[OT] Firestorm Armada mini-review
Richard Busby
game from Spartan Games. Spartan apparently have a popular fantasy ship
combat game Uncharted Seas or some such and based Firestorm Armada off
this apparently so it will have a big "ships of the line" feel.
Linky: http://www.spartangames.co.uk/firestorm_armada.htm
The minis are really quite nice, with four factions already produced and
at least two more in the works. The ships are mostly resin with the
occasional white metal turret or other detail piece. Bases are 40mm
square with center posts that fit into holes on the bottom of the ships.
Each fleet has ships in the Carrier, Battleship, Cruiser and Frigate
classes as well as fighters and other small boats. The bigger ships have
models where the boats are represented by counters (for now, expect
bases with tiny fighters on them if this thing takes off). The
Battleships are about 6" (17cm for you metric types), Cruisers 3" and
Frigates about 1.5". All are nicely detailed.
http://www.spartangames.co.uk/images/firestorm/wallpaper-firestorm-ship-1280by1024.jpg
Clockwise from upper left: Dindrenzi, Sorylian, Aquan, Terran
We both have three cruisers and four frigates each. I take Dindrenzi and
he takes Aquans. The Dindrenzi have rail guns and do the most damage
firing forward but have weaker side and rear guns. The Aquans have
balanced shooting all the way around.
Each ship has it's own chart showing range bands for each of the
forward, side and rear arcs as well as for mines and torpedoes. Each
weapon system has a number of attack dice (the entire system is D6) and
everything above a 4 is a hit. Sixes score two hits and let you roll
that dice again... you could theoretically roll a number of sixes and a
frigate could take out a battleship in one shot. It would be a long
shot, but it's possible. There's also defensive weapons, point defense
and shields. Point defense works against torpedoes but not energy
weapons, shields work against everything. Each has a rating in dice that
you roll and each successful hit on the defense nullifies one attacking
hit. It's a simple system that is grasped easily.
We played on a 6x4 board with asteroid fields scattered about in two of
the four quarters. Asteroid fields represent a hazard and you must move
at half speed or risk taking damage moving through them. They also
reduce the power of your shooting by half. You can't shoot through more
than 8" of asteroid fields. One maneuvers their ships around by using
the turning template. It's a cutout that has a 45 degree turn in a one
inch arch. I felt the movement was a little fiddly in that you are not
supposed to pivot then move one inch, but rather move 1/2" and then
pivot and then move another half inch. Given that the scales are rather
large (or would that be small?) the ships could likely turn an entire
360 in the space of their bases so I felt this "move-pivot-move" a
little much.
Anyway, we soldier on and eventually end up in a head on confrontation
with me stuffing my rail guns in his face and doing heavy damage. Then
he flies by me and drops his mines... ruh-roh. One of my cruisers is
destroyed outright and the other damaged heavily. I learn my lesson and
remember to keep my distance. His frigates move to flank his cruisers
and my frigates are picking their way through the left hand asteroid
belt to hit his cruisers from the rear. Eventually I manage to kill his
frigates, beat down his cruisers and my one lone remaining frigate limps
home leaving a debris-strewn asteroid belt behind. Total game time @1hour.
My first impression was that the mechanics are very simple, a good thing
in my book. As mentioned the movement was a little quirky but I'll get
used to it. Since all the ships have to abide by the mechanic it's not
unbalancing. The weapons and countermeasures appear to provide a nice
way to distinguish ships in play without filling the rulebook with
exceptions. After playing a game my impression is much improved. It
appears to be simple to play and difficult to master, the mark of great
games. I picked up a Terran ship started box and the rulebook and look
forward to playing more Firestorm Armada!
-Richard
Phil Bowles
wrote:
> So a local at the FLGS brought in Firestorm Armada, a new spaceship mini
> game from Spartan Games. Spartan apparently have a popular fantasy ship
> combat game Uncharted Seas or some such and based Firestorm Armada off
> this apparently so it will have a big "ships of the line" feel.
>
> Linky:http://www.spartangames.co.uk/firestorm_armada.htm
>
> The minis are really quite nice, with four factions already produced and
> at least two more in the works. The ships are mostly resin with the
> occasional white metal turret or other detail piece. Bases are 40mm
> square with center posts that fit into holes on the bottom of the ships.
> Each fleet has ships in the Carrier, Battleship, Cruiser and Frigate
> classes as well as fighters and other small boats. The bigger ships have
> models where the boats are represented by counters (for now, expect
> bases with tiny fighters on them if this thing takes off). The
> Battleships are about 6" (17cm for you metric types), Cruisers 3" and
> Frigates about 1.5". All are nicely detailed.
>
> Clockwise from upper left: Dindrenzi, Sorylian, Aquan, Terran
>
> We both have three cruisers and four frigates each. I take Dindrenzi and
> he takes Aquans. The Dindrenzi have rail guns and do the most damage
> firing forward but have weaker side and rear guns. The Aquans have
> balanced shooting all the way around.
>
> Each ship has it's own chart showing range bands for each of the
> forward, side and rear arcs as well as for mines and torpedoes. Each
> weapon system has a number of attack dice (the entire system is D6) and
> everything above a 4 is a hit. Sixes score two hits and let you roll
> that dice again... you could theoretically roll a number of sixes and a
> frigate could take out a battleship in one shot. It would be a long
> shot, but it's possible. There's also defensive weapons, point defense
> and shields. Point defense works against torpedoes but not energy
> weapons, shields work against everything. Each has a rating in dice that
> you roll and each successful hit on the defense nullifies one attacking
> hit. It's a simple system that is grasped easily.
Those rules seem suspiciously familiar - everything's a pulsar lance
and individual ships have their own range bands, but otherwise it
looks a straight lift from BFG.
Still, BFG was fun - this looks to be too. And undoubtedly cheaper.
Phil
Seamus
news:hgg4dg$tqn$1...@news.eternal-september.org:
> So a local at the FLGS brought in Firestorm Armada, a new spaceship
> mini game from Spartan Games. Spartan apparently have a popular
> fantasy ship combat game Uncharted Seas or some such and based
> Firestorm Armada off this apparently so it will have a big "ships of
> the line" feel.
>
> Linky: http://www.spartangames.co.uk/firestorm_armada.htm
On a related note:
http://www.drunkdwarves.com/?p=172
A comparison between Uncharted Seas and Man O' War, compliments of the
Drunk Dwarves.
--
Steve: Last night I dreamt I was gaming in Hell.
<snipped>
Larry: Then, how do you know it was Hell?
Steve: We were only allowed to play Warhammer and there was a lot of
screaming and suffering.
Larry: Well... It certainly sounds like Hell.
- Larry Leadhead
Phil Bowles
> Richard Busby <richbu...@hatespam.bellsouth.net> wrote innews:hgg4dg$tqn$1...@news.eternal-september.org:
>
> > So a local at the FLGS brought in Firestorm Armada, a new spaceship
> > mini game from Spartan Games. Spartan apparently have a popular
> > fantasy ship combat game Uncharted Seas or some such and based
> > Firestorm Armada off this apparently so it will have a big "ships of
> > the line" feel.
>
> > Linky:http://www.spartangames.co.uk/firestorm_armada.htm
>
> On a related note:
>
> http://www.drunkdwarves.com/?p=172
>
> A comparison between Uncharted Seas and Man O' War, compliments of the
> Drunk Dwarves.
Good review, though not saying anything I wouldn't expect from a
comparison between, say, MoW and BFG, which the latter system seems
largely based on. I too liked the character of MoW (and I too was
turned off by Seas of Blood and the overdone Plague Fleet lists -
surprised he didn't pick on Skaven or Chaos Dwarfs in his examples of
unbalanced fleets). Both games are pretty much products of their time
- Man O'War came from the era of 40k2, Necromunda and Space Marine 2nd
Ed, with their emphasis on detail and narrative-driven skirmish
campaigns, while Uncharted Seas and newer GW systems belong in a
modern gaming environment that wants speed of play and 'clean'
mechanics which makes for games that are technically better but in
some cases less fun (with the caveat that there's probably never been
a game invented that's less fun than 40k2).
Having looked at the models and prices, I'm underwhelmed. Pricing is
comparable with BFG if not higher per model (frigates aside), although
I'd hazard a guess that fleets will generally be smaller. The models
look technically accomplished but stylistically mostly dreadful, and
with each class of ship apparently using the same mould as every
other, just adjusted for size. I like the Aquan style, but the other
three fleets just look to be exactly the same ship design with a
different geometry to the hull - cylindrical, rectangular or wedge-
shaped. By contrast BFG Eldar ships have different styles from one
another, and you can't make an Eldar cruiser from an Imperial one just
by substituting a rectangular hull for a triangular one, or even a
Chaos cruiser by replacing it was a wedge.
Phil
Richard Busby
> Those rules seem suspiciously familiar - everything's a pulsar lance
> and individual ships have their own range bands, but otherwise it
> looks a straight lift from BFG.
It may look the same on paper but plays really quite different. There
are no column shifts, and the torpedoes are handled as direct fire so no
markers to track there. It's elegant and fast to play and little book
keeping is required other than tracking ship damage and the occasional
critical effect.
Ships have two ratings which are that to damage and the critical rating.
If you meet the damage rating but do not meet the critical rating, you
do a hull point of damage. If you exceed the critical rating you do two
points plus roll on the critical table where all the nasty stuff
occurs. For each point of hull damage the ships' weapons are reduced by
one dice so you get a nice debilitating curve as the ships take damage.
You can also "link" ship weapons where members of a squadron contribute
to the "focus" ship, adding 1/2 their attack dice each to the shots. In
this way a swarm of smaller ships can hope to damage a large one and
it's handled in a quick and simple manner. Example: My Frigate gets 4
dice and normally would have little chance of damaging a Battleship with
damage rating 8; but if my four buddies join into the same attack I get
4+2+2+2+2=12 attack dice! Now I have a reasonable chance of doing some
damage.
All in all Firestorm rules feel cleaner and play faster than BFG. This
should only improve with time, IMHO.
> Still, BFG was fun - this looks to be too. And undoubtedly cheaper.
Starter boxes are US $59 each (10 ships: BB, 3xCruisers, 6xFrigates) and
the rulebook was US $25.
smcdaniel1
"Richard Busby" <rich...@hatespam.bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:hgg4dg$tqn$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
> So a local at the FLGS brought in Firestorm Armada, a new spaceship mini
> game from Spartan Games. Spartan apparently have a popular fantasy ship
I know you didn't use any in your game, but how do the rules for carriers
look?
--
Sir Scott " " McDaniel
smcdaniel1
--
Sir Scott " " McDaniel
"Phil Bowles" <pbo...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:b3a72cee-8915-41c3...@n35g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> On 18 Dec, 18:14, Seamus <eatabulletsa...@yourface.net> wrote:
>>
>> On a related note:
>>
>> http://www.drunkdwarves.com/?p=172
>>
>> A comparison between Uncharted Seas and Man O' War, compliments of the
>> Drunk Dwarves.
>
> Good review, though not saying anything I wouldn't expect from a
> comparison between, say, MoW and BFG,
Agreed on both counts though I thought BFG also relied quite a bit on Epic
40K. Probably to save money on the cardstock overstock, and the Dice.
> Both games are pretty much products of their time
> - Man O'War came from the era of 40k2, Necromunda and Space Marine 2nd
> Ed, with their emphasis on detail and narrative-driven skirmish
> campaigns, while Uncharted Seas and newer GW systems belong in a
> modern gaming environment that wants speed of play and 'clean'
> mechanics which makes for games that are technically better but in
> some cases less fu(n)
True in most repects, but some of my favorite games ever were very simple.
Just like me. Does anyone remember Games Design Workshop's game: Asteroid?
Btw, how long until GW sends them a C&D for IP infringement over their name?
> (with the caveat that there's probably never been
> a game invented that's less fun than 40k2).
This would be an outtake, but it is so far out of context it just can't
stand alone...
>
> Having looked at the models and prices, I'm underwhelmed. Pricing is
> comparable with BFG if not higher per model (frigates aside), although
> I'd hazard a guess that fleets will generally be smaller. The models
> look technically accomplished but stylistically mostly dreadful,
Exactly. I could see two of Hwang's fleets, one Terran the other Dindrenzi
being hopelessly confused.
> other, just adjusted for size. I like the Aquan style,
I never was one much for the Mimbari...
> By contrast BFG Eldar ships have different styles from one
> another, and you can't make an Eldar cruiser from an Imperial one just
> by substituting a rectangular hull for a triangular one,
Testify! And if one were to confuse a Tyranid Razorfiend for an Imperial
Lunar one should stick to "Chutes and Ladders".
--
Sir Scott "I still want to try Firestorm Armada though... " McDaniel
Myrmidon
rich...@hatespam.bellsouth.net says...
> So a local at the FLGS brought in Firestorm Armada, a new spaceship mini
> game from Spartan Games. Spartan apparently have a popular fantasy ship
> combat game Uncharted Seas or some such and based Firestorm Armada off
> this apparently so it will have a big "ships of the line" feel.
>
> Linky: http://www.spartangames.co.uk/firestorm_armada.htm
>
> The minis are really quite nice, with four factions already produced and
> at least two more in the works. The ships are mostly resin with the
> occasional white metal turret or other detail piece. Bases are 40mm
> square with center posts that fit into holes on the bottom of the ships.
> Each fleet has ships in the Carrier, Battleship, Cruiser and Frigate
> classes as well as fighters and other small boats. The bigger ships have
> models where the boats are represented by counters (for now, expect
> bases with tiny fighters on them if this thing takes off). The
> Battleships are about 6" (17cm for you metric types), Cruisers 3" and
> Frigates about 1.5". All are nicely detailed.
>
> http://www.spartangames.co.uk/images/firestorm/wallpaper-firestorm-ship-1280by1024.jpg
> Clockwise from upper left: Dindrenzi, Sorylian, Aquan, Terran
Oddly enough, I really like the Terran ships. (I know, I know -
I'm species centric. I'll make a fine Xeno-phobe when the Emperor takes
over...) Bring on the Carriers, and it needs some Destroy class ships
too.
>
> We both have three cruisers and four frigates each. I take Dindrenzi and
> he takes Aquans. The Dindrenzi have rail guns and do the most damage
> firing forward but have weaker side and rear guns. The Aquans have
> balanced shooting all the way around.
What? No battleships for a first game. Why that sounds <gasp!>
'reasonable'. And we can't have reason here on RGMW. Well, not at
least without a very good reason for it. ;)
>
> Each ship has it's own chart showing range bands for each of the
> forward, side and rear arcs as well as for mines and torpedoes. Each
> weapon system has a number of attack dice (the entire system is D6) and
> everything above a 4 is a hit. Sixes score two hits and let you roll
> that dice again... you could theoretically roll a number of sixes and a
> frigate could take out a battleship in one shot. It would be a long
> shot, but it's possible. There's also defensive weapons, point defense
> and shields. Point defense works against torpedoes but not energy
> weapons, shields work against everything. Each has a rating in dice that
> you roll and each successful hit on the defense nullifies one attacking
> hit. It's a simple system that is grasped easily.
>
I like games with straight forward mechanics. I've always liked
the 'Silent Death' mechanic where your weapons 'to hit' rolls also
determine the amount of damage done to the target. Nice concept that
works well in play and saves time wasted on excessive dice rolling.
> We played on a 6x4 board with asteroid fields scattered about in two of
> the four quarters. Asteroid fields represent a hazard and you must move
> at half speed or risk taking damage moving through them.
Ah, the old familiar 'pain in the asteroids'.
> They also
> reduce the power of your shooting by half. You can't shoot through more
> than 8" of asteroid fields. One maneuvers their ships around by using
> the turning template. It's a cutout that has a 45 degree turn in a one
> inch arch. I felt the movement was a little fiddly in that you are not
> supposed to pivot then move one inch, but rather move 1/2" and then
> pivot and then move another half inch. Given that the scales are rather
> large (or would that be small?) the ships could likely turn an entire
> 360 in the space of their bases so I felt this "move-pivot-move" a
> little much.
>
This begs the question, what are typical movement rates and
weapons ranges. With the movement system you describe, I'm going to
make the educated guess that it is NOT designed to be played on a hex
mat but rather free form. How do they handle facing since it sounds
like arcs of fire are very important within the combat mechanics?
> Anyway, we soldier on and eventually end up in a head on confrontation
> with me stuffing my rail guns in his face and doing heavy damage. Then
> he flies by me and drops his mines... ruh-roh. One of my cruisers is
> destroyed outright and the other damaged heavily. I learn my lesson and
> remember to keep my distance. His frigates move to flank his cruisers
> and my frigates are picking their way through the left hand asteroid
> belt to hit his cruisers from the rear. Eventually I manage to kill his
> frigates, beat down his cruisers and my one lone remaining frigate limps
> home leaving a debris-strewn asteroid belt behind. Total game time @1hour.
>
Out of 14 ships one makes it home? Ouch! Sounds crunchy and
explody! Our kind of game. Any really good 'catastrophic failures' or
just the "We put so many holes in your hull you're now a 'culender in
space'." type of thing?
> My first impression was that the mechanics are very simple, a good thing
> in my book. As mentioned the movement was a little quirky but I'll get
> used to it. Since all the ships have to abide by the mechanic it's not
> unbalancing. The weapons and countermeasures appear to provide a nice
> way to distinguish ships in play without filling the rulebook with
> exceptions. After playing a game my impression is much improved. It
> appears to be simple to play and difficult to master, the mark of great
> games. I picked up a Terran ship started box and the rulebook and look
> forward to playing more Firestorm Armada!
Damn you and your nice gaming report! Like I NEED another gaming
system. Mumble mumble mumble... (Hello FLGS I'd like to order...)
Myrmidon :)
--
"I'm already impoverished from buying wargames minis,
and I'm too knackered for riotous living..."
-- Moramarth
RGMW FAQ: http://www.rgmw.org
Richard Busby
> In article<hgg4dg$tqn$1...@news.eternal-september.org>,
> rich...@hatespam.bellsouth.net says...
> Oddly enough, I really like the Terran ships. (I know, I know -
> I'm species centric. I'll make a fine Xeno-phobe when the Emperor takes
> over...) Bring on the Carriers, and it needs some Destroy class ships
> too.
Someone here pointed out they look like Imperial Star Destroyers a
little... that probably helps. I too like the Terrans and have the
starter box sitting on my workbench begging me to finish them.
>> We both have three cruisers and four frigates each. I take Dindrenzi and
>> he takes Aquans. The Dindrenzi have rail guns and do the most damage
>> firing forward but have weaker side and rear guns. The Aquans have
>> balanced shooting all the way around.
>
> What? No battleships for a first game. Why that sounds<gasp!>
> 'reasonable'. And we can't have reason here on RGMW. Well, not at
> least without a very good reason for it. ;)
Beg pardon. My age is showing. :P
> I like games with straight forward mechanics. I've always liked
> the 'Silent Death' mechanic where your weapons 'to hit' rolls also
> determine the amount of damage done to the target. Nice concept that
> works well in play and saves time wasted on excessive dice rolling.
Yep... the same roll to hit tells you damage. The point defense and
shields rolls give the target player a little something to do while
getting shot to pieces and make you feel more involved during play.
> This begs the question, what are typical movement rates and
> weapons ranges. With the movement system you describe, I'm going to
> make the educated guess that it is NOT designed to be played on a hex
> mat but rather free form. How do they handle facing since it sounds
> like arcs of fire are very important within the combat mechanics?
Rates of movement vary per ship class with movement of up to 6" for BB
class, 8" for Cruisers and 11" (odd choice) for Frigates. Ships must
move at least half speed per turn and may only make one 45 degree turn
in a certain distance, 2" for BB, 1" for Cruisers and no min for Frigates.
Weapons are all rated by range bands of 8" each with efficiency
diminishing at extreme ranges, some having no damage potential at the
most extreme range band (24"-32"). The entire system favors range band
two (8"-16") where most weapons are at their most deadly. Torpedoes
mostly keep their same damage potential at any range.
The ship is pointing the way the model is pointed. The square bases make
figuring out arcs easy, just draw a line from the center post to the
four corners of the squares and there's your front, side and rear arcs.
Draw a line from your post to your target center post, observe
quadrant... it's just that easy!
> Out of 14 ships one makes it home? Ouch! Sounds crunchy and
> explody! Our kind of game. Any really good 'catastrophic failures' or
> just the "We put so many holes in your hull you're now a 'culender in
> space'." type of thing?
There is a very nice Critical Hit table that will allow for some pretty
spectacular fireworks that catch nearby ships in their effects. If the
game I played was any indication there is the occasional "onsey-twosey"
infliction of wounds at range while jockeying for the chance to dash
into effective range and then a knife fight with ships dying quickly
once they close. The more Attack Dice you put on a ship, the more the
chance of a Critical Hit and then getting the spectacular ka-booms.
> Damn you and your nice gaming report! Like I NEED another gaming
> system. Mumble mumble mumble... (Hello FLGS I'd like to order...)
It's getting quite the flash start at our FLGS here and I have high hope
for it being viable. The best part about it is the publisher (Spartan
Games) is active on their web forums, quickly publishes errata and FAQ's
and handles customer issues on the forums, by email and phone and by all
accounts does a great job.
Richard Busby
> Rates of movement vary per ship class with movement of up to 6" for BB
> class, 8" for Cruisers and 11" (odd choice) for Frigates. Ships must
> move at least half speed per turn and may only make one 45 degree turn
> in a certain distance, 2" for BB, 1" for Cruisers and no min for Frigates.
And what I forgot to mention here is this is the Terran fleet... other
races have different movement rates for the different classes of ships.
Turning rates are consistent among the races for each class.