M2 Technology vs. NINTENDO. Who's gonna win?
Isaiah Paradise
OK,
We all know how powerful the N64 is: REALLY POWERFUL! But what about the
M2? The last confirmed news is that they were planning on incorporating
DVD technology into the later verions of the M2. Well....???? What are
the specs? The M2 was said to be out this Fall, so why isn't there any
news? Last I heard, the M2 is slightly superior to the Nintendo 64 (Which
is entirely based on their target specs, not actual specs). Well, I don't
know about you, but I'm wondering if the M2 is going to live up to those
specs--AND deliver at the price they wanted?
If you want my opinion, I don't think they're going to do it. Sure, they
might get the machine as powerful as they wanted it to be, but at $250-300
bucks? I doubt it. One thing we know is that the Big M is the biggest
and richest consumer electronic company in the world. They're so good,
they can even package up dog shit and make a profit. We all saw how Sony
dominated Sega with their 100 million Playstation release plan. Right
now, they're ahead and staying ahead. Will this same event happen when
the multi Billion dollar Maturishita (how the hell do you spell it?)
delivers the M2? Can Nintendo handle the heat of this new foe? I think
they can. Nintendo basically ownes the entire industry? When people hear
the name "Nintendo," they know it stands for "Quality." I think this Fall
will be very, VERY interesting. If I'm going to bet on a winner, I'd
invest on Nintendo. Even if the M2 ends up running circles around the N64
in terms of computing power, Nintendo wears "BIG SHIT KICKERSS."
Everything we've seen so far are just the preliminaries. This Fall, we're
going to see the Main Event.
-Isaiah Paradise
Daniel Yang
>
> OK,
>
> We all know how powerful the N64 is: REALLY POWERFUL! But what about the
> M2? The last confirmed news is that they were planning on incorporating
> DVD technology into the later verions of the M2.
Don't forget one thing..... a DVD drive costs about $200+ (or even more?? I don't
remember...) Therefore they're DEFINITELY lying about the $250-300 price if
they're really planning on incorporating DVD technology in M2.
Daniel Yang
Danny Ruiz
hodl true to the specs, it should be an extremely powerful system capable
of everything the N64 is, and maybe some more. I'm not real big on the Big
N, but I consider the N64 to be a very capable system with some very
interesting upgrade capabilities. But the M2 also has the capability of
using the Digital Versatile Disc, which would be nothing to laugh at from
a competitor's stance. If Matsushita does intend on utilizing the DVD
technology on the M2 and acquires some high-caliber 3-rd party licensees,
it may spell doom for the N64, unless N was to create a DVD drive of their
own which would further fragment the N64 market into three groups.
Matsushita would probably be taking a loss on each M2 that leaves the
factory, but for a company as large as they are they could recoup (sp?)
the money elsewhere. They would also establish their system in the market
which could potentially yield them more money in the long run if their
system catches on through software sales and perhaps re-designing it to
make it more cost-effective. The DVD would make the M2 a system to
confront; CDs are fantastic for gaming just because of how much space they
have on them. With DVDs having I believe 4 times the storage, about three
times the throughput, and less than a half the access time, they are thr
true ideal video-gaming format. Now if only Matsushita can get some more
and better licensees is where the future of the M2 lies....
L8s...
--
________________________________________
Danny Ruiz | Who can you believe?
| It's hard to play it safe
afn3...@afn.org | But apart from a few good friends
or | We don't take anything on faith
d013...@dcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us | Until later...-RUSH (Show Don't Tell)
----------------------------------------
Brandon Rowlett
The price would then be around $400 to $500. The companies that got together
decided to release the DVD in 4 parts. The first part that we will see this
fall will be able to hold 4.7 Gigabytes. By 1998 this capacity should have
expanded to a recordable 18 Gigabyte capacity. In my opinion, it sounds as
if DVD is too new to implement as soon as the fall. In fact I wouldn't expect
to hear anything about it being incorporated in a console for at least a year
or two. Look how long CD's were out on the computer before they finally
made it to a console. And while I wait for that, I think the Bulky drive will
satisfy me for the time being.
David Wilmot
<para...@bmi.net> writes
>
>OK,
>
>We all know how powerful the N64 is: REALLY POWERFUL! But what about the
>M2? The last confirmed news is that they were planning on incorporating
>the specs? The M2 was said to be out this Fall, so why isn't there any
>news? Last I heard, the M2 is slightly superior to the Nintendo 64 (Which
>is entirely based on their target specs, not actual specs). Well, I don't
>know about you, but I'm wondering if the M2 is going to live up to those
>specs--AND deliver at the price they wanted?
Remember the original 3DO specs, if they were true then it would be
far more powerful than the Playstation is now. Nintendo may muddle about
with release dates but they don't mislead much with specs and games.
They said that the N64 will generate at least 100 000 polygons a second
with all the effects on, there are a hell of a lot. Currently Mario 64
has at least 140 000 with all the effects added, the shonoshi one was
only operating at 50% graphics power.
As for coming out this fall they aren't showing it at E3, they
probably can't get it ready by then. They can't even get the upgrade
version to run on certain 3DO models. So any descent release this year
would be almost impossible.
>
>If you want my opinion, I don't think they're going to do it. Sure, they
>might get the machine as powerful as they wanted it to be, but at $250-300
>bucks? I doubt it. One thing we know is that the Big M is the biggest
>and richest consumer electronic company in the world. They're so good,
>they can even package up dog shit and make a profit. We all saw how Sony
>dominated Sega with their 100 million Playstation release plan. Right
>now, they're ahead and staying ahead. Will this same event happen when
>the multi Billion dollar Maturishita (how the hell do you spell it?)
>delivers the M2? Can Nintendo handle the heat of this new foe? I think
>they can. Nintendo basically ownes the entire industry? When people hear
>the name "Nintendo," they know it stands for "Quality." I think this Fall
>will be very, VERY interesting. If I'm going to bet on a winner, I'd
>invest on Nintendo. Even if the M2 ends up running circles around the N64
>in terms of computing power, Nintendo wears "BIG SHIT KICKERSS."
>Everything we've seen so far are just the preliminaries. This Fall, we're
>going to see the Main Event.
>
>-Isaiah Paradise
>
Has anyone seen any actual games running on the M2?
On a side note people have been saying that the early N64 demos (the
ones on Onyxs) can't be done on the N64, I disagree. I've looked at the
early demos and have seen some of the things in screenshots of the
actual game. The Space Shuttle on the launch pad is in part of
Pilotwings 64, looking better than it did. The Passanger plane is
undoughtingly there as well. The underwater bits with sharks and
submarines are in Mario 64's underwater levels.
David
Danny Kusters
Daniel Yang <dya...@osf1.gmu.edu> wrote:
>Isaiah Paradise wrote:
>>
>> OK,
>>
>> We all know how powerful the N64 is: REALLY POWERFUL! But what about the
>> M2? The last confirmed news is that they were planning on incorporating
>> DVD technology into the later verions of the M2.
>
don't
>remember...) Therefore they're DEFINITELY lying about the $250-300 price if
>
> Daniel Yang
>
M2 will probably be more powerful, but who cares when you got only
crap games for it? N64 is bound to have far better games than M2;
just look at what happened to 3do...
Grtx, Ryu
------------------------------------------------------------
Ryu's homepage: http://www.cuci.nl/~dannyku/index.htm
email: dan...@cuci.nl
Torbjorn
>OK,
>We all know how powerful the N64 is: REALLY POWERFUL! But what about the
>M2? The last confirmed news is that they were planning on incorporating
>DVD technology into the later verions of the M2. Well....???? What are
>the specs? The M2 was said to be out this Fall, so why isn't there any
>news? Last I heard, the M2 is slightly superior to the Nintendo 64 (Which
>is entirely based on their target specs, not actual specs). Well, I don't
>know about you, but I'm wondering if the M2 is going to live up to those
>specs--AND deliver at the price they wanted?
>If you want my opinion, I don't think they're going to do it. Sure, they
>might get the machine as powerful as they wanted it to be, but at $250-300
>bucks? I doubt it. One thing we know is that the Big M is the biggest
>and richest consumer electronic company in the world. They're so good,
>they can even package up dog shit and make a profit. We all saw how Sony
>dominated Sega with their 100 million Playstation release plan. Right
>now, they're ahead and staying ahead. Will this same event happen when
>the multi Billion dollar Maturishita (how the hell do you spell it?)
>delivers the M2? Can Nintendo handle the heat of this new foe? I think
>they can. Nintendo basically ownes the entire industry? When people hear
>the name "Nintendo," they know it stands for "Quality." I think this Fall
>will be very, VERY interesting. If I'm going to bet on a winner, I'd
>invest on Nintendo. Even if the M2 ends up running circles around the N64
>in terms of computing power, Nintendo wears "BIG SHIT KICKERSS."
>Everything we've seen so far are just the preliminaries. This Fall, we're
>going to see the Main Event.
>-Isaiah Paradise
I think its unlikely that we will see a head to head collision this
autumn. It wasn't to long ago since Matsushita purchased the M2
technology from 3DO. They may want to wait out Nintendo, so all N64
specs are "on the table", and then pull a similar stunt as Sony made
on Saturn (coming out later but with more launch-titles etc). If they
are going for DVD a natural guess is that they will NOT compete in the
same segment as N64 (kids buying $250 consoles). My guess is that they
would position it for a more mature aduience (at a much higher
price-point as well). Maybe a Home-entertainment console? Primary a
DVD-player for Home-Cinema (AC3-Dolby pro-logic etc), Karakoe,
DVD-surround Music-disc HI-FI player, with built in Video-game
ability. This kind of system are what we may see in the future, as a
lot of the chips/technology is converging, and will also justify a
significantly higher price than a games-only console.
/TJ
Gene Chan
says...
Well actually game consoles had implemented CD technology as soon as there
was one, almost at the same time as PC. I don't know if you heard of it or
not, but the precedent of the old Turbo Graphx, the PC Engine had a single
speed CD-ROM add on, and I used to play Street Fighter 1 on it.
-=[SoN GoKoU]=-
Torbjorn
>M2 will probably be more powerful, but who cares when you got only
>crap games for it? N64 is bound to have far better games than M2;
>just look at what happened to 3do...
>Grtx, Ryu
Why will N64 have better games than M2???
3DO and M2 are different hardware...Just as Virtual boy and N64 are
different hardware...
How do you know that NAMCOs (or maybe Even SEGAs) games would suck on
the M2 hardware???
We've seen some biassed carp before...and your posting won't probably
be the last....
/TJ
Isaiah Paradise
>Isaiah Paradise wrote:
>>
>> OK,
>>
>> We all know how powerful the N64 is: REALLY POWERFUL! But what about the
>> M2? The last confirmed news is that they were planning on incorporating
>> DVD technology into the later verions of the M2.
>
>remember...) Therefore they're DEFINITELY lying about the $250-300 price if
>
> Daniel Yang
You got a point there Daniel. I'm not sure when they were deciding to incorporate
the DVD technology, but I'm sure they want to wait until the rewriteable versions
come down cheap enough. Personally, I don't see the M2 really making it out by this
christmas. After the the N64 rolls out, there's going to be so much hype, who's
going to look over at M2? Gamers should really ask if they really need the M2 right
now. If I were the designers at 3DO, I would hold off another 3 years until the N64
starts seeing its age. ONLY then would people want to upgrade to the next powerful
system. Who knows, by then they'll have 256-Bit systems that eat a N64 for
breakfast. I think It's pretty safe to say the Nintendo will have their share of the
market.
Happy gaming!
Isaiah Paradise
Richard T Jordan
>I think its unlikely that we will see a head to head collision this
>autumn. It wasn't to long ago since Matsushita purchased the M2
>technology from 3DO. They may want to wait out Nintendo, so all N64
>specs are "on the table", and then pull a similar stunt as Sony made
>on Saturn (coming out later but with more launch-titles etc). If they
>are going for DVD a natural guess is that they will NOT compete in the
>same segment as N64 (kids buying $250 consoles). My guess is that they
>would position it for a more mature aduience (at a much higher
>price-point as well). Maybe a Home-entertainment console? Primary a
>DVD-player for Home-Cinema (AC3-Dolby pro-logic etc), Karakoe,
>DVD-surround Music-disc HI-FI player, with built in Video-game
>ability. This kind of system are what we may see in the future, as a
>lot of the chips/technology is converging, and will also justify a
>significantly higher price than a games-only console.
If that ends up being the case, M2 is dead where it stands.
Already, that idea of the M2 reeks of CD-i or the Internet TV...One a
system that tried to cater to adults, the other an over-priced device
that tries to do everything.
Danny Kusters
Read the magazines and the newsgroups, and you'll
see the biggest problem of the M2 will be the
probable lack of 3rd party publishers, just like
the 3DO.
Danny Kusters
There won't be many 3rd party publishers if the M2 is going to be this
expensive. Also, 3rd party publishers will be very reluctant to develop
for M2, since they know what happened to 3DO...
If you want to play games, buy a console, not a multimedia machine.
Torbjorn
>In article <4lc72q$k...@dfw-ixnews5.ix.netcom.com>,
> Cyb...@ix.netcom.com(Richard T Jordan) wrote:
>>
>>>I think its unlikely that we will see a head to head collision this
>>>autumn. It wasn't to long ago since Matsushita purchased the M2
>>>technology from 3DO. They may want to wait out Nintendo, so all N64
>>>specs are "on the table", and then pull a similar stunt as Sony made
>>>on Saturn (coming out later but with more launch-titles etc). If they
>>>are going for DVD a natural guess is that they will NOT compete in the
>>>same segment as N64 (kids buying $250 consoles). My guess is that they
>>>would position it for a more mature aduience (at a much higher
>>>price-point as well). Maybe a Home-entertainment console? Primary a
>>>DVD-player for Home-Cinema (AC3-Dolby pro-logic etc), Karakoe,
>>>DVD-surround Music-disc HI-FI player, with built in Video-game
>>>ability. This kind of system are what we may see in the future, as a
>>>lot of the chips/technology is converging, and will also justify a
>>>significantly higher price than a games-only console.
>>
>> If that ends up being the case, M2 is dead where it stands.
>>Already, that idea of the M2 reeks of CD-i or the Internet TV...One a
>>system that tried to cater to adults, the other an over-priced device
>>that tries to do everything.
I don't know,
I don't think a machine that can play DVD movies and play video-games
"tries to do everyting".
I know I will buy a DVD-player for my home-cinema and TV-system. I
also know I would like a DVD-based Console...I would definitively be
interested to buy a cool console with a built in DVD-player for films
and surround music disk etc. I don't beleive I am the only one who
would like such a box?
>>
>You're definately right.
(not me..the other poster :-))
>There won't be many 3rd party publishers if the M2 is going to be this
>expensive. Also, 3rd party publishers will be very reluctant to develop
>for M2, since they know what happened to 3DO...
>If you want to play games, buy a console, not a multimedia machine.
I think the M2 will have a strong 3rd-party backing if Matsushita puts
its weight behind it...but only time will tell us wheather yours or
mine speculation will be correct.
I have greats hope for M2 (just as I have great hopes for N64, PSX2
etc etc)...
/YJ
Torbjorn
>>dan...@cuci.nl (Danny Kusters) wrote:
>>
>>>M2 will probably be more powerful, but who cares when you got only
>>>crap games for it? N64 is bound to have far better games than M2;
>>>just look at what happened to 3do...
>>>Grtx, Ryu
>>
>>Why will N64 have better games than M2???
>>
>>3DO and M2 are different hardware...Just as Virtual boy and N64 are
>>different hardware...
>>
>>How do you know that NAMCOs (or maybe Even SEGAs) games would suck on
>>the M2 hardware???
>>
>>We've seen some biassed carp before...and your posting won't probably
>>be the last....
>>
>>/TJ
>>
>>
>I've got a 3DO, and the games SUCK.
>Read the magazines and the newsgroups, and you'll
>see the biggest problem of the M2 will be the
>probable lack of 3rd party publishers, just like
>the 3DO.
In my opinion, you can't judge the M2 based on experienses with 3DO.
1) Its a new company making it (and its Big and its Japanese!!)!!
(and marketing it!!)
2) The hardware is VERY different from 3DO.
3) According to every comment I've read the 3rd-parties has been very
impressed and optimistic about the system, and looked with great
optimisim about the techonolgy knbeing used by Matsushita instead
of the original 3DO company.. There have even been
rumors about Sega using the technology etc...So I can't see any
major reason really why this machine couldn't get tremendeous
back-up from 3rd-party deelopers, both in Japan and US.
I think I've said this a couple of times before...but here we go
again...
It's not that easy as you can tell the future by looking at the
past...
/TJ
Juergen Rally Fischer
: system. Who knows, by then they'll have 256-Bit systems that eat a N64 for
You seem to believe in the rule 64 bit = 2 times faster than 32bit.
That is far from the truth. While this was quite true for some 2d
operations (scrolling for example. but which console would scroll
by copying the data anyway ?) it is not true at all for 3d!
When doing texturemapping, the mapper-chip must read "random"
pixels from memory. So the memory read on 32bit path is not
faster than on 8bit path, except for the unlikely case the
next pixel is read within the same 4 pixel block!
while 64bit makes sense on gfx-cards of workstations to display
and move high resolution screens, 64bit is quite useles for
a console (I don't know but I guess not all components of
the N64 will have 64bit paths. maybe only one part).
the qualities like memory acess speed, chip architecture of
special hardware etc. count factors more than bits.
the bits are however good for the commercial ;)
so, 256bit is imho more far away than you might think.
and if it will be used, it will do high speed copy but
not gfx-fx (except 2d fx).
: Isaiah Paradise
------------------------------------------------------------------------
fisc...@Informatik.TU-Muenchen.DE (Juergen "Rally" Fischer) =:)
Shawn
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/3754
This requires a frames capable browser! Go to the N64 section for the M2
Vs. N64 stuff.
SK
Casey Rhee
I don't care if the M2 is a 100 times more powerful than the
N64. It's still gonna bomb. I think Trip Hawkins is the
biggest joke. He always poses in magazines like he's some
video game god or something and look what happened to the
3DO. Trip Hawkins has the charisma, but he doesn't know crap
about running a video game hardware company. Look how the
3DO was marketed. It was marketed as an all purpose,
education, entertainment, FMV, kids, old, "We're better than
CD-I" machine. The system lacked any good software and he
priced it at $750+ to start. Trip doesn't know how to run a
console company! He's just a smooth talking salesman. M2
looks nice and clean, but it will never succeed, because it's
in the wrong corner.
Casey Rhee
-Casey
Casey Rhee
> I think the M2 will have a strong 3rd-party backing if Matsushita puts
> its weight behind it...but only time will tell us wheather yours or
> mine speculation will be correct.
Matsushita as you well know is called Panasonic here in the
states. This was the same company that produced the original
3DO hardware. I honestly believe that they don't have the
know how to market the machine against such heavy
competition. Even if it's a superior machine, proper
marketing and quality softs are much more important and the
M2 will be lacking in both.
Dan Lastoria
Well Moron, that's a good thing, because Trip is not going to have
anything to do with marketing the M2 since 3DO sold the technology to
Matsushita. If you don't think one of the world's largest electronic
manufacturers won't be able to market the M2 then you are insanely mistaken.
Dan
PS. Everyone is now dumber for having listened to you.
--
///////////////////////////////////////////////////
// R U S H K A P P A S I G M A //
///////////////////////////////////////////////////
Tom Baker
Casey I think you stated perfectly the facts as they stand to day.
Panasonic was sold a bill of goods with a dead market. Nintendo has a
shot at it still (amazing isn't it) but M2 is dead for all the reasons
you state. Tom Baker
Torbjorn
Casey Rhee <ca...@mcs.net> wrote:
>> I think the M2 will have a strong 3rd-party backing if Matsushita puts
>> its weight behind it...but only time will tell us wheather yours or
>> mine speculation will be correct.
>Matsushita as you well know is called Panasonic here in the
>states. This was the same company that produced the original
>3DO hardware.
>I honestly believe that they don't have the
>know how to market the machine against such heavy
>competition
Why not? Because of money, brains, or lack of ability to learn from
former misstakes???
>Even if it's a superior machine, proper
>marketing and quality softs are much more important and the
>M2 will be lacking in both.
You BEILIVE it will fail because the hardware designs were made by a
company who privously didn't succeed as well as needed.
Well I don't see a big connection between 3DO and M2 now when the
technology has been sold...So I think its disregarding the facts to
say it wont have software or marketing...I don't know...and I bet you
can't know it either...
/TJ
Alexander Suvorov
>> the multi Billion dollar Maturishita (how the hell do you spell
>> it?) delivers the M2? Can Nintendo handle the heat of this new
>> foe?
Maturishita? M2? What the hell was he even talking about?! Never heard
of theese.
--
Best regards!
Alexander.
patrickl...@gmail.com
> Last I heard, DVD wasn't supposed to be realeased for the PC until this fall.
> The price would then be around $400 to $500. The companies that got together
> decided to release the DVD in 4 parts. The first part that we will see this
> fall will be able to hold 4.7 Gigabytes. By 1998 this capacity should have
> expanded to a recordable 18 Gigabyte capacity. In my opinion, it sounds as
> if DVD is too new to implement as soon as the fall. In fact I wouldn't expect
> to hear anything about it being incorporated in a console for at least a year
> or two. Look how long CD's were out on the computer before they finally
> made it to a console. And while I wait for that, I think the Bulky drive will
> satisfy me for the time being.
Alexander Suvorov
>> Last I heard, DVD wasn't supposed to be realeased for the PC until
>> this fall. The price would then be around $400 to $500. The
>> companies that got together decided to release the DVD in 4 parts.
> you could get one less than 20 bucks nowadays.
about the same enormous price.
--
Best regards!
Alexander.
Alexander Suvorov
>> Maturishita? M2? What the hell was he even talking about?! Never
>> heard of theese.
> cancelled.
Oh.. I see. Guess that's why I never did heard of it :)
--
Best regards!
Alexander.
Tim Miller
news:5d17c17a-7082-460d...@googlegroups.com:
>
> M2 supposed to be the successor to the Panasonic 3D0, but it was
> cancelled.
screenshots from various games that were ever published.
Tim (tm)
--
Gaming journals: http://xexyz.blogspot.com
Economics blurb: http://www.economic-truth.co.uk