On behalf of Mike Berlyn...
Gunther Schmidl
Find it on GMD, currently in incoming.
--
+-----------------+---------------+------------------------------+
| Gunther Schmidl | ICQ: 22447430 | IF: http://gschmidl.cjb.net/ |
|-----------------+----------+----+------------------------------|
| gschmidl (at) gmx (dot) at | please remove the "xxx." to reply |
+----------------------------+-----------------------------------+
Michael Berlyn
On behalf of Gunther Schmidl, I tell you I release Gunther Schmidl from
having to tell you I have released Dr. Dumont into the public domain.
Er... I release it.
-- Mike
mailto: mbe...@cascadepublishing.com
"No matter where you go, there you are."
-- Buckaroo Bonzai
David Given
Michael Berlyn <mbe...@cascadepublishing.com> writes:
[...]
> On behalf of Gunther Schmidl, I tell you I release Gunther Schmidl from
> having to tell you I have released Dr. Dumont into the public domain.
>
> Er... I release it.
Um... are you sure?
IIRC, public domain means that you have no rights over it. i.e., I could
download it, change the name, market it as my own work, and make lots of
money, all legally. I think you may want to use the word `freeware'
instead, and look into some open source licenses.
--
+- David Given ---------------McQ-+ "Pigs have wings, making them hard to
| Work: d...@tao-group.com | catch." --- Diana Wynne Jones, _Archer's
| Play: dgi...@iname.com | Goon_
+- http://wired.st-and.ac.uk/~dg -+
Michael Berlyn
Thanks. I stand corrected. I am making it freeware but retain all
rights. Anyone is free to distribute it as long as nothing in or about
the product is modified. (Insert boring legal stuff here.)
-- Mike
mailto: mbe...@cascadepublishing.com
Steve Evans
Michael Berlyn <mbe...@cascadepublishing.com> wrote:
> On behalf of Gunther Schmidl, I tell you I release Gunther Schmidl
from
> having to tell you I have released Dr. Dumont into the public domain.
>
> Er... I release it.
>
> -- Mike
>
Firstly, I must say that the demise of CMP is very sad, but I was
heartened by Mike's comment that the much anticipated "Chameleon" will
still be released. Given the amount of interest in IF there should still
be a place for a commercial IF enterprise, and I hope that sometime soon
the time will be right for a new venture.
Secondly, on the subject of Dr Dumont's Wild PARTI, I read some time ago
in Hans Perrson's Adventureland pages that this game was originally
intended for Infocom.
About it, Hans says:
"This was originally written for Infocom but when they were
taken over by Activision, all outside projects were cancelled, and
although the alpha version had been delivered, they returned the
rights to the game to the authors."
I had no reason to question this until I recently read (somewhat
belatedly) Stephen Granade's 1999 interview with Mike which suggested
that Confetti/Chameleon was the cancelled Infocom game, with Dr Dumont
being a later work always intended for First Row Software.
Mike, to save me having sleepless nights over this, can you shed some
light on the situation regarding the history of "Dr Dumont"?
Cheers,
Steve
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Michael Berlyn
> Firstly, I must say that the demise of CMP is very sad, but I was
> heartened by Mike's comment that the much anticipated "Chameleon" will
> still be released.
Thanks. I am working at it.
> Given the amount of interest in IF there should still
> be a place for a commercial IF enterprise, and I hope that sometime soon
> the time will be right for a new venture.
I am not giving up. I am closing CMP. CMP was a Hydra: print books,
eBooks, and IF. Next time, it'll be just IF. And there will be a next
time.
> Secondly, on the subject of Dr Dumont's Wild PARTI, I read some time ago
> in Hans Perrson's Adventureland pages that this game was originally
> intended for Infocom.
>
> About it, Hans says:
>
> "This was originally written for Infocom but when they were
> taken over by Activision, all outside projects were cancelled, and
> although the alpha version had been delivered, they returned the
> rights to the game to the authors."
>
> I had no reason to question this until I recently read (somewhat
> belatedly) Stephen Granade's 1999 interview with Mike which suggested
> that Confetti/Chameleon was the cancelled Infocom game, with Dr Dumont
> being a later work always intended for First Row Software.
>
> Mike, to save me having sleepless nights over this, can you shed some
> light on the situation regarding the history of "Dr Dumont"?
Sure, Steve. Here's the story as well as my synapses can remember:
I left Infocom so Muffy and I could start a company called "Brainwave
Creations." This company was supposed to create ideas and designs for
games -- design only. At the time (the mid 1980s), there were more
coders than designers, and we figured we could get out of the coding
business. Be in the architecture business rather than the construction
business.
Broderbund agreed to put us on retainer so I could quit Infocom, and
flew me out to Karlofornia to meet with the Synapse people. Everything
was fine, but when the first check was to appear and did not, I called
and found out that they had fired their VP of Product Development and
the new VP was not at all interested in a design firm. Sigh. So we put
on our creative hats, came up with a frightening concept, and went out
to sell it...
We had an idea for a game, Confetti, which we pitched and sold to
Infocom. It was such a different approach, they signed it on the spot
with just a proposal, came out to meet with us, etc. They were very
excited/shocked about the whole thing. It was a networked story,
character driven, with no puzzles. We started work on it and quickly
realized we were in well over our heads. It was impossible for Muff and
I to wrap our minds around the whole project, and any attempt to
organize it failed. It was like trying to hold a gallon of water in our
bare hands. We had charts covering the walls, story line charts,
character charts, spread sheets, etc., but no matter how we looked at
it, we eventually ended up with a glazed look, staring off into space,
wondering how the hell we could ever get this done. Well, we gave up and
eventually offered to return the money to Infocom, which they
magnanimously refused, and told them that we couldn't figure out how to
design it, never mind code it.
Through the entire Brainwave time period, I was also working on a
ZIL-like language I called IVY whose source code resembled ZIL. I was
planning on using it to write adventures for Broderbund and others, so
by the time we gave up on Confetti, IVY was mostly done.
A few days later, Muff was reading about the search for particle X, and
the thought of making a search for particle X in metaphor seemed like a
cool idea. Particle physics was a big thing at the time. So we planned
out how it might work. We called the project "Rager," with was an
acronym for the device used (the isolation tank linked to the particle
accelerator) to put the character in the sub-atomic world (later renamed
P.A.R.T.I.).
We were approached by Origin Systems, and the Rager concept was pretty
well developed by that time. They signed a three game deal with us for
text adventures, and I started work coding Rager. About two months into
the project, Activision bought Infocom, and Origin figured it would be
nuts to go into the adventure game market when Infocom had failed. (BTW,
Infocom's failure had nothing to do with adventures and everything to do
with their business product, Tombst... er... Cornerstone.)
So, I finished coding Rager, thinking we could sell it somewhere.
When the dust settled at Infocom, we approached them with Rager, now a
playable game. We offered it to make up for blowing the Confetti deal,
and they were thrilled with the idea. They played it, liked it, and
asked me to recode it in ZIL so they could use their interpreter for it.
So I recoded it in ZIL and, the day of delivery, Activision, who had
bought Infocom, canceled all outside projects. Sigh.
A few weeks later I got a call from First Row Software. I should never
have answered the phone. They needed a product. We needed the money. We
already had Rager coded in IVY. Since there were so many Marx Bros.
references in the game, we renamed it Dr. Dumont's Wild PARTI due to
Margaret Dumont, Groucho's "straight man" in so many of their movies.
We didn't know it at the time, but First Row was a tax shelter for some
wealthy people in Phillie, and they had no intentions of marketing the
product. The company went under a few weeks after Dr. D shipped.
Oh, and BTW, Confetti is Chameleon. Rager is Dumont. And my brain hurts.
:)
Best,
-- Mike
mailto: mbe...@cascadepublishing.com
"I want to die peacefully in my sleep, like Grandpa. Not screaming in
terror, like his passengers."
-- Jack Handey
Matthew Murray
> I am not giving up. I am closing CMP. CMP was a Hydra: print books,
> eBooks, and IF. Next time, it'll be just IF. And there will be a next
> time.
...and later:
> We had an idea for a game, Confetti, which we pitched and sold to
> Infocom. It was such a different approach, they signed it on the spot
> with just a proposal, came out to meet with us, etc. They were very
> excited/shocked about the whole thing. It was a networked story,
> character driven, with no puzzles. We started work on it and quickly
> realized we were in well over our heads. It was impossible for Muff and
> I to wrap our minds around the whole project, and any attempt to
> organize it failed. It was like trying to hold a gallon of water in our
> bare hands. We had charts covering the walls, story line charts,
> character charts, spread sheets, etc., but no matter how we looked at
> it, we eventually ended up with a glazed look, staring off into space,
> wondering how the hell we could ever get this done. Well, we gave up and
> eventually offered to return the money to Infocom, which they
> magnanimously refused, and told them that we couldn't figure out how to
> design it, never mind code it.
...and finally:
> Oh, and BTW, Confetti is Chameleon. Rager is Dumont. And my brain hurts.
> :)
I've done my best to follow this thread, but it's possible I may
have missed something. Is Chameleon still on the boards? The way you
described the original Confetti is, I think, extremely provocative, and it
sounds like it could make an utterly fantastic game. If you're still
working on it, and do plan to release it in one form or another, please
let us know, because I will DEFINITELY be interested!
Also, if you're making Dr. Dumont's Wild P.A.R.T.I freeware, can
it be downloaded from GMD, or did you make it available elsewhere? (I
think you may have said something about that earlier, but I couldn't find
it in the thread.)
===============================================================================
Matthew A. Murray - mmu...@cc.wwu.edu - http://www.wwu.edu/~mmurray
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A critical history of computer gaming: | "I'm up among the stars, on earthly
Over 195 computer game reviews, covering | things I frown, I'm throwing off the
games from 1977 to the present! | bars that held me down... Who could
| ask for anything more?"
http://www.wwu.edu/~mmurray/Reviews.html | --The Gershwins, from Crazy for You
===============================================================================
Andrew Plotkin
> Also, if you're making Dr. Dumont's Wild P.A.R.T.I freeware, can
> it be downloaded from GMD, or did you make it available elsewhere? (I
> think you may have said something about that earlier, but I couldn't find
> it in the thread.)
First message, posted by Gunther.
It's at /if-archive/games/zcode/dumont.z5 on gmd.de; the manual and other
documentation are in the same directory.
--Z
"And Aholibamah bare Jeush, and Jaalam, and Korah: these were the
borogoves..."
Michael Berlyn
>
> On Tue, 9 May 2000, Michael Berlyn wrote:
>
> > eBooks, and IF. Next time, it'll be just IF. And there will be a next
> > time.
>
>
> > We had an idea for a game, Confetti, which we pitched and sold to
> > Infocom. It was such a different approach, they signed it on the spot
> > with just a proposal, came out to meet with us, etc. They were very
> > excited/shocked about the whole thing. It was a networked story,
> > character driven, with no puzzles. We started work on it and quickly
> > realized we were in well over our heads. It was impossible for Muff and
> > I to wrap our minds around the whole project, and any attempt to
> > organize it failed. It was like trying to hold a gallon of water in our
> > bare hands. We had charts covering the walls, story line charts,
> > character charts, spread sheets, etc., but no matter how we looked at
> > it, we eventually ended up with a glazed look, staring off into space,
> > wondering how the hell we could ever get this done. Well, we gave up and
> > eventually offered to return the money to Infocom, which they
> > magnanimously refused, and told them that we couldn't figure out how to
> > design it, never mind code it.
>
>
> > Oh, and BTW, Confetti is Chameleon. Rager is Dumont. And my brain hurts.
> > :)
>
> have missed something. Is Chameleon still on the boards? The way you
> described the original Confetti is, I think, extremely provocative, and it
> sounds like it could make an utterly fantastic game. If you're still
> working on it, and do plan to release it in one form or another, please
> let us know, because I will DEFINITELY be interested!
Chameleon is still in the works. And anything I wrote about Confetti
applies to Chameleon as they are one in the same.
And it's not really a game, per se. It's more like... well... a
chameleon. :)
-- Mike
mailto: mbe...@cascadepublishing.com
"No matter where you go, there you are."
-- A lost Mike
Steve Evans
Michael Berlyn <mbe...@cascadepublishing.com> wrote:
> Steve Evans wrote:
>
> > Firstly, I must say that the demise of CMP is very sad, but I was
> > heartened by Mike's comment that the much anticipated "Chameleon"
will
> > still be released.
>
> Thanks. I am working at it.
>
> > Given the amount of interest in IF there should still
> > be a place for a commercial IF enterprise, and I hope that sometime
soon
> > the time will be right for a new venture.
>
> I am not giving up. I am closing CMP. CMP was a Hydra: print books,
> eBooks, and IF. Next time, it'll be just IF. And there will be a next
> time.
>
Thanks for all this info, Mike!! :-) I'll be able to sleep tonight
afterall.
Chameleon sounds fantastic, and well worth the 14 year wait. ;-) You can
sign me up for a copy.
...and best of luck with the new commercial IF venture. If it starts
with Chameleon, I'm sure it can't go wrong.
All the best,
Steve Evans
Michael Berlyn <mbe...@cascadepublishing.com> wrote:
>
> Broderbund agreed to put us on retainer so I could quit Infocom, and
> flew me out to Karlofornia to meet with the Synapse people. Everything
> was fine, but when the first check was to appear and did not, I called
> and found out that they had fired their VP of Product Development and
> the new VP was not at all interested in a design firm. Sigh. So we put
> on our creative hats, came up with a frightening concept, and went out
> to sell it...
The Synapse connection (excuse the pun) was something I hadn't known
before, and the timing of this would have been unfortunate. This was
about the time that Broderbund cancelled the final three of Synapse's
own interactive novels (Ronin, House of Change and Deadly Summer) as
being too racy for the family market.
> Through the entire Brainwave time period, I was also working on a
> ZIL-like language I called IVY whose source code resembled ZIL. I was
> planning on using it to write adventures for Broderbund and others, so
> by the time we gave up on Confetti, IVY was mostly done.
I've seen the IVY version of Dr. Dumont. The parser was pretty good. :-)
Lelah Conrad
<mbe...@cascadepublishing.com> wrote:
>Chameleon is still in the works. ...
>And it's not really a game, per se. It's more like... well... a
>chameleon. :)
I had a chance to play a few minutes of it at Mike's in Bend a couple
of years ago, and I agree with others who want to see it released --
it was very interesting and engrossing! I'm still wondering what
happened to ...
Lelah
Fredrik Ekman
> IIRC, public domain means that you have no rights over it. i.e., I could
> download it, change the name, market it as my own work, and make lots of
> money, all legally.
Actually, about the only thing you CANNOT do to something that is in the
public domain is to claim that you made it yourself. You can sell it for
money, but the author's claim to be the original creator is irrevocable.
> I think you may want to use the word `freeware'
> instead, and look into some open source licenses.
FSF's Copyleft, which is the most common OS license, also allows the
software to be sold for profit. The major difference to PD is that it
requires that the source be released along with the software.
/F