Anybody play Mahjongtime?
Michael P. Thompson
interesting. It can be hard to get enough people to play a game, depending
on the time of day, but once you do, it's pretty cool. I find it a bit
difficult to read some of the text because they have dark on dark and it's
pretty tiny. I also found you have to be pretty fast, as there's a delay
caused by the transmission time, and an automatic timeout on some moves. You
can actually walk away for a bit and it will play automatically, though
randomly, so it's not good for making a good hand.
They have both Hong Kong and Chinese Official rules, and you can use flowers
or not, as you wish.
One thing that confused me though was that the game would sometimes suddenly
end and all four players would be declared the winner. I also didn't
understand the scoring. Has anybody else played on this system? And did you
have a similar experience?
--
Join the fun! Join the forum!
http://www.coloradoflyfishing.us
Nath Krismaratala
Yes, I've also tried MahJongTime.
The connection is not only very slow, but the software is even slower,
so it takes over and makes stupid decisions. The scoring doesn't make
any sense to me also. I never could finish a game. Got disconnected for
no reason or the game stopped abruptly. Very bad interface.
The worst experience I had with a Mahjong server.
They keep sending me "reminders" (spam) I don't need nor want.
Extremely disappointing.
wil...@mahjongtime.com
Thank you for your comments. This is William with MahjongTime. Have you
played at MahjongTime recently? We experienced some slow connections
due to unexpected traffic surge in middle of Dec 05, but since then, we
have upgraded the servers to make sure the players have the best
experience possible with the game. Since then, we have not received any
comments about the slow connection. Please also note that depends on
your internet connection, the slow connection might also originated
from your ISP.
If you still experiencing the slow connection, please let us know. You
can simply login to our site and chat with our 24/7 Player Services so
that can help to investigate the source of the problem further.
In regards to the scoring, we use Chinese Official or Hong Kong scoring
system depending on the version that you play. For more details about
the scoring, please visit:
http://mahjongtime.com/Mahjong-Game-Info.html
Lastly, in regards to the reminders, you can always not to receive them
by clicking on the unsubscribe link within the email. Many of our
members appreciate the reminders and the notification about new
features that we are sending via email, and should you choose not to
receive them, you can easily notify us automatically via our
unsubscribe system, or simply let us know and we will take care of it.
We strive to create the best mahjong experience possible for our
members, so if you have any feedback or ideas about things that we can
improve, please don't hesitate to let us know. We greatly appreciate
your comments so that we can continually improve our site.
Warm Regards,
William
MahjongTime.com
J. R. Fitch
> In regards to the scoring, we use Chinese Official or Hong Kong scoring
> system depending on the version that you play. For more details about
> the scoring, please visit:
> http://mahjongtime.com/Mahjong-Game-Info.html
MT needs to work a bit on those COMJ details. For example, element #55
has the erroneous "Seven Pairs... does not combine with All types..".
Then, the COMJ scoring section ends on this note: "Chinese Official
scoring is fairly flexible with several well-liked variations.". Huh?
COMJ scoring is intentionally inflexible, and there are no variations.
Actually, this verbiage seems to have been copy-and-pasted from the HKMJ
section.
In the HKMJ section, there is a table which lists a 0 fan self-drawn
hand as paying 2+2+2=6 chips. Since Self-Pick is 1 fan, there is no such
thing as a 0 fan self-drawn hand.
These are small copy-writing details that may not reflect on the
accuracy of the online program, but they do not encourage much
confidence.
--
J. R. Fitch
Nine Dragons Software
San Francisco, CA USA
http://www.ninedragons.com
Nath Krismaratala
> from your ISP
I play on several Japanese and American websites. Connection speed has
never been an issue except with your server/software. And never I've
seen a server/software choose such bad discards when it takes over. It
destroys systematically carefully crafted hands. Seems to choose at
random, and usually the worst tile. Also your programers are obviously
not familiar with the game. If they were, they wouldn't have designed
the menus like they did. There is no point of asking every single
player, for every single tile, to NOT make a chow, a pong, a kong or go
out if it's not one's turn to play or one don't have the required
tiles.
Take a look at http://www.ron2.jp
They have the best logical, functional, esthetic interface.
Take a look at Yahoo Games also
Michael P. Thompson
Fitch" <jrf...@ninedragons.com> wrote:
> These are small copy-writing details that may not reflect on the
> accuracy of the online program, but they do not encourage much
> confidence.
I did notice that, and I wondered if they were translation problems from the
Chinese or something.
Michael P. Thompson
1138030322.6...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com, "Nath Krismaratala"
<mahjong...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Also your programers are obviously
> not familiar with the game. If they were, they wouldn't have designed
> the menus like they did. There is no point of asking every single
> player, for every single tile, to NOT make a chow, a pong, a kong or go
> out if it's not one's turn to play or one don't have the required
> tiles.
It made sense to me that they always asked the players to pass if they
didn't want the tile, because it saves time waiting for the next move, but
you're right, it shouldn't offer the ability to pung, kong, chow, or MahJong
unless such a move is legal at the time. They just need to improve the logic
interface for that.
It does seem to discard at random if you don't choose yourself, but that
motivated me to pay more attention to the game so as not to lose what I was
trying to build, so I didn't think that was such a flaw. It does point up
the importance of the time-out setting though. The default is 30 seconds,
and in one game I played, one of the players clearly wandered off, so it had
to wait the full thirty on every play, and it really made the game slow.
However, ten seconds, which seems to be popular, seems way too short to me,
as it takes two or three seconds to display the tiles, and a second or two
for the system to acknowledge your click, so you really have to be fast to
keep up with it. Good setting for experts, but the rest of us could use
twenty, or at least fifteen.
Michael P. Thompson
1137957047.5...@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com,
"wil...@mahjongtime.com" <wil...@mahjongtime.com> wrote:
> In regards to the scoring, we use Chinese Official or Hong Kong scoring
> system depending on the version that you play.
William, my question about the scoring was that a game would just suddenly
end, with everybody's hands being laid down. Nobody had MahJong, and the
system would tell each player "You are the winner." Three players would have
64 points, and one player would have something else. None of us knew why
this was happening. Is there a time limit or something?
Michael P. Thompson
1138030322.6...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com, "Nath Krismaratala"
<mahjong...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Take a look at http://www.ron2.jp
> They have the best logical, functional, esthetic interface.
Nice if you can read Chinese, but that lets me out.
Julian Bradfield
> random, and usually the worst tile. Also your programers are obviously
> not familiar with the game. If they were, they wouldn't have designed
> the menus like they did. There is no point of asking every single
> player, for every single tile, to NOT make a chow, a pong, a kong or go
> out if it's not one's turn to play or one don't have the required
> tiles.
You haven't thought it through, I think.
If the program passes automatically on behalf of players who can't
claim the discard, then other players may be able to guess this based
on the speed of the pass, whereas if they can claim, but choose not
to, this will be deducible from the slightly slower pass while they
hit the button (or whatever it is they have to do).
Michael P. Thompson
Bradfield" <j...@inf.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
> If the program passes automatically on behalf of players who can't
> claim the discard, then other players may be able to guess this based
> on the speed of the pass, whereas if they can claim, but choose not
> to, this will be deducible from the slightly slower pass while they
> hit the button (or whatever it is they have to do).
It's not players who can't claim, but players who do not claim. Most of the
players click pass right away to keep the game going.
William
contents accordingly. I can assure you that the game works properly in
accordance to the rules. Again, I greatly appreciate your valuable
feedback as we continue to improve our game.
Warm Regards,
William
MahjongTime.com
William
> end, with everybody's hands being laid down. Nobody had MahJong, and the
> system would tell each player "You are the winner." Three players would have
> 64 points, and one player would have something else. None of us knew why
> this was happening. Is there a time limit or something?
Hi Michael, this happens when somebody wrongly declare a winning hand
(wrong Mahjong), which get penalized by maximum penalty.
Warm Regards,
William
MahjongTime.com
William
> didn't want the tile, because it saves time waiting for the next move, but
> you're right, it shouldn't offer the ability to pung, kong, chow, or MahJong
> unless such a move is legal at the time. They just need to improve the logic
> interface for that.
Michael, you are correct about passing. We ask the players to pass if
they didn't want the tile to keep the game going rather than waiting
for the time to expire. The reason why we still make the option to
pung, kong, chow or Mahjong available because we want to make the
online game as close to real game as possible. Just as like in the real
game when somebody can declare a wrong chow/pung/kong/mahjong, we want
to make the game mimic that as well. We can easily disable the ability,
but then it beats the joy to taunt your opponent (via chat) when they
declare a wrong move! :-)
Warm Regards,
William
MahjongTime.com
William
> motivated me to pay more attention to the game so as not to lose what I was
> trying to build, so I didn't think that was such a flaw.
Hi Michael, the system does have some basic intelligence as to what
tiles to throw if you don't choose yourself when the time is expired
and we will continually improve the logic of the system. However, as
you pointed out, the main purpose of the auto-player is to keep the
game going in case of the time limit expired, and also to have people
to pay more attention to the game. Otherwise, somebody can simply stall
the game by not moving.
Again, I greatly appreciate all the comments and feedback. We are
working as hard as we can to continually improve our game and make it
problem-free, but as some of you might know, there is always glitches
here and there due to the complexity of the game. We appreciate your
patience and feedback so that we can make the improvement and
adjustment necessary to make our site a fun place to play mahjong
online.
Warm Regards,
William
MahjongTime.com
J. R. Fitch
> Thanks for pointing out some of the content errors. We will revise the
> contents accordingly.
This statement appears in both the HKMJ and COMJ rules:
"Considered as Major or Honor Tiles are the tiles 1 and 9, as well as
the Winds and the Dragons. While tiles numbered from 2 to 8 are called
the Minor Tiles."
As it is written, this is incorrect. For HKMJ, I would suggest deleting
it. It has no relevance to that game. For COMJ, it should be re-written
to indicate that 1 and 9 are Terminals, 2 through 8 are Simples, and
Winds and Dragons are Honors.
This statement also appears under "Winning" in both the HKMJ and COMJ
rules:
"If East (the Dealer) wins the game he stays as East. Or else, the
player to the right becomes the new dealer (East) as the wind / seating
position rotate counterclockwise.".
This is not true for COMJ. The Winds rotate even if East is the winner.
It should be added that in HKMJ, the Winds remain in place after a Dead
Hand. In COMJ, they rotate.
Nath Krismaratala
I don't have to. I rely on my exprerience of other websites, not on
abstract knowledge. Multiple Japanese systems work without revealing
strategic info about rivals intents.
There is no point of asking me if I want to "chow" on a tile discarded
by a player in front or on right of me. The option shouldn't appear in
the menu. Also, if the system answers automaticaly for me, it doesn't
have to immediately. It can wait until every other players have
decided.
If I compare to RON2 and similar Japapese websites, MahjongTime is
very, very primitive, and has..., how to put this gently... yes... a
lot room for improvement.
Nath Krismaratala
It's Japanese, not Chinese. If you want to be a major player on Mahjong
scene, you need to look at Japanese games. They have a big advance in
that field and lot of experience. Most Mahjong software are produced by
Japanese compagnies. There is a lot to learn from them.
If you are not able to read or translate Japanese, try
http://games.yahoo.com/mj
John (Zi Rong) Low
you can download as ROMs for various emulators. Many of them appear on
Super Nintendo, N64 and Gameboy Advance. And they are programmed so the
computers are intelligent and rarely create "Furiten"s.
Julian Bradfield
> There is no point of asking me if I want to "chow" on a tile discarded
> by a player in front or on right of me. The option shouldn't appear in
> the menu.
I don't entirely agree. Part of learning mah-jong is learning when you
can do what. Of course, nobody beyond beginner needs a button for an
impossible chow, but there are beginners.
If you make machines think for people, people stop thinking. This is
as true for playing mah-jong as it is for flying planes.
You also mentioned pung, kong, mah-jong in the bit of your original
posting that I cited. So:
> Also, if the system answers automaticaly for me, it doesn't
> have to immediately. It can wait until every other players have
> decided.
If there are three (or even two) players, none of whom can take the
tile, what's it going to do?
> If I compare to RON2 and similar Japapese websites, MahjongTime is
> very, very primitive, and has..., how to put this gently... yes... a
> lot room for improvement.
No doubt, though I haven't used either. How usable are these Japanese
websites by somebody who's never played before?
Nath Krismaratala
> can do what. Of course, nobody beyond beginner needs a button for an
> impossible chow, but there are beginners.
If you like, buttons for chow, pung/kong and going out could be
permanently visibles, but grey out, to show you those possiblities
eventually exist, but right now you can't used them. In my opinion, the
worst thing for beginners is pop-up windows appearing all the time,
asking them to chow/pung/kong or go out, then telling them most of the
time they shouldn't have pressed the button, and, from time to time, at
random in the eyes of a beginner, they suddenly work. Always active
buttons don't show them when the window of opportunity opens and closes
for all those actions.
> How usable are these Japanese
> websites by somebody who's never played before?
Actually, before I tried them, I didn't quite understood Mahjong. My
game improved a lot by using them.
For children and absolute beginners there are simplified mah-jong
(donjara) games, like http://www.jeuxflash.tv/jeux/963.SWF
Have a nice day!
Michael P. Thompson
1138074165....@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, "Nath Krismaratala"
<mahjong...@gmail.com> wrote:
> There is no point of asking me if I want to "chow" on a tile discarded
> by a player in front or on right of me. The option shouldn't appear in
> the menu. Also, if the system answers automaticaly for me, it doesn't
> have to immediately. It can wait until every other players have
> decided.
It's not necessarily asking you if you WANT to chow, it's just giving you
the option to chow, just like you have in a real world (RW) game with real
people. Now that William has explained things, I realize that MJTime is
purposely geared to be more like a RW game than an online game. In a RW game
you can call pung or chow at any time, whether it's allowed by the rules or
not. Limiting the menu options to legal moves merely creates a crutch for
those who don't pay attention, so that they couldn't accidentally make a
wrong move.
The system can certainly wait for the timeout period rather than having
people click "pass" but the latter option makes the game go faster, while
still allowing everyone to make their own decision. In RW, you have but a
few seconds to decide whether you want a tile or not. Again, MJTime seems to
be designed to make an experience more like RW.
Michael P. Thompson
1138074509....@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, "Nath Krismaratala"
<mahjong...@gmail.com> wrote:
> It's Japanese, not Chinese. If you want to be a major player on Mahjong
> scene, you need to look at Japanese games. They have a big advance in
> that field and lot of experience. Most Mahjong software are produced by
> Japanese compagnies. There is a lot to learn from them.
Thanks. But do the Japanese games play by Japanese rules?
John (Zi Rong) Low
Japanese rules.
My favourite ones for Super Nintendo (SNES) emulator are:
Super Mahjong 3: Karakuchi
Nichibutsu Mahjong 1
Zoot Mahjong
Super Real Mahjong P5- Paradise (no stripping)
N64:
Maajan 64 (very beautiful graphics)
Gameboy Advance:
Dai Mahjong (most proper interface for GBA)
Dokodemo Taikyoku: Yakuman Advance
Super Real Mahjong Dousoukai (no stripping)
The SNES ROMs can be downloaded at www.romnation.net if you do a SNES
ROMs search on that website.
Charlie
making the game less fun, and making you feel like a robot, clicking
the only option that comes up. I think that Mahjong Time has done a
wonderful job in making the game seem like the real life game we all
love. Giving the players the opportunity to make a mistake livens up
the game and keeps people on their feet. The "pass" command just speeds
up the game instead of everyone having to wait for the timer to run
out, when no-one needs the tile anyway. I found that MahjongTime makes
online chineese and hong kong mahjong seem the most lifelike. Keep up
the good work MahjongTime!
Charlie
miracle sites you played on, but i think Mahjong time offers a damn
good place for players to get together. If you feel the need to play on
a perfect site, suited perfectly to YOUR needs and YOUR opinions, why
not create a site for yourself? In the meantime, I'll be playing
mahjongtime and having fun there.
Nath Krismaratala
moment,
Sorry to not find your website perfect. I would be the first one to
promote your services if they were fun to use. But they are not. Sorry.
I'm sure you invested a lot of time and money in this venture. I hope
you'll find ways to improve your website. You have my best wishes.
I don't need to create a special site, just for myself. There are
already a lot fun places for Mahjong enthousiasts like me to enjoy a
good, fun, free game and meet interesting people. MahjongTime is not
one of them. Too bad.
I'm intitled to my opinion. And you don't have to be angry because this
customer espressed his honest opinion.
Have a nice day debuging MahjongTime!
Nath Krismaratala
Now, all it takes is to make live up to the advertisment you just made.
(^_^)
By the way, We all know each other by name, if not in real life, on
rec.games.mahjong. New users that sporadically come here to "promote"
products, and never to been seen again, are easily spotted. That said,
if you like to really participate to our discussions, for more than a
few advertisment posts, you are welcome. Please take a look at the
excellent FAQ maintained by Tom Sloper.
William
1) I am not posting as Charlie or whoever else you think I am posting
as. You can clearly see that from the email address that I am using to
respond to this discussions. I can talk about MahjongTime just fine as
myself, I do not need to post as others to state my opinion and my
answers.
2) I did not come to this board to promote MahjongTime. I was informed
by Tom that there is a posting about MahjongTime here and I simply
responded to your complaint about the slow connection and I guess here
we are.
3) As you stated, everybody is entitled to their own opinion. You seem
to dislike our site so much, but don't you think there are also people
that like our site a lot and also entitled to their opinion on this
newsgroup?
So, I am urging you and everybody else in this discussion, let's keep
the discussion clean and professional. I respect your opinion and
always welcome any feedback to continually improve our site. If you
don't like MahjongTime and like other sites better, I wish you much fun
and best of luck playing at other sites. I only ask you to please show
courtesy to others that do not have the same opinion with you. Strong
opinions and disagreements are perfectly fine, but to start accusing
and making assumptions are uncalled for and going beyond the real
purpose of this type of newsgroup.
As I posted earlier, we strive to create the best mahjong experience
possible for our members. As with any products, we realize that not
everybody is going to like it and we appreciate any feedback and ideas
about things that we can improve. But, let's not turn this into a hate
discussion, I do not believe that it's fair to others that
participate/reading this thread.
Thanks,
William
http://www.MahjongTime.com
Michael P. Thompson
1138261275....@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, "William"
<wil...@mahjongtime.com> wrote:
> I am urging you and everybody else in this discussion, let's keep
> the discussion clean and professional. I respect your opinion and
> always welcome any feedback to continually improve our site.
I agree. There's no need for this name-calling and such.
Nath, I know you've been around the newsgroup and the Mah-Jong world for a
long time. You're certainly entitled to your preferences about how an online
game should run. However, Charlie and I were just pointing out that certain
features, which you had chalked up to inept programming, seem, upon further
explanation, to be done on purpose by Mah-Jong Time to make the online game
more like a real world game with friends.
Charlie, you do not need to be casting aspersions on Nath, either. As you
said, everyone is entitled to his opinion. If Nath thinks the online game
should not offer illegitimate options, he's certainly entitled to that
opinion.
I do like MahJongTime, though I can see room for improvement in it as well.
I'm glad William is here to interact with us on the subject.
J. R. Fitch
- the 1st message from "Charlie" seemed suspicious to Nath (and to
others).
- the 2nd message from "Charlie" addressed Nath personally, rather than
commenting on his remarks, and was sarcastic.
This is a small group. Perhaps Charlie may wish to introduce himself,
and we can continue an objective discussion of the merits of MT. Maybe
some of us could join him in an online round of COMJ.
Nath Krismaratala
> - the 1st message from "Charlie" seemed suspicious to Nath (and to
> others).
> - the 2nd message from "Charlie" addressed Nath personally, rather than
> commenting on his remarks, and was sarcastic.
Yes, exactly.
> This is a small group. Perhaps Charlie may wish to introduce himself,
Yes, good suggestions.
> and we can continue an objective discussion of the merits of MT.
I encourage you to try MT and to compare it to other
websites/softwares. You already know my opinion. I won't comment
anymore.
Nath Krismaratala
> long time. You're certainly entitled to your preferences about how an online
> game should run.
Thank you.
> However, Charlie and I were just pointing out that certain
> features, which you had chalked up to inept programming, seem, upon further
> explanation, to be done on purpose by Mah-Jong Time to make the online game
> more like a real world game with friends.
It reminds me a businessman who told me, several years ago, when
commenting an engineering software gone wrong: - "If they can get rid
off all inadequacies they should market them as features, at least
until they come up with an improved version of their software."
- Getting disconnected for no reason
- A dumb AI that takes over and destroys good hands
- A flawed scoring system
are not "features" that make MT more like a real world game with
friends. Sorry.
I've taken enough discussion space. Now, I encourage others to try MT
and express their opinions.
Have a nice day!
William
> - the 1st message from "Charlie" seemed suspicious to Nath (and to
> others).
> - the 2nd message from "Charlie" addressed Nath personally, rather than
> commenting on his remarks, and was sarcastic.
Yes, I do agree that Charlie was harsh in his messages. Charlie, should
you choose to respond, please keep your postings related to the subject
and not in regards to the person who posted something that you are
disagreeing with. I appreciate your support for MT, but since I am
interacting on behalf of MT, anything postings that not originated from
me which shows strong support will be somehow flagged as suspicious
posting and myself or MT are blamed for it! So, in the future, please
keep your posting intact with the subject. Thanks!
Nath, I respect your opinion and thank you for your comments. It will
definitely help us to improve our game to serve the mahjong enthusiasts
that have the same opinion with you. However, likes and dislikes are
purely subjective, so I ask that you respect others that favors and
support MT. You may conclude that certain things are flawed and
inadequate, but as shown in this thread, there are others that like the
game and think it is a good feature. I hope that you respect people
that disagreeing with you and not try to enforce your conclusion to
others. I am sensing that you have a very strong opinion but if you see
what others are saying, I think you will find that not everything that
you dislike are "flaws" and "gone wrong". Perhaps one product are
designed for different purpose and to serve certain market. Again, I
appreciate your feedback and should you wish to see MT implement some
features that you would like to see, please feel free to contact me via
email personally and I would be more than happy to discuss it with you.
I've also already taken too much space here, but I just want to comment
on the claimed flaws before I sign off for good...
>> Getting disconnected for no reason
I mentioned in my past posting that MT experienced server problem back
in mid Dec 05 due to traffic surge, however, we have added new servers
to resolve the problem. If any of you are still experiencing slow
connection and disconnection, please let me know. Perhaps you can
contact me via email personally or chat with our player services so
that we can help to pinpoint where the problem is. So far, since we
upgraded the servers, we have not received any complaints about the
connections. If you have problems, just let us know because we
definitely want to fix it!
>> A dumb AI that takes over and destroys good hands
There are enough previous postings here that talk about this, but to
re-iterate again, the main purpose of the AI is to keep the
game going in case of the time limit expired, and also to have people
to pay more attention to the game. Otherwise, somebody can simply stall
the game by not moving. MT meant to be multi-player and mimic mahjong
in Real World as close as possible. We are relatively new (only few
months old!), so we are making improvements everyday to get one step
closer to mahjong in real world. More about the AI, it currently has
some basic intelligence as to what tiles to throw if you don't choose
yourself when the time is expired
and we will continually improve the logic of the AI. If the AI keep
performing the move for you, then perhaps the time limit is too fast
for you and you should create or join games with longer time limit. In
the future, we are also planning to create a training mode, where you
can actually play with the AI without any other real players in the
table. However, I do believe that we need to improve the AI first since
right now, the main purpose of AI is not for practicing/training as I
pointed out above.
>> A flawed scoring system
We use Chinese Official or Hong Kong scoring system depending on the
version that you play. (By the way, thanks to J.R. who pointed out
incorrect copy-writing in few places -- we have revised the contents
and also verified that the game keep track of the scoring as it
supposed to -- thanks again J.R.!).
Thanks again for the opportunity to respond to the postings. Please
feel free to contact me if there is something that you think we should
improve as we strive to provide the best online mahjong experience as
possible.
Have a great weekend!
William
http://www.mahjongtime.com
Michael P. Thompson
1138379043.6...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com, "Nath Krismaratala"
<mahjong...@gmail.com> wrote:
> - Getting disconnected for no reason
> - A dumb AI that takes over and destroys good hands
> - A flawed scoring system
Now that's more like a discussion!
I have never been disconnected, so I don't know about that one.
As for the dumb AI, it's true, but it only takes over if you don't play your
own hand. They do have a robot to allow for three handed play, and it's not
as dumb, from what I can see. So they do appear to have the capability of
making a smarter AI. But why should the AI make smart plays for those who
are not paying attention? You play your own game or suffer the consequences,
it seems like. At least that's what appears to be the case. Can't say for
certain that's what they intended.
I haven't figured out their scoring system yet, so I can't say whether it's
flawed or not. Can you give more details?
Michael P. Thompson
1138402492.8...@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, "William"
<wil...@mahjongtime.com> wrote:
> main purpose of the AI is to keep the
> game going in case of the time limit expired, and also to have people
> to pay more attention to the game. Otherwise, somebody can simply stall
> the game by not moving.
So my interpretation was correct. The AI is not intended to simulate a
decent player, but merely to keep the game moving. This makes sense, when
players are all over the world, and may have distractions unknown to the
rest of us. I know I was playing MahJongTime at work the other day, during a
slow time, but I did get a customer and had to be away for a few seconds.
When I play poker online, there's a provision to sit out a few hands that I
can use for this, but the nature of Mah Jong is different, and you couldn't
really do that. It makes sense to me to have the AI make random plays for
you in this case.
Even if they made the AI to play decently, how would it know what strategy
you were pursuing. Maybe you had kept a six bamboo for discard and two nine
bamboos in hopes of a pung and the AI sees a chance to chow, making one of
the nines useless and ruining your strategy. Or maybe it pungs when you are
going for an all chow hand. Is that really any better than random?
I'm interested in your comments Nath. You say the AI is dumb, but you
haven't addressed why you would prefer it otherwise.
Nath Krismaratala
> haven't addressed why you would prefer it otherwise.
In, even extremely simple games, for instance on a first generation
Gameboy, the computer discards the less connected tile, the one that
doesn't already form a Chow/Pon/Kong, always searching to increase the
value of the hand, to make it ready, to go out fast.
For instance, If I had :
B123 C123 D123 GGG E (it's obvious, all I need is an East to go out)
...
I draw 8 Dot, so I have now B123 C123 D1238 GGG E . The two logical
candidates for my next discard are D8 and E.
...
The connection times out. The AI takes over. What do you think it chose
to discard?
...
D2 !!!!
...
And on next turn, after drawing C9? It trows away G !!! Not letting me
play again for no apparent reason. There is no other G available
because the fourth one was discarded at the beginning of the round.
The algorythm obviously isn't able to evaluate the potential value of
hands. It doesn't recognize a ready hand. It doesn't try to multiply
chances of going out by creating double-sided Chows. It doesn't take
in account already discarded tiles. It discards randomly and simply
destroys good hands.
I'm curious. Which Mahjong websites or software, other than MT, have
you tried and are familiar with? Did you tried Four Winds, Nine
Dragons, Yahoo, or any Nintendo, PlayStation games?
Michael P. Thompson
1138515509.5...@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, "Nath Krismaratala"
<mahjong...@gmail.com> wrote:
> The algorythm obviously isn't able to evaluate the potential value of
> hands. It doesn't recognize a ready hand. It doesn't try to multiply
> chances of going out by creating double-sided Chows. It doesn't take
> in account already discarded tiles. It discards randomly and simply
> destroys good hands.
I don't disagree with you on that, but it's apparently a purposeful choice
by MT to discourage people from abandoning their hands. Pay attention or pay
the consequences. It's not intended to play for you, any more than the other
players in a RW game would play for you.
>
> I'm curious. Which Mahjong websites or software, other than MT, have
> you tried and are familiar with? Did you tried Four Winds, Nine
> Dragons, Yahoo, or any Nintendo, PlayStation games?
I used to have a Mah Jong game on Macintosh that I played, where it was one
player against three computer players. They've updated the operating system
now though, so it no longer works. I currently have a Java game called
SmartMJ, in which you can play against the computer, or apparently against
online players. I haven't used it much. Other than that, I did play on Yahoo
a couple of days ago, after people recommended it on this group. I haven't
entirely figured it out very well yet, so I can't comment on how it compares
to MT. I do have a Game Boy Advance. Are there any MJ games available for
that?
Tom Sloper
> I do have a Game Boy Advance. Are there any MJ games available for
> that?
Probably. If there is a Japanese video game shop near you, they probably
have something. I play Yakuman DS myself these days, when I'm traveling
anyway. Anyway, if there isn't a Japanese video game shop near you, I'm sure
there are some on the internet.
Good luck!
Tom
Charlie
I'm a guy who plays games online a lot! I mean it! I tried to learn
how to play Mahjong from different sites, downloading software, playing
against the computer, but this was too much trouble or too boring. I
also tried Yahoo, but couldn't really figure it out. I like
mahjongtime because I can play with real players, the game there is
more like real life, plus their player services help me to learn the
game.
If my opinion sounds too strong, that's because I really like
mahjongtime. Let's have others to post their opinion here. Or,
William, how about making an opinion poll at mahjongtime so we could
see what others think?
Also, if someone wants to play online, let me know what time you would
prefer.
swhap...@gmail.com
> Hi Nath,
>
> Thank you for your comments. This is William with MahjongTime. Have you
> played at MahjongTime recently? We experienced some slow connections
> due to unexpected traffic surge in middle of Dec 05, but since then, we
> have upgraded the servers to make sure the players have the best
> experience possible with the game. Since then, we have not received any
> comments about the slow connection. Please also note that depends on
> your internet connection, the slow connection might also originated
> from your ISP.
>
> If you still experiencing the slow connection, please let us know. You
> can simply login to our site and chat with our 24/7 Player Services so
> that can help to investigate the source of the problem further.
>
> In regards to the scoring, we use Chinese Official or Hong Kong scoring
> system depending on the version that you play. For more details about
> the scoring, please visit:
> http://mahjongtime.com/Mahjong-Game-Info.html
>
> Lastly, in regards to the reminders, you can always not to receive them
> by clicking on the unsubscribe link within the email. Many of our
> members appreciate the reminders and the notification about new
> features that we are sending via email, and should you choose not to
> receive them, you can easily notify us automatically via our
> unsubscribe system, or simply let us know and we will take care of it.
>
> We strive to create the best mahjong experience possible for our
> members, so if you have any feedback or ideas about things that we can
> improve, please don't hesitate to let us know. We greatly appreciate
> your comments so that we can continually improve our site.
>
> Warm Regards,
>
> William
> MahjongTime.com
>
> Nath Krismaratala wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > Yes, I've also tried MahJongTime.
> >
> > The connection is not only very slow, but the software is even slower,
> > so it takes over and makes stupid decisions. The scoring doesn't make
> > any sense to me also. I never could finish a game. Got disconnected for
> > no reason or the game stopped abruptly. Very bad interface.
> >
> > The worst experience I had with a Mahjong server.
> >
> > They keep sending me "reminders" (spam) I don't need nor want.
> >
> > Extremely disappointing.
Its currently July 17th, 2014
I totally agree with all of the above, The Server is very bad and I live in Canada West Coast Vancouver BC...
I hate it when the lags during the beginning of the game... for example the game AUTO discard a tile and I have not even touch my mouse or keyboard. I am like WTF.
I have a extreme very fast internet connection 100 MB/S Downstream and 15MB/S Upload.
I had been playing for the past couple of days, I get mad and very frustrated when Mahjongtime Servers LAGS or DELAYS for nearly for 2 mins or more and then its speeds up AUTO Discarding tiles from your wall WHEN my hands are in my pocket, Example, When it gave me a Green Dragon Tile, then .5 or 1 sec after the Server AUTO Discard that Green Dragon in where I need that so much to complete my hand or Set... I just wish that MAHJONG TIME can upgrade or fix or upgrade to a Fibre Connection.. especially server lag.. imagine spending real money game and then Auto Discard and when your going to win or mahjong?? Then in turns Mahjongtime auto discard and don't win??
I know VIP and Paid Members are secured for 1 min or 2mins etc... but that doesn't beat other online Casino type of games such as POKER online...especially in money tables... IF you delay but get back in, its goes back to normal speed and carries through...
In Mahjong Time... Once you delay for a sec ... the games on berserk and auto discard on super speed... That is not right.
Mahjong time is a great online game to be honest but please be more realistic with all possible hands in all version of Mahjong...
There is one more thing, IF I throw a tile I dont need... it goes into the middle and it stays there blinking (assuming that someone needs to Pung or Chow) it takes too long blinking... In the real world of Mahjong... If you dont see it before it comes... you miss it and to bad... Mahjong its a game of great speed and brain challenger, example Chess is a challenging but slow
I wish there was a faster speed version of mahjong... 7 sec is okay but wish there was 2 sec to think etc...
Let me know about your thoughts about this... if you get the servers to speed up / fix of the lags...
Thank you in advance.
copp...@aol.com
Then I suddenly stopped as it became obvious that new players won more games than older ones getting the new customers interested and established and I began to wonder just how honest the site was. Its so so easy for the people who run a site like this to make sure you lose enough games to make you buy more chips and to win enough games to keep you interested,they are number crunchers by trade after all,its easy to fix.
I recently came back to mahjong time and there it is again, one day you win 6 in a row next day you lose 25 in a row, some of the methods they use are in fact a bit easy to spot. far too often for the law of averages the person on your right discards a tile and hey presto you draw the same tile or you discard a tile and wow,next time round you draw the same tile again. Id love to play an honest mahjong game but I wonder about this one,interested to see what the site says about this
