Medallion Combos
jason
Bishop wrote:
>
> Buyback seems like the best combo right now. In order to really get the most out of
> a medallion, you need to be casting more than one spell per turn: or a diamond would
> have been just as good.
>
> So far they seem pretty weak.
>
> Sapphire-> Capsize, Whispers of the muse, Dismiss
> Emerald -> Gaia's Blessing, Armageddon with Vineyard.
> Jet ->
> Ruby -> Searing Touch, Manabarbs,
> Pearl -> Invulnerability, Enlightened Tutor.
>
> Any other good combos ?
Don't forget X spells. With a couple of Sapphires out, I would rather
draw a Powersink than a regular counter. You get a "free" mana for each
medallion out. Rolling Thunder. Drain Life. Dregs of Sorrow (!)
-jason
jason
heh. jeez, i shouldn't try to post that early in the morning. Drain Life
doesn't work like this, as i'm sure many of you will *love* pointing out
to me. personal note: at least two cups of coffee before posting to
newsgroups.
-jason
Doug
In article <346EBA...@midtn.campus.mci.net>,
jason <jpr...@midtn.campus.mci.net> wrote:
>
>heh. jeez, i shouldn't try to post that early in the morning. Drain Life
>doesn't work like this, as i'm sure many of you will *love* pointing out
>to me. personal note: at least two cups of coffee before posting to
>newsgroups.
The coffee will just make you jittery. Besides, I believe you were right the
first time. Medallions do reduce the cost to play a drain life. Check out
recent posts in .rules for clarification.
I'd suggest that you use Deja News and search for "medallion* & drain life"
Deja News is located at:
http://www.dejanews.com/
Doug Hershberger
hers...@tc.umn.edu
jason
no. i don't think so, because Drain Life specifies black mana, not
colorless.
-jason
Warrl kyree Tale'sedrin
jason wrote in rec.games.trading-cards.magic.strategy:
>> In article <346EBA...@midtn.campus.mci.net>,
>> jason <jpr...@midtn.campus.mci.net> wrote:
>> >
>> >heh. jeez, i shouldn't try to post that early in the morning. Drain Life
>> >doesn't work like this, as i'm sure many of you will *love* pointing out
>> >to me. personal note: at least two cups of coffee before posting to
>> >newsgroups.
>>
>> The coffee will just make you jittery. Besides, I believe you were right the
>> first time. Medallions do reduce the cost to play a drain life. Check out
>> recent posts in .rules for clarification.
>no. i don't think so, because Drain Life specifies black mana, not
>colorless.
The cost of a Drain Life is B + 1 + a variable amount of B.
So, one Medallion would reduce the cost by 1.
A second Medallion wouldn't help any.
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Aaron Huntsman
jason wrote:
>
> heh. jeez, i shouldn't try to post that early in the morning. Drain Life
> doesn't work like this, as i'm sure many of you will *love* pointing out
> to me. personal note: at least two cups of coffee before posting to
> newsgroups.
As a matter of fact, Drain Life _does_ work. The 5E printing of Drain
Life has the additional cost written as "X: drain something for X. You
can only spend black mana this way." Even though you can only spend
black mana, the X is considered generic for the Medallion's purposes.
So it will reduce the cost of a 5E Drain Life.
--
Aaron Huntsman /\~"~/\ The quietness of a manhole
Rose-Hulman Inst. of Tech. \=.=.=/ cover cannot compare with the
Computer Science - c/o '99 =\ T /= wild vapors of nylon I sense
''' in your larynx.
Frederick Scott
wa...@blarg.net writes:
>jason wrote in rec.games.trading-cards.magic.strategy:
>
>>> In article <346EBA...@midtn.campus.mci.net>,
>>> jason <jpr...@midtn.campus.mci.net> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >heh. jeez, i shouldn't try to post that early in the morning. Drain Life
>>> >doesn't work like this, as i'm sure many of you will *love* pointing out
>>> >to me. personal note: at least two cups of coffee before posting to
>>> >newsgroups.
>>>
>>> The coffee will just make you jittery. Besides, I believe you were right the
>>> first time. Medallions do reduce the cost to play a drain life. Check out
>>> recent posts in .rules for clarification.
>
>>no. i don't think so, because Drain Life specifies black mana, not
>>colorless.
>
>The cost of a Drain Life is B + 1 + a variable amount of B.
>
>So, one Medallion would reduce the cost by 1.
>
>A second Medallion wouldn't help any.
No, weird as it seems, you apparently _can_ a Jet Medallion
to pay the "X" mana as well. Even though the text states that,
"only Black mana may be spent..." (to pay for the X), since
the spell cost uses the generic mana "X" sign at all, the Jet
Medallion counts. I wouldn't have guessed it either.
Fred
tolun
postm...@127.0.0.1 (Warrl kyree Tale'sedrin) wrote:
>jason wrote in rec.games.trading-cards.magic.strategy:
>>> In article <346EBA...@midtn.campus.mci.net>,
>>> jason <jpr...@midtn.campus.mci.net> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >heh. jeez, i shouldn't try to post that early in the morning. Drain Life
>>> >doesn't work like this, as i'm sure many of you will *love* pointing out
>>> >to me. personal note: at least two cups of coffee before posting to
>>> >newsgroups.
>>>
>>> The coffee will just make you jittery. Besides, I believe you were right the
>>> first time. Medallions do reduce the cost to play a drain life. Check out
>>> recent posts in .rules for clarification.
>>no. i don't think so, because Drain Life specifies black mana, not
>>colorless.
>The cost of a Drain Life is B + 1 + a variable amount of B.
>So, one Medallion would reduce the cost by 1.
>A second Medallion wouldn't help any.
There's a difference between "generic" mana, the gray-circle mana
symbol, and colorless mana, which doesn't have a symbol. The
medallions reduce generic mana required to play a spell.
The additional cost of Drain Life is generic mana, even though it
specifies which color mana to use, it's still generic. Anything which
requires "X" mana is generic, even if it specificies which "flavor"
mana to use. WotC is good at contradicting itself this way...
On the other hand, you can Spell Blast it for 2U, because the "casting
cost" is 1B, the extra mana is part of the cost to "play" the spell,
not the casting cost... weird, in't?
Tolun
Frederick Scott
Jan Sandorf <j...@swip.net> writes:
>to...@postoffice.ptd.net (tolun) writes:
>
>> There's a difference between "generic" mana, the gray-circle mana
>> symbol, and colorless mana, which doesn't have a symbol. The
>> medallions reduce generic mana required to play a spell.
>>
>> The additional cost of Drain Life is generic mana, even though it
>> specifies which color mana to use, it's still generic. Anything which
>> requires "X" mana is generic, even if it specificies which "flavor"
>> mana to use. WotC is good at contradicting itself this way...
>
>The additional cost of Drain Life is BLACK mana, not generic mana, not
>colorless mana.
Why are you contradicting him when he explained it all very carefully?
Maybe you think if you say it enough times, it will become true?
The "X" mana in the Drain Life spell is generic _by definition_, it's
just generic mana that can only be paid with black mana.
Fred
Kosuda Takahito
lar...@pathcom.com wrote
>> Buyback seems like the best combo right now. In order to really get the most out of
>> a medallion, you need to be casting more than one spell per turn: or a diamond would
>> have been just as good.
I agree.
>> So far they seem pretty weak.
>>
>> Sapphire-> Capsize, Whispers of the muse, Dismiss
>> Emerald -> Gaia's Blessing, Armageddon with Vineyard.
>> Jet ->
>> Ruby -> Searing Touch, Manabarbs,
>> Pearl -> Invulnerability, Enlightened Tutor.
>>
>>
>> Any other good combos ?
Pearl + Celestial Dawn. If you had 4PM and 4 Helm of Awakening
in play, you could cast almost every spell at W or WW.
__
KOSUDA Takahito
f930...@eds.ecip.nagoya-u.ac.jp
Benmark
So, just a quick rulings question. On the medallions with buyback, do they
reduce buyback costs as well as casting cost? For example, if I have a
Sapphire Medallion, does Capsize cost UU2 with the buyback? Or UU3? Thanks!
Fred Brady
No. The medallion only reduces the cost of the spell, not the cost of
the buyback which is an activation cost. Have a look at the FAQ for
Tempest at wizards.
tolun
ben...@aol.com (Benmark) wrote:
>So, just a quick rulings question. On the medallions with buyback, do they
>reduce buyback costs as well as casting cost? For example, if I have a
>Sapphire Medallion, does Capsize cost UU2 with the buyback? Or UU3? Thanks!
Medallions reduce the cost to "play" a spell of the appropriate color,
which includes the casting cost written in the upper right corner, and
any other costs incurred in addition, including the X black mana paid
for a Drain Life, and the buyback cost of some spells.
And incidentally, Capsize costs what, UU1 and 3 to activate buyback?
The first Sapphire Medallion would reduce the casting cost to UU and 3
for buyback, a second would reduce that to UU and 2, etc.
Tolun
Jakob Vogdrup Hansen
Fred Brady wrote:
>
> No. The medallion only reduces the cost of the spell, not the cost of
> the buyback which is an activation cost. Have a look at the FAQ for
> Tempest at wizards.
>
> > they
> > reduce buyback costs as well as casting cost? For example, if I have a
> >
> > Sapphire Medallion, does Capsize cost UU2 with the buyback? Or UU3?
> > Thanks!
Well, I did, and I found this:
Q: Is the buyback cost part of the spell's casting cost?
A: The cost isn't listed in the upper right hand corner, so it's not
part
of the casting cost. It's an additional cost that's represented by a
standard ability.
Q: Can the Medallions reduce additional costs listed in card text, like
doing damage with Drain Life or splitting up a Fireball?
A: The Diamonds don't specify that they reduce casting cost, so can
"pay for" additional costs.--
So I guess that Medallions (or Diamonds :) ) can pay for buyback.
Jakob V. Hansen Tlf: 86 750618
Rydevænget 87, 1. th. Kontor: B2.15 Lokal: (8942)3355
8210 Aarhus V E-mail: Vog...@daimi.aau.dk
Doug
In article <3473F2...@daimi.aau.dk>,
Jakob Vogdrup Hansen <vog...@daimi.aau.dk> wrote:
>So I guess that Medallions (or Diamonds :) ) can pay for buyback.
Yes, but as I understand it, they only reduce the total cost to play a spell
once per spell. Thus, with 1 medallion capsize costs UU3. With 2, UU2 with 3,
UU1 with 4, UU. Check Deja News to verify this.
The Redneck
Benmark wrote
>So, just a quick rulings question. On the medallions with buyback, do they
>reduce buyback costs as well as casting cost? For example, if I have a
>Sapphire Medallion, does Capsize cost UU2 with the buyback? Or UU3? Thanks!
UU3. If you have *two* S.Medallions in play, it's UU2.
The Med.s can be applied to Buyback costs or any other additional
costs of generic mana. The same Medallion cannot, however, apply
to both the casting cost and an additional cost.
--
The Redneck
the_r...@geocities.com
tolun
>> Well, I did, and I found this:
>>
>> Q: Is the buyback cost part of the spell's casting cost?
>> A: The cost isn't listed in the upper right hand corner, so it's not
>> part
>> of the casting cost. It's an additional cost that's represented by a
>> standard ability.
>>
>> Q: Can the Medallions reduce additional costs listed in card text,
>> like
>> doing damage with Drain Life or splitting up a Fireball?
>> A: The Diamonds don't specify that they reduce casting cost, so can
>> "pay for" additional costs.--
>>
>Interesting. I now have a question. Is the cost of buyback an
>'additional' cost or is it an activation cost. I had a look at the
>tempest rules at wizards and this is what I found.
> Buyback
> Instants, interrupts, and sorceries normally go
>to your graveyard after
> they resolve. Buyback is a new option that allows
>you to use these
> types of spells over and over again by returning
>them to your hand
> when they resolve. Each such spell has a "buyback
>cost" in addition to
> the casting cost.
>The last line seems to indicate that it is an 'additional' cost. I
>wonder if wizards meant it to be that though? I will write to them and
>see what they say.
I'm very sure they knew what they were doing, and intend the buyback
cost to be both optional and additional. It's "tacked on" to the
casting cost, but is not a part of the casting cost, and therefore
doesn't count with effects that look at a spell's "casting cost,"
(Spell Blast) but do count when looking at the cost to play the spell
(Medallions).
Tolun
Serman
> UU3. If you have *two* S.Medallions in play, it's UU2.
>
> The Med.s can be applied to Buyback costs or any other additional
> costs of generic mana. The same Medallion cannot, however, apply
> to both the casting cost and an additional cost.
Actually, if you read the FAQ in the wizard.com page about tempest, buyback
costs are not part of the casting cost therefore medallions only reduce the
mana at the top right corner. Which means even if you had 4 sapphire
medallions in play a capsize would cost UU3 with the buyback. The
medallions do not apply to the costs of effects on the card, just the
casting cost. And since Buyback is not actually part of the casting cost,
the medallions do not get the generic mana bonus.
Mason Murray
WHEN ARE PEOPLE GOING TO STOP ASKING THE SAME QUESTIONS ABOUT BUYBACK
AND MEDALLIONS OVER AND OVER, AD NAUSEUM???
1. Tempest storybook explains exactly what buyback is: Buyback IS an
ADDITIONAL cost to the spell you are buying back.
2. Medallions and Helm of Awakening do not I REPEAT DO NOT have the word
casting cost on them anywhere. They do, however, say that they reduce
the COST of spells.
3. Therefore, any reasonably intelligent person could and should
understand the relationship of these artifacts and spells.
4. Buyback is an additional cost; so, If I cast a Capsize spell, the
casting cost/total cost is UU1, if I want to buyback this capsize the
casting cost is UU1 and the total cost of the spell is UU4.
Total cost of Capsize with varying #'s of Sapphire medallions:
# of Medallions COST TO CAST(not casting cost)
1 UU3
2 UU2
3 UU1
4 UU
DOES ANYBODY NOT UNDERSTAND THIS. IF YOU DO NOT, I SUGGEST A SLIGHTY
LESS TAXING GAME; CHECKERS PERHAPS!
It is not my intention to offend, but I am very tired of seeing multiple
posts asking the same question over and over again. Please, give it up.
This is the way it works!!!!
Stephen Rollins
Serman wrote:
>
> > UU3. If you have *two* S.Medallions in play, it's UU2.
> >
> > The Med.s can be applied to Buyback costs or any other additional
> > costs of generic mana. The same Medallion cannot, however, apply
> > to both the casting cost and an additional cost.
>
> Actually, if you read the FAQ in the wizard.com page about tempest, buyback
> costs are not part of the casting cost therefore medallions only reduce the
> mana at the top right corner. Which means even if you had 4 sapphire
> medallions in play a capsize would cost UU3 with the buyback. The
> medallions do not apply to the costs of effects on the card, just the
> casting cost. And since Buyback is not actually part of the casting cost,
> the medallions do not get the generic mana bonus.
actually medallions can reduce buyback read the errata listed for
tempest at the dojo
David Sachs
I would like to add for emphasis that one thing Medallions do NOT do
is reduce the CASTING COST of a spell. If they did you could cast
bigger creatures for free with Alluren.
WOTC has created a semantic nightmare by make the "casting cost" of
a spell mean something entirely distinct from the "cost" of the same spell.
--
*** The Klingon's favorite food was named by the first earthling to see it
***
David Sachs - Fermilab - MS369 - PO Box 500 - Batavia, IL 60510
tolun wrote in message <657rvj$chi$1...@news3.ptd.net>...
>"Serman" <ser...@in2nett.com> wrote:
...
>Where does it say anything about "casting cost?" The cost to play a
>spell includes *anything* that is a cost... Casting Cost, pay X mana,
>Sacrifice a creature or life, Stand on One Foot, whatever the card
>says to do when you cast the spell.
J. Kreutzer
Let's try an experiment. I assume you have a web browser, since you were
able to check the WotC home page. Now, before you post again, go to
www.dejanews.com and search for "+medallion +buyback" There, that wasn't
so hard, was it?
Alternatively, you could venture over to .rules and read the several
thousand official answers to your questions. The fellow you criticized
actually had it exactly right (and four sapphire medallions means you can
capsize for UU).
--Jake--
On 23 Nov 1997, Serman wrote:
> > This is so. However, I wouldn't call it an "only." Being able to
> > "only" cast Dismiss for the price of a Counterspell with two Sapphire
> > Medallions, to "only" drain someone for two points for B with three
> > Jet Medallions, etc. is a damn nice ability... if they did more it
> > would be too much, for their cost...
> >
> > Tolun
> >
> >
> >
> In the WotC homepage, the FAQ on tempest states that buyback is not part of
> the casting cost therefore medallions cannot pay for the buyback parts of
> the spell. Just like it would only cost U3 for spellblast to conter
> capsize even if buyback is paid. So even with four sapphire medallions a
> capsize would cost UU3 with its buyback. Also I don't understand how I
> would be able to drain life for two points with three jet medallions since
> the cost of Drainlife is B1 and every additional B you pay after that it
> deals one damage and you gain one life. And the medallions only reduce
> colorless mana so it would cost you only one less for drainlife.
>
>
>
tolun
"Serman" <ser...@in2nett.com> wrote:
>> UU3. If you have *two* S.Medallions in play, it's UU2.
>>
>> The Med.s can be applied to Buyback costs or any other additional
>> costs of generic mana. The same Medallion cannot, however, apply
>> to both the casting cost and an additional cost.
>Actually, if you read the FAQ in the wizard.com page about tempest, buyback
>costs are not part of the casting cost therefore medallions only reduce the
>mana at the top right corner. Which means even if you had 4 sapphire
>medallions in play a capsize would cost UU3 with the buyback. The
>medallions do not apply to the costs of effects on the card, just the
>casting cost. And since Buyback is not actually part of the casting cost,
>the medallions do not get the generic mana bonus.
Sapphire Medallion's text:
Your blue spells cost 1 less to play.
Where does it say anything about "casting cost?" The cost to play a
spell includes *anything* that is a cost... Casting Cost, pay X mana,
Sacrifice a creature or life, Stand on One Foot, whatever the card
says to do when you cast the spell.
Tolun
Serman
tolun
The Drain Life maneuver is possible because even though there is an
additional condition (spend only black mana this way) the X mana to do
X damage/gain X Life is ***generic*** mana.
There's a difference between generic mana and colorless mana.
Colorless mana can only pay for generic mana costs, but generic mana
is not necessarily colorless.
Tolun
spectre
In article <wr67prp...@swip.net>, Jan Sandorf <j...@swip.net> writes
>to...@postoffice.ptd.net (tolun) writes:
>
>> There's a difference between "generic" mana, the gray-circle mana
>> symbol, and colorless mana, which doesn't have a symbol. The
>> medallions reduce generic mana required to play a spell.
>>
>> The additional cost of Drain Life is generic mana, even though it
>> specifies which color mana to use, it's still generic. Anything which
>> requires "X" mana is generic, even if it specificies which "flavor"
>> mana to use. WotC is good at contradicting itself this way...
>
>The additional cost of Drain Life is BLACK mana, not generic mana, not
>colorless mana.
>
>-Jan
Come on guys, sort it out. There are different versions of drain life
out there and i rekon ive got most of them. The Drain life that asks
for B mana can be used with the medallion which redeces the cost by 1
because thats part of the casting cost. The additional B cannot be be
reduced because it is B mana.
The other version that needs ruling is the X (which must be black)
version in which the casting cost is still the same except it says:
... x ... spend only black mana in this way. This version should be
able to be made cheaper with the medallion in question.
--
spectre
tolun
"David Sachs" <us...@msn.com> wrote:
>I would like to add for emphasis that one thing Medallions do NOT do
>is reduce the CASTING COST of a spell. If they did you could cast
>bigger creatures for free with Alluren.
>WOTC has created a semantic nightmare by make the "casting cost" of
>a spell mean something entirely distinct from the "cost" of the same spell.
>>Where does it say anything about "casting cost?" The cost to play a
>>spell includes *anything* that is a cost... Casting Cost, pay X mana,
>>Sacrifice a creature or life, Stand on One Foot, whatever the card
>>says to do when you cast the spell.
Yep, the casting cost is the symbols actually written on the upper
right corner of the card, and getting a "discount" or paying extra to
cast the spell doesn't change the actual casting cost... like the
Medallions, enchantments like Chill and Gloom do not increase the
casting cost of Red and White spells, respectively: they add a further
condition to playing them: Pay the casting cost *and* an extra X mana.
Effects which look at the casting cost of the affected spell (like
Spell Blast) do not take the extras into account.
Tolun
NateRenaud
Here's a nother experiment. Go to the rules section of the official WOTC
site. Look up Helm of Awakening. It clearly states that the 2 (or 6?) items
work the same and that 4 helms lets you drain for 2 with only "B" or lets you
cast Capsize for UU
Nathan
Marcus Vipsanius Agrippa
-| out there and i rekon ive got most of them. The Drain life that asks
[..]
-| The other version that needs ruling is the X (which must be black)
-| version in which the casting cost is still the same except it says:
All versions of drain life are considered equivalent to the latest print
by the proxy rule. different versions of the card all act in exactly the
same way. thus, drain life, Atog, etc., all cards that have a previous,
differently worded version, are all ruled as in the case with the latest.
sorry, no dice.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
| Adam M. Beal be...@uiuc.edu|
| www.cen.uiuc.edu/~beal |
| President, Sons of Kosh Kosh Lives!!|
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
ODariani
oracle.... Oracle... ORACLE! please read the rules before you post pn a
strategy forum!
sorry for the shouting...
omeed.