Town Campaign
Pat Calhoun
I've got a question to all of the experienced GM'er out there. When
taking a party through a town/city, how much detail does one go into??
Do you spend some adventures in some towns?? Or do you find it's too
difficult to spend a full adventure in the town/city??
When entering a shop, does one have to name every item for sale (which
probably means setting up all of the shops beforehand). How does one
interact with the shopkeeper?? Ideally, role-playing the shop keeper
would make the game more believable, but the town I'm talking about
has a HELL of a population rate (imagine how many shops exist!!)
Also, considering all of the people who exist in this town, The party
will see but not interact with most of them (except for the stray which
show up on the random check), so this won't be a problem.
I'd appreciate if you'd explain how YOU deal with shops in you're
town adventures.
"The opinions expressed herein do not necessarily reflect the views of
the author, the cleaning staff, or the President of the United States."
_^_ ||| Pat "King of the Trenches" Calhoun
<o o> | Technical Support Group, AT&T Canada Inc.
/\/\/\/\ MAIL: attmail!pcalhoun
Charles Jacob Cohen
How do you handle town encounters?? Good question!
First, set up the major areas of interest first, where you know the
characters will most probably go (like the Mayor's house, a specific
tavern if they were told to look for one). Then set up major portions
of the town, like the poor quarter, the merchants area, the docks, etc.
Second, aside from planned encounters, just wing it! Give the flavor
of the area, and then make it up as you go along. For example:
GM: You have just strolled through the gates of Perador. The main street
seems to be a bustle of activity, with all types of people ranging from
beggers to noblemen. You see various shops, inns, taverns, and other buildings
made mostly out of brick stretching of in the distance, and many intersecting
streets.
Player: Are there any inns?
GM: [marks down the inns' names and approximate location] Yes, immediately
on the left side of the rode, next to a stable, is the "Inn of the Axe and
Shield" and you note that the sign is faded, and one of the windows is boarded
up. Further down on the right side of the road is the "The Grumpy Dwarf Inn,"
but you can't make out many details at this angle.
Player: Is there a tavern nearby?
GM: You don't see one, but there is a beggar limping toward you thrusting a
bowl in your face. Perhaps you could ask him?...
And just continue like that. Make a list of names for taverns and such,
but if they are looking for a grain store, then let them find it.
Good luck! - Chuck Cohen
Purple dragons! EVERYWHERE!!!
In article <12...@attcan.UUCP> pcal...@attcan.UUCP (Pat Calhoun) writes:
(questions about town stuff deleted)
Don't bother writing up what your shops do and don't have. Wait til the
players ask for something, then decide. If you need to make up a new
shop (because none of the ones they know of would carry the item), go
for it. And don't be afraid to make them look in two or three shops for
something before they find it...
As for town encounters that don't really have anything to do with the plot,
throw in about one per session (assuming a session is less than six hours).
This will help increase the atmosphere of the town without bogging down play
too much.
Hope this helps...
==GROWF!
Paul J. Hinker
I've taken lots of parties through, into and around towns and yes,
I think you can spend entire adventures in towns that are not completely
'fleshed-out'.
As for filling the shops before-hand --- I, personally, don't do it.
Ranger : I want to go to the weapons shop.
Dm : Okay, you're there.
Ranger : Do I see any composite bows?
Dm : Yes
Ranger : I'll ask the shop keeper if he/she has one that will take
advantage of my strength.
Depending on the size of the town/city, I assign a chance that this
particular shop carries that particular type of special weapon. Roll
the dice and answer yes or no.
I've found that most players are either going to ask for very general
things (i.e. a pound of flour, score of arrows, etc.) or completely
outrageous things (+5 vorpal sword, Cloak of Slay All Enemies, etc.)
and it's easy to say whether or not your shop will have the requested
item.
As far as prices go, I have my NPC's look at how the PC is dressed.
Does he have nice armor/weapons/mounts? Does anyone he/she is with
have nice/expensive things? If so, charge through the nose. My
worlds are, after all, based on a barter economy. If the shop keep
thinks he/she can charge 20 gp for a score of wooden arrows, by golly
that's what the price will be.
Just my $.02
--
Paul Hinker --- MS-287 : Hin...@ACL.Lanl.gov : Phone : 665-1907
Acl E-Mail : hin...@acl.lanl.gov :: Beta E-mail : p...@beta.lanl.gov
**** --- If it works, it's not state-of-the-art. Chuck Hansen
Jon Bonnell
>
>
>
>taking a party through a town/city, how much detail does one go into??
>Do you spend some adventures in some towns?? Or do you find it's too
>difficult to spend a full adventure in the town/city??
By all means spend as much time in the city/town as plyers want. It's
not a waste. Forcing the players to stay in the town can be though.
>When entering a shop, does one have to name every item for sale (which
>probably means setting up all of the shops beforehand). How does one
>interact with the shopkeeper?? Ideally, role-playing the shop keeper
>would make the game more believable, but the town I'm talking about
>has a HELL of a population rate (imagine how many shops exist!!)
I don't set up any shops in advance maybe than establishing what types
of shops might be found (since the town you are speaking of is rather
large just decide where these shops will be as most types will probably
exist, am I right?). I role play each shop keeper as best I can (being
an actor helps some). There is no need to establish character sheets for
each of these NPCs. Just vocally role play them. Your players won't
know if you made this person up before hand or not and it shouldn't
matter (unless of course they try to kill him).
>Also, considering all of the people who exist in this town, The party
>will see but not interact with most of them (except for the stray which
>show up on the random check), so this won't be a problem.
>
>I'd appreciate if you'd explain how YOU deal with shops in you're
>town adventures.
Like I said, I role play each shop as the players encounter it. Usually in
large cities I let the players decide what they are looking for and provide it
one way or the other. If the seek a general store I let them find it (ask
questions, etc) and then wing it. Don't rely on pre made everything when its
not that necessary. Develope your adventures and things that are pertainent
to the game. Filler is filler and just try and wing it as best you can. One
way I overcame this in the beginning was to fill out note cards with
store names and types and propriators. Even stats some times. I would generate
whole towns out of randomly picked cards from this pile. It works as long
as you don't repeat yourself too often.
Jon Bonnell
John Bellando
>taking a party through a town/city, how much detail does one go into??
>Do you spend some adventures in some towns?? Or do you find it's too
>difficult to spend a full adventure in the town/city??
The way I work it is to go into as much detail as possible. Let me
explain: If I know that the players are going to want to train, I
very briefly outline the types of training halls, mentors etc. that
will be available. If the city is large, as yours seems to be, there
should be no problem with anyone finding someone to train them, unless
of course they are playing an Illiterate Snow Barbarian from the tundra
regions to the north! I will usually write down names for the PC's
trainers (if there is a possibility that they will meet them later
on). Also, I will have a few NPC's there for the character's to meet
and talk to about recent events (possibly a future adventure).
>When entering a shop, does one have to name every item for sale (which
>probably means setting up all of the shops beforehand). How does one
>interact with the shopkeeper?? Ideally, role-playing the shop keeper
>would make the game more believable, but the town I'm talking about
>has a HELL of a population rate (imagine how many shops exist!!)
If the characters are there to buy goods and restock, then I jot down
a few of the more prominent stores and their owner's names. This way
if the playres want the best, it is available. However, if the PC's
want some rare, slightly illegal or just plain weird items, then you
must make some shop up. (Either an 'antique' shop, a shady weaponsmith,
or a curios shop). Town squares or open markets are good for this
kind of buying. Then, depending on the location in town (poor, rich
or merchant section) I roughly role-play each shop keep with my
voice or manner (taking notes for later on). Usually the players
can always buy any item in the Players Handbook or any of the new
Handbook's (be careful with the items and prices in the Thieves
Manual though).
As for adventures, hey improvise and let your imagination flow. For
instance, an entire adventure could revolve around a theft which
occurred while one of the character's was in a store (and he/she could
be blamed for it for added excitement). this could lead the players
to prove their innocence, because in most medieval societies they are
guilty until proven innocent. Other adventures could arise if the
thief in the party tries to steal something, the bard tries to sing
for money without a license or permission from the bard's guild, or
if the mage casts spells which terrify the inhabitants.
Another personal favorite is the alchemist, who can send the players
on hunts for rare and magical ingredients for a potion or magical
item.
Remember towns and cities are full of wondrous people and sights;
they are good places for the characters to interact with others; they
are also good places for the DM to relieve PC's of excess wealth;
and they are limited only by your imagination!
Hope that this helps
> Pat "King of the Trenches" Calhoun
*-------------------------*------------------------------------------*
| John Bellando | Internet: bell...@snuffy.lerc.nasa.gov |
|-------------------------*------------------------------------------*
|"Never Forget: Wherever you go, there you are!" |
| -Someone more profound than myself |
*--------------------------------------------------------------------*
--
Pat Calhoun
>
> As for town encounters that don't really have anything to do with the plot,
> throw in about one per session (assuming a session is less than six hours).
> This will help increase the atmosphere of the town without bogging down play
> too much.
>
For town encounters, I have generated myself a random encounter table which
I will periodically check. However, in certain parts of town where the city
guards don't venture when it is dark, I have a seperate table and the checks
will be made more often. I also have a seperate one for the Noble part of
town. But in a large town such as mine, how do you ensure that the player's
meet a planned encounter?? The party must meet four people which will give
them four very specific clues. Should these NPCs pop-up anywhere in town??
I was kind of hoping to have the players meet these NPCs in their lair.
I could always have someone talk about this GREAT tavern which is where one
of the four people will be. This should work!!
Robert Plamondon
> Ranger : I want to go to the weapons shop.
> Dm : Okay, you're there.
> Ranger : Do I see any composite bows?
> Dm : Yes
> Ranger : I'll ask the shop keeper if he/she has one that will take
> advantage of my strength.
> Depending on the size of the town/city, I assign a chance that this
> particular shop carries that particular type of special weapon. Roll
> the dice and answer yes or no.
I see a few problems with this. It ignores how things like weapons
are actually purchased, it doesn't recognize the non-commodity nature
of goods in a pre-modern society, and it's dull.
My wife became interested in archery and bought a composite bow a
couple of years ago. She drove around to a couple of sporting goods
stores, which had nothing of interest. She drove around to a bunch
of archery shops and had better luck. She tried out a whole bunch of
bows. No one had bows that fit her, so she had to use bows that were
too long and guess how they'd feel if they were the right size. She
finally made a selection, and the shop special-ordered her bow.
Now, this was for a MODERN bow: factory-made, with a catalog number;
any two bows of the same type would be pretty much the same. Archery
shops have catalogs for most of the bows made today in the world.
Modern bows are reliable, durable, and long-lived.
In a pre-industrial society, you could still count on the weapons
shop not having exactly what you wanted. But finding the right thing
will be harder. The quality and origin of most goods will be
questionable. Most goods have only a limited distribution, so people
in one town may be unaware of a fantastically talented boyer who
lives only 50 miles away. The lack of modern materials makes the
issue of proper care and maintenence doubly important -- especially
for something like a composite bow, where the horn, sinew, wood, and
glue are all subject to aging; where leaning it against a wall
(instead of hanging it on pegs) will cause it to warp; where age or
exposure to moisture will cause it to weaken and delaminate.
Given the variability of goods, the "book" statistics for weapons
should be taken only a medians. If I were running a pre-modern D&D
game, mundane weapons would vary from -4 to +2 or +3, while magic
ones would vary from -5 to +5, and many weapons would have unusual
features. This encourages an interest in craftsmanship and in
finding weapons in ways not related to looting bodies.
-- Robert
--
Robert Plamondon
rob...@weitek.COM
Owen Reynolds
Maybe I've only noticed this since I play in several campaigns at once,
but there is a tendancy for all cities to have that same r.p.g. sameness.
This is probably as hold-over from the days when the town was the place
you paid 1 gp/hitpoint between adventures.
Things I have done or seen done: Foreigners are confined to a small section
of town. You need to know someone/make a roll/... to get more general access.
Inns don't exist. If you have business with someone, stay with them; if not,
why are you in town?
Police-type protection is non-existant in the wrong parts of town.
I've got a whole checklist of things I used to go through:
universal military training? city watch are militia, private armies, or mercs?
bribery is considered proper? how concerned about spies/shock troops?
what underground organizations?
Any one thing to make it differ from the generic frp town can add a lot.
Quick example from D&D: We got stuck in a town where the assassin's guild
was the most popular and powerful organization. There were NO written rules,
and only one penalty for breaking an unwritten one.
Pendragon: Needed some info in a Saxon town. The one Saxon with us was a
pig even for a Saxon, and none of our usual methods worked. Finally, one knight
decided to get an entire inn drunk for 3 nights in a row. That did the trick.
(you have to know Pendragon for that one--in general, buying drinks is a bad
idea.)
DON'T do what we used to do. DON'T start all your adventures in 'Town Town.'
Robert Plamondon
>
>taking a party through a town/city, how much detail does one go into??
You have to give enough detail to orient the players. In particular,
the size, apparent wealth, apparent degree of lawlessness, and the
reaction of people on the street to the player characters should
always be given. Town and city adventures work better if the GM has
a map. I recommend plagiarizing everything from real maps (this goes
double for wilderness adventures. Use topo maps and ignore the
freeways). For medieval towns, use aerial photos of old towns in
National Geographic. Use any tricks you can think of.
>Do you spend some adventures in some towns?? Or do you find it's too
>difficult to spend a full adventure in the town/city??
Adventures in the city are a piece of cake. Instead of monsters, you
have gangsters and cops. Getting into a fight may lead to arrest,
turning the emphasis from action-adventure to courtroom drama. Most
players have never had a character hanged. It would be a new
experience for them.
>When entering a shop, does one have to name every item for sale (which
>probably means setting up all of the shops beforehand).
No. When a real person goes into a shop, he is not barraged with an
itemized list of its contents. He gets an impression of the goods on
display, and notices isolated objects that grab his attention.
That's all you should report to a player; that and the appearance of
the building and the people in it.
> How does one
>interact with the shopkeeper??
By role-playing.
> Ideally, role-playing the shop keeper
>would make the game more believable, but the town I'm talking about
>has a HELL of a population rate (imagine how many shops exist!!)
It doesn't matter. Role-playing is what the game's about.
I don't populate towns in advance, except for a handful of notables.
The rest of the population is created on demand, during play. If
people want to go to a weapons shop, I create one on the spot, invent
a shopkeeper, decide whether he lives on the premises (and, if so, if
he has any family members kicking around -- like beautiful daughters
or younger sons who yearn for adventure), and decide what sort of
shop it is.
A "weapons shop" could be a pawn shop with a number of cheapo used
weapons in it, or a caravan outfitter, a military supplier, a cop
shop, a weapon-maker's workshop, a salvage yard, a magic shop, a
stall at the bazaar, a person who heard you're in the market for a
weapon and has just the thing, and so on. Even if it's what you'd
normally think of as a weapons shop (the renaissance equivalent of a
gun shop), it probably specializes in something: military weapons,
civilian weapons, fancy court weapons, hunting and trapping gear,
etc.
Anyway, I just pick something. Anything. If the character doesn't
like it, he'll try again, and I'll make up something else. (I'll
also write down something about the shop, since once created, it
should be made permanent.)
An example:
Player (as Jen Erik Figher): "There any weapons shops around here?"
GM: "You haven't noticed any."
Jen: "Bartender! There any weapons shops around here?"
GM (as Bartender): "Yes, indeed, sir. What did you have in mind?"
Jen: "I'm looking for a replacement for this." [Pulls a bowcase out
of his duffel bag, puts it on the table, opens it. Inside are the
broken pieces of what used to be a finely wrought composite bow of
unusual size]
Bartender: [Picks up one of the pieces reverently, puts it back.]
"What a pity. I would say, sir, that nothing in this town could
compare to such a bow -- but Old John might make one for you, if he
takes a liking to you."
[You see how it goes. Old John lives outside of town, in the eaves
of the Old Forest. He is a famous boyer, but doesn't make many bows
these days, and never makes them in advance; he always builds them to
the measure of his customer. He's suspicious, cantankerous, and not
liked by his neighbors. It might be difficult to get him to accept a
commission -- especially if Jen makes a pass at Old John's
granddaughter.]
Shops? Shops are neat. They're often interesting in their own
right, they have Neat Stuff in them, and they provide adventure
hooks; based on what's in them, and on what's not.
Pat Calhoun
>
> No. When a real person goes into a shop, he is not barraged with an
> itemized list of its contents. He gets an impression of the goods on
> display, and notices isolated objects that grab his attention.
> That's all you should report to a player; that and the appearance of
> the building and the people in it.
>
Hmmm. Never met my wife(tm), have you??
Arlo Crymble
gaming experiences. The city provides one of the largest
gamuts of role-playing possibilities. The city itself
could be basically controlled by a counsel of lawful
good NPC's or it might be under the control of some
utimately evil persona who is partially insane to make
matters worse...other possibilities include the acceptance
of magic--maybe it is common in the city or maybe the townfolk
disdain its use and mob spellcasters and drown them like
witches.
As for shops, once again there is a wide variety of
variations. Many have been mentioned in previous
articles so I won't expand on those. One idea I have
though is from a magazine call "Polyhedron". In it
at the rear is a recurring article called the Living
City. The Living City is composed of submitions of
favorite stores, NPC's, or any other related material
to the City. People constantly send in more of their
ideas and the city grows.
How about starting a NetCity?
Arlo Crymble
<mhas...@zephyr.cair.du.edu>
Disclaimer: Who's opinion was that?
wayne wallace
>How about starting a NetCity?
>Arlo Crymble
><mhas...@zephyr.cair.du.edu>
>Disclaimer: Who's opinion was that?
>
We HAVE a city!
It is called Tabolport, set in a {AD&D,Rolemaster,etc} type area.
check the Welcome to Rec.games.frp posting for ftp access.
Maybe we need a futuristic city ?
Nahhh....we'd never agree on what tech is there unless....
Hey! A GURPS Space city, or a CyberPunk/Shadowrun city ?
Wayne
Joel Lovell
><lot of stuff deleted> being an actor helps...
>
>Jon Bonnell
Do you think you could write a few pointers on things the GM could do
to protray different NPC's encountered? I know the old standby of giving
each NPC a "swagger, a snicker, or a snort" to make them be recognizable,
but how about a few simple tips on "potraying" these PEOPLE.
Thanks
Joel
Robert Plamondon
>meet a planned encounter??
You don't. You can do things to make it very, very likely, but to
ENSURE it you have to lead the players by the nose (a painful and
embarrassing procedure.)
>The party must meet four people which will give
>them four very specific clues.
By doing so, you've created a fragile scenario. By making
the clue structure less rigid you'd make your life a whole lot easier.
> Should these NPCs pop-up anywhere in town??
>I was kind of hoping to have the players meet these NPCs in their lair.
The NPCs should be played in chracter. They can only be met in
places they'd go to.
Matthew Presley
I need to known the full name for the author's of these
spells. Please email me the author's name and the spells
by the author. Thanks...
Note that this is not the complete list of spells in the
Net Spellbook. These are only the spells that I don't
know the author.
Level 1 Spells:
Cat Spirit
Frost Touch
Small Fire Ball
Spirit Command
Level 2 Spells:
Acid Water
Ahshay's Mystic Mutable Aura
Bigby's Groping Fingers
Cloud Walk
Detect Spirit
Dispel Silence
Dust Warriors
Expose Magic
Improved Detect Magic
Malta's Pattern Creation
Malta's Pattern Image
Mimicry
Noise Filter
Petition
Plane Source
Protection from Enchantment
Resist Paralysis
Veschiul's Shadowcurse
Veschiul's Shadowbolt
Level 3 Spells:
Astral Wall
Free Action
Hold Spirit
Improved Armour
Malta's Pattern Transport
Marty's Magic Bow
Rathe's Trigger
Spirit Call
Stren's Improved Floating Disk
Tenser's Deadly Strike
Level 4 Spells:
Bergil's Fire Bolt
Branit's Backstabbing Surprise
Improved Magic Mouth
Negative Bolt
Rathe's Mage Lock
Shadow Wall
Sleep II
Spirit Skill
Steal Skill
Time Warp
View Past
Level 5 Spells:
5-Mile Carrier
Blizzard
Deflect Normal Weapon Attacks
Greenfire
High-Energy Lightning Bolt
Improved Fire Ball
Meillikhom's Room of Seclusion
Rathe's Contingency Trigger
Summon Warrior
Level 6 Spells:
Lich's Palm
Lorth's Stasis
Mass Teleport
Replay
Teleport Trap
Level 7 Spells:
Deflect Magic Weapon Attacks
Eye of the Beholder
Mind Find
Prismatic Beam
Stash
Summon Wizard
Zandere's Twist
Level 8 Spells:
Long-Range Carrier
Lorth's Sending
Stargate
Teleport Warp
Level 9 Spells:
Fenzill's Phantasmal Fingers
Lazzaro's Murderous Sword
Lorth's Translocation
Magic Swarm
Nuke
Symmetry
--
----------------------------------------------------------------
Matthew Presley (UCLA CS Grad. Student) & (JPL CS dude)
Internet (pre...@cs.ucla.edu) or (ma...@sapphire.jpl.nasa.gov)
"Twisted yellow puppies play loudly broken flutes..."
Mary K. Kuhner;335 Mulford
>In article <12...@attcan.UUCP> pcal...@attcan.UUCP (Pat Calhoun) writes:
>> But in a large town such as mine, how do you ensure that the player's
>>meet a planned encounter??
>You don't. You can do things to make it very, very likely, but to
>ENSURE it you have to lead the players by the nose (a painful and
>embarrassing procedure.)
And even if you do lead them by the nose, they may get away, especially
if the players realize what is happening. It's human nature to resent
being manipulated, and some players will go to *amazing* lengths to make
sure they don't "do what the GM wants."
You also risk having the players make calculations along the lines of
"the GM wants us to go here," which are bad for roleplaying and even
worse if the players are wrong--they'll tend to feel betrayed. (What
do you mean, we went the wrong way? We were following your clues!)
>>The party must meet four people which will give them four very specific clues.
>By doing so, you've created a fragile scenario. By making
>the clue structure less rigid you'd make your life a whole lot easier.
I agree totally. Setting up something like this is a real invitation
for trouble. Even if you manage to nudge the players into encountering
all four people, they may refuse to talk to them, beat them up, etc.
rather than getting the clues!
If certain specific bits of information are really necessary to the
success of the scenario (a password to enter the main setting, for
example), an easier and safer method is to let the PCs find out that
they need this information. Then they'll be actively looking for it,
and you won't have to worry about them evading your clues. But
it's not a good idea to rely on heavily directive stuff like this.
It has a remarkable way of going wrong.
Mary Kuhner
mkku...@enzyme.berkeley.edu
David P Hopkins
>
>How about starting a NetCity?
>
address where most of it is found right now. BTW - has anyone got anything
to add to Tabolport? I haven't seen a post for it in quite a while and I
found it quite interesting and useful.
David Hopkins
ho...@vax1.udel.edu
>
Deb Atwood
system set up charts for randomly generating whats in a shop? For
example, given a weapon shop in a medieval town, a chart with
% chances that certain weapons will be available, and then roll for
how many (on avg) and leave the GM to decide specifics such as
quality, size of weapon, etc?
If a game has something like this, or any other charts to help in
quickly generating a city type atmosphere... I'd appreciated to
know details. If not, I guess I'm gonna have to work out a system
myself because I've been learning that running things off the cuff
only gets me in trouble in my email campaign (every goof I make
is written down for posterity - oh boy!) so I need to plan a lot
more than I normally do when running a game. So I'm interested in
something that will allow me to figure things out without having
to think about nitpicky little details like will they have a
broadsword.... ?
Thanks in advance!
D-Singer
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Deb Atwood 90_at...@union.bitnet (until 9/90)
atw...@turing.cs.rpi.edu 90_at...@gar.union.edu (until 9/90)
Purple dragons! EVERYWHERE!!!
In article <> pcal...@attcan.UUCP (Pat Calhoun) writes:
>> One idea I have
>> though is from a magazine call "Polyhedron".
Probably because it's not carried in stores...
Polyhedron is the official newsletter of the RPGA, sent out quarterly,
maybe? I don't remember. RPGA is the official gaming club for TSR,
and costs like $10 or $20 a year.
==GROWF!
Freeland K Abbott III
is (very loosely) modelled on the RPGA's Polyhedron's "Living City"
(which, by the way, seems to me to generally contain rather silly
entries. IMHO, of course). Furthermore, it was my idea first, so I
got stuck as semi-official administrator (maybe I should have looked
before speaking).
Anyway, I have (I think) all of the files here on MIT's Project
Athena, in a publicly-accessable locker named "tabolport".
Unfortunately, "public" means "public to athena users", not to the
world, which is one of the reasons I welcomed the offers of two ftp
sites... in fact, perhaps they should even become the primary storage
sites, if they're willing. After all, I can ftp from them, but other
folks can't from here. And maybe they could set up a mail archiver,
which would simplify the filing process. Unfortunately, my
bookkeeping is such that I couldn't identify them now (lost in the
end-of-term purge, I guess), which is a problem, to say the least, and
an embarrassment as well.
The idea was that by contributing bits and pieces, possibly building
on other peoples' bits and pieces, we could probably come up with a
pretty darn good, varied, and freely available city. It went strong
for a while, then faded to almost a lone contributor (Mr. Davenport--
my records aren't *that* bad), and will now perhaps experience a
rebirth. I haven't done anything myself, what with limitations from
interest, development of my own campaign (some bits of which I posted
already; more will follow-- probably when I return to school),
dialups, and gainful employment (40hrs doesn't seem like it should be
so much of my time!!).
I do still have the collection of everything thus far submitted, or at
least of everything I've noticed. I have not gone through and done my
usual housekeeping lately, although nothing's been submitted lately,
either. However, if anyone is interested in receiving what I've got--
I'm planning to spend a lot of time tomorrow logged in, so I may get
to fiddle with Tabolport-- they should by all means send me mail, to
include a robust return address, and whether they want a tar of the
actual files, a postscript summation generated by Scribe, a text
summation by the same program, or any combination. These last may
become less available soon, too: Athena is no longer supporting
Scribe, so, although I doubt it'll go away immediately, it will do so
eventually. Anyone know how to compile a directory structure into a
single document, sectioning appropriately, using LaTeX?
--
Freeland K. Abbott fab...@athena.mit.edu
454D 410 Memorial Drive MIT Undergrad (Comp. Sci. nerd)
Cambridge, MA 02139 USA "Stop the world, I want to get off..."
Pat Calhoun
> One idea I have
> though is from a magazine call "Polyhedron".
Can you tell me where I can get such a mag. I've never seen it before.
"The opinions expressed herein do not necessarily reflect the views of
the author, the cleaning staff, or the President of the United States."
_^_ ||| Pat "King of the Trenches" Calhoun
<o o> | Technical Support Group, AT&T Canada Inc.
/\/\/\/\ UUCP: attmail!pcalhoun
Thomas Frost
>In article <1990Aug2.1...@mercury.cair.du.edu> mhas...@zephyr.cair.du.edu (Arlo Crymble) writes:
>>
>>How about starting a NetCity?
>>
>There is a NetCity! It is called Tabolport, I don't remember the ftp
>address where most of it is found right now.
It's f.ms.uky.edu, but because of some trouble they've closed anonymous
FTP for the moment (maybe forever?).
Anyone know if Tabolport is elsewhere available?
t.f.
D Brad Shapcott
Since some liked my article on style, I feel encouraged to post about another
concept which has been part of my personal GMing style, and certainly made
fantasy games with magic much easier to GM, from a logical standpoint.
Again, this is a matter of personal taste and some GM's are advised not only
to ignore it, but some will benefit by ignoring. If this helps your personal
style then by all means use it, and if not, avoid it like the plague.
Basically, I was confronted with a myriad of system using magic for which there
seemed no basis or premise for the existence of magic. There merely existed
rules for handling magic, and some rather long and complex spell lists. It
really became a matter of memory work to be able to handle spells in a game
quickly, and more often resulted in an annoying halt in the heat of battle to
see if X spell was being cast properly, and its effects being applied properly.
If the reference was avoided and the GM relied on instinct, often the spell
was applied inconsistently between castings, which infuriates the players.
Tedium. Pure tedium. It was worse than most wargames (don't get me wrong, I
like wargames and play them, but I don't think that wargame type rules fit
very well into role playing systems). So I pondered until I came up with
what is a very *simple* way of handling magic (extremely simple -- so simple
it is beyond me that I've never seen such a system before), which relied on
*one* simple assumption, that seemed to apply well to all situations.
Basically, consider that your fantasy world adheres to the physical laws of
Earth, except in one tiny regard -- energy and matter can be created and
destroyed by the mechanism of magic. It became merely a matter of deciding the
ratio of how much energy and/or matter need be created/destroyed and
devising a formulae for how much 'magical energy' was required to accomplish
this. In fact, it is so easy if not thought through you might be inclined to
think that it couldn't possibly cover a good range of magical spells.
In fact, it does.
I'll go through this in a systematic manner.
(1) The actual system. (2) Some spell examples. (3) Generalized application.
1. We must consider that the role of the magic user is to manipulate magical
energy to obtain a certain result -- the magical energy must be directed
towards a purpose. Magical energy is only a potential, and the magiican
releases this energy by 'asking' it to create/destroy matter/energy.
So, the magic user learns incantations and gestures that 'direct' the magical
energy into physical energy -- magical energy can't be converted to a fireball
unless a magic user directs it to do so by the correct sequence of incantation
and gesture. Fair enough. So the magic user must learn some spells, by which
he can manipulate the energy (this is a game concept -- the real life player
wouldn't memorize spells unless the GM were a sadist).
Material components may often be required as a 'focus' for the magical energy
(that is, a 'target' for the spell), or as an aid to its casting. One spell
may transform lead to gold, so lead is necessarily a material component. For
another spell, the material component is merely an aid -- it helps to create
the spell, though it may even be left out if the caster is willing to expend
more energy. If we create a small creature, having some water to form part
of its body may be helpful, as the caster then doesn't have to use extra
energy to create water as part of the casting. If he left the water out, he
could expend extra energy to include 'create water' as part of the spell.
Now, since casting involves energy, we might assume that casting a spell at
a distance involves either more power, or attenuated effect. The latter is
easier to apply, using an inverse square law. If a spell cost X to cast at
1 yard, it costs 9*X to cast at 3 yards, since 1/3^3 of the power reaches the
target. We may let more experienced magic users 'focus' the energy more
tightly, and therefore have a better range in casting and require less power
over a small distance. I'm not making explicit rules for this, this is left
to any GM who wants to use such a system.
We also quickly establish a rate at which a magic user of a certain level may
use magical power. The caster may have X maximum energy, which he regains at
a rate of Y per hour. A very simple system to establish.
Finally, we set a cost for the creation/destruction of matter/energy. Even
though Einstein gave us e = mc^2, I would suggest that you conjecture that
energy is much easier than matter to create magically. Otherwise it may
throw game balance off entirely. In your units system 1 unit energy =
1 unit mass (the units are yours to create).
It seems like there is quite a bit here at first glance, but remember this
system will eventually handle *any* spell, so that individual descriptions are
not required. The actual spells can be reduced to formulaes -- short and
simple.
I haven't given any specifics here, but it is really a matter of system and
personal taste. The application becomes more readily apparent if I try to
apply this system to some spells that seem popular in several RPG's. Making
an actual magic system by this process, though not complicated, is however
beyond the scope of the short introduction -- the examples will therefore
be discussed theoretically and not numerically or in detail.
2. We are going to cover a few spells. Hopefully these are familiar to you
in some form.
Fireball -- The perennial favourite. *Very* easy to convert.
The caster creates a certain amount of heat energy, and the directs the super
hot gas at a target. This involves two stages. First, the caster creates
heat energy, then he creates kinetic energy to move the gas.
The size of the fireball is determined by the amount of energy put into the
heating spell, and the speed of the fireball by the magical energy expended
on creating the kinetic energy. Of course the amount of kinetic energy
required depends on the mass of the fireball created.
For advanced spell casters, more energy can be put into a smaller mass of gas,
and though the heat energy is the same, it would require less kinetic energy
to get the smaller mass of gas moving. It would move faster and farther
(increased chance to hit and increased range).
A variation may be to allow the caster to create a liquid first, and then
follow through the steps for a fireball spell. While the liquid may be
harder to heat and move, it would have a great advantage if it were liquid
tar (sticks nicely - more damage).
Animate Creature
Let's postulate intelligence as some form of 'energy' (you may want to make
this a very costly energy to create, saying that it is complex). But before
the caster bestows intelligence, he will create the body of the creature.
The cost is however much matter must be created to form the creature (so a
dragon is *much* more costly than a cobra).
If the creature is not merely an extension of the magic user, he can then
put 'intelligence' energy into the creature. If it is an extension, then the
caster must expend energy depending on how far the creature roams from him
(since his control is magical, sending the magical energy obeys the inverse
square law).
Last, the creature may require a constant drain on the caster to stay in
motion (a skeleton, for example, is magically animated) -- or by using more
energy to make a more complex creature, the creature may be able to move
by itself. With intelligence, the creature may be totally independant of
the magic user (though subserviant).
Block Portal
A real easy one to convert. When a door is blocked what really occurs is the
creation of mass inside the door, so that it swells and jambs its frame. The
more matter created, the more securely jambed the door will be.
Here we can also examine the distance rules. If a caster is 20' from the
target door casting will be more costly than 3' from the door. We shouldn't
get a situation like this confused with fireballs because while fireballs
are effective a distance from the caster, the kinetic energy that goes into
moving them is made right by the caster -- *then* this kinetic energy moves
the fireball away.
Magic Shield
A magic shield is a spell that may be only accomplished by a magic user
illusionist. First mass is created (the shield) and then made invisible.
The value of the shield depends on the type of material used and thickness
(and obviously steel, being heavier, is more difficult to create than wood).
The size of the shield depends on the amount of material created.
No formulas or numbers are given for these spells, but they are either easily
devised (20 magic pullas = 1 energy gogla) or taken from the physical world.
We may also add a notion of complexity to casting costs, as one object weighing
the same as another may be much more complicated in contructions. Similarly,
even molecular complexity may be evaluated (but keep it simple!!!!!).
3. Generalizing the concept requires that we make it easy. Simple, set
formulaes will be availble for casting any spells, and the easiest way
to represent spells is to tabulate the formula results. Keep the equations
simple so that slight adjustments can be estimated quickly during play (how
many more 'pullas' does it cost to make a liquid fireball, for example?).
We may also make typical divisions between magic users, which indicates which
types of energy/matter they manipulate best. An illusionist, for example, is
particularly adept at manipulating light and sound.
All magic users will have a knowledge of the basic create/destroy matter/energy
spells.
New spells are easily handled, as are variations on existing ones, by applying
the uniform set of rules. Make a few simple calculations, and the GM quickly
has a new/revised spell which fits into the existing spell system very well.
This is a major problem with other systems, in that they tend to get butch-
ered if added to on the fly. The rules are also so much of a mish-mash that
the GM more or less invents a spell from scratch -- without a lot of genius
these 'invented' spells can ruin the game. Spells under the premised system
seem to always stay within the confines of the system (and therefore the
game).
If one is careful in creating such a system, it is remarkably easy to use and
the flexibility of such a system is quite high. It is very easy to decide
how a spell operates when conditions change slightly. Too many systems send
the GM/players hunting through the rule book looking for the correct way to
use the spell, and often the results are so hard to apply and vary so much
from spell to spell (even with similar spells) that there is none of the
conistency that is so important in RPG's.
Beware though -- some choices must be made wisely, as they will govern the
entire system -- and if a rule or formulae is difficult to apply, the entire
system will suffer. This system is intended to make an adequate system for
magic that has consistency and plausibility, but it is open to abuse. If the
GM insists on calculating the bonding energy for every molecule created in a
spell things will quickly get out of hand.
It doesn't seem prudent to continue without first determining if anyone cares
a whit about such a system -- I like it, but I also was the one who dreamt it
up. I'd be quite happy to expound on its features and implementation, for
anyone who thinks that they might like to try it. Until then, it was just
a suggestion . . .
dbshapcott
Zach Steele
Could someone e-mail or post the NetCity. I do not have an ftp site or
any connections to one. Thanx in advance.
--
******************************************************************************
* Zach Steele * Famous Last Words: "Only a tiny,tiny,tiny little *
* za...@mic.lonestar.org * thing" Dumbell the Fighter. *
******************************************************************************
Elliot Wilen
archives. It may take a while, but it can be done. For details on
using BITFTP, send mail to BIT...@PUCC.BITNET with the word HELP in
the first line.
Please note that the archive at U. Kentucky is still available during
off-peak hours (beftween 6PM and 8AM EDT). If you use it, you might
send mail to Dan Chaney (cha...@ms.uky.edu), since he writes: "I
encourage you to send me mail if you use the archive here, since
I can take this mail and use it to prove we need an upgraded T1 line."
--Elliot Wilen
Jemearl T. Smith
Yep... if you want to get f.ms.uky.edu online during the day, PLEASE write
him... the more ammo we have, the better off we can be....
Jemearl
:
Jemearl T. Smith
| t.f.
It is available, but you have to call/ftp during non-peak hours. Since we have
a slow line to f.ms.uky.edu, and the admin. here doesn't think we need a faster
one (hahahahahahaha can you say WAKE UP?) send them mail. write to:
He's my boss and has been pushing for a faster line for some time now...
thanks
Jemearl Smith
Keeper of Tabolport Archive (and all around nice guy)
-- Jemearl T. Smith // Ondur Ildoch'i (SCA)
-- Archiving Dude, and Amiga owner. \X/ Dragonsmark
-- jem...@ms.uky.edu jem...@UKMA.BITNET !ukma!jemearl {UUNET}
--
Worlds may change, galaxies disintegrate -- but a woman
always remains a woman.
-- Kirk, "Conscience of the King," stardate unknown.
Freeland K Abbott III
about a dozen people who asked for it... it's about 158K, so I'm
pretty reluctant to mail it, especially since you can order it
yourself from the ftp sites. However, if you've sent me mail asking
for the archive and haven't gotten it, it may be that the path you
sent me wasn't usable-- I had about three or four of those. Try
again; we can see if there's some way to get it to you.
Unfortunately, my script to assemble it all into one scribe document
seems to be broken. Until I get a chance to look at it (and I have a
full-time and part-time job, and jury duty, so this is relatively low
priority), the tar's all I can offer. Sorry!
Also, if you're inclined to submit materials (or to post anything
about the city, for that matter-- but e-mail me requests for the
archive, if you can't get the ftp or BITFTP stuff to work), PLEASE put
the word "Tabolport" into the subject line: anything else I might skip
over. Thanks...
Chris Robertson
And let's not forget one of the inevitable consequences of a large,
well-run city with an active City Council and Merchants' Guild --
bureaucracy! Let's illustrate from one of my recent adventures:
The party has arrived in town, laden with assorted loot to sell.
They've found an inn which won't rob them blind overnight (through
sheer good luck), and have got directions to the Street of the Armorers...
Player: I'd like to sell a suit of plate mail. It's magic.
Armorer: Magic, eh? No problem, magic plate's always in demand.
Let's see the pink slip for it then.
Player: Pink slip???
Armorer: Yeah, the pink slip. From the wizard who certified it.
Player: Certified it???
Armorer: Look, don't keep on repeating what I just said. Do you have
a pink slip or don't you? Can't take any magic stuff without
the pink slip, everyone knows that!
And so begins a lovely chase up and down the Street of the Wizards
(whose fees are *much* too dear for our lowly party), ending up at Benjamin
the Hedge-Wizard's for an under-the-table pink slip, leading to an
introduction to the Captain of the Guard ("So you expect me to believe
you didn't know this pink slip wasn't issued by an *accredited* wizard
when you gave it to the armorer who sold the mail to His Lordship?"),
and the beginning of their next adventure...
--
"In the beginning was the Word -- no, just a sec, | Chris Robertson
the Byte, no, the Bit... oh hell, forget it!" | ch...@griffon.mcc.pyrsyd.oz
Beth MOURSUND
involve any manipulation of matter or energy?
Thomas Frost
>How does your system account for informational spells, which don't
>involve any manipulation of matter or energy?
in my systems, information has an existance of its own, along with
matter and energy. just as matter can be transformed into energy and vice
versa, so information can be changed into either and back again. (hence
spells, which are information, change into matter (Create Water) or energy
(Lightning Bolt), or information (Augury).
or try this: information is the link between matter (existence) and
energy (action). spells therefore allow a mage to bridge that gap in ways
he/she directs, or to transform the link (information) itself.
does this help any?
t.f.
D Brad Shapcott
>involve any manipulation of matter or energy?
Good question. It breaks down into two answers.
(1) Some informational spells can be represented by a physical component, such
as a Wizard's Eye (everyone has seen something like this, haven't they -- an
eye that floats around independantly but which the wizard may 'see' through)
involve the creation of the eye, levitating it, moving it, etc. The eye has
an existence that can be represented, so that it can be used under a magic
premise system.
(2) As with creating a creature, intelligence may be thought of as an energy.
If the information is contained in another intelligence, it may be taken and
manipulated by the magic user through magic.
There is really a third point that must be made, and that is that eventually
a magic premise system will limit what the magic user can do. And that is
great, because that is exactly one of the effects I was looking for.
Too many systems really design a cleric or psychic as a 'magic user' who gets
his/her spells from some different mechanism, but whose spells are essentially
the same. A cleric and a magic user in AD&D are so close as to be almost in-
distinguishable except by title.
So the other function of a magic premise situation is to limit the magic user.
It functions concurrently with a 'religious' premise for clerics and a
'psychic' premise for psions. There may be overlap in these character profess-
ions, but they are not so much variations on a theme as they are in AD&D.
The premises, briefly, are:
A magic user is able to accumulate and focus a magical, ethereal power that
exists naturally in his/her universe in order to break one fundamental physical
law of that universe, which is that matter/energy cannot be created/destroyed.
A cleric is granted divine power, in the form of the ability to create miracles
or divine intercession, in service to his deity. The power I usually give
clerics is much greater than that of a magic user in the same party, but their
use of it is more restricted. The deity will not intervene frivilously, or if
the cleric is not pursuing a course of action in service to him.
A psychic is adept at controlling an ambient psychic energy which surrounds
any sentient being. Every being possesses this energy, however a psion may
have it in greater concentration than a normal human and be more adept at
controlling it. The caveat to this is that psions are usually much more
sensitive to manipulation of the psychic energy around them, and must make
conscious effort to maintain defences.
These characters must be played completely differently and have a much
better defined role that the AD&D cleric and magic user did. In AD&D much
of what the cleric did could be taken over by the magic user, and vice versa --
and there also was no premise on which to play the characters differently.
In a premised system a magic user is always confident that he can act as he
pleases and that his magic will serve him according to his ability. A cleric
learns to question his actions, and in a sense becomes nervous about the
validity of his faith. A cleric under a premised system plays more like a
religious leader than was ever required in AD&D, and the gods are given a real
purpose in the game. A cleric who does not establish a good relationship with
his deity in my campaign is probably dead meat. The god will not be there to
intervene when the character needs it.
Ummm . . . to close this -- I have gotten mail on Magic Premise saying merely
'PLEASE EXPOUND'. I'm happy that people are interested, but such a phrase is
too ambiguous to really respond to. A premised base magic/religious/psychic
system probably needs some explaining, but I'm not superhuman. I can't put
out a three hundred page post in one week explaining every point that needs
explained. It would be much easier on me to see general or specific questions
asked rather than requests to expound on the entire system -- and to thereby
explain all the nicities involved in a series of increments.
dbshapcott