Poxers of the world, unite!
Kim Allen Andrus
There is a feeling that I think I share with many of you out there...the
lurking suscipsion that Pox is a strong card, and is, like necropotence,
just waiting to find the right something that will bring out its true
potential.
I have also heard occasional rumors of "decent" Pox decks among us,
but nothing really solid and threatening has emerged in the tourney scene.
So, as a believer in Pox, I would like to make my contribution to this
newsgroup by beginning a serious thread on Pox strategy. I would later
compile the findings and major ideas into a document. I'd also like
all you Poxers out there to email me your nastiest Pox-based deck, and
I will include in the Pox Document all the submitted decks.
Now, to begin the discussion:
Pox as a (Type II) thinking strategy, a theme-based strategy, and
as a disruptor.
There is no question that Pox is a thinking man's (or woman's) card. The
fact that it will potentially damage you as much as your opponent
requires you to be extremely wise when playing it, or it may be more
advantageous to your opponent. In fact, you can almost consider your
self to be at a natural disadvantage when playing Pox -- if, for example,
the # of lands, # in hand, # of creatures, # of life for you and your
opponent are all equal, you not only hurt yourself just as much as them,
but have wasted, if not an entire turn, at least 3 black mana for
nothing (not considering the relative values creatures/lands to be sacced,
etc).
Thus Pox as a strategy requires the player to know how to manipulate
resources, recognize opposing strategies, and, yes, have some basic
mathematical skills.
The great thing about Pox, the thing that makes many of us feel that it
is a sleeping giant, is that it does everything that black is good at.
Namely:
Hand destruction
Land destruction
Creature removal
Direct damage
Hurt yourself
Aside from the last, these four are in themselves already either
potent themes (hand & land d) or essential elements of most strategies
(creature removal, direct d). The sub-themes that often accompany
themes (like reanimation and creature recycling) also are worthy of
consideration when building the Pox deck.
It makes sense, then, that an effective Pox deck will be built around
one or two of these themes, and incorporate Pox as a do-it-all
disruption of the opponents game as well as an element aiding in your
theme. An effective Pox deck will also be designed to make sure
Pox's effects on your own development and resources are as minimal as
possible.
When putting together a Pox deck, some special issues should be considered,
such as:
1. How do I insure that I won't manascrew myself? (special
consideration of mana sources)
2. How do I insure that Pox won't lower my life so much
that I'll be too vulnerable to death by creatures
or direct damage? (life gaining measures, or
special direct d/creature precautions)
3. How do I keep from breaking out into uncontrollable laughter
and pointing my finger at my opponent, when I win by
doing the final point of damage to my opponent with Pox
4. How to keep from acquiring the habit of growling, in a
Texan accent,"It's roundup time, pardner!" after each Pox
---Well I hope this will provide enough to get a good Pox discussion
going. Again I remind you all to email me those Pox decks.
Hasta,
Kim
--
Kim Andrus MA-TESL Program
ki...@bgnet.bgsu.edu Bowling Green State University
Vincent Saldell
Notice that Pox doesnt remove any artifacts - so plenty of noncreature
artifacts will make Pox net you a resource advantage.
Generally maxcost of artifacts ought to be 3, since more costly arti-
facts tends to be stuck in your hand if you have poxed.
>Aside from the last, these four are in themselves already either
>potent themes (hand & land d) or essential elements of most strategies
>(creature removal, direct d). The sub-themes that often accompany
>themes (like reanimation and creature recycling) also are worthy of
>consideration when building the Pox deck.
Im actually into playing creatureless (sometimes using factories)
when making a poxdeck - since you then will not bite yourself as much
when poxing.
>It makes sense, then, that an effective Pox deck will be built around
>one or two of these themes, and incorporate Pox as a do-it-all
>disruption of the opponents game as well as an element aiding in your
>theme. An effective Pox deck will also be designed to make sure
>Pox's effects on your own development and resources are as minimal as
>possible.
>When putting together a Pox deck, some special issues should be considered,
>such as:
> 1. How do I insure that I won't manascrew myself? (special
> consideration of mana sources)
> 2. How do I insure that Pox won't lower my life so much
> that I'll be too vulnerable to death by creatures
> or direct damage? (life gaining measures, or
> special direct d/creature precautions)
> 3. How do I keep from breaking out into uncontrollable laughter
> and pointing my finger at my opponent, when I win by
> doing the final point of damage to my opponent with Pox
> 4. How to keep from acquiring the habit of growling, in a
> Texan accent,"It's roundup time, pardner!" after each Pox
>---Well I hope this will provide enough to get a good Pox discussion
>going. Again I remind you all to email me those Pox decks.
Ill post my best poxdeck so far (its allmost into tourneyclass, but
not quite - yet at least).
6 swamps
7 mountains
4 sulphurous springs
4 strip mines
4 dark rituals
2 sol grails
2 barbed sextants
1 zuran orb
4 the rack
2 disrupting sceptres
4 lightning bolts
3 incinerates
3 guerilla tactics
2 pyrokinesis
2 earthquakes
2 primal justices
4 hymn to tourach
4 pox
As you see, it uses the fact that both will end up abit low in life
by a heavy bolt-theme, and also a rather strong creatureless discard-
strategy.
Problem is the use of only a few black cards, and then cards with
double or triple (!) black in casting cost. My answer to this is
dark rituals, sol grails and barbed sextants.
Here is another poxdeck I made that looks smoother - but it is still
inferior to the boltpox deck:
14 swamps
4 strip mines
4 mishras factories
4 dark rituals
2 sol grails
1 zuran orb
4 the rack
2 disrupting sceptre
4 urzas bauble
4 aeolipiles
4 icequake
4 hymn to thourach
4 hypnotic spectres
3 contagion
2 demonic consultations
Problem with this deck is that weeniedecks tends to not getting
stopped good enough by the land destruction theme, and that poxes
are dangerous to one selfs life total both versus weenies and
boltsdecks. A goblindeck for instance eats this deck alive.
In general I have found out that 18 cards will probably be
in any poxdeck I make: 4 hymns, 4 poxes, 4 the rack,
2 disrupting sceptres (and 4 dark rituals :-)
-Vincent Saldell
BRausch950
heres a pox deck i built that p;ayed fairly well when the opponent was not
loaded down with direct damage.
4 pox
4 pestilence
4 cemetary gates
3 earthquakes
4 incinerates
4 lightning bolt
4 dark ritual
4 fountain of youth
1 zuron orb
3 sheild sphere
1 demonic consultation
4 hymn to tourach
4 sulphurous springs
10 swamps
6 mountains
sideboard
I forget the whole sideboard but it went something like this
3 anarcy
3 dark banashing
4 guerilla tacticts
1 feldons
4 pyroblasts
the deck had a semi locking mechanism when a pestilence and a cemetary
gates stayed on the board. I eventually stopped playtesting the deck
because players with a solid red base turned our duels into a race for
zero which turned most duels into random acts of kindness. the deck did
have a good ratio of wins against necro- arount 55-60%.
Any advice on this deck would be appreiated, so maybe i could bring it
back into existence.
Jason Davis
In the Pox deck I've been developing for the past few weeks I've been
using the baubles (Urza's and Lodestone) as a way to throw away cards in
my hand before Poxing and then regain them in the aftermath.
This goes along with the idea of using artifacts and/or enchantments in
your deck because Pox has no effect on them.
I think Mono-Black is the best way to run Pox becasue of the three black
mana requirement and every time you cast the spell you have to lose
land. Mishra's and The Rack (combined with Hymns and Disrupting
Sceptres) make good additional damage sources. A few Pump Knights can be
helpful even if you'll only get a few attacks out of each one.
Just some random thoughts that have been floating in my head since I
started playing around with this card.
Jason Davis
Jeff D. Barnes
Hmmm... been working on a Pox deck for the last week or so.
Basically, it's primarily (gasp) land destruction. I decided to ditch
the hymns after I got sick of drawing GTactics with them... or drawing
them too late in the game for them to matter.
Here's the deck, with comments attached:
BLACK
3 Pox I found that 4 was too many, 2 not enough.
4 Icequake Self-explanatory
4 Dark Ritual Fast mana
2 Soul Burn Recoup a bit of lost life. Not Drain Life, because
I usually don't have enough black to make it effective.
2 Terror Take care of big citters. Not Dark Banishing; how many
big artifact creatures have you seen of late?
RED
3 Pillage Kill that land -- or that Z'orb
3 Pyroclasm The deck tends to get eaten alive by weenies w/o these.
4 Lightning Bolt Kill critters -- or do damage after a Pox
2 Fireball Mostly to damage the opponent or kill big creatures
1 Mudslide Love this card; wish I had more.
ARTIFACTS
2 Gustha's Scepter Neat card to stop losing cards from a Pox. Also good
vs. early Hymns
1 F of Youth Recoup life during the post-Pox/LD period
1 Zuran Orb Round the edges off the Pox land loss
2 Lodestone Bauble Recover lands lost to the Pox
1 Black Vise Great after LD. Damage, damage.
1 Feldon's Cane Get everything back
1 Jayemdae Tome Draw like a madman
LAND
4 Strip Mines Land destruction
1 Sulfurous Spring Dual land, but I'm thinking of either adding another Swamp
or Lava Tubes in its place
2 Lava Tubes Dual land, no pain
9 Mountains
8 Swamps
SIDEBOARD (currently in flux)
2 Dystopia Must... kill... Land Tax...
4 Pyroblast Must... stop... Stasis...
2 Anarchy White Weenie is still *very* popular here...
4 Guerilla Tactics ...but Necro is finally coming on strong
1 Pillage General use, esp. vs. Stasis
2 ??? Need something vs. red blast decks, but dunno what
Basically, you blow up their lands. If they get creatures out, you blow
them up, too. After the intial rush, there tends to be a respite where
neither deck does much. Bide your time, put out a FoY and Mudslide, blow
up lands they get, put out a Jayemdae the second you get it.
Poxes reduce their life by 1/3, giving you a shot at their life via
Bolts, Fireballs, and/or Soul Burns.
Big problems: early hymns if you don't have the Scepters down, and red
blast decks.
Neatest first turn play so far: I draw my eight. Play a swamp, 2 G's
Scepters, Lodestone Bauble. Pop 2 cards under the Scepters, ritual,
Pox. Didn't do a whole lot, but it was impressive-looking nevertheless. =)
Comments?
-Jeff
Stil
Kim Allen Andrus (ki...@bgnet.bgsu.edu) wrote:
: The great thing about Pox, the thing that makes many of us feel that it
: is a sleeping giant, is that it does everything that black is good at.
: Namely:
: Hand destruction
: Land destruction
: Creature removal
: Direct damage
: Hurt yourself
: It makes sense, then, that an effective Pox deck will be built around
: one or two of these themes, and incorporate Pox as a do-it-all
B
: disruption of the opponents game as well as an element aiding in your
: theme. An effective Pox deck will also be designed to make sure
: Pox's effects on your own development and resources are as minimal as
: possible.
I think you've fairly accurately described the way a pox deck should be
created. To be focused around one of the themes above. Let's review the
themes now.
Creature Removal & Hurt Yourself: These two themes are out the window,
as you cannot be sure your opponent will have creatures to remove, and
there is no mirror in type 2.
Hand Destruction: This, I feel, is the best way to run the pox deck,
second only to direct damage. Consider:
4 Pox
4 Ritual (The dark one. :) )
4 Hymn
4 Consult
4 Disks
4 Spectres
4 Racks
4 Strip Mine
2 Sticks (Disrupting Sceptres)
2 Drains
24 Swamps
You'll either Pox on turn 1, pulling an average of two cards from your
opponent (always let them go first, to kill their early permanents),
then rack or strip or consult for a hymn on turn 2, then hymn or pox on
turn 3, depending on whether or not you got the ritual. You opponent has
lost 4 cards (average) to the discarding aspect, and likely 2 from the
pox (land & permanent), which leaves them with 2 cards. Pop down a rack,
and they are really hurting quickly. I know I haven't gone into much
detail, but I will if there is interest. I want to hit the other ways to
run the deck.
Land Destruction:
This works, but like all LD, it can be tempermental. Let's look at a
deck:
4 Pox
4 Ritual
4 Strip Mine
4 Evil Presence (yes, they work)
4 Icequake
4 Blight (yes, they work. Try them)
4 Disk (need defense)
2 Lodestone Bauble (For yourself)
2 Misinformation (For them. :))
1 Black Vise
4 Mishra
2 Drain Life
22 Swamp
This is the weakest of the 3, very little defense.
Direct Damage:
This was ok before, but now with Alliances, it's a little bit better.
4 Pox
4 Ritual
4 Disk
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Incinerate
4 Tactics
3 Pyroclasm
1 Black Vise
3 Consultation
4 Erg Raiders
2 Pump Knights
4 Sulf. Springs
2 Lava Tubes
2 City of Brass
2 Mountains
11 Swamps
1st turn pox, they are at 13. Second turn bolt, they are at 10. Third
turn Incinerate, they are at 7. 4th turn Tactics & Consult for a pox,
they are at 5. 5th turn pox & Bolt/Incinerate. Death
sorry I wasn't really specific on any of the strategies, but I wanted to
cover all three.
john
-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-
The contraction "You're" does not indicate possessive. It indicates a
state of being, or, more commonly, a description of the person being
addressed.
The word "Your" does indicate possesive. It does NOT indicate a state of
being, or a description.
-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-
Jeff
Since we on the subject of Pox here... Here is the Pox deck I
played at the California Regionals... I didn't make the cut,
but I didn't too bad either. As you can see it is pretty much a
Necro deck with Pox in lieu of Necro.
4 Nevi's Disk
4 Aeolipile
1 Zuran Orb
4 Dark Ritual
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Hypnotic Spectres
4 Knights of Stromgald
2 Order of the Ebon Hand
2 Drain Life
3 Pox
1 Sengir
1 Demonic Consultation
18 Swamps
4 Strips
4 Mishra's Factory
Sideboard
2 Icy Manipulator
2 Serrated Arrows
2 Gloom
2 Weakness
2 Meekstone
1 Drain Life
2 Walking wall
2 Dark Banishing
Alliances cards I am considering adding...
1 Lode Stone Bauble <Sideboard>
2 Contagion <1 in SB, 1 in deck>
3 Dystopia <3 in SB>
1 Thawing Glaciers <in Deck>
1 Gusta's Sceptre <or however ya spell it :p>
Jeff
SMEULDERS J.C.F.
-------------
stuff deleted
-------------
>When putting together a Pox deck, some special issues should be considered,
>such as:
> 1. How do I insure that I won't manascrew myself? (special
> consideration of mana sources)
> 2. How do I insure that Pox won't lower my life so much
> that I'll be too vulnerable to death by creatures
> or direct damage? (life gaining measures, or
> special direct d/creature precautions)
> 3. How do I keep from breaking out into uncontrollable laughter
> and pointing my finger at my opponent, when I win by
> doing the final point of damage to my opponent with Pox
> 4. How to keep from acquiring the habit of growling, in a
> Texan accent,"It's roundup time, pardner!" after each Pox
I've been trying pox for a couple of months now and have come to the
conclusion that a mono-black pox deck is a risky thing. Main problem was issue
2 over and over again. My opponents began to see how the deck worked and
discarded their medium/large creatures and used their small ones to bring me
to 0 life-points.
I've tried a total destruction (both land-hand destruction) which worked out
nice but pox simply wasn't a good card in this deck. It simply destroyed my
own hippies. I've also been trying a red/black direct damage/pox deck. It
worked reasonbly well, but it had the same problem a lot of pox decks will
have: if you don't have a dark ritual in your hands, it's going to be a tough
cookie to cast it early on in the game, which you will have to do if you don't
want to start spending valuable direct damage cards on creatures your opponent
is bound to bring out.
So one thing I learned form this all is that your are going to need lots of
mana support. Jeweled amulets, barbed sextants, fellwarstones. etc.
Also you're going to need a way to get rid of your opponent last life points
after casting a pox or two AND you are going to need a way to get rid of his
creatures.Now there is a black card which can do both: PESTILENCE and it will
work great with your mana support. Throw in mishras factories and for one mana
each turn you can keep your pestilence in play (look in the latest duelist for
the ruling on the end of turn sequence)
This was the deck I played :
4 pox
4 dark ritual
4 hymn to tourach
3 pestilence
2 demonic consultation
4 "2/2 flyer-come back at end of turn when in graveyard creatures"
2 CoP black
2 disenchents
3 StP
1 Land tax
4 jeweled amultes
4 barbed sextants
1 zuran orb
1 fountain of youth
11 swamps
8 plains
4 mishra's factory
62 cards
One of the ideas I want to look into is a necro-pox deck. Anybody tried that
one? How do you ensure that your life points are not going below a certain
level?
Jeroen
Kim Allen Andrus
There have been some great responses to this thread! Thanks also
for posting or emailing me those decks. I just want to sum up off the
top of my head a few of the ideas floating, which there seems to be
a general consensus about.
1. Discard is perhaps the strongest element to build on.
2. Defense is a MAJOR concern, and must be dealt with.
Most decks I've seen are too vulnerable to creatures
or a bit of direct damage.
Disks are nice but basically rule out other artifact
support. Pestilence/Withering wisps are nice, if you
can keep it in play.
3. Artifact mana sources are mighty helpful (don't function
with disks as defense, though)
4. The inclusion of red is an definate option, to make
the deck more offensively geared.
5. The inclusion of white is an option, to make the deck more
geared towards defense.
One thing that no one has touched on: speed.
If the deck is offensively/agressively oriented, it will need to beat
the opponent to the punch. Also, speed helps reduces Pox's discard
effect on yourself (or completely eliminates it, if you can keep your
hand empty).
The quick Pox deck is perhaps best seen in the b/r bolt versions.
I could even see this deck leaving out discard and adding lim-dul's vaults,
pulling up the Poxs and bolts immediately, and using weenines such as
pump-knights to take out some additional life points, as well as
buying time through kamikazi blocking/creature standoffs. Tri-color Pox
might be asking too much, though.
Where we have seen red as defense/finishing, white as defense, how would
blue work with Pox? Anything in blue other than lim-dul's vault useful?
-Hasta,
Kim
(Recently overheard as I approached the multi-player tables -- "Oh no,
here comes Poxboy!"
"He's not on my team!"
"Well, no way he's on my team!")
Muahaha.
Kendall Redburn
Pox is good as a fast kill with black/red.
I use
Vampire Bats
Ashen Ghoul
pox
Dark Ritual
Winter Orb!
bolts
Lands Edge
Unholy Strength
Shatter
Pox/winter orb creates an environment in which mana is rare. Opponent
gets 1 creature out, I pox, lowers opponents life, kills creature,
destroys land, removes cards. I would probably add guerilla tactics to
this also. Part of the key is not to lay more than 4 land down at any
one time.
Kendall
Mastursatan In San Diego
Since I saw your W/B Pox-Pestilence deck i tinkered with those colors and
heres what I have.
4 Pox
4 Pestilence
4 Dark Ritual
2 Drain Life
4 Hymn To Tourach
2 Demonic Consultation
2 Blinking Spirit (Might eat my mana when resummoning?)
1 Ivory Gargoyles
2 Disenchant
3 Cop Black
1 Balance
1 Land Tax
2 Sol Grail
3 Barbed Sextant
2 Jeweled Amulet
2 Fountain of Youth
1 Zorb
4 Mishra's Factorie
12 Swamp
8 Plains
Haven't actually put this one together yet, don't know exactly how it
will run, looks alot like your deck i suppose, but the sol grails really
help get the black mana. I'm not sure about zorb in any pox deck, but i
put it in anyway, if you pox twice or three times and they have a
fireball your screwed, but with the zorb your alive one more turn, only
drawback is you'll never have much land so it will really hurt to sack
it.
---Mastursatan
"Uhhh... what was I doing? Just Mastursatan."
Alex Rhomberg
Stil wrote:
> 4 Pox
> 4 Ritual
> 4 Strip Mine
> 4 Evil Presence (yes, they work)
> 4 Icequake
> 4 Blight (yes, they work. Try them)
> 4 Disk (need defense)
> 2 Lodestone Bauble (For yourself)
> 2 Misinformation (For them. :))
> 1 Black Vise
> 4 Mishra
> 2 Drain Life
> 22 Swamp
Can't believe nearly all of you missed this absolutely great card
combined with discard: Misinformation. My Pox deck was Pox, Hymns, 12
bolts. I put in two Lodestone Baubles for myself and two Misinformation.
Misinformation really rocks, especially combined with LD and and
discard. I once managed to hold someone at ZERO land for several turns.
If the opponent doesn't have enough lands, Misinformation is like a
THREE TURN TIMEWALK (for B :-)) I decided to try some more LD (pillage)
From the top of my head, I have:
3 Pox
12 Bolts (Incinerate, Tactics)
4 Hymns
4 Dark Rituals
4 Disks (probably too much, could go into sideboard)
4 Misinformation
4 Mishra's
4 Strips
Zorb (of course)
Assorted land
Against discard, it worked great. Against fast R/G, it died miserably.
For those,
one should have all the disks and probably sideboard in some racks and
hold back with the poxes (if opponent has as many bolts and GT, poxes
help him a LOT) This deck doesn't win everything, but it sure is fun to
pox! (and with some more LD, it could really kick ass)
--
_________________________________________________________________
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| Institut fuer Elektronik Fax: +41 1 632 12 10 |
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Lennart Qvarnstrom
jsh...@mason2.gmu.edu (Stil) wrote:
<snip>
>Hand Destruction: This, I feel, is the best way to run the pox deck,
>second only to direct damage. Consider:
>4 Pox
>4 Ritual (The dark one. :) )
>4 Hymn
>4 Consult
>4 Disks
>4 Spectres
>4 Racks
>4 Strip Mine
>2 Sticks (Disrupting Sceptres)
>2 Drains
>24 Swamps
<Snip>
Ok, some things are missing.
A) Non- land mana. Jeweled amulet, possibly Sol grail.
B) Continuity. Zur's Wierding. It's broken, it's a killer.
C) Fast damage. Insidious Bookworms w. Unholy str? Unstable Mutation?
Painlands? Pain is irrelevant.
Suggestion;
4 City of Brass
4 Underground River
11 Swamp
19
2 Sol Grail
4 Dark Ritual
6
3 Demonic Consultation
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Pox
11
4 Initiates of the Ebon Hand
4 Soldevi Sentry
2 Insidious Bookworms
12
1 Balance
1 Land Tax
1 Zuran orb
3 The Rack
6
4 Unstable Mutation
3 Zur's Wierding
6
Sigh... Already I see some weaknesses. Got to try this
some day, tho'.
Lennart Qvarnstrom
Mikkel EJRNAES
Stil wrote:
>
> Kim Allen Andrus (ki...@bgnet.bgsu.edu) wrote:
>
> : The great thing about Pox, the thing that makes many of us feel that it
> : is a sleeping giant, is that it does everything that black is good at.
> : Namely:
> : Hand destruction
> : Land destruction
> : Creature removal
> : Direct damage
> : Hurt yourself
>
> : It makes sense, then, that an effective Pox deck will be built around
> : one or two of these themes, and incorporate Pox as a do-it-all
> B
> : disruption of the opponents game as well as an element aiding in your
> : theme. An effective Pox deck will also be designed to make sure
> : Pox's effects on your own development and resources are as minimal as
> : possible.
>
> I think you've fairly accurately described the way a pox deck should be
> created. To be focused around one of the themes above. Let's review the
> themes now.
>
> Creature Removal & Hurt Yourself: These two themes are out the window,
> as you cannot be sure your opponent will have creatures to remove, and
> there is no mirror in type 2.
>
> second only to direct damage. Consider:
>
> 4 Pox
> 4 Ritual (The dark one. :) )
> 4 Hymn
> 4 Consult
> 4 Disks
> 4 Spectres
> 4 Racks
> 4 Strip Mine
> 2 Sticks (Disrupting Sceptres)
> 2 Drains
> 24 Swamps
>
> opponent (always let them go first, to kill their early permanents),
> then rack or strip or consult for a hymn on turn 2, then hymn or pox on
> turn 3, depending on whether or not you got the ritual. You opponent has
> lost 4 cards (average) to the discarding aspect, and likely 2 from the
> pox (land & permanent), which leaves them with 2 cards. Pop down a rack,
> and they are really hurting quickly. I know I haven't gone into much
> detail, but I will if there is interest. I want to hit the other ways to
> run the deck.
>
On the subject of hand destruction, I'd like to advocate a bit for my
pox deck, which is a tough competitor:
Basically the deck tries to deplete ressources and does suceed so often
that it is a thrill. The deck runs as this:
Black:
4 x Hymn to Tourach
4 x Hypnotic Spectre
4 x Pox
4 x Order of the Ebon Hand
2 x Dark Ritual
2 x Dance of the Dead
2 x Demonic Consultation
White:
1 x Balance
1 x Land Tax
Artifacts:
4 x Nevinyrral's Disk
4 x Urza's Bauble
4 x Barbed Sextants
1 x Zuran Orb
1 x The Rack
Land:
4 x Strip Mine
1 x Plains
17 x Swamp
1 x Ebon Stronghold
A couple of comments:
only 2 dark rituals? Yes, I find that this deck doesn't really need the
speed the rituals offer, because when the pox lands a lot is going down
the drain, and you really don't need to waste cards to get speed when
you want cards to kill.
Why diluting the deck with silly cantrips when you said you wanted cards
to kill---cantrips don't kill! No, but they provide a very important
support so that pox wont hurt youself as much as it hurts opponent.
Remember after a turn three pox the play area depleted for cards which
means that if you can get a one card advantage over opponent you are in
a much stronger position, since both players has lost 1/3 life.
Why dilut the deck with white (after all it's supposed to be a pure evil
deck)? Well, 1st of all these white cards are sooo good, that you just
have to consider them when building a deck. Second support for them were
already there since I use 4 sextants and believe me, when this deck
draws balance be carefull, because a lot of the time it'll just be
sitting doing nothing in you hand, but when used correctly you will win.
Actually this might be an argument for banning balance (ala mind twist).
Playing style: Relaxed if you're not playing against willowgeddon or
other miscellanous weenie decks, don't pox until turn opponent has 4
lands in play. That way you'll nuke to lands which will set them back a
great deal. Follow up with a hymn, and let the order/spectre do the
rest.
Best play so far:
hand: swamp, swamp, swamp, sextant, sextant, pox, hymn
turn 1: draw order of the ebon hand, play swamp -> sextant
turn 2: draw sextant, play swamp -> 2 x sextant
turn 3: draw swamp, play swamp -> pox, send mana through all three
sextants discard swamp.
At this time my opponent had out 1 creature and 4 lands 5 cards in hand.
From there it was downhill for the opponent. He went to 0 creatures, 2
lands, 3 cards in hand. I went to 0 creatures, 2 lands, 2 cards in hand
(5 next upkeep).
I got a strip mine as the next card which took out his last mountain and
he was toast. A lonely Order of the Ebon Hand don't have to run very far
after a pox to kill the opponent.
A little note: To minimize the downside of pox on myself I play with a
deck that can run on _very_ little mana, as this deck is capeable of
sending any deck to mana death! Quite impressive, but true.
This deck crushes defensive blue/white decks for breakfast,
> Land Destruction:
[deck snipped]
Every pox deck should pack 4 strip mines, because the disruption caused
by pox followed up by a strip mine, can send a opponent to the canvas.
> Direct Damage:
[deck snipped]
I tried this (only with some goblins+grenades as well) but It didn't
work nearly as good, because pox would ruin myself as well, and
especially my need for colored mana.
> john
>
> -/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-/|\-
> The contraction "You're" does not indicate possessive. It indicates a
> state of being, or, more commonly, a description of the person being
> addressed.
> The word "Your" does indicate possesive. It does NOT indicate a state of
> being, or a description.
> -\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-
--
Mikkel Ejrnaes
ejr...@na47sun05.cern.ch
http://na47sun05.cern.ch/~ejrnaes/
Tianrah
It seems to me that people may have overlooked a few cards that go great
in Pox decks: these are all artifacts which in effect "store" card
advantage to be regained after casting Pox. The cards are:
1) Urza's bauble - worked wonders in my Pox deck. Play it, it's an
artifact that is unaffected by Pox. After Poxing, use it to pop a card
back into your hand. Retain card advantage and play Pox at the same time!
2) Barbed Sextant and Astrolabe - Having trouble getting 3 black mana for
Pox? These guys help, and they have the same effect as Urza's
bauble...keeping card advantage safely out of Pox's way.
3) This card is just asking for a Pox deck to help:
Gustha's Scepter
0
Artifact
If Gustha's Scepter leaves play or you lose control of it, put all cards
under Gustha's Scepter into your graveyard. T: Put any card from
your hand face down under Gustha's Scepter. You may look at that
card at any time. T: Return any card under Gustha's Scepter to your
hand.
As soon as I saw this card in Alliances, I thought about draggin my Pox
deck back out of the graveyard (no pun intended).
Thanks for starting this thread, and making a summary of it! Best
discussion I've seen in weeks.
Stil
: 2. Defense is a MAJOR concern, and must be dealt with.
: Most decks I've seen are too vulnerable to creatures
: or a bit of direct damage.
: Disks are nice but basically rule out other artifact
: support. Pestilence/Withering wisps are nice, if you
: can keep it in play.
: 3. Artifact mana sources are mighty helpful (don't function
: with disks as defense, though)
: 4. The inclusion of red is an definate option, to make
: the deck more offensively geared.
: 5. The inclusion of white is an option, to make the deck more
: geared towards defense.
Ok, I'll go over these 5 points.
1. Discard
I agree. Discard is the strongest because poxes are hymns+, to put it
bluntly. Which gives you 8 hymns to play with. This gets brutal quickly,
with a few racks.
2. Defense
This is really the only reason that I don't have a pox deck built at
the moment. The complete and utter lack of defense is just a little TOO
scary. I use a completely offensive T1 deck, but it T1, you have the
speed to do it. Type 2, it's a lot tougher. I really like the disks as
defense, simply because you don't play with that many permanents, and
the only thing I don't like about them is that you may lose your racks.
But, if you need to disk, your racks are not helping you enough anyway.
3. Artifact Mana = Good
This one, I haven't tried. It seems like a good idea, considering how
fast pox decks lose their land, but what can be done for defense if you
are using artifact mana? Also, it slows down the speed of the kill,
which (to me) is not what you want to do with this sort of a deck.
4. Red = Good.
I definately agree. Bolts (not fireballs, and other x spells because
they cost waaaay too much mana) are an excellent option, but keeping a
red producing land around can be difficult. Bolts/Racks/HD seems to work
the best, because you have out permanent threats (hippie, rack) that
they need to use cards to get rid of, but if you can keep a rack out,
they will be less likely to use their cards, especially after a pox.
5. White = Option
I don't know about this one. Yes, defense is nice, and the deck needs
it, but you are slowing the kill down again. What white will you add?
You can't add plows, because that 4 life from ernie will keep them alive
longer than you. Balance & Land tax are the only options I see..
: Where we have seen red as defense/finishing, white as defense, how would
: blue work with Pox? Anything in blue other than lim-dul's vault useful?
Better off using the consults, I think. No splicing to another color,
and you have what you want without paying what little life you have left
after a pox.
Allan Grooby
With all this talk on POX in the net here is my latest version,it is
built for speed with enough consideration to defense?HAHA as should be
given\can be given in a pox deck
4 pox
4 demonic consultations
4 dark rituals
4 lightening bolts
4 incinerates
4 hyppies(makes them keep their anti creature in)
4 hymms
4 racks(disrupts their play and makes the, keep their anti artifact)
1 balance
4 paraylses
4 felware stones
4 strip mines
4 cities of brass
2 lava tubes
4 sulphourus springs
10 swamps
This version has over come the previous versions major weekness of mana
now has 32 total or 28 if you count the non land as halves which I do it
also has more defense inthe form of 8 bolts instead of the 6 in the prev
The DC's also give the deck a new dimension.I do miss not having more
creatures ie the Ghouls and nether shadows but you just carn't have
everything!!
Sideboard not sure yet,
glooms,terrors,guerillia tatics,animate deads(maybe in the main
deck),pryoblasts,shatters,icy's????????
Your comments please
BTW I have played around with a necro version a few months ago
3 Necro
3 pox
8 pumpknights
4 black knights
4 thrull retainers
4 unholy strength
4 hyppies
4 hymms
4 racks
4 dark rituals
4 strips
16 swamps
This deck is just plain evil to play and to play against it plays like a
speed black which as usual does big time damage 1st 3-4 turns before
they establish any D,the necro of course gives you card advantage and
the pox was a straight kill card either to do big damage before an
attack which finishes them off or to get there hand low enough to have
them die on the rack,has the advantage of being straight black too.
for the side board
gloom,deathgrips,disks,paralyse
usually didn't need to sideboard only where they were playing with speed
or necro black or prot black creatures
again comments welcome
Lurch
The only life you have to worry about is theirs-Pox it
IHorizon
Also, don't forget that POX is all about 1's, 2's, 3's and 4's!
Memorize the 1/3 rounded-up formula and work it out each turn for both
you and your opponent.
Stil
Mikkel EJRNAES (ejr...@na47sun05.cern.ch) wrote:
: Stil wrote:
: Basically the deck tries to deplete ressources and does suceed so often
: that it is a thrill. The deck runs as this:
(deck deleted)
: the drain, and you really don't need to waste cards to get speed when
: you want cards to kill.
Well, this depends on how fast a kill you are going for. I always went
with immediate kills, but what you have said is making me re-think it.
Perhaps a slower strategy, with poxes on turn 3/4? Using just your
standard old swamps to do it? I don't know, though. The problem with
that is that your opponent still has the ability to recover, as they
have not lost much land. If you do it early, they lose lots (all/half)
of their land, and lots of cards in hand. 2/3. If you consider that your
opponent realizes that they will lose their land, and know that they
need to hold onto some land in their hand, that makes them lose non-land
cards to the discard effect, which is very desirable to you. Then again,
perhaps I'm talking out my ear.
: Why diluting the deck with silly cantrips when you said you wanted cards
: to kill---cantrips don't kill! No, but they provide a very important
: support so that pox wont hurt youself as much as it hurts opponent.
: Remember after a turn three pox the play area depleted for cards which
: means that if you can get a one card advantage over opponent you are in
: a much stronger position, since both players has lost 1/3 life.
Cantrips are good. Very good. And if you use Lodestones, you'll not have
to worry so much about packing the deck with land, because it will be so
easy to get it back. Lodestones fit VERY nicely in this sort of deck,
even if you are only tossing one or two swamps back on the library.
: Why dilut the deck with white (after all it's supposed to be a pure evil
: deck)? Well, 1st of all these white cards are sooo good, that you just
: have to consider them when building a deck. Second support for them were
: already there since I use 4 sextants and believe me, when this deck
: draws balance be carefull, because a lot of the time it'll just be
: sitting doing nothing in you hand, but when used correctly you will win.
: Actually this might be an argument for banning balance (ala mind twist).
The white is good. Balance, of course. If only for creature elim, which
pox desperately needs. The tax helps solve the 3 land problem. You need
3 swamps to pox/hippie, 2 important things. The tax brings them to you.
: At this time my opponent had out 1 creature and 4 lands 5 cards in hand.
: From there it was downhill for the opponent. He went to 0 creatures, 2
: lands, 3 cards in hand. I went to 0 creatures, 2 lands, 2 cards in hand
: (5 next upkeep).
: I got a strip mine as the next card which took out his last mountain and
: he was toast. A lonely Order of the Ebon Hand don't have to run very far
: after a pox to kill the opponent.
This illustrates my point on the effectiveness of racks, I think.
Imagine that your opponent has 2 lands and 3 cards in hand. That's IT.
Meanwhile, you've got an order hammering away. They NEED to cast
something, or they are toast. Casting something lets the rack hit them.
This is good. :)
: Every pox deck should pack 4 strip mines, because the disruption caused
: by pox followed up by a strip mine, can send a opponent to the canvas.
Yes, I fully agree with this. Turn 2/3 pox followed by a strip just
ruins your opponent's day.
: > Direct Damage:
: [deck snipped]
: I tried this (only with some goblins+grenades as well) but It didn't
: work nearly as good, because pox would ruin myself as well, and
: especially my need for colored mana.
I was thinking of attempting a Goblin deck with 3 poxes in it, just for
the DD. The mana was too much of a problem, though. :(
Zorro (Jim Batka)
Seth Jaffee wrote:
> Another strategy I've heard of with Pox is using Nether Shadows
> and Ashen Ghouls... so what if you lose them or have to discard them...
>
> Yet another is to just Pox once or twice, then burn them to death
> with DD. An early Pox is 7 damage for 3 mana, that's a lot better than
> incinerate, and almost as good as lightning bolt... but the best part is,
> you still have the Bolts to use!
>
> I haven't experimented much with the last 2, but They might be good, I
> think the Necro Pox deck will turn some heads though.
Consider the usage of other potential (but not necessary combos) too.
Follow a Pox with a Songs of the Damned / Drain Life combo. Now you
have card & life advantage (maybe). Damn what's the name of the black
critter which gets a regeneration token every time a creature goes to
the graveyard?
I also think someone mentioned Pox combined with a reanimator deck.
Of course you can play with a Zuran's Orb then apply the same principal
to your lands. Not thrilled with your chances of pulling the
Zorb in time, play with forests and use Dark Heart of the Woods plus
the life advantage becomes truely awesome. Since you're expecting
to play the pox you should keep a couple in hand.
Just throwing out ideas folks, I haven't really considered how to work
this into a deck ;).
--
Jim Batka Email: jim....@sdrc.com
It's good to keep an open mind,
Just not so open that your brains fall out.
-Unknown Usenet Poster
jpjo...@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca
Just a little anecdote about my shameful loss to a pox deck:
In a small local tournament, I was playing a B/U Necrodeck variant - all
the land destruction swapped for control magic, sleight of mind (great
for the knights, and binding grasp). The deck did reasonably well,
except for loosing to a mono red land destruction/varchilds war riders
deck (I necro, he vises, what do I do?) and yes, a pox deck.
In one game, here's what happens:
Round 1, and I get first go - I have ritual and hypno specter, and so I
drop it, feeling confident. His turn, and he ritual Pox, I have to sac
my Specter, and my land and two cards from my hand - we both go down to
13. But, to my horror, he discards a Colossus of Sadira into the
graveyard!
Two rounds later, and I'm having mana problems (that's what I get for
playing B/U) and he's animating his Colossus. Great. Next round, I take
8 damage, dropping me to 5 life (!) and leaving him with a creature that
will not untap for the rest of the game. No problem, I can come back -
all I have to do is drop some knights quickly and finish him off - after
all, he's only at 13 life. I never get the chance, seeing as how he
Burnt Offering (sac Colossus for 9 black mana) and drains me for - well -
more than 5. I'm dead.
I'll grant you, I had a pretty bad draw, but the point is that I lost,
bigtime. I did much better in the second game, ritual binding grasp to
get his discarded Colossus (discared on the first round, without Pox this
time) but I still lost. The Pox deck went on to win the tournament, even
beating the mono red land destruction. I suspect a real Necrodeck would
probalby beat both the red LD and the Pox deck, but I was suitably
impressed - I wouldn't even think of using Necro after I had taken 7
damage against a deck that can drain for 11 on 2 mana. While I am not
privy to the contents of the deck I faced, I have put together my best
estimate:
4 Pox
3 Colossus of Sadira
3 Triskellion
2 Tetravius
3 Demonic Consultation
4 Animate Dead
4 Dance of the Dead
4 Drain Life
4 Dk Ritual
1 Hymn to Tourach (He said only one hymn...)
2 Soldevi Andiate (Or whatever they are called...)
3 Burnt Offering
2 Lake of the Dead (Never used against me, I wouldn't use these...)
22 Swamp
I only played the deck two games, so this is the best I can guess - all
the cards I saw are there. Have fun!
Zorro (Jim Batka)
Stil wrote:
> Cantrips are good. Very good. And if you use Lodestones, you'll not have
> to worry so much about packing the deck with land, because it will be so
> easy to get it back. Lodestones fit VERY nicely in this sort of deck,
> even if you are only tossing one or two swamps back on the library.
I've also been trying to think of other types of cards that normally
appear to suck, but just might work into the theme. I haven't really
thought the ramifications through but some others that seem interesting
are:
Icatian Moneychanger
Play him BEFORE pox, reduce damage and get your life back,
just be ready with the counterspells and don't get greedy!
Living Artifact
no mana regenerator from Pox damage (enchantments are left
alone).
Land Tax ?
Sean O'Brien
>
> Icatian Moneychanger
> Play him BEFORE pox, reduce damage and get your life back,
> just be ready with the counterspells and don't get greedy!
> Living Artifact
> no mana regenerator from Pox damage (enchantments are left
> alone).
> Land Tax ?
Read the card it isn't damage, how many people out there still do not
understand the difference between damage and loss of life...
New Deck's i've come up with
Necro/Pox/Greed/COP Black ..... or Channel/COP Green .....
<end sarcasm>
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SzzzzzzzzzzzHzzzMzzzzzzzzYzzzzzzzSEzzzzzzzzzzzzzLzzF
zzzzzTzzzzzzOzzzzzPzzzzzzIEzzzzzzzzzCzzzzezzzzzzzzSz
IzzzzzzzzzDzzzzzzzzzONzzzzzzzzzTzzzzzKzzNzzzzzzOWzzz
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Zorro (Jim Batka)
Jim B. posted for Scott who suffered an "unfortunate" accident.
Sorry Scott but I *had* to do it ;).
Thus spake Scott:
First off, kudos to what has to be the best thread in weeks! (Go pox!
:) Here are some of my thoughts on pox, without actually listing a deck
out...(I'm kind of short on time here)
Cantrips: Not to be overlooked, as mentioned earlier. The value of
the pox deck, imho, is the overwhelming disruption of enemy plans. With
this in mind, I think that the under-used mind ravel works wonders in
the deck, for reasons which should be obvious upon reflection. Hard to
fit
in, but once they're there, you'll love 'em!
Reanimation: One strategy, once someone figures your deck out, is
to toss big creatures to the HD. Dance of the dead works wonders here,
because you can get your specters back, or steal their
Ernham/Shivan/Assorted Nasties. Furthermore, once you _have_ danced the
biggie, the opponent will be very hesitant to discard the biggie next
time to pox, slowing him down tremendously and inflicting psychological
damage along with life damage. >:)
Mana: Though I saw one mention earlier, the key here is Thawing
Glaciers. Stops the mana problems with pox, _and_ helps support an extra
color, should you be so inclined. The main advantage you have over your
opponent is that you know ahead of time that the mayhemish (is that a
word? :) Pox will be hitting the table in droves, so plan ahead and take
advantage of this knowledge.
Creatures: Obviously Hypnos. Other choices depend on your deck
focus. For speed, try orders. For more discard, try Abyssal Specters.
(Silly in other decks, but great here with racks and/or reanimation.
Dancing Abyssal= 3/4 flying disrupting scepter...not bad for b1 during
the upkeep...) For slower decks, I reccomend factories, also allowing
the
withering wisps option for extra defense and that extra "oomph" at the
end. For more creature-heavy aims, look to such creatures as the
shadows,
ashen ghouls, and krovikan horrors. Again, use your fore-knowledge to
the
most!
Defense: Depending on desired deck speed, I like Aliopiles, as
they do not influence the pox. Also good is withering wisps/factory,
Disks
in a permanent-lite deck (as mentioned earlier). Banishings and
Dystopias
can work wonders in the s'board. Arrows are great for effeciency, but
will
most likely be too cost-intensive for all but the slowest versions. (ala
the wisps deck)
One last note: As discussed, (if you have room) the final "oomph"
can be critical. As the deck deals lots of damage, some way to
accelerate the death is great, if you can find the room. I prefer racks,
but also good are Lim-Dul's hex(another sillyish card that can work
wonders in the right usage), withering wisps, maybe 1 or 2 drain lives,
if you have a plethora of thawing glaciers.
I have to go to work, but I hope I've helped out here. In all
honesty, the only reason I don't play my pox deck in tournies is that I
am _very_ worried about playing any deck with any quantity of DD.
Particularly terrifying to me is the g. tactics, as they _will_ get to
use these on you, whether by hymn, pox, or specter...boiling down to a
race between DD and the Rack, or a race to "find the Z'orb".
Scott Johns
#2 DCI type 2
Thus spoketh Scott "Alas poor Scott, I knew him well", well actually I
don't know him at all.
Jeff
I've been contemplating tossing together a Type 1 Pox deck...
Mainly because I thought about how well the Jade Statue would
fit into a Pox deck...
So here is my starting point.
Any comments?
// ARTIFACT:
1 Disrupting Scepter
1 Gustha's Scepter
1 The Rack
4 Jade Statue
1 Zuran Orb
// BLACK:
2 The Abyss
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Necropotence
3 Hymn to Tourach
2 Dark Ritual
3 Pox
1 Underworld Dreams
// BLUE:
1 Ancestral Recall
2 Psionic Blast
1 Recall
1 Timetwister
1 Timewalk
// GREEN:
1 Regrowth
// RED:
1 Fireball
1 Fork
4 Lightning Bolt
// WHITE:
1 Balance
2 Disenchant
// MANA:
1 Library of Alexandria
1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Pearl
1 Sol Ring
4 City of Brass
4 Underground Sea
4 Badlands
2 Sulfurous Springs
4 Strip Mine
--
Jeff Hagerty + I am a firm believer in exercise...
jef...@cris.com + Why I ran five miles just this morning...
Jeff in PWL + Finally, I said...
Manaburn on IRC #mtg + You can have your F***ing purse back.
+ --- Emo Phillips