic about that the software situation will
improve drastically for N64...I am afraid we maye see a slow release
of titles and a system mostly specialized on "safe" ports from PCs and
otherwise relying completely on inhouse Nintendo development...This is
not good as I would really like each console release to be a step
forward..Not 1 step forward and 1 step backward!!
>Anyway, I am going to enjoy Sony games like Soul Edge,
>FFIV
FFVII right??
>, RE2, but I'm also going to enjoy N64 games like WaveRace, Turok,
>SMKR, Metroid 64. I guess what I really can't believe is that you are
>so skeptical about the success of the N64 when (if I'm not mistaken) you
>have pretty much bought every system on the market.
I'll buy a system either if it a) has lots of games i couldn't live
without or b) if it's good enough hardware wise to make me confident
enough that it'll have kick-ass titles..
N64 hasn't fullfilled those requriements yet (a) to few games, and no
solid facts about release-dates, 64DD, etc etc..Lots of if's and
but's... and b) The hardware isn't complete until they get their 64DD
act together at Shoshinkai, and the choice of carts is horrible enough
to make me VERY catious about buying the system...I think the cart's
are extremely bad, so now it's up to Nintendo that they can produce
128Mbit games for less than $70 and that there will be more than a
dozen of games available...in a reasonable timeframe...
> Let's now go to your tired arguments, again. You have made many points,
>especially the cart format being so shitty.
sure!
> Well, I ask you? Where is the loss in quality? How do you know Mario can be faithfully done on a
>CD without compromise?
Because I know that Mario is 8MB of compressed data...and the N64 has
4.5 MB RAM. The rest is as Sherlock holmes used to say, elementary!!
A system with a CD and 12.5MB RAM could fit both the 64Mbits into RAM
and have 4.5MB RAM free for processing/decompressing etc etc...
>Why do you think Nintendo chose carts?
Main reason:
a) To meet a target price point of the base-unit of $250 (which later
got adjusted to $199 due to competition).
b) Prestige, as the SNES CD cooperation with Sony broke down earlier
in history.
>Do you think they are stupid?
no, they are really clever!! Can't say the same about many of their
fans though !
>Are you arrogant enough to say that you know a
>lot more than the engineers at Nintendo and Silicon Graphics that
>developed the machine and the business people at Nintendo that together
>decided to go with the cart format?
No.
>Don't you think that it would have been easier, less risky, and much more
>profitable for Nintendo to go with the CD format?
Not neccesarily..If people are dumb enough to pay them more just to
shave of a couple of seconds of the initial loading, and consumers
care much more to the base-unit costs and speed than they care about
cost-of-ownership issues future limitations and lack of software
development, then Nintendo's gamble pays of and they earn BIG bucks!
If it works it's great for Nintendo? But I don't really give a shit
about Nintendo's profit (or Sonys and Segas for that matter) I care
about what they can offer to me...And personally I don't see a big
advantage of paying $199 upfront and $70 per game instead of $300
upfront and $50 per game...But I realize I'm probably not an average
customer..So Nintendo may have made the right descicion...But They ARE
running a risk with this strategy..Many computer system has faild
becasue of one simple cause...lack of software... (the makers of those
systems, like NeXt, Apple, Wang etc wasn't that stupid either!
>Why the hell do you think they went with the cart then?
Read the above..(prestige, lower introductionary unit-price, usage of
old manufacturing plants)
>Of course, Nintendo controls the cart manufacturing, and you can
>say that they will make a killing because of this, but then why did Sega
>leave the cart market for the Cd market?
Exactly! So basically You're saying that Sega, Sony, Matsushita,
Microsoft, PC-makers etc are all less intelligent than Nintendo as
they didn't arrive to conclusion that cartridge is the optimal
storage...
BTW Sega and Sony controls the CD making, so this isn't much of a
difference, in terms of control of production...(Sony as special disk
with black coating etc for PSX, Saturn also uses proprietary CD
formats in order to prevent copying.
>I'm sure Nintendo thought this through and came to the conclusion that carts were better, at least for
>Nintendo.
Yupp they took a gamble, and maybe it is best for Nintendo..But to me
the big questionis if it is best for ME (and fellow gamers)!!
>Nintendo is anal about everything. Do you honestly think
>that Nintendo thought up everything about the N64, developed it, and
>said "Holy Shit, this is a cart system. Damn we made a monumental
>mistake. We can't turn back now. We better just release it." ?
No but I think, they've realised they would get more problems with
thius descicion than originally planned when Software developers came
back to them and said..What the f**k have you done we need more
space...( does Square ring a bell!!). And then They switched strategy
to *calm down* the development compunity by promising the 64DD
disk-drive to provide bigger and less costly storage for game-makers..
>They leave no stones unturned, especially when it concerns major system
>upgrades. The way I see it, carts are going to let the N64 do stuff
>that can't be done on Playstations and Saturns, as CDs will enable PSXs
>and Saturns to do stuff that the N64 can't do (like play FFIV).
The way I see it is that nothing prevents the use of cartridges in a
CD-based system. And that the N64 would be able to do much more and
get much more games if it had a CD...
As things stands know very few games have actually been announced with
planned-release dates...
> Also, you're other argument that there won't be many games for the
>system is SUCH A TIRED AND OVERUSED ARGUMENT. How do you know that the
>N64 won't have a lot of games?
I don't! But I do now that it a) don't have many now! b) don't have
many announced being in development c) hasn't got anything really
indicating that there will be lots of games...Most developers are
taking a wait and see attitude..And the carts combined with the
confusion regarding N64s future storage (64DD) doesn't help either..
>What other company do you need
>supporting the system? Namco officially announced two games.
Yes, one for the 64DD (whenever it gets released) and one unnamed
sports game...(vrtual stadium brand)...
So No Tekken, Soul Edge, Rave racer etc as it looks right now...
And you think this is putting all its weight behind N64 :-)
>Konami announced at least five games.
Yea, golf, baseball and Majong, a 64DD RPG..etc..not to exciting when
you dig under the surface, (hope I'm wrong) and once again..When will
this RPG arrive...It all comes down to whenever the 64DD will become
reality...
>Capcom hasn't officially to my
>knowledge, but you know they are going to jump in (if they haven't
>already). What other companies that are worthy in the same breath as
>these companies haven't I mentioned. You think of one, and I bet they
>they either have or intend to jump in, or Nintendo refused them a
>license. The only one that is a question mark that I can think of is
>Square. Anyways, there will be a crap load of games (maybe not as much
>as Sony or Sega, but the N64 will have its fair share).
1) you're focused on company names giving lip-service to Nintendo..I'm
more intersted in what games they announce, and what dates they
promise!!
2) You've may not have heard of companies like, Koei, Psynosis, Taito,
Takara, Bandai, Jaleco, Spectrum Holobyte, Shiny, Tonkinhouse,
DataEast, Warp, Riverhillsoft, ASCII, Altron, Toshiba EMI, Compile,
BMG, Imagineer, NCS, Square, Sunsoft, Virgin, Pack in Video, Right
Stuff, Agenda, Coconuts, Acclaim, ASMIK, gaps, gaga, Culture brain,
Pioneer, naxat, climax, UEP-systems, Benpresto etc...
3) I hope it will have a crap load of games..but there is still no
signs of that to happen!
> Last argument, N64 carts are going to be expensive. You are right,
>but I have yet to see a hot PSX title go for less than 50 bucks. The
>big money makers that bring people in the store (like Tekken 2) may be
>an exception. But most of the new releases are $50 or more anywhere you
>go. Even the big volume discount stores are $50 or more.
Of course stores and game makers will charge as much as the consumers
are willing to pay! But if a CD game is exepensive we know this isn't
becuase of the CD itself, so there must be a big profit in that case
(translating to profitability for Game-makers and thereby attracting
more game-makers and development of more games for the console from
existing developers).
>I have seen the prices for the N64 games coming this year and most of them are $70
>at TRU (they have presell tags).
This is expensive imop.. Keep in mind the first carts are 1) small,
8MB, future carts will be bigger and thus more costly to produce 12,16
or perhaps more will most likely translate to higher cost! 2) Because
of the competiveness at the launch Nintendo has a *huge* insentive to
keep cart-prices to a minimum.. When enough people are *locked into*
the system it would be reasonable for them to charge more..(easy to
justify this with larger carts as well...)
>I agree that the 20-30 bucks
>difference is a lot, but it's not the "Sony games are $35 and Nintendo
>games are $90" crap I hear.
I doubt the price difference will be that huge ever...It would be a
too hard sell for Nintendo...And the introduction of the 64DD will
help to adjust so the price gap doesn't expand too much..
>Nintendo 64 is going to kick ass, and I'm not a biased boy like you
>since I now also have a Playstation.
Well, you probably have some bias (its quite impossble to not have any
bias or personal preferences...). But I've no emotional attachments to
either the Saturn or the PSX for that matter! I would buy the M2 on
the spot if it got released today (Though I didn't think 3DO was worth
a buy), because of the specs of the machine looks just about right to
kick as.. N64 doesn't kick ass ass i see it...It has pro's and it has
con's and only time can tell if the pro's can prevail over the
bad-parts...
>Why did I get a Playstation, if I also bought a N64, you ask?
I do not ask that..I think its a pretty sane decision from you!
Actually It's likely that a great percentage of the current N64 gamers
in US also have a Playstation or a Saturn...
>As I have said before, I sold my Super Nintendo + a bunch of games and ended
>up paying the store a measily $15 bucks for my new Playstation. I may
>have been able to get a N64 with the store credit, but I didn't want to
>chance it with this store probably not carrying N64 at launch. Oh well.
>Anyways, quit complaining and enjoy your Playstation, 3DO and all the
>other stuff you have.
>-Casey
I don't own a 3DO..And I'll keep complaining until a PSX2 or M2 or
N128 or whatever comes out that has 1M polys+ and large storage!
/TJ
Hanson
m-1...@mailbox.swipnet.se (Torbjorn) wrote:
>Casey Rhee <cr...@enteract.com> wrote:
<snip>
>> Well, I ask you? Where is the loss in quality? How do you know Mario can be faithfully done on a
>>CD without compromise?
>Because I know that Mario is 8MB of compressed data...and the N64 has
>4.5 MB RAM. The rest is as Sherlock holmes used to say, elementary!!
>A system with a CD and 12.5MB RAM could fit both the 64Mbits into RAM
>and have 4.5MB RAM free for processing/decompressing etc etc...
Perhaps this is a lost argument with you (considering that you've
professed many times that compression schemes can't go much over 2:1),
but it seems that the problem with your scenario is that the 8 megs in
Mario is more compact than anything Sega or Sony has ever produced.
Unless both companies start burning the midnight oil working on their
compression algorithms like Nintendo has, you're going to need more
than 12.5 MB of RAM for caching and processing. And the N64 games are
only going to get bigger. How much RAM will you need for a 16 meg
game?
<snip>
>>Don't you think that it would have been easier, less risky, and much more
>>profitable for Nintendo to go with the CD format?
>Not neccesarily..If people are dumb enough to pay them more just to
>shave of a couple of seconds of the initial loading, and consumers
>care much more to the base-unit costs and speed than they care about
>cost-of-ownership issues future limitations and lack of software
>development, then Nintendo's gamble pays of and they earn BIG bucks!
How very arrogant of you to think everyone who buys the N64 is dumb.
I think the big problem here is that you are so sure you're correct
that you're not even allowing the advantages of the system to be
issues and focus instead on all the negatives. I'll tell you flat out
-- I got it because of Mario. I'll keep it because of Wave Race. The
rest is gravy (SMK-R, SOTE, Turok, DOOM 64, Tetrisphere, etc).
>If it works it's great for Nintendo? But I don't really give a shit
>about Nintendo's profit (or Sonys and Segas for that matter) I care
>about what they can offer to me...And personally I don't see a big
>advantage of paying $199 upfront and $70 per game instead of $300
>upfront and $50 per game...But I realize I'm probably not an average
>customer..So Nintendo may have made the right descicion...
For the "dumb" customers, right? Nintendo will not stay in business
with a $300 machine. Plain and simple. Want to see the user base
figures of $300 game machines? Sony and Sega sold more units at $200
in a shorter span of time than they ever sold at $300-$400.
>But They ARE
>running a risk with this strategy..Many computer system has faild
>becasue of one simple cause...lack of software... (the makers of those
>systems, like NeXt, Apple, Wang etc wasn't that stupid either!
That's a completely different analogy. For one thing, Nintendo
develops much of their own software. For another, there is no
monopoly looming over Nintendo to squash them. And of course, you're
assuming that there will be a lack of software for the N64. I assume
that there won't be, considering that many companies waited to see how
the N64 would pan out before putting their support behind it. Why do
you think there are more and more companies announcing Nintendo
projects right now? I'll concede that the next year won't bring
anywhere near the same amount of titles that the 32-bit will have (and
I don't suppose they ever really will), but there will be enough for
the consumer. And consider that so far, the titles released have been
called the best of their genre (even Habu Shogi is the best shogi
chess game for a home console ever made! :-)
<snip>
>BTW Sega and Sony controls the CD making, so this isn't much of a
>difference, in terms of control of production...(Sony as special disk
>with black coating etc for PSX, Saturn also uses proprietary CD
>formats in order to prevent copying.
And they work wonders, don't they? HK anyone?
Hanson
"Leave the gun. Take the cannoli"
- Clemenza
Jamie Dirom
Hanson wrote:
> m-1...@mailbox.swipnet.se (Torbjorn) wrote:
>
> >Casey Rhee <cr...@enteract.com> wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
> >4.5 MB RAM. The rest is as Sherlock holmes used to say, elementary!!
> >A system with a CD and 12.5MB RAM could fit both the 64Mbits into RAM
> >and have 4.5MB RAM free for processing/decompressing etc etc...
>
> professed many times that compression schemes can't go much over 2:1),
> but it seems that the problem with your scenario is that the 8 megs in
> Mario is more compact than anything Sega or Sony has ever produced.
> Unless both companies start burning the midnight oil working on their
> compression algorithms like Nintendo has, you're going to need more
> than 12.5 MB of RAM for caching and processing. And the N64 games are
> only going to get bigger. How much RAM will you need for a 16 meg
> game?
If this is right, I would wager that Mario could be done on a CD system
with less backup RAM. But I think I may be trusting everyone's grammar a
little too much. If the GAME is 8 Megs, then it's easy enough to whittle
that down into bitesized (no pun intended) chunks to fit into RAM, even
if there's a compression ratio of 4:1 (32 Megs in 100 levels.. that
means that one level isn't an excessive amount of information to be
loaded into memory.
<rest of Nintendo vs. Sega and Sony arguments snipped>
Anyhow, I hope that this kind of game is possible on Saturn/PSX even if
these systems aren't capable of all the N64's graphical effects, and I
think it's hard to say "yes they are" or "no they aren't" yet. I think
it's a matter of "wait and see." If Nights is an indication, that may
well be the case.
The reason I say this is that is that it's hard to justify an N64
purchase (for me) right now. For $279 Cdn, plus $80-100 Cdn. per game,
that's a lot of cash that could upgrade my computer's memory, graphics
or buy me some more software (six or seven games!).
To be frank, I'm not the biggest Mario fan, so a little of the hype is
lost on me, although the game (and I have played it) has its charm and
probably hooks you in pretty quickly. (After 15 minutes of gameplay at
Toys 'R Us, I can't make a real judgement, although I'd definitely rent
before buying). Nonetheless, I think this is an exciting genre, and I'd
like to see it on a system I own already.
While seeing the N64 in stores tempts me to dig into my pocket for
another game system, I'm wearied by the fact that N64 software will take
a long time to decrease in price. When I see a game for $75 Cdn, I think
"wow that's expensive," and I haven't seen an N64 game for less yet.
The N64 looks like a good system, and I envy those of you who have
enough cash to purchase one. But it carries a cost premium, and has a
software problem (only 2 titles??) at the moment. Hopefully both these
things will change. Not for Nintendo's sake (the slimy bastards!
<grin>), but for us gamer-types who want the best right now. Note to
Nintendo: More sporting titles!!
Uhmm... that's it. Yes, I am a crackpot. Thanks for listening but you
shouldn't encourage me. This is not intended to be a pro/con diatribe,
just my personal perspective on why I can't afford stuff. This
disclaimer is now finished!
-J
Torbjorn
fat...@ix.netcom.com (Hanson) wrote:
>m-1...@mailbox.swipnet.se (Torbjorn) wrote:
>>Casey Rhee <cr...@enteract.com> wrote:
><snip>
>>> Well, I ask you? Where is the loss in quality? How do you know Mario can be faithfully done on a
>>>CD without compromise?
>>Because I know that Mario is 8MB of compressed data...and the N64 has
>>4.5 MB RAM. The rest is as Sherlock holmes used to say, elementary!!
>>A system with a CD and 12.5MB RAM could fit both the 64Mbits into RAM
>>and have 4.5MB RAM free for processing/decompressing etc etc...
>Perhaps this is a lost argument with you (considering that you've
>professed many times that compression schemes can't go much over 2:1),
For general data yes...But textures, pictures, sound etc can be
compressed much more (and the compression is of course used and
available on both CD's carts etc)...
>but it seems that the problem with your scenario is that the 8 megs in
>Mario is more compact than anything Sega or Sony has ever produced.
>Unless both companies start burning the midnight oil working on their
>compression algorithms like Nintendo has, you're going to need more
>than 12.5 MB of RAM for caching and processing. And the N64 games are
>only going to get bigger. How much RAM will you need for a 16 meg
>game?
I don't get the point here..You seem to think I'm running a system
war..defending Sony and Sega against Nintendo? I don't give a shit
weather 12.5MB would have been enough to have Mario-replica on
PSX...What I'm saying is tha N64 should have been CD-based, in order
to make it go beyond good, and that load time wouldn't be a concerning
issue if 8-12 MB and a 4X drive was used...
><snip>
>>>Don't you think that it would have been easier, less risky, and much more
>>>profitable for Nintendo to go with the CD format?
>>Not neccesarily..If people are dumb enough to pay them more just to
>>shave of a couple of seconds of the initial loading, and consumers
>>care much more to the base-unit costs and speed than they care about
>>cost-of-ownership issues future limitations and lack of software
>>development, then Nintendo's gamble pays of and they earn BIG bucks!
>How very arrogant of you to think everyone who buys the N64 is dumb.
>I think the big problem here is that you are so sure you're correct
>that you're not even allowing the advantages of the system to be
>issues and focus instead on all the negatives. I'll tell you flat out
>-- I got it because of Mario. I'll keep it because of Wave Race. The
>rest is gravy (SMK-R, SOTE, Turok, DOOM 64, Tetrisphere, etc).
Okay re-read my statemnt...
You are not dumb! If you bought it becuase you think Mario and WR is
worth $400 (I assume extra-controller and stuff), but If you bought it
becuase you felt $200 was okay, but $300 would'nt (if WR and Mario
were less expensive) and If youwould have dumped the system if you'd
to wait 5 seconds for "booting" Mario...then yes then you would have
been dumb!
>>If it works it's great for Nintendo? But I don't really give a shit
>>about Nintendo's profit (or Sonys and Segas for that matter) I care
>>about what they can offer to me...And personally I don't see a big
>>advantage of paying $199 upfront and $70 per game instead of $300
>>upfront and $50 per game...But I realize I'm probably not an average
>>customer..So Nintendo may have made the right descicion...
>For the "dumb" customers, right? Nintendo will not stay in business
>with a $300 machine. Plain and simple. Want to see the user base
>figures of $300 game machines? Sony and Sega sold more units at $200
>in a shorter span of time than they ever sold at $300-$400.
So you are concluding that people rather buy something less valuable
for $200 than something really great at $300, isn't that dumb... then
what is?
>>But They ARE
>>running a risk with this strategy..Many computer system has faild
>>becasue of one simple cause...lack of software... (the makers of those
>>systems, like NeXt, Apple, Wang etc wasn't that stupid either!
>That's a completely different analogy. For one thing, Nintendo
>develops much of their own software. For another, there is no
>monopoly looming over Nintendo to squash them.
Well ther wasn't really an analogy...Just making example that even the
brightest minds make misstakes. (we don't even need to mention the
virtual boy..right)
>And of course, you're
>assuming that there will be a lack of software for the N64. I assume
>that there won't be, considering that many companies waited to see how
>the N64 would pan out before putting their support behind it. Why do
>you think there are more and more companies announcing Nintendo
>projects right now? I'll concede that the next year won't bring
>anywhere near the same amount of titles that the 32-bit will have (and
>I don't suppose they ever really will), but there will be enough for
>the consumer. And consider that so far, the titles released have been
>called the best of their genre (even Habu Shogi is the best shogi
>chess game for a home console ever made! :-)
Cant say I've tried them all though, have you :-)
Apart from that It feels a little bit odd but I actaully agree with
what you say in this section. I'm not sure at all N64 will flop (If I
were to place bets I would probably have it as a successfull console
sharing avout 1/3 with Sony and Sega of the market)
><snip>
>>BTW Sega and Sony controls the CD making, so this isn't much of a
>>difference, in terms of control of production...(Sony as special disk
>>with black coating etc for PSX, Saturn also uses proprietary CD
>>formats in order to prevent copying.
>And they work wonders, don't they? HK anyone?
Well in terms of producing originals, they have production control..
The pirates are pretty much as controlled from Sony, Sega as they are
from Nintendo :-)
/TJ
Hanson
m-1...@mailbox.swipnet.se (Torbjorn) wrote:
>fat...@ix.netcom.com (Hanson) wrote:
>>For the "dumb" customers, right? Nintendo will not stay in business
>>with a $300 machine. Plain and simple. Want to see the user base
>>figures of $300 game machines? Sony and Sega sold more units at $200
>>in a shorter span of time than they ever sold at $300-$400.
>So you are concluding that people rather buy something less valuable
>for $200 than something really great at $300, isn't that dumb... then
>what is?
But you see, the N64 is essentially a toy. Videogame consoles are all
toys. The mass market will not bear a $300 toy, plain and simple.
Making analogies to cars or refrigerators (or even computers) is
fruitless, because those are either essential items or at least
considered practical items. It doesn't matter how much better a $300
toy is versus a $200 toy, because the ultimate frivolity threshold is
$200. And even $200 is too much for NES-like market penetration.
You'd be hard pressed to get even 1 million units sold in a year at
$300 in the US. That's why it was simply not feasible to add a disk
drive or a large amount of system RAM -- it would have driven the cost
of the units up (not to mention the lost cart revenue from 3rd party
publishers and converting the existing cart plants into CD plants).
And over the long run, a cart system will cost more due to the
difference in price between carts and CD games. But unlike the otaku
who read these newsgroups, most people don't buy 20 games a year.
They'll mostly rent games and borrow from friends. Besides, the big
factor in buying any console system is how much the start-up cost is
over the long term costs. I mean, if people were so obsessed with the
long term cost, why hasn't every switched over to flourescent
lighting?
Torbjorn
fat...@ix.netcom.com (Hanson) wrote:
>m-1...@mailbox.swipnet.se (Torbjorn) wrote:
>>fat...@ix.netcom.com (Hanson) wrote:
>>>For the "dumb" customers, right? Nintendo will not stay in business
>>>with a $300 machine. Plain and simple. Want to see the user base
>>>figures of $300 game machines? Sony and Sega sold more units at $200
>>>in a shorter span of time than they ever sold at $300-$400.
>>So you are concluding that people rather buy something less valuable
>>for $200 than something really great at $300, isn't that dumb... then
>>what is?
>But you see, the N64 is essentially a toy. Videogame consoles are all
>toys. The mass market will not bear a $300 toy, plain and simple.
>Making analogies to cars or refrigerators (or even computers) is
>fruitless, because those are either essential items or at least
>considered practical items. It doesn't matter how much better a $300
>toy is versus a $200 toy, because the ultimate frivolity threshold is
>$200. And even $200 is too much for NES-like market penetration.
>You'd be hard pressed to get even 1 million units sold in a year at
>$300 in the US. That's why it was simply not feasible to add a disk
>drive or a large amount of system RAM -- it would have driven the cost
>of the units up (not to mention the lost cart revenue from 3rd party
>publishers and converting the existing cart plants into CD plants).
>And over the long run, a cart system will cost more due to the
>difference in price between carts and CD games. But unlike the otaku
>who read these newsgroups, most people don't buy 20 games a year.
>They'll mostly rent games and borrow from friends.
But what does that do to the profits of the Video-game companies, if
people buys very few games and mostly rent games...not good for
profits!
>Besides, the big factor in buying any console system is how much the start-up cost is
>over the long term costs.
That's what I menyt by being dumb (=shortsighted)...
>I mean, if people were so obsessed with the long term cost, why hasn't every switched
>over to flourescent lighting?
If it saves lots of money I'll bet many have...
/TJ