ClassicArcades Flash Stencil Paint Question
centa...@yahoo.com
Just wanted to get a few feedbacks from those that have used this
stencil kit with success.
I googled the topic, checked Jeff's website and PinballPal's website
already for answers.
I've done the 3 coats of the base black (after the primer was done)
and now ready to use the stencils....
Jeff''s site says to "apply paint thick using the stencils" and
Pinball Pal's says after applying to remove the stencil.
My question is....can I keep the stencil down to let dry then apply
another coat and let dry and apply a 3rd coat to ensure there's no
bleed through of the black?
OR should I just apply a thick one coat and remove the stencil to let
dry?
I don't want paint to stick and peel in the dry with stencil on method
and don't want any wet paint to smear with the apply and remove
stencil method. Plus want a solid colour result without uneven
"thickness" by applying a thicker coat.
Jeff any chance of seeing the Flash video you had up on your site?
Anyone looking for my spare Flash to buy when I'm done :->
Thanks everyone,
Brian
Barrie, Ontario
deafdumb&blindboy
wrote:
#1, don't spray the color directly onto the black - shoot a misting
coat of primer onto the stenciled cab and let it dry. Then sand it
real lightly, and then tack it off with a tack rag. THEN shoot your
colors. You will have better adhesion, no bleed, and brighter colors.
And you don't want to leave that stencil on there too long, otherwise
it will bring paint with it when you remove it.
#2, if you decide to leave the stencils on for longer than a day or
two, wax the area first then apply the stencil. Then VERY thoroughly
remove the wax from the area to be painted with naphtha. Then prime
and paint as detailed above. Then when you remove the stencil it'll
come up beautifully with no paint on it.
I've used Jeff's stencils and I've used Jim May's stencils, and
although they were both Avery material, I believe, Jim's came off more
cleanly, possibly because they were three parts for each side of the
cab. Which poses alignment issues if not applied carefully, but much
easier to handle than a one-piece stencil. A one piece stencil is
awkward to align and once it takes a set in a certain direction away
from where you want it to go, there's almost no way to bring it back
in, not without damaging the stencil.
J.
centa...@yahoo.com
wrote:
Hmm...interesting perspective on doing it...never thought of doing
another primer coat...thanks for your thoughts man!
Brian
Any other perspective?
Brian
silverball
wrote:
The key I have found through trial and error, after doing a few sets
is spary the base, let sit for a couple of days. Spray the second
color, remove the stencil immediately and very carefully not letting
what you pull off touch the wet paint. Let sit for two days and do
the third color and so on. The longer you let the paint dry with the
stencils on the more paint tear up you will have. Trust me on this.
I have just did my KISS with Pinball Pal stencils and it looks great.
I will agree that stencils are a bitch to get lined up with the second
and third colors. I cut each of the faces out and done them
individually on my KISS black to get them right but it was worth it.
deafdumb&blindboy
wrote:
>
> Hmm...interesting perspective on doing it...never thought of doing
> another primer coat...thanks for your thoughts man!
> Brian
>
> Any other perspective?
> Brian
Oh, I'm far from the first to advise priming first before shooting the
colors. For one thing, if you were to shoot directly onto the black
without scuffing it first, at the bare minimum, you would have runs
all over the place, unless you lay the cab on it's side and shoot one
side at a time with the plane horizontal. But you need to be careful
in doing this to avoid too much paint going on and leaving ridges that
must later be buffed out. Also, I highly recommend NOT using spray
cans. I am pretty damn good at getting a good flow with spray cans and
keeping it evenly laid down, but it's almost impossible to do it on an
area like a cab with a stencil - you won't have good enough contrast
to tell when you may be too light here or there. Use a cap sprayer or
a airbrush sprayer and you will get pro results. Do not use a Wagner
power sprayer, they suck donkeys.
Take a look at the job I did on my Pinbot here:
http://usergallery.myhomegameroom.com/gallery/Johns-garage under the
album entitled "Pinbot undergoes a cabinet repaint" on the first page.
There are some tips in the captions. Without being too harsh, I will
say that the first stencils I got were from Jeff, and they were the
very first ones he made for Pinbot, and were not up to par - there
were a boatload of errors. After battling it out with him, I finally
found another guy who made me a good set, and I got the set for cost,
because there were two mistakes that I had to hand touchup. Don't know
if he made more and don't want anyone breathing down his neck or
sending him C&D's so I'll let him stay somewhat anonymous. But
Pinbot's cab is a bit more intricate than Flash's, and I've seen other
stencils of Jeff's that weren't bad, so I don't doubt it'll turn out
fine. Although his Gorgar one wasn't so hot either....
Final tip - after the paint has dried for a week or two, either spray
if with Defthane or some clear acrylic spray, and then buff it after
that dries, or if like me you have no problems with surface blending
on the colors, just buff it and leave it. I just used a non-orbital
buffer at low - medium speed and No. 7 brand auto polish, and the
photos speak for how it turned out. BTW, the Pinbot is for sale at a
lowered price of $1050, a damn good deal if I must say considering
it's condition, and condition is everything when it comes to pin
prices.
John
centa...@yahoo.com
appreciated and will be of value for others in the future when they
google the topic!
I'll be applying the red and white over the base black by use of paint
and roll so no spraying will be done.
The advice of lifting soon after applied was what I thought would be
best and guess I'll apply a thicker coat of paint before removal of
the stencils (not too thick but not too thin) and hope it's the right
application amount. This leaves the questioning of will I see less of
the undercoat under the white and red with a primer base (looking odd
next to the back surrounding it) or with the scuffed up black inside
the stenciling parts of where the red and white goes to see a more
natural black...one roll deal here :->
The clear coat I had thought of before to even out things of the paint
job too.
Thanks again guys...always open to other thoughts from anyone else who
wants to chirp in....Jeff?
Brian
Mark Clayton
I advise that you peel off the stencil earlier rather
than later if you're using vinyl stencils. If you allow
the paint to dry, the paint dried to the stencil will
pull at the paint on the cabinet and may cause
a rough edge or it may pull up chips of paint
that should have remained on the cabinet. If you
remove the stencil while the paint is wet, this is
minimized, and the paint at the edge of the stencil
is given a chance to settle so that the edge is not
as sharp.
As for paint coverage, you need to consider how the
original cabinet was painted. Often, the stencil colors
were not painted with a completely opaque layer - just
a thin, single coat was applied. This affects the color
of the stencil paint as it appears on the cabinet, especially
with dark base colors. Although you're free to paint your
cabinet however you like, the original factory colors often
showed the base color from beneath the stencil colors.
This also affects how the colors look when the two stencil
colors overlap. A "perfect" re-paint will use heavy, opaque
paint coverage, but a "factory original" re-paint may not.
The choice is yours.
-Mark
--
http://pinballpal.com/
<centa...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:1176392011....@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
do...@inphonic.com
stencils were very good (not perfect); I wouldn't hesitate at all at
buying these kits from him again. My only issue was minor lineup if
trying to apply a whole side stencil at one time. I simply cut the
stencils in sections, and took my time lining everything up. No
problems there. I used three different brands of spray paint, and I
think my game came out really well...
Silverball's comments are pretty much in line with my experience...
make sure your basecoat is dry before applying the first round of
stencils. I did all stencils on a horizontal basis, I never applied
paint to a vertical surface! My first "round" was red, so I very
lightly sprayed 1 lite coat; waited 20 minutes to air dry; sprayed
another semi-light coat; waited 15 minutes to dry; sprayed 3rd coat
(wet coat but not enough to pool paint!). Then I immediately peeled
the stickers, making sure the peeled part never touched any wet paint,
and SLOWLY peeled the sticker off. I waited 24 hours in a 70 degree
garage prior to painting the 2nd "round" of stencils, using the same
technique as above... except that this color was black and only
required 2 coats... one thin, the 2nd a tad thicker ...with NO peel!!!
Like they say, your mileage may vary, and I think that paint
application outcome depends on the type of paint you're using, air
temperature and of course humidity... and of course common sense and
last but not least...patience!!!!!
deafdumb&blindboy
wrote:
Oh, one other tip about removing the stencils - when you pull them, do
not pull them away from the cab, pull them away from the area you just
painted. You want to separate the paint on the stencil from the paint
on the cab so they don't come up together. It will split cleanly on
the stencil line if you pull it away like this. Rather than trying to
peel the stencil away in one fluid motion, which never works, because
if it grabs any fresh paint it will take a whole line off, try to
bunch the stencil up in your fingers and pull away small portions at a
time. This is especially true in curved areas or surrounded areas.
Once the integrity of the fresh coat is compromised, if it crosses the
stencil line, it will want to all come away a lot more easily than
before. So if the cab is upright, you will pull the stencils away in a
vertical plane and if it is flat then you pull in a horizontal plane.
Got that? Very crucial, especially if the paint hasn't cured yet. You
can avoid a lot of that by priming the area to be stenciled first
because the paint adheres better to the primer.
Mark is correct in saying that the factory finish is usually not very
precise. He gave me a lot of good tips when I was doing my stencils as
well, he knows of which he speaks. The factory of course sprayed
everything, and they likely used thin flexible brass stencils which
they would hold in place with one hand and shoot with the other.
Because they were shooting as many as possible, the stencils often had
overspray from where they didn't hold it down very carefully. Some
people even try to duplicate these mistakes, saying that it is more
"factory correct" than a nice, clean line everywhere. I say forget
that, I'd rather have it look real good than look like a lousy factory
paint job. When we pulled my friend Eric's NIB Black Knight out of the
box last year and set it up, it was comical just how bad the factory
paint was. In places where the paint guy had missed, you could see he
obviously dipped his finger into the paint can and touched up spots.
But you have to realize that on a production line you don't have time
for perfection when you have 17,505 cabs to paint on one run. And the
later on in the run, the worse the stencils got, the worse the paint
job was, because those brass stencils are fairly fragile. And they
have to be cleaned well after every, well, I'm not sure, but I would
guess 10 cabs. Otherwise the paint gets on places it shouldn't and
it's a mess. I say go for the precise look, if you are going to
repaint it. Since everyone knows it is a repaint and not original,
then it should look as good as possible, not as original as possible,
since it's obvious that it isn't original.
Also, I have tried rolling, and make sure you use a dense foam roller
on a smaller roller, not a big full sized house paint roller. We
always called those medium length ones "dog dick" rollers, you get the
idea on which size I'm talking about. 1" diameter by 6" long or so.
Dense foam is the key to a smooth finish, no nap rollers. Use
throwaway ones and use a fresh one for each color. Don't try to go too
thick if you are painting on a vertical plane or you will get runs and
drips. Paint the whole thing, then before you toss your roller, go
back and very carefully inspect the whole thing under fresh
(preferably sun) light and see if you missed anything. It's easy to
touch up and blend if the paint is still wet. Avoid using a brush, if
you have to, use a foam disposable brush for small areas or touchups.
Bristles and nap cause rolling and brush marks, which you obviously
don't want. Good luck!
John
centa...@yahoo.com
do and should do now!!
Nerve racking job for perfection but I'm not gonna rush it!
Thanks again,
Brian