First Strike vs. Flanking

[Ingo Warnke]

Curt Sellmer (cu...@kazan.com) wrote:

: If a 2/2 flanking creature attacks a 2/2 first strike creature, who
: wins.

The Flanker.

: Does the first strike creature strike fast enough to avoid the -1/-1
: from flanking?

: Or does the -1/-1 get added before combat begins so that the first
: strike creature strikes with 1/1 which is not enough to kill the
: flanking attacker?

The Mirage rulebook says that -1/-1 is applied as a triggered effect of
blocking assignment. So this happens *long* before any damage is dealt.
After this fast effects can be played.

When damage dealing comes around, first the first striker deals 1 damage to
the flanker. A dp step starts. Since the flanker has a toughness of 2, he survives.
So he deals 2 damage to the first striker in 'normal' damage dealing. This
kills the first striker.

Ingo Warnke

[David R. Henry]

Curt Sellmer writes:

Attempting to redeem myself over the Firestorm question, I'll
try this one:

>If a 2/2 flanking creature attacks a 2/2 first strike creature, who
>wins.

Flanking happens upon declaration of blocking. First strike doesn't
happen until damage is dealt. Flanker wins.

--
dhe...@plains.nodak.edu * Lion Clan Abomination *
What was the question? --Kate Bush // All you of Earth are IDIOTS! --P9fOS

[Curt Sellmer]

If a 2/2 flanking creature attacks a 2/2 first strike creature, who
wins.

Does the first strike creature strike fast enough to avoid the -1/-1
from flanking?

Or does the -1/-1 get added before combat begins so that the first
strike creature strikes with 1/1 which is not enough to kill the
flanking attacker?

Thanks,

-- Curt
======================================================
Curt Sellmer cu...@kazan.com
Kazan Software 512/328-8860
Austin, Texas fax 512/328-8892
======================================================

[Ingo Kemper]

On Mon, 15 Sep 1997 16:00:41 GMT, cu...@kazan.com (Curt Sellmer) wrote:

>If a 2/2 flanking creature attacks a 2/2 first strike creature, who
>wins.

The flanker, because it will effectively fight a 1/1 first striker.

>Does the first strike creature strike fast enough to avoid the -1/-1
>from flanking?

No. Flanking triggers as soon as the block is declared (even before
you have the chance to cast other "normal" instants), while First
Strike just makes sure that a creature will deal its combat damage in
the first of the two combat damage dealing steps.

>Or does the -1/-1 get added before combat begins so that the first
>strike creature strikes with 1/1 which is not enough to kill the
>flanking attacker?

Not really "before combat begins" - you're already inmidst combat when
blockers are declared -, but long before combat damage is dealt.

__ _ __ __ __ __
__/ /_/ \/ /_/____/_ |___Sky...@uni-muenster.de___---===> \
/_/ /_/\_/ |__/ |__/ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ---===>__/

[Krooz]

Curt Sellmer wrote:
>
> If a 2/2 flanking creature attacks a 2/2 first strike creature, who
> wins.
>

> Does the first strike creature strike fast enough to avoid the -1/-1
> from flanking?

Nope

> Or does the -1/-1 get added before combat begins so that the first
> strike creature strikes with 1/1 which is not enough to kill the
> flanking attacker?

Correct and the first strike blocker dies.

--
*********************************************************
* KROOZ * Email: Special_A...@thepentagon.com *
******** URL: http://alpha7.curtin.edu.au/~ehau *
******************************************************

[Ian Knope]

In article <341d597a....@client1.news.psi.net>, Curt Sellmer
<cu...@kazan.com> writes

>
>
>If a 2/2 flanking creature attacks a 2/2 first strike creature, who
>wins.
>
>Does the first strike creature strike fast enough to avoid the -1/-1
>from flanking?
>

>Or does the -1/-1 get added before combat begins so that the first
>strike creature strikes with 1/1 which is not enough to kill the
>flanking attacker?
>

>Thanks,
>
>-- Curt
>======================================================
>Curt Sellmer cu...@kazan.com
>Kazan Software 512/328-8860
>Austin, Texas fax 512/328-8892
>======================================================

-- The first striker immediatly gets the -1/-1 as soon as it is declared as a
blocker. so does 1 point of damage to the 2/2 flanker which will eventually
deal 2 damage to the first striker killing it.

Ian Knope