Soldering 101 - how long should a tip last if youre not an idiot?

[Frax]

Clearly, I'm an idiot. I have not done that much soldering since I
bought my iron but have wasted 3 tips to the point they will not take
solder. I cant seem to get them clean enough, they look burned and the
solder just rolls right off when I try to re-tin it. I would say all in
all I have probably made less than 50 joints all said and done, but they
have taken a long time becuase.....see above? Idiot.

I thought i was doing a decent job of keepin the tip wiped off and free
of flux, but this keeps happening. Tips arent expensive but its
annoying.

I don't have one of those wire ball tip cleaners.


--
Frax


This USENET post sent from http://rgparchive.com

[TheKorn]

Frax <count...@gmail.com> wrote in news:Frax....@rrgparchive.com:

You're definitely doing something wrong. In your scenario that tip should last
months if not *years*! A few thoughts...

* After you clean the tip on a sponge, do you immediately re-wet the tip with
fresh solder? You should. (Just a little bit to coat the fresh surface, not a
ton.)

* Do you unplug (or otherwise turn off) your soldering iron when it's not going
to be used for a long time? For our purposes, let's say it's going to be more
than ten minutes between joints. You should.

* After you're done soldering, do you re-wet the tip with some solder, so that
there is solder on the tip while it's cooling down and the next time it's heating
up? You should.

A brass cleaning pad is nice because it doesn't drop the tip's temperature as much
when you're cleaning it. But it's not required; a wet sponge works just as well,
you just have to wait a second or two for the tip's temperature to recover.

--
Have a home video that's trapped on your camera? Want to share it on the web or
on DVD?

http://www.webwidevideo.com/

[AddictedToEMs]

I've used the same one for years - Is your iron too hot? Is the temp
adjustable?

[bara...@gmail.com]

If you have a shitty radio shack (or similar) iron the tips go bad quickly.

Since i have started using a weller soldering station i havent had to change the tip yet. Lasting sooo much longer.

[Frank Furhter]

Frax wrote:
> Clearly, I'm an idiot.

TBD.

> I have not done that much soldering since I
> bought my iron but have wasted 3 tips to the point they will not take
> solder. I cant seem to get them clean enough, they look burned and the
> solder just rolls right off when I try to re-tin it. I would say all in
> all I have probably made less than 50 joints all said and done, but they
> have taken a long time becuase.....see above? Idiot.

You bought crap then, or you are doing something very wrong, or see above.

> I thought i was doing a decent job of keepin the tip wiped off and free
> of flux, but this keeps happening. Tips arent expensive but its
> annoying.

Tin your tip, and do it regularly. Wipe it off with just about
anything, including old shirt, wet sponge, or fancy tip cleaning mesh.

>
> I don't have one of those wire ball tip cleaners.

You don't need anything to keep a tip clean really, just tin and use
quality solder. And don't run your iron too hot. Know what you are
doing by practicing :) and not being an idiot.

[Taxman]

If you clean and tin it should last a long time. So let's peel this
onion and fill in a few blanks.

What kind of soldering iron?

What temperature is it set at? (I hope it has temperature and not just
a wattage)

Just for fun, what does it say on the side of the solder you are
using?


Dave "Taxman" http://www.pinbald.com

[kenny_ii]

Tip life depends on many things. First off, what temp are you soldering
at? All things being equal, I start around 625 F and adjust as needed.
If you do not have a temp controlled iron, you'll never get good
results, BTW. A lot of manufacturers will have a variety of tip quality
and types. A tip that advertises rapid heat transfer will generally
wear out sooner as a function of material and plating.

Second is what you are soldering. New boards with clean components are
less destructive than old battery damaged ones. Flux can actually help
tip life. Flux removes oxygen and impurities from the joint, keeping it
clean and un-burned. Downside is it leaves a residue that should be
cleaned off.

A wet sponge or the brass brillo cleaners are good for removing residue
and oxidation during soldering. You should also invest in a tip tinner
pot. I use a sponge. Wipe the tip on the sponge so it shines. Tin the
tip with solder and solder the joints in question. Wipe the tip on the
sponge again. Run the tip through the tinner pot and coat it before
putting the iron in the holder. This will keep the tip from burning and
turning black just sitting there.

K2


--
kenny_ii

[Eddie]

Once again Ill post this great vid for those wanting info on
soldering.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_NU2ruzyc4

[Frax]

I bought an adjustable temp one from Fry's after I could not find a tip
for the single temp pencil one I had originally.

Turning it off is probably the issue by the sound of it. Literally, this
stupid thing takes like 10-15 min to get to a point where it will melt
the solder I have. Dont een ask me exactly what it is. All I can tell
you for sure is that its rosin core lead free. Cheap garbage. At any
rate patience is not one of my virtues. I usually work 55-70 hours a
week and have two kids. Time is a limited commodity. I guess you get
what you pay for but damn, I can not wait on that thing.

I bought some of the Kester stuff Pinball Life has and its in my box of
parts that cane today.

Looks like I really just need to suck it up and invest in a better
station that will heat up quickly and I can find the appropriate tip for
to hear wires without melting insulation.

[GOCATGO]

Frax...take a look here>> http://www.pinballnews.com/learn/soldering/index.html
A nice hand soldering seminar from Todd Anderson hosted by Pinball
News and sponsored by Pinball Renaissance and SS Billiards(LTG : )
Enjoy the learning process!

Russ
www.Team-EM.com

[Frax]

Knew someone was going to ask about the damn solder type. Beat me to it.
I'll post some more info when I get home tonight.

Curiosity didnt kill the cat, its that the cat didn't prepare for what
he found, lol.

[Frank Furhter]

Get a 5 dollar used Weller pencil at a garage sale. If you do buy a
station with a coil holder, make sure the pencil is touching the coil
metal holder if you leave it turned on. Basically Wellers are nearly
nuke proof, you can't go wrong with their products generally speaking.

[Robert Winter]

If you can afford it, get the Weller WESD51 or the WES51. $80-$120
depending on when/where/which you buy.

I've had the same tips on my Wellers for *years* and they still work
great. Just keep them clean and tinned.

And with a good soldering station, you won't be waiting 15-20 minutes to
get up to temp. Maybe 2 minutes.

Robert
-----
http://robertwinter.com

[Hans]

I think the weller WTC that I'm using is around the same age as I am,
and I'm still using the original tips that came with it, and I've
been doing a lot of soldering with it the past couple of years.

Which model iron are you using, and what solder are you using?

-Hans

[phishrace]

On Feb 23, 12:35 pm, Frax <countrye...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Looks like I really just need to suck it up and invest in a better
> station that will heat up quickly and I can find the appropriate tip for
> to hear wires without melting insulation.

Try going cheaper instead. I use a Weller SP23L (25W, ~750 degrees) I
got at Frys for about $15. Take 2-3 minutes to warm up. They also sell
Weller replacement tips.

-phish

[seymour.shabow]

I've had the tip in my weller 100 for almost 20 years. Good thing it's
lasting too since they don't make tips to fit it anymore.

As long as you tin it properly a tip should last a long, long time.

[TheKorn]

Frax <count...@gmail.com> wrote in news:Frax....@rrgparchive.com:

> Turning it off is probably the issue by the sound of it. Literally, this
> stupid thing takes like 10-15 min to get to a point where it will melt
> the solder I have. Dont een ask me exactly what it is. All I can tell
> you for sure is that its rosin core lead free. Cheap garbage.

That's probably the genesis of your problem. Lead free needs a LOT more heat to
melt. So your iron has to sit naked in the air a lot longer, plus it's getting
hotter than normal, and thus oxidizing a lot faster. Kind of a perfect storm,
really.

> At any
> rate patience is not one of my virtues. I usually work 55-70 hours a
> week and have two kids. Time is a limited commodity. I guess you get
> what you pay for but damn, I can not wait on that thing.

Sounds like investing in a much, much better iron then would be warranted!

> I bought some of the Kester stuff Pinball Life has and its in my box of
> parts that cane today.

Good stuff!

> Looks like I really just need to suck it up and invest in a better
> station that will heat up quickly and I can find the appropriate tip for
> to hear wires without melting insulation.

Normally not a problem. The leaded solder will help you out tremendously.

[kurtok]

On Feb 23, 3:00 pm, Frax <countrye...@gmail.com> wrote:

I bought a used Xytronics station on ebay 4 years ago for $25. It came
with 5 rolls of solder, flux, extra tips and a tinner. I think the
solder alone was worth more than I paid for it. Lucked out.
The tip on it was used and it's still good, so something is wrong. If
you're going to touch a board with it either get a station with
temperature output, not just a pot, or prepare to fuck up a lot stuff.
I have a pencil iron too but if you do anything more advanced then
replacing a light socket or a switch and you'll want something better.
Don't you deserve it?
Kurt

[kurtok]

Might have something to do with the fact that 20 years ago everything
wasn't Chinese shit.
KK

[seymour.shabow]

Probably. I didn't check to see where the new wellers are made. It
definitely comes down to if you take care of the tip properly - when the
tenma stations were $11 a couple years ago I bought 2, one for me as a
spare/field iron and one for a buddy. His burned up the tip in about a
week and mine's still ok, even though it gets used more. Not sure why
he has such a problem with irons - he must be soldering at too low or
high a temp I'm guessing.

[Hans]

I missed the part about the rosin core lead-free solder.

Man, that rosin they use for lead-free is some nasty stuff. Smokes
like hell, stinks like hell, and takes forever to clean up.
Which reminds me, I need to get a roll of the good Kester no-clean
stuff eventually. Took forever to clean off my last batch of boards,
and I really couldn't get it all off of there.

-Hans

[Kirkd2]

TheKorn;1891464 Wrote:
> Frax <count...@gmail.com> wrote in news:Frax.58em1a (AT) rrgparchive
> (DOT) com:

> recover. [\QUOTE]
>
>
>
> +1 on the above except the brass brush/pad - never used one and I have
> had the same tip in my iron since about 1986.
> Can't be an idiot is you weren't taught.


--
Kirkd2

[martin]

Not for every job, but I really like the water wash flux. It does a great job with dirtier surfaces. The downside is that you absolutely have to do a good water wash.

Also - if the tip of your iron is too hot, it will oxidise and become useless very quickly.

[blubbo]

I have this one:
http://www.circuitspecialists.com/xytronic-soldering-station-137esd.html

I have had it for years and I'm still using the same tip. I use the
brass brillo thing to clean the tip. It heats up in about 10-15
seconds. It's been really solid and is reasonably priced. I think I
have it set at 640F which seems to work well on just about everything.
Dan

[Frax]

My.....thing... Is a velleman vtss5u. Dingy 20$ soldering station. Its
adjustable but not marked at all so who knows what temp its at.

I didnt have money at the time and I needed something right away to do
some stuff when I started all this last June. I will end up biying
something better, just not right now. Gotta sell something to get the
80-120$ looks like the decent stations are running.

Guess I suck it up and solder faster or be more patient in the meanwhile
lol.


--
Frax

[Frank Furhter]

Frax wrote:
> My.....thing... Is a velleman vtss5u. Dingy 20$ soldering station. Its
> adjustable but not marked at all so who knows what temp its at.
>
> I didnt have money at the time and I needed something right away to do
> some stuff when I started all this last June. I will end up biying
> something better, just not right now. Gotta sell something to get the
> 80-120$ looks like the decent stations are running.
>
> Guess I suck it up and solder faster or be more patient in the meanwhile
> lol.
>
>

You do *NOT* need a 100-120 dollar station, or even a 80-100 Weller.
Get a 5 dollar pencil soldering iron at a garage sale and you are good
to go for like 20+ years or longer. They just last that long!

[kurtok]

Lose it and get yourself something nice

[Frank Furhter]

http://greenville.craigslist.org/ele/2846369672.html

Go and get some, tips that is... Bet you can get seller down to 55/60
delivered.