Help with Paints
G. Munch
unpainted minis that I had when I was a kid and I have a question about
paints.
I've read in here that many people use the craft store less expensive
acrylics for a lot of their painting. I saw that AC Moore has Americana
acrylics on sale this week for $0.50 a bottle. So, I'm thinking of
stocking up...
My question is: what colors should I look at getting to have a good base?
And what paints do I need to supplement with (if any) from other paint
lines?
Most of my old miniatures are fantasy type themes, but I might decide to
try other types as well. So I'm looking to get a pretty comprehensive set
of paints.
Thanks for any help!
Garon
smithdoerr
"G. Munch" <garon...@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:peTN8.28555$6m5....@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net...
What colors should you get? Well at only $0.50 a bottled I'd get them all
:)
Seriously though it depends on how much you'll want to mix custom colors and
how much you'll want to use "stock colors". For
armies/squads/regiments/warbands of minis I use only stock colors because I
want them to look uniform. For single minis I'll sometimes mix custom
colors but most of the time I'll use stock colors simply because I have
them. At the very least you should get:
Black
White
"Medium" shades of the following:
Grey
Red
Blue
Yellow
Green
Orange
Brown
Flesh
At only $0.50 I'd recommend also getting a lighter and darker shade of the
above including an off-white/ivory color and an olive/cammo green so you'll
have at least three shades of each. Browns and Greens usually get used a
lot since they are often used on bases so you may want to get even more
shades of those. For metallics you'll want at least a medium silver and
gold but most craft paint metallics aren't that good so you may want to buy
just one and test it first.
--
-smithdoerr
RT Maitreya
G. Munch wrote
> acrylics for a lot of their painting. I saw that AC Moore has Americana
> acrylics on sale this week for $0.50 a bottle. So, I'm thinking of
> stocking up...
Do it. Many painters here have a mix of craft and modeling acrylics for
all of their work, myself included. Buy them and use them. . . you will
find some are awesome, and some are not very good, and it depends as
much on the color as it does the manufacturer and line.
> My question is: what colors should I look at getting to have a good base?
> And what paints do I need to supplement with (if any) from other paint
Craft metallics generally suck ass, so you'll probably want some nice
expensive modeling paints for small metal flake size. Go with as many
shades as you can reasonably afford. I'm serious. If you can afford a
ROYGBIV assortment, and one dark and one light of each, then you'll be
glad you did. Add some browns and olive drabs, as well as a set of
black, white, light grey, dark grey, you are going to have a nice set of
paints to work with.
Play with these paints, and you will find out very quickly which
specific colors cover well and that you like to work with. The ones
that do NOT cover well, simply set them aside for terrain use, and
replace the color with an expensive model-paint version.
RTM
Myrmidon
garon...@attbi.com, G. Munch shouted out the following words of wit...
> Hi all - first post to this group. I am contemplating dragging out my old
> unpainted minis that I had when I was a kid and I have a question about
> paints.
>
Ahhh, first things first. Plan much, paint once, and be satisfied
with the results... I suggest you consider the following steps to help
yourself out before you even begin to paint.
Primering before painting.
1. Decide what the major color of the figure(s) is going to be - Ultra
Marines for example would be largely (and unsurprisingly) blue.
2. Decide what color you want to primer your mini(s) with. Black,
Gray, and White are generally used as the primer or base coat. But as
our example in step one was Ultra Smurfs - you could get away with
primering them in Ultra Marine blue or even a darker shade of blue (so
you could start building up your value scale (more on this later) right
from the primer coat. I've also primered in black, and then drybrush
the mini with white acrylic before beginning the color work so I don't
have to put down a black wash and then repaint all my brighter raised
areas.
2a. Choices of primer. You can use GW primers though they do tend to be
a bit expensive. You can use other matt (non-glossy) primers as well,
just be aware that all primers have some sort of solvent in them -
glossy spray paints and primers tending to have more than the matt
varieties. You may have to experiment to find a decent alternative
available in your area, but I'll explain how to go about this in step 5.
A word of Note: Both GW and Armory make primers that are designed for
miniatures - but both of their White primers tend to be troublesome and
often seem to result in a rough or textured surface on the minis - this
is known as 'orange peel' and is not desirable.
3. WASH YOUR MINIATURES - I'll say that again... WASH YOUR MINIATURES!
You want to wash them with something that WONT melt plastics but will
remove any mold release formula that may remain on the minis along with
any oils or dirt from being handled. I use things like Fantastic
household cleaner or even Clorox household cleaner which has a bit of
bleach in it.
You'll want to have the following items handy:
Cullender to wash the minis in (so you don't loose any small bitz
down the drain - nothing is worse than being hosed before you've even
begun.) Your cleaner of choice, some rubber 'cleaning' gloves, safety
glasses (beats getting cleaner in your eyes) and an old tooth brush.
Put the minis in the cullender, spray them down with cleaner (do this in
a sink) and then rinse them with warm water while gently scrubbing them
with a tooth brush. Place them someplace convenient and let them dry.
(Or if you're in a serious hurry, you can use a hair dryer to speed
things up - as long as you don't melt them.)
5. Actually spraying the damn things! Primering allows the paint to
have a good surface to adhere to on the mini and generally allows the
paint job you're going to spend valuable time on to remain in good
condition for a long time. The goal is to get a smooth coat that covers
the mini without being so thick that it obscures any of the fine
details. The bane of primering is the dread 'orange peel' where
wrinkles or rough textures develop on parts or all of the mini where
the primer has been applied. Orange Peel can be the result of any or
all of the following...
Oils, dirt, or mold release formula still on the mini that react with
the primer. (Hence my strong recommendation for pre-washing).
Primering plastic minis with 'high' solvent content primer - the solvent
actually slightly melts the surface of the mini. In technical terms -
that's bad!
Primering in very high or low humidity conditions. In high humidity
conditions the paint may sit on the mini in a wet state for longer than
normal - resulting as above in the solvents affecting the plastics. In
low humidity conditions the paint actually starts to dry and 'chunk up'
before it ever reaches the surface of the mini.
Primering in colder conditions. Paint - and primers as well seem to
form nice smooth and even coatings on warm (not hot) surfaces much
better than on cold ones.
But fear not! These obstacles are all easily surmounted. We
started by washing the minis which should get rid of any crud on the
surface. Next step is to test the primer to make sure it isn't going to
react with the plastic in the minis BEFORE actually spraying a bunch of
expensive minis. You do this by saving sprue (the plastic frame the
model parts come on) and test painting this with the primer you intend
to use. I STRONGLY recommend you test each can of primer in this way
before painting - even if it's a brand you've used many times. No two
cans of primer are exactly the same, nor is the plastic used in minis
always the same. Better safe than sorry. As for painting in during
periods of high or low humidity - avoid it if possible. If you simply
have to paint in that sort of environment (such as living in Arizona or
Washington state) hopefully this will help. Under normal conditions one
wants to keep the spray can about 8 to 12 inches from the items you're
primering. Under high humidity conditions, hold the can farther away,
and lightly mist the minis until they're coated. Let them dry and
repeat with 2nd coat - again holding the can a bit farther away than
normal. Under low humidity conditions where the paint tends to dry to
quickly, hold the can a bit closer, and smoothly sweep it across the
minis. (Again, you can practice on some old sprue to make sure this
will work before spraying your minis.) And if you absolutely have to
primer some minis in the dead of winter - here's how to go about it.
Keep your primer warm by placing the can in a bath of warm (not hot or
boiling!) water. Warm the minis (esp. plastics) with a hair dryer.
Take everything out to the garage or wherever you spray, primer them
quickly and bring the minis and primer can back in the house allowing
the minis to dry in a warm environment.
Additional primering tips. I typically set my minis on a cardboard
surface (old pizza boxes are great for this) so that I can spin the
minis around and paint them from all sides without having to move around
the minis. I also find that one gets better results by lifting the
surface up and spraying upwards at the undersides of the minis without
having to lay them all down on their sides or trying to tilt the can on
it's side (which can cause the paint to spatter in thick blobs). Also
start spraying to the side of the target, and smoothly sweep the spray
back and forth across the mini. This helps prevent any initial splatter
from hitting the minis. I'd also highly recommend some sort of cheap
filter mask while spraying - a serious sinus infection is a poor way to
figure out that you inhaled to much primer.
> I've read in here that many people use the craft store less expensive
> acrylics for a lot of their painting. I saw that AC Moore has Americana
> acrylics on sale this week for $0.50 a bottle. So, I'm thinking of
> stocking up...
>
I use craft paints such as 'Plaid' and 'Folk Art' all the time.
As RTM pointed out in his reply - the individual colors vary by line and
manufacturer, so there's no sure fire way to know exactly which paints
are going to work for you without a little trial and error. I tend to
use mostly the craft paints as you get more for your money and they
don't dry out in no time like GW paints do. (Whoever designed GW's
current 'boltershell' paint bottle should be taken out and clubed like a
harp seal!)
> My question is: what colors should I look at getting to have a good base?
> And what paints do I need to supplement with (if any) from other paint
> lines?
>
Ok, quicky painting lesson. Paints are described with the terms; Hue -
which is their color attribute such as red or yellow, Croma - which is
their brightness or intensity, and Value - which is how light or dark
they are visually. Paints are also described as 'warm' (advancing
colors - they jump out at you) or cool (retreating colors - the fade
into the background). Ultra Marine blue is a warm blue, where as Navy
blue is cool blue.
Ideally, the absolute smallest number of paints you could buy would be a
bright warm blue, a bright warm yellow, and a bright warm red. You
could then mix variants of all the other colors through careful
combinations of these 3. You'd also find a thing of black & white
useful. But remember - when you add black or white to color you're
simply reducing it's croma (how bright it is) by diluting the amount of
colored pigment in the paint. Black's tend to make colors dark and
muddy (I tend to avoid mixing black paint with colors) and adding white
makes things look pastle rather than a 'lighter shade' ie brighter than
the original color.
You'll have to experiement with the craft colors you're using, and see
how well they mix to make other 'varient' colors. If you're satisfied
with the results - you can buy only a few other colors to suppliment
your primary choices. I use mostly craft paints for the main colors,
GW's inks (and some artist grade inks) for washes, I tend to use
Testor's Military modeller acrylics for their greens and browns, plus
their metallic ranges (GW's metallics aren't bad, but they come in those
crappy GW bottles). There are a few decent 'craft paint' metallics, but
most tend to be inferior - so odds are this is where you'll most likely
have to buy from another paint range.
Someone recently posted a good list of paint ranges for minis - Humbrol,
Coat D'arms, Tamiya & Gunyo (spelling?) (Both are Japanese paint lines -
but you can find them at hobby shops here in the states and on line)
Testors Military Modeller, Plaid, Apple Barrel, Folk Art. Hopefully
other folks will point out any I missed.
> Most of my old miniatures are fantasy type themes, but I might decide to
> try other types as well. So I'm looking to get a pretty comprehensive set
> of paints.
>
> Thanks for any help!
>
> Garon
>
Hope that helps,
Myrmidon
--
I thought it was the FUCKING Steam tank? Or has the official spelling
changed and I have to change my AB files again? -- KMarkusV
RGMW FAQ: http://www.rgmw.org
Or...
RT Maitreya
Myrmidon wrote:
> 3. WASH YOUR MINIATURES - I use things like Fantastic
> household cleaner or even Clorox household cleaner which has a bit of
> bleach in it.
While I agree with the sentiment, you'll do fine to
use dishwashing detergent and warm water. I don't
have trouble at all with flaking and adhesion, and
I just scrub with a small brush and some soapy water.
> 5. Actually spraying the damn things! Primering allows the paint to
> have a good surface to adhere to on the mini and generally allows the
> paint job you're going to spend valuable time on to remain in good
> condition for a long time.
Yes, yes, yes. Always spray prime EVERYTHING despite
what local wives' tale lore says about "I nevvah prahm
mah minis, it don' do nuttin". Ignore those people.
> Primering in very high or low humidity conditions. In high humidity
> conditions the paint may sit on the mini in a wet state for longer than
> normal - resulting as above in the solvents affecting the plastics. In
> low humidity conditions the paint actually starts to dry and 'chunk up'
> before it ever reaches the surface of the mini.
This and the cold results in "dusting" whereby your
miniature is not actually harmed, but is unsightly,
rubs off on your hands, and provides a rough texture.
You want neither orange peeling nor dusting, but at
least dusting is somewhat fixable.
Other than these niggling points, believe every single
word Myrm writes. It is gospel.
RTM
Robert Singers
> Myrmidon wrote:
>
>
> > 3. WASH YOUR MINIATURES - I use things like Fantastic
> > household cleaner or even Clorox household cleaner which has
a bit of
> > bleach in it.
>
> While I agree with the sentiment, you'll do fine to
> use dishwashing detergent and warm water. I don't
> have trouble at all with flaking and adhesion, and
> I just scrub with a small brush and some soapy water.
I just soak them in warm dishwashing liquid and rinse them with
warm\hot water and leave them to dry. I have noticed that minis
I've stripped in caustic soda take primer better. I'm guessing
the surface get's mildly etched. I also read over on RGMM of
someone who soaks plastic minis in white vinegar over night
before priming to get the same effect.
> > 5. Actually spraying the damn things! Primering allows the
paint to
> > have a good surface to adhere to on the mini and generally
allows the
> > paint job you're going to spend valuable time on to remain in
good
> > condition for a long time.
>
> Yes, yes, yes. Always spray prime EVERYTHING despite
> what local wives' tale lore says about "I nevvah prahm
> mah minis, it don' do nuttin". Ignore those people.
Don't ignore them - spit on them. Repeatedly. They're likely to
be filthy top-posters as well.
> > Primering in very high or low humidity conditions. In high
humidity
> > conditions the paint may sit on the mini in a wet state for
longer than
> > normal - resulting as above in the solvents affecting the
plastics. In
> > low humidity conditions the paint actually starts to dry and
'chunk up'
> > before it ever reaches the surface of the mini.
>
> This and the cold results in "dusting" whereby your
> miniature is not actually harmed, but is unsightly,
> rubs off on your hands, and provides a rough texture.
> You want neither orange peeling nor dusting, but at
> least dusting is somewhat fixable.
Actually don't forget dust itself. You can lower the chance of
dust in your spray job by using a drop cloth or newspaper that
you've sprayed with a fine mist of water. If you use a cardboard
box as a sprayhood you can mist the inside lightly as well.
G. Munch
than I was hoping for. I'm getting psyched to join the ranks of mini
painters!
Garon