[LSJ] Powerbase: Tshwane and Non-Played Cards
Kushiel
play by means other than being played?
For instace:
-weapons brought into play via Concealed Weapon
-mages brought into play via Antonio d'Erlette's ability
-equipment brought into play via Alastor, Magic of the Smith and Kiss
of Lachesis
When looking for rulings about this, I found this post, in which you
seem to be indicating that Tshwane can't be used in this manner.
http://preview.tinyurl.com/4r9ce3
However, in this post, you say that you can use Tshwane in this
manner, but later in the thread there's a post from The Lasombra that
contains another instance of you saying that it's not possible to do
so. (You never replied to his post.)
http://preview.tinyurl.com/539kp7
So...how does this work?
John Eno
LSJ
Tshwane works, per the ruling cited and quoted in http://preview.tinyurl.com/539kp7
Kushiel
> Tshwane works, per the ruling cited and quoted inhttp://preview.tinyurl.com/539kp7- Hide quoted text -
Then why can't a Concealed weapon or d'Erletted mage be the target of
Direct Intervention? Eccentric Billionaire, Tshwane and DI all seem to
have the same wording with regards to cards being played, yet the
former two seem to work differently than the latter. Why is that?
John Eno
Jozxyqk
Because the 7/7/7 rulings only cover cost of cards, not other aspects
of being "played".
John Flournoy
> On Oct 13, 8:48 am, LSJ <vtes...@white-wolf.com> wrote:
>
>
> Then why can't a Concealed weapon or d'Erletted mage be the target of
> Direct Intervention? Eccentric Billionaire, Tshwane and DI all seem to
> have the same wording with regards to cards being played, yet the
> former two seem to work differently than the latter. Why is that?
>
> John Eno
Because there's rules about how cards that do not count as 'played'
yet enter play via a variety of means (concealed, pier 13, d'Erlette,
etc) still have to have their cost paid - even though normally 'cost
paid' is a part of 'playing the card'. This distinguishes these
effects from other ways that cards enter play that -don't- require a
cost (like returning from contestation).
And there's rulings effectively saying 'cards that affect the cost
apply when a card enters play with the cost paid.'
I mean, it basically boils down to 'because there's a rule that says
'cost-modifiers also work via this exception' and there isn't a
corresponding ruling saying DI works that way; which implies that
neither type of card-wording inherently lets you use them (else there
wouldn't need to be a ruling saying 'cost-modifiers work in this other
circumstance too').
Alternately, you can look at it as 'because the Rules Team felt it was
appropriate to let cost-modifiers work on those cards and did not feel
it was appropriate to let DI work on them.'
-John Flournoy
Kushiel
> Because the 7/7/7 rulings only cover cost of cards, not other aspects
> of being "played".
On Oct 13, 11:56 am, John Flournoy <carne...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I mean, it basically boils down to 'because there's a rule that says
> 'cost-modifiers also work via this exception' and there isn't a
> corresponding ruling saying DI works that way; which implies that
> neither type of card-wording inherently lets you use them (else there
> wouldn't need to be a ruling saying 'cost-modifiers work in this other
> circumstance too').
>
> Alternately, you can look at it as 'because the Rules Team felt it was
> appropriate to let cost-modifiers work on those cards and did not feel
> it was appropriate to let DI work on them.'
Ah, okay. I had thought that the 7/7/07 ruling was a clarification,
rather than a ruling overriding card text. "It's because LSJ waved the
fiat stick" is a legit reason for the cards working this way; I'd been
assuming that there was a line of reasoning here that I wasn't
understanding. Thanks.
John Eno
LSJ
> On Oct 13, 8:48 am, LSJ <vtes...@white-wolf.com> wrote:
>> Tshwane works, per the ruling cited and quoted inhttp://preview.tinyurl.com/539kp7- Hide quoted text -
>
> Then why can't a Concealed weapon or d'Erletted mage be the target of
> Direct Intervention?
Because DI only works on cards played as normal.
> Eccentric Billionaire, Tshwane and DI all seem to
> have the same wording with regards to cards being played, yet the
> former two seem to work differently than the latter. Why is that?
RTR 7/7/7
Blooded Sand
> "It's because LSJ waved the
> fiat stick"
>
> John Eno
I am having visions of LSJ waving a tiny Italian car around a
stick..... ;)