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Rob Treasure

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Jun 19, 2001, 4:22:40 PM6/19/01
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This one came up last night whilst playing some of the superb new FN stuff
and can't possibly be right.... can it ?

>>>>>>>>>
Fida'i

Fida'i do not untap as normal during the untap phase . Any ready Assamite
you control with capacity above 6 can burn 1 blood to untap the Fida'i. Not
unique etc.
>>>>>>>>>

Hmm. We were split 50/50 on this one. Reading the text it would seem that an
Assamite with a capacity above 6 can untap the Flids ANYTIME. In the first
sentence the stipulation is made not to untap in the untap phase. Does the
then given untap requirement apply to the untap phase as well or can they be
untapped anytime ? If anytime, can they be untapped more than once ?

Also a swift clarification.

Am I correct in thinking that a Deranged Camarilla vampire does not get
previous titles (Prince etc.)back if the Derange is then moved and the vamp
reverts to it's original clan ?

Thank you kindly.

Rob.


LSJ

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Jun 19, 2001, 5:20:19 PM6/19/01
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Rob Treasure wrote:
>
> This one came up last night whilst playing some of the superb new FN stuff
> and can't possibly be right.... can it ?
>
> >>>>>>>>>
> Fida'i
>
> Fida'i do not untap as normal during the untap phase . Any ready Assamite
> you control with capacity above 6 can burn 1 blood to untap the Fida'i. Not
> unique etc.
> >>>>>>>>>
>
> Hmm. We were split 50/50 on this one. Reading the text it would seem that an
> Assamite with a capacity above 6 can untap the Flids ANYTIME. In the first
> sentence the stipulation is made not to untap in the untap phase. Does the
> then given untap requirement apply to the untap phase as well or can they be
> untapped anytime ? If anytime, can they be untapped more than once ?

Only during the untap phase. Sorry the wording doesn't show that more clearly.

> Also a swift clarification.
>
> Am I correct in thinking that a Deranged Camarilla vampire does not get
> previous titles (Prince etc.)back if the Derange is then moved and the vamp
> reverts to it's original clan ?

No. See section 10.

--
LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc.
Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules:
http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

Flux

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Jun 19, 2001, 5:30:51 PM6/19/01
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"Rob Treasure" <rob.tr...@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:9gocqp$n5r$1...@taliesin.netcom.net.uk...

> This one came up last night whilst playing some of the superb new FN stuff
> and can't possibly be right.... can it ?
>
> >>>>>>>>>
> Fida'i
>
> Fida'i do not untap as normal during the untap phase . Any ready Assamite
> you control with capacity above 6 can burn 1 blood to untap the Fida'i.
Not
> unique etc.
> >>>>>>>>>
>
> Hmm. We were split 50/50 on this one. Reading the text it would seem that
an
> Assamite with a capacity above 6 can untap the Flids ANYTIME. In the first
> sentence the stipulation is made not to untap in the untap phase. Does the
> then given untap requirement apply to the untap phase as well or can they
be
> untapped anytime ? If anytime, can they be untapped more than once ?

I'd interpret it the same way at first (untap at any time), but LSJ has
already answered this one saying you can only untap them during your untap
phase.

> Also a swift clarification.
>
> Am I correct in thinking that a Deranged Camarilla vampire does not get
> previous titles (Prince etc.)back if the Derange is then moved and the
vamp
> reverts to it's original clan ?

No. From the SW rulesbook:
"If a vampire with a title changes clans or sects to a clan or sect
inappropriate for his title, he loses the benefit of the title until his
clan or sect changes appropriately." [10]

Note that he only loses the benefit of the title, not the title itself
(unless it is contested meanwhile)


Flux (learning how to search the rulesbook)


Johan Lundstrom

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Jun 20, 2001, 7:31:31 AM6/20/01
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LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote:

>Only during the untap phase. Sorry the wording doesn't show that more clearly.

Can a particular Fi'dai be untapped several time during the untap
phase if it manages to tap during the untap phase (for whatever reason
- I don't know if there actually is any way to tap in the untap
phase)?

-----------------------------------------------------------
Johan Lundstrom <jo...@algonet.se>

"Knowledge is power. Power corrupts."

LSJ

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Jun 20, 2001, 7:41:58 AM6/20/01
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Johan Lundstrom wrote:
>
> LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote:
>
> >Only during the untap phase. Sorry the wording doesn't show that more clearly.
>
> Can a particular Fi'dai be untapped several time during the untap
> phase if it manages to tap during the untap phase

No. I'll calrify the wording for the online list when it goes up.

Luis Duarte

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Jun 20, 2001, 11:09:38 AM6/20/01
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"Flux" <fl...@netc.pt> wrote in message news:<3b2fc3ea$1...@212.18.160.197>...

>> Am I correct in thinking that a Deranged Camarilla vampire does not get
>> previous titles (Prince etc.)back if the Derange is then moved and the
> vamp
>> reverts to it's original clan ?
>
> No. From the SW rulesbook:
> "If a vampire with a title changes clans or sects to a clan or sect
> inappropriate for his title, he loses the benefit of the title until his
> clan or sect changes appropriately." [10]
>
> Note that he only loses the benefit of the title, not the title itself
> (unless it is contested meanwhile)
>
> Flux (learning how to search the rulesbook)

Does this means that if Sir Walter Nash is deranged he
can't use his title (but don't loose it)?
If he moves the Derange he still has his title?

.- Luis Duarte (luis....@clix.pt)
- - -
Powerbase:Lisbon - [ http://planeta.clix.pt/vampire ]

LSJ

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Jun 20, 2001, 11:30:12 AM6/20/01
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Luis Duarte wrote:
> "Flux" <fl...@netc.pt> wrote in message news:<3b2fc3ea$1...@212.18.160.197>...
> > "If a vampire with a title changes clans or sects to a clan or sect
> > inappropriate for his title, he loses the benefit of the title until his
> > clan or sect changes appropriately." [10]
> >
> > Note that he only loses the benefit of the title, not the title itself
> > (unless it is contested meanwhile)
> >
> > Flux (learning how to search the rulesbook)
>
> Does this means that if Sir Walter Nash is deranged he
> can't use his title (but don't loose it)?
> If he moves the Derange he still has his title?

Yes - that's exactly what it says and means.

Gomi no Sensei

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Jun 20, 2001, 1:02:22 PM6/20/01
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In article <3b30891d....@news.algonet.se>,

Johan Lundstrom <jo...@algonet.se> wrote:
>LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote:
>
>>Only during the untap phase. Sorry the wording doesn't show that more clearly.
>
>Can a particular Fi'dai be untapped several time during the untap
>phase if it manages to tap during the untap phase (for whatever reason
>- I don't know if there actually is any way to tap in the untap
>phase)?

Baleful Doll (equipment, Necro) lets you tap in the untap phase to
activate its effect. Fida'i don't use the 'during X, do Y' template,
so it's conceivably legal to burn 1 blood to untap a Fida'i, tap it to
burn the Doll, then burn another blood to untap it again.

Many elder Assamites have THA, so using Magic of the Smith to get the
Sargon Fragment is a possibility. Then get a Baleful Doll and Heidelberg
it off to a Fida'i. Repeat until a vampire is dry, use Foul Blood to
knock 'em into torpor. Fun, yet full of moving parts.

gomi
--
Yes, I believe but I'd rather not pray
What I believe in I'd rather not say, baby

Halcyan 2

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Jun 21, 2001, 4:32:23 AM6/21/01
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>> Does this means that if Sir Walter Nash is deranged he
>> can't use his title (but don't loose it)?
>> If he moves the Derange he still has his title?
>
>Yes - that's exactly what it says and means.

I've always incorrectly thought that he lost his title and just gets it back
(possibly) later. So, exactly what is considered "using" his title? I know he
can't play 5th Traditions or 2nd's, and can't use the two votes. But if other
minions play things that affect titles, does this count as "using?"

(A) Can a Blood Siege take away the title of the Deranged Prince?

(B) Also, does he still *have* the votes (and just can't "use" them) or does he
lose the votes period? Might be helpful for Island of Yiaros.

(C) If the Deranged Prince was the Prince of Paris, is using The Louvre
considered "using" the Prince's title?

(D) Can The Treatment still be played on the Deranged Prince?

Thanks!

Halcyan 2

LSJ

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Jun 21, 2001, 6:41:00 AM6/21/01
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Halcyan 2 wrote:
>
> >> Does this means that if Sir Walter Nash is deranged he
> >> can't use his title (but don't loose it)?
> >> If he moves the Derange he still has his title?
> >
> >Yes - that's exactly what it says and means.
>
> I've always incorrectly thought that he lost his title and just gets it back
> (possibly) later.

Correct enough, except that it fails to take into account someone else
getting the same unique title in the meantime.

> So, exactly what is considered "using" his title? I know he

Everything that depends on him having the title.

> can't play 5th Traditions or 2nd's, and can't use the two votes. But if other
> minions play things that affect titles, does this count as "using?"

He is considered to be without title except for the instance of someone
getting his old unique title - then he loses it completely.



> (A) Can a Blood Siege take away the title of the Deranged Prince?

No.



> (B) Also, does he still *have* the votes (and just can't "use" them) or does he
> lose the votes period? Might be helpful for Island of Yiaros.

The latter.



> (C) If the Deranged Prince was the Prince of Paris, is using The Louvre
> considered "using" the Prince's title?

Yes.



> (D) Can The Treatment still be played on the Deranged Prince?

No.

legbiter

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Jun 21, 2001, 11:26:57 AM6/21/01
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LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote in message news:<3B2FC213...@white-wolf.com>...

> Rob Treasure wrote:
> >
> > This one came up last night whilst playing some of the superb new FN stuff
> > and can't possibly be right.... can it ?
> >
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > Fida'i
> >
> > Fida'i do not untap as normal during the untap phase . Any ready Assamite
> > you control with capacity above 6 can burn 1 blood to untap the Fida'i. Not
> > unique etc.
> > >>>>>>>>>
> >
> > Hmm. We were split 50/50 on this one. Reading the text it would seem that an
> > Assamite with a capacity above 6 can untap the Flids ANYTIME. In the first
> > sentence the stipulation is made not to untap in the untap phase. Does the
> > then given untap requirement apply to the untap phase as well or can they be
> > untapped anytime ? If anytime, can they be untapped more than once ?
>
> Only during the untap phase. Sorry the wording doesn't show that more clearly.

NOOOO!!!! There goes the deck i was going to play in the UK
Euro-championship qualifiers. Sigh. Anybody want 8 million Fida'i?

<snip>

Flux

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Jun 21, 2001, 12:10:05 PM6/21/01
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"legbiter" <legb...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:68f2e9f8.01062...@posting.google.com...

> NOOOO!!!! There goes the deck i was going to play in the UK
> Euro-championship qualifiers. Sigh. Anybody want 8 million Fida'i?

Me! Me! Me!
Then I can trade them for Abbt Kindred and build my 'Disposable Snakes'
deck, once I get a couple more Khobar Towers. :-)


Flux


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