Can a system 11C be used in Data East Games?
kbliznick
generational differences, but not as much experience with the Data
East board set and 3 revisions.
The main difference I know of between the Williams and DE is the
inclusion of the System 6/7 style sound and speech section that was
build directly onto the MPU and later phased out completely by 11C.
I see 11C boards go cheap because the game list is somewhat small and
mostly unpopular and they are not easily retrofitted back into the
older boardsets.
If this is possible is should also be possible to use 11A and 11B
MPU's in a DE, but not the other way around.
kbliznick
MPU board.
Power supplies are interchangeable.
Display boards and drivers are interchangeable, although Williams
inverted the signal on their 16 digit displays.
Pinouts of the MPU are identical between the 2 (minus the sound
section)
System 11A, B and C are all compatible with each other (if you ignore
the onboard sound differences) (11 if you add the components for the
special solenoids but it has a 7 segment LED for diagnostics)
All versions of DE MPU's had the 3 LED's for diagnostics which matches
11A, B and C.
DE rev 3 is backwards compatible to rev1 and 2 (although it appears
that you have to change some jumpers to drop into the Rev1/Rev2 laser
war)
Version 3 is when DE implemented the controlled special solenoids
(which Williams had this set up on their hardware for 11A, B and C
even though they did not implement the software to do this until 11B)
Only difference I see between DE Rev 1 and 2 is the RAM size increased
from 6016 to 6064 and some jumper changes
Williams required no jumpers for Eprom changes, but always used 2
eproms at U26 and U27 (27128's and 27256's)
DE does require a jumper change depending on if you are using 2 eproms
at 5B and 5C(27128's and 27256's) or a single Eprom at 5C (a 27512
eprom)
All of this tells me that a system system 11 (if modified according to
clays guide) 11A, 11B or 11C CPU should drop right into a Data East
that used 2 eproms (Secret Service to Batman)
However if you want to put one into a Rev C game that accepts a
single 27512 Eprom (Star Trek 25th and up) it looks like you will have
to cut one trace and jumper another.
So now I just need to go into the schematics for each game and find
the trace that is the equivalent to jumpers J4 and J5 in the williams
game and cut and jumper those traces.
Has anyone tried this already?
kbliznick
> section)
Need to double check this. The power supply connector appears to be
slightly different.
kbliznick
System 11 and 11A can only hold the 6116 RAM, so these will not work
in DE games (except maybe laser war)
11B and 11C has the extra pads and jumper to replace the 6116 with a
6264
So where I am at at the moment is to use an 11B or 11C board in a DE
game
#1 replace the RAM at U25 with 6264 and jumper correctly,
#2 Modifiy the power connector in the DE game to match.
#3 Cut trace and add jumper to convert to single 27512 eprom (at U27)
for those games that need it.
The actions to accomplish these are
#1 To convert 11B and 11C to 6264 ram at U25, remove jumper W5 and
install it at Jumper W6
#2 Add a wire to pin 9 on the connector for J17 to supply 12V to the
board The schematic for DE matches williams with pin #7 keyed, but the
pictures of DE MPU's appear to show something different
Either way, Pins #1-3 are ground #4-6 are 5V and #9 is for 12V. -12V
isn't needed.
#3 Cut the trace from Pin 1 of U27 (it connects to 5V) and jumper it
to address line 15 (pin 25 of the 6808 CPU)
These all seem like minor enough changes to make it worthwhile to
convert an 11C board over to work in Data East games. If #3 is done
clean enough, it should be easily reversible back into an 11C with no
need to switch the RAM back.
Am I making this too easy? Are there any weird addressing issues I am
not looking at?
stangbat
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the Williams power supplies
are only interchangeable for the DE games with an alphanumeric display
(Laser War to the Simpsons). Once you go to the DMDs that needed HV, I
think you need to stick with a DE PS.
--
stangbat
This USENET post sent from http://rgparchive.com
kbliznick
kbliznick
love to find out if this works as the DE MPU boards can sometimes
command high prices and this would turn the 11C board from an unwanted
board into to a useful one.
kbliznick
Also looks like the requirements for 12V's on the 11C board can be
eliminated by changing jumper W11 to W10. This is the voltage for the
reset section. Is the 12V used anywhere else on this board?
TheKorn
679863...@w7g2000pre.googlegroups.com:
> Also looks like the requirements for 12V's on the 11C board can be
> eliminated by changing jumper W11 to W10. This is the voltage for the
> reset section. Is the 12V used anywhere else on this board?
Shouldn't be; the opto circuit was already dropped and the only other place
they really needed +12 was for the audio. (...which was dropped by then.)
--
Have a home video that's trapped on your camera? Want to share it on the
web or on DVD?
kbliznick
is correct.
Checkiing the schematics the special solenoids are different between
Williams and DE, with only #5 being the same between them.
Williams to DE
1-4
2-6
3-2
4-1
5-5
6-3
This probably explains the dual sets of special solenoid transistors
on the Rottendog board and probably the use of an jumper to decide
which set to enable.
Makes this conversion a little less desirable, but not impossible.
However these are special solenoid so the inputs from the playfield
will still be correct for all of the games that used the playfield
switches to activate the coils.(rev 2 pins) They would just be in the
wrong order during the solenoid test.
This won't work for the games that switched these over to computer
control.
The easiest way to correct this would be to pull U49 from the 11C
board and make a little converter board that would allow you to swap
the outputs to the correct pins.