Voodoo 2 PC vs. Dreamcast....
H. West
< I have a Voodoo 2 PC and I'm convinced that the Dreamcast is going
< to kick the living shit out of it. I have seen the best there is in PC
< 3d accelerated game technology (Unreal, NFS3, Quake 2, etc.) and NO WAY
< do those games push over 1 million polys per second, probably not even
< 500,000. I was playing Grand Turismo on my PSX the other day and I was
< amazed to see that this 5 or more year old PSX technology is displaying
< a racing game that looks comparable to what's on today's pc, even
< surpassing it in some instances, especially the fully rendered replays.
< The answer lies in CPU FPU performance folks. A cheaper console RISC CPU
< is designed and optimized only for that purpose. Thus, it feeds the 3d
< subsystem the geometry info it needs. The Intel x86 architecture is
< designed for many more tasks other than FPU operations, like running
< Win95, Photoshop, Office, Explorer, etc. The Hitachi SH4 is designed for
< games and that's all. Alot of PC gamers, unlike myself, despise the fact
< that they just spent $500-1000 upgrading their PC to find out that a
< $299 "toy" machine will beat out their more "sophisticated" game
< machine.
UK} Killa HedgeHog AKA Paul Hendrick
difference, cause thats what your TV runs at!!
--
Paul Hendrick A.K.A. UK} HedgeHog (and used to be Killa HedgeHog)
E-Mail p...@hie.NoSpAm.ndirect.co.uk
ICQ - # 14737715
To Reply, er well, you know what do to !!
H. West wrote in message ...
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
hardware, wait till PII 700's roll out next year, but it can't do multipass
rendering, online game like quake, limited to fuzzy ugly tv, crappy controls,
crappy sound, no upgrade, lame number of games when it 1st comes out, lame
console games, no SIMS RTS or Action FPS games. The DC is based on the
technicaly inferior PRVRSG with its already dated 120 Mp/sec single pass fill
rate ( 1 voodoo 2 can do 90 Mp/sec but can render 2 pixels at once so
effectively 180) A simple game like Unreal would be fillrate bound on this
system with its 3, 4+ pass rendering system.
H. West
< Hhahahahahahahahahahahahahah Ok Dreacast *CAN* do more polys/sec then TODAYS
< hardware, wait till PII 700's roll out next year, but it can't do multipass
< rendering, online game like quake, limited to fuzzy ugly tv, crappy controls,
< crappy sound, no upgrade, lame number of games when it 1st comes out, lame
< console games, no SIMS RTS or Action FPS games. The DC is based on the
< technicaly inferior PRVRSG with its already dated 120 Mp/sec single pass fill
< rate ( 1 voodoo 2 can do 90 Mp/sec but can render 2 pixels at once so
< effectively 180) A simple game like Unreal would be fillrate bound on this
< system with its 3, 4+ pass rendering system.
Good points, but just so you know I didn't write that.
Norb
to play games? Buy a console and be happy. Also the TV may by fuzzier
than a Monitor but do you have a 32inch Monitor on your desktop, I
didn't think so.
Norb
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
High quality textures 32 player deathmatch in Quake 3 Arena I will. Till
then my expensive PC will do just fine for games AND other things....like a
job.....so I can pay for my expensive computer.
Anonymous
> When the 700 PII comes out it will be over $3000. Is it really worth it
> to play games? Buy a console and be happy. Also the TV may by fuzzier
> than a Monitor but do you have a 32inch Monitor on your desktop, I
> didn't think so.
Given that I sit within 2 feet of my monitor.. the angular size, and
apparent size of the computer monitor is far larger, than a 32" monitor at
a normal viewing distance would be.
Heck, visually, the monitor looks good at ~8" away. That's larger than a
IMAX screen! O:-)
H. West
says...
< >Hmmm well when a console gets a non fuzzy large screen high resolution with
< >High quality textures 32 player deathmatch in Quake 3 Arena I will. Till
< >then my expensive PC will do just fine for games AND other things....like a
< >job.....so I can pay for my expensive computer.
< >
< >
<
< that 15.8 viewable screen.
Hmm? My screen is 20.7 viewable, Mr. Cynical Old Man.
< I'll be sitting here at home playing games on a 36
< inch tv with a kick ass stereo connection,
I'll be playing on a screen that looks much larger and sharper at three times
the resolution running technically superior games with a monster stereo and two
bazookas.
< in a room full a friends. You quake
< kids are pathetic.
Well we can't all be skilled masters of the Bomberman, now can we.
< Wow you can play quake with 31 other people!
Actually, it's 64 officially. The WF TC just had a 100 person game, however.
< How much fun
< can you have when the people aren't there?
You'd be amazed how engrossing a good game is. You should try one someday.
< I'll take a 10 person game of saturn
< bomberman anyday over sitting alone in front of a computer playing quake.
I could too, but I wouldn't like taking the massive amounts of psychoactive
drugs that would be necessary to keep me from falling asleep.
< I
< hate trolls. You make it sound like it so tough to afford a decent computer. I
< took the money i would have wasted on a nice computer and built a 3000 dollar
< home theatre system, which has given me many more fun with my friends than a
< computer would have.
And exactly how much "many more fun" are we talking about? Is that metric "many
more funs" or standard?
< We have weekly football parties, watch movies, play
< games, etc. Computer games will neevr beat console games in the simple fact
< that computer games usually imply one person sitting in front of a computer in
< one home playing a bunch of other people sitting in front of their computers in
< their homes. blah.
Have you not heard of the Gateway destination? A phine PC quilt as a home
theater, complete with wireless controls. Anyone who wants to can easily set up
a console style PC rig. That is not an advantage of a console, since the PC can
do it just as well.
Azound
H. West wrote in message ...
>< Hhahahahahahahahahahahahahah Ok Dreacast *CAN* do more polys/sec then
TODAYS
>< hardware, wait till PII 700's roll out next year, but it can't do
multipass
>< rendering, online game like quake
Actually, it won't do online games like quake... it will do online games
like Unreal, Skies, and 10^6.
, limited to fuzzy ugly tv
Um, no. Dreamcast is High-Definition so when the new TVs come out, you'll
be complaining how "grainy" your monitor is.
, crappy controls,
Oh, yeah. Analog controls, they're horrible.
>< crappy sound
DC has the Yamaha ARM7 with 3D surround sound. Trust me, it's just fine.
, no upgrade,
Do you know at all what you're talking about? It's connected to the
internet. This means that you can download upgrades. The OS is on each CD
so when new technologies emerge, the new games can use it. Next time don't
make an argument if you no nothing about it.
lame number of games when it 1st comes out,
define "lame". It's gonna have more games then you need. It will have
between 8-12 at launch. If you're so rich to buy more than that, then i
guess yeah, that is lame.
lame>< console games
As in....? DC is more powerful than any computer. It's got the best
console games and the best computer games. If you don't like the console
games than that's your problem, but you can just as easily get computer
games for the DC.
, no SIMS RTS or Action FPS games.
Sims galore, C&C 2, Unreal, Akolyte, etc. What was your question?
I'm sorry, but your vague "impressions" aren't anything to go by. Next time
you should know exactly what it is your talking about before you make wild
guesses about something's power. It's more powerful thatn a 10,000 arcade
game, to give you a reference.
MAD
>I'll be playing on a screen that looks much larger and sharper at three times
>the resolution running technically superior games with a monster stereo and two
>bazookas.
Technically superior? Sine when on gods green earth did this mean
better games?
William Frisbee
to be costing in the neighborhood of $800 when released.
Norb wrote in message <35E2FA2F...@flash.net>...
>When the 700 PII comes out it will be over $3000. Is it really worth it
>to play games? Buy a console and be happy. Also the TV may by fuzzier
>than a Monitor but do you have a 32inch Monitor on your desktop, I
>didn't think so.
>
>
>Norb
>
Sean
worse?
Sean
Azound wrote in message <6rv8p9$f1v$1...@sparky.wolfe.net>...
<SNIP>
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
to have enough ram to actually support a 32 player game.
Hmm a HDTV...thats only $5,000+ IF you can find 1
No better control then keyboard/mouse or a joystick with programmable throttle.
Vortex 2 chip on pc is *good enough* as you say
8-12 games....wow. My PC will play all my old pc games and the new ones that
come out...can y play Sonic 1?
Hmm
DC WILL have C&C2? Unreal? UGLY C&C 2 on a condole is a joke.. DC WON'T have
MANY of the PC's games because PC games are moving to high quality textures and
multipass rendering. The console has only 1 *sim* and that's the PSX game Grand
Turismo or what ever it is called. Hell the DC won't be here in the US till
late next year AND it won't have PC games like Quake 3, TA2 or what ever is out
then. All this console will have is crappie jap RPG's, Arcade fighters/racers,
and lame platform games. I'd still like to see Dreamcast do a TRUE port of say
Unreal w/o cutting corners by removing rendering passes or lowering sound/texure
quality. Also, this net connection will it work with my ADSL line, or my cable
line? I'd hate to go back to 33.6 modems. And will the Online gaming be
FREE????? Or will you have to pay for sega servers. And will its online access
be open like a PC's or will you be forced to use one company that will set a
high price cause its then or nothing?
Ahh shizite look at the email address. Are ALL of you DC fans on AOL or is
this just a coincidence?
Azound wrote:
> guesses about something's power. It's more powerful thatn a 10,000 arcade
Ace
>to play games? Buy a console and be happy. Also the TV may by fuzzier
>than a Monitor but do you have a 32inch Monitor on your desktop, I
>didn't think so.
Fully loaded P2-450 machines are available right now for $1700. That's
including a 17" monitor. When the P2-700 (actually it will probably be at
733 MHz) ships, I fully expect it to be available for under $1500 not
including the monitor. Yes, that still a lot more than a console. But not as
much as you suggest.
Ace
I totally agree. If DC requires an HDTV, it automatically becaomes
equivalent in price to about 3 top of the line PC's connected in a home LAN.
At that point there is no question which system wins hands down for games.
Kyle...just Kyle
Ace wrote in message <#2oPdXH09GA.171@upnetnews05>...
But it doesn't.
------------------------------
Digital-Ages Online http://www.digital-ages.com
proud owner of a Neo Geo Shinoken cart and a PCE Dracula X!
support the rec.games.video.sony NEXUS
http://members.aol.com/jakade/
------------------------------
Sentinel
>
> When the 700 PII comes out it will be over $3000. Is it really worth it
> to play games? Buy a console and be happy. Also the TV may by fuzzier
> than a Monitor but do you have a 32inch Monitor on your desktop, I
> didn't think so.
>
I can't wait till the year 2008 when I'll buy a 5GHZ
quad processing V-Real box. The reality definition
graphics will be more real than real.
Or maybe I'll wait till 2018 and buy game time
with the virtual game services on the world
net. I'll escape into a reality where I go back
in time to 1998 and play my N64.
--
The Sentinel
"Through me is the way to the city of pain;
Through me is the way to eternal suffering;
Through me is the way among those lost...
Abandon all hope, ye who enter here" -Inferno: Canto III
Luke 19:10 " For the Son of man came to seek and to save the lost."
Matt Adamowicz
H. West wrote:
> Have you not heard of the Gateway destination? A phine PC quilt as a home
> theater, complete with wireless controls. Anyone who wants to can easily set up
> a console style PC rig. That is not an advantage of a console, since the PC can
> do it just as well.
>
You can't have your cake and eat it too, man... Earlier in this arguement you
said that TVs were fuzzy (and that's b/c they have a resolution of 640x480). Now
you're talking about how cool a Destination PC is and it's advantages. The
Destination's monitor is the same resolution as a TV, 640x480. Atleast that was the
resolution of the highest quality Destination monitor when I bought my minitower PC
in March...
Matt
-Mmm.... cake...
Chris Alsan
etc. etc.
I want better video when I get a Playstation 2/Dreamcast/Nintendo
2000/Jaguar 128...
(OK, that last one was a joke, but I didn't want to offend anyone)
Pachoo Hiromi
>Hmm
>DC WILL have C&C2? Unreal? UGLY C&C 2 on a condole is a joke.. DC WON'T have
>MANY of the PC's games because PC games are moving to high quality textures and
>multipass rendering. The console has only 1 *sim* and that's the PSX game Grand
>Turismo or what ever it is called. Hell the DC won't be here in the US till
>late next year AND it won't have PC games like Quake 3, TA2 or what ever is out
>then. All this console will have is crappie jap RPG's, Arcade fighters/racers,
>and lame platform games. I'd still like to see Dreamcast do a TRUE port of say
>Unreal w/o cutting corners by removing rendering passes or lowering sound/texure
>quality. Also, this net connection will it work with my ADSL line, or my cable
>line? I'd hate to go back to 33.6 modems. And will the Online gaming be
>FREE????? Or will you have to pay for sega servers. And will its online access
>be open like a PC's or will you be forced to use one company that will set a
>high price cause its then or nothing?
\
\Jesus Christ, you are a completely uninformed dork. C&C 2 is coming
out for Dreamcast and there is nothing in that game the Dreamcast
can't handle without breaking even a bead of sweat. CaveDog is
strongly rumored to be developing for the Dreamcast and I am sure we
will see TA 2 on it. And I would bet ANYTHING Quake 3 will be on the
Dreamcast by Next Xmas in the US. The Dreamcast will be able to do
anything Unreal on the PC with V2 can do, don't doubt that. And the
Modem in the Dreamcast is removable....i.e. you can add a cable modem
to it. And how in the hell is Gran Turisomo the only simulation out on
consoles? Are you completely braindead?
H. West
< Anyone hear anything about Console support for Digital TV?, FireWire, HDTV,
< etc. etc.
<
< I want better video when I get a Playstation 2/Dreamcast/Nintendo
< 2000/Jaguar 128...
Deamcast does not support it. And even in a decade or two when consoles do
support it, you still won't get anywhere near the resolutions you would on a PC.
PC games on a TNT are at 1600x1200 TODAY. By the time HDTV gets to consoles
we'll be in the 3 thousands or more.
H. West
<
< >Hmm
< >DC WILL have C&C2? Unreal? UGLY C&C 2 on a condole is a joke.. DC WON'T have
< >MANY of the PC's games because PC games are moving to high quality textures and
< >multipass rendering. The console has only 1 *sim* and that's the PSX game Grand
< >Turismo or what ever it is called. Hell the DC won't be here in the US till
< >late next year AND it won't have PC games like Quake 3, TA2 or what ever is out
< >then. All this console will have is crappie jap RPG's, Arcade fighters/racers,
< >and lame platform games. I'd still like to see Dreamcast do a TRUE port of say
< >Unreal w/o cutting corners by removing rendering passes or lowering sound/texure
< >quality. Also, this net connection will it work with my ADSL line, or my cable
< >line? I'd hate to go back to 33.6 modems. And will the Online gaming be
< >FREE????? Or will you have to pay for sega servers. And will its online access
< >be open like a PC's or will you be forced to use one company that will set a
< >high price cause its then or nothing?
<
< \
< \Jesus Christ, you are a completely uninformed dork. C&C 2 is coming
< out for Dreamcast and there is nothing in that game the Dreamcast
< can't handle without breaking even a bead of sweat. CaveDog is
< strongly rumored to be developing for the Dreamcast and I am sure we
< will see TA 2 on it. And I would bet ANYTHING Quake 3 will be on the
< Dreamcast by Next Xmas in the US. The Dreamcast will be able to do
< anything Unreal on the PC with V2 can do, don't doubt that.
Doom was ported to the SNES too, but the SNES couldn't handle it so it had to be
stripped down. The Dreamcast has crippled one-trick geometry and texture
processors, it does not have a fast all-around CPU like a P2 and it cannot do
curved surfaces like you see in Unreal. That means even if Unreal is redesigned
and takes advantage of all odd-million polygons it will look blocky. Not so on
the PC, were with curved surfaces edges are indistinguishable. Quake 3 uses
curved surfaces as well, as do all recently announced PC games. And Dreamcast
has severe memory limitations, as you can tell from the preview screenshots, the
textures are about 1/2 the size of Quake 2s and about 1/8 the size of Unreals.
Quake 3 wouldn't even render one frame with such little memory. Sure these games
could be ported to Dreamcast (although Quake 3 would need a MASSIVE rewrite to
take advantage of DirectX) but they would be missing those features and many
more. They would look like cold shit compared to the real PC versions they're
trying to emulate.
And that's only Dreamcast at it's best. The PC will continue to innovate and use
new effects and engines, but Dreamcast will only be able to do what it could at
release. These limitations already show themselves with Dreamcasts already
lacking features, but once more new features come out in PC games that weren't
around for Dreamcasts designers to copy when it was made it will just look worse
and worse.
< And the
< Modem in the Dreamcast is removable....i.e. you can add a cable modem
< to it.
Sure, if Sega decides to let you have one. They won't, it's not commercially
viable.
Rob Goforth
UK} Killa HedgeHog AKA Paul Hendrick wrote in message
<35e2b...@news.netdirect.net.uk>...
>yeah you turn your monitor res down to 512 by what ever and see the
>difference, cause thats what your TV runs at!!
in fact most consoles run at 320 x 240 because they cannot manage higher
res.
I think the PSX is included. the N64 runs in a window in the middle of the
screen too.
plus a TV can only handle 24fps PAL and I don't know.. 21 fps NTSC or
something.
And console owners can't use addons or conversions for games.. or
patches.. plus console only games usually only take 3 hours to complete.. so
at least
us PC owners have a bit more longevity from our games (which cost about 1/2
the price
of N64 games and come in much more impressive boxex.
>
>--
>Paul Hendrick A.K.A. UK} HedgeHog (and used to be Killa HedgeHog)
>E-Mail p...@hie.NoSpAm.ndirect.co.uk
>ICQ - # 14737715
>
>
>To Reply, er well, you know what do to !!
>H. West wrote in message ...
>>In article <35E283...@erols.com>, ama...@erols.com says...
>>< I have a Voodoo 2 PC and I'm convinced that the Dreamcast is going
>>< to kick the living shit out of it. I have seen the best there is in PC
>>< 3d accelerated game technology (Unreal, NFS3, Quake 2, etc.) and NO WAY
>>< do those games push over 1 million polys per second, probably not even
>>< 500,000. I was playing Grand Turismo on my PSX the other day and I was
>>< amazed to see that this 5 or more year old PSX technology is displaying
>>< a racing game that looks comparable to what's on today's pc, even
>>< surpassing it in some instances, especially the fully rendered replays.
What playstation are you using? IMHO the PSX and even the N64 suck big-time
graphics
and game-play wise compared with voodoo2. The only excuse now for buying
a console is price. Dreamcast will use a PowerVR 3D chipset and we all know
how much
better voodoo2 is than them.
H. West
So how is a console monitor running at 640x480 better than a PC monitor running
at 640x480? I think you're just talking shit anyway.
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
Janes F-15 or Longbow 2 for referance. I don't think Quake 3 would be very good on
any console, that is unless you can use a mouse AND keyboard in the game. And still
why bother with a non upgradable one? Quake 3 for the computer will have the
samethings Quake 1 and 2 had, upgraded and MODS. And....do you think the DC will
want a basically multiplayer ONLY game? And if by some strange chance you do get
Quake 3 will you be able to play with people that have the PC version? Since the PC
version will be patched and new versions arn't compatable with old one's NOPE.
Dreamcast CAN'T do Unreal as well as a voodoo 2 because of the fill rate limitation
the PRVRSG has. No multiplass rendering hurts it sooo much in a game like unreal.
TA 2 on the DC? Again, downloadable units, free multiplayer, patches, will you get
them?
Pachoo Hiromi wrote:
> CaveDog is strongly rumored to be developing for the Dreamcast and I am sure we
> will see TA 2 on it. And I would bet ANYTHING Quake 3 will be on the
> Dreamcast by Next Xmas in the US. The Dreamcast will be able to do
> anything Unreal on the PC with V2 can do, don't doubt that. And the
> Modem in the Dreamcast is removable....i.e. you can add a cable modem
Perry Denton
but on the various sites I've looked at, the P2 500 Mhz
won't be out for another 6 months, and the P2 600 Mhz
won't be out for another year. I haven't read anything
about the possible release date of any 700 Mhz version.
Perry
In article <MkGE1.130$Ed2.1472985@shore>,
William Frisbee <bfri...@nospam.webengine-db.com> wrote:
>$3000 for the P2 700Mhz? Nope, the Katmai version at .18microns is scheduled
>to be costing in the neighborhood of $800 when released.
>
>
>Norb wrote in message <35E2FA2F...@flash.net>...
>>When the 700 PII comes out it will be over $3000. Is it really worth it
>>to play games? Buy a console and be happy. Also the TV may by fuzzier
>>than a Monitor but do you have a 32inch Monitor on your desktop, I
>>didn't think so.
--
--
Perry Denton
Motorola, Inc.
Schaumburg, Illinois
Phone: (847) 538-7195
Bill Katsipournias
No thanks, my DC will be here in less than 3 months.
PVRSG is technically inferior to what? V2? You mean you have seen PVRSG
running?
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
<35E2C815...@ameritech.net>...
>Hhahahahahahahahahahahahahah Ok Dreacast *CAN* do more polys/sec then
TODAYS
>hardware, wait till PII 700's roll out next year, but it can't do multipass
H. West
< I'm not sure where everyone is getting their information,
< but on the various sites I've looked at, the P2 500 Mhz
< won't be out for another 6 months, and the P2 600 Mhz
< won't be out for another year. I haven't read anything
< about the possible release date of any 700 Mhz version.
According to Intel:
Katmai 500 out in 1st quarter of 99
Tanner 550 out in 2nd quarter of 99
Coppermine 650 out in 2nd half of 99
Cascades 650 out in 2nd half of 99
Merced out in 2000
Kyle...just Kyle
Rob Goforth wrote in message <6rvh39$smd$1...@heliodor.xara.net>...
>in fact most consoles run at 320 x 240 because they cannot manage higher
>res.
>I think the PSX is included. the N64 runs in a window in the middle of the
>screen too.
>plus a TV can only handle 24fps PAL and I don't know.. 21 fps NTSC or
>something.
No, the PSX is capable of 640x480, as is the N64. Without breaking out my
N64 I'm pretty sure that it doesn't run in a window, unless you're a PAL
gamer.
>And console owners can't use addons or conversions for games..
Which is bad how? Instead of paying for something that's just more levels
you get a new game.
>or patches..
Which is bad how? PC games are markedly more bug prone than console games.
Witness Daggerfall.
>plus console only games usually only take 3 hours to complete..
Which game would that be? I assume you're speaking from complete ignorance.
>so at least us PC owners have a bit more longevity from our games (which
cost about 1/2
>the price of N64 games and come in much more impressive boxex.
You mean big unwieldy boxes. The only boxes I throw away nowadays are PX
game boxes, because they just take up too much space. I still fail to see
how a PC game has more longevity, please elaborate. Deer Hunter may cost
1/2 the price of an N64 game ( low as %39.99 ), but most PC games cost at
least as much as that.
Kyle...just Kyle
H. West wrote in message ...
For one thing, the console setup is likely to be 1/10 the price.
Bill Katsipournias
Heh..i would love to see a PC producing near Model 3 graphics.
Unreal is already under development for Dreamcast.
Who the hell told you that US Dreamcast will have a 33,6 modem? It will
probably be a cable modem.
Now go play your 414515463476312 Doom and strategy clones on your crappy
PC.
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
<35E330AF...@ameritech.net>...
>Hmmm...Unreal DOESN't work over the net....and I think a DC will be hard
pressed
>to have enough ram to actually support a 32 player game.
>
>Hmm a HDTV...thats only $5,000+ IF you can find 1
>
>No better control then keyboard/mouse or a joystick with programmable
throttle.
>
>Vortex 2 chip on pc is *good enough* as you say
>
>
>8-12 games....wow. My PC will play all my old pc games and the new ones
that
>come out...can y play Sonic 1?
>
Holy Cow TerrryBear
better softwares. On the other hand, console game manufactures can
improve the quality of the game withouth any hardware upgrade. Pcs are
too expensive to keep up with the trend. A guy might say PC would go up
to 700mhz PentiumII next year or so. The question is can he really buy it
when it comes out? He might have a shitty computer right now and whinning
us how good it would be to have nice computer cuz he can't afford it.
TakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoS
I am spinning round and round dizzy from you
The sky is dark they call it stormy weather
You look to God for him to show you light
Who's playing games playing with your feelings
I want your love
What can I do
I want to share do you dare to come to my life now
Just come inside and dream with me
I have a vision call I love fantasy
So come on and please hold me tight
Together we'll fly all thought every night
You know I've got nothing but love in my heart
Forget the past and let's start
Just wild heaven for you and for me
Winds are blowing in passion
Love is mystery
Just like dreamers we are living on lies
Who knows what the future may hold
A world full of laughter that we may create
Just like wild heaven..
By the way, is this too long? I am tired.
TerrryBear
On Tue, 25 Aug 1998, Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote:
> Hhahahahahahahahahahahahahah Ok Dreacast *CAN* do more polys/sec then TODAYS
> hardware, wait till PII 700's roll out next year, but it can't do multipass
> rendering, online game like quake, limited to fuzzy ugly tv, crappy controls,
> crappy sound, no upgrade, lame number of games when it 1st comes out, lame
> console games, no SIMS RTS or Action FPS games. The DC is based on the
> technicaly inferior PRVRSG with its already dated 120 Mp/sec single pass fill
> rate ( 1 voodoo 2 can do 90 Mp/sec but can render 2 pixels at once so
> effectively 180) A simple game like Unreal would be fillrate bound on this
> system with its 3, 4+ pass rendering system.
>
> H. West wrote:
>
> > In article <35E283...@erols.com>, ama...@erols.com says...
> > < I have a Voodoo 2 PC and I'm convinced that the Dreamcast is going
> > < to kick the living shit out of it. I have seen the best there is in PC
> > < 3d accelerated game technology (Unreal, NFS3, Quake 2, etc.) and NO WAY
> > < do those games push over 1 million polys per second, probably not even
> > < 500,000. I was playing Grand Turismo on my PSX the other day and I was
> > < amazed to see that this 5 or more year old PSX technology is displaying
> > < a racing game that looks comparable to what's on today's pc, even
> > < surpassing it in some instances, especially the fully rendered replays.
Brett Gerhardi
surely you get what you pay for... don't get something for nothing etc. etc.
questions I would like to ask on this topic (I'm on neither side, everything
balances out in the end)
- Are the games gonna be 60 quid each like N64 etc.
- What input devices can you use ... I would only buy it if you could have
a mouse and a keyboard (or ergonomic replacement) as fps games like
goldeneye would be great if you had a mouse for it, as it stands it's just a
nice engine with frustrating unrealistic controls)
- What resolutions will it be limited to (with this digital TV stuff that I
hear about)
- How can it be that much cheaper than a PC (I build my pc's at component
level, and I get them from wholesale suppliers)
-=- 00
Holy Cow TerrryBear
most of games are optimized for 640 x 480. And ou need powerful computers
to play 3D games smoothly and flawelssly in such a high resolution. You
have to remember, console gamers don't sit one inch away from the monitor.
We sit more than 4 ft away from a big tv screen. Everything looks fine
from that distance. Beside, only PC users are stupid. They don't
understand basic concept of console games and c an't distinguish it from
PCs. oh btw, i do have a computer too. I upgrade it once every 3 or 6
month. cuz i am rich. Still, I prefer Sega over PC for games. PC is for
AOL> HAHAHAHA!!
TakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoS
I am spinning round and round dizzy from you
The sky is dark they call it stormy weather
You look to God for him to show you light
Who's playing games playing with your feelings
I want your love
What can I do
I want to share do you dare to come to my life now
Just come inside and dream with me
I have a vision call I love fantasy
So come on and please hold me tight
Together we'll fly all thought every night
You know I've got nothing but love in my heart
Forget the past and let's start
Just wild heaven for you and for me
Winds are blowing in passion
Love is mystery
Just like dreamers we are living on lies
Who knows what the future may hold
A world full of laughter that we may create
Just like wild heaven..
By the way, is this too long? I am tired.
TerrryBear
Holy Cow TerrryBear
make the greatest game of all time. In console industry, they improve
software developing technology instead of replacing to a new hardware
every 6 month or so. that means, console game developers actually learn
the system and improve the knowledge and software developing skill instead
of whinning like a jive ass mother fucker and ask for a better hardware to
fullfill thier need. No wonder Console games sell a lot more thatn PC
does. hahaha.
TakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoS
I am spinning round and round dizzy from you
The sky is dark they call it stormy weather
You look to God for him to show you light
Who's playing games playing with your feelings
I want your love
What can I do
I want to share do you dare to come to my life now
Just come inside and dream with me
I have a vision call I love fantasy
So come on and please hold me tight
Together we'll fly all thought every night
You know I've got nothing but love in my heart
Forget the past and let's start
Just wild heaven for you and for me
Winds are blowing in passion
Love is mystery
Just like dreamers we are living on lies
Who knows what the future may hold
A world full of laughter that we may create
Just like wild heaven..
By the way, is this too long? I am tired.
TerrryBear
On 26 Aug 1998, H. West wrote:
> In article <35e39c1c...@news.mindspring.com>, p...@mindspring.com says...
> <
> < >Hmm
> < >DC WILL have C&C2? Unreal? UGLY C&C 2 on a condole is a joke.. DC WON'T have
> < >MANY of the PC's games because PC games are moving to high quality textures and
> < >multipass rendering. The console has only 1 *sim* and that's the PSX game Grand
> < >Turismo or what ever it is called. Hell the DC won't be here in the US till
> < >late next year AND it won't have PC games like Quake 3, TA2 or what ever is out
> < >then. All this console will have is crappie jap RPG's, Arcade fighters/racers,
> < >and lame platform games. I'd still like to see Dreamcast do a TRUE port of say
> < >Unreal w/o cutting corners by removing rendering passes or lowering sound/texure
> < >quality. Also, this net connection will it work with my ADSL line, or my cable
> < >line? I'd hate to go back to 33.6 modems. And will the Online gaming be
> < >FREE????? Or will you have to pay for sega servers. And will its online access
> < >be open like a PC's or will you be forced to use one company that will set a
> < >high price cause its then or nothing?
> <
> < \
> < \Jesus Christ, you are a completely uninformed dork. C&C 2 is coming
> < out for Dreamcast and there is nothing in that game the Dreamcast
> < can't handle without breaking even a bead of sweat. CaveDog is
> < strongly rumored to be developing for the Dreamcast and I am sure we
> < will see TA 2 on it. And I would bet ANYTHING Quake 3 will be on the
> < Dreamcast by Next Xmas in the US. The Dreamcast will be able to do
> < anything Unreal on the PC with V2 can do, don't doubt that.
>
> Doom was ported to the SNES too, but the SNES couldn't handle it so it had to be
> stripped down. The Dreamcast has crippled one-trick geometry and texture
> processors, it does not have a fast all-around CPU like a P2 and it cannot do
> curved surfaces like you see in Unreal. That means even if Unreal is redesigned
> and takes advantage of all odd-million polygons it will look blocky. Not so on
> the PC, were with curved surfaces edges are indistinguishable. Quake 3 uses
> curved surfaces as well, as do all recently announced PC games. And Dreamcast
> has severe memory limitations, as you can tell from the preview screenshots, the
> textures are about 1/2 the size of Quake 2s and about 1/8 the size of Unreals.
> Quake 3 wouldn't even render one frame with such little memory. Sure these games
> could be ported to Dreamcast (although Quake 3 would need a MASSIVE rewrite to
> take advantage of DirectX) but they would be missing those features and many
> more. They would look like cold shit compared to the real PC versions they're
> trying to emulate.
>
> And that's only Dreamcast at it's best. The PC will continue to innovate and use
> new effects and engines, but Dreamcast will only be able to do what it could at
> release. These limitations already show themselves with Dreamcasts already
> lacking features, but once more new features come out in PC games that weren't
> around for Dreamcasts designers to copy when it was made it will just look worse
> and worse.
>
> < And the
> < Modem in the Dreamcast is removable....i.e. you can add a cable modem
> < to it.
>
Kyle...just Kyle
Brett Gerhardi wrote in message <35e42...@mercury.nildram.co.uk>...
> - Are the games gonna be 60 quid each like N64 etc.
I'm not aware of European pricing, and I don't want to be aware of it. I
have it on a good source that it's cheaper to import games to Europe ( UK at
least ) than it is to get the domestic ones.
> - What input devices can you use ... I would only buy it if you could have
>a mouse and a keyboard (or ergonomic replacement) as fps games like
>goldeneye would be great if you had a mouse for it, as it stands it's just
a
>nice engine with frustrating unrealistic controls)
It will most likely get a mouse, most popular systems eventually get one
also it has internet capabilities ). It may get a keyboard, I think the
chances are good. But most console gamers prefer using an analogue stick to
keyboard. Me? I hate FPS games so I don't bother.
> - What resolutions will it be limited to (with this digital TV stuff that
I
>hear about)
That I don't know...
> - How can it be that much cheaper than a PC (I build my pc's at component
>level, and I get them from wholesale suppliers)
Because the PC is engineered to be a multipurpose machine.
H. West
says...
< You are full of shit. Gran Turismo is the only sim game?
< Heh..i would love to see a PC producing near Model 3 graphics.
the PC passed Gran Turismo levels several generations ago.
< Unreal is already under development for Dreamcast.
< Who the hell told you that US Dreamcast will have a 33,6 modem? It will
< probably be a cable modem.
That is a damn lie. Cable is one way, they would have to include a modem and a
cable demodulator, and then the modem would be a bottleneck in multiplay so the
cable would be worthless anyway.
H. West
says...
< >And console owners can't use addons or conversions for games..
<
< Which is bad how? Instead of paying for something that's just more levels
< you get a new game.
Instead of getting a new game you download a mod.
H. West
shim...@river.it.gvsu.edu says...
< I don't like the fact PC game companies requireds better hardwares to make
< better softwares. On the other hand, console game manufactures can
< improve the quality of the game withouth any hardware upgrade.
A console is always limited by its debut hardware. If the games get better over
time it's because the first games were poorly written and didn't take advantage
of the system completely. You would never find the kind of innovation in
software on a console as you do with every new game on a PC.
H. West
< most of games are optimized for 640 x 480. And ou need powerful computers
< to play 3D games smoothly and flawelssly in such a high resolution. You
< have to remember, console gamers don't sit one inch away from the monitor.
< We sit more than 4 ft away from a big tv screen. Everything looks fine
< from that distance. Beside, only PC users are stupid. They don't
< understand basic concept of console games and c an't distinguish it from
< PCs. oh btw, i do have a computer too. I upgrade it once every 3 or 6
< month. cuz i am rich. Still, I prefer Sega over PC for games. PC is for
< AOL> HAHAHAHA!!
Pregnant mothers, this is why you shouldn't smoke crack.
Kyle...just Kyle
H. West wrote in message ...
make
>< better softwares. On the other hand, console game manufactures can
>< improve the quality of the game withouth any hardware upgrade.
>
>A console is always limited by its debut hardware. If the games get better
over
>time it's because the first games were poorly written and didn't take
advantage
>of the system completely. You would never find the kind of innovation in
>software on a console as you do with every new game on a PC.
What innovation? Show me where there's no innovation on consoles as opposed
to innovation on PCs?
Kyle...just Kyle
H. West wrote in message ...
And it's the same game. How is that especially entertaining?
H. West
says...
<
< H. West wrote in message ...
< >shim...@river.it.gvsu.edu says...
< >< I don't like the fact PC game companies requireds better hardwares to
< make
< >< better softwares. On the other hand, console game manufactures can
< >< improve the quality of the game withouth any hardware upgrade.
< >
< >A console is always limited by its debut hardware. If the games get better
< over
< >time it's because the first games were poorly written and didn't take
< advantage
< >of the system completely. You would never find the kind of innovation in
< >software on a console as you do with every new game on a PC.
<
< What innovation? Show me where there's no innovation on consoles as opposed
< to innovation on PCs?
Show me a console game that does something that has never been done bephore.
H. West
< H. West wrote in message ...
< >says...
< >< >And console owners can't use addons or conversions for games..
< ><
< >< Which is bad how? Instead of paying for something that's just more
< levels
< >< you get a new game.
< >
< >Instead of getting a new game you download a mod.
<
< And it's the same game. How is that especially entertaining?
Because a "modification" modifies it, Kreskin.
Kyle...just Kyle
H. West wrote in message ...
>says...
><
>< H. West wrote in message ...
>< >shim...@river.it.gvsu.edu says...
>< >< I don't like the fact PC game companies requireds better hardwares to
>< make
>< >< better softwares. On the other hand, console game manufactures can
>< >< improve the quality of the game withouth any hardware upgrade.
>< >
>< >A console is always limited by its debut hardware. If the games get
better
>< over
>< >time it's because the first games were poorly written and didn't take
>< advantage
>< >of the system completely. You would never find the kind of innovation in
>< >software on a console as you do with every new game on a PC.
><
>< What innovation? Show me where there's no innovation on consoles as
opposed
>< to innovation on PCs?
>
>Show me a console game that does something that has never been done
bephore.
PaRappa the Rapper. Your turn.
Kyle...just Kyle
H. West wrote in message ...
>says...
>< H. West wrote in message ...
ky...@digital-ages.com
>< >says...
>< >< >And console owners can't use addons or conversions for games..
>< ><
>< >< Which is bad how? Instead of paying for something that's just more
>< levels
>< >< you get a new game.
>< >
>< >Instead of getting a new game you download a mod.
><
>< And it's the same game. How is that especially entertaining?
>
>Because a "modification" modifies it, Kreskin.
How is it a different game though? State a specific mod example.
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
supply cable modem service, or if they won't hook it up to dreamcast?
Bill Katsipournias wrote:
> You are full of shit. Gran Turismo is the only sim game?
> Heh..i would love to see a PC producing near Model 3 graphics.
> Unreal is already under development for Dreamcast.
> Who the hell told you that US Dreamcast will have a 33,6 modem? It will
> probably be a cable modem.
>
> Now go play your 414515463476312 Doom and strategy clones on your crappy
> PC.
>
> Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
> <35E330AF...@ameritech.net>...
> >Hmmm...Unreal DOESN't work over the net....and I think a DC will be hard
> pressed
> >to have enough ram to actually support a 32 player game.
> >
> >Hmm a HDTV...thats only $5,000+ IF you can find 1
> >
> >No better control then keyboard/mouse or a joystick with programmable
> throttle.
> >
> >Vortex 2 chip on pc is *good enough* as you say
> >
> >
> >8-12 games....wow. My PC will play all my old pc games and the new ones
> that
> >come out...can y play Sonic 1?
> >
Enforcer
>
>H. West wrote in message ...
>>In article <6s16f4$4s3$1...@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu>, ky...@digital-ages.com
>>says...
>>< >And console owners can't use addons or conversions for games..
>><
>>< Which is bad how? Instead of paying for something that's just more
>levels
>>< you get a new game.
>>
>>Instead of getting a new game you download a mod.
>
>And it's the same game. How is that especially entertaining?
Did you buy Mortal Kombat 2 and 3 for the Genesis/SNES when (if?) those were
the best consoles? Mostly the same games, with a few character
changes/moves/cheats. How much did you/common console gamer pay for 3?
This is just one example I can think of, consoles are more expensive in the
long run if you want more gaming fun than 5 or 6 games.
Joshua Kaufman
>
> In article <6s1bdo$7hv$1...@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu>, ky...@digital-ages.com
> says...
> <
> < >shim...@river.it.gvsu.edu says...
> < >< I don't like the fact PC game companies requireds better hardwares to
> < make
> < >< better softwares. On the other hand, console game manufactures can
> < >< improve the quality of the game withouth any hardware upgrade.
> < >
> < >A console is always limited by its debut hardware. If the games get better
> < over
> < >time it's because the first games were poorly written and didn't take
> < advantage
> < >of the system completely. You would never find the kind of innovation in
> < >software on a console as you do with every new game on a PC.
> <
> < What innovation? Show me where there's no innovation on consoles as opposed
> < to innovation on PCs?
>
> Show me a console game that does something that has never been done >bephore.
Show me a PC game that does something that has never been done before,
and I could tell you a similar console example probably.
-Joshua
--
User of the name Aerith... Master bad punner... Composer of 8 opi....
Player of FF series... Worshiper of Nobuo Uematsu... Watcher of Sailor
Moon... Member of the Ellipsis Faction... Proprietor of the ellipsis...
ICQ#: 5404138 AOL-IM: TerraEpon
"Is the whole world going bonkers or is it just me!?!"
- Serena on Sailor Moon (eps. 54)
"As you can see, this is a Playstation black disk. Cut number 1 contains
computer data, so please, don't play it. But you probably won't listen
to me, will you?"
- Alucard, when you put C-SOTN in a CD-player
MAD
>In article <Pine.HPP.3.95.98082...@river.it.gvsu.edu>,
>shim...@river.it.gvsu.edu says...
>< I don't like the fact PC game companies requireds better hardwares to make
>< better softwares. On the other hand, console game manufactures can
>< improve the quality of the game withouth any hardware upgrade.
>
>A console is always limited by its debut hardware. If the games get better over
>time it's because the first games were poorly written and didn't take advantage
>of the system completely. You would never find the kind of innovation in
>software on a console as you do with every new game on a PC.
Boy your a moron, programmers for the console always have to come up
with new ways to program in order to get the most out of dated
hardware. On the other hand pc programmers can be as lazy as they want
seeing as buy the time their game is released they can pretty much
make the requirements anything they want. It takes innovation to
constantly make games better on an again platform while it doesn't
take squat to program for a platform that needs upgrades ever 5 weeks.
Kyle...just Kyle
Enforcer wrote in message ...
>Kyle wrote...
>>
>>H. West wrote in message ...
>>>says...
>>>< >And console owners can't use addons or conversions for games..
>>><
>>>< Which is bad how? Instead of paying for something that's just more
>>levels
>>>< you get a new game.
>>>
>>>Instead of getting a new game you download a mod.
>>
>>And it's the same game. How is that especially entertaining?
>
>
>Did you buy Mortal Kombat 2 and 3 for the Genesis/SNES when (if?) those
were
>the best consoles? Mostly the same games, with a few character
>changes/moves/cheats. How much did you/common console gamer pay for 3?
No, I despise Mortal Kombat.
>This is just one example I can think of, consoles are more expensive in the
>long run if you want more gaming fun than 5 or 6 games.
By that same logic all first person shooters are just Doom with character
changes, and all real time strategy games are C&C with different sprites.
How are consoles more expensive in the long run? Each game is about the
same as a PC game ( which is not true, some games are cheaper than PC
games ). For every Mortal Kombat 3 there's a Quake 2.
Kyle...just Kyle
Kyle...just Kyle
Charles Miller Jr
> res.
Most, yes. I assume you are talking about all consoles, but the "next gen"
N64, etc, can run higher.
> I think the PSX is included. the N64 runs in a window in the middle of
the
> screen too.
Hm... Doesn't everything?
> plus a TV can only handle 24fps PAL and I don't know.. 21 fps NTSC or
> something.
More than that.
> And console owners can't use addons or conversions for games..
Good point.
> or patches..
With standard hardware you rarely need patches.
> plus console only games usually only take 3 hours to complete..
Ok Clark.
> so
> at least
> us PC owners have a bit more longevity from our games (which cost about
1/2
> the price
> of N64 games and come in much more impressive boxex.
Mark, is that you?!?!?! Look at my collection of boxes!!! Woo Hoo!
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
damage, head shot kills, leg shit makes u walk wierd.
Kyle...just Kyle wrote:
> H. West wrote in message ...
> >In article <6s1bfn$7kt$1...@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu>, ky...@digital-ages.com
> >says...
> >< H. West wrote in message ...
> >< >In article <6s16f4$4s3$1...@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu>,
> ky...@digital-ages.com
> >< >says...
> >< >< >And console owners can't use addons or conversions for games..
> >< ><
> >< >< Which is bad how? Instead of paying for something that's just more
> >< levels
> >< >< you get a new game.
> >< >
> >< >Instead of getting a new game you download a mod.
> ><
> >< And it's the same game. How is that especially entertaining?
> >
> >Because a "modification" modifies it, Kreskin.
>
> How is it a different game though? State a specific mod example.
>
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
The guys don't hit the target 100% of the time< cough War2 & SC cough>
Joshua Kaufman wrote:
> H. West wrote:
> >
> > In article <6s1bdo$7hv$1...@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu>, ky...@digital-ages.com
> > says...
> > <
> > < H. West wrote in message ...
> > < >In article <Pine.HPP.3.95.98082...@river.it.gvsu.edu>,
> > < >shim...@river.it.gvsu.edu says...
> > < >< I don't like the fact PC game companies requireds better hardwares to
> > < make
> > < >< better softwares. On the other hand, console game manufactures can
> > < >< improve the quality of the game withouth any hardware upgrade.
> > < >
> > < >A console is always limited by its debut hardware. If the games get better
> > < over
> > < >time it's because the first games were poorly written and didn't take
> > < advantage
> > < >of the system completely. You would never find the kind of innovation in
> > < >software on a console as you do with every new game on a PC.
> > <
Kyle...just Kyle
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
>Action Quake has all new weapons, sounds, models, and maps. It has body
>damage, head shot kills, leg shit makes u walk wierd.
It's still the same game. The only notable thing is body damage, everything
else is cosmetic.
Kyle...just Kyle
Joshua Kaufman wrote in message <35E43A...@email.uc.edu>...
Hey back off dude. I get to play with the troll first. I already threw out
my first shot, wait your turn!
Kyle...just Kyle
Charles Miller Jr wrote in message
<01bdd112$70e64e80$84e2...@Host.net66.com>...
>Mark, is that you?!?!?! Look at my collection of boxes!!! Woo Hoo!
HAHAHAHAHA
Sorry, private RGVS joke.
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
HDTV which could be used ot buy the end all PC system. Also PC has many free
games, the first to mind is Wing Commander S.O. and the millions of
freeware/shareware games out there.
Kyle...just Kyle
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
>TA took the RTS area to a new level. 3d units terrain. Elevation line of
sight.
>The guys don't hit the target 100% of the time< cough War2 & SC cough>
So TA takes RTS to a new level, kind of like Virtua Fighter takes fighters
to a new level. I don't see any more innovation here...
Enforcer
>>shim...@river.it.gvsu.edu says...
>>< I don't like the fact PC game companies requireds better hardwares to
make
>>< better softwares. On the other hand, console game manufactures can
>>< improve the quality of the game withouth any hardware upgrade.
>>
>>A console is always limited by its debut hardware. If the games get better
over
>>time it's because the first games were poorly written and didn't take
advantage
>>of the system completely. You would never find the kind of innovation in
>>software on a console as you do with every new game on a PC.
>
>
>with new ways to program in order to get the most out of dated
>hardware. On the other hand pc programmers can be as lazy as they want
>seeing as buy the time their game is released they can pretty much
>make the requirements anything they want. It takes innovation to
>constantly make games better on an again platform while it doesn't
>take squat to program for a platform that needs upgrades ever 5 weeks.
Who's the real moron? The console programmers don't come up with these "new
ways" to program, they just make their games look worse and take out
features to make them run smoothly. PC programmers, on the other hand,
don't program for the same 5 part system every 5 day work week. Every week,
the hardware gets better, and totally different hardware is thrown into the
ring, and guess who has to deal with it and make their games run on it? PC
PROGRAMMERS! There are what, 2 or MAYBE 3 consoles supported by each
console game, that's nothing compared to the thousands (millions?) of
combinations created by ever advancing PC hardware. So don't put down PC
proggers with such haste...they do more than you originally thought.
--
Enforcer
s...@usaor.net
ICQ: 8819885
Kyle...just Kyle
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
>You still limited by the TV and its fuz-o-vision. Unless you want a $5,000
>HDTV which could be used ot buy the end all PC system. Also PC has many
free
>games, the first to mind is Wing Commander S.O. and the millions of
>freeware/shareware games out there.
Are those games worth it though? There's usually a reason it's freeware.
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
games?
Just because the game engine is the same doesn't mean game play is the same.
Run around shooting like mad in action quake and you will die fast or soon be
out of ammo. So take yer pick.. PC mods, or console games that you buy that
are just the same.
Instead of getting a new game you download a mod.
> ><
> >< And it's the same game. How is that especially entertaining?
> >
> >Because a "modification" modifies it, Kreskin.
>
> How is it a different game though? State a specific mod example.
Kyle...just Kyle wrote:
> Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
> <35E43E48...@ameritech.net>...
> >Action Quake has all new weapons, sounds, models, and maps. It has body
> >damage, head shot kills, leg shit makes u walk wierd.
>
> It's still the same game. The only notable thing is body damage, everything
> else is cosmetic.
>
Kyle...just Kyle
Enforcer wrote in message ...
"new
>ways" to program, they just make their games look worse and take out
>features to make them run smoothly. PC programmers, on the other hand,
>don't program for the same 5 part system every 5 day work week. Every
week,
>the hardware gets better, and totally different hardware is thrown into the
>ring, and guess who has to deal with it and make their games run on it? PC
>PROGRAMMERS! There are what, 2 or MAYBE 3 consoles supported by each
>console game, that's nothing compared to the thousands (millions?) of
>combinations created by ever advancing PC hardware. So don't put down PC
>proggers with such haste...they do more than you originally thought.
Actually don't most programmers just program for Direct X now?
At any rate the configuration problem is a detraction for me. That's the
principle version why PC games are so buggy compared to console games.
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
the movies. The graphics are great and so is the game play.
Kyle...just Kyle wrote:
> Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
> <35E43F50...@ameritech.net>...
> >You still limited by the TV and its fuz-o-vision. Unless you want a $5,000
> >HDTV which could be used ot buy the end all PC system. Also PC has many
> free
> >games, the first to mind is Wing Commander S.O. and the millions of
> >freeware/shareware games out there.
>
> Are those games worth it though? There's usually a reason it's freeware.
>
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
hahah 5 weeks? I have had my P200 MMX with voodoo 1 for 2 years, no upgrades yet.
I have frineds that bought PII 400's several months ago and don't plan to upgrade
for atleast 1 & 1/2 years. And if it is sooooooooo easy to make a PC game lets see
you make the next Unreal engine, or Quake 2 multiplayer engine.
Enforcer
>
>Enforcer wrote in message ...
>>>
>>>H. West wrote in message ...
ky...@digital-ages.com
>>>>says...
>>>>< >And console owners can't use addons or conversions for games..
>>>><
>>>>< Which is bad how? Instead of paying for something that's just more
>>>levels
>>>>< you get a new game.
>>>>
>>>
>>>And it's the same game. How is that especially entertaining?
>>
>>
>were
>>the best consoles? Mostly the same games, with a few character
>>changes/moves/cheats. How much did you/common console gamer pay for 3?
>
>
>No, I despise Mortal Kombat.
>
>
>>This is just one example I can think of, consoles are more expensive in
the
>>long run if you want more gaming fun than 5 or 6 games.
>
>
>By that same logic all first person shooters are just Doom with character
>changes, and all real time strategy games are C&C with different sprites.
No, that is totally wrong, MK2 and 3 used basically the same engine with
VERY LITTLE difference in graphics/sounds. This is because at that time,
the programmers for the old consoles couldn't come up with anything new,
because of the outdated hardware, and quickly their bosses came out with the
N64/PSX/Saturn to get more money from the bewildered console gamer. Any
common PC gamer can spew out at least 10 RTS and 10 FPS games that are
totally different from one another in many ways.
>
>How are consoles more expensive in the long run? Each game is about the
>same as a PC game ( which is not true, some games are cheaper than PC
>games ). For every Mortal Kombat 3 there's a Quake 2.
Have you even played Quake 2 or Quake 1? Play them and then make that
statement.
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
problems. While if you go buy a crappie Sound card, or the $25 discount video
card you MIGHT have problems. But any one with a lick on common knowledge can
avoid config problems.
Kyle...just Kyle wrote:Actually don't most programmers just program for Direct X
Enforcer
>
>Enforcer wrote in message ...
>"new
>>ways" to program, they just make their games look worse and take out
>>features to make them run smoothly. PC programmers, on the other hand,
>>don't program for the same 5 part system every 5 day work week. Every
>week,
>>the hardware gets better, and totally different hardware is thrown into
the
>>ring, and guess who has to deal with it and make their games run on it?
PC
>>PROGRAMMERS! There are what, 2 or MAYBE 3 consoles supported by each
>>console game, that's nothing compared to the thousands (millions?) of
>>combinations created by ever advancing PC hardware. So don't put down PC
>>proggers with such haste...they do more than you originally thought.
>
>
>
>At any rate the configuration problem is a detraction for me. That's the
>principle version why PC games are so buggy compared to console games.
Maybe you should read the message I was responding to, the person stated
that PC programmers were "lazy" and things such as that. Even when
programming for Direct X and it's components, PC programming is still much
more of an effort than console programming. Many gamers' hardware has
incompatibilities with DirectX, and many PC programmers make mistakes in
accounting for all the hardware. It's not easy, and MAD really didn't have
a clue.
Kyle...just Kyle
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
>Configuration problems? Since DOS ( hell even in DOS) I never had config
>problems. While if you go buy a crappie Sound card, or the $25 discount
video
>card you MIGHT have problems. But any one with a lick on common knowledge
can
>avoid config problems.
I have a little more than a lick of common knowledge. And I'm not talking
about an individual PCs configuration, but about the number of PC
configurations that the developer has to contend with. That, as I said, is
the main reason why PC games are so buggy compared to console games.
Kyle...just Kyle
Enforcer wrote in message ...
>the
>>>long run if you want more gaming fun than 5 or 6 games.
>>
>>
>>By that same logic all first person shooters are just Doom with character
>>changes, and all real time strategy games are C&C with different sprites.
>
>
>No, that is totally wrong, MK2 and 3 used basically the same engine with
>VERY LITTLE difference in graphics/sounds. This is because at that time,
>the programmers for the old consoles couldn't come up with anything new,
>because of the outdated hardware, and quickly their bosses came out with
the
>N64/PSX/Saturn to get more money from the bewildered console gamer. Any
>common PC gamer can spew out at least 10 RTS and 10 FPS games that are
>totally different from one another in many ways.
So Doom and Doom 2 are about as different as MK2 and MK3. So quickly PC
hardware bosses came out with 3D accelerator cards to get more money from
the bewildered PC gamer. Any common console gamer can spew out at least 10
fighters and 10 RPGs that are totally different from one another in many
ways.
Parallel logic works wonders. If you try to dispute the logic you end up
invalidating your own argument, so you're left with no option but to
actually give specific examples.
>>How are consoles more expensive in the long run? Each game is about the
>>same as a PC game ( which is not true, some games are cheaper than PC
>>games ). For every Mortal Kombat 3 there's a Quake 2.
>
>
>Have you even played Quake 2 or Quake 1? Play them and then make that
>statement.
Nope. Have you even played Final Fantasy 6 or Final Fantasy 7? Play them
and then make me make that statement.
If I've misled you, I'm talking about cost and sequels.
Kyle...just Kyle
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
>You asked how it modified it so I told you. Di you expect mod's to be new
>games?
>
> Just because the game engine is the same doesn't mean game play is the
same.
>Run around shooting like mad in action quake and you will die fast or soon
be
>out of ammo. So take yer pick.. PC mods, or console games that you buy
that
>are just the same.
I asked for a mod that would actually show how a mod would change gameplay
enough that it would be worthwhile. It may change Quake ( I don't know, I
shun FPS games ), but apparently not enough to make it worthwhile. So in
the end it's just the same game with cosmetic and minor gameplay changes.
So console games can't be modded, but you also don't have the problem of
installation for consoles, as well as paying for the hardware required to
run PC games.
I'm not a particular fan of console gaming, I game where I can and on what I
can. But to label console games as somehow inferior is just wrong. The
console entertainment software market is 3X the size of the PC entertainment
software market.
Kyle...just Kyle
Enforcer wrote in message ...
>>
>>At any rate the configuration problem is a detraction for me. That's the
>>principle version why PC games are so buggy compared to console games.
>
>
>Maybe you should read the message I was responding to, the person stated
>that PC programmers were "lazy" and things such as that. Even when
>programming for Direct X and it's components, PC programming is still much
>more of an effort than console programming. Many gamers' hardware has
>incompatibilities with DirectX, and many PC programmers make mistakes in
>accounting for all the hardware. It's not easy, and MAD really didn't have
>a clue.
I did read the message that you responded to. I didn't say anything about
any programmers being lazy. Maybe you should read MY message moer
carefully.
jay jefferson
up to the hardware vendors... that's the whole point of Direct X, so
that the game developers don't have to worry about what hardware is in
there. They just make there game fit the Direct X standards and the
hardware vendors driver is left up to making it work with the
hardware... I do agree that overall, PC programmers are getting
"lazier".
-j.
On Wed, 26 Aug 1998 17:07:30 GMT, "Enforcer" <s...@usaor.net> wrote:
>Kyle...just Kyle...
>>
>>Enforcer wrote in message ...
>>>Who's the real moron? The console programmers don't come up with these
>>"new
>>>ways" to program, they just make their games look worse and take out
>>>features to make them run smoothly. PC programmers, on the other hand,
>>>don't program for the same 5 part system every 5 day work week. Every
>>week,
>>>the hardware gets better, and totally different hardware is thrown into
>the
>>>ring, and guess who has to deal with it and make their games run on it?
>PC
>>>PROGRAMMERS! There are what, 2 or MAYBE 3 consoles supported by each
>>>console game, that's nothing compared to the thousands (millions?) of
>>>combinations created by ever advancing PC hardware. So don't put down PC
>>>proggers with such haste...they do more than you originally thought.
>>
>>
>>Actually don't most programmers just program for Direct X now?
>>
>>At any rate the configuration problem is a detraction for me. That's the
>>principle version why PC games are so buggy compared to console games.
>
>
>Maybe you should read the message I was responding to, the person stated
>that PC programmers were "lazy" and things such as that. Even when
>programming for Direct X and it's components, PC programming is still much
>more of an effort than console programming. Many gamers' hardware has
>incompatibilities with DirectX, and many PC programmers make mistakes in
>accounting for all the hardware. It's not easy, and MAD really didn't have
>a clue.
>
>>
Kyle...just Kyle
hol3{SpankMe}usa.net wrote in message
<35ea4df6....@proxyserver.chq.ei>...
>On Wed, 26 Aug 1998 13:26:18 -0400, "Kyle...just Kyle"
><ky...@digital-ages.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>I'm not a particular fan of console gaming, I game where I can and on what
I
>>can. But to label console games as somehow inferior is just wrong. The
>>console entertainment software market is 3X the size of the PC
entertainment
>>software market.
>
>
It's old news, you can find it somewhere...
http://headline.gamespot.com/news/98_03/10_market/index.html
Not exactly 3X, but you catch my drift.
Unknown
yet they use the same engine. eg Doom and Doom II, Quake, Duke Nukem,
Unreal, half Life etc. They are all different games, they some of them
share the same engine. Mods are enhancements to the engine, Something
you will never ever get from any console game. The best you can hope
for in a console game is to be able to either trade or sell it once
you have played and beaten it a couple of times.
On Wed, 26 Aug 1998 13:06:18 -0400, "Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]"
<eri...@ameritech.net> wrote:
>You asked how it modified it so I told you. Di you expect mod's to be new
>games?
>
> Just because the game engine is the same doesn't mean game play is the same.
>Run around shooting like mad in action quake and you will die fast or soon be
>out of ammo. So take yer pick.. PC mods, or console games that you buy that
>are just the same.
>
>
>
>Instead of getting a new game you download a mod.
>> ><
>> >< And it's the same game. How is that especially entertaining?
>> >
>> >Because a "modification" modifies it, Kreskin.
>>
>> How is it a different game though? State a specific mod example.
>
>Kyle...just Kyle wrote:
>
>> Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
>> <35E43E48...@ameritech.net>...
>> >Action Quake has all new weapons, sounds, models, and maps. It has body
>> >damage, head shot kills, leg shit makes u walk wierd.
>>
>> It's still the same game. The only notable thing is body damage, everything
>> else is cosmetic.
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> Digital-Ages Online http://www.digital-ages.com
>> proud owner of a Neo Geo Shinoken cart and a PCE Dracula X!
>> support the rec.games.video.sony NEXUS
>> http://members.aol.com/jakade/
>> ------------------------------
=======================================================
Ron Hines / s69|Ho|3
wr0n...@bigfoot.com / s69-wr...@quakeclan.net
http://quakeclan.net/star69
-------------------------------------------------------
I do whatever my rice krispies tell me to...
=======================================================
Unknown
<ky...@digital-ages.com> wrote:
>
>
>I'm not a particular fan of console gaming, I game where I can and on what I
>can. But to label console games as somehow inferior is just wrong. The
>console entertainment software market is 3X the size of the PC entertainment
>software market.
can you show me statistics on this please? I would like some proof.
>
Kyle...just Kyle
>Exactly. There are several games out there that are not the same game,
>yet they use the same engine. eg Doom and Doom II, Quake, Duke Nukem,
>Unreal, half Life etc. They are all different games, they some of them
>share the same engine. Mods are enhancements to the engine, Something
>you will never ever get from any console game. The best you can hope
>for in a console game is to be able to either trade or sell it once
>you have played and beaten it a couple of times.
It's all about relative advantages and disadvantages. Mods generally aren't
significant enough to interest me. It's kind of like buying a Game Shark
and playing console games with it.
Are those games you mentioned really different though? To a FPS fanatic I'm
sure they are, but to the average gamer most FPS games look and play
similarly.
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
that gams a lot of people want while consoel lacks them. Maybe if I was 12
years old and had a paper route I would like the cheap consoel. But now, at
still only17, with a job at a computer shop I can afford a PC and a console, but
would never buy a console due to the lack of anythign other then platform games,
beat up fighters, and Japanise RPG's. The FF style RPG is so easy compared to a
more "Hard core" RPG found on the PC. Then there is the lack of any flight sims
on console, and the lack of quality driving sims. And the Lack of first perosn
online shooters and RTS games.
Kyle...just Kyle wrote:
> Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
> <35E4408A...@ameritech.net>...
> >You asked how it modified it so I told you. Di you expect mod's to be new
> >games?
> >
> > Just because the game engine is the same doesn't mean game play is the
> same.
> >Run around shooting like mad in action quake and you will die fast or soon
> be
> >out of ammo. So take yer pick.. PC mods, or console games that you buy
> that
> >are just the same.
>
> I asked for a mod that would actually show how a mod would change gameplay
> enough that it would be worthwhile. It may change Quake ( I don't know, I
> shun FPS games ), but apparently not enough to make it worthwhile. So in
> the end it's just the same game with cosmetic and minor gameplay changes.
>
> So console games can't be modded, but you also don't have the problem of
> installation for consoles, as well as paying for the hardware required to
> run PC games.
>
> I'm not a particular fan of console gaming, I game where I can and on what I
> can. But to label console games as somehow inferior is just wrong. The
> console entertainment software market is 3X the size of the PC entertainment
> software market.
>
Pachoo Hiromi
>Doom was ported to the SNES too, but the SNES couldn't handle it so it had to be
>stripped down. The Dreamcast has crippled one-trick geometry and texture
>processors, it does not have a fast all-around CPU like a P2 and it cannot do
>curved surfaces like you see in Unreal. That means even if Unreal is redesigned
>and takes advantage of all odd-million polygons it will look blocky. Not so on
>the PC, were with curved surfaces edges are indistinguishable. Quake 3 uses
>curved surfaces as well, as do all recently announced PC games. And Dreamcast
>has severe memory limitations, as you can tell from the preview screenshots, the
>textures are about 1/2 the size of Quake 2s and about 1/8 the size of Unreals.
>Quake 3 wouldn't even render one frame with such little memory. Sure these games
>could be ported to Dreamcast (although Quake 3 would need a MASSIVE rewrite to
>take advantage of DirectX) but they would be missing those features and many
>more. They would look like cold shit compared to the real PC versions they're
>trying to emulate.
Even if curved surfaces aren't directly supported in hardware, it can
be emulated in software. The Sh-4 processor is beefy enough where it
will be able to handle it. And come on, the SH-4 kicks the P2 chip
series ass where it counts in 3d gaming, FPUs. No computer game right
now will have any trouble being ported to the DC. You are totally
making crap up, trying to convince yourself it is otherwise. Hell the
president of Epic said they have Unreal up and running right now and
the port is EXTREMELY easy. I guess you are going to cry your eyes out
when you see Unreal running better on a DC than it does on your $3000
computer.
>And that's only Dreamcast at it's best. The PC will continue to innovate and use
>new effects and engines, but Dreamcast will only be able to do what it could at
>release. These limitations already show themselves with Dreamcasts already
>lacking features, but once more new features come out in PC games that weren't
>around for Dreamcasts designers to copy when it was made it will just look worse
>and worse.
Christ, you are judging the Dreamcast already and they just NOW have
finally delivered the final spec development kit to game houses? Jeez,
you really are trying to come up with bullshit out of thin air. You're
arguments are so unjustifiable its silly.
>< And the
>< Modem in the Dreamcast is removable....i.e. you can add a cable modem
>< to it.
>
>Sure, if Sega decides to let you have one. They won't, it's not commercially
>viable.
Duh, in interviews they already stated that they were planning on
it....thats the whole reason they didn't hardwire it into the console
you dumbass.
Pachoo Hiromi
>Hmmm ok a sim is NOT any flying game. A si has a REALISTIC flight/driving model.
>Janes F-15 or Longbow 2 for referance. I don't think Quake 3 would be very good on
>any console, that is unless you can use a mouse AND keyboard in the game. And still
>why bother with a non upgradable one? Quake 3 for the computer will have the
>samethings Quake 1 and 2 had, upgraded and MODS. And....do you think the DC will
>want a basically multiplayer ONLY game? And if by some strange chance you do get
>Quake 3 will you be able to play with people that have the PC version? Since the PC
>version will be patched and new versions arn't compatable with old one's NOPE.
>Dreamcast CAN'T do Unreal as well as a voodoo 2 because of the fill rate limitation
>the PRVRSG has. No multiplass rendering hurts it sooo much in a game like unreal.
>TA 2 on the DC? Again, downloadable units, free multiplayer, patches, will you get
>them?
Um, the PVRSG in the Dreamcast has over twice the fillrate of a single
V2 card and has a higher fillrate than even an SLI configuration. Plus
its not hampered by the P2 bottleneck like a V2 is. And yes,
downloadable patches, units are very possible with Dreamcasts modem
and VMS unit to store the info during gameplay. Its quite easy.
Pachoo Hiromi
>What playstation are you using? IMHO the PSX and even the N64 suck big-time
>graphics
>and game-play wise compared with voodoo2. The only excuse now for buying
>a console is price. Dreamcast will use a PowerVR 3D chipset and we all know
>how much
>better voodoo2 is than them.
We do huh? Well thats funny, people like Tom at www.tomshardware.com
says that PVRSG blows the V2 out of the water. And Guess what. The
PVRSG chipset in the Dreamcast is twice as powerful as the one being
deisgned for the PC market, twice the fillrate. So the chipset in
Dreamcast is more powerful than even an SLI configured, $600 V2 setup,
and its not constricted by the P2 FPU limited bottleneck that the V2
has to contend with. Besides, the V2 renders its textures in shitty 16
bit color and has way less precision than does the PVRSG, which has
192 bit precision and renders in 32 bit color. Much better looking.
Pachoo Hiromi
>In article <6s06m6$9bv$1...@eskinews.eskimo.com>, bgo...@eskimo.com says...
>< Anyone hear anything about Console support for Digital TV?, FireWire, HDTV,
>< etc. etc.
><
>< I want better video when I get a Playstation 2/Dreamcast/Nintendo
>< 2000/Jaguar 128...
>
>Deamcast does not support it. And even in a decade or two when consoles do
>support it, you still won't get anywhere near the resolutions you would on a PC.
>PC games on a TNT are at 1600x1200 TODAY. By the time HDTV gets to consoles
>we'll be in the 3 thousands or more.
Dreamcast supports HDTV formating, as well as VGA outputs and S-VHS.
Pachoo Hiromi
>In article <6s1bdo$7hv$1...@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu>, ky...@digital-ages.com
>says...
><
>< H. West wrote in message ...
>< >In article <Pine.HPP.3.95.98082...@river.it.gvsu.edu>,
>< >shim...@river.it.gvsu.edu says...
>< >< I don't like the fact PC game companies requireds better hardwares to
>< make
>< >< better softwares. On the other hand, console game manufactures can
>< >< improve the quality of the game withouth any hardware upgrade.
>< >
>< >A console is always limited by its debut hardware. If the games get better
>< over
>< >time it's because the first games were poorly written and didn't take
>< advantage
>< >of the system completely. You would never find the kind of innovation in
>< >software on a console as you do with every new game on a PC.
><
>< What innovation? Show me where there's no innovation on consoles as opposed
>< to innovation on PCs?
>
>Show me a console game that does something that has never been done bephore.
Durr, lets see. Mario 64 when it came out blew the doors of any PC
games. Sonic Adventure when it debuts this November will do the same,
as will most all of the debut games. These games SIMPLY cannot be done
on today's Pc's, not even close. And if you think they can be, then
you are completly delusional.
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
This is in single pass games, Quake 2 requires 2 Unreal 3 to 4, and Quake 3 should be
arround 4 passes. Voodoo 2 beats it with multipass rendering. And how can u d/l units
unless you have a hard drive to store them on????
Unknown
inovation. Things like this are just a programmers preference.
On Wed, 26 Aug 1998 13:02:53 -0400, "Kyle...just Kyle"
<ky...@digital-ages.com> wrote:
>
>Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
><35E43E98...@ameritech.net>...
>>TA took the RTS area to a new level. 3d units terrain. Elevation line of
>sight.
>>The guys don't hit the target 100% of the time< cough War2 & SC cough>
>
>
>So TA takes RTS to a new level, kind of like Virtua Fighter takes fighters
>to a new level. I don't see any more innovation here...
>
>------------------------------
>Digital-Ages Online http://www.digital-ages.com
>proud owner of a Neo Geo Shinoken cart and a PCE Dracula X!
>support the rec.games.video.sony NEXUS
>http://members.aol.com/jakade/
>------------------------------
>
>
>
=======================================================
Pachoo Hiromi
>In article <6s06m6$9bv$1...@eskinews.eskimo.com>, bgo...@eskimo.com says...
>< Anyone hear anything about Console support for Digital TV?, FireWire, HDTV,
>< etc. etc.
><
>< I want better video when I get a Playstation 2/Dreamcast/Nintendo
>< 2000/Jaguar 128...
>
>Deamcast does not support it. And even in a decade or two when consoles do
>support it, you still won't get anywhere near the resolutions you would on a PC.
>PC games on a TNT are at 1600x1200 TODAY. By the time HDTV gets to consoles
>we'll be in the 3 thousands or more.
You are making shit up again. The TNT hasn't even been sized down to
25 micron yet. No one has their hands on the final mold. You are
completly lying when u say your cousin or whoever has one. No
reviewers have a copy, no magazine, nobody. Manufacturing has not been
completed, and already questions have been raised as to wether or not
it will achieve the fillrate of 200Mpixels that it claims.
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
When did mario 64 come out? Wasn't GL quake alive and kicking back then? I'm not
sure of the date N64 came out so I can't be for sure. Look at the quality in the
textures and sounds of N64 games, or lack there of. The textures are low res,
sounds are low quality. This in part due to the cart storage and low ram of then
N64.
Unknown
On Wed, 26 Aug 1998 14:06:14 -0400, "Kyle...just Kyle"
<ky...@digital-ages.com> wrote:
>
>hol3{SpankMe}usa.net wrote in message
><35e94d62....@proxyserver.chq.ei>...
>>Exactly. There are several games out there that are not the same game,
>>yet they use the same engine. eg Doom and Doom II, Quake, Duke Nukem,
>>Unreal, half Life etc. They are all different games, they some of them
>>share the same engine. Mods are enhancements to the engine, Something
>>you will never ever get from any console game. The best you can hope
>>for in a console game is to be able to either trade or sell it once
>>you have played and beaten it a couple of times.
>
>
>It's all about relative advantages and disadvantages. Mods generally aren't
>significant enough to interest me. It's kind of like buying a Game Shark
>and playing console games with it.
Yep. There are advantages and disadvantages to everything we chose to
do or buy. For instance, Buying a ferrari looks real nice, but wastes
alot more gas than a honda.
With a PC you have to upgrade, buy new hardware, hope to god that this
game will run on your PC real nice like it does on your friends. With
the PC you get more options, you can do more than just play games, you
can do all sorts of things that you cannot do on a console. With the
console there are no hardware compatability problems to contend with,
some people just don't want the hassel of a pc, nor do they care to
try and learn how to use one, other people have the best of both
worlds and just have both.
This is a endless subject that not everyone will argree on.
>
>Are those games you mentioned really different though? To a FPS fanatic I'm
>sure they are, but to the average gamer most FPS games look and play
>similarly.
>
Pachoo Hiromi
>
>
>hahah 5 weeks? I have had my P200 MMX with voodoo 1 for 2 years, no upgrades yet.
>I have frineds that bought PII 400's several months ago and don't plan to upgrade
>for atleast 1 & 1/2 years. And if it is sooooooooo easy to make a PC game lets see
>you make the next Unreal engine, or Quake 2 multiplayer engine.
>
>MAD wrote:
Well thats nice and all, but to be able to get the kind of performance
you will get with the $200 Dreamcast, you better plan to buy a brand
new pc at the end of next year, because until then, nothing even comes
close.
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW]
next year? My PC already has the bets shooters, sims, and RTS games. I doubt a
console will ever have the best of these style of games. You can have yout shallow
Tekken 3, the boering and simple Sonic games while I play Quake 2 and TA and longbow 2.
Pachoo Hiromi
>In article <6s16f4$4s3$1...@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu>, ky...@digital-ages.com
>says...
>< >And console owners can't use addons or conversions for games..
><
>< Which is bad how? Instead of paying for something that's just more levels
>< you get a new game.
>
>Instead of getting a new game you download a mod.
Oh god, yeah a Mod is a completely new game. Whatever. I'd rather buy
Final Fantasy VII then play with some X Men Mod for Quake II that lets
me play with a Wolverine skin. Woohoo, what fun.
Kyle...just Kyle
Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
>LACK OF GAMES?!?!?! How many games will this system have when it arrives
in the US,
>next year? My PC already has the bets shooters, sims, and RTS games. I
doubt a
>console will ever have the best of these style of games. You can have yout
shallow
>Tekken 3, the boering and simple Sonic games while I play Quake 2 and TA
and longbow 2.
You're refusing to see things from the other side of the issue. Many people
think that FPS games are shallow and RTS games are getting boring and
repetitive. And consoles have the best fighters, platformers, and SHMUPS
around. I doubt a PC will ever have the best of these styles of games. You
can have your shallow Quake 2, the boring and simple RTS games while I play
Tekken 3 and Mario 64 and Gradius.
bobr...@my-dejanews.com
Holy Cow TerrryBear <shim...@river.it.gvsu.edu> wrote:
> only morons are obssessed with the resolution of the game. Even for PC,
> most of games are optimized for 640 x 480. And ou need powerful computers
> to play 3D games smoothly and flawelssly in such a high resolution. You
> have to remember, console gamers don't sit one inch away from the monitor.
> We sit more than 4 ft away from a big tv screen. Everything looks fine
> from that distance. Beside, only PC users are stupid. They don't
> understand basic concept of console games and c an't distinguish it from
> PCs. oh btw, i do have a computer too. I upgrade it once every 3 or 6
> month. cuz i am rich. Still, I prefer Sega over PC for games. PC is for
> AOL> HAHAHAHA!!
<snip>
> > < I want better video when I get a Playstation 2/Dreamcast/Nintendo
> > < 2000/Jaguar 128...
> >
> > Deamcast does not support it. And even in a decade or two when consoles do
> > support it, you still won't get anywhere near the resolutions you would on a
PC.
> > PC games on a TNT are at 1600x1200 TODAY. By the time HDTV gets to consoles
> > we'll be in the 3 thousands or more.
Ummmm..... my p200mmx with a orginal monster3D can run games flawlessly at
640x480.. And no I don't upgrade EVERY 3-6 months I just by a new component
every couples of months like the upgrade from a sb16 to sbpci64 or my 33.6 to
56k. And what are you talking about people can see the difference in
resolution. I play tomb raider 2 on my pc in 800x600 and saw it on a
playstation and all i can say is it looks like washed out crap. The
playstation's graphics are expremely grainy. I also watch tv from about 10
feet away from by 31inch tv and i can still see the grainy pixation from
there. And dont get me start on AOHell.
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/rg_mkgrp.xp Create Your Own Free Member Forum
Kyle...just Kyle
>What you guys are forgetting is this is programming, NOT HARDWARE
>inovation. Things like this are just a programmers preference.
There is no more programming innovation on PCs than there is on consoles.
Unknown
kinds of games they like and don't like to play. My fiance hates
quake, but she loves to sit and play Solitare.. go figure.. haha
On Wed, 26 Aug 1998 14:36:11 -0400, "Kyle...just Kyle"
<ky...@digital-ages.com> wrote:
>
>Eric Whalen Ominous[CW] wrote in message
><35E454DB...@ameritech.net>...
>>LACK OF GAMES?!?!?! How many games will this system have when it arrives
>in the US,
>>next year? My PC already has the bets shooters, sims, and RTS games. I
>doubt a
>>console will ever have the best of these style of games. You can have yout
>shallow
>>Tekken 3, the boering and simple Sonic games while I play Quake 2 and TA
>and longbow 2.
>
>
>You're refusing to see things from the other side of the issue. Many people
>think that FPS games are shallow and RTS games are getting boring and
>repetitive. And consoles have the best fighters, platformers, and SHMUPS
>around. I doubt a PC will ever have the best of these styles of games. You
>can have your shallow Quake 2, the boring and simple RTS games while I play
>Tekken 3 and Mario 64 and Gradius.
>
>------------------------------
>Digital-Ages Online http://www.digital-ages.com
>proud owner of a Neo Geo Shinoken cart and a PCE Dracula X!
>support the rec.games.video.sony NEXUS
>http://members.aol.com/jakade/
>------------------------------
>
=======================================================
Pachoo Hiromi
>What does market size have to do with one being better then the other? PC has
>that gams a lot of people want while consoel lacks them. Maybe if I was 12
>years old and had a paper route I would like the cheap consoel. But now, at
>still only17, with a job at a computer shop I can afford a PC and a console, but
>would never buy a console due to the lack of anythign other then platform games,
>beat up fighters, and Japanise RPG's. The FF style RPG is so easy compared to a
>more "Hard core" RPG found on the PC. Then there is the lack of any flight sims
>on console, and the lack of quality driving sims. And the Lack of first perosn
>online shooters and RTS games.
>
Do you even know anything about PC RPGs? I don't think you do if youa
re even trying to compare them to Console rpg's right now. They suck
in general except for one game, Fallout. Name one other good PC RPG
released lately.
The Home of Whopper Cow House
polygons and more gore. See, I am not really in fond of 3D. I love 2D
games like Capcom or Neo Geo fighters. Those better 3D graphics doens't
really wow me. The truth is PC cann't handle 2D actions like Street
fighter alpha or the king of fighters series. That is why I like consoles
better. I like PC RPGs though. I like Wizardly series. ;)
TakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoShimizuTakeoS
I am spinning round and round dizzy from you
The sky is dark they call it stormy weather
You look to God for him to show you light
Who's playing games playing with your feelings
I want your love
What can I do
I want to share do you dare to come to my life now
Just come inside and dream with me
I have a vision call I love fantasy
So come on and please hold me tight
Together we'll fly all thought every night
You know I've got nothing but love in my heart
Forget the past and let's start
Just wild heaven for you and for me
Winds are blowing in passion
Love is mystery
Just like dreamers we are living on lies
Who knows what the future may hold
A world full of laughter that we may create
Just like wild heaven..
By the way, is this too long? I am tired.
TerrryBear