Adnd: Recharging Magic Items
ta...@isuvax.iastate.edu
The other day I was looking through the first edition DMG searching
for recharging information because of the debate. I don't remember what
page the info was on, but it went something like this:
To recharge an item a mage of appropriate level(I think of at least 10)
must prepare a scroll with the spell upon it i.e. for a wand of fireballs a
scroll of fireball. Then the mage must cast an enchant an item spell on
the wand, then use some method to merge the scroll with the wand(the DMG
suggests a limited wish).
Now this method works o.k. for the first edition, but there is a
problem using it in the second edition. I have a second edition mage who
is interested in making some magic items. The problem is he is a specialty
mage evoker who can't use spells from the enchant/charm school. I personally
think there should be a means of making magic items that use magic from his
specialty. My DM tends to agree, however we are unsure how to proceed.
An idea we had was for my evoker to research a spell that would allow the
natural forces of the planes to be channeled into an object, but that basically
would be defeating the purpose of having separate schools. Any suggestions?
Oh, by the way getting an NPC mage to cast the enchant an item isn't really
an option since although my mage(an the entire party) seem to be shifting
to a neutral alignment; they still have a rather nasty reputation from their
wilder more evil days.
Thanks in advance.
--Todd--
Ryk E Spoor
> To recharge an item a mage of appropriate level(I think of at least 10)
>must prepare a scroll with the spell upon it i.e. for a wand of fireballs a
>scroll of fireball. Then the mage must cast an enchant an item spell on
>the wand, then use some method to merge the scroll with the wand(the DMG
>suggests a limited wish).
How utterly disgusting.
They talk about things being "able to be recharged" and then make
the recharging process basically a remake of the creation (substitutin
limited wish for Permanency, and adding a scroll for intermediary).
All I do is say that it can be recharged by any mage who has
been taught how to channel their energies into an item (you could make
it a first level spell if you wanted, "Channeling" or just make it
a skill) and who knows the spell in question... or at least a closely
related spell. To go through THAT much trouble just to recharge it...
it's hardly worth it. I think it should be really tough to MAKE any
magic item, but if it's supposed to be a rechargable one then it
should not be much harder to recharge than a flashlight is; you just need
to find a source of batteries and put them in. The mechanism for
spellcasting, etc, was placed in the wand at its creation.
Sea Wasp
Allan Longley
>
> All I do is say that it can be recharged by any mage who has
>been taught how to channel their energies into an item (you could make
>it a first level spell if you wanted, "Channeling" or just make it
>a skill) and who knows the spell in question... or at least a closely
>related spell.
This is how I've always done recharging. The mage is taught how to recharge
items -- channel spells into items -- at 9th level. Thereafter, the mage
must only know the spell -- or closest proximity -- that the item duplicates.
Therefore, a 9th level mage that knows POLYMORPH OTHER could recharge a wand
of polymorph -- one spell = one charge. For items with multiple abilites,
the mage must be able to cast all the spells in the item to recharge it.
Therefore, a 9th level mage could not recharge a Staff of the Magi because
(s)he cannot cast some of the spells that are contained within the staff.
>I think it should be really tough to MAKE any
>magic item, but if it's supposed to be a rechargable one then it
>should not be much harder to recharge than a flashlight is; you just need
>to find a source of batteries and put them in.
Well, not quite that easy. It does take a highly skilled/powerful mage to
recharge an item -- 9th or above -- and some item even require more
powerful mages.
>The mechanism for spellcasting, etc, was placed in the wand at its creation.
Now, the trick is to not let the item run out of charges, else:
" That's a really fancy walking stick you got there Gandolf.
Ya, it used to be a Staff of Thunder and Lightning, I keep
it to remind me to recharge my other items."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Allan Longley, University of Waterloo, Department of Chemical Engineering
e-mail: lon...@eris.uwaterloo.ca
voice: (519) 885-1211 x3816 Stay, we'll rumage!!!
home: (519) 746-5747
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Allen Wessels
>Doesn't this open up wand use to abuse/munchkinism? All some PC mage has to do
>is lock himself away for awhile (perhaps while other party members are training
>or something) and cast a bunch of recharges into his wand. Even while on the
Any lock a PC can set, a GM can unset. Besides, you can always find a magic
item. Experience is hard to come by. And it is hard to conquer the world
while you are recharging that fireball wand that some decent-level fighter
will end up trick-shooting out of your hand anyway.
>road, the mage could cast a recharge every night before going to sleep - he
Right. In between sleeping, watches, caring for the horses, setting spell
wards, and <gasp> rememorizing. And nothing has been said about what happens
during these tasks.
>could even begin doing this soon after making/finding the wand, so he will
>never (as long as it's used conservatively) run out of charges. Ever have any
>problems like this, or am I way off base? I would add a (small) chance of wand
>damage/destruction with each (or after every few) recharges; maybe even add a
>chance the recharge attempt will fail/backfire/whatever.
A simple device is to require that the mage make a saving throw vs spell to
zap the charge in. Adding a chance of backfire changes the way items are
made. No problem with that, but it sure would be a pain for a player to
find that out after spending all that time developing a mage.
Allan J. Mikkola
> Now this method works o.k. for the first edition, but there is a
>problem using it in the second edition. I have a second edition mage who
>is interested in making some magic items. The problem is he is a specialty
>mage evoker who can't use spells from the enchant/charm school. I personally
>think there should be a means of making magic items that use magic from his
>specialty.
Wait a second, isn't _enchant an item_ also an alteration spell? Now if you
decide spells from two schools come in two different varieties, you can just
use the alteration version. It has always been my opinion that TSR made this
a dual-school spell for this very reason - so all specialists may have access
to it. I mean it's a *very* important spell, so denying access to it for
any specialty school could be crippling.
Of course, if you rule that you must have access to *both* schools, well, then
you're out of luck :-(
Later,
AJ Mikkola
--
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|| Allan J. Mikkola ||
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===========================================================================
Allan J. Mikkola
>In article <157...@unix.cis.pitt.edu> res...@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Ryk E Spoor) writes:
>>
>> All I do is say that it can be recharged by any mage who has
>>been taught how to channel their energies into an item (you could make
>>it a first level spell if you wanted, "Channeling" or just make it
>>a skill) and who knows the spell in question... or at least a closely
>>related spell.
>
>This is how I've always done recharging. The mage is taught how to recharge
>items -- channel spells into items -- at 9th level. Thereafter, the mage
>must only know the spell -- or closest proximity -- that the item duplicates.
>Therefore, a 9th level mage that knows POLYMORPH OTHER could recharge a wand
>of polymorph -- one spell = one charge.
Doesn't this open up wand use to abuse/munchkinism? All some PC mage has to do
is lock himself away for awhile (perhaps while other party members are training
or something) and cast a bunch of recharges into his wand. Even while on the
road, the mage could cast a recharge every night before going to sleep - he
could even begin doing this soon after making/finding the wand, so he will
never (as long as it's used conservatively) run out of charges. Ever have any
problems like this, or am I way off base? I would add a (small) chance of wand
damage/destruction with each (or after every few) recharges; maybe even add a
chance the recharge attempt will fail/backfire/whatever.
Later,
Eric Boyd
a) use three "enchant weapon" spells per charge
b) "research" a new spell
After following this discussion for a while, it seems
most of the people have not read FR4 - The Magistar
- it's still first edition, but it does answer a lot
of questions. There is only about two pages in there
by it's useful. (IMHO) Basically the concept is to
create a ring of xray vision, you must research an
xray vision spell. Why not use this spell all the
time? Perhaps the material component is a 2' x 4' by 6"
slab of lead. Likewise, to recharge a staff of striking,
one could research a spell "enchant staff to strike"
with some ridiculous material component to prevent
its use in actual adventuring except for recharging.
Or assume the "recharging" spell might be useful in
adventuring, but is merely currently "lost" to the
common knowledge.
Just a thought.
Jason Haar, Network Consultant, CSC
> How utterly disgusting.
> They talk about things being "able to be recharged" and then make
> the recharging process basically a remake of the creation (substitutin
> limited wish for Permanency, and adding a scroll for intermediary).
Yeah, the whole issue of recharging items is terrible - 99% of effort should go
into creating one - not recharging.
I rule that a MU 'just' has to cast Enchant an Item (EaI) on the item to be
recharged (with all that entails - only difference being that there is _no_
chance of failure) - followed by the spells to be sucked within. I say that EaI
alters magic around the spell caster so that any spell they cast whilst it is
in effect is directed _as_a_charge_ to the item so directed. If the spell
caster is attacked while in this state, I'd allow them to throw away the item
and thus break the EaI spell - allowing them normal attack facilities the
next round.
I personally rule creation of weapons/armour/protective items as follows:
Level Pluses Spells Required
12th: +1 enchant an item, enchant weapon
14th: +2 same as above
16th: +3 same as above, permanency
18th: +3 plus same as above
20th: +4 same as above, wish
22nd: +4 plus same as above
25th: +5 same as above
N.B the 'plus' refers to weapons with special powers like a frostbrand/etc.
I'd rule the +1 sword of sharpness as being '+3 plus' and a vorpal weapon as +5
(be honest - what'd you rather have, a +5 sword or a +3 vorpal weapon...).
The above is only a guide, I'd also say that to create a +1 weapon requires the
blood of a creature that requires a +1 weapon to hit, and must be forged by the
light of the silvery moon (the silvery moooon! ;-) - or whatever the DM
decides.
My chart would allow MU's to start producing weapons at only 12th level -
but I don't think you'd find that to unbalance a world - let's face it - there
shouldn't be that many characters over 3rd level really (unless your campaign
is pretty wild).
Jason
pan...@st1.vuw.ac.nz
> On how to recharge a magic "staff of striking" ...
> After following this discussion for a while, it seems
> most of the people have not read FR4 - The Magistar
> - it's still first edition, but it does answer a lot
> of questions. There is only about two pages in there
> by it's useful. (IMHO) Basically the concept is to
> create a ring of xray vision, you must research an
> xray vision spell. Why not use this spell all the
> time? Perhaps the material component is a 2' x 4' by 6"
> slab of lead. Likewise, to recharge a staff of striking,
> one could research a spell "enchant staff to strike"
> with some ridiculous material component to prevent
> its use in actual adventuring except for recharging.
IMHO, this is one of the best ways to do it-but rather than 'ridiculous'
components, why not use, say, conditions keyed to patricular times and places-
'Fireball can only be recharged in the Place of The Everlasting Flame' or
one of those silly fantasy names we feel uncomfortable with :^)
>
> Or assume the "recharging" spell might be useful in
> adventuring, but is merely currently "lost" to the
> common knowledge.
>
Again, a good way to do it, because this also sets the scope for adventures.
It would also have the useful effect that, when a wand, et al, is most useful
to a character, the difficulties involved in recharging would be sevre
given their lower level of power, but when such challenges become relatively
trivial, so has the item
> Just a thought.
Rodger
Jonah H Cohen
Okay, but... how would you recharge an item that doesn't do spell
type stuff.
Ex: The Staff of Striking. (See magic items, 1st ed. DMG.) It's a
quarterstaff that's always @ +3 to hit. The damage bonus uses charges.
Each charge you expend gives a +3 on damage, max of 3 charges/pop.
It's listed as having a limited #, but being recharageable.
?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
Praxis
Allan Longley
>>
>>This is how I've always done recharging. The mage is taught how to recharge
>>items -- channel spells into items -- at 9th level. Thereafter, the mage
>>must only know the spell -- or closest proximity -- that the item duplicates.
>>Therefore, a 9th level mage that knows POLYMORPH OTHER could recharge a wand
>>of polymorph -- one spell = one charge.
>
>Doesn't this open up wand use to abuse/munchkinism? All some PC mage has to do
>is lock himself away for awhile (perhaps while other party members are training
>or something) and cast a bunch of recharges into his wand. Even while on the
>road, the mage could cast a recharge every night before going to sleep - he
>could even begin doing this soon after making/finding the wand, so he will
>never (as long as it's used conservatively) run out of charges. Ever have any
>problems like this, or am I way off base? I would add a (small) chance of wand
>damage/destruction with each (or after every few) recharges; maybe even add a
>chance the recharge attempt will fail/backfire/whatever.
Well first of all, the mage never knows exactly how many charges are in the
wand. If (s)he overcharges it -- KKKAABBOOMM !!! This is one danger.
(S)he may also accidentally use it up -- "nice stick you got there".
Second -- which I forgot to mention -- is that the item must be prepared.
Not magical preparation, but something like an identify spell. This
preparation requires a lab -- not a full lab, say a 10,000 gp lab, which is
a one time expence.
Wands, staffs, etc., -- actually all character travelling possessions -- are
subject to attrition due to combat, theft, etc. An adventuring party comes
across alot of magic items over a lifetime, but they also lose alot.
Also, Wands, staffs, & rods have less of a chance of succeeding than spells
-- ie., they are easier to save against -- and a high level mage will have
realized this.
And finaaly, I have considered adding a temporary constituion loss for
recharging items -- say 1 point per charge, regaining 1 point per day. But,
I haven't run into munchkin problems yet, their always too busy adventuring.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Allan Longley, University of Waterloo, Department of Chemical Engineering
e-mail: lon...@eris.uwaterloo.ca
voice: (519) 885-1211 x3816 Was that you?
home: (519) 746-5747
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Allan Longley
The Staff of Striking is recharged using the spell Enchant an Item, one
spell equals one charge. Therefore it would take a 12th level mage to
recharge a Staff of Striking.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Allan Longley, University of Waterloo, Department of Chemical Engineering
e-mail: lon...@eris.uwaterloo.ca
voice: (519) 885-1211 x3816 What do you mean; He's keeping it.
home: (519) 746-5747
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Allen Wessels
>The Staff of Striking is recharged using the spell Enchant an Item, one
>spell equals one charge. Therefore it would take a 12th level mage to
>recharge a Staff of Striking.
I doesn't think so. That isn't what Enchant an Item is all about. The spell
that charges an item really ought to have something to do with the function
of that item.
Enchanted Weapon is the spell that gives a weapon "+"s. The staff is a +3
weapon, so you'd need 3 per charge. Just to zing a little spin on the
process, I'd require that the mage save 3 times in a row for the Enchanted
Weapon spells (3) to complete a given charge.
Of course, the DMG says that the mage can never know whether the save is
successful or not. (The words never, impossible, and always are immediate
clues to BS rules.)
Francois Menneteau
>never (as long as it's used conservatively) run out of charges. Ever have any
>problems like this, or am I way off base? I would add a (small) chance of wand
>damage/destruction with each (or after every few) recharges; maybe even add a
>chance the recharge attempt will fail/backfire/whatever.
According to ADD v1 rules :
Each time you put some charges into a wand, the MU must successesfully
save versus spell. If it fails, the wand explodes. So It is quite impossible
for a low level MU to recharge an item.
--
Francois Menneteau () __|||||__ () "... I had their lives in my hands
================== () /O O\ () their fate their fortune in my visions
ir...@imag.fr () - .|. - () No one believed in my true prophecy
================== () \=^=/ () And now it's too late." (Iron Maiden)
Allen Wessels
>According to ADD v1 rules :
>Each time you put some charges into a wand, the MU must successesfully
>save versus spell. If it fails, the wand explodes. So It is quite impossible
>for a low level MU to recharge an item.
What a bogus answer. Post the page number and book in which this rule is
stated. (Hint: you can't.)
Geez, people. AD&D has enough problems without giving stuff like this to
critics.
Matthew Goodall
must make a save vs spells at -1 (the same save as the caster),
or be destroyed (it does NOT explode) however, evil DMs might make
the wand cursed instead. :^> :^>
Also for those trying to recharge a staff of striking there was a
3rd or 4th level Cleric spell in Basic D&D called Striking however
I dont have the stats for it.
Matt Goodall
S89...@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au
Ryk E Spoor
>is lock himself away for awhile (perhaps while other party members are training
>or something) and cast a bunch of recharges into his wand. Even while on the
>road, the mage could cast a recharge every night before going to sleep - he
>could even begin doing this soon after making/finding the wand, so he will
>never (as long as it's used conservatively) run out of charges. Ever have any
>problems like this, or am I way off base? I would add a (small) chance of wand
>damage/destruction with each (or after every few) recharges; maybe even add a
>chance the recharge attempt will fail/backfire/whatever.
Hmm. I don't see that as a problem. That's WHY he recharges a wand, eh?
So that he can use it as a regular weapon! Most mages are not melee-death
machines in close combat. Instead they like the "automatic weapons" approach.
"I stay back and fire magic missiles from my wand into the orcs". It's TOUGH
to get a good wand or staff; when you have one, you naturally want to use it
and keep using it. It's like the fighter who gets a really good sword with
good enchantments: he gets used to using it and it becomes a reliable mainstay
of his offense and defense. So it is with the mage; certain of his magical
items become almost trademarks, and are something that he can always rely on
in situations where his mana may be depleted, or even where he'd just rather
save his own magical power for what may lie ahead which the wand may not
be able to deal with.
Sea Wasp
Ryk E Spoor
I generally just rate that as putting in raw spell power (with
the charge option!) and decide how many spell levels/mana points it
equates to. Since 3 points is about average for one die of damage,
I'd say that each Striking charge equals one spell level of power (or 1.5
mana points) and require the mage to put in that much.
Sea Wasp
/^\
:::
Francois Menneteau
>In article <24...@imag.imag.fr> ir...@imag.imag.fr (Francois Menneteau) writes:
>
>>According to ADD v1 rules :
>>Each time you put some charges into a wand, the MU must successesfully
>>save versus spell. If it fails, the wand explodes. So It is quite impossible
>>for a low level MU to recharge an item.
>
>What a bogus answer. Post the page number and book in which this rule is
>stated. (Hint: you can't.)
SORRY. It was in the DMG v2 p88.
Rodent of Unusual Size
I've lost the original post, but I personally like the previously-
mentioned idea of using _Enchant an Item_ to pave the way for recharging
an item, followed by casting the appropriate spells (e.g., multiple
_Fireball_ spells for a _Wand of Fireballs_). This way, low-level
characters can't do it themselves, but must pay to do it - and high-level
characters must pay for it, too, in terms of time away from adventuring.
I think I would remove the requirement that a saving throw be cast; once
an item has been successfully ensorcelled, it's `primed.'
Of course, there is a precedent for the *level* of spell being the
key thing: the _Rod of Absorption_ and the _Staff of the Magi_. Both of
these are rechargable by laymen, simply by casting spells at them after
willing them to receive. So a case could be made that *any* third-level
spell would add a charge to a _Wand of Fireballs_, since _Fireball_ is a
third-level spell.
My wife and I both have magic-rich worlds, but that seems to make it more
enjoyable. For instance, Jeratol the Chaotic, my 9th-level magic user
(which I run in *her* world) has magic items out the wazoo (including
three _Rings of Elemental Command_ and a _Staff of the Magi_) - but she
still has no trouble confounding him. Stirges are his bane, for instance.
#ken :-)}
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Operator
|>
|> The other day I was looking through the first edition DMG searching
|> for recharging information because of the debate. I don't remember what
|> page the info was on, but it went something like this:
|> To recharge an item a mage of appropriate level(I think of at least 10)
|> must prepare a scroll with the spell upon it i.e. for a wand of fireballs a
|> scroll of fireball. Then the mage must cast an enchant an item spell on
|> the wand, then use some method to merge the scroll with the wand(the DMG
|> suggests a limited wish).
As I recall... the Enchant-an-item requires a friendly extraplanar, eg Slaad,
or a friendly mage (perhaps yourself) of 12th+ level, the limited wish,
however, costs you a bigger extraplanar critter or a friendly 14th+ level
mage. 10th isn't worth very much at recharging, except putting the speel into
the prepared item.
|> Now this method works o.k. for the first edition, but there is a
|> problem using it in the second edition.
[brevity inserted...]
|> Oh, by the way getting an NPC mage to cast the enchant an item isn't really
|> an option since although my mage(an the entire party) seem to be shifting
|> to a neutral alignment; they still have a rather nasty reputation from their
|> wilder more evil days.
I can here the mission now...
The mages who are capable of helping you, and their Paladin-like friends, are
going to charge you a high price (in pennance, not pence) to earn your help.
For this reason if no other, the research should fail, and hiring be essential.
|> Thanks in advance.
|> --Todd--
ro...@kazoo.ssd.loral.com (finally, a mail address that doen't bounce!)
Allen Wessels
>SORRY. It was in the DMG v2 p88.
Well, I shouldn't have been so crabby about it. I have a bunch of the 2nd
Edition stuff and could have figured that reference out too.
The way to tell 2nd Edition stuff from first is in how the mid levels have been
changed. Open-ended spells have been capped, creating magic items has been
bumped up a couple of levels (potions and scrolls), and in general, the power
level of magic has dropped.
As near as I can tell, all those changes have been made to prop up incompetent
DMs who can't deal with higher level characters.
Marc R.
>In article <53...@ut-emx.uucp> awes...@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Allen Wessels) writes:
>>In article <24...@imag.imag.fr> ir...@imag.imag.fr (Francois Menneteau) writes:
>>
>>>According to ADD v1 rules :
>>>Each time you put some charges into a wand, the MU must successesfully
>>>save versus spell. If it fails, the wand explodes. So It is quite impossible
>>>for a low level MU to recharge an item.
>>
>>What a bogus answer. Post the page number and book in which this rule is
And as long as you are going to play 'rules lawyer' here, let's
ALSO quote the DMG correctly. On page 89, the item crubles
into dust, not blow up in your face.
(minor quibble, but hey, what's UseNet without constant corrections?)
--
Marc Rassbach ma...@marque.mu.edu If you take my advice, that
MS-DOS - it's not ma...@milestn.mke.wi.us is your problem, not mine!
my problem! If it was said on UseNet, it must be true.
Unix - It's a nice place to live, but you don't want to visit there.
David_Moursund
of hack and slash), to recharge an item you must cast 'enchant
an item' on it, and then you have 24 hours to cast spells into
it, which are stored as charges (ie. fireballs or burning hands
or wall of fire into a wand of fire, etc.)
Since it takes a 12th level wizard to cast enchant an item,
this service doesn't come cheap.
dm