Waste Management Operation/Deal with the Devil/Vast Wealth combo question
legbiter
Sabbat Wars promotional tournament. "Protected" means that it's aimed
at Newbies, each of whom will get a clan-themed deck provided by me.
The decks are meant to be balanced with respect to each other so's
to provide the purest possible test of playing skill. But mainly
it's about giving people loadsa cards in the form of playable decks,
and a secondary aim is to make sure there are NO text-errata'd cards
in the decks so's not to put people off.
As i was building the !Brujah deck it struck me that i need the answer
to a rules question. i was thinking of putting Waste Management Operation,
Deal with the Devil and Vast Wealth in, the idea obviously being to make
your ash-heap into your future hand. The question is, if you have run out
of library cards can you still do the WMO trick? i think you may not be
allowed to, because there is no target "bottom of your library" for the
card's effect. Am i right?
LSJ
> As i was building the !Brujah deck it struck me that i need the answer
> to a rules question. i was thinking of putting Waste Management Operation,
> Deal with the Devil and Vast Wealth in, the idea obviously being to make
> your ash-heap into your future hand. The question is, if you have run out
> of library cards can you still do the WMO trick? i think you may not be
> allowed to, because there is no target "bottom of your library" for the
> card's effect. Am i right?
The bottom of an empty library still exists. WMO can still be used to
return a card to an empty library.
--
LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc.
Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules:
http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/
jeroen rombouts
*a weapon (Arm's dealer, Horrid Reality, Terrrorists)
* equipment (Vast Wealth, Magic of the Smith)
*Giant's Blood (Bindusara, Historian of the Kindred)
....
when you know the card(s) your looking for are not in your deck?
This is important when playing with WMO. Can you return your Deflection to
your library and then shuffle, hoping to draw it back soon?
Jeroen
Andy Brown
I would say yes, as your opponent doesn't know whether they are there
or not.
However, if the card states you must obtain equipment from the deck,
then this would mean that you couldn't.
Just my own way of playing (derived from magic, in which you can do
this in a similar strategy idea, and it is legal)
Andy (setitesuk)
Frederick Scott
>
> Can you go though your library to find
> *a weapon (Arm's dealer, Horrid Reality, Terrrorists)
> * equipment (Vast Wealth, Magic of the Smith)
> *Giant's Blood (Bindusara, Historian of the Kindred)
> ....
> when you know the card(s) your looking for are not in your deck?
I assume you must be able to. Otherwise, people with CRS are at
a distinct advantage when playing with such cards. There are no
sanctions on the cards or in the game rules for looking through your
deck for a card that didn't turn out to be in there. So I don't see
how it can matter where you did so knowingly or were on your 15th
Cuba Libre at the time or what.
> This is important when playing with WMO. Can you return your Deflection to
> your library and then shuffle, hoping to draw it back soon?
I guess so.
Fred
P.S. CRS = Can't Remember Shit. I am not only a sufferer, I'm the president
of the foundation for helping people like me. Send me money. I forget where.
LSJ
>
> jeroen rombouts wrote:
> >
> > Can you go though your library to find
> > *a weapon (Arm's dealer, Horrid Reality, Terrrorists)
> > * equipment (Vast Wealth, Magic of the Smith)
> > *Giant's Blood (Bindusara, Historian of the Kindred)
> > ....
> > when you know the card(s) your looking for are not in your deck?
> >
> > This is important when playing with WMO. Can you return your Deflection to
> > your library and then shuffle, hoping to draw it back soon?
> >
> > Jeroen
>
> I would say yes, as your opponent doesn't know whether they are there
> or not.
Yes.
> However, if the card states you must obtain equipment from the deck,
> then this would mean that you couldn't.
?
You would be able to "search" for equipment and fail to find it, sure.
jeroen rombouts
>
> P.S. CRS = Can't Remember Shit. I am not only a sufferer, I'm the
president
> of the foundation for helping people like me. Send me money. I forget
where.
Just sign me up too. Forget my own ...er... thingy...wossname...next.
J
Jason Bell
"LSJ" <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote
> > However, if the card states you must obtain equipment from the deck,
> > then this would mean that you couldn't.
>
> ?
> You would be able to "search" for equipment and fail to find it, sure.
One more related question. Are you allowed to "not search very hard"
and fail to find equipment that is actually in your library? This is
important for a diminished library where you just want to shuffle.
- Jason Bell
Roger Carhult
--
"Jason Bell" <Jason...@mail.com> wrote in message
news:WxSS6.75$ru2.1...@typhoon.southeast.rr.com...
Or are you allowed to skip the searching at all? If you know that there's no
equipment and everyone takes your word for it (to save time).
LSJ
> > > > However, if the card states you must obtain equipment from the deck,
> > > > then this would mean that you couldn't.
> >
> > One more related question. Are you allowed to "not search very hard"
> > and fail to find equipment that is actually in your library? This is
> > important for a diminished library where you just want to shuffle.
>
> Or are you allowed to skip the searching at all? If you know that there's no
> equipment and everyone takes your word for it (to save time).
Yes to both. Enforcing other options is not really tenable.
You'd still have to shuffle, however, since you've still ostensibly "searched"
your library.
Jozxyqk
> Roger Carhult wrote:
>> "Jason Bell" <Jason...@mail.com> wrote in message
>> > "LSJ" <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote
>> > > > However, if the card states you must obtain equipment from the deck,
>> > > > then this would mean that you couldn't.
>> > > You would be able to "search" for equipment and fail to find it, sure.
>> >
>> > One more related question. Are you allowed to "not search very hard"
>> > and fail to find equipment that is actually in your library? This is
>> > important for a diminished library where you just want to shuffle.
>>
>> Or are you allowed to skip the searching at all? If you know that there's no
>> equipment and everyone takes your word for it (to save time).
> Yes to both. Enforcing other options is not really tenable.
> You'd still have to shuffle, however, since you've still ostensibly "searched"
> your library.
That's where my Tusk the Talebearer/Vast Wealth no-equipment deck idea comes in :)
"Hmm.. I don't like that top card. Reshuffle as a +1 stealth action."
Jason Bell
"Jozxyqk" <jfeu...@eecs.tufts.edu> wrote
+1 stealth action to show everyone your entire deck then reshuffle.
- Jason Bell