Why Random Artifacts & Uniques??
Chuan-Tze Teo
In article <63o056$q...@niktow.canisius.edu>
wi...@niktow.canisius.edu (Ken Wigle) writes:
> I am going to buck the current trend and have all flame retardent
>equipment on. Why do we want random artifacts??
Because some of us who have played quite a lot get bored of
seeing and using the same items game after game. Notice that
most winner posts seem to contain equipment comprised from a
rather limited subset of items (Dor-Lomin, Thorin/Anarion,
Fingolfin/Cambeleg, Caspanion/Celeborn, etc.) If you remember
the excitement of fighting, say, Kavlax the first time, or seeing
Ringil's +10 speed bonus appear, well you can get the same
sort of thrill again.
Note that random artifacts are always optional, no one is being
forced to use them.
Chuan
da' sweet talker
Which is all the more reason to make it an option, not a feature. That
way, the newbies can read the manual (and that wonderful little section
about artifacts - That thing had me riveted for almost an hour when I
first downloaded pc angband 1.4.1, all that long time ago) and get all
the mystique and excitement from finding artifacts. Then, when they have
beat the game for the umpteenth time, this time with a half troll mage,
just for the 'challenge' of it, they turn on random artifacts and have
the new challenge of a completely different set of equipment.
From that, you may have gleaned that if random artifacts are turned on,
I don't want to see any of the old artifacts in my game. No name
recycling, either, as that just makes it all anticlimactic.
You feel the iron helm in your pack is special . . .
You feel the longsword in your pack is special . . .
a) the Iron Helm 'Ringil'
b)the Longsword 'Dor-Lomin'
Blaaaaahhhhh.
Shimpei Yamashita
Ken Wigle <wi...@niktow.canisius.edu> writes:
>
>Ok,
>
> I am going to buck the current trend and have all flame retardent
>few items created from an age long gone. Everyone knows what they are,
>it makes for great comparisons and they all have a "legend" or
>mental image if you will. Random ones IMO simply make the existing
>ones less meaningful. The existing ones are mostly based on tolkien
>lore. A dagger Sting is much cooler than a dagger Garthlop (or whatever
>random name appears).
>
> The same goes for Uniques. I would not be adverse to adding some
>artifacts or uniques but let's not make random ones.
>
> One of the few features that won't be included in Kangband unless it
>finds its way into regular Angband and then only as an option.
>
> It's not that I don't applaud the ingenuity and imagination. I do and
>agree that random elements keep each game from being the same. It's just
>that these two items do not belong in the "randomize" category.
Well...I can see the randomizers' rationale, in that too many Angband
games get reduced eventually to "scum level yy until artifact xxxx
appears," which gets monotonous after a while. (Popular candidates for
xxxx: Phial, Star, Thorin, Dor-Lomin, Colluin...) Random artifacts
changes the game fundamentally--you can no longer plan your equipment
with undiscovered artifacts in mind. I don't know about you, but I
often press deeper into the dungeon than I should without
chaos/confuse resist because I know Thorin is relatively easy to find,
and deeper the better. This sort of artifact memory abuse will
disappear with random artifacts.
OTOH, many of the artifacts in regular Angband are there for good
reasons--some for game balance, some for sentimental reasons. You
*want* something like Colluin because there is no other way for
non-mages to get double elemental protection. You *want* some good
item that also gives immunity to acid because the side effect of acid
is more distracting than detrimental late in the game (the last
powerful acid breathers in the game are Ancalagon and Tiamat), but you
wouldn't use an equipment slot on a mediocre item that gives immunity
to acid just for that benefit. You *want* reasonable amount of items
with certain resists to show up at a certain depth because the game
will become too difficult otherwise. You *want* a few very rare items
to be there for you, always, just because the very names of Ringil and
Bladeturner and all those great items cause longtime Angbanders to
chortle with joy. You *don't* want to see Ringil turned into a
(1d4)(+3,+5) dagger--what an anticlamactic thing to do to the very
weapon that wounded Morgoth eight times in the hands of Fingolfin the
High-Elven King! And you *want* Narthanc to be a flame dagger, Ringil
to be a cold sword, Barukkheled to be a pretty axe, and Great Axe of
Eonwe to be a kick-butt weapon, just like you would expect them to be
if you knew Elvish, Dwarvish and some Tolkien mythology.
I like the basic idea behind random artifacts, in that it makes
Angband more replayable, but I agree with you: the resulting artifact
list is kind of annoying to people like me who got into Angband
because of the Tolkien background. Maybe the random artifact generator
could be more sophisticated about associating names with weapons, or
even generate names itself.
--
Shimpei Yamashita <http://www.patnet.caltech.edu/%7Eshimpei/>
Peter
Shimpei Yamashita wrote:
> OTOH, many of the artifacts in regular Angband are there for good
> reasons--some for game balance, some for sentimental reasons. You
> *want* something like Colluin because there is no other way for
> non-mages to get double elemental protection. You *want* some good
> item that also gives immunity to acid because the side effect of acid
> is more distracting than detrimental late in the game (the last
> powerful acid breathers in the game are Ancalagon and Tiamat), but you
> wouldn't use an equipment slot on a mediocre item that gives immunity
> to acid just for that benefit. You *want* reasonable amount of items
> with certain resists to show up at a certain depth because the game
> will become too difficult otherwise. You *want* a few very rare items
> to be there for you, always, just because the very names of Ringil and
> Bladeturner and all those great items cause longtime Angbanders to
> chortle with joy. You *don't* want to see Ringil turned into a
> (1d4)(+3,+5) dagger--what an anticlamactic thing to do to the very
> weapon that wounded Morgoth eight times in the hands of Fingolfin the
> High-Elven King! And you *want* Narthanc to be a flame dagger, Ringil
I didn't know it was Ringil he used. In fact I thought Ringil was a
made-up
name :-)
Nice to know. In fact I think a draw weapon/flourish weapon (the last
only
for rogues, warriors and rangers) option should be made, and certain
weapons
should cause fear or unease in certain enemies (Orcs should fear
Glamdring and
Orcrist, the only weapon that could cause Morgoth to feel unease should
be
Ringil. And a flourish will make the effect larger :-)
> to be a cold sword, Barukkheled to be a pretty axe, and Great Axe of
> Eonwe to be a kick-butt weapon, just like you would expect them to be
> if you knew Elvish, Dwarvish and some Tolkien mythology.
>
> I like the basic idea behind random artifacts, in that it makes
> Angband more replayable, but I agree with you: the resulting artifact
> list is kind of annoying to people like me who got into Angband
> because of the Tolkien background. Maybe the random artifact generator
> could be more sophisticated about associating names with weapons, or
> even generate names itself.
I like the Tolkien stuff, it will keep me playing a little, after I
reach the
point where I know the game in detail
> --
> Shimpei Yamashita <http://www.patnet.caltech.edu/%7Eshimpei/>
Peter