WTB: Black Knight Prototype In Lane Plastics
Eric Bundy
bit high.
Xamindar
> anyone have them? I see a pair on ebay for 40.00 but I think that's a
> bit high.
contacted the seller noting it was too high a price and he responded
with "we shall see". Haha. I hope ebay charges each time you re-list an
item.
seymour.shabow
They don't, unfortunately. One insertion price until it sells.
Eric, if you want most of a CPR repro set that is only missing one or 2
pieces I'd sell it for $80 including the proto style inlane plastics,
but don't want to sell them separately. If you're interested email me
(address isn't munged).
-scott CARGPB#29
Troz
> anyone have them? I see a pair on ebay for 40.00 but I think that's a
> bit high.
Check your email...
-Karl
Retrogameconnection
They're up-side down!
Eric Bundy
who cares, they sill look better than plain metal guides. Besides is
it proven that they're updside down? Last I heard there weren't any
pictures showing a these "right side up"
Retrogameconnection
Original proto's were right side up. I saw them myself. I don't have
photos.
Back in the days before CPR and before Wayne was shutting everyone
down (early to mid 90's) - Alan Meyer reproduced these (along with
dozens of other single, commonly broken plastics) after getting his
hands on a prototype BK. He mistakenly had them printed upside down.
But, instead of re-doing them he just sold them as they were.
Fast forward several years later when CPR started up. They put out
the word looking for "original" proto lane guides for BK and someone
who bought Alan Meyer's repros sent them in. They weren't originals -
they were Alan's repros which were manufactured incorrectly.
Now we have all these reproductions out there with upside down
graphics. Why would Williams have printed them upside down?
I tried to let CPR know about the error hoping that they would correct
them before running them. But they refused to believe it and ran them
off anyway.
That's my story and I'm sticking to it. I was there when all this
went down... now it's too late.
Eric Bundy
Funny kinda sad story. Too bad they're all upside down now. Anyone
have an update on the little plastic that goes on the far left edge of
the upper playfield? I read CPR was possibly going to add it onto
their re-run of plastics.
Radius
I think Hans got a set of the prototype plastics, similar to those on
Ebay, and said the quality was terrible. Uncertain if there are more
than one go of remakes out there, aside from the CPR's.
Would be a fairly easy matter, if one had a good scan of the plastics
to reverse it (redraw it as vector art), then put it to water slide
decal stock, same with the small plastic Eric mentions. Not ideal,
but better than waiting for nothing to happen, perhaps.
I have been playing with ideas for the metal pieces for sometime. Not
my intention to make my Black Knight an exact production restoration,
but rather give it little bits of eye candy and even zest, without
detracting from the original. I have played with the design elements
on the machine, attempting to find a look that worked, or at least
drew your eye less than the metal. One idea I like, that I have not
completely fleshed out, is to have the metal engraved, then blued,
etc., etc.. Again, I have yet to come up with an answer I like, but
will it will come more into focus as I progress with the restoration.
R~
Sparky
> bit high.
Email sent.
Mark Malmberg (Sparky) - Ceres, California
Mike at CPR
New sets available within a day or two with the prototype graphics
flipped right side up.
JeffB418
WOOO HOOO!
Hans
>
> New sets available within a day or two with the prototype graphics
> flipped right side up.
>
> Mikewww.ClassicPlayfields.com
D'oh! I wasn't expecting them to be available so soon, and I JUST
did that diagnostic board print order. I'll find the money somewhere.
-Hans
Kevin CPR
> them before running them. But they refused to believe it and ran them
> off anyway.
Not directed at you in particular, but just wanting to put this to bed
forever...
Just a couple things, since its interesting this has come up again
many years later. I remember sticking up for Alan Meyer back then
(even never having met him or spoke to him) just based on knowing how
reproduction artwork is done. I couldn't figure out a way that
somebody could scan original pieces, vector trace the artwork (or
prepare it for silkscreening in whatever way) working from those
scans...and somehow "flip" the artwork in the process. The bottom
line for me (when I knew 100% for sure that the rightside-up gargoyles
were an urban legend) was this: Their feet were ALWAYS toward the
return lane. Put another way: Their feet were always in the
direction of the curl of the pointed tip. You can flip, mirror,
rotate your artwork (mistakenly or intentionally) but no matter what
image you work from, the gargoyles' feet will always be against the
INNER edge of the plastic.
Here is an exercise for y'all: Just to tease your brain, try it...
Look at this picture:
http://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=310&picno=26691
Now try (in your mind) to flip, mirror, rotate (in any way you please)
the artwork...pretend you're totally screwing up the redraw in
Photoshop or Illustrator...and see that you'll never end up with non
"upside-down" gargoyles. There is no way to do it. Even with the
left piece on the right side, mirrored. Or vice versa.
People always ask... why would Williams have had the gargoyles facing
away from the player? In looking at them in place on a machine, I
guess (IMO) they had them in a "concentric" look emenating from the
sword in the middle of the playfield. Dunno.
Now, just to finally end this... I just called and spoke to Alan Meyer
on the phone. He confirmed for me that he 100% matched an NOS
Williams pair, from an original labelled Williams part baggie. The
gargoyles were NOT facing the player. There were no artwork
screwups. Heck, he didn't even know after all this time there was a
legend surrounding his repro's being dead wrong. :) I told him, oh
yeah, it's definitely out there. :) "Upside down is an Alan Meyer
mistake that planted the original seed - propogated later by the CPR
repro, caused strictly by his reproduction being mimmicked... and the
original Williams part was "rightside up". Alan was taken aback a
little, to say the least. None of this was true. (Which is why nobody
could ever produce pictures of original pieces that defied his
repro). There has never been a rightside-up gargoyle look.
Until now.
We just re-ran Black Knight reproduction plastics, and we decided to
flip the gargoyles for everybody. This seemed to be what everybody
wanted. But I can tell you as the person who made the change - the
gargoyles (alone) were flipped vertically, but the green and black
artwork was left untouched. It takes a selective & intentional
alteration to make the artwork change.
I'll be posting the re-run announcement shortly. They are available
for order and shipping now at our site. Photo gallery posted.
Oh - and to the first person who can produce a photo to me showing
original Williams return lanes with the gargoyles "rightside up" - I
will ship you a free set of Black Knight plastics :) Please post
it here in the thread (a link for all to see). Then email me
privately to claim your prize.
KEVIN
Classic Playfield Reproductions
http://www.classicplayfields.com
Kevin CPR
Just changing the thread title, as it being a "WTB" thread won't
communicate to most the eventual discussion found in here.
Kevin
Retrogameconnection
Kevin,
I apologize. After reading your post, I immediately picked up the
phone and called Alan also. The story that I had always gotten from
him was that they were inadvertently printed upside down and that the
originals were right side up.
Today, it seems he is saying that is the way they were when he got
them. Strange. I certainly don't want to be the one spreading
rumours or incorrect information. But that is the way I seem to
remember it playing out and I had to reconfirm this again today. So
the story has changed....
I'm really happy that you have corrected them. It's always bothered
me that they were upside down. So much so that I wouldn't put them on
my game. I always blamed Alan for this error because I was sure that
he confirmed it for me so many years ago...
I stand corrected and apologize for any confusion.
Thanks for making these RIGHT!
Steve Winslow
Hans
There was a rumor floating around you might do some in the metallic
silver, to match the Silver Knight playfields. Any chance you were
able to do that?
Have to wait till payday to order, unfortunately.
-Hans
Kevin CPR
> silver, to match the Silver Knight playfields. Any chance you were
> able to do that?
Rumours abound, I guess :)
Sorry no, the silver plastic sets were only done back in 2008 to go
with the silver edition playfield pairs.
The way you see the sets at our site is the way they all look this
time.
SilverUnicorn
Thank you for this excellant write up!
Ha to the scoffers! I think it is a good move to print them the other
way, but I will keep my originals, which are correctly "upside
down" :)
Thaks for all you do Kevin.
Chris