A History of MUDs
Patrick J. Wetmore
junior high or whatever and reading books and making friends instead
of staring at a computer all day, this guy Aspnes made TinyMUD; it was
like another game called Monster, which is really silly if you've ever
played it.
Boy, I bet he'd have never done that if he'd anticipated TinySex. But
that's beside the point.
Anyways, he stuck that baby up on the net - it was just called TinyMUD.
Plain old vanilla TinyMUD. The wizard was just called Wizard. Just Wizard.
The players on TinyMUD were all radically different types of people
interacting with eachother, and it was fun. We'll refer to them as
Dinosaurs later on, but for now we'll just call them Players.
Some of the players were furry-types, some were the not-furry types, but
they all hung out together anyways (in the Rec Room). Someone got really
bored at this point and invented TinySex. Possibly Carneggy, but I don't
know. 10% of the players were actually a young teenybopper named Claire
(this is a syndrome that happens to MUDs occasionally).
Let's get to some real name-dropping, though:
PinkIII: a robot, similar to Pink and PinkII. Fun to talk to.
Spidey & Cindy: the cutest couple on the MUD.
Oklahoma: A state somewhere between Massachusetts and California.
In Oklahoma, a man who called himself Nightfall and his girlfriend
Chrysalis started up a MUD called TinyHELL. The second TinyMUD ever.
(a hint for newbies: Nightfall would have called himself Random, but the
name was taken by some goober on TinyMUD. This may or may not be true;
my memory is flakey). TinyHELL was fun, too, and the players who played it
were a subset of TinyMUD's players. It was the first themed TinyMUD.
Anyways, name dropping from TinyHELL:
Molly: a transsexual cyborg. it happens.
bob: he did TinyMUD too, but thought TinyHELL was cooler.
Insane_Hermit: just this guy.
Anyways, Nightfall got tired of us players slashing eachother to bits in
the Nexus (a place in TinyHELL where all kinds of other places met. in a
virtual sense, of course), so he tried to create a Rule saying No More
Killing In The Nexus. Molly, bob, and this other guy Hurin (your narrator)
responded by slashing eachother to virtual pieces behind his back.
Thus, the Kill Macro was invented.
Also thus, the Haven flag was invented.
Anyways: people saw how much fun Nightfall had by ruling a bunch of unruly
college computer users with an Iron Fist, and decided they needed their
OWN power trips. Thus, Islandia was created, the first of many MUDs to be
ruled by committee. All the Furry types immediately migrated to Islandia,
and played Truth or Dare and had too much TinySex and pretended to be
woodland animals. Go figure. Eventually Islandia sank, oh well. But that's
in the future.
There was also TinyTIM around now, and it's still around. (A story for you:
Once upon a time, TinyTIM never bothered to change 'Wizard's password from
the default 'potrzebie'. An acquaintance of the TinyTIM wizards told this
fact to some awful person at RPI, who logged on and proceeded to @toad
everyone. This was the first recorded Evil Attack On A Helpless, Innocent
MUD).
Islandia was really starting to be a drag, being full of furries and
committees and such boring stuff, and every room in it was Haven'd so that
a decent, God-fearing person couldn't hammer the hell out of greased-up
naked virtual fuzzy animals with a well-placed 'kill Gadget=100'. (A
note: Gadget, to my knowledge, was a TinyVirgin who never greased up or
got naked, in a virtual sense.) So the Hideous Antithesis was created with
the help of such Evil Entities as bob, Molly, Grod, and dirque:
BloodMUD. It was based on Islandia's own base, TinyBASE, and was an affront
to Furriness everywhere. It was also the first MUD to teach the lesson:
Suicide Earns Valuable Cash!
Right about now we're in Spring of '90. alt.mud was still alt.mud, and
some goobs from Penn decided to build the most impressively all-capable
MUD that was ever conceived of by man or woman or whatever: PennMUD.
Unfortunately, they announced their MUD before it was completed, or
even started, and thus invoked the mighty Shub-Internet, who doused them
with flames and they withered and never got laid or anything.
Also in Spring of '90, the first major wave of NEWBIES arrived, driving away
all the Cool Folks from TinyMUD to TinyHELL. Thus, we see the division:
TinyMUD: newbies. they mostly had tinysex with eachother, but didn't pretend
to be animals.
TinyHELL: the beginnings of the 'Random Gang'.
Islandia: Furries. Anyone for Truth or Dare?
TinyTIM: Some really weird people, who were doing their own thing.
BloodMUD: Islandia users who inadvertently saw '#### Please reconnect to
Bloo...@pawl24.pawl.rpi.edu (128.113.10.34) port 6666 ####'
It was at this time that the Fine Art of Newbie-Bashing was introduced to
MUDdom. Nothing like slumming in TinyMUD for newbies to kill-fest. Woo,
what lingo!
Then the narrator went away for the summer to read fucking gas and electric
meters and be attacked by various four-legged hell-beasts.
But he came back, and this is what he saw:
TinyHELL II: it was this place with all the same people as TinyHELL.
except maybe Nightfall had changed his name to Random.
Islandia: bloated and dying.
Classic TinyMUD: actually this happened later. Was it tarrant running it?
hell if I know. TinyMUD went down right before I left
in the spring, and was resurrected as an undead corpse,
and eventually run by Bruce, who ruined it.
TinyTIM: Still there.
BloodMUD: the database was accidentally erased. the new database was
lame in comparison. it was rm'd.
Big News at This Time: more newbies. mostly furries.
Rec.games.mud was created, too. MUDding was legitimitized! Not really.
Rec.games.mud soon became reknowned for having far more scathing flames
than alt.mud ever did.
TinyHELL II died, of course. So then we got Chaos. Which was TinyMUCK. Which
was programmable. Same people, same wizards, new toys. The Pirate Ship,
for one. Bugging incidents. Fun for everyone!
The Crossroads project was started. All the furries talked about it; the
evil bastards wouldn't give me a character.
Islandia sank and died. No tears. All the furries went and had tinysex
somewhere else.
Chaos eventually bit, and Brigadoon took over. The first and only MUD to
host the Random Gang that wasn't actually run by Random. (maybe it was the
other way around, and brigadoon was first. I don't really remember).
Anyways, Kaine was a wizard. Now do you understand how utterly abominable
Brigadoon was? But it had a cool floating island made by hugh, and lots
of people had withered penises, for no good reason.
But brigadoon sank, too, and then came DreamScape, which was a Random'n'
Moira mud, but that sank, too, and then came Asylum, which was an older
MUCK, and that sank, too, and then came Space Madness, and that's sinking
because MUSH is awful and wrong.
In between some of that stuff, we've got:
TwinsPeaksMUSH: the best MUSH I've ever played. it was really cool.
SanctuaryMUSH: a silly mush. nobody played it much.
PernMUSH: I once tried to impress a dragon uninvited. They @toad'd me.
buttholes.
The CrossRoads Incident: a chapter in itself. all lies!
Goldman Diku: a dikumud, which, according to rumor, had its source in an
account which could have .rhosts written to. According to
another story I've heard, mysterious players named 'Abdul'
and 'Wajeem' hacked up the source so that level-gaining
was a cinch if you cast spells in your sleep, and proceeded
to attack other players at random. All rumor and innuendo.
alt.callahans: a bunch of mudders from a random'n'moira mud got bored one
day. 'Tactical Invasive Posting' invented.
All the preceeding hideously out of order, of course.
Anyways, here's some elaboration on CrossRoads:
Allegedly, some naughty wizard on CrossRoads who most certainly wasn't
Tourmaline gave her password to two naughty players who most certainly
weren't Grod or Hurin. The two naughty players proceeded to cautiously
and quietly create several other wizard characters with which to @toad
particularly vile Furry characters with, or so I'm told. Eventually,
all the stolen unauthorized wizard characters were @toad'd.
There's more: the Furries were in an uproar at this blatantly disrespectful
violation of their most sacred inner sanctum. They demanded the heads of
the alleged perpetrators, who maintained their innocence. They wrote
nasty email saying 'an experimental database on our system was corrupted
in an attack by one of your users.' Threats of lawsuits were shouted far
and wide across the net! And absolutely nothing happened to anyone, as
people found other things to occupy their time with.
About this time, the net was blessed with the sacred presence of Joel
Furr. Actually, I have no idea when jfurr showed up. I'm just making this
up.
CrossRoads had other problems, though, as all the wizards were argumentative
and always in an uproar over some furry issue or another; even Chris, who
was supposed to be the level-headed guy. So they all got pissed off and
rm'd the bloated thing.
Then they all went to play FurryMUCK, and were only occasionally harrassed
by Hurin, and harassed a whole lot by Joel Furr, who was often mistaken
for Hurin.
This is about the present, I guess. Go back a few years, and imagine a
young math ph.d. candidate type working on a disk-based mud server. Imagine
in him pink fuzzy slippers, with a propeller-beanie on his head. Imagine
him inventing TeenyMUD and a rather more angstful fellow running a
TeenyMUD and calling it (EVIL!)MUD. Imagine that the initial server was
a little buggy, and typing 'kill bob=100' would corrupt your password so
you could never play the game again. MUD karma.
At some point, DIKU was invented, and people who liked to hack and slash
at pretend monsters but couldn't program for shit played it.
Also at some point, the number of LP people whining about TinyMUD people
not taking them seriously and that TinyMUD people should stop flaming
all their requests for serious discussion about programming grew to such
a level that I got annoyed and newgroup'd alt.mud.lp. So don't say I
never did anything for you, you LP-weenies.
Names to drop:
Tweeni: cute chick!
TERL: handsome stud!
Other things that happened:
BloodMUD II: the coolest LP yet. Erased in a hideous accident. Those of you
who've played it know it was a Righteous in the Filmy Eyes of
Shub-Internet.
BloodMUD III: an UnterMUD, pre-programming-language. Erased in a hideous
accident. Detect a theme?
a secret mud: don't worry about it.
MURPE: i was the first one to use the acronym, yes. had about 2 players.
got tired of hacking on the source and erased it.
EliteMUD: a return to TinyMUD 1.4.something. Then summer came. Short-lived.
a MUCK that was unnamed: Woodlock called it ScudMUCK. It was actually FuckMUCK.
database deleted in a horrible accident.
CI: the source is up for FTP. hopefully not to be deleted in a horrible
accident.
spoofmud: grod's mud. it's fun.
MOO: a sound a cow makes.
CoolMUD: buggy.
ColdMUD: from the guy who made TinyFugue.
TinyWar: the nonexistent alternative to TinyFugue. /* drunk, fix later */
PoohMUD: interesting for a while. but then something happened. i forget what.
rec.games.mud.* subdivision: I was actually a candidate for moderator of
rec.games.mud.announce. Have no idea why.
This is a very Hurin-centric history, of course. Other stuff may have happened;
I either forgot it, or don't think it's important, or didn't know about it.
pat.
Michael M. Huang
Sheesh... guess they do do something other than tinysex.
From the title of the article, you would expect it to be other things than
just tinymuds with a few diku's and a few LP slams thrown in in the middle.
If you want to set out and write "A History of MUDs", at least have the
curtsey of exploring and explaining all fields of muds, instead of just
sticking to the degenerated portion of the MUD world.
-michael
--
Michael M. Huang | Don't believe what your eyes are telling you.
ICEMT, Iowa State Univ. | All they show is limitation. Look with your
mic...@iastate.edu | understanding, find out what you already know,
#include <standard.disclaimer> | and you'll see the way to fly. - J. L. Seagull
Mr E D G Robertson
|> If you want to set out and write "A History of MUDs", at least have the
|> curtsey of exploring and explaining all fields of muds, instead of just
|> sticking to the degenerated portion of the MUD world.
hey, the thing was pretty obviously from that one person's viewpoint, and
I for one found it amusing reading..
Regards,
E.Robertson - `Xolf' - ms...@csv.warwick.ac.uk
Andrew Boardman
>[A series of senseless blabberings of some tinymud realms]
>
>Sheesh... guess they do do something other than tinysex.
>
>From the title of the article, you would expect it to be other things than
>just tinymuds with a few diku's and a few LP slams thrown in in the middle.
>
>If you want to set out and write "A History of MUDs", at least have the
>curtsey of exploring and explaining all fields of muds, instead of just
>sticking to the degenerated portion of the MUD world.
>
*poke inna eye* Shaddup. Go home. Go away.
It was a thoroughly accurate and complete representation of the
entirety of the history of MUDding. If you don't think so, you
have OBVIOUSLY been CONFUSED by the ZIONIST CONSPIRACY, and the
MIND-CONTROL techniques of the CIA and OTHER GOVERNMENT AGENCIES.
DO NOT TAUNT HAPPY FUN HURIN
Followups to alt.fan.robert.mcelwaine.
-- Andrew/Satan
Bryant Durrell
>Sheesh... guess they do do something other than tinysex.
Sure do, kiddo me lad. We issue newgroups for alt.mud, run votes
for rec.games.mud, and moderate rec.games.mud.announce. Be damned
glad social MUDs exist, cause they fostered the environment you
see around you today.
Would it have happened without us? I dunno. But I do know that
tinymudders damned well did it. And hey -- despite the chatter
about how biased our positions are, you still don't see a lot of
Diku or LP people writing FAQs or histories. (A respectful nod
of the hat to Richard Bartle.) *We* ain't stopping you.
--
Bryant Durrell dur...@chop.isca.uiowa.edu
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I feed on the flesh of the living, and I vote.
jim miller
Ol' Bryant Durrell from University of Iowa, Iowa City, IA writes:
>In article <michael....@pv0235.vincent.iastate.edu> mic...@iastate.edu (Michael M. Huang) writes:
>>[A series of senseless blabberings of some tinymud realms]
>
>>Sheesh... guess they do do something other than tinysex.
>
>Sure do, kiddo me lad. We issue newgroups for alt.mud, run votes
>for rec.games.mud, and moderate rec.games.mud.announce. Be damned
>glad social MUDs exist, cause they fostered the environment you
>see around you today.
>
>Would it have happened without us? I dunno. But I do know that
>tinymudders damned well did it. And hey -- despite the chatter
>about how biased our positions are, you still don't see a lot of
>Diku or LP people writing FAQs or histories. (A respectful nod
>of the hat to Richard Bartle.) *We* ain't stopping you.
*big huge yawn* Bryant, *.mud* is and always has been a playground
for the damned tinymudders to carry on a not-so-mature display of
conflicting egos in a public forum. Some of them a lot more so
than others. Some of them who for years have posted articles that
have amounted to nothing more than puerile electronic shoves at
people. Can you find no other position to take here, if you must
take one, than to get your dander up at the anti-tiny remark? Do
you *really* blame people for stigmatizing tinymudders after reading
posts like Wetmore's? No, don't answer that.
I suspect that Diku and LP people are happily doing whatever they do,
without the need for FAQs or votes or ego trips or any of that.
Back to blessed senescence.
Michael M. Huang
[Some text deleted]
>Would it have happened without us? I dunno. But I do know that
>tinymudders damned well did it. And hey -- despite the chatter
>about how biased our positions are, you still don't see a lot of
>Diku or LP people writing FAQs or histories. (A respectful nod
>of the hat to Richard Bartle.) *We* ain't stopping you.
Well, guess Diku and LP mudders simply have more life than trying to
flaunt their virtual powers in their make-believe world.
An' sure. I respect the portion of the history as dictacted by Hurin
(whoever he is). It was actually enlightening to see how useless some
of the people's life can get during the course of their mudding lifes.
But, shouldn't you think that it belongs to whatever the hierarchy of
rec.games.mud.* that tiny goes under (i.e. *shock* rec.games.mud.tiny)?
What's the use of dividing up the newsgroups so that we can crosspost
everything to every possible newsgroup there is. An' not to mention
(again) under such a confusing and misinformed subject heading.
From the article, you would expect that everything arised from tinymuds.
Not that I really give it a damn where it all started or who had tinysex
with whom 3 summers ago during the high tide of the northern shores. But,
since y'all went through all that trouble of setting up a zillion mud
newsgroups, shouldn't you use it like they are set up to?
Please note that I didn't start the who's-mud-is-better flame. The
"History of the MUDs" did, or so implied.
An' one last note. I appreciate the regular FAQ and the previous votes on
divisions of the newsgroups (even though I never used the FAQ or cared about
the divisions in the newsgroups). I appreciate them nevertheless. But, I
give my thanks to the "people" who made them possible, an' not because they're
tinymudders. There's a difference there. If you can't tell the difference,
then you seriously need help.
-michael
Vincent's Hollow
Bryant Durrell
>Please note that I didn't start the who's-mud-is-better flame. The
>"History of the MUDs" did, or so implied.
Bah, humbug. Like various and sundry Tinies didn't get flamed? Like
he didn't mention the LPs he ran?
>An' one last note. I appreciate the regular FAQ and the previous votes on
>divisions of the newsgroups (even though I never used the FAQ or cared about
>the divisions in the newsgroups). I appreciate them nevertheless. But, I
>give my thanks to the "people" who made them possible, an' not because they're
>tinymudders. There's a difference there. If you can't tell the difference,
>then you seriously need help.
Course I can. I've got the ability to distinguish between individual
members of a group and the group as a whole. Look at it this way,
though -- if you aren't going to give tinymudders in general credit
for the FAQs, the newsgroups, and so on, isn't it just a tad
hypocritical to give tinymudders in general the blame for Pat and
whatever other TinyActivity you find distasteful?
Alan Krantz
Who's Hurin ?
atk
Alan Cox
It is of course important that you remember to go back the twenty years of
MU gaming before 1990. Yes _TWENTY_. Even in 1970 people had a small number
of multi user games running. You have to go as far as the mid 70's to find
some early games resembling the MUD world of today, and 1979 will find you
MUD1, which is pretty much grandfather to most of the MUD styles of today.
MUD sort of broke out on the internet about 1988 when a few internet people
got hold of AberMUD3, and then decided to improve it and got Aber4, then
decided the code was horrid and wrote their own (LpMUD, DikuMUD, DickMUD,
and assorted others). In the mean time TinyMUD turned up and for some
reason (I still dont understand!) people liked it too.
Alan
Stephen Schmidt
>Sure do, kiddo me lad. We issue newgroups for alt.mud, run votes
>for rec.games.mud, and moderate rec.games.mud.announce. Be damned
>glad social MUDs exist, cause they fostered the environment you
>see around you today.
>Would it have happened without us? I dunno. But I do know that
>tinymudders damned well did it. And hey -- despite the chatter
>about how biased our positions are, you still don't see a lot of
>Diku or LP people writing FAQs or histories. (A respectful nod
>of the hat to Richard Bartle.) *We* ain't stopping you.
Well, Sulam is now maintaining the LP FAQ. Not to slay your glorious
self-flattery with facts....
BTW, what is this BS doing on 14 different news groups? I'm setting my
followups appropriately and encourage others to do likewise...
ObLPMUD (since I saw this on rgm.lp):
if (sscanf(user,"%s#%d",tmp,tmp2)==1 && tmp=="/std/user" &&
func == "log_file") {
return 1 ;
}
--
Steve Schmidt <>< wh...@leland.stanford.edu
Never insult a Wunderlander's asymmetric beard.
Patrick J. Wetmore
>Sheesh... guess they do do something other than tinysex.
Yeah, we flame on r.g.m. Whee! Wahoo! Fun!
>From the title of the article, you would expect it to be other things than
>just tinymuds with a few diku's and a few LP slams thrown in in the middle.
No, no, no. They were slams at the diku and LP *players*. If you read
carefully, you'd have noticed that I even ran an LP for a bit. I play
LP's and Diku's every now and again, when I feel like beating up on a
virtual monster instead of senselessly flaming and gossiping.
>If you want to set out and write "A History of MUDs", at least have the
>curtsey of exploring and explaining all fields of muds, instead of just
>sticking to the degenerated portion of the MUD world.
Perhaps if LP and Diku had a more interesting history? Face it. Not much
happens of interest with them. There's nowhere near as much social interaction
as on a Tiny. It makes really dull reading.
Now, degeneracy, THERE'S some fun.
>-michael
pat.
Patrick J. Wetmore
>Well, guess Diku and LP mudders simply have more life than trying to
>flaunt their virtual powers in their make-believe world.
No. They're too busy trying to make 20th level on UmpteenthJustTheSameMUD
to have time for flaunting their virtual powers.
>An' sure. I respect the portion of the history as dictacted by Hurin
>(whoever he is). It was actually enlightening to see how useless some
>of the people's life can get during the course of their mudding lifes.
Really? What grand achievements have you accomplished? My god, I've treated
MUD as 'just a game' consistently for the last four years; stigmatize me!
I haven't done anything 'serious' with it!
>But, shouldn't you think that it belongs to whatever the hierarchy of
>rec.games.mud.* that tiny goes under (i.e. *shock* rec.games.mud.tiny)?
>What's the use of dividing up the newsgroups so that we can crosspost
>everything to every possible newsgroup there is. An' not to mention
>(again) under such a confusing and misinformed subject heading.
It was a History of MUDs that involved Diku's and LP's. Not as much as
Tiny's, but it involved them nonetheless.
>From the article, you would expect that everything arised from tinymuds.
TinyMUDs and their derivates had, until recently, been the MUD of choice
for the overwhelming majority of players. Also, this was a history of
things *I* knew about and felt were interesting. If you've got an
alternate, happy just-combat-mud history you want to share, go ahead.
Perhaps 'A Social History of MUDs' would have been more appropriate.
>-michael
pat.
Joel Furr
>Who's Hurin ?
>
>atk
More importantly, does he squeak like a squirrel when he has sex with Tank
Girl?
Ron Archer
>MU gaming before 1990. Yes _TWENTY_. Even in 1970 people had a small number
>of multi user games running. You have to go as far as the mid 70's to find
>some early games resembling the MUD world of today, and 1979 will find you
>MUD1, which is pretty much grandfather to most of the MUD styles of today.
>
Compuserve back around 1987-1988. It was very similar to the
present LPMuds and was called something like English Realms or
English Kingdom or some such. One of the quests, in fact, was
identical. Taking the Good King's head to the Evil King.
Does anyone else remember this Compuserve game and how it
relates to present day Muds?
Cheers,
Ron Archer
VampLestat
>>From the article, you would expect that everything arised from tinymuds.
>TinyMUDs and their derivates had, until recently, been the MUD of choice
>for the overwhelming majority of players.
Yea, but because it may be popular doenst mean its any good. Paula Abdul
may sell tons of records, but I think her music is pure shit.
Stop hacking on diku's and go back to your wanking on tiny's.
--
Ryan L. Watkins : : : : : :: ::: :::: :::::
va...@eskimo.com : : : : : :: ::: :::: :::::
rwat...@cmcvx1.claremont.edu Anyone notice that the level of
vamplestat @ fajita II diku mud stupidity on USENET increases daily?
Felix S. Gallo
Hmm. Garrett, Random, Hurin and Jiro have posted. Guess it's my turn --
mic...@iastate.edu (Michael M. Huang) writes:
>Well, guess Diku and LP mudders simply have more life than trying to
>flaunt their virtual powers in their make-believe world.
Yeah. I'm sure running around pretending to beat on the same creatures
over and over to gain experience points so you can become a "wizard" and
design poorly-written creativity-free "castles" with horribly illiterate
descriptions and lord it over the next generation of twinks while churning
out really *bad* "code" in a grotesque language parodying C is quite
a bit more "lifelike" than talking to other real human beings.
>An' sure. I respect the portion of the history as dictacted by Hurin
>(whoever he is). It was actually enlightening to see how useless some
>of the people's life can get during the course of their mudding lifes.
Hurin is a dino, much like you aren't. He's probably written more
interesting and useful code than anyone you know. I won't even get
into the superiority of his grammatical ability over your pathetic
mewlings.
>But, shouldn't you think that it belongs to whatever the hierarchy of
>rec.games.mud.* that tiny goes under (i.e. *shock* rec.games.mud.tiny)?
>What's the use of dividing up the newsgroups so that we can crosspost
>everything to every possible newsgroup there is. An' not to mention
>(again) under such a confusing and misinformed subject heading.
What sort of incomprehensible pseudo-slang is "An'"? Are you trying
to type only with your left hand, or are you bravely attempting to
simulate drunkenness in a vain attempt to disclaim your stultified,
carelessly moronic post?
>From the article, you would expect that everything arised from tinymuds.
Everything important did "arised" from tinymuds. Believe me, if I had
a penny for every pimply elfin magyk wayk00l LP W1ZURD who thought LPMuds
were the cat's pyjamas and went on to flunk out by writing a stupid
senior thesis on them, I'd be RICHER THAN CROESUS. I'd be SMOKING
MONEY AND CACKLING IN THE GOLD-PLATED SEAT OF MY LEAR JET.
>Not that I really give it a damn where it all started or who had tinysex
>with whom 3 summers ago during the high tide of the northern shores. But,
>since y'all went through all that trouble of setting up a zillion mud
>newsgroups, shouldn't you use it like they are set up to?
You don't understand, clearly. This is a revival of the Great War of MUDs,
a very important biannual affair which concerns all MUDs and all MUDders
everywhere. As such, it's critical that it achieve as wide a distribution
as possible. Hell, I'd tack on news.groups and misc.fitness, if I weren't
too busy typing.
>Please note that I didn't start the who's-mud-is-better flame. The
>"History of the MUDs" did, or so implied.
Damn straight. You're too much of a nobody to initiate the ritual. It
takes someone with cojones -- someone like Hurin.
>An' one last note.
There's that IDIOTIC AGRAMMATIC MORPHEME AGAIN.
> I appreciate the regular FAQ
Why, you're welcome.
>and the previous votes on
>divisions of the newsgroups (even though I never used the FAQ or cared about
>the divisions in the newsgroups). I appreciate them nevertheless. But, I
>give my thanks to the "people" who made them possible, an' not because they're
>tinymudders. There's a difference there. If you can't tell the difference,
>then you seriously need help.
We don't care if you appreciate us because we're tinymudders. All we're
currently interested in pointing out is that there's a super-strong
correlation between Being A Useful And Contributing Member of Society
(BAUACMS for short) and being a TinyMUDder -- and a similar correlation
between being a Tedious Infacile Friendless Dungeons And Dragons Obsessed
Dropout and being a Dikumudder. The sooner you come to accept this,
the sooner we can get on to another topic.
>
>-michael
> Vincent's Hollow
He is? Well FILL HIM UP! AAHHAHA
>
>--
>Michael M. Huang | Don't believe what your eyes are telling you.
>ICEMT, Iowa State Univ. | All they show is limitation. Look with your
>mic...@iastate.edu | understanding, find out what you already know,
>#include <standard.disclaimer> | and you'll see the way to fly. - J. L. Seagull
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Felix Sebastian Gallo rhod...@wixer.cactus.org
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
David Bennett
>to have time for flaunting their virtual powers.
Speak for yourself.
>>An' sure. I respect the portion of the history as dictacted by Hurin
>>(whoever he is). It was actually enlightening to see how useless some
>>of the people's life can get during the course of their mudding lifes.
>Really? What grand achievements have you accomplished? My god, I've treated
>MUD as 'just a game' consistently for the last four years; stigmatize me!
>I haven't done anything 'serious' with it!
What colour do you want?
>>From the article, you would expect that everything arised from tinymuds.
>TinyMUDs and their derivates had, until recently, been the MUD of choice
>for the overwhelming majority of players. Also, this was a history of
>things *I* knew about and felt were interesting. If you've got an
>alternate, happy just-combat-mud history you want to share, go ahead.
>Perhaps 'A Social History of MUDs' would have been more appropriate.
Perhaps. Everything did not originate from tinys though. Lp came from
aber, aber came from mud in england...
Well. Perhaps insipired is a better word.
There are two completely distinct sets of evolution in muds as far as
I was aware.
In case you have not noticed. There have been two completely seperate
faqs for this news group made and posted. One of them (mine) didn't last
long and was discontinued for reasons I would rather not mention.
(The frogs ate it).
We discuss just as many totaly pointless and totaly useless facts in this
news group as you ever will in a tiny group.
David.
[DDT] Pink fish forever.
S. Green
at the University of Wales at Aberystwyth (hence Aber). Wales !=
England. Sorry.
S.
Froud D D M
+ It is of course important that you remember to go back the twenty years of
+ MU gaming before 1990. Yes _TWENTY_. Even in 1970 people had a small number
+ of multi user games running. You have to go as far as the mid 70's to find
+ some early games resembling the MUD world of today, and 1979 will find you
+ MUD1, which is pretty much grandfather to most of the MUD styles of today.
And where is it now? They only decided to throw, sorry give, away the
DEC-10 the summer before I came to Essex Uni, didn't they? Sheesh...
Now that's what I call a MUD. None of this look-alike ___MUD stuff! :(
And if you've got loads of money to spare, then you can pay to play MUD-2.
I wonder if Richard Bartle would like to come and put a copy up on our
solbourne...:)
+ MUD sort of broke out on the internet about 1988 when a few internet people
+ got hold of AberMUD3, and then decided to improve it and got Aber4, then
+ decided the code was horrid and wrote their own (LpMUD, DikuMUD, DickMUD,
+ and assorted others). In the mean time TinyMUD turned up and for some
+ reason (I still dont understand!) people liked it too.
What about UK modem MUDs? That's where you'll find original ideas and
diverse worlds.
+ Alan
Dominic
(not a very high level on MUD2, even worse at MUD1)
--
_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
_/ Dominic Froud _/ Essex University, UK _/ Buy me at... _/
_/ fr...@essex.ac.uk _/ Dept. of Computer Science _/ "Spods 'R' Us" _/
_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
TAN KWANG MENG
[Vamp is parched and drinks a packet of blood.... stuff deleted] 8)
> --
> Ryan L. Watkins : : : : : :: ::: :::: :::::
> va...@eskimo.com : : : : : :: ::: :::: :::::
> rwat...@cmcvx1.claremont.edu Anyone notice that the level of
> vamplestat @ fajita II diku mud stupidity on USENET increases daily?
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Hey Vamp, so when's it happening? The last time I asked, Impy said I
*could* have grandchildren by the time it's born. 8)
Kadaver/Grandluxe/Glyde @ dikumuds. 8)
--
o------------------------o------------------------------------o
| IoI Tan Kwang Meng IoI |"Watching the scenery \|/ |
|------------------------| Instead of the car ahead (0 0) |
|isc2...@nusunix1.nus.sg| Is the way to become V |
| tank...@iscs.nus.sg | Part of both" - R. Renniessen Jr.|
o------------------------o------------------------------------o
Kjetil Torgrim Homme
> at the University of Wales at Aberystwyth (hence Aber). Wales !=
> England. Sorry.
Well, yes, but the original MUD was at the University in Essex. Essex
lies in England does it not?
Incidentally, I remember reading an article in Micro Adventurer (RIP)
about the Bartlett's MUD in oh, 1984. I was drooling all over myself,
of course, and when I read that the University in Oslo was running a
copy of that game, the path was set out for me :-) (of course by the
time I could begin here, the PDP-11 had been discontinued, and an
Abermud had taken its place)
Kjetil T. (a could-have-been)
Keith C. Estanol
>wet...@titan.ucs.umass.edu (Patrick J. Wetmore) writes:
>>>From the article, you would expect that everything arised from tinymuds.
>
>>TinyMUDs and their derivates had, until recently, been the MUD of choice
>>for the overwhelming majority of players.
>
>Yea, but because it may be popular doenst mean its any good. Paula Abdul
>may sell tons of records, but I think her music is pure shit.
I like Paul Abdul.
And her music.
Okay, just her first few albums.
There was something I should say here .. oh yeah!
"Stop presenting opinion as fact"
Keith C. Estanol | st...@ucsd.edu
UCSD, Cognitive Science | st...@ucsd.bitnet
Institute of Geo and Planetary Physics : kest...@bull.ucsd.edu
---------------------------------------------------------------
"We don't want to be victims, on that we all agree.
So we lock up the killer instinct, and throw away the key.."
Patrick J. Wetmore
>>TinyMUDs and their derivates had, until recently, been the MUD of choice
>>for the overwhelming majority of players.
>Yea, but because it may be popular doenst mean its any good. Paula Abdul
>may sell tons of records, but I think her music is pure shit.
>Stop hacking on diku's and go back to your wanking on tiny's.
What thrilling, exciting insight you've given me.
>Ryan L. Watkins : : : : : :: ::: :::: :::::
> va...@eskimo.com : : : : : :: ::: :::: :::::
> rwat...@cmcvx1.claremont.edu Anyone notice that the level of
> vamplestat @ fajita II diku mud stupidity on USENET increases daily?
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Thank you for doing your part to help this great cause.
pat.
Patrick J. Wetmore
>We discuss just as many totaly pointless and totaly useless facts in this
>news group as you ever will in a tiny group.
You obviously don't read Tiny* groups. We have discussed EVERY SINGLE
TOPIC KNOWN TO MAN OR WOMAN, most of them MORE THAN TWICE ALREADY. You see,
relevance has never bothered the Articulate, Intelligent TinyMUDder.
Granted, pretty much anything posted about LP's or Diku's is going to
be pointless and useless; but you don't have the vast breadth of shallowness
that rec.games.mud.tiny has. By limiting your readership to a group of
hack-and-slash virtual orc slayers, you've also pretty much limited your
scope of conversation to topics dealing with virtual orcs.
We on rec.games.mud.tiny have a much wider scope of stupidity; why,
we'll rationally discourse on any given topic. Some interesting things
covered in the past: virtual reality applications of sexual intercourse,
German Fascism during the 1930's and 1940's, tree-bound rodent audio
emissions, relations between limes, sasquatch, and rabbits of extraterrestrial
origin; the list goes on! You'll never, ever be close to our unique
pointlessness.
>David.
>[DDT] Pink fish forever.
pat.
Lars Syrstad
: Incidentally, I remember reading an article in Micro Adventurer (RIP)
: about the Bartlett's MUD in oh, 1984. I was drooling all over myself,
: of course, and when I read that the University in Oslo was running a
: copy of that game, the path was set out for me :-) (of course by the
: time I could begin here, the PDP-11 had been discontinued, and an
: Abermud had taken its place)
Hmm. I remember I read something about a multi-user text adventure
game running somewhere in England around that time. (It probably
appeared in Sinclair User or some other ZX-Spectrum oriented mag.
Whatever the topic was doing in there I don't have the foggiest clue to.)
However, my reaction was something along the lines of 'What a stupid
idea! How could anyone possibly want to play on such a thing???'
Of course, that was before I discovered role-playing, and also before
I got immensely tired of graphical games in general. :-)
Oh well. The autumn of -90 I (re)discovered muds, and was addicted at first
sight. It was a bit painful, though, when a buddy with an all too good
memory reminded me of the article and my reaction to it. (wave soular) :-)
: Kjetil T. (a could-have-been)
Lars Syrstad (an if-Kjetil-T-is-only-a-could-have-been-then-I-really-wonder-
how-little-I-could-ever-amount-to (not much)), aka Drevreck.
--
So in that twilight world that lies 'midst life and death I dream
And writhe in fitful slumber - no one hears my silent screams
Except the horse's head that stares with black and lifeless eyes
Atop its totem glaring - as it mocks my helpless cries
- Sabbat: 'Do Dark Horses Dream Of Nightmares'
Alan Cox
>for rec.games.mud, and moderate rec.games.mud.announce. Be damned
>glad social MUDs exist, cause they fostered the environment you
>see around you today.
>
asking about AberMUD and someone refusing to post it cos its a bit large
(the net has improved since then...)
>Would it have happened without us? I dunno. But I do know that
>tinymudders damned well did it. And hey -- despite the chatter
>about how biased our positions are, you still don't see a lot of
>Diku or LP people writing FAQs or histories. (A respectful nod
>of the hat to Richard Bartle.) *We* ain't stopping you.
We're all too busy having fun or murdering one another to stop and write
a load of waffle about the history of Mudding that is
a) Invariably rubbish
b) Can never spell Aberystwyth
Alan
[Before flaming press the 'reveal-smiley' button on your newsreader]
S. Green
OK then, maybe I misunderstood the original post :).
>Kjetil T. (a could-have-been)
S.
David Bennett
>Alan
>[Before flaming press the 'reveal-smiley' button on your newsreader]
Is this some sort of treasure hunt? What do we win if we find the
invisble smiley hiding in some obscure part of your document?
I found it!
Can I have a car?
David Bennett
>Hmm. Garrett, Random, Hurin and Jiro have posted. Guess it's my turn --
You had a turn? Oh dear. You really shouldnt post articles whilst having
a turn you know.
>mic...@iastate.edu (Michael M. Huang) writes:
>>Well, guess Diku and LP mudders simply have more life than trying to
>>flaunt their virtual powers in their make-believe world.
>Yeah. I'm sure running around pretending to beat on the same creatures
>over and over to gain experience points so you can become a "wizard" and
>design poorly-written creativity-free "castles" with horribly illiterate
>descriptions and lord it over the next generation of twinks while churning
>out really *bad* "code" in a grotesque language parodying C is quite
>a bit more "lifelike" than talking to other real human beings.
Instead I could write strange descriptions in a very obscure strange
scripting thingy language in a tiny*mud. Thanks but no thanks, I think
I will stick to writing strange and interesting descriptions in
language which actually looks like a language. Of course on all
the lpmuds I have been on. I have never once had a conversation with
anything other than a rock. So I suppose you could be right about
the fact we never talk on lpmuds.
>>From the article, you would expect that everything arised from tinymuds.
>Everything important did "arised" from tinymuds. Believe me, if I had
>a penny for every pimply elfin magyk wayk00l LP W1ZURD who thought LPMuds
>were the cat's pyjamas and went on to flunk out by writing a stupid
>senior thesis on them, I'd be RICHER THAN CROESUS. I'd be SMOKING
>MONEY AND CACKLING IN THE GOLD-PLATED SEAT OF MY LEAR JET.
Thats nice. I imagine its a very small match box model lear jet and that
you could only afford to smoke a one dollar note. Everything important
asised from tinymuds. Ok.
The concept of muds. (Big cross)
The concept of talking to people on the net. (Big cross)
A community of some sort. Well, who knows maybe on this one. Did irc
come before or after? However, from the article I read years and years
ago on the MUD1 it seemed to have quite a bit of a community thingy
to. So (little cross).
Actually. I am hard pressed to think of many things at all that have
arised from muds. Maybe I am a cynic.
Of course none of the points I mentioned above came from lps either.
They all sort of pre date both muds rather a bit.
>>Not that I really give it a damn where it all started or who had tinysex
>>with whom 3 summers ago during the high tide of the northern shores. But,
>>since y'all went through all that trouble of setting up a zillion mud
>>newsgroups, shouldn't you use it like they are set up to?
>You don't understand, clearly. This is a revival of the Great War of MUDs,
>a very important biannual affair which concerns all MUDs and all MUDders
>everywhere. As such, it's critical that it achieve as wide a distribution
>as possible. Hell, I'd tack on news.groups and misc.fitness, if I weren't
>too busy typing.
sorry. Its more than biannual. Its at least weekly in various places :)
>>Please note that I didn't start the who's-mud-is-better flame. The
>>"History of the MUDs" did, or so implied.
>Damn straight. You're too much of a nobody to initiate the ritual. It
>takes someone with cojones -- someone like Hurin.
cojones? coperative jones's just so you can keep up with them with
more flair?
>>and the previous votes on
>>divisions of the newsgroups (even though I never used the FAQ or cared about
>>the divisions in the newsgroups). I appreciate them nevertheless. But, I
>>give my thanks to the "people" who made them possible, an' not because they're
>>tinymudders. There's a difference there. If you can't tell the difference,
>>then you seriously need help.
>We don't care if you appreciate us because we're tinymudders. All we're
>currently interested in pointing out is that there's a super-strong
>correlation between Being A Useful And Contributing Member of Society
>(BAUACMS for short) and being a TinyMUDder -- and a similar correlation
>between being a Tedious Infacile Friendless Dungeons And Dragons Obsessed
>Dropout and being a Dikumudder. The sooner you come to accept this,
>the sooner we can get on to another topic.
Good to know what category I fit into. Mind if I just go and shoot myself,
the frog next door, seven little kiddies and their father now? I didn't
think so.
I accept your prosition and raise you a bigger better one with nice shinny
new knobs and a built in radio.
David Bennett
>TOPIC KNOWN TO MAN OR WOMAN, most of them MORE THAN TWICE ALREADY. You see,
>relevance has never bothered the Articulate, Intelligent TinyMUDder.
>Granted, pretty much anything posted about LP's or Diku's is going to
>be pointless and useless; but you don't have the vast breadth of shallowness
>that rec.games.mud.tiny has. By limiting your readership to a group of
>hack-and-slash virtual orc slayers, you've also pretty much limited your
>scope of conversation to topics dealing with virtual orcs.
Relevance is not something of interest. Ignoreing the topic and writing
something completely different is more fun. Like this thread for
instance. When did we last mention a history? Must have been in 1912
when we were just grazzing our sheep.
>We on rec.games.mud.tiny have a much wider scope of stupidity; why,
>we'll rationally discourse on any given topic. Some interesting things
>covered in the past: virtual reality applications of sexual intercourse,
>German Fascism during the 1930's and 1940's, tree-bound rodent audio
>emissions, relations between limes, sasquatch, and rabbits of extraterrestrial
>origin; the list goes on! You'll never, ever be close to our unique
>pointlessness.
Well... We have discussed recipes for frogs, what noise frogs make when
you drop them out of buildings. Who has hidden the point. How totaly
usless tinymudders are. How totaly useless lpmuddersa are. What
consitutes a good breakfast cerial. Need I go on?
>pat.
Bing!
David.
[DDT] Pink fish forever.
Flameing without the use of any extra aids or coffee cups. If you can
find the smiley hidden in this article, I will give you a small rubber
chicken called simon. You will have to pay postage.
Allen Garvin
>for the overwhelming majority of players.
Of course, anything that the masses of the population would willingly
engage their free time in MUST be culturally and intellectually bankrupt!
We sophisticates stick to LPs.
-Earendil
Q: What's green and red and goes round and round and round?
A: A frog in a cuisinart.
(that's not my .sig, it's just I reread the whole amber series over the
weekend and thought it would go over well here :)
Michael M. Huang
>language which actually looks like a language. Of course on all
>the lpmuds I have been on. I have never once had a conversation with
>anything other than a rock. So I suppose you could be right about
>the fact we never talk on lpmuds.
Wait! I talked to you on many occasions. Does this mean I am a rock?
I always thought I was a pebble or something. Or maybe even a frog.
-michael
Michael M. Huang
>Well... We have discussed recipes for frogs, what noise frogs make when
>you drop them out of buildings. Who has hidden the point. How totaly
>usless tinymudders are. How totaly useless lpmuddersa are. What
>consitutes a good breakfast cerial. Need I go on?
Iowan frogs still splat better than Aussies'.
Patrick J. Wetmore
>Relevance is not something of interest. Ignoreing the topic and writing
>something completely different is more fun. Like this thread for
>instance. When did we last mention a history? Must have been in 1912
>when we were just grazzing our sheep.
I don't want to be RUDE or OFFEND your SENSIBILITIES, but WHAT THE HELL
DOES THIS MEAN? Obviously, you have spent far too much time playing LPMud
or DikuMUD or AberMUD; having had no conversation with anyone else but
the game's simple parser for the last few years, you have become incapable
of communicating even the simplest thought effectively.
I've got a few interpretations of your incoherent, and atrociously spelled,
text:
1. rec.games.mud.whichevercombatmudyouplay has even less relevant threads
than rec.games.mud.tiny, which you prove by claiming this thread as an
example; which was, of course, started by someone who primarily plays
TinyMUDs and who isn't even subscribed to rec.games.mud.toomuchD&D.
2. Your piddling little newsgroup has been posting histories of MUDs for
far longer than rec.games.mud.tiny; in fact, since 1912. Well, the
facts say 'no'. I wrote my first history of MUD sometime in early
spring of 1990 (and even then I was ignoring the existence of AberMUD
and MUD2 and MUD1 and the rest of those decrepit hack-n-slash games -
ON PURPOSE. Yes, I'll never mention them EVER. The MUD world started
and ended with TinyMUD, and THAT'S THAT. Pavel Curtis has heroically
taken up this tradition with his articles written on MOO - why
acknowledge that anything but your own chosen server even exists?),
before I newgroup'd alt.mud.lp (your first combat-mud newsgroup),
and well before DikuMUD was even a gleam in some-Dane-with-too-much-
time-on-his-hands' eye.
3. Your history, and presumably the history of LP&DikuWeenies everywhere,
has since 1912 involved 'grazzing' sheep (something sexual, I presume).
>Well... We have discussed recipes for frogs, what noise frogs make when
>you drop them out of buildings.
If you were a TinyMUDder, no discussion would have been needed; you merely
would have performed the experiment.
They go 'splat'.
>Who has hidden the point. How totaly
>usless tinymudders are. How totaly useless lpmuddersa are. What
>consitutes a good breakfast cerial. Need I go on?
No, I rather wish you wouldn't; but I'm sure you'll Follow-up anyways.
>David.
pat.
>Flameing without the use of any extra aids or coffee cups. If you can
>find the smiley hidden in this article, I will give you a small rubber
>chicken called simon. You will have to pay postage.
There are no smilies, hidden or otherwise, in this article.
Michael M. Huang
>There are no smilies, hidden or otherwise, in this article.
Oh no. And the world trembles at his anger.
Darin Johnson
>the fact we never talk on lpmuds.
Untrue. The biggest gripe I have about most of the LPmuds I've
played on is that people keep wanting to talk to me. Sheesh,
if I wanted to talk I'd go see my friends rather than wait for
someone typing a word a minute to finish their thought. Well,
maybe not all the time, but inevitably when I'm not in the mood
for talk and am exploring, etc, I will get hundreds of "Hey, you're
new aren't you" when in fact I'm not, but just don't play 24
hours a day, and then forget to respond to one of them who goes
off and tells everyone what a stick in a mud I am. And in the
middle of a tough quest when I'm thinking long on the problems
some dork will out of the blue start talking to me, inevitably
reaching the point where they say "oh, you're doing quest X,
well that's not a hard one, you just lift the rock here and get
the key and - hey, stop hitting me!"
--
Darin Johnson
djoh...@ucsd.edu
Where am I? In the village... What do you want? Information...
Happiness and Light
>In <1smcsg...@titan.ucs.umass.edu> wet...@titan.ucs.umass.edu (Patrick J. Wetmore) writes:
>>There are no smilies, hidden or otherwise, in this article.
>Oh no. And the world trembles at his anger.
Okay, Mr. Huang, your comment is EXEMPLARY of what pisses me
off about the smiley thing. Carve this into the back of your hand:
IF SOMEONE DOESN'T USE A SMILEY, IT DOESN'T MEAN THEY'RE ANGRY,
IT MEANS THAT THEY AREN'T GRINNING INSANELY AT THE SCREEN,
HIGH-INTENSITY JOY WATTAGE CAUSING RADIATION BURNS ON HAPLESS
PASSERBYS AND LEAKING ON THE FLOOR LIKE SPILLED TABASCO.
Say, that IS sort of long. Write small, ok?
>-michael
-jen kleiman (aka Tourmaline at Space Madness, where we keep statistics
on this sort of thing. I use smileys 0.2159% of the time,
and Hurin uses them 0% of the time. But I have a lower
ellipsis usage percentage.)
Michael M. Huang
>In article <michael....@pv0235.vincent.iastate.edu> mic...@iastate.edu (Michael M. Huang) writes:
>>In <1smcsg...@titan.ucs.umass.edu> wet...@titan.ucs.umass.edu (Patrick J. Wetmore) writes:
>>>There are no smilies, hidden or otherwise, in this article.
>>Oh no. And the world trembles at his anger.
>Okay, Mr. Huang, your comment is EXEMPLARY of what pisses me
Well, when I read any articles in rec.games.mud.*, I attach smiley
faces to everything. So, when this guy says no smiley faces are
attached, then I think he's really serious. An' when you're serious
about this, well, I think you need help.
There's only one true net anyway -- HappyNET.
>off about the smiley thing. Carve this into the back of your hand:
Sorry, I have carved too many things in the back of my hand already.
Gregory D Lewis
>In article <1sj4de$4...@uniwa.uwa.edu.au> d...@gu.uwa.edu.au (David Bennett) writes:
<Quite a well put together flame by Hurin about Tiny vs. Diku and LP deleted>
Being one who knows my limitations I won't attempt to outflame Mr. Wetmore...
(Or to out womble Pinkfish :)
But I just wanted to point out one eensy weensy thing. Didn't you at one time
run an LPMud? I believe called BloodMUD? Of course not that I'm calling you
a hypocrite or anything...
*grin*
- Greg
P.S. Please don't put us LP players with Diku players, its most distressing ;)
.____________________________________________________________________________.
| Greg Lewis - "he's the one they call DrFeelgood" |
| Applied Maths | Email:gle...@spam.maths.adelaide.edu.au |
| Adelaide Uni | gle...@pax.tpa.com.au |
| "I`m the Third World War" -Angus Young |
|____________________________________________________________________________|
==============================================================================
One hour from now,
another species of life form
will disappear off the face of the planet
forever ... and the rate is accelerating - "Countdown to Extinction"
==============================================================================
James Waldrop
>In <1sm0vl$9...@uniwa.uwa.edu.au> d...@gu.uwa.edu.au (David Bennett) writes:
>
>>Well... We have discussed recipes for frogs, what noise frogs make when
>>you drop them out of buildings. Who has hidden the point. How totaly
>>usless tinymudders are. How totaly useless lpmuddersa are. What
>>consitutes a good breakfast cerial. Need I go on?
>
>Iowan frogs still splat better than Aussies'.
Don't forget frog coraking nosies.
Kvaack kvaack.
Btw, there's an LP FAQ. Scratch that one off your list of things LP's
aren't foolish enough to do.
Sulam
Richard Bartle
>+ You have to go as far as the mid 70's to find
>+ some early games resembling the MUD world of today, and 1979 will find you
>+ MUD1, which is pretty much grandfather to most of the MUD styles of today.
>And where is it now?
and run on a regular basis (about 1K hours a week). This is on CompuServe,
where the game endures the name "British Legends". As MUD1 only runs under
TOPS-10, this ought to provide you with some idea of the antiquity of
CompuServe's computer systems...
>I wonder if Richard Bartle would like to come and put a copy up on our
>solbourne...:)
Solbourne? Isn't that some kind of ghastly fizzy mineral water they
sell bottled in independent supermarkets?
>What about UK modem MUDs? That's where you'll find original ideas and
>diverse worlds.
And undernourished programmers, impoverished by British Telecom's
pricing structure.
Richard
--
* Meeeow ! Call Spuddy on (0203) 364436/362560 for FREE mail & Usenet access *
Richard Bartle
>Incidentally, I remember reading an article in Micro Adventurer (RIP)
>about the Bartlett's MUD in oh, 1984.
in not one of them did they add two t's to the end of my name..!
>I was drooling all over myself,
>of course, and when I read that the University in Oslo was running a
>copy of that game, the path was set out for me :-) (of course by the
>time I could begin here, the PDP-11 had been discontinued, and an
>Abermud had taken its place)
MUD1 ran on a PDP-10, an altogether more powerful machine than
PDP-11s, which it used as front-ends.
Peter Churchyard
good a mud is, but the database that someone has built. There are good and
bad examples in each category...
I didn't like the way existing muds were put to gether so I put my own system
together.. It's just a game..
Pete. (Prism 129.31.80.167 4201)
Alan Cox
>lies in England does it not?
>
Trubshaw who started the Essex MUD did it as an original concept (so its
'an original mud'). Different versions of it including games you could build
in and finally the form we all know so well.
Nevertheless there were games well before the Essex MUD.
Alan
Alan Cox
games and their style yes but to generalise is pointless - you can rewrite
the whole tinymud system in LpMUD code (tho why anyone would want to is beyond
me).
As to the use of MUD stuff - several projects are exploring MUD type ideas
and deriving things from the work done on the internet. For example SETI
is using MUD stuff. I don't think in 30 years time you'd recognise a 'MUD'
in the same way. You might log on and chat to people in an electronic
environment but it would probably be 3d view graphics, and you might go off
and play a competetive game down your ISDN phone line. I don't think there
is a single game system fast and well enough written to cope with the kind
of demands people will want, but there will be in time. To start with once
datacomms really takes off (and its still crawling out of the stone age)
there will be so much money in the area.
It won't be like the MUD of today, being able to tell how it was written
will be a problem not a feature...
ALan
Patrick J. Wetmore
>But I just wanted to point out one eensy weensy thing. Didn't you at one time
>run an LPMud? I believe called BloodMUD? Of course not that I'm calling you
>a hypocrite or anything...
Yes. The Mighty BloodMUD, realm of the unholy Toad Lords, was an LP that
Grod and I ran. BloodMUD II, that is.
There is no hypocrisy; BloodMUD II was unlike the current batch of LP
and Diku MUDs, and its players were way-cooler.
>- Greg
pat.
Alan Cox
In article <1smcsg...@titan.ucs.umass.edu> wet...@titan.ucs.umass.edu (Patrick J. Wetmore) writes:
>1. rec.games.mud.whichevercombatmudyouplay has even less relevant threads
> than rec.games.mud.tiny, which you prove by claiming this thread as an
> example; which was, of course, started by someone who primarily plays
> TinyMUDs and who isn't even subscribed to rec.games.mud.toomuchD&D.
BZZT: No its just the non TinyMUD/Brain people have discovered that you
post about other topics in other groups and don't put it all in
rec.games.mud.tiny
>
>2. Your piddling little newsgroup has been posting histories of MUDs for
> far longer than rec.games.mud.tiny; in fact, since 1912. Well, the
> facts say 'no'. I wrote my first history of MUD sometime in early
> spring of 1990 (and even then I was ignoring the existence of AberMUD
> and MUD2 and MUD1 and the rest of those decrepit hack-n-slash games -
> ON PURPOSE. Yes, I'll never mention them EVER. The MUD world started
> and ended with TinyMUD, and THAT'S THAT.
Rumour has it that the Nazi party are looking for people like you who
can't cope with real history and like editing the facts. The history of
social MUD goes back well before that - Essex MUD1 was social and building
based. If you compare these things you miss the point anyway. Some people
like a competetive game instead of vegetating on a glorified extension of
the IRC concept.
> before I newgroup'd alt.mud.lp (your first combat-mud newsgroup),
> and well before DikuMUD was even a gleam in some-Dane-with-too-much-
> time-on-his-hands' eye.
We were discussing AberMUD on comp.sources.games in 1988.
>>Well... We have discussed recipes for frogs, what noise frogs make when
>>you drop them out of buildings.
>
>If you were a TinyMUDder, no discussion would have been needed; you merely
>would have performed the experiment.
>
>They go 'splat'.
>
As someone who has previous run over a frog with a flymo(1) I don't see that
you have to be a tinymud person to do that. In fact MIST (probably one of
the most violent combat oriented games ever) actually has a replica of
said blood covered flymo in it.
Alan
(1) It was an accident.
Lars Syrstad
: Okay, Mr. Huang, your comment is EXEMPLARY of what pisses me
: off about the smiley thing. Carve this into the back of your hand:
: IF SOMEONE DOESN'T USE A SMILEY, IT DOESN'T MEAN THEY'RE ANGRY,
: IT MEANS THAT THEY AREN'T GRINNING INSANELY AT THE SCREEN,
: HIGH-INTENSITY JOY WATTAGE CAUSING RADIATION BURNS ON HAPLESS
: PASSERBYS AND LEAKING ON THE FLOOR LIKE SPILLED TABASCO.
:-)
- Lars Syrstad.
Alan Krantz
>In article <FROUD.93M...@SunLab46.sx.ac.uk> fr...@SunLab46.sx.ac.uk (Froud D D M) writes:
>>+ You have to go as far as the mid 70's to find
>>+ some early games resembling the MUD world of today, and 1979 will find you
>>+ MUD1, which is pretty much grandfather to most of the MUD styles of today.
>>And where is it now?
> Contrary to what the FAQ says, the original MUD1 IS still in existence,
>and run on a regular basis (about 1K hours a week). This is on CompuServe,
>where the game endures the name "British Legends". As MUD1 only runs under
>TOPS-10, this ought to provide you with some idea of the antiquity of
>CompuServe's computer systems...
>
This is actually quite amazing when you consider just what a KL-10 is.
I'm not sure which model compuserve runs and I've forgotten most of what
i used to know about the KL-10 but if memory serves me correctly a
process was limited to a total of 2^18 (256KB) words. A word was 36 bits.
5 ascii characters could be packed into a word (though accessing them
was some what inefficient using a thing called a byte pointer). Though,
the mud is probably written in assembly language - it is probably easier
to read than many of todays muds (MACRO-10 was thing of beauty - quite easy to
read and very easy to program in - I wished microsoft had learned
something about assembly language before writing macro-88 or whatever
it's called). I think there are numerous emulators for macro-10 though
i'm not sure how complete they were/are. Oh - a KL-10 is approx 2 mips
(I think) - i still have a copy of a game called galaxy (not the
spooler) somewhere if someone wants it - though you'll need a bliss-10
compiler for it. Anyways, it would be quite easy to port - er recode
MUD1 in C if someone really wanted to - though i can't imagine the
driver being all that sophisticated.
atk
Patrick J. Wetmore
>>1. rec.games.mud.whichevercombatmudyouplay has even less relevant threads
>> than rec.games.mud.tiny, which you prove by claiming this thread as an
>> example; which was, of course, started by someone who primarily plays
>> TinyMUDs and who isn't even subscribed to rec.games.mud.toomuchD&D.
>
>BZZT: No its just the non TinyMUD/Brain people have discovered that you
>post about other topics in other groups and don't put it all in
>rec.games.mud.tiny
You've failed to understand the implicit sarcasm; predictable, really.
>Rumour has it that the Nazi party are looking for people like you who
>can't cope with real history and like editing the facts. The history of
>social MUD goes back well before that - Essex MUD1 was social and building
>based. If you compare these things you miss the point anyway. Some people
>like a competetive game instead of vegetating on a glorified extension of
>the IRC concept.
Oh, so what you're doing on that 'competitive game' (nothing like competing
with a virtual orc - must be challenging for you) is somehow mind-expanding?
You're right, discussing the latest in current affairs, high technology,
or programming techniques can't even begin to compare with the intellect-
building capabilities of zapping a Wand O' Death at the S00per-Drag0n.
>Alan
pat.
p.s. misc.test? really. how typically juvenile. to be expected, of course.
David Bennett
>In article <1sm0vl$9...@uniwa.uwa.edu.au> d...@gu.uwa.edu.au (David Bennett) writes:
>>Relevance is not something of interest. Ignoreing the topic and writing
>>something completely different is more fun. Like this thread for
>>instance. When did we last mention a history? Must have been in 1912
>>when we were just grazzing our sheep.
>I don't want to be RUDE or OFFEND your SENSIBILITIES, but WHAT THE HELL
>DOES THIS MEAN? Obviously, you have spent far too much time playing LPMud
>or DikuMUD or AberMUD; having had no conversation with anyone else but
>the game's simple parser for the last few years, you have become incapable
>of communicating even the simplest thought effectively.
You don't? You did a good job then. Yes, I spend ages in a bath just
trying to tell my leg to move.
Since you obviously don't understand sarcasm I will stop here.
>No, I rather wish you wouldn't; but I'm sure you'll Follow-up anyways.
Good guess.
Brian Mullaney
>Oh, so what you're doing on that 'competitive game' (nothing like competing
>with a virtual orc - must be challenging for you) is somehow mind-expanding?
>You're right, discussing the latest in current affairs, high technology,
>or programming techniques can't even begin to compare with the intellect-
>building capabilities of zapping a Wand O' Death at the S00per-Drag0n.
if you wanted to talk to people over the net, why don't you use IRC?
ive never seen any real discussion on a MUCK...except maybe from
some furries ('i'm typing with one hand, baby!') now that takes some
real talent to do that
that line about the orc is ironic, coming from you
didn't you say in an earlier post that you play D&D?
what do you do in dnd, anyway
sit around having discussions about current events?
--
Brian Mullaney | NRA N-SSA | Battery B, 1st NJLA
HELP! HELP! I'm being repressed! FidoNet:jamesbond@1:273/239
Internet:bmul...@ultrix.ramapo.edu, @njcc.wisdom.bubble.org
Joel Furr
Furries are the lowest of the low. Furries go nuts if you play on their
MUCK and refuse to act just as "cute" as they do. Furries page the
wizards and demand that you be toaded if you happen to say something like
"you losers need a life."
Hey, Furries! You losers need a life.
Joel Furr
anthropomorphic animals, usually intensely cute and interested in
lots of snuggling 'n' stuff."
seattle smirks.
Randomness nods to elthar.
Tater says "the 'n' stuff usually includes total naked public
humping"
elthar can dig it out, seattle. Just a sec
Devon chuckles Tater-ward.
elthar says "What, naked? They have fur! :)"
Storm Naked Public HUMPING!!!!
Tater says "the quote "I'm typing with ONE HAND, baby" is often
heard on furry muck"
Tourmaline says "personally i don't like Furryism, because it
seems degrading to women, and i dislike some furries, because
they act saccharine-sweetly cute and if you don't act cute TOO
they tend to get very fascist"
Tater nods to Tourmaline. "That bit about fascism is dead on
target."
dirque says "Personally i don't like furry cause the players are
even worse losers than the average mud geek"
Tater says "and they have these page-long descriptions that have
lots of references to "sleek thighs" and "firm, rosy-nippled
breasts" and stuff. hence of course you know that 99% of furries
are guys"
Tourmaline says "well dirque, that's what i really meant but i
was trying to be tactful"
Devon says "I know a couple of Furries... one is pretty cool, the
other is one of the biggest losers I know. Bleh."
Storm is pretty glad he didn't go to ConFurrence.
Finrod says "99 FUCKING percent"
Randomness snickers at Tater. "Yeah, tourmy visited one of the
parties."
Finrod says "furry parties are a truly sad affair"
Tater says "most RL females play MALE furries so as not to get
constantly hit on by RL guys playing VR males and RL guys playing
VR lesbians."
Randomness has nothing against furries, but does mind being
harassed for being insufficiently cute.
dirque says "well the fact remains, I'm embarassed to be seen in
public with furries and not so much with any group of weenies"
Tourmaline says "the furry party i went to was SO PATHETIC, i
mean, it was more pathetic than Pete from windsor, it was more
pathetic than the time my nonexistent license was suspended for a
nonvalid reason, it was TRULY pathetic. 100 FUCKING percent old
guys who drew pictures of lightly fur-covered women getting
fucked by machines or such. i mean nearly all the furry art was
pornographic in nature. the smell of sweaty frustrated testorone
filled the air like cheap cigar smoke"
Randomness grins. 'filled the air like cheap cigar smoke'.
Tourmaline says "some people have the bad luck to be involved
with furrymuck, but can be rescued and untaught their furry
ways."
Andrew C. Crowell
Joel, have you considered Valium? Or perhaps some similar tranquilizing agent?
I'm sure that if you were to get yourself into a good therapy program to
deal with your paranoia and delusions about these "furries", you'd be able
to get a prescription for those. It _is_ pretty obsessive to be continuing
to rant and screech about such a trivial topic for all this time, wasting
bandwidth, and annoying those of us who are trying to get some _actual_
information out of this newsgroup.
Oh, and by the way, Joel, I succeeded in getting what looks to be a $36K+
per year position as a sound programmer...via Furrymuck connections. I think
you've been pissing in the wrong flowerpatch, child. (poster laughs long
and loud and heartily at the weenie on the other end.)
D.A.C. Crowell
Ivo_A@Furrymuck, etc.
Computer Music Project/School of Music
University of Illinois at Urbana/Champaign
(da...@cmp-rt.music.uiuc.edu)
Patrick J. Wetmore
>I doubt it. I dfind the likelyhood that this obscure mud was the best LP
>ever to exist lesser than the likelihood of me decaying into a burst of
>photons in the next 10 minutes. Given your arrogance, I doubt it would
>rank in the top 100.
Obscure to you, I suppose. It's really irrelevant; I sincerely doubt you
would've enjoyed the MUD at all, since weenies were not well-treated.
> -Descartes
pat.
Patrick J. Wetmore
>I have been rather quiet on this subject until today,
You should have stayed that away; but the lure of the spotlight was
irresistable.
>because I have been
>rather uncertain as to exactly what it is you think is so damn
>superior about TinyMuds. This post has borne out that you are in fact
>quite ignorant. Combat is a possible feature of LPMuds, not a necessary
>sould of an LPMud.
I have no idea what 'sould' means; some peculiar nerd jargon, I suspect.
If you meant that LP doesn't have to be about combat, I was well aware of
that; LP-C is, after all, Turing equivalent.
>I can get on any silly interactive situation, including
>my talk daemon and discuss current affairs, high technology, or programming
>techniques. But on LPMud's I can do more (if the LPMud is done right,
>there are some lousy LPMud's out there).
Are you trying to get me to believe that you discuss anything of importance
while gathering your net-friends to 'go adventuring'?
>The goal of an LPMud should
>be to create a social atmosphere that forms the background of an
>adventuring community (it is a game, not a mindless bulletin board).
>The social aspect should be really important to the game.
I don't really care what you think the "goal" of an LP "should" be. I am
aware of what the "goal" of LP's currently IS: to beat up the most
monsters in the least amount of time.
>If it is
>all about beating orcs all by yourself, then the LPMud in question
>sux. But that is not what it is to be an LPMud. And I know many
>LPMud's out there that are quite good and creating a social
>environment for adventuring.
Oh, I see. Your definition of "social" is beating up monsters in a GROUP.
Many nerds conquer where one fails.
I suppose this is the same strategy you guys are adopting in this flame
war; well, it isn't working out too well for you.
>But LPmudder != D&D player. I hope you can understand that concept.
Oh, I understand; in D&D, at least, the NPC's are run by a person. Plus,
you can't play D&D with macros.
> -Descartes
pat.
Lars Syrstad
are dumb morons whose only good trait is that they use the comp
all day and thus don't show their silly faces on the streets or
in pubs. (For a more complete characteristic, ask Mr Pat Wetmore).
We also have a bunch of Furries, who are more worthless still.
Furthermore, certain comments from Mr Wetmore imply that there is
in fact also a good number of generally worthless (i.e. flame-deserving)
individuals on Tinies - even on such Tinies that Mr Wetmore deigns
to visit frequently.
Actually, I think this can be generalised quite a bit. I think Mr Wetmore
will agree with me if I say that most people in the world at large are
totally clueless idiots. I look outside my relatively small
circle of associates, and see a seemingly infinite ocean of dumb,
virtually brainless individuals. Of course, there is a very minor
number of intelligent and respectable persons out there as well, but
until these are clearly identified and tagged as such, one may
disregard their presence. No need to mess up a perfectly working
world-view with such details.
Now, the major difference between Mr Wetmore and me (and also,
I suspect, most other persons - morons or otherwise) is that
Mr Wetmore delights in telling these sorry individuals exactly
what he thinks of them.
I suspect that Mr Wetmore must be a very happy man these days.
- Lars Syrstad (another moron, and LP-weenie at that)
--
From early youth I saw the world through tunnel-vision eyes
My cloistered mind philosophized and phossilized
- Sabbat: 'The Clerical Conspiracy'.
jsc...@ux4.cso.uiuc.edu
>drev...@colargol.edb.tih.no (Lars Syrstad)
>
>writes
>
>>Actually, I think this can be generalised quite a bit. I think Mr Wetmore
>>will agree with me if I say that most people in the world at large are
>>totally clueless idiots. I look outside my relatively small
>>circle of associates, and see a seemingly infinite ocean of dumb,
>>virtually brainless individuals.
>
>
>What i dont like is ---> THEY LET THEM VOTE !!
>one reason for the crap state of the world today :)
>
>
>
>-Jonathan Rees
>
>P.S. still smiling :)
>
The general population of the world are not 'clueless idiots' - only ingorant
peasants. When people like you say such things as you say, and start to
convince others of it, you have the beginnings of facism. The public
should not be 'ignored' or 'lead hand and foot'. They have the same rights
as you self-proclaimed geniuses, and deserve to be treated as such. And,
who are you to say that intelligence = worth!! There have been many
not-so-brights that I have met in my life whom I would place amung the
nicest and kindest people I know. That is the way I judge people, not
by weither they can understand unified field theory or write there own
operating systems in assembly language or wrote a thesis on the relitive
compexity of various socio-ecomic theories. I judge them by the content
of their character, not thier IQ. And, in my experience, the content
of character and IQ tend to be inversly related.
Jeff
ps. This probably doesn't belong in alt.mud, but I couldn't let this go.
pss. All you city-slickers better get of you high horse. It makes you look like complete fools.
Patrick J. Wetmore
>if you wanted to talk to people over the net, why don't you use IRC?
>ive never seen any real discussion on a MUCK...except maybe from
>some furries ('i'm typing with one hand, baby!') now that takes some
>real talent to do that
So don't play FurryMUCK. Play something else. Am I supposed to care what you,
in your obviously limited experience, have seen? If you become confused at this
point, the answer is "no."
>that line about the orc is ironic, coming from you
>didn't you say in an earlier post that you play D&D?
>what do you do in dnd, anyway
>sit around having discussions about current events?
Oh, yeah, I play about once a year; mostly I drink beer and chuck dice at
people.
> Brian Mullaney | NRA N-SSA | Battery B, 1st NJLA
pat.
Patrick J. Wetmore
>The general population of the world are not 'clueless idiots' - only ingorant
>peasants. When people like you say such things as you say, and start to
>convince others of it, you have the beginnings of facism. The public
>should not be 'ignored' or 'lead hand and foot'. They have the same rights
>as you self-proclaimed geniuses, and deserve to be treated as such.
No. They are a servant class, born to be ruled.
>And,
>who are you to say that intelligence = worth!! There have been many
>not-so-brights that I have met in my life whom I would place amung the
>nicest and kindest people I know.
Thrilling. I'll squash them like bugs.
>That is the way I judge people, not
>by weither they can understand unified field theory or write there own
>operating systems in assembly language or wrote a thesis on the relitive
>compexity of various socio-ecomic theories. I judge them by the content
>of their character, not thier IQ. And, in my experience, the content
>of character and IQ tend to be inversly related.
Oh. You like stupid people, then.
>pss. All you city-slickers better get of you high horse. It makes you look like complete fools.
There's nothing worse than looking like a fool in the eyes of a country
bumpkin.
pat.
Patrick J. Wetmore
>Oh, and by the way, Joel, I succeeded in getting what looks to be a $36K+
>per year position as a sound programmer...via Furrymuck connections.
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA... Why, I'm laughing AT you, not WITH
you, in case you were wondering.
Some of us rely on the "real" old-boy network.
The absurdity of "furry" connections being worth anything, other than a cheap
replacement for ipecac syrup, strikes me as immensely funny.
>D.A.C. Crowell
>Ivo_A@Furrymuck, etc.
pat.
George Reese
Please plug yourself back up so I can escape this river of crap.
George Reese
bo...@hebron.connected.com
"Milk me sugar."- Ludwig Wittgenstein
"Attributions of intentions and beliefs to dogs smack of anthropomorphism."
-Donald Davidson
George Reese
>
>There is no hypocrisy; BloodMUD II was unlike the current batch of LP
>and Diku MUDs, and its players were way-cooler.
>
ever to exist lesser than the likelihood of me decaying into a burst of
photons in the next 10 minutes. Given your arrogance, I doubt it would
rank in the top 100.
George Reese
>
>Oh, so what you're doing on that 'competitive game' (nothing like competing
>with a virtual orc - must be challenging for you) is somehow mind-expanding?
>You're right, discussing the latest in current affairs, high technology,
>or programming techniques can't even begin to compare with the intellect-
>building capabilities of zapping a Wand O' Death at the S00per-Drag0n.
>
rather uncertain as to exactly what it is you think is so damn
superior about TinyMuds. This post has borne out that you are in fact
quite ignorant. Combat is a possible feature of LPMuds, not a necessary
my talk daemon and discuss current affairs, high technology, or programming
techniques. But on LPMud's I can do more (if the LPMud is done right,
be to create a social atmosphere that forms the background of an
adventuring community (it is a game, not a mindless bulletin board).
all about beating orcs all by yourself, then the LPMud in question
sux. But that is not what it is to be an LPMud. And I know many
LPMud's out there that are quite good and creating a social
environment for adventuring.
I personally find that to be a dull and dreary game that I have not
played at all since I was 10. Some other like it, and that is fine.
But LPmudder != D&D player. I hope you can understand that concept.
Ron Archer
>and run on a regular basis (about 1K hours a week). This is on CompuServe,
>where the game endures the name "British Legends". As MUD1 only runs under
>TOPS-10, this ought to provide you with some idea of the antiquity of
>CompuServe's computer systems...
>
friggin expensive. grin.
JH REES,,,,
writes
>Actually, I think this can be generalised quite a bit. I think Mr Wetmore
>will agree with me if I say that most people in the world at large are
>totally clueless idiots. I look outside my relatively small
>circle of associates, and see a seemingly infinite ocean of dumb,
>virtually brainless individuals.
I agree with this....
Roy W Schletzbaum
>In article <1spgb5$5...@hebron.connected.com> bo...@hebron.connected.com (George Reese) writes:
>>I doubt it. I dfind the likelyhood that this obscure mud was the best LP
>>ever to exist lesser than the likelihood of me decaying into a burst of
>>photons in the next 10 minutes. Given your arrogance, I doubt it would
>>rank in the top 100.
a lot more often nowadays...
>
>Obscure to you, I suppose. It's really irrelevant; I sincerely doubt you
>would've enjoyed the MUD at all, since weenies were not well-treated.
>
See, weenies are still not well treated on LPMuds, which is the reason you
should stick to TinyMUDs and rec.games.mud.tiny. Get lost.
>> -Descartes
>
>pat.
Daroki @ Genocide and Nightmare
Alan Cox
>>
>>BZZT: No its just the non TinyMUD/Brain people have discovered that you
>>post about other topics in other groups and don't put it all in
>>rec.games.mud.tiny
>
>You've failed to understand the implicit sarcasm; predictable, really.
>
you.
>Oh, so what you're doing on that 'competitive game' (nothing like competing
>with a virtual orc - must be challenging for you) is somehow mind-expanding?
>You're right, discussing the latest in current affairs, high technology,
>or programming techniques can't even begin to compare with the intellect-
>building capabilities of zapping a Wand O' Death at the S00per-Drag0n.
>
Many things are not exactly mind expanding, millions of americans watch this
bizarre sport where large thugs run at each other while someone throws a
ball around. Its not mind expanding - ITS FUN. Anyway I don't care for virtual
orcs. Im into competition with other players. I had enough of mud programming
techniques when I wrote AberMUD.
This is silly a serious reply to a flamefest. I thought everyone knew that
when someone is compared to the Nazi's on Usenet it means the flamewar is
over. Obviously not.
misc.test : Oh yes I forgot that FWB (Flamers work bench) - its a set of
scripts and stuff that let you dig bible quotes, peoples quotes and
obscure things someone said six months ago out of news archives - automatically
uses misc.test. (It also refuses to post an article without the word Nazi in
it...).
Alan
George Reese
>
>Are you trying to get me to believe that you discuss anything of importance
>while gathering your net-friends to 'go adventuring'?
>
nonsense out of your ass instead of discussing a subject you know anything
about.
>
>I don't really care what you think the "goal" of an LP "should" be. I am
>aware of what the "goal" of LP's currently IS: to beat up the most
>monsters in the least amount of time.
>
it. So we have yet another instance of you talking about what you do
not know.
>
>Oh, I see. Your definition of "social" is beating up monsters in a GROUP.
>
Just because ONE thing people do on a good LP is beat up monsters
does not mean that is the ONLY thing they do. Bad logic there Pat.
-Descartes
Richard Bartle
>Trubshaw who started the Essex MUD did it as an original concept (so its
>'an original mud').
That depends where you put the emphasis: Essex MUD was the original
MUD in the sense that there was nothing called MUD before it. Programs which
might now be considered as MUDs but which pre-dated Essex MUD were not
known as MUDs at the time. I agree that referring to Essex MUD as "the original
MUD" might give rise to confusion in people who were unaware of parallel
developments elsewhere, in the same way that calling the Wright brothers'
flying machine "the original fixed-wing aircraft" is technically incorrect.
However, I still have no qualms about referring to Essex MUD as the "original
MUD", simply because it WAS the original MUD. It might not have been the first
multi-user adventure game written, but it was the first MUD.
>Nevertheless there were games well before the Essex MUD.
I agree that there were games around that would pass muster nowadays
as being MUDs, but "well before" Essex's MUD? Crowther & Woods' "adventure"
was written only a few years before Essex's MUD, yet is generally regarded
as the archetype for SUDs. Were there MUDs before SUDs? (I'm not saying there
weren't - I'm just asking!).
All this "mine was first" nonsense that gets spouted from time to
time is really quite irrelevant. The ancient Egyptians and Babylonians used
to vie with one another to "prove" that their civilisations were the elder
of the two, but age doesn't necessarily confer seniority. What matters is the
developmental heritage, and the fact of the matter is that if you pick
virtually any game on the MUDlist and follow back its family tree, the
furthest you get while still able to refer to the ancestor as a MUD is
Essex's MUD. As you rightly point out, other games preceded it, but Essex
MUD was the one that is "the original" for the MUDs of today.
Richard
--
* Meeeow ! Call Spuddy on (0203) 364436/362560 for FREE mail & Usenet access *
Richard Bartle
>> Contrary to what the FAQ says, the original MUD1 IS still in existence,
>>and run on a regular basis (about 1K hours a week). This is on CompuServe,
>>where the game endures the name "British Legends". As MUD1 only runs under
>>TOPS-10, this ought to provide you with some idea of the antiquity of
>>CompuServe's computer systems...
>This is actually quite amazing when you consider just what a KL-10 is.
>I'm not sure which model compuserve runs
had around 60, but they may have got rid of some by now).
>if memory serves me correctly a
>process was limited to a total of 2^18 (256KB) words. A word was 36 bits.
>5 ascii characters could be packed into a word (though accessing them
>was some what inefficient using a thing called a byte pointer).
That's correct, although naturally USERS couldn't get at all 256K
adressable memory. MUD1 was written to a limit of 120P, ie. 60K 36-bit
words.
>Though, the mud is probably written in assembly language
It was written in MACRO-10 originally, and in the first rewrite, but
the version which really made it (and which still lives on CompuServe) was
in BCPL.
>Anyways, it would be quite easy to port - er recode
>MUD1 in C if someone really wanted to
In order to pack a game like MUD1 into 60K, you need to take every
advantage possible of the machine architecture. MUD1 therefore assumes it is
going to run on a 36-bit machine, and all its data structures are predicated
on that fact. Bleah!
>i can't imagine the driver being all that sophisticated.
It was quite sophisticated, but still did a lot of the work itself
rather than having code in the definition language handle it. This is probably
the worst of both worlds insofar as porting it is concerned: the driver is
large & messy (because it implements the functions required by the definition
language, and there are a lot of them because the granularity is all wrong);
the definition language is not as complete as it ought to be, so merely
writing an interpreter for it from scratch means constant referall to the
BCPL code to find out what idiosyncratic meaning each function has.
That said, I know people HAVE written interpreters for MUD1's
definition language ("MUDDL"). Making them available publicly, though, is
likely to bring the wrath of CompuServe (not to mention their lawyers) down
you the prepetrator's head.
Andrew C. Crowell
Laugh away, oh ye snotty one...I'm still going to be making all that money.
It's a real uneasy feeling when you're wrong about something, ain't it, Pat?
DACC.
Patrick J. Wetmore
>See, weenies are still not well treated on LPMuds,
Not well treated, really? Then how come LP's BREED them like the MAGGOTS
crawling around on your DISEASED MEMBER? HMMMM? LP's are a WEENIE HEAVEN.
A PARADISE for the LIFELESS REFUSE of COLLEGE-AGE HUMANITY.
>which is the reason you
>should stick to TinyMUDs and rec.games.mud.tiny. Get lost.
I have no desire to join you and the other lost weenie-souls in your den of
shame; worry not.
As for USENET, well; it must be horribly frustrating for you to have to deal
with someone VERBALLY, rather than being able to "attack pat". If only you had
more USENET "experience points," ey?
>Daroki @ Genocide and Nightmare
pat.
Patrick J. Wetmore
>>You've failed to understand the implicit sarcasm; predictable, really.
>As I think have you. Shall I paint a 6 foot high smiley on the next one for
>you.
No, you haven't been thinking at all. You're a babbling idiot. Reading
comprehension is not your forte'.
>Many things are not exactly mind expanding, millions of americans watch this
>bizarre sport where large thugs run at each other while someone throws a
>ball around. Its not mind expanding - ITS FUN.
SORT OF IRRELEVANT, THOUGH, ISN'T IT? Hey, the original poster only said
that LP's and Diku's were MIND-EXPANDING; never even mentioned the word
FUN.
The current crop of LP's and Diku's is, by the way, about as much fun as
self-trepanation.
>Anyway I don't care for virtual
>orcs. Im into competition with other players. I had enough of mud programming
>techniques when I wrote AberMUD.
Stick to programming; your communications skills are lacking.
>Alan
Oh, wow, you didn't even set the Followup-To: to "misc.test" this time.
Impressive.
pat.
David Bennett
>>If it is
>>all about beating orcs all by yourself, then the LPMud in question
>>sux. But that is not what it is to be an LPMud. And I know many
>>LPMud's out there that are quite good and creating a social
>>environment for adventuring.
>Oh, I see. Your definition of "social" is beating up monsters in a GROUP.
>Many nerds conquer where one fails.
>I suppose this is the same strategy you guys are adopting in this flame
>war; well, it isn't working out too well for you.
Ahh. So there is only one person posting with your line then? I had
better go and delete everyone elses articles.
David Bennett
>drev...@colargol.edb.tih.no (Lars Syrstad)
>writes
>I agree with this....
>-Jonathan Rees
>P.S. still smiling
Smiley deletion program underway.
Jackie F. Russell
Do any of the other DikuMUDder's wish these idiots would stay in their
own newsgroups and quit crossposting to our group.
Why dont you fucking idiots with no life(tinyMUDDERS) go sit on the mush
and jack off or whatever you do on those things, and leave us real mudder
alone once and for all.
Russ
Patrick J. Wetmore
>>Are you trying to get me to believe that you discuss anything of importance
>>while gathering your net-friends to 'go adventuring'?
>Actually yes, thus proving my point that you are just spouting
>nonsense out of your ass instead of discussing a subject you know anything
>about.
Have some commas: ,,,,,,,,,,,,
>>I don't really care what you think the "goal" of an LP "should" be. I am
>>aware of what the "goal" of LP's currently IS: to beat up the most
>>monsters in the least amount of time.
>I said that is the goal of any decent LP, and there are many that achieve
>it. So we have yet another instance of you talking about what you do
>not know.
Here's some more commas: ,,,,,,
A few semicolons, too: ;;;;;;;;;
>>Oh, I see. Your definition of "social" is beating up monsters in a GROUP.
>Just because ONE thing people do on a good LP is beat up monsters
>does not mean that is the ONLY thing they do. Bad logic there Pat.
You're probably going to need these in later posts: ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
>-Descartes
At least you had plenty of >'s.
Awwww, heck, I'll bite: what DO you do besides beat up monsters on LP's?
You really should have shared this tidbit in the first place. It's
called "bad style," Descartes.
pat.
p.s. You'd think such a famous logician and philosopher would argue better
than this.
Patrick J. Wetmore
>Laugh away, oh ye snotty one...I'm still going to be making all that money.
Oh, I'm laughing, all right. Even with $35,000 a year, you're still who
you are. You can't buy clues.
>It's a real uneasy feeling when you're wrong about something, ain't it, Pat?
I wouldn't know; I've never been wrong about anything.
>DACC.
pat.
Ammo Goettsch
have formally ended this flame war. Therefore, if you people continue it, you
will only make yourselves look like NetNewbies. Since most of your ego manaical
flight of fantasy seems to revolve around you being the TRUE mudders and
everybody else being newbies, losers, net-illiterates and furries (just
a joke for those of you who read the other one of Pat's threads :) ), you
are defeating yourself.
Sincerely,
Ammo Goettsch
A Computer Professional, Computer Science Researcher and PK MUD player/wiz.
Gnort, God of Chaos
>>What i dont like is ---> THEY LET THEM VOTE !!
>>one reason for the crap state of the world today :)
>>
>>-Jonathan Rees
>>
>>P.S. still smiling :)
>>
[sour stomach-acid fumes deleted]
> Jeff
>ps. This probably doesn't belong in alt.mud, but I couldn't let this go.
Jeez, Jeff!
You're right. It doesn't belong in alt.mud. Or any other newsgroup for that
matter!
It's people like you, totally devoid of a sense of humour, who've
degenerated the world into what it is today... The guy left _two_ smileys
after his statement, dammit!! Learn some Usenet rules...
>pss. All you city-slickers better get of you high horse. It makes you look like complete fools.
Erm. Bit off topic, aren't we???
--
Gnort @ { DikuII | Unicorn | Discworld } gn...@daimi.aau.dk
Andrew C. Crowell
>In article <C6x9F...@news.cso.uiuc.edu> da...@cmp-rt.music.uiuc.edu (Andrew C. Crowell) writes:
>>Laugh away, oh ye snotty one...I'm still going to be making all that money.
>
>Oh, I'm laughing, all right. Even with $35,000 a year, you're still who
>you are. You can't buy clues.
Maybe...if I needed clues. But I can buy a house, a nice car, lots of very
good equipment, good food, all of those things that make life nice and
enjoyable, rather than make life consist of sitting about on a newsgroup
blowing _my_ reputation all to hell by being a rude little bastard.
Pat, did it ever occur to you that people on Furrymuck (in fact,
a goodly number of people on Furrymuck) work in the computer industry? That
these very people you're _so_ insistant on insulting may well be the people
whose desks your resume may pass over at some point. Given that, how much
more likely do you think it'll be that your resume (as well as several
others) will be the most popular substitute for the daily paper for lining
canary cages? I think it'll be pretty _damn_ likely, myself...
...or do you not pay any attention to how many people read
newsgroups? Seems like you need the clues. Too bad you can't buy them...
>
>>It's a real uneasy feeling when you're wrong about something, ain't it, Pat?
>
>I wouldn't know; I've never been wrong about anything.
Well, here's a start, innit?
DACC.
Stephen Schmidt
>Why dont you fucking idiots with no life(tinyMUDDERS) go sit on the mush
>and jack off or whatever you do on those things, and leave us real mudder
>alone once and for all.
Hey, there's a reason his name is "Wetmore". Unfortunately, "Wetdream"
was already taken, so they had to settle for this.
I'm not sure why they didn't get "Sewermouth" for his first name. I think
Sewermouth J. Wetmore would be an ideal moniker. Probably just an oversight
on his parents' part. Or maybe they didn't fully realize what they were
letting loose on the world at birth.
--
Steve Schmidt <>< wh...@leland.stanford.edu
Never insult a Wunderlander's asymmetric beard.
Jacob Hallen
[ Stuff ignored ]
Can't we all just ignore him, so he goes away?
Jacob Hallen
Roy W Schletzbaum
>In article <1sqdhh$f...@bigboote.WPI.EDU> sp...@wpi.WPI.EDU (Roy W Schletzbaum) writes:
>>See, weenies are still not well treated on LPMuds,
>
>Not well treated, really? Then how come LP's BREED them like the MAGGOTS
>crawling around on your DISEASED MEMBER? HMMMM? LP's are a WEENIE HEAVEN.
>A PARADISE for the LIFELESS REFUSE of COLLEGE-AGE HUMANITY.
>
post. But since I don't visit them, I refuse to judge all TinyMUDDERs by
your posts. Maybe you, Mr. Superior, should learn something from me, the
"WEENIE" with "MAGGOTS crawling around on your [my] DISEASED MEMBER".
>>which is the reason you
>>should stick to TinyMUDs and rec.games.mud.tiny. Get lost.
I said it once, I'll say it again, get lost Pat, you're giving your "superior"
TinyMUDDERs a bad name.
>
>I have no desire to join you and the other lost weenie-souls in your den of
>shame; worry not.
>
*whew* At least there's someplace I'm safe from you, if I wasn't laughing
so much everytime I read one of your notes, I wouldn't pay much attention
to this newsgroup, but you are hilarious. Stupid, foolish, arrogant, and
not very personable, but then again, that's what you're aiming for, isn't
it?
>As for USENET, well; it must be horribly frustrating for you to have to deal
>with someone VERBALLY, rather than being able to "attack pat". If only you had
>more USENET "experience points," ey?
>
Hrmmm, first off, I'd probably do something like this if you were on my LP.
goto hurin
zap hurin
wave hurin
destruct hurin
goto /room/adv_guild
banish hurin
Nahhh, why bother attacking...
>>Daroki @ Genocide and Nightmare
>
>pat.
>
PS. I'm trying to figure out why someone hasn't combatted Pat's claim that
all LPMudders do, is just go around killing virtual orcs with one of three
Muds, Blood Bath (?), Rogue (shrug), or Genocide (cheer Blackthorn).
Virtual orcs? Nahhh... try 40 to 70 people as your opponents, no virtual
orcs there...
Roy W Schletzbaum
>In article <1sr19d$r...@hebron.connected.com> bo...@hebron.connected.com (George Reese) writes:
>>>Are you trying to get me to believe that you discuss anything of importance
>>>while gathering your net-friends to 'go adventuring'?
>>Actually yes, thus proving my point that you are just spouting
>>nonsense out of your ass instead of discussing a subject you know anything
>>about.
>
>Have some commas: ,,,,,,,,,,,,
>
maybe, just maybe, Descartes is right? (In other words, that for the last
week or so, that Pat has just had a REALLY bad bowel movement that just
hasn't stopped? :)
>>>I don't really care what you think the "goal" of an LP "should" be. I am
>>>aware of what the "goal" of LP's currently IS: to beat up the most
>>>monsters in the least amount of time.
Wrong. pip.shsu.edu 2222 and see how many monsters get killed there.
*boggle* (tm, Blackthorn)
>>I said that is the goal of any decent LP, and there are many that achieve
>>it. So we have yet another instance of you talking about what you do
>>not know.
>
>Here's some more commas: ,,,,,,
>A few semicolons, too: ;;;;;;;;;
>
Again, Pat can't think of anything witty to respond with? Methinks his bowel
may be giving out folks. *crosses fingers*
>>>Oh, I see. Your definition of "social" is beating up monsters in a GROUP.
Ooooh, spoken from such experience I'm sure.
And don't even tell me that you've run an LP, I have too, that doesn't really
mean a thing Pat.
>>Just because ONE thing people do on a good LP is beat up monsters
>>does not mean that is the ONLY thing they do. Bad logic there Pat.
>
>You're probably going to need these in later posts: ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
>,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
>,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
>,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
>
Nahhh, have them back Pat, at least I can see an actual thought in
Descartes' post, unlike the useless cries of "LP and DikuMudders are GEEKS,
WEAK, bleh bleh bleh"
>>-Descartes
>
>At least you had plenty of >'s.
>
Yeah, that's what happens when you quote from posts Pat.
>Awwww, heck, I'll bite:
Here, have a dog biscuit instead.
>what DO you do besides beat up monsters on LP's?
>You really should have shared this tidbit in the first place. It's
>called "bad style," Descartes.
But hey, who's noticing with this thread? Hasn't the whole thing been in
bad style?
>pat.
>
>p.s. You'd think such a famous logician and philosopher would argue better
> than this.
He's still ahead of you.
Patrick J. Wetmore
>>Oh, I'm laughing, all right. Even with $35,000 a year, you're still who
>>you are. You can't buy clues.
>Maybe...if I needed clues. But I can buy a house, a nice car, lots of very
>good equipment, good food, all of those things that make life nice and
>enjoyable,
You can then buy yourself some friends and a wife, too.
>rather than make life consist of sitting about on a newsgroup
>blowing _my_ reputation all to hell by being a rude little bastard.
> Pat, did it ever occur to you that people on Furrymuck (in fact,
>a goodly number of people on Furrymuck) work in the computer industry? That
>these very people you're _so_ insistant on insulting may well be the people
>whose desks your resume may pass over at some point.
You assume, of course, that I would want to work for such a person.
Let's visit the Land of Make Believe for a bit:
Pat Wetmore walks into an office to meet his interviewer. He sniffs a little.
"What HORRID B.O.!" he thinks to himself. The walls are decorated with
pornographic art, depecting lesbian panthers being fucked by giant
machines. A gaunt, balding male swivels his desk chair around; he
wears torn jeans and a "Metallica" t-shirt. Pat Wetmore looks vaguely
disgusted, and leaves without a word.
I find it infinitely more likely that such FurryMUCKers resumes will be
passing over MY desk. Aside from an astounding ego, I've got an
astounding degree of ability, especially where my One True Love, money,
is concerned.
Furthermore, I'm hardly restricted to the computer science industry; I
am a *mathematics* major, not a computer science major.
>Given that, how much
>more likely do you think it'll be that your resume (as well as several
>others) will be the most popular substitute for the daily paper for lining
>canary cages? I think it'll be pretty _damn_ likely, myself...
Thank you for your concern; none of the resumes I've sent out so far have
come back stamped, "Sorry, Mr. Wetmore, but your posting habits in
rec.games.mud are too offensive."
It seems it was unwarranted.
> ...or do you not pay any attention to how many people read
>newsgroups? Seems like you need the clues. Too bad you can't buy them...
Well, sport-o, not everyone needs a "FurryMUCK connection" to become
employed. As for the potential employer who reads this newsgroup (if
any such persons exist), well, they are free to do whatever they like,
in the circumstance that my resume ever fall into their hands.
>>I wouldn't know; I've never been wrong about anything.
>Well, here's a start, innit?
No.
>DACC.
pat.
Joel Furr
>In article <1srfce$d...@Tut.MsState.Edu> jf...@Violin.CC.MsState.Edu (Jackie F. Russell) writes:
>>Why dont you fucking idiots with no life(tinyMUDDERS) go sit on the mush
>>and jack off or whatever you do on those things, and leave us real mudder
>>alone once and for all.
>
>Hey, there's a reason his name is "Wetmore". Unfortunately, "Wetdream"
>was already taken, so they had to settle for this.
>I'm not sure why they didn't get "Sewermouth" for his first name. I think
>Sewermouth J. Wetmore would be an ideal moniker.
Nope.
Try "Hurin" on for size. Maybe one day, when you've finally realized that
achieving ONE MORE LEVEL on yet another look-alike lp-mud that's almost,
but not quite, exactly like all the other lp-muds you've played on, you'll
understand the true quintessence that is Hurin.
Darin Johnson
Actually, I tried IRC once, and it took all day to figure out
how (I had waited a month to see if a FAQ would show up in the
irc newsgroup, but none did). I'm not your everyday moron
either, but a better class of moron - I've been a system admin,
wrote a sendmail script, and even been published in rec.humor.funny.
However, it was incredibly difficult to figure out and comprehend
this IRC thingy that was supposedly the latest rage and all these
undergrads figured out (in humanities too). I'm positive there
must be a way to connect without running your own server+client,
but I didn't figure out how. I eventually did get in though, and
it was basically just a distributed chat program; although it was
one BIG system, not a bunch of small muds.
So anyway, I would assume that your typical undergrad would prefer
a simple mud where all you do is type "telnet blah foo" than one
where you need a client (and server?) or convince your sysadmin to
put one somewhere. You read the mud groups, and you get this
"list of muds" pretty regularly, and so to try on out it simple.
--
Another reason though is that muds "trap" people. When you first
discover them, you say "gee, I can build my own stuff here", so
you go off and build an area/house/whatever and be creative. Then
you discover that no one gives a kvaak about you actually building
interesting areas or stuff, they just hang out in the rec room or
pub or whatever talking all day, maybe building some clothing or
camera objects or sofas to prove they haven't forgotten lost their
building skills. But by then, the typical "player" gets drawn into
this style of interacting and is hooked. Heck, even on the role
playing tinies, people spend most of the time sitting around talking
(with someone in character occasionally saying "look at the bread I
baked").
--
Darin Johnson
djoh...@ucsd.edu
"Particle Man, Particle Man, doing the things a particle can"
George Reese
>
>Awwww, heck, I'll bite: what DO you do besides beat up monsters on LP's?
>You really should have shared this tidbit in the first place. It's
>called "bad style," Descartes.
>
figured if you actually came to understand my earlier post, we could then
move on. Kudos to you for having grasped it.
It might be easier to ask what I do not do on LP's. I actually I have
not beat up an orc in over a year, as I do not even play LP's anymore.
I enjoy coding them. But the player's on muds I code for do in
fact bash some orcs. Beyond that, however, they also work together
to solve quests, make money, build homes, get married, get divorced,
have silly mudsex, go fishing. And that is the game part of LP'ing
(note, it is a game). Players and coders also play jokes and discuss
serious issues like the LA Riots, gays in the military, religion, etc.
Keep in mind, however, that this is all for entertainment. If you
or anyone takes it for anything more than that, they need to get help.
So please do not flame Lp's because they do not contribute to world peace
or whatever. None of the MUD stuff is meaningful in the scheme of
things beyond their entertainment value. But as entertainment, LP's
are damn good.
By the way, do not lecture me on logic or philosophy, you would not
be able to stand the pressure.
-Descartes
Patrick J. Wetmore
>>Have some commas: ,,,,,,,,,,,,
>Hrmmm, does this mean that Pat can't think of anything to say? And that
>maybe, just maybe, Descartes is right? (In other words, that for the last
>week or so, that Pat has just had a REALLY bad bowel movement that just
>hasn't stopped? :)
No; it means I've refuted and flamed the same stupid arguments you've used
again and again until the mere predictability of your posts has begun to
numb me to any sensation whatsoever. Your enthusiastic repetition of
the same excrementally phrased arguments is more than slightly boring.
But that's OK, really; there is enough of a volume of postings, now, that
I can pick and choose which ones to respond to and still make quota.
[the following regarding Descartes' s00per-flamage, D000D!!!!]
>>p.s. You'd think such a famous logician and philosopher would argue better
>> than this.
>He's still ahead of you.
Hush, you're beginning to drool.
>Daroki @ Genocide and Nightmare
pat.
George Reese
>In article <1sqdhh$f...@bigboote.WPI.EDU> sp...@wpi.WPI.EDU (Roy W Schletzbaum) writes:
>>See, weenies are still not well treated on LPMuds,
>
>Not well treated, really? Then how come LP's BREED them like the MAGGOTS
>crawling around on your DISEASED MEMBER? HMMMM? LP's are a WEENIE HEAVEN.
>A PARADISE for the LIFELESS REFUSE of COLLEGE-AGE HUMANITY.
>
You attack me for my use of logic? It seems all you do is stick out your
tongue and call people names. The only proof you have offered for the
thesis that LPMudders are weenies is your holy word. I am sure that is
good enough for you, but for most humans, that is good enough to prove
the opposite. But who accused you of being human?
-Descartes
Patrick J. Wetmore
>It might be easier to ask what I do not do on LP's. I actually I have
>not beat up an orc in over a year, as I do not even play LP's anymore.
>I enjoy coding them. But the player's on muds I code for do in
>fact bash some orcs. Beyond that, however, they also work together
>to solve quests, make money, build homes, get married, get divorced,
>have silly mudsex, go fishing. And that is the game part of LP'ing
>(note, it is a game).
Wow. So LP's have evolved into FurryMUCK, only without all the hair.
> By the way, do not lecture me on logic or philosophy, you would not
>be able to stand the pressure.
Thank you for your concern; I'll have to agree with you on this. The
vacuum of your ignorance would likely tear me apart.
> -Descartes
pat.
Patrick J. Wetmore
>You attack me for my use of logic? It seems all you do is stick out your
>tongue and call people names. The only proof you have offered for the
>thesis that LPMudders are weenies is your holy word. I am sure that is
>good enough for you, but for most humans, that is good enough to prove
>the opposite. But who accused you of being human?
Cool beans! I'm not human - I must be a semi-divine messenger from
GOD HIMSELF, hear to show you all the ONE TRUE WAY TO MUD.
> -Descartes
pat, Angel of the LORD
R. Nomad
> Pat, did it ever occur to you that people on Furrymuck (in fact,
>a goodly number of people on Furrymuck) work in the computer industry? That
>these very people you're _so_ insistant on insulting may well be the people
>whose desks your resume may pass over at some point. Given that, how much
>more likely do you think it'll be that your resume (as well as several
>others) will be the most popular substitute for the daily paper for lining
>canary cages? I think it'll be pretty _damn_ likely, myself...
Remember, kids:
If you can't take the heat, threaten them with your awesome "RL" influence.
While Pat may be a ranting berserker here, as likely to hit friend as foe,
I think a bit of reflection and perspective says that the above paragraph
is a rather silly reaction.
I mean, not once, not ONCE, have I said, "Oh yeah, auzzie, well, huh, you
just see what happens if you wind up at this university!" Mostly because
that would be a serious lack of proportion, not to mention a declaration
of intent to at least mildly abuse a position.
In short, get real.
-Random
or is it get virtual
--
---------------------===Comedy! Sudden, violent comedy!===--------------------
Russ Smith -- ru...@math.okstate.edu | "This is the Nineties, Bubba, and
Don Random of the "Random Gang" | there is no such thing as Paranoia.
What a pinhead! Does he not fear us? | It's all true." -- Hunter S Thompson
James Waldrop
Let's see, the last time I was logged into an LP I was talking about
making a new kind of mud that will be *very* distributed, kinda
like UnterMud. Oh, and I have talked about various other things,
including AI, VR, what's going on with NeXTStep, effective ways
to teach people in online environments, networks, etc...
Ok, so it revolves a lot around computers. I don't usually talk
about the weather online (except when it's particularly spectacular)
or sports (although I did get nice updates on what was going on
at the SuperBowl, despite having no TV and no local radio station
covering it). We did have a long conversation once about the
presidency, but everyone gave it up after a while.
Pat, I really think the main people who are the ones qualified to
say "I don't hack and slash on orcs, my time on LP's is spent
valuably" are all DOING valuable things with their time. In
other words, you're lucky I am compiling something right now,
or you'd not be getting proven wrong...
Then again, I have to wonder how much time you could possibly
be spending doing these things that you are blasting LP's for
not discussing, since you *do* seem to be spending quite a
lot of time responding to and posting mindless drivel with
little logical consistency.
You also continually ignore posts saying things like this one has.
Since the only point of all this seems to be to raise the noise/signal
ratio in rgm.admin, you're most likely going to ignore this one too,
but the rest of you should get a clue. Unless you *like* the idea of
giving Pat a little thrill every time you respond to him.
Sulam @ Gnosis
jim miller
Our young friend R. Nomad reveals he has a *little* something to crow about
today:
>I mean, not once, not ONCE, have I said, "Oh yeah, auzzie, well, huh, you
>just see what happens if you wind up at this university!" Mostly because
>that would be a serious lack of proportion, not to mention a declaration
>of intent to at least mildly abuse a position.
Russ, at this point it needs to be said: we're all crackling *proud* of
you, and the uncharacteristic amount of restraint and good sense you're
exhibiting here. It's good to see you glanced through the Handbook
of Administrator Ethics that came with the computers there and drew
a few ideas from it, too. If you flip to the end, there's even a chapter
on non-aggressive communication you might want to take a look at.
-jim
(If he's talking about OK State -- thanks, I'll stick with Ivy Tech.)
Joel Furr
Hurin's a DAMN SIGHT MORE HUMAN THAN YOU, treacle-brain. We check his
papers HOURLY during the spring and fall equinoxes.
Here, let's start a list of why LP's suck:
10) they're identical in all important aspects, lacking even the amusing
fucking vats that pop up here and there on badly constructed Tinys
such as FurryMUCK
9) Played one, played 'em all
8) Never been crashed by auzzie
7) Emphasize violence and greed over meaningful social interaction
I'll let others continue the list to see what they come up with. Storm?