The Joy of the Non-Anal Collector
Jack (www.villagebbs.com)
I don't like garbage, I have three machines and I'd rate them all as
perhaps.. 'nice'. They work, they play well and all are fairly clean.
While I would never go for a pin with major wear (especially down the
wood) I suspect my tolerance for fault is HUGE compared to many people.
For example, my Dr. Who has major fade on one side of the cabinet. Not
on the playfield mind you, just the side. I like it because hey, its a
bit of a change from the non-faded side isn't it? It just doesn't
matter to me. It doesn't affect game play, still looks fine and since
the game is right up against another pin you can't really see it
anyway.
I dunno. To me its more about if the game plays well and works well. It
needs to look fairly nice, but a ding here, some fade there.. eh, not
going to kill me. Then again, i'd never pay $6,000 (with shipping) for
say a Twilight Zone. No, I'd rather pay $2,000 for a nice routed one at
auction, fix it up and have the $4k left over. If my $2k TZ has some
fade or perhaps a ding or two.. maybe some wear on the leg mounts? I
don't care. The clock works.
But that's just me.
= numsix
= http://813museum.villagebbs.com
seymour...@excite.com
for to be extra nice, but there's plenty of Junkyard dogs in my
collection (I don't like the worn to the wood either, but ball swirls?
Sure.)
Keith Stelter
Of course my standards have come up over the 20 years that I have been
collecting, but that mostly has to do with available income and the fact
that I've run across "better" examples of games that I like. I'm always
looking to upgrade the "keeper" machines in my collection, but they are
games to be played first and foremost!
I've said it a million times here on RGP, pinball machines were (and are)
made to be put into a bar or arcade, have the crap kicked out of them for a
few years, and then be dumpstered. They are (and never were) made to be
perfect pieces of everlasting, precision machinery!
Sure there are ball swirls, insert art wear, and cabinet fade. In the "old"
days, we would buy beater games from operators for $20.00, clean them up,
put whatever drop targets or bumper caps on them that we had lying around,
and played the heck out of them!
The hobby has changed quite a bit. I stopped going to Expo, and usually
don't sell any machines to RGP'ers anymore because most of the collectors
here are far too critical to risk my reputation by selling to them!
Better just to enjoy my machines, and sell them to the family down the
street who will enjoy the game without crying about it having an star on the
spinner instead of a lightning bolt!
<seymour...@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1131301028....@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----
J. Weaver Jr.
> But that's just me.
You're not alone, Jack. Other than my one NOS machine (which I'm trying
to keep Real Nice, because I'm not that seriously in love with it),
_function_ is far more important to me than form.
I'll never forget the guy I met at the bar at Expo a few years back. He
showed me a photo album with a ton of pictures of absolutely perfect
looking woodrails. But, when I asked him how much he _played_ in an
average day, he looked at me like I'd just suggested that he hump his
mother. Perfect, beautiful lineup of pins, never actually _used_. <shudder>
My pins get used _every_ day, and they look it, a little. (My friends
encourage this, as they complain the machines are too fast right after I
clean 'em.) But, I bought 'em to _play_, not to collect.
Ever been in a house with kids? Collections are on _shelves_, toys are
on the floor. Pinballs are (and belong) on the floor. -JW
Manic
machine can made very playable so if you buy the first one
you see the hunt is over. Now if the cab and PF look doable
then yeah - bringing it back to close to pristine shape
is indeed satisfying.
For me I know the gameplay is not gonna keep me
*enruptured* forever (remember this great Archie Bunker
saying? :) so I like to add the "hunt" to the hobby as I do
want to keep 'em and rarely sell anything.
That's why I also don't buy the restored pins from some
of the good guys in the hobby as that eliminates both the
"hunt" and the possible "super shop job/fix up" route.
Though they sometims DO look tempting ;-)
BUT I do understand when people are not near an area
where you can search for pins (actually that's becoming
everywhere these days :-( and just want to get 'em and play!
And some just plain HATE the "hunt" anyways ;-)
--
*Because John Shields HATES to see people's collections:*
M.M, C.V, N.G.G, T.O.M, J.Y, N.F, J.D, P.M, J.M,
Shad*w, C.F.T.B.L, A.F.M, F.T, W.W, L.O.T.R, T.S.P.P
"Jack (www.villagebbs.com)" <lup...@planetjurai.com> wrote in message
news:1131300318.0...@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
PT
every part in a machine when I shop it. Does this qualify me as anal?
I like working on them as much as playing them. Once done I have no
problem with them getting played like rented mules. Anyone is welcome
to come and play. I don't understand the "only for show" attitude.
John
Pin Geek
likes to rub her butt against one as she walks by and denies it. Girls in
general love doing this. A scratch or two, here and there, they didn't do
it. Part of life I guess:(
--
Josh
http://www.pingeek.com
Get your pinball show dvds here:
http://host300.ipowerweb.com/~pingeekc/dvd_sale.htm
See you at The Hershey Gameroom Expo, 12/9-12/11
http://www.sledworks.com
"J. Weaver Jr." <jw...@poSPAMSUCKSbox.com> wrote in message
news:65sbf.442$Id6...@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
seymour...@excite.com
example - I take what's there and make the most of it. Sure, the drop
targets aren't right, but they sure are CLEAN.
I do this because I want the machine to perform nice.... looks are
secondary.
The Prowler
I have a TZ that has 2 holes with fan plates over the outside of the
head of the machine. It also has a 6 inch circle where some one peeled
the graphics off the side. The playfield is super nice and I always
thought what the hell I dont play on the cabinet and it doesnt bother
me at all.
Keith Stelter
about how I shop or maintain a machine!
I run all the parts through the Berry polisher, and do a complete shop job
on every game that I shop, not just the really "good" machines.
I haven't done an older machine with a Magic Eraser yet. I'm anxious to find
the time and the right machine to see how many ball swirls and marks I can
get off.
<seymour...@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1131309101.8...@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
GA Pinhead
out, no.
I get no joy from working on them, just playing. If it works, I'll play
it. If it stops working, I'll worry about getting it fixed. Wax still
helps the worn to wood parts...
I guess part of it is playing crappy location pins for SO many years
that if I was not forgiving, I would have stopped playing along time ago.
Of course the brand new LOTR had better be nice...
John!
Pin Geek
out.
However, the playfield is nice and it plays great, other than the eye
plunger repair needed. Works for me.
--
Josh
http://www.pingeek.com
Get your pinball show dvds here:
http://host300.ipowerweb.com/~pingeekc/dvd_sale.htm
See you at The Hershey Gameroom Expo, 12/9-12/11
http://www.sledworks.com
"The Prowler" <jves...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1131309223....@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Bryan Kelly
most about collecting is making my pins look the best I can. Now, if
you think they don't get played, you're mistaken.
Funny thing is, around my house they actually get played more by the
neighbor kids. :-) 10 year old Hunter, from next door, comes over
every couple of weeks to play. He used to come by himself but lately,
he's been bringing his friends. One day last week, I had 4 of them in
the gameroom. I'm in the shop keeping an ear on things and they're
having a blast, banging away at the games.
What's really cool is they now call the games by names, instead of "the
one with the martians", they turn them off and on by themsleves, they
no longer flip both flippers at the same time and I can hear them
telling each other what to shoot for. They're also really nice, polite
kids who thank me for having them and ask if they can come back again.
you bet, I tell them, anytime.
Of course, after they're gone, I get the glass cleaner out and clean
all the games. :-)
Bryan (CARGPB14) http://usergallery.myhomegameroom.com/gallery/bspins
"Warning! Achtung! Run away, Run away!: BK restorations may emit a
shower of sparks or flames or both. Keep a safe distance (like four
city blocks). Never return to a restoration once lit. Hot hot hot!"
(Sig line compliments of Clive at the Coin-Op Cauldron.)
Pin Geek
collector who lays out every part, THEN puts back every screw where it was
originally on the playfield after hand polishing each piece instead of using
a tumbler. Underneath, I don't worry about it for some reason, but on the
playfield, it must be as the playfield was assembled, unless the screw head
is stripped. Then I replace it.
Is anybody else crazy enough to do this or just me?
--
Josh
http://www.pingeek.com
Get your pinball show dvds here:
http://host300.ipowerweb.com/~pingeekc/dvd_sale.htm
See you at The Hershey Gameroom Expo, 12/9-12/11
http://www.sledworks.com
"GA Pinhead" <georgia...@SPAMTHISyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:d26b2$436e6da7$a6663607$16...@ALLTEL.NET...
Bryan Kelly
You've been here long enough to know about TUMBLERS, man!!!
You're actually no different then us anal guys. We just do it to the
whole game. :-)
Bryan (CARGPB14) http://usergallery.myhomegameroom.com/gallery/bspins
"Warning! Achtung! Run away, Run away!: BK restorations may emit a
shower of sparks or flames or both. Keep a safe distance (like four
city blocks). Never return to a restoration once lit. Hot hot hot!"
(Sig line compliments of Clive at the Coin-Op Cauldron.)
Pin Geek
to post arcade open house. Maybe some chrome polish for good measure.
Judging by all the brain cells I've lost from it, I'm sure it kills some
germs:) Left me purdee dain banaged.
--
Josh
http://www.pingeek.com
Get your pinball show dvds here:
http://host300.ipowerweb.com/~pingeekc/dvd_sale.htm
See you at The Hershey Gameroom Expo, 12/9-12/11
http://www.sledworks.com
"Bryan Kelly" <bske...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1131312862....@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pin Geek
I know about the tumblers. I have for years.
I just can't do it. I can't. Oh, the humanity!:)
Ok, time to step outside and trim the bushes that are encroaching over the
house.
I think some squirrels are missing in action.
--
Josh
http://www.pingeek.com
Get your pinball show dvds here:
http://host300.ipowerweb.com/~pingeekc/dvd_sale.htm
See you at The Hershey Gameroom Expo, 12/9-12/11
http://www.sledworks.com
"Bryan Kelly" <bske...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1131313118.1...@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
frenchy
my belt, I think of tons of little stupid things I got obsessed with
when I was younger. Now it's mainly get the machine working, a little
wear adds character to a game. It's fun taking a ragged machine and
getting it to play like new without doing all this swapping stuff, just
work with what you got. If it's got a totally crapped backglass or a
broken plastic or something like that then I will hunt one up, sure.
Cabinets are something I REALLY don't give a damn about anymore, used
to fret about repainting them or touchups. Now I simply don't give a
hot damn about them as long as they are not peeling like 5 days after a
bad sunburn.
GA Pinhead
> OK, let me speak up for the anal guys. I'll admit, what I enjoy the
> most about collecting is making my pins look the best I can. Now, if
> you think they don't get played, you're mistaken.
>
And that is a good thing, I am more of the "sure I could change my own
oil, but do I want to?". People like you get my business!
> Funny thing is, around my house they actually get played more by the
> neighbor kids. :-) 10 year old Hunter, from next door, comes over
> every couple of weeks to play. >
We live in the country and truthfully, I would not let many of the
neighbors even in my yard... One of the few exceptions, Roger came over
last night to check out LOTR. I really enjoy sharing my machines with
others.
Get em working, make them better if the money and parts are there. I
would love to replace some Taxi stuff, but it is not available.
"Bryan, are the Martians supposed to be on fire?"
John!
> Bryan (CARGPB14) http://usergallery.myhomegameroom.com/gallery/bspins
>
Fred Kemper
Not a single "Trailer Queen" in my line-up.
--
Fred
TX
CARGPB#8
******************
"Jack (www.villagebbs.com)" <lup...@planetjurai.com> wrote in message news:1131300318.0...@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> Just wondering if I was alone in being 'non-anal'
1hookeds...@gmail.com
almost a year because I could not afford to get all new art etc.
I nearly sold it but while getting it ready I put it back together and
played a few games. It hit me like a ton of bricks...
"Oh yea...you PLAY these...preferably in a dimly lit room. You don't
turn halogen lights on and stare at the sideart weeping over every nic
and scratch"
kirb
You will find far more people in your boat than the other.
Kirb
Harry Williamson
"> Just wondering if I was alone in being 'non-anal'.
I wish I was "non anal" I literally just polished my
coin door lid and bracket for the lock down bar. My
seven year old daughter said it looked great, but wondered
why I did it since NO ONE WILL SEE IT!!!!!
I just got a MB, and am now completely shopping it out.
Of course it doesn't really need it, but I can't rest until it's
done.
Harry whose got the shiniest coin door lids in SJ.
Del
Want,, You can walk into my Shop & you'll see things piled on top of
game & dirty PF glass's.
I DO have a Group of Keepers that I keep as clean as I can &
99 % of these wont be sold,,,, BUT
I was at Chris Hs, shop this morning & I can only wish a few on my
games were as nice as the ones I see there,, I have 3 Games for him to
restore/Fix for me & those will be Keepers
As far as Kids coming to play my games ??, I have 4 Kids coming to my
place as well & I Hope they keep up the good manners & keep coming
back,,Nothing like watching those lil Kids enjoying the games,,, Right
now Slug fest is getting the most play & thats fine with me !! ( Keeps
um off my good games ) .
Hunting more Games ???, Heck Yea !!! finding & buying games is
something I Live for & right now "Everyone" here is tired of me talking
Pinball,,, Caint help it & not going to give it up !!! =)
Pin-Del,
twilightzonepinball
For me it's all about doing something different to keep my interest.
Started out just fixing and collecting EMs. Then made the big leap to
DMDs after a 10 year rest. Now I enjoy creating new mods, restoring
cosmetics (sometimes being anal), and trouble shooting the electronics.
Of course all the while playing and getting better.
My plan is to keep moving forward wherever it leads.
-Tom
http://mysite.verizon.net/vze8f4tt/tomstwilightzonepinballmachineaccessories/index.html
Boyd Bottorff
>
> You will find far more people in your boat than the other.
Of course, a far greater percentage of the other kink hang out here.
Boyd Bottorff
> >
> > You will find far more people in your boat than the other.
>
> Of course, a far greater percentage of the other kink hang out here.
Oops. I meant "kind". I think.
Woodsy
collector" quality; the rest are old route machines, I shop them out as good
as I can at the time, but once they are up and running, they get played,
waxed and fixed if they brake. None of my machines are perfect, but they are
good enough for me, friends and family. Folks that play them never ogle (
sp) over them... they just have fun playing them. I am in a mode now that
I take in a project, get it running, if I like playing it , I work on it
some more and keep it longer, if I don't like playing it, I cut it loose.
But, my guess is most of us do this.
Bri...@aol.com
playfield swaps on occasion.
For me the game must play well first, everything else is secondary. I
have seen some games in extremely nice
cosmetic condition that played horribly. While I do have some very
nice pins with NOS fields, I also have some pins with wear down to the
wood. If the cabinet is nice that is a plus, but it is not a
dealbreaker for me.
Brian Bannon
Steve
I'm with you also. I've got a few really nice pins, but most have defects
that others would take issue with. I guess its a matter of what you're
willing to pay to have a really mint pin. Most of the pins I enjoy the most
were free to $200. I've put a lot of work into them, and have made
them all about as nice as they can be (thats part of the fun IMO).
There are folks that pay big bucks for really nice pins. More power to
them. When their machines wear out, or they sick of them, I'll end up
with a few more in my collection. ;-)
Steve
frenchy
I "
Want>>
I've found that I truly don't even know if I want a game in the first
place until I've already had it a month ; )
Fred Kemper
--
Fred
TX
CARGPB#8
******************
"Boyd Bottorff" <bbot...@nomail.com> wrote
ldnayman
in average condition, you really appreciate when you get a nice piece.
It's not a must but it is really sweet to go though a 30 year old game
that looks like it just came off the line on the inside.
And games that look that nice, in my experience, tend to hold up
better. You don't seem to get these little problems that keep happening
over and over, and little things breaking once a week.
LouiSurfer
hands on anything worth having, because those types of machines around
here are hard to come by (or out of my price range) for titles I'd
like.
Plus I'd have to devote a lot MORE time and money than I already do
into getting games to look that way by the magnitude of five times.
I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, but my situation with
family and other hobbies makes it impossible for me to be that type of
collector.
Here's to the guys that enjoy condition 8/10 machines - that have been
used, routed at some point, banged up a bit, but restored to 100%
working playable and touched up cleanly.
Cheers!
L.
llabrevlis
of pinball. To me, if you are fixing things that are not visible then
that is being anal. I like the game to look as nice as possible, and
will go to any reasonable length to make it as original as possible,
but if I can't see it when I'm playing the game, I don't care about it.
Until I started reading the group, I had never noticed cabinet fade,
just didn't matter to me. It's still not a deal breaker, but now I do
try to get one as unfaded as possible, Guess I'm being corrupted a
little ;-)
DG
m6onz5a
been rubbing and then you'll have your proof! ;)
Chas
Rictor
anyway if you have your pins close together. I'd rather get a pin with
cosmetic flaws for $1,000 than a collector-grade pin for $3,000 if they
both play exactly the same.
seymour...@excite.com
right? Since most mechanical parts aren't visible but are essential to
game play, they get fixed first.....
I actually did my Blackout out of order, usually I fix the electronics
first then shop the PF second. Did the PF first this time and the
electronics second..... here's hoping Oliver K will make a /10 rom for
it as it's easy to roll it!!
Boyd Bottorff
> of pinball. To me, if you are fixing things that are not visible then
> that is being anal.
There's a bit more than that. There's a gradiation of anality, really,
but here's my general take on it:
Too loose: ignores features that don't work, doesn't care about lights,
so long as the flippers flip. IE, sort of like a neglected route game.
Kinda loose: the game works, but switches need to be gapped, a few
feature lights need to be replaced, stuff like that. About route
machine that's been mostly kept up state.
About mid-line: game works, play is fairly sharp, game is mostly clean,
but a few GI lights may not be working, the plastics may not be
flawless, and stuff like that.
Kinda anal: worries about perfectly having formed, NOS or perfect
reproduction slingshot plastics. Ramps took an hour to polish properly.
Game placed specially in the house to prevent cabinet fade; if it
already occurred, he's considering reproduction decals to cover the
flaw.
Badly anal: Worries about cleaning under the plastics. Panics when he
finds nicks on the back of the game. If the cabinet has begun to fade,
he plans on purchasing a new one, but worries that the paint will not be
applied in the same fashion as the original cabinets.
seymour...@excite.com
stripping down the playfield and cleaning everything (including under
the plastics). That doesn't make you badly anal - the other parts of
BA - I agree.
I'm badly anal if you define that as game plays extremely well, and I
WILL fix a mal adjusted switch right away, or if a switch is not
scoring as it should.
I don't think that qualifies - my standard is If I were a concientious
operator in the late 70s (when most ops cared) I would fix the machines
properly right away. I'm not going to repaint a cab or something like
that on the fly, but if a switch or something needed fixing, do it
right away. I might leave some non-feature lamps out, but will replace
those that are needed to play the game enjoyably.
I think the breakdown needs to be amongst two lines: a list for people
that are restoring/shopping, and then an anality list for people that
are maintaining.
madsygrl
No, far from it.
In fact I'm surprised there aren't more. Guess they won't admit it. :-)
As long as it has a fighting chance to be "resurrected" and it's a
title we enjoy, then bring it on. What's a little fade among
friends...how often do you look at the side of the machine when you're
playing after all.
Most of our collection are auction or Flea Market pieces, many waiting
for revival.
I have a special place in my heart for the "Crapacomb" we picked up for
$75.00 at Allentown.
And John just LOVED fixing the "Italian Job",as he called it, a HSII
reimport that it seems was used as an ashtray for its lifespan and had
all sorts of nifty operator fixes like the infamous drywall screw
balltrap stopper. (which we also noticed on a BoP we used to own)
But we love them anyway.
MAD
Jack (www.villagebbs.com) wrote:
> Just wondering if I was alone in being 'non-anal'. Don't get me wrong,
> I don't like garbage, I have three machines and I'd rate them all as
> perhaps.. 'nice'. They work, they play well and all are fairly clean.
> While I would never go for a pin with major wear (especially down the
> wood) I suspect my tolerance for fault is HUGE compared to many people.
>
>
> For example, my Dr. Who has major fade on one side of the cabinet. Not
> on the playfield mind you, just the side. I like it because hey, its a
> bit of a change from the non-faded side isn't it? It just doesn't
> matter to me. It doesn't affect game play, still looks fine and since
> the game is right up against another pin you can't really see it
> anyway.
>
> I dunno. To me its more about if the game plays well and works well. It
> needs to look fairly nice, but a ding here, some fade there.. eh, not
> going to kill me. Then again, i'd never pay $6,000 (with shipping) for
> say a Twilight Zone. No, I'd rather pay $2,000 for a nice routed one at
> auction, fix it up and have the $4k left over. If my $2k TZ has some
> fade or perhaps a ding or two.. maybe some wear on the leg mounts? I
> don't care. The clock works.
>
> But that's just me.
>
> = numsix
> = http://813museum.villagebbs.com
Rondogg
The super anal collector also maintains perfectly clean, under
playfield wires.
Dave Pauk
virtues of over-anality.
Why, just the other day, I was snipping off excess cable lace out of my
SO76 backbox to use in the lower cab where it was missing some :-)
Next up, polishing the flipper bats UNDERNEATH where the rubber goes
;-P
Dave
kirb
Boyd Bottorff wrote:
> Too loose: ignores features that don't work, doesn't care about lights,
> so long as the flippers flip. IE, sort of like a neglected route game.
Hard to even claim this guy is a collector.
> Kinda loose: the game works, but switches need to be gapped, a few
> feature lights need to be replaced, stuff like that. About route
> machine that's been mostly kept up state.
Yep, basic "get it running", wipe it down, make sure most things work
> About mid-line: game works, play is fairly sharp, game is mostly clean,
> but a few GI lights may not be working, the plastics may not be
> flawless, and stuff like that.
Decent shop job, don't go through everything, re-do flippers, replace
burnt bulbs, live with a few flaws, cabs not a big deal.
> Kinda anal: worries about perfectly having formed, NOS or perfect
> reproduction slingshot plastics. Ramps took an hour to polish properly.
> Game placed specially in the house to prevent cabinet fade; if it
> already occurred, he's considering reproduction decals to cover the
> flaw.
kinda anal would be a full stripped down shop job, but not all NOS
stuff. Fully buffed out and worked over. All new bulbs and flipper
parts, every mech scrubbed, every sleeve replaced, game works flawless
and looks great. Cab decals and other minor PF imperfections are taken
care of as good as can be.
> Badly anal:
I don't agree with most of what you pointed out- I would say that BA is
complete shop jobs with many NOS parts, wire harness cleaned, cab
stripped and painted inside, boards scrubbed, new decals or perfect
cab, cleared PF, new coin door, new legs, new levelers, new leg bolts,
new carrage bolts or newly plated, etc....
Kirb
Mike Schudel
Although I'm not a NOS hound, spending all my time looking for perfect
parts, I can make the old ones look good enough. I have never spent too
much time making the underside of the pf look pretty other than cleaning
inserts and mechanisms. I do own cabinet decals, but have never installed
any yet, but I do admit to buying new legs, levelers and leg bolts. I have
applied patch overlays on a playfield and touched up cabinets with paint,
but have never sent in a pf for clearcoating.
Making a game play 100% and be relaible is my first concern, cosmetics in
areas where you look are the next concern. I do love to slap save and I
play the hell out of them and let others do as well.
--
Mike S.
Kalamazoo, MI
Gameroom: http://tinyurl.com/7lbv3
W C S Owner's List: http://tinyurl.com/8ua2n
M B Scoop Repair: http://tinyurl.com/9lfu
--------------------------------------------
kirb
Mike Schudel wrote:
> Making a game play 100% and be relaible is my first concern, cosmetics in
> areas where you look are the next concern. I do love to slap save and I
> play the hell out of them and let others do as well.
Thanks again, BTW....
Kirb
Mike Messersmith
*perfect* and they never will be. For the most part they look good and
play good. Stuff gets traded every so often to keep it interesting.
Manufacturer and date don't stop me from picking up a game and enjoying
it for a while either.
Mike