RuneQuest Daily, Mon, 17 Oct 1994, part 1
RQ Daily Discussion List
This is the RuneQuest Daily Bulletin, a mailing list on
the subjects of Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's
world of Glorantha. It is sent out once per day in digest
format.
More details on the RuneQuest Daily and Digest can be found
after the last message in this digest.
X-RQ-ID: index
6617: 100102.3001 = (Peter J. Whitelaw)
- Alex Fer'Geasa'n
6618: goroh = (Andre de Oliveira Fernandes)
- curving lights
6619: ANDOVER = AND...@delphi.com
- Missing issues
6620: ANDOVER = AND...@delphi.com
- Griffin Island back to Griffin Mountain
6621: alex = (Alex Ferguson)
- Shear Loonacy
6622: alex = (Alex Ferguson)
- Soul-searching.
6623: alex = (Alex Ferguson)
- Lismelder
6624: MAudley = (Audley, Mark)
- sub list MAu...@VCOMSVOP.TELECOM.com.au
6625: alex = (Alex Ferguson)
- Shamans and divine magic
6626: davidc = (David Cake)
- Some Pamaltela ideas
6627: alex = (Alex Ferguson)
- re: Those damn Kitori and Arkati, still
6628: ddunham = (David Dunham)
- Dwarvish traits; weddings
---------------------
From: 10010...@compuserve.com (Peter J. Whitelaw)
Subject: Alex Fer'Geasa'n
Message-ID: <941016110803_100...@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 16 Oct 94 11:08:03 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6617
Hi all,
Alex responds to some meandering thoughts about Gifts and Geases:
>Peter J. Whitelaw:
>> I cannot envision a 'formula' for such rewards since they
>> would be derived from he GM's appraisal of the players' good roleplaying.
>
>Not really, geasa are pretty much either literally observed, or broken;
>college tries or "breaching the spirit" are fairly beside the point, I
>think.
Yes Indeed. To clarify my point: I was referring to the nature of the rewards
themselves being a function of the GM's appraisal. If, for example, a PC had
stringently adhered to all his Geasa as well as those other 'behavioural
recommendations' of his religion I might feel more inclined to cut him some more
slack (Luck rolls, DI etc.) than a PC that adhered only to his Geasa and spent
the rest of the time wearing armour and being nice to trolls.
>> If one is using PDP, however, the concept might well be abstracted in terms
of
>> the Traits & Pasions mechanism.
>
>Only in very general terms (though I approve of using T&P, in any
>case). One could admittedly attempt to unify the two, say by making
>breach or conspicuous observance of a geas cause for decrease or
>increase of the most-obvious-related Trait (or by using directed
>Traits). Frex, one could say the various Never Eat geasa were
>Temperate ones, the armour ones were Valourous ones, etc. (So breaking
>one of the former might get you an Indulgent check, even if you don't
>"have" that geas.)
This is pretty much what I had in mind.
>> Obviously, these levels correspond to those of Initiate,
>> Acolyte and Priest although we use those terms rather loosely.
>
>Well, they don't, quite,
Perhaps I ought to have inserted 'could' between 'levels' and 'correspond'.
>I'm not sure that Common magic should be easier
>to obtain than Special spells. Judging by spell availability at shrines,
>Lodril temples, and for some flavours of Rune Lord, the reverse seems to
>be more true.
Hmmm. <thinks some> Yes, you're probably right.
******
All the best,
Peter
---------------------
From: go...@fee.unicamp.br (Andre de Oliveira Fernandes)
Subject: curving lights
Message-ID: <1994101614...@diamante.fee.unicamp.br>
Date: 16 Oct 94 10:19:08 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6618
> Second: Make a little drawing. Light curving UP would be hitting the
>south face of the Moon - Light curving DOWN would be more on the top. ANd
>the Clement Longhair theory (promulgated by me and quoted by Greg) is
>that light, like Fire, tend to rise toward its natural home, the Sky World.
>Thus, Light curves UP and Moon is sunlit on its southern face, not on
>top. Even with straight light rays (pshaw) the southern face of the Moon
>is lit. Draw a side view of Glorantha and convince yourself.
Hmmm.... Gotta change my Gloranthan ray-tracing algorythim...
---------------------
From: AND...@delphi.com
Subject: Missing issues
Message-ID: <01HICJKVI...@delphi.com>
Date: 16 Oct 94 10:57:03 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6619
I have not received anything for Wednesday, October 12, Saturday October
15, or Sunday October 16. Is this a general condition or something
specific to me? If the latter, I would appreciate anyone who would forward
the text of the three missing days to me. Thanks! Jim Chapin
---------------------
From: AND...@delphi.com
Subject: Griffin Island back to Griffin Mountain
Message-ID: <01HICK748...@delphi.com>
Date: 16 Oct 94 11:19:31 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6620
In response to Paul's inquiry. The main changes are the addition of orcs
and slarges; a new city; the transformation of Halcyon var Enkarth into
an incredibly powerful sorceror; and a few major new characters (Granny
Keeneye, Arskus Gree, etc.). In our campaign in Balazar, we added the
new city (put it on the north side of the Elf Sea and made its history
shorter), left out the orcs but kept a few mysterious slarges (so we
could keep the trolls); gave the new powers of Halycon to Arskus Gree,
and put the Redeye temple under his tower as a depraved Lunar heresy.
Granny is out there as a frightening rumor for the players: Blueface has
interacted with them to get the adamantine spike, which is part of his
long-run plan to get rid of her (they don't know that). Jim Chapin
---------------------
From: al...@dcs.gla.ac.uk (Alex Ferguson)
Subject: Shear Loonacy
Message-ID: <941016225...@hawaii.dcs.gla.ac.uk>
Date: 16 Oct 94 22:52:08 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6621
Nick asides:
> Maybe [Argrath], and other White Moonies
In what sense is Argrath a Moonie? I can think of several ways in which
this may or may not be true, but the casual reference is confusing/intruiging.
Alex.
---------------------
From: al...@dcs.gla.ac.uk (Alex Ferguson)
Subject: Soul-searching.
Message-ID: <941016232...@hawaii.dcs.gla.ac.uk>
Date: 16 Oct 94 23:27:45 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6622
Sandy plays Spot that Soul:
> Because most roleplayers come from a
> modern society which has decided that man's "life" centers in the
> brain, most roleplayers assume that the same must be true of their
> characters as well. I've tried to claim before that the liver is
> where the soul is centered. The heart is another claimant.
Seems most plausible that the Gloranthan jury is hung on the issue.
Maybe Yelmic belief is for the brain, Orlanthi the heart, Westerners may
take the view of Platonic dualists, and the Kralori, holists. I'd
suggest the stomach for trolls, but this would raise the obvious question:
which one? (I'll say "entire GI tract" for now.)
An interesting question would be what happens when these interact in some
way; frex, if an Orlanthi cuts out a Lunar's heart, and his body gets taken
to a Yelmic healer. My first thought is that the beliefs of the resurrector
(especially where they coincide with those of the resurrectee) should be the
principle determinant
> On the other hand I _like_ the idea that
> to prevent resurrection you've got to do a little more than lop off
> the head and carry it off (like excise the heart).
Probably "rather less" is more like it in practice, due to the difficulties
of fixing up badly mutilated bodies, but that's less a ultimate limitation
than a T-hitch in fixing up the non-contiguous or incomplete corpse.
> Hah. I've seen ye both. "Stick Insect" is the word. You [Joerg],
> Alex, and John Cleese.
I think Sandy is just _gagging_ for a spate of endomorph jokes, but I'm
bigger than that. Well, vertically, at least.
> I would say that a heretic dwarf who joined a
> lightbringer cult could be resurrected through CA magic. For that
> matter, I'd allow a Brithini who'd spent his lifetime persecuting
> lightbringer cults to be resurrected through CA magic
I note that Sandy stops short of claiming an _orthodox_ dwarf could be
CA-resurrected. Maybe this is because the Brithini does share some
reference points for belief in a soul (and in resurrection), even if he
thinks it doesn't survive death in any long-term way.
> Just like
> there's _one_ soft-hearted Death Lord somewhere.
Doubtless in the sense of being on a high-fibre diet (lots of aldryami)
and hence having comparatively unclogged arteries.
Alex.
---------------------
From: al...@dcs.gla.ac.uk (Alex Ferguson)
Subject: Lismelder
Message-ID: <941016234...@hawaii.dcs.gla.ac.uk>
Date: 16 Oct 94 23:49:28 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6623
David Hall says, with weird columnation (I blame Word, for this as for so
much else):
> I reckon that a Lismelder tribesman or woman initiated into the cult of
> Indrodar cuts
> themself off from their previous life and from their kin.
> [...] However, individuals are also hired out as housecarls to
> Chieftains, and this is the way I get PC Indrodari back into the campaign!
I agree with the logic of David's argument, but I'm not entirely sanguine
with the results. This seems to suggest that no Humakti can hold "rank"
in the Lismelder greater than housecarl/weaponsthane. Now, for most
tribes, this makes perfect sense: a Humakti has all the social and
political influence of a whelk, but I see them as more important among
the Lismelder (say, more like a mussel).
> Earth Esrolia
[...]
> Water The Islands
> Logic God Forgot
Or Law, the zeroth/first/sixth/seventh/ahdunnoth "element", even.
Alex.
---------------------
From: MAu...@VCOMSVOP.TELECOM.com.au (Audley, Mark)
Subject: sub list MAu...@VCOMSVOP.TELECOM.com.au
Message-ID: <2EA2...@msmail.trl.oz.au>
Date: 17 Oct 94 14:56:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6624
sub list MAu...@VCOMSVOP.TELECOM.com.au
---------------------
From: al...@dcs.gla.ac.uk (Alex Ferguson)
Subject: Shamans and divine magic
Message-ID: <941017010...@hawaii.dcs.gla.ac.uk>
Date: 17 Oct 94 01:01:28 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6625
Joerg parodies mercilessly:
> Apparently a lot of people tend to think of getting a divine spell like
> this: [comic turn follows]
I'm becoming increasingly confused by the thread: aren't we all saying
much the same thing, and disagreeing about terminology?
> There will be a difference between a first-time aquisition of a spell
> and successive sacrifice for more points of that same spell
I sense another Rune Power Too convert, just _waiting_ to happen. ;-)
> Now, if the divine aquisition of a spell already is connected to such a
> miniquest, why shouldn't a shaman undergo the same quests?
I think the biggest variable in what sort of quest you do isn't in which
spell it's for, it's in the nature of the religion doing the questing.
For shamanistic religions especially, where the quest may be very much
more "personalised" (or ad hoc, according to your biases) than in a
theistic religion. "I spoke with the Lightning Spirit, he told me to
go to the top of the Condor Crags, collect six amber stones, and wait
until the angry spirit comes." Or something quite different, depending
on that shaman's own tradition, and personal experience.
Alex.
---------------------
From: dav...@cs.uwa.edu.au (David Cake)
Subject: Some Pamaltela ideas
Message-ID: <1994101704...@cs.uwa.oz.au>
Date: 17 Oct 94 20:56:21 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6626
I have been reading up on African myth recently, and I have got a
few ideas that I would like to hear any comments on.
The most important is evil figures within Doraddi society. I know
that the Doraddi are in general more peaceful and cooperative than most
Genertelans, and I think that this is a good thing. I do not think that
there should be large antagonistic religions like there are in Genertela.
But African myth is filled with evil sorcerers (and accusations of sorcery
against other tribe members still happen today). I would like there to be
ways for evil people to cast evil magic. Most of the figures of evil in
Doraddi myth currently are external, like Sikkanos or Vovisibor. So far the
best I have come up with is evil shamans could ask for help from the King
of Below.
So what other thoughts or suggestions do people have on evil
magicians within Doraddi society?
I have one really good idea, still not written up, for a sort of
voodoo like cult that is insidious and, while not necessarily evil, useable
by evil people.
Hyenas - in African myth they are rather evil. They are used as servants by
witches and sorcerers, and there are Hyena men that have a lot in common
with werewolves. Do Hyenas exist in Pamaltela? I know that in Genertela
Hyena is a trickster, but it could be quite different in Pamaltela.
Ogres - I like to think that ogres exist as well.
Crocodiles - crocodiles make good powerful and dangerous water spirits. I
think that many water sources are haunted by crocodile spirits. This is not
always a problem to the people though, if crocodile is happy. Many of them
are the husbands of the Naiads, and so happy. Some of them are monsters,
though.
More ideas later.
Cheers
Dave
---------------------
From: al...@dcs.gla.ac.uk (Alex Ferguson)
Subject: re: Those damn Kitori and Arkati, still
Message-ID: <941017045...@hawaii.dcs.gla.ac.uk>
Date: 17 Oct 94 04:58:53 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6627
David Cake persists in his Two Tribes origin theory:
> I think that the marriage probably happened at the
> time of the OOO's rule, with AA rule providing some cultural links between
> the two, and allied troll and human tribes being politically expedient for
> both.
A tribal merger at the instigation of the OOO is getting early enough to
be more Mythology than History. If it were this ancient, their stories
would be unlikely to acknowledge a diverse origin, even if it were
"really" true (which I also remain skeptical of).
> Think of KL as taking the place of Ancestor worship and shamanism
> among the humans.
Hard to think of it this way when you tell me the humans don't do it. If
each worships separate sets of ancestors, or one doesn't at all, then this
rather underscore the separateness of their origins.
> >> Much too dull. There are enough founder deities around (though a
> >> married pair if founder deities is bearable).
> You were the one who said it was a cop out!
In the sense I expounded on: trouble is, just naming and labelling a deity
doesn't tell us much about it.
> I was merely agreeing with you
Were not. ;-)
> > I'm thinking of something which has KL-style "ancestor"
> >worship shades to it, as well as being a founder cult per se. This is
> >a cop out in the sense of effectively "relabelling" religious strands to
> >be more acceptable to all.
> I like this idea, but I am unsure why you need a single founder
> deity to make it work.
You don't, but you'd need what is effectively a single _cult_, worshipped,
or at least acknowledged, by the whole tribe.
> > (most trolls don't even have tribes, mind you)
> Look at page 39 of Uz Lore, which consists mostly of a list of
> troll tribes - most trolls do have tribes, generally springing from a
> common ancestress.
These are not so much "tribes" in anything like the human sense as "extra-
large clans". Dagori Ingarth is also a very "civilised" area by troll
standards, and I think most troll social groupings (whether we call them
clans or tribes) are smaller. Anyway, this is pretty beside the point
(such as it was).
> The Kitori allow human clans, but apart from that are
> probably organised on relatively conventional lines.
By virtue of not having a common ancestor, they surely can't be.
> From the point of view of the Elder Kin of Dagori Inkarth, I think
> trolls allowing humans into their tribe is their mistake, and their
> foolishness, and welcome to it [...] But allowing humans into the KL cult
> is vile [...] I wouldn't want those folks mad at me.
I think those folks would consider this alleged distinction between joining
the cult and joining the tribe petty-fogging and pedantic, and say so
loudly as they ate your brains.
The nature of KL adoption is that anyone who has undergone it _is_ a troll,
even if they look kinda funny and not 100% uzko-like. What is required
to satisfy this may vary considerably, even to the point of being less
regularly fatal then the "standard" version. Doubtless never pain or risk
free, though.
Alex.
---------------------
From: ddu...@radiomail.net (David Dunham)
Subject: Dwarvish traits; weddings
Message-ID: <1994101705...@radiomail.net>
Date: 17 Oct 94 05:15:40 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6628
Joerg asked about Pendragon traits for dwarfs. I'd give 'em all very large
traits (perhaps 19 in things like Energetic, Temperate, Worldly) to
indicate that they rarely have free will. (Pendragon only forces
personality rolls when your traits are extreme, 16+.)
Has anyone run an Orlanthi wedding? I abstracted the last ones in my East
Ralios campaign. It's possible there'll be another, and it might be nice to
have more detail. I know the last ones were big affairs, with people
showing up from all over, and gifts given to the couple. A priest of
Orlanth would preside.
---------------------
X-RQ-ID: Extro
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RQ Daily Discussion List
This is the RuneQuest Daily Bulletin, a mailing list on
the subjects of Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's
world of Glorantha. It is sent out once per day in digest
format.
More details on the RuneQuest Daily and Digest can be found
after the last message in this digest.
X-RQ-ID: index
6629: rstaats = rst...@mail.lmi.org
- The Sacred Time
6630: eco0kkn = (Sog University)
- Strangers in Prax cover
6631: JARDINE = JAR...@RMCS.CRANFIELD.AC.UK
- Lewis on DI
6632: niwe = (Nils Weinander)
- Body shapes
6633: paul = pa...@phyast.pitt.edu
- Re: RuneQuest Daily, Sun, 16 Oct 1994, part 1
6634: Richard.McAllister = (Richard McAllister)
- Clint Bigglestone
6637: SMITHH = (Harald Smith 617 724-9843)
- imtherian lbq story
6638: erisie = (Sven *Erik Sievrin)
- Re:Vessels, vampires and cyberdwarves....
6639: 100116.2616 = (David Hall)
- Foul and fiendish Fazzurites
6640: 100270.337 = (Nick Brooke)
- Bits 'n' pieces
6641: dave_cordes = (Dave Cordes)
- Shamans, Swamps, and Powerg
6642: davidc = (David Cake)
- Hopefully the last word on the Kitori for now
6643: 100116.2616 = (David Hall)
- French Nomad Gods
---------------------
From: rst...@mail.lmi.org
Subject: The Sacred Time
Message-ID: <9409177824....@mail.lmi.org>
Date: 17 Oct 94 14:20:35 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6629
Greetings!
Hope this finds all well and in excellent health and spirits! Been
lurking for awhile on the net as work has been hectic lately. I have
a few questions for the assembled Runemasters on the list.
There are numerous references to the gods/desses reenacting
mythology during the Sacred Time (this makes sense in light of
Illumination taking place during the Sacred Time too). Do the Chaotic
deities participate in this too? How vivid are these scenes? Do they
just occur to holy folk chewing hamasim or are they there in the
heavens for all to see?
Always wondered about that . . .
I'll be in Deutschland from 21 to 29 OCT 94 and back after that.
In service,
Rich
---------------------
From: eco...@cabell.vcu.edu (Sog University)
Subject: Strangers in Prax cover
Message-ID: <941017155...@cabell.vcu.edu>
Date: 17 Oct 94 15:55:21 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6630
Hi all. Mike Dawson here, not Kirsten Niemann.
There's been some discussion about the Strangers cover and the
visibility of the Red Moon in Pavis.
Steve Langmede originally sketched the cover with a big red moon
hovering in the background because he thought it was cool. I believe
my reply to this was "Though it does look good, there are a lot of RQ
fans who will dispute whethere or not the moon is visible from that
angle."
Looks like I was prophetic.
That little ball hanging between the horns of the Moon Boat is a
piece of moon rock, not the Red Moon. At least, that was my idea
based on MOB's ideas. A bit of sympathetic magic was the idea.
And yes, the cover should all be bathed in a bright red glow, but this
would make the temple and characters look really peculiar.
Just for the record, I believe the celestial map in Elder
secrets--that the moon is visible all over Glorantha and the old
description in Cults of Prax is wrong.
Further, I think the moon's phases are visible inside the glowline,
though the effect is intensified so inside the line, magic works as
if the moon was full.
I think at Lunar towns along the glowline, merchants sell
crimson-colored glasses for people from the empire travelling outside
the Glowline. And wide-brimmed red hats that leak red-tinged sunlight
through the brim.
Mike
--
------------
Gloranthophiles need to contact me at code...@aol.com
for information about Codex Magazine.
UK Gloranthophiles write to cphi...@blue.demon.co.uk
"Inquiries into the nature and secrets of Glorantha" .
------------------------------------------------------/_\
---------------------
From: JAR...@RMCS.CRANFIELD.AC.UK
Subject: Lewis on DI
Message-ID: <941017165...@Sun.COM>
Date: 17 Oct 94 16:32:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6631
WRT DI I am not in the camp that says only 1 Rune Spell equivalent per DI.
The rules imply that DI will resurrect 1, heal some and teleport the whole
party out. I disagree and believe that the type of effect available should
depend on the god/dess (& pantheon). NB Humakt NEVER resurrects.
Examples:
Orlanthi fit the rules quite well:
CA resurrects.
CA, Ernalda and Co can heal.
Mastakos (& Orlanth by proxy) can teleport all over the shop.
Lunars can do most of this:
QD resurrects.
7M, QD et al. heal.
But who does the teleportation???
Maybe some other effect can be used...
Daka Fal can resurrect and heal but sends spirits to help and
cannot teleport.
Humakti can get healed but I allow them to DI for DEATH (sever spirit)
on their enemies! For this the spell is cast with their faith as its
stength (opponent must resist their POW not MPs).
General rules:
Only 1 resurrection (minimum 3 POW unless CA cultist). Remember DI
should not cost less than runemagic (resurrection costs 3 POW for
everyone except CA and possibly QD(7M)).
Only 1 person affected by heal/teleport per point of POW. Thus if
an Orlanthi Wind Lord DIs to teleport the whole party out and rolls
a 1 Orlanth favours him and extracts him alone (cost = 1 POW).
As a GM I might allow the WL to expend more POW to get out others
who are in Orlanth's good books (the WLs shadowcat familiar, the
Wind Voice and the CA healer, the Lunar, Yelmalion and Ancestor
Worshipper can get stuffed...)
Well, its the way I do it
Lewis
---------------------
From: ni...@ppvku.ericsson.se (Nils Weinander)
Subject: Body shapes
Message-ID: <941017163...@ppvku.ericsson.se>
Date: 17 Oct 94 18:39:51 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6632
Sandy to Joerg:
> Hah. I've seen ye both. "Stick Insect" is the word. You [Joerg],
> Alex, and John Cleese
Alex in defense:
>I think Sandy is just _gagging_ for a spate of endomorph jokes, but I'm
>bigger than that. Well, vertically, at least.
Lean and wiry RQers unite! Take no shit from the horizontally big ones!
/Nils W (weighing in at 65 kg)
---------------------
From: pa...@phyast.pitt.edu
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Sun, 16 Oct 1994, part 1
Message-ID: <941017175...@venus.phyast.pitt.edu.phyast.pitt.edu>
Date: 17 Oct 94 17:51:48 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6633
Paul Reilly here.
Well, apparently there is a dispute about the origins of the Presence/Vessel
system. Will people who saw it on the RQ4 list back in the first half
of 1993 back me up?
- Paul Reilly`
---------------------
From: Richard.McAllister@Eng (Richard McAllister)
Subject: Clint Bigglestone
Message-ID: <941017181...@urth.Eng.Sun.COM>
Date: 17 Oct 94 04:10:11 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6634
I thought the RQ list should see this sad news. Clint was involved
with Chaosium and RuneQuest since the early days, as the presence of the
"Biggle Stone" on the map of Prax attests.
Rich
------------- Begin Forwarded Message -------------
My husband, Clint Bigglestone, long time Littleman and PENSFA
fellow traveler, died yesterday, October 13th. Clint's death was
apparently sudden and painless, exactly the way he always said he
wanted to go, just 30 or 40 years too soon!
Clint stayed home yesterday to rest from a migraine-troubled
somewhate sleepless night. I phoned home around noon and he was feeling
fine, but some time between then and when I got home around 7, he
had a heart attack of some sort. (Without Clint, I'm having
trouble decoding the medicalesse for specific info.)
We're holding a wake for Clint on Thursday, October 20. Stop by
any time from 2pm to 9pm, 1384 Skyline Drive, Daly City, CA. If
you need directions or questions answered, please call Arlin
Robins at 510/527-5303.
Sarah Goodman
------------- End Forwarded Message -------------
---------------------
From: 10011...@compuserve.com (David Hall)
Subject: Foul and fiendish Fazzurites
Message-ID: <941017212204_100...@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 17 Oct 94 21:22:05 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6639
A Nest of Vipers:
Of course they called Onjur a Poet to be polite. His was in fact mad,
completely mad. Driven insane by his unnatural lusts for his mother, and
his consuming desire to avenge her death. He was Fazzur's favourite son,
the youngest and most spoilt of the brood. Perhaps the murderous "betrayal"
by his beloved father was the final straw.
I suspect that he turned his other brothers and sisters against their
father and led the plot to murder poor, noble, Fazzur. The final words of
Fazzur were in fact, "You too, Onjur!" - having been stabbed in turn by his
children.
The vengeance of Horatio Hostilius was also enough to send anyone mad. The
sons and daughters were hunted down, one by one, and killed; spitted upon
the end of Fazzur's own blade. Onjur was the last. But for some reason
Horatio hesitated, perhaps remembering the baby he had bounced upon his
knee, and the young lad he had taught swordsmanship and riding. Instead, he
turned the sword upon himself.
Surely that would have been enough to send any sane man mad, let alone the
already unhinged Onjur.
But perhaps the final proof of Onjur's madness came in 1631. Would else but
a madman would ally himself with the barbarian war-leader Argrath
Demonspawn?
I believe the real tragedy is that Fazzur was innocent of any crime except
love. I believe that it was the Queen who killed his wife and presented it
to Fazzur as a fait accompli (strangulation is the traditional method of
ritual Esrolian execution). What could Fazzur do? The damage was already
done and he loved her...
Are you satisfied Joerg? This cesspit is of your making!! Do you weep for
Fazzur?
Aeolian heresy:
In deference to Nick Eden's concerns here is the history section of the
htwwo sect write-up. I've left off the theology, etc. Remember that it is
from the point of view of the Aeolians!
The Aeolian Church of Heortland
History
The history of our church begins with the Lightbringer's Quest when
Orlanth, Creator and Invisible God created the world with the Great
Compromise and with Time. Afterwards his son Malkion, Hrestol the First
Prophet, and the Lightbringer Saints carried his worship across the world.
However, over time, the forces of Chaos returned to the world and from its
foul seed arose Gbaji the Deceiver. Gbaji played upon the common people's
ignorance, and he deceived them into thinking that his many ways were
better than Orlanth's one way. His missionaries spread across the world
changing, subverting, usurping, and, above all, confusing the worship of
Orlanth.
When Gbaji the Deceiver held almost all the lands of the world in his evil
grip, in the West arose Arkat, Hero and Prophet, to counter his evil
machinations. He was a son of Saint Humakt and he led the united nations
and religions of the West in a crusade against Gbaji. However, at the very
point that he had freed the western lands he was defeated and imprisoned in
the underworld.
From the lands of Dragon Pass there then came another hero, Harmast
Barefoot, inspired by Orlanth to seek the Light in the West. Amongst his
followers was his Knowing Companion, Aeol. After an epic journey Harmast
found Arkat deep in the underworld and freed him.
Harmast recognized Arkat as Humaktsson, and taught him the Orlanthi ways of
Dragon Pass. Arkat recognized the true origin of both ways and spread this
amongst his followers: Orlanth and the Invisible God were one in the same
and always had been.
With this new knowledge Arkat was strengthened and he led the combined
forces to Dragon Pass to combat Gbaji's Lieutenants, Palangio the Iron Vrok
Lord and Lokayamadon. Soon Dragon Pass was freed of Gbaji and Arkat
prepared to march on Peloria and then on to the heartland of Gbaji:
Dorastor.
However, Arkat was defeated twice, both times by the Sun worshippers of the
Pelorian lowlands. Many of his followers despaired, thinking that Arkat had
somehow miscalculated or offended Orlanth. Then came another Hero to Arkat,
his name was Kwaratch Kang, and he was a troll from the Castle of Lead.
Kwaratch taught Arkat the ways of the Trolls and from him Arkat learnt of
yet another aspect of Orlanth the Creator, the missing aspect that would
give him victory over Chaos. With this knowledge Arkat was able to defeat
Gbaji in Dorastor, and thus was Chaos forced back for another Age.
Many people think that Arkat betrayed the secrets of the Lightbringers and
Solace & Joy when he embraced the forces of Darkness to destroy Chaos. But
the truth is that he discovered deeper truths of the Invisible God.
Arkat later founded and ruled a great Dark Empire in Ralios which
worshipped Orlanth in the same way that he had been worshipped at the
beginning of time. He also set his followers to guard all of the places on
the heroplane and in the underworld where Chaos might seep in again.
Saint Aeol was a companion of Harmast, and then Arkat, and when he returned
home from Arkat's Dark Empire he brought with him Arkat's knowledge and
taught it to us. Now that the Dark Empire is no more we are the last people
who follow the correct form of worship according to Arkat.
In the Third Age Chaos has returned in the guise of the Red Goddess and the
Red Emperor. We must fight her and seek a new Liberator who will unite the
forces of the West, the Orlanthi, and the Trolls, in the correct worship of
the Creator. Only in this way can Chaos be defeated!
Cheers,
David
---------------------
From: 10027...@compuserve.com (Nick Brooke)
Subject: Bits 'n' pieces
Message-ID: <941017215206_10...@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 17 Oct 94 21:52:06 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6640
____
Nils asks, re: Esrolia,
>> Birds are uncommon, and regarded as a pest to be exterminated with
>> egg-eating snakes.
> Why? earth and sky aren't enemies.
Presumably, because farmers don't like birds eating their seed. Look at
scarecrows. The Esrolite chic of using snakes to stop them is neat.
In my world-view, Esrolia is rather close to Egypt. The peasants look like
those on tomb wall paintings: clean-shaven, and dressed in linen kilts. To
outsiders, these beardless skirt-wearing types help propagate the image of
the "land of women" (aka "land of effeminate men").
Pumice-stone from Caladraland is used as a depilatory; Esrolite men shave
chins, chests, legs and all points between. Very odd. Their women tell them
SIZ doesn't matter, which is just as well...
______
Joerg:
> Thus, whether the moon is visible from Pavis (as I think it is) or not,
> it couldn't possibly be visible on the SiP cover
In which case, regardless of the artist's intentions, that red sphere is
presumably a part of the Moon Boat.
________
David D:
> Hmm, I seem to be overly literal about those inverted pyramids in the
> Kingdom of Ignorance -- I kept thinking you pick up the pyramid and
> balance it on its point.
Is this ignorance squared? <g>
_______________
Richard Ohlson:
> BTW, speaking of Death- what IS the proper way to send a dead Orlanthi
> off to the after life? Stick quarters on his eye-lids and bury him?
> Put him on a big boat and set it on fire?
Tradition says a smoky cremation with rune-carved logs, probably best
carried out in a high and turning wind. Storm Voices can arrange that.
Haven't you ever read the cult write-up?
______
Andre:
> Hmmm.... Gotta change my Gloranthan ray-tracing algorythim...
Nah. The point of this excursion into Gloranthan physics is to explain why
the flat world looks just like a round one (and therefore to avoid needing
tedious tendentious twaddle like the box on SiP p.36). IMHO. So unless you
previously modified the RW ray-tracer to fit Glorantha, it'll still work
just fine. (Unless you want to cast Farsee while using it, frex).
====
Nick
====
---------------------
From: 10011...@compuserve.com (David Hall)
Subject: French Nomad Gods
Message-ID: <941018070427_100...@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 18 Oct 94 07:04:28 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6643
Les Dieux Nomades:
I just got a welcome parcel in the post - the French version of Nomad Gods.
This is a revised edition by Stephen Martin printed by Oriflam (who, like
everyone else, can't spell Stephen's name).
As expected from Oriflam the production quality is excellent. The counters
are beautiful, with very nice colour illustrations on each of them. The
two-part map is colurful, though it's on light card rather than the robust
and heavy card like the AH Dragon Pass map.
I'll have to grab a French speaker and play it soon!
David
RQ Daily Discussion List
---------------------
From: SMI...@A1.MGH.HARVARD.EDU (Harald Smith 617 724-9843)
Subject: imtherian lbq story
Message-ID: <01HIDWPKJ...@MR.MGH.HARVARD.EDU>
Date: 17 Oct 94 09:10:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6637
(This story is a piece of the Imtherian Lightbringer cycle. It pertains
to the character Noss, the Imtherian equivalent of Flesh Man.)
The Madness of Noss
by Harald Smith
When the world went dark and the plants began to die, too, the people
decided that they had failed the gods. This realization caused great
fear amongst the people because they did not know how they had failed.
So they called upon two of the people to go up to the great mountain at
the center of the world (known by all as the Spike) and ask the gods
what they should do.
The first chosen was Theraf, for he was the leader of the people, a
mighty man full of strength and wisdom. The second chosen was Noss, for
he was like an opposite of Theraf, a plain man who spent his time
dancing amidst the trees or rolling in the grass. Since the people did
not know the will of the gods, they reasoned that one or the other
should be able to understand the ways of the gods once they reached
them.
Theraf and Noss set off for the great mountain from their home. Theraf
wore the blessings of the people. He wore greaves of seametal, taken
from the rivers themselves and as light as the flowing water. These
were yet so strong that they could turn any blow. He wore a skirt and
shirt of copper, taken from the mountains that guarded the four
directions. These were as solid as the earth itself and impenetrable to
any blow. He wore braces of pure silver, captured from the clouds.
These were so magical that they would turn all opposing magics back
against their caster. He wore a helm of gold, gifted from Khelmal, son
of Yelem, who dwelt amongst the people. This helm was so radiant that
it would render any foe helpless should they gaze upon it. Finally, he
carried the Spear of Law and Justice, the very weapon the gods
themselves had given to the people to aid them in all their tasks.
Bearing these gifts of the people, Theraf was ready for any fight.
Noss however refused such blessings. He wore an old robe of grey wool,
which he fashioned for himself years before. Though it itched him
horribly, he was happy with it. He also wore a pair of linen sandals,
so worn with age that several toes stuck out and the sole of one would
not even protect against a rock. Though they were almost useless, Noss
was happy with them. Only one item did Noss take--a crown of flowers
woven by the children of the people. And he only took this because it
made him happy.
Theraf and Noss walked and walked south toward the great mountain. As
they went farther and farther, the great Spike seemed to grow higher and
higher and broader and broader, reaching up to the peak of the heavens
themselves. Occasionally, bandits or beasts would halt them, but Theraf
turned each aside with ease. Noss laughed and danced, and though there
were none to laugh and dance with, he was still happy. Occasionally, he
even rolled upon the dead grass or ran through the dead forests,
catching twigs and straw within his robe.
When they reached the Unbreakable Bridge, they were met by a small dwarf
who scowled at them. "Who are you and what do you seek?" the dwarf
asked.
Theraf answered, "We are the spokesmen for the people and we come to
question the gods."
Noss smiled and nodded, though mostly he played with a spider's web
which he had found.
The dwarf shook his head. "None may go to question the gods. I allow
none to pass." So saying, the dwarf drew a mighty axe that glowed with
radiant magic.
Theraf smiled. "We shall see about that, for I carry the gifts of the
people and the gods. With these, all must part before me."
The two circled and closed, fought and retreated, again and again
throughout the day. Stars moved above and winds howled below. Noss
finally tired of waiting and walked across the bridge while the two
continued their fight. Turning back, Noss called out, "Hurry up Theraf!
The gods are waiting."
The dwarf turned at this sound and grew enraged at Noss. But while he
was turned, Theraf struck with the Spear of Law and Justice, hurling the
dwarf off the Unbreakable Bridge. Theraf then crossed the bridge to
join Noss again. Together, they continued on the path to the mountain
top.
While they were walking up the path, Noss heard a small voice near his
ear. He looked around but couldn't see anyone. "Who said that?" he
asked.
"Why, it is I, the spider," said the creature which dangled from the web
that he had placed upon his head.
"Oh," said Noss. "Well, I'm glad to have your company. Theraf doesn't
say much, and he certainly never wants to play. Do you?"
"Of course," replied the spider. "We can play a game real soon. I bet
that you can walk right through that shadow ahead."
Noss looked and saw the shadow which rapidly approached. "I bet I can,
too."
Noss waited while Theraf charged ahead against the shadow to do battle
with it. He smiled while Theraf jabbed it with his spear. He smiled
while Theraf turned the shadow's magics aside with his silver braces.
He smiled when he walked forward and through the shadow. Turning back,
Noss called out, "Hurry up Theraf! The gods are waiting."
Discovering that Noss had walked right through the shadow, Theraf
stopped fighting and did the same. The shadow dispersed around him.
They continued on up the path.
Pretty soon the spider spoke again. "Would you like to play another
game? If you do, I bet that you can walk right over that horrible water
serpent ahead."
Noss looked and saw the serpent which coiled around and over the ground
ahead. "I bet I can, too."
Noss waited while Theraf charged the serpent to do battle with it. He
smiled while Theraf jabbed it with his spear. He smiled while Theraf
turned the serpent's bites aside with his seametal greaves. He smiled
when he walked forward and then jumped over the serpent. Turning back,
Noss called out, "Hurry up Theraf! The gods are waiting."
Discovering that Noss had jumped right over the serpent, Theraf stopped
fighting and did the same. The serpent hissed, but did not follow him.
They continued on up the path.
Pretty soon the spider spoke again. "Would you like to play another
game? If you do, I bet that you can walk right around that ugly gnome
ahead."
Noss looked and saw the gnarled and craggy gnome which blocked the path
ahead. "I bet I can, too."
Noss waited while Theraf charged the ugly gnome to do battle with it.
He smiled while Theraf jabbed it with his spear. He smiled while Theraf
turned the gnome's rocky fists aside with his copper shirt. He smiled
when he walked forward and around the gnome. Turning back, Noss called
out, "Hurry up Theraf! The gods are waiting."
Discovering that Noss had walked right around the gnome, Theraf stopped
fighting and did the same. The gnome shook its fists at him but did not
follow. They continued on up the path.
Pretty soon the spider spoke again. "Would you like to play another
game? If you do, I bet that you can dance with that puffy cloud ahead."
Noss looked and saw the puffy cloud ahead which gathered its breath in
its huge cheeks to blow everyone off the path. "I bet I can, too."
Noss waited while Theraf charged the puffy cloud to do battle with it.
He smiled while Theraf jabbed it with his spear. He smiled while
Theraf's radiant helm blinded the cloud and caused its breath to go
astray. He smiled when he walked forward and danced with the cloud
until he was past it. Turning back, Noss called out, "Hurry up Theraf!
The gods are waiting."
Discovering that Noss had danced with the cloud until he was past,
Theraf stopped fighting and did the same. The cloud blew out great
gusts of wind but the winds could not follow them. They continued on up
the path.
At last, though, they reached a gate of gold. Beyond it they could see
the Garden of the Gods. Theraf looked around for a guardian to fight,
but could find none. Placing his hand upon the gate, he opened it and
entered. Noss followed and immediately started rolling in the grass and
dancing around the trees. But neither found anyone to talk to.
After sitting awhile, puzzling about where the gods were, the spider
spoke again. "Why don't you both take off your garments?" she asked.
"After all, the gods don't like armed people in their garden."
Noss thought this a grand idea and quickly stripped off his robe and
sandals. Theraf was less sure, but eventually took off his armaments
and laid his spear aside. Still the gods did not show themselves, so
the two went to sleep.
They were woken by rough hands shaking them. Sitting up, they found
themselves surrounded by grey-maned gods with eyes of iron. These gods
wore flowing robes of grey and white, whipped back by winds. In their
right hands were swords while their left hands gripped the necks of
serpents.
Theraf rose to address the gods. "We have come to ask the gods a
question."
The leader of the gods, whose mane was whiter than the rest and whose
brows all but covered up his eyes, laughed. "You come to ask us
questions? Puny mortal, we answer to none. Here strength rules and
rules alone. We have conquered the world and we do as we see fit."
Theraf looked around at the gathered gods. "Who are you?" he finally
asked.
The leader glowered in rage. "Who am I! I am Umatum! I rule the
world! I, who conquered weak-willed Yelem and sent him to his death, am
the master of the mountain now and of all below the mountain!"
Stepping forward, Umatum seized the armaments of Theraf. "These are
good and useful. I claim them as my own." Theraf made to protest, but
Umatum continued, picking up the Spear of Law and Justice. "This,
though, is useless. It is a tool of Yelem which no longer belongs
here." And with a mighty twist, Umatum shattered the spear into a
thousand pieces and cast it down from the mountain.
Theraf could bear the affront no longer. These were not his gods, but
usurpers. Though now without armaments and weapons, but raised his
fists against foul Umatum. But these gods were faster and stronger than
Theraf. Swords came down upon him. Serpents bit his flesh. The sons
of Umatum grabbed his limbs and pulled his body to pieces and cast it
down upon the world. One piece came down to the people and they knew
despair in Theraf's failure. But Umatum and his sons just laughed.
Through all this, Noss sat upon the ground and listened. Umatum and his
sons in turn ignored Noss, for he was but a puny mortal, without weapons
or armor. The spider spoke to him, though. "Would you like to play
another game? If you do, there is a well in the midst of this garden.
I bet that you can look into it and even take a drink out of it."
Noss looked around the garden and noted where all the gods were. "I bet
I can, too."
He got up and sauntered merrily through the garden. Sometimes a son of
Umatum would approach him, but he just danced with the son or walked
around the son, depending on his mood. The sons just laughed and
thought him crazy.
Noss finally reached the well. As he was about to gaze into its depths,
he heard the voice of Umatum. "What do you think you are doing?"
Noss looked up and smiled. "Why I was just going to look into this well
and see if there was any water in it to drink."
"That well is forbidden to all, but me. I rule here and that is what I
say."
Noss still smiled. "Well, if that is the case, why don't you let me get
some water for you?"
Umatum thought upon this. Certainly, there could be no harm in letting
someone fetch water for him. After all, he was the ruler of all the
gods now. "Very well. You may fetch me water. Mind that you don't
drink any yourself, though!"
So Noss picked up a dipper and leaned over the well. He looked into the
water with his smiling face. As he looked, he saw his face vanish and
the world swirled beneath his gaze. He beheld the sons of Umatum
tearing around the world and pulling it apart. He beheld a son of
Umatum lifting the sky dome off its axis and opening the world to the
void. He saw chaos enter the world and consume it piece by piece. He
saw Umatum himself bound and chained. He saw the great mountain
disappear amidst the horrors of the void. He saw the fabric of the
world stretch and thin and tear apart. He saw the horror of the future.
His smile fled his face. His soul filled with knowledge. He raised the
dipper to his lips and drank.
The spider whispered in his ear, "Run!" and he did.
Behind him he heard the bellows of Umatum, but that was nothing compared
to the horrors which now filled his soul. Madness overtook him as he
passed through the garden's gate. He leapt from the top of the great
mountain, hoping to find death, too. But winds caught in the spider web
which still clung to him. Like a sail it billowed out and carried him
slowly downward, westward, toward a distant land. Seas raged below,
winds raged around, but still he drifted on.
As he drifted, he saw the visions come to pass. He heard the laughter
of the sons of Umatum as they broke the power of life. He saw chaos
enter the world. He saw Umatum bound and chained. He saw the world
mountain shatter and the world well destroyed. He saw the dead flee
past him. He saw the world defeated and destroyed. He saw the fabric
of the world stretch and tear. Worst of all, he knew that only he alone
knew the future of the world. He wanted to die himself.
Finally, he came down before a gate, the Gate of Dusk, but it was locked
and barred to his passing. He wanted to pass through, but he could not.
In his madness, though, he knew that others would come there too. All
the world would come there, for all the world was about to die. He
would wait so that he too could die and find peace once more.
---------------------
From: eri...@utu.fi (Sven *Erik Sievrin)
Subject: Re:Vessels, vampires and cyberdwarves....
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9410172...@polaris.cc.utu.fi>
Date: 18 Oct 94 01:13:20 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6638
First, thanks alot for (xxxxxxxx)'s sorcery rules.
They were interesting, but they cause a lot of questions, most of which
other people already asked during the last days. The answers given to
these by both (xxxx) and others were almost as interesting as the rules
suggestions that caused them. Here are some more questions, as well as a
few comments:
-As I understand it one of the precepts is that the persons who turn their
whole life to magic always do something special with their hidden self.
The shaman awakwns it and lives alongside it, the priest sacrifices it to
his god, and the sorceress (used as rules term, not in the Western
Gloranthan sense) controls it. What about the shaman who is also a
priest? You stated that the henotheists could not have a Vessel since they
are supposed to give their hidden self to their gods, so the "sorcerer who
is a priest" has been taken care of, but what about the shaman/priest? (I
define a "priest" as someone who gets reusable divine magic - horribly
mechanically, I know, but I suppose the mechanics reflect a similar
relation between the magic of a priest/acolyte/runelord and that of an
initiate in the "real" Glorantha) Since the shaman uses his hidden self as
a fetch, how can it be with his god? I have two explanations myself : 1, I
take the sacrifice too literally. The shaman's fetch has been DEDICATED to
his god(s), but it is still with him. This mean, I suppose, that if the
shaman betrays his god, he will also loose his fetch, and that the fetch's
personality, if fetches have such, would be more closer to that of the god
in question. 2, That POW and INT aint a REAL fetch at all. It is a spirit
sent from the shaman's god to help her, in the same way that a real fetch
does. The same distinctions as above apply - but I would also like to make
the fetch more akin to an "allied spirit", ie it starts more powerful than
a real fetch, but cannot get as powerful.
-Cyberdwarves and dwarves without a personality: I do not like the idea
of Mostali being purely mechanical beings, even if I agree that they are
much less individualistic than, say, humans - if I used T&P I would
certainly think that a beginning dwarf would start at about 18-20 in the
relevant attributes to their caste - all except Irondwarves would be very
Cowardly, while Irondwarves would be very Brave. They are made that way,
unless the Quicksilver dwarf tending the incubator slips - or, horrible
thought, is a heretic and by purpose modifies all his dwarf-modules to be
individualistic, or what ever his heresy would be.
This is my version of the Mostali Vessel:
All dwarves are imperfect versions of the "real" Mostali, those beings
created by Mostal himself, of whic the dwarves are merely clay (organic)
copies ("the Clay Mostali"). They all strive to come closer to their
originals, however. That is part of their work rebuilding the Machine.
All dwarves BEGIN with a Vessel, with a prescense of 1D3, just like a
"newbaked" Malkioni Wizard. Just like a human, they can sacrifice POW to
the Vessel. However, this is usually a slow
process. See it like this: Mostali society is totally concentrated on
rebuilding the World Machine, of restoring the world to pre-Time
perfection. What is this if not heroquesting and reality-changing on the
Gbaji/Godlearner/Lunar level - with the difference that the dwarves are
CHANGING BACK the world, and that they work slowly and carefully as to
not do the same kind of mistakes as foolish humans have done in similar
situations. So the dwarves work to change the world, how? Well, we all
know about the ceremonies of human cultures at sacred time and other
important dates. The dwarves have similar ceremonies going at the same
time, but to humans they do not look like ceremonies. Do you think
allthose dwarven machines have any mundane purpose? If studied by a human
engineer, he would find that most of those machines do NOTHING. Wheels
turn, coal burns, levers pump, but they have no purpose other than
ceremonially representing functions of the World Machine. In some cases
this would be obvious - the machine shows the stars and planets moving,
for instance. Such machines are tended by skilled dwarves - not
necessarily Diamonddwarves just very skilled ones. And there are
equivalents in other dwarven sciences than that of mechanics. The Rock
Dwarves dig labyrinths of tunnels leading nowhere when concerned with
normal space, forming sacred geomethric shapes, some of them
non-euclidean. The Quicksilver Dwarves in their laboratories create
chemical compounds that ARE NOT POSSIBLE, according to the laws (?) of
Glorantha, but existed before Time. And so on.
All these projects are taken care of by skilled dwarves. Skilled dwarves
are those who has served as mundane workers - digging for ore, making
food, forging tools and weapons, etc. - for some hundred years, and
mastered the necessary skills. The projects are planned and administrated
by Diamonddwarves. While working at these projects, dwarves slowly
increase their Vessel. At the same time, they loose their "softness" and
become more "metallic", ie non-human from our point of view. This happens
at a different rate for different dwarves, and game mechanics for it
seems unnecessary, but the rulelawyer in me suggests loosing 1 POW and
increasing Vessel with one each 10-20 years - Silver dwarves should loose
theirs quickly, Rock and Lead Dwarves slowly. Individualists actually
have higher Vessel than other dwarves (remember how the founder of this
heresy "was so pious that his bones turned to stone (the Prosopaedia)". They
still want to rebuild
the Machine, but have own ideas how to do it and are often much more
enthusiastic about it. Thus, they loose more of their POW and gain more
Vessel. One way they do this is working in their spare time with Private
Projects, sometimes already as mundane workers. However, at the same time
they tend to exercise their POW more, so the difference is not as big as
one may think.
Dwarves putting vaccuum tubes into their heads...? Hmmm, there is already
a certain amount of "cybernethics" among the Mostali - the Tin dwarves (I
think) are among other things responsible for creating replacement limbs
for dwarves who have lost theirs due to accidents. Since they are also
responsible for the creation of dwarven "androids" (Jolanti etc), you can
get funny ideas of this.....
I was thinking about saying something about solace and vampires as well
but suddenly notices that I have a real life as well, so I'll be back
again...
Erik
RQ Daily Discussion List
---------------------
From: dave_cordes@cl_63smtp_gw.chinalake.navy.mil (Dave Cordes)
Subject: Shamans, Swamps, and Powerg
Message-ID: <941017233...@Sun.COM>
Date: 17 Oct 94 08:08:41 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6641
CL QM-SMTP gw Shamans, Swamps, and Powergaming
I realize that some of these issues are over a week old. But our gateway has
been rather spastic lately. I'm just now getting caught up. I figured I
should respond to some of these comments as I started the questions about
Shaman Ressurections.
_____________
X-RQ-ID: 6482 Curtis Taylor:
>Note that a shaman in RQ 3 may bind spirits and force them to cast
>any Divine magic that the spirit knows (including Resurrect-type
>Divine magic).
Wow!! That's great. Expect that our GM doesn't think that spell spirits
know divine spells. They only know spirit or scorcery spells. Divine spells
come from ceremonies (heroquests?) that are performed in temples. Not from
spirits.
___________
X-RQ-ID: 6472 Colin Watson:
>> Now that at least four of us agree that resurrections should not
>>necessarily be limited to just the Chalanna Arroy Divine Spell.
>Four in agreement? There must be some mistake. ;-)
It must be Eurmal's doing!! ;-)
>I tend to adhere to the idea that newly-dead spirits retain their STR, CON
>and DEX for a while after death (though these characteristics are fairly
>useless in the spirit-world and tend to dissolve in a matter of days). If
>you recovered the spirit quickly enough and used a 5-POW binding
>enchantment on the body (to bind the pseudo-ghost's INT POW DEX STR and
>CON) I think you'd essentially restore the person's life.
Sounds reasonable to me. Now if I could only figure out what type of spirit
binding I need. We haven't found or learned of any type of generic spirit
binding that can be made a 5 point binding. So far, in our game, bindings
are customized to a certain type of spirit. (ie Heal Spirit Binding, or Magic
Spirit Binding, or Ghost Binding). I guess I need to find someone who's made
a Bind Elmer's Spirit Spell and learn it. This is however going to extremely
limit the number of ressurections I attempt to perform. Creating a new type
of Binding for each person being ressurected will probably be more limiting
than the 5 PWR I'll need to expend. Maybe I could get away with a Bind Dead
PC Spirit Spell.
I do like the Idea of a newly deceased spirit retaining the STR, CON, and DEX
until they disipitate, instead of the body. I haven't seen many corpses that
had much of any of those characteristics going for them.
______________
X-RQ-ID: 6489 Joerg Baumgartner:
>Shamans are known to travel into the border zone between life and death
>to guide spirits back to their bodies. They do so in case of diseases
>or curses which cause a soul to leave the body, and probably an
>untimely death by violence or accidents will send the unprepared spirit
>into this region, too. If the body left by the spirit still (or again)
>is inhabitable, I think the shaman ought to be able to guide the spirit
>back and force it into the mundane plane again. While I think that some
>permanent POW loss ought to be involved, I don't feel there should be a
>binding matrix enchantment as a component. Maybe this POW is used to
>seal the leak through which the spirit escaped into the Otherworld.
I like this idea. It solves my previous problems with Colin's solution. I
don't need a Bind Elmer's (or whoever) Spirit Spell. As to the loss of PWR
needed to bind the spirit back into the body. How about using Colin's
suggestion of 5 PWR, one each for INT, PWR, DEX, STR, and CON?
Heaven and Telmor help me. This makes twice in one month that I have agreed
with Joerg. I'd better be careful, or next I'll be agreeing with Nick and
Peter.
>.....while I can express myself somewhat fluently in English,....
Joerg, I work with a large number of very intelligent, well educated American
Scientists and Engineers (minimum education level - BS degree). Most of
these guys can't express themselves half as well as you do.
_______________
As to Sandy and Peter's Swamp Discussions:
My wife's family are Cajuns from Louisiana. They live scattered about in
small towns on the high spots (~10 - 100 ft. above sea level) near the
swamps. They handle the mosquitos the same way my family in the South Dakota
farm country do. They use a shot gun. Just kidding. Both those places have
some of the biggest darn mosquitos I've ever seen.
After reading the historys written by my in-laws I don't see them dwelling on
the hardships of living in the swamps any more then my ancestors dwelled on
the brutal winters or the indian raids living in the Dakotas. The only
really difference I've been able to descern was the travel times. Traveling
50 miles for my ancestors (circa 1800) was a 2-3 day horse or wagon ride. In
the late 1700's 50 miles to my cajon relatives was a one week horse or foot,
and boat trip.
Life in either place was hard but not without it's rewards. They simply
lived by different survival rules that had been adapted to the area they were
in. Interesting enough, as civilization made both areas comfortably
habitable, hunting and fishing progressed from being a necessity-to-survive
to one of the most popular pastimes in both areas.
______________
POWER-GAMER ALERT POWER-GAMER ALERT POWER-GAMER ALERT
X-RQ-ID: 6543 T.J.Minas :
> a) Most Shamans aren't powerful enough (IMO) to be able to resurrect
>people via the Shamanic route. But its pretty easy for them to join Daka
>Fal, and gain the spells that way.
I am a hunter. My wolfbrother and I roam the forest and plains as though we
own them. We run together seeking game and sport. The hunt is exhilerating.
The kill the climax. The feeding is a time to share with one another. We
live as the great wolf has taught us. We live as our parents before us
lived. We live as our children after us will live. This is how it should
be.
I am also a shaman. I tend to my people as I was taught. The great wolf
showed me the paths on which I walk. As I will show those paths to another
when it is time. And would never soil my soul by attempting to walk the
paths of those who are not of the wolf's way. The magic taught by those who
are not wolf will bring destruction upon them. I will not take part in such
perversions.
- Wolfstar.
Let me put this another way: From a role playing standpoint - do you think
it is okay for your character to just go cult hopping in order to get the
spells you as a player may want? Where is your dedication to your cult?
Where is your commitment? Where are the spirits of reprisal that should be
raining down upon you?
David Cordes
---------------------
From: dav...@cs.uwa.edu.au (David Cake)
Subject: Hopefully the last word on the Kitori for now
Message-ID: <1994101804...@cs.uwa.oz.au>
Date: 18 Oct 94 20:22:19 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6642
Hopefully the last word on the subject for now, though I may do a Kitori
'what my Father told me' soonish.
>David Cake persists in his Two Tribes origin theory:
>> I think that the marriage probably happened at the
>> time of the OOO's rule, with AA rule providing some cultural links between
>> the two, and allied troll and human tribes being politically expedient for
>> both.
>
>A tribal merger at the instigation of the OOO is getting early enough to
>be more Mythology than History. If it were this ancient, their stories
>would be unlikely to acknowledge a diverse origin, even if it were
>"really" true (which I also remain skeptical of).
>
Its only three or four hundred years or so! Ancient history, but
still recorded. And in any case, just because something is old enough to be
mythical doesn't mean that it is forgotten, if it is important. As for your
scepticism as to what really happened - I accept David Halls info from
Chaosium, which says that they started as two tribes, trolls native to the
Troll Woods, and human Argan Argari refugees from the OOO's reign.
>> Think of KL as taking the place of Ancestor worship and shamanism
>> among the humans.
>
>Hard to think of it this way when you tell me the humans don't do it.
I think that there is dfinately lots of shamanism among the humans,
but I don't think that the shamans run the place, as they might in a
primarily shamanic society. I think that they have more shamanism than the
average Sartarites.
>If
>each worships separate sets of ancestors, or one doesn't at all, then this
>rather underscore the separateness of their origins.
>
I think that most ancestor worship is directed at the clan level
anyway, so ancestor worship is always about separate sets of ancestors
(isn't that what clans are?). They do consider the troll and human clans to
be related, though. Its just that those very old ancestors (clan founders,
etc.) aren't summoned that often. Summoning great-great grandfather is more
common.
>> > I'm thinking of something which has KL-style "ancestor"
>> >worship shades to it, as well as being a founder cult per se. This is
>> >a cop out in the sense of effectively "relabelling" religious strands to
>> >be more acceptable to all.
>
>> I like this idea, but I am unsure why you need a single founder
>> deity to make it work.
>
>You don't, but you'd need what is effectively a single _cult_, worshipped,
>or at least acknowledged, by the whole tribe.
>
I think that it is a flavour of ancestor worship, worshipped by the
humans as plain old ancestor worship, by the trolls intermixed with KL, and
by both as linked to AA.
I do think that they have a single cult worshipped by both tribes,
but I think that it is AA, and the ancestor worship that they both partake
in is less important, being mostly at clan level, though underscoring the
AA domination by acknowledging common ancestors.
>> > (most trolls don't even have tribes, mind you)
>
>> Look at page 39 of Uz Lore, which consists mostly of a list of
>> troll tribes - most trolls do have tribes, generally springing from a
>> common ancestress.
>> The Kitori allow human clans, but apart from that are
>> probably organised on relatively conventional lines.
>
>By virtue of not having a common ancestor, they surely can't be.
>
I think that they acknowledge a common ancestress, a troll queen
who married the human king. That does not mean that the Queen is seen as
ruler of the tribe, though.
>> From the point of view of the Elder Kin of Dagori Inkarth, I think
>> trolls allowing humans into their tribe is their mistake, and their
>> foolishness, and welcome to it [...] But allowing humans into the KL cult
>> is vile [...] I wouldn't want those folks mad at me.
>
>I think those folks would consider this alleged distinction between joining
>the cult and joining the tribe petty-fogging and pedantic, and say so
>loudly as they ate your brains.
>
I think that trolls can definately distinguish between the tribe
and the cult. They acknowledge all the trollkin as members of the tribe -
but certainly wouldn't let them in the cult without a lot of proving
themselves. KL is very much about trolls as a species, and the trolls are
very picky about who they might acknowledge as a troll.
Try telling the Elder Kin that all the trollkin tribe members
should be allowed into the cult!
And note that most troll cults allow non-troll members - indeed, in
some cases are largely made up of non-trolls (Gorakiki frex). It is only KL
that requires initiates to be trolls, and I think that it is a major tenet
of the cult.
I think that your average troll would find your non-distinction
between tribe and cult to show a lot of ignorance!
>The nature of KL adoption is that anyone who has undergone it _is_ a troll,
>even if they look kinda funny and not 100% uzko-like. What is required
>to satisfy this may vary considerably, even to the point of being less
>regularly fatal then the "standard" version. Doubtless never pain or risk
>free, though.
>
I agree that the Kitori trolls may be a little more relaxed about
adopting their fellow tribe members - but only possibly. I certainly think
that the humans who wiosh to join KL (and I can't see that many doing it)
do still need to undergo ritual rebirth - but they might escape the
ceremonial dismemberment. I think that there is a chance that Kitori trolls
might consider Kitori humans as being relations, and thus part troll, which
eases the adoption ceremony a fair bit. I certainly don't think that they
consider them eligible to join the cult as trolls, and I think if they did
it would be highly heretical.
Cheers
Dave
>Alex.
RQ Daily Discussion List
This is the RuneQuest Daily Bulletin, a mailing list on
the subjects of Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's
world of Glorantha. It is sent out once per day in digest
format.
More details on the RuneQuest Daily and Digest can be found
after the last message in this digest.
X-RQ-ID: index
6644: niwe = (Nils Weinander)
- Birds in Esrolia
6645: caille = (Jerome Caille)
- -American Board-English Rules-French Counters-
6646: JARDINE = JAR...@RMCS.CRANFIELD.AC.UK
- Lewis on Rose Tinted Spectacles
6647: Vingkot = Vin...@aol.com
- ancestor spirits/resurrect
6648: sandyp = (Sandy Petersen)
- Re: misc. plus some Sandy campaign notes
6649: jonas.schiott = (Jonas Schiott)
- Backing Paul, Re: Arkati and Illumination.
6650: JARDINE = JAR...@RMCS.CRANFIELD.AC.UK
- Mostali Mindset and Magic Methods
6651: erisie = (Sven *Erik Sievrin)
- More about vessels...
6652: 100270.337 = (Nick Brooke)
- Sacred Time Chaos
6653: paul = (Paul Reilly)
- Re: RuneQuest Daily, Tue, 18 Oct 1994, part 3
6654: 100116.2616 = (David Hall)
- Death and Life
6655: paul = (Paul Reilly)
- Re: RuneQuest Daily, Tue, 18 Oct 1994, part 1
6656: Michelle_Ringo = (Michelle Ringo)
- Divine Intervention
6657: ddunham = (David Dunham)
- spirits & spells
---------------------
From: ni...@ppvku.ericsson.se (Nils Weinander)
Subject: Birds in Esrolia
Message-ID: <941018085...@ppvku.ericsson.se>
Date: 18 Oct 94 10:59:29 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6644
Mike Dickison:
>> Birds are uncommon, and regarded as a pest to be exterminated with
>> egg-eating snakes.
Me:
> Why? earth and sky aren't enemies.
Nick:
>Presumably, because farmers don't like birds eating their seed. Look at
>scarecrows. The Esrolite chic of using snakes to stop them is neat.
OK, I can buy that for crows and other wild bird species which eat your
grain and fruit, but how do the Esrolians train their pet snakes to eat
only wild birds and not the domestic chickens, ducks, geese, turkeys
etc?
/Nils W (who happens to like birds)
---------------------
From: cai...@tabarly.saclay.cea.fr (Jerome Caille)
Subject: -American Board-English Rules-French Counters-
Message-ID: <caille.37...@tabarly.saclay.cea.fr>
Date: 18 Oct 94 12:56:36 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6645
Subject: Les Dieux Nomades
David:
>I just got a welcome parcel in the post - the French version of Nomad Gods.
>This is a revised edition by Stephen Martin printed by Oriflam (who, like
>everyone else, can't spell Stephen's name).
Have you a beta version or is it released yet?
>The two-part map is colurful, though it's on light card rather than the
>robust and heavy card like the AH Dragon Pass map.
This is a real problem, for DP we actually play with the american board and
french counters...Another even more sensible point are the rules
translations(I'm talking about DP): they are full of nonsense and bugs, so the
best way is: American Board-English Rules-French Counters.
Do you know if it's possible to join the two boards in one game?
>I'll have to grab a French speaker and play it soon!
Grab me! Do you want a Nomad's journey in Paris for a week?
Jerome
Ria knip sah erialc tenalp
Der era seert eht lla
Ereht seid reven eno on
Daeh a sah eno on
---------------------
From: JAR...@RMCS.CRANFIELD.AC.UK
Subject: Lewis on Rose Tinted Spectacles
Message-ID: <941018133...@Sun.COM>
Date: 18 Oct 94 13:19:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6646
Mike
I loved the image of Lunars seeing the World through
ROSE TINTED SPECTACLES...
Cheers
Lewis
---------------------
From: Vin...@aol.com
Subject: ancestor spirits/resurrect
Message-ID: <941018103...@aol.com>
Date: 18 Oct 94 06:36:56 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6647
Subject: ancestor spirits
Hello, all.
>X-RQ-ID: 6641 Dave Cordes:
>>Note that a shaman in RQ 3 may bind spirits and force them to cast
>>any Divine magic that the spirit knows (including Resurrect-type
>>Divine magic).
>Wow!! That's great. Expect that our GM doesn't think that spell >spirits
know divine spells. They only know spirit or scorcery spells.
>Divine spells come from ceremonies (heroquests?) that are performed >in
temples. Not from spirits.
In the RQ 3 Daka Fal writeup there is a Random Ancestor Table to
determine the specifics on any random ancestors a Daka Fal shaman
may summon. This table includes Divine Spells for some ancestors
(and specifically includes the Divine Spell of Resurrect(ion) as a
possibility).
--Curtis Taylor
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Laugh while you can, Monkey Boy.
Send your Red Lectoids to Vin...@aol.com
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
---------------------
From: san...@idcube.idsoftware.com (Sandy Petersen)
Subject: Re: misc. plus some Sandy campaign notes
Message-ID: <941018160...@idcube.idsoftware.com>
Date: 18 Oct 94 02:09:43 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6648
Lewis had an excellent segment talking about how the different gods
should have widely different DI. Frex, Humakt shouldn't heal. I think
it is a bit harsh to say that Ernalda, et al, cannot resurrect. She
is enough of a renewing, nurturing, healing entity (who was
resurrected herself, by the way) to be allowed to do this by DI, if
appropriate for the situation. My main cavil with Lewis's notes is
that he recommends that Daka Fal not teleport -- Daka Fal worshipers
don't get any DI whatsoever. And they're not the only ones. The
existence of certain deities that lack DI implies the existence of
deities with limited DI. We all know about Cacodemon and Krarsht's
stinky DI, but I'm sure there are many other examples.
> a) Most Shamans aren't powerful enough (IMO) to be able to
>resurrect people via the Shamanic route. But its pretty easy for
>them to join Daka Fal, and gain the spells that way.
IMO, Daka Fal is one of the hardest of all religions in
Glorantha to join. You get _no_ benefits from it unless your own
ancestors happen to have been Daka Fal for some time. Basically, if
you're not born into it, you're out of luck.
In my own campaign, the shaman is an Ancestor Worshiper, and
two of the party members are also Daka Fal. The rest have apostatized
to more modern and useful gods (such as Dormal, Humakt, and Orlanth).
The shaman is desperately seeking new members, since the island that
all the PCs (well, most of them) come from was recently wiped clean
of life by a supernatural catastrophe. Hence, the PCs are the only
survivors of their entire homeland (except for a few random folks who
happened to be out fishing at the time of the disaster). Anyway, this
means that there's a whole heap of ancestors with only three (3)
living descendants.
The shaman has discovered that it's possible to adopt an
awakened herd man into his family, because the herd man has no
(sentient) ancestors to object, so the shaman's own ancestors don't
mind the adoption. Normally, of course, adoption like this isn't
really possible, and blood lineages , or at least marriages, are
required. One of the two dudes who belongs to the shaman's "cult" is,
in fact, an awakened herd man (the player is Guy Hoyle, who is known
to post on the Daily). Anyway, the PCs have come up with a crazed
plan, so deranged I can hardly stand it -- they plan to rescue a
whole herd o' herd men, somehow get them en masse awakened, and then
adopt the presumably grateful rescuees into the shaman's particular
Ancestor cult. What a fine plan.
---------------------
From: jonas....@vinga.hum.gu.se (Jonas Schiott)
Subject: Backing Paul, Re: Arkati and Illumination.
Message-ID: <941018170...@vinga.hum.gu.se>
Date: 18 Oct 94 19:09:37 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6649
> Paul Reilly here.
>
> Well, apparently there is a dispute about the origins of the Presence/Vessel
>system. Will people who saw it on the RQ4 list back in the first half
>of 1993 back me up?
I've seen it in the RQ4 list archives. You definitely have priority for the
_terminology_. As for mechanics, I can't comment, not having read any of
the umpteen proposed sorcery systems very closely.
____________
Alex -
>(CoT, to be picky)
Slip of the mind...
>What Greg seems to think is that the cults of the Dark Empire, and perhaps
>some of the latter-day Arkat cults, had their own "system of information"
>which was like Illumination in some ways (such as ability to detect
>Illuminates, I'm tempted to guess)
Philosophy classes on "Sophistic Gbaji Rhetoric, and How To Refute It"?
>he seems to be rethinking Pelorian idea on illumination, pouring scorn
>on all existing and any possible future rules for illumination (et al),
>and is being very quiet about Arkat cults in the 3rd age.
Oh good, that means I can ignore them a while longer. :-)
>You seemed to be saying, rather, that "some Illuminates might not be either
>Dark-siders or Light-siders".
Yes?
>What I'm suggesting is that it's basically a
>philosophical distinction, and trying to classify individuals by it is a
>bit pointless.
Whoa, that's deep! ;-) You mean you refuse to classify individuals
according to their philosophical beliefs? Or do you mean by "philosophical"
that the distinction is purely _technical_; only names the end points of a
spectrum, or is only applicable to the 'atomary' components of a belief
structure?
( Jonas Schiott )
( Institutionen for Ide- och lardomshistoria )
( Goteborgs Universitet )
---------------------
From: JAR...@RMCS.CRANFIELD.AC.UK
Subject: Mostali Mindset and Magic Methods
Message-ID: <941018172...@Sun.COM>
Date: 18 Oct 94 16:27:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6650
WRT Dwarf Sorcery & Vessels
IMHO Dwarfs are not sorcerors, well by that I mean non-appostate or
heratic ones are not. REAL UNBROKEN Mostali use Mechanics a complicated
Magical System of Mechanisms which has similarities with a computer program.
Broken Dwarfs are unable to use this and often resort to sorcery as the
most similar magic system. (I will not detail my version of the Mechanics
system here as David Hall has told me he intends to publish it in the next
issue of Tales)
I regard unbroken Dwarfs as having something like a hive-mind.
In effect this means that all their vessels are linked together rather
than to a deity/fetch/sorceror's vessel. Because of this they can use
magics which would be impossible for a single creature to encompass in
their mind and consequently use a radically different magic system.
This system has (at least in overview) some similarities to sorcery,
which caused the GLs to adopt the belief that Dwarfs use sorcery.
The Dwarfs were quite happy to support this fiction and the natural
inclination for broken Dwarfs to adopt sorcery has further reinforced
the idea.
The hive mind has a further, overt, effect on Dwarfs in that it
tends to reinforce stereotypical behavior. In PDP terms Dwarfs average
their trait rolls with the ideas for their caste. Thus all Copper Dwarfs
will act in a fairly similar manner and only those with the individualist
heresy will be seen to obviously depart from the norm. Individualist
heratics occur when a Dwarfs traits vary greatly from the caste norms and
the hive-mind isolates the individual to avoid contamination. While this
is not the total rejection that an apostate would receive it does result
in a fair less intimate contact between the individual and the collective
consciousness, this impairs magic but does not result in aging. Other
herasies have similar effects (I can't remember them all, but they are
ALL aberant behavious in terms of the MEAN COLLECTIVE PERSONA (MCP) and
are thus isolated to some extent.
Well I hope this causes a stir
Cheers
Lewis
---------------------
From: eri...@utu.fi (Sven *Erik Sievrin)
Subject: More about vessels...
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9410181...@polaris.cc.utu.fi>
Date: 18 Oct 94 22:10:07 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6651
First of all: My apologies to Bruce Mason for forgetting to write his
name in my comments - I wrote as I did since I was not sure of your name
and thought to check it up when all was written. Then I had to quit
rather suddenly and forgot about it.
Second: IF, as some claim, Bruce Mason has snatched someone's ideas
somehow, I hereby forward all praise of these ideas to them.
Solace: Someone (sorry, succeeded in deleting that piece by mistake)
suggested that Malkioni Wizards see the vessel as sending their hidden
self into Solace. Would not that be the same thing as a "normal"
priest's sacrifice of his hidden self to his god - or am I just jumping
to conclusions when I assume someone in Solace are close to, if not in
the presence of, the Invisible God?
Vampires: Liked the suggestions about that a lot. That means both the
simple ones ("vampires spend all the POW they need before they undie") as
well as the more complicated ones (the chaotic Vessel).
However, what is it that says that there has to be vampire adepts
(sorcerers totally committed to their magic)? What infotmation about
vampire magic we has is the writeup of Vivamort in Cults of Terror, which:
A, is RQ2, so it consists of rune and spirit magic.
B, I do not have (whine) simply because I am one of those who began to
play when it was out of print.
When I thought of using vampires in our campaign (the Humakti in the
party decided to go and search for one just because of a rumor, and our
campaign generally consists of the players wanting to do something and me
showing them the consequences) I used what little information I had from
the prosopaedia and stiched together this idea: vampires use sorcery,
yes, in the way living and healthy people use spirit magic. Their "big
guns" comes from their Gifts from Vivamort - powers stolen by him in
Godtime from other beings. The first of these is simply becoming a
vampire, which simply means yoy loose your soul but can steal power from
others by drinking their blood. Each Gift has its drawback, however -
accquiring the gift means you also accquire the enmity of the one from
whom it was stolen, or his relatives if he does not exist anymore. I
never created any list or soemthing like that, but thought some ideas out
for each separate vampire. One of them could Stare Commandingly - Vivamort
stole this from a solar godling at Yelm's court, so the vampire in
question was burnt and demoralized by the sun. He had also gained the
power of healing very quickly - stolen from Genert, so he was unable to
pass ground sanctified or blessed by any earth deity - so he had to run
zig-zag around the fields of the village (Bless Crops-ed) when fleeing
from the characters. The cult of Vivamort knows the secret heroquests
that gives a vampire these powers, and teaches sorcery as well.
Erik
---------------------
From: 10027...@compuserve.com (Nick Brooke)
Subject: Sacred Time Chaos
Message-ID: <941018172930_10...@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 18 Oct 94 17:29:30 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6652
_________________
Rich Staats asks:
> There are numerous references to the gods/desses reenacting mythology
> during the Sacred Time (this makes sense in light of Illumination taking
> place during the Sacred Time too).
(Illumination doesn't, any more, but no matter...)
> Do the Chaotic deities participate in this too?
Yep. Reread the Orlanthi myth of the Summons of Evil. When we worshippers
reenact Orlanth's defeat of an Enemy God in a worship service, that Enemy
God is in fact *there*. When we ritually kill it in effigy, it is *hurt*.
Being a good Lightbringer, I have no idea what Chaos worshippers get up to
during Sacred Time, as I'm always kept busy doing my own rites. In fact,
sneaking away from the Lightbringer rites to spy on what evil, nasty, rude,
foreign gods are getting up to strikes me as a highly Chaotic way to carry
on: a way of weakening my cosmos, society, god, cult, etc.
> How vivid are these scenes? Do they just occur to holy folk chewing
> hamasim or are they there in the heavens for all to see?
In the heavens? Hell, we see them walking around in Greydog Village! Kornos
Longbrewer (our mighty Chieftain) looks great as Orlanth, and we all enjoy
chucking the Goat into the fire on the eleventh day. There's no time for us
to be staring off into space, what with all those buckets to fill and conga
lines and feasts and whatnot...
OK, I may be exaggerating a bit. But let's not forget that my Gloranthan
character's experience of Sacred Time will be of the rites he participates
in, which reaffirm his culture's worldview. So Chaos features only as a foe
to be kicked in, the Gods walk in the bodies of their greatest followers,
and *everything* is magical.
____________
Paul Reilly:
> Well, apparently there is a dispute about the origins of the Presence/
> Vessel system. Will people who saw it on the RQ4 list back in the first
> half of 1993 back me up?
Saw it, hell: I've still got my copy of it! Posted on 9th June '93, the
headers say. Is anyone else *seriously* claiming to have invented it? I
thought this was just another Adam Reynolds job: sloppy crediting and a
lack of respect for other people's work.
Let's give credit for any "wizardtastically wonderful" systems where it's
due: to the original authors! For the record, that's Paul Reilly and Mike
Holliday.
Being more optimistic, it's surely better that people are "independently"
running along the same tracks: something we usually take as proof of a
Gloranthan Truth Being Revealed. So, given that Bruce says he was working
at third hand without access to anything you'd written (except by word of
mouth), it's quite a boost that his core system looks so similar to yours!
Guess you can't keep a good idea down...
___________
David Hall:
I speak French, ride High Llama, and kick Sable butt. When are you free?
====
Nick
====
---------------------
From: pa...@phyast.pitt.edu (Paul Reilly)
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Tue, 18 Oct 1994, part 3
Message-ID: <941018151...@minerva.phyast.pitt.edu>
Date: 18 Oct 94 15:12:34 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6653
Hi. Paul Reilly here. Of course, ten seconds after I sent my last message
to RQDigest I got a very nice email from Brian Maples straightening things
out. THe situation is under control, and I'd like to thank all my friends
who sent supportive letters. More later, perhaps - must grade now.
SOrry about any confusion - the time lag on the Daily leads to misunderstand-
ings
-Paul Reill
y
---------------------
From: 10011...@compuserve.com (David Hall)
Subject: Death and Life
Message-ID: <941018205024_100...@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 18 Oct 94 20:50:24 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6654
Lismelder Humakti:
I don't really understand Alex's objections.
In the Lismelder tribe Humakti only have a role at the tribal level. They
don't have any loyalty to clan - beyond contractual obligations and
left-over family loyalty. They serve the king and the tribe.
So, it would be extremely unlikely for a Humakti to become a chieftain.
But, I don't see anything wrong with this? The Humakti's role is not that
of community leader, i.e. part-time judge, jury, farmer, herdsman,
craftsman, warrior, politician and leader. The Humakti is pure and simply a
warrior.
When the tribal king is chosen he must become an initiate of the Humakti
Temple and this allows him his authority over the Humakti and presumably
initiates him into their importance and role. This tradition goes back to
Indrodar who was the first to set this up.
In the past King and temple have argued about what is good for the tribe
and so the temple should not simply be seen as the king's lackeys - though
their fanatical loyalty to kings is well attested. Also, there have been
Humakti kings chosen in the past, usually in time of war.
But the basic fact is that chieftains, kings and queens are 85% of the time
from an Orlanth & Ernalda background and not from a Storm Bull, Humakti,
Lhankor Mhy, Chalana Arroy background. As Orlanth and Ernalda are the
rulers of the pantheon so are their worshippers the rulers of the clan and
tribe.
Orlanthi Marriage:
We've had one or two in the Lismelder campaign. I use as a basis the
Lightbringer model from the last Biturian Varosh entry in Cults of Prax.
An Orlanthi priest officiates, but the couple also receive sponsorship and
gifts from Lightbringer representatives. I think Fleshman was represented
by a drunk from the Greydog Inn. I'm not sure what he gave, or if he just
threw up.
For most clan marriages the Lightbringers are represented by important
Household or Clan figures, but it makes the marriage luckier if you can get
real priests and priestesses or important people. In one marriage they had
a friendly duck Issaries Goldentongue turn up and an Ernaldan priestess
they'd helped. You also get better gifts from those who owe you or are good
friends!
I'm also toying with the idea that these people also act as
Godfathers/mothers to the marriage. If there is trouble then either partner
can go to one of the sponsors of their marriage to get guidance. The
sponsors are honour bound to help. So if the king sponsors your marriage
you can maybe stretch things a bit and ask for help against a pesky
neighbour.
Of course, it cuts both ways when you have sponsor someone else's marriage.
Which gives me some ideas for the next game session...
Cheers,
David
---------------------
From: pa...@phyast.pitt.edu (Paul Reilly)
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Tue, 18 Oct 1994, part 1
Message-ID: <941019005...@minerva.phyast.pitt.edu>
Date: 19 Oct 94 00:55:43 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6655
About Sacred Time and Chaos:
I play that the Sacred Time rituals may attract opponents, who manifest
in a very real way. If there are no Chaos creatures clos to your
community, there is still some chance that Chaos will make use of the
local outlaws, etc. to disrupt the Sacred Time re-creation of the world.
:q
--
Paul Reilly, Department of Physics and Astronomy
University of Pittsburgh, Pittsburgh PA 15260 (USA)
E-mail: pa...@phyast.pitt.edu
I'm in Pittsburgh. Why am I here?
-- Harold Urey, Nobel Laureate
---------------------
From: Michell...@ed.gov (Michelle Ringo)
Subject: Divine Intervention
Message-ID: <9409187824....@ed.gov>
Date: 18 Oct 94 14:25:27 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6656
Divine Intervention --
Usually, we only get one divine intervention per encounter,
which can involve trying to heal everyone or send everyone
home, etc. However, the God/Goddess can only "see" those
worshipping him/her and those from associated cults. This
encourages PCs to only adventure with others like them or
associated cults.
---------------------
From: ddu...@radiomail.net (David Dunham)
Subject: spirits & spells
Message-ID: <1994101903...@radiomail.net>
Date: 19 Oct 94 03:35:30 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6657
Dave Cordes said
>our GM doesn't think that spell spirits
>know divine spells. They only know spirit or scorcery spells. Divine spells
>come from ceremonies (heroquests?) that are performed in temples. Not from
>spirits.
Spell Spirits don't, but other types of spirits can, notably Magic Spirits
and Ghosts (and I suspect many Cult Spirits, a poorly defined term if ever
there was one).
>I'd better be careful, or next I'll be agreeing with Nick and Peter.
Then you'd be Illuminated, since they never agree with each other...
RQ Daily Discussion List
This is the RuneQuest Daily Bulletin, a mailing list on
the subjects of Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's
world of Glorantha. It is sent out once per day in digest
format.
More details on the RuneQuest Daily and Digest can be found
after the last message in this digest.
X-RQ-ID: index
6658: joe = (Joerg Baumgartner)
- Re: Aeolian Heresy, and Fazzur as truly tragic hero
6659: JARDINE = JAR...@RMCS.CRANFIELD.AC.UK
- Lewis on Grue
6660: pyspas = (Paul Snow)
- Spirit Magic: What's going on?
6661: gerry = (Gerard Martin)
- Re: Resurrection
6662: dave_cordes = (Dave Cordes)
- Illuminated Posters
6663: igorlick = (ian i. gorlick)
- Esrolian society
6664: sandyp = (Sandy Petersen)
- Re: howdy
6665: PMichaels = PMic...@aol.com
- Trickster
6666: 100116.2616 = (David Hall)
- Les Dieux Nomades
6667: 100270.337 = (Nick Brooke)
- Rosy
6668: loren = (Loren Miller)
- Rules: GOONQUEST 1
6669: ddunham = (David Dunham)
- Tales of Ralios
---------------------
From: JAR...@RMCS.CRANFIELD.AC.UK
Subject: Lewis on Grue
Message-ID: <941019093...@Sun.COM>
Date: 19 Oct 94 09:34:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6659
Hi Everyone
I was dusting off some old files and came across a file I wrote a while ago. The subject matter is Grue detailing the various types and development
that occurs over time. For those of you who do not realize it GRUE == ALIEN.
Consequently I've shamelessly ripped off ideas from the books and films (but
not the RPG). The files also includes the stats of the (worker) grue from the
Gloranthan bestiary with only minor mods to bring it in line with my ideas.
If people are interested I will post it to the digest (its 260 lines),
I will however delete the worker grue bit unless Sandy is happy to leave it
in since he is the original author and Creator/Ripper Off of the species...
Cheers
Lewis
---------------------
From: pys...@bath.ac.uk (Paul Snow)
Subject: Spirit Magic: What's going on?
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.90.94101...@midge.bath.ac.uk>
Date: 19 Oct 94 12:07:49 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6660
Spirit Magic
------------
What happens when you learn a spirit magic spell? I was under the
impression that once you beat a spirit in spirit combat you can call on
it again to work for you. My GM informs me that when I beat a spirit in
combat it then teaches me how to do something and that is what I take
away from the encounter. How do these different ideas work in practice?
Under the first, if in combat you call upon your Bladesharp spirit
then it dances up and down your sword trying to wound your opponent. If
you call upon a Heal spirit it licks the wound clean and holds it
together. etc. If you cast Ploughsharp it sits at the point of the Plough
scrabbling soil out of its path.
Under the second (official ?) version then you call upon a piece of
knowledge that you may not be able to remember and if you recall it you
fight better. This can be seen as calling upon some extra hidden reserve
( I'm sure Sandy wrote about people getting Spirit Magic like effects in
the real world by mental training) but I rather like my vision of it as
well.
How do you imagine spirit magic to work?
Paul "Interested in Glorantha - Knows v. little about RQ" Snow
---------------------
From: ge...@clan.demon.co.uk (Gerard Martin)
Subject: Re: Resurrection
Message-ID: <920326193...@clan.demon.co.uk>
Date: 26 Mar 92 19:38:06 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6661
Dave Cordes :
____________
> >Colin Watson:
> >I tend to adhere to the idea that newly-dead spirits retain their STR, CON
> >and DEX for a while after death (though these characteristics are fairly
> >useless in the spirit-world and tend to dissolve in a matter of days). If
> >you recovered the spirit quickly enough and used a 5-POW binding
> >enchantment on the body (to bind the pseudo-ghost's INT POW DEX STR and
> >CON) I think you'd essentially restore the person's life.
I disagree with you here Colin because I believe spirits only possess INT
and POW. The characteristics of STR CON and DEX are inherently physical
attributes of the body and therefore are left behind when the spirit leaves.
> ______________
> X-RQ-ID: 6489 Joerg Baumgartner:
>
> >Shamans are known to travel into the border zone between life and death
> >to guide spirits back to their bodies. They do so in case of diseases
> >or curses which cause a soul to leave the body, and probably an
> >untimely death by violence or accidents will send the unprepared spirit
> >into this region, too. If the body left by the spirit still (or again)
> >is inhabitable, I think the shaman ought to be able to guide the spirit
> >back and force it into the mundane plane again. While I think that some
> >permanent POW loss ought to be involved, I don't feel there should be a
> >binding matrix enchantment as a component. Maybe this POW is used to
> >seal the leak through which the spirit escaped into the Otherworld.
>
> I like this idea. It solves my previous problems with Colin's solution. I
> don't need a Bind Elmer's (or whoever) Spirit Spell. As to the loss of PWR
> needed to bind the spirit back into the body. How about using Colin's
> suggestion of 5 PWR, one each for INT, PWR, DEX, STR, and CON?
>
I also like Joerg's idea which is similar to the way in which I play. Just
to give you a quick run down :
The shaman requires the body to be fully healed and painted with a
harmony rune. After death the body still resonates with the essence of the
departed spirit. Using this resonance as a guide the shaman travels into
the border zone between life and death and tracks down the spirit (Track
Resonating Spirit ;) After dealing with any random encounters and finding
the spirit, the shaman offers the spirit the oportunity of returning to
life in its former body. If unwilling the shaman has the option of
stopping here or defeating the spirit in spirit combat. The shaman guides
the spirit back to the body and re-establishes the link between them by
giving up three points of POW.
Using the RQ rules for travel in the spirit plane the shaman searches for
the lost spirit by rolling on the random encounters table and treating any
roll of ghost as the lost spirit.
The harmony rune is used as a focus for the 3 POW and to ease the joining
of spirit and body.
optional: The ceremony skill may be used as a percentage to gain the "scent" of
the lingering essence.
Thomas Moffatt
c/o Gerry.
~===========================================================================~
Gerard Martin - ge...@clan.demon.co.uk (Private Node)
---------------------
From: dave_cordes@cl_63smtp_gw.chinalake.navy.mil (Dave Cordes)
Subject: Illuminated Posters
Message-ID: <941019152...@Sun.COM>
Date: 19 Oct 94 00:24:10 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6662
CL QM-SMTP gw Illuminated Posters
X-RQ-ID: 6657 David Dunham :
>>I'd better be careful, or next I'll be agreeing with Nick and Peter.
>Then you'd be Illuminated, since they never agree with each other...
Hey! One of the powers of an illuminate is to Ignore Cult Restrictions.
Cool. Then I could stop putting Subject Lines on my postings.
Unfortunately I'm terrible at riddles.
DC
---------------------
From: igor...@bnr.ca (ian i. gorlick)
Subject: Esrolian society
Message-ID: <_16689_Wed_Oct_19_12:08:48_1...@bnr.ca>
Date: 19 Oct 94 08:07:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6663
The recent posts about Esrolian culture and society have been very interesting.
I like Nick's sort-of-egyptian flavour to the place. I do feel that the society
still needs a couple extra mechanisms to maintain the matriarchal structure.
The suggestion that only females can own slaves or hold an indenture gives the
females a large economic advantage. I would extend this by insisting that only
women can own land, or inherit title to use land if the land is held communally.
I would also include some magical/religious mechanisms that help convince the
men of the rightness of female dominated society. I suggest that all citizens of
the country are required to be initiated into the cult of Esrola/Ernalda (there
may be a special category of initiation for males that differs from females).
Any adult resident of the country who is not an initiate is subject to immediate
enslavement. (Special visitor's visas are available for foreigners, but make
sure you leave the country before it expires.) All other local cults tolerate
dual membership, even Humakt allows this extra initiation into the earth cult.
This situation will leave the male population of the county either subject to
the cult spirits of reprisal or to enslavement. The cult spirits of reprisal
work in subtle ways to ensure that male initiates LIKE their subservient
position. The spirits work through the powers of earth and fertility. A male
being targetted by the spirits finds that his sex life is no fun, he has trouble
getting and maintaining an erection and his orgasms are much less intense. He
also finds that his food (products of the earth) is tasteless no matter how much
spice is added. Beer won't make him merry, it just exercises his kidneys. Get
the picture? Of course, as soon as he reforms his behaviour life becomes much
more fun. The cult probably has spirits of reconciliation which actually improve
things above their normal state to reinforce how much nicer life is when you
behave properly.
I want to create a female cult that works through subtler persuasion and
reconciliation as opposed to the standard male cults where spirits of reprisal
beat on the miscreant until he repents.
-------------------
About the tragic saga of Fazzur and his Esrolian love....
Bravo! Bravo!
Everyone contributing take a bow!
This is definitely a three-hanky story.
---------------------
From: san...@idcube.idsoftware.com (Sandy Petersen)
Subject: Re: howdy
Message-ID: <941019175...@idcube.idsoftware.com>
Date: 19 Oct 94 06:00:05 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6664
Paul Reilly:
>I play that the Sacred Time rituals may attract opponents, who
>manifest in a very real way.
The opponents, of course, which may be chaos monsters, are
simply re-enacting their _own_ sacred time. In addition, most Sacred
Time rituals that include opponents doubtless include special
opponents just for this task. For instance, a person made up to be
Orlanth Traitorous no doubt appears at the Yelm rituals and does a
ritual assault, then repentance, bringing Yelm back from his sleep.
In Pamaltela, every Sacred Time a Sikkanos outlaw approaches
the local Pamalt chieftain and must ask him for a task. If the task
is impossible, the outlaw band instead must refrain from attacking or
robbing anyone from that tribe for the rest of the year. Normally,
the chieftain assigns something quite impossible (one tradition is to
ask for "a rock from Enmal").
---------------------
From: 10011...@compuserve.com (David Hall)
Subject: Les Dieux Nomades
Message-ID: <941019205912_100...@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 19 Oct 94 20:59:12 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6666
Jerome Caille asks:
>Have you a beta version or is it released yet?
It's a final production copy. I'm not sure if it's been released yet - it
must be soon.
Greg Fried asked me to post the address of Oriflam. It is:
132 rue de Marly,
57 158 Montigny-les-Metz
I'm not sure if they do mail order. Perhaps Jerome can suggest a good shop
in Paris that will do mail order? I once got some RQ supplements and copies
of Tatou from L'Oeuf Cube, who were very helpful and tolerant!
I wonder, does anybody know if Oriflam stuff gets over to shops in
French-speaking Canada?
Jerome also asks:
>Do you know if it's possible to join the two boards in one game?
Almost. They do just about match (though the hexes are slightly different
sizes). But only about half of the edge of each map is common. We need a
Dagori Inkarth map next.
I just noticed that the original Chaosium Dragon Pass map does match up
with the RQ2 Trollpak map and with the Chaosium Nomad Gods map. However,
the Dagori Inkarth map doesn't match the Nomad Gods map. Ho hum.
Cheers,
David
---------------------
From: 10027...@compuserve.com (Nick Brooke)
Subject: Rosy
Message-ID: <941019235426_10...@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 19 Oct 94 23:54:26 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6667
______
Lewis:
> Mike
> I loved the image of Lunars seeing the World through ROSE TINTED
> SPECTACLES...
Cf. Chris Gidlow's "Cult of Glamour" in Tales #12.
______
David:
>> I'd better be careful, or next I'll be agreeing with Nick and Peter.
> Then you'd be Illuminated, since they never agree with each other...
Depends on which Peter. Some of them are less foolish than others.
====
Nick
====
---------------------
From: j...@sartar.toppoint.de (Joerg Baumgartner)
Subject: Re: Aeolian Heresy, and Fazzur as truly tragic hero
Message-ID: <H.ea.PZX...@sartar.toppoint.de>
Date: 19 Oct 94 09:01:34 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6658
David Hall basks in the light of the Red Moon in X-RQ-ID: 6639
The apparent Lunar bias of this scholar makes his claims for mental
unadjustment somewhat untrustworthy (as if being a Lunar simp wouldn't
suffice):
> A Nest of Vipers:
> Of course they called Onjur a Poet to be polite. His was in fact mad,
> completely mad.
A good Loonie?
> Driven insane by his unnatural lusts for his mother, and
> his consuming desire to avenge her death.
Evil Lunar propaganda, as can be found elsewhere.
> But perhaps the final proof of Onjur's madness came in 1631. Would else but
> a madman would ally himself with the barbarian war-leader Argrath
> Demonspawn?
This passage truly rips off the mask of the innocent, gentle guise of the
editor of TotRM!
> I believe the real tragedy is that Fazzur was innocent of any crime except
> love. I believe that it was the Queen who killed his wife and presented it
> to Fazzur as a fait accompli (strangulation is the traditional method of
> ritual Esrolian execution). What could Fazzur do? The damage was already
> done and he loved her...
> Are you satisfied Joerg? This cesspit is of your making!! Do you weep for
> Fazzur?
Of my making? You were the one who came up with the strangulation of his
first wife, you were the one who didn't allow them a peaceful retirement
somewhere outside of Tarsh. I was just forced by your foul annoncement
of Fazzur's murder to reconcile the facts with Onjur Fazzursson's
honourable Orlanthi nature. And what happens? You declare this epitome
of Tarshite manhood a Lunatic only because he opposes the Lunar
depredations of Moirades and Pharandros! Phie!
> The Aeolian Church of Heortland
> History
> The history of our church begins with the Lightbringer's Quest when
> Orlanth, Creator and Invisible God created the world with the Great
> Compromise and with Time. Afterwards his son Malkion, Hrestol the First
> Prophet, and the Lightbringer Saints carried his worship across the world.
Malkion, son of Aerlit...
Do you believe that the Hendriki identify Aerlit with Orlanth, or is
this "son of" business only a metaphoric expression of kinship?
Since *rl*t is very similar to all the other names of the local Orlanths
(Worlath, Orlando, Orlantio, what was Nick's Wenelian version?), an
actual father-son relation is not impossible.
> Harmast recognized Arkat as Humaktsson, and taught him the Orlanthi ways of
> Dragon Pass. Arkat recognized the true origin of both ways and spread this
> amongst his followers: Orlanth and the Invisible God were one in the same
> and always had been.
This is the core of the Aeolian creed.
> However, Arkat was defeated twice, both times by the Sun worshippers of the
> Pelorian lowlands. Many of his followers despaired, thinking that Arkat had
> somehow miscalculated or offended Orlanth.
Where and when was it that Arkat was defeated by the lowland Pelorians?
While I haven't seen the Arkat's Saga, I think that such victories would
have left their traces in Dara Happan history. A military feat like
winning a decisive victory over the foe of the Bright Lord of Dorastor
certainly would have found its way into the Elmexdros rolls (the military
history of Dara Happa, in DHBE).
> Then came another Hero to Arkat,
> his name was Kwaratch Kang, and he was a troll from the Castle of Lead.
> Kwaratch taught Arkat the ways of the Trolls and from him Arkat learnt of
> yet another aspect of Orlanth the Creator, the missing aspect that would
> give him victory over Chaos. With this knowledge Arkat was able to defeat
> Gbaji in Dorastor, and thus was Chaos forced back for another Age.
I'm not so sure an Aeolian would view it this way...
I like to interpret Arkat's troll escapade as a very elaborate version
of the Sandals of Darkness quest - creep into the troll stronghold and
steal a power from them, and break a few legs or heads while doing so...
> Many people think that Arkat betrayed the secrets of the Lightbringers and
> Solace & Joy when he embraced the forces of Darkness to destroy Chaos. But
> the truth is that he discovered deeper truths of the Invisible God.
As long as we keep in mind that Arkat assumed human form again after
slaying Gbaji, and returned to the creed of Orlanth and Malkion, as
Aeol reported. The Black Arkati troll friends don't understand this and
keep trollhood as their false ideal, and that is why their souls are
endangered.
> Arkat later founded and ruled a great Dark Empire in Ralios which
> worshipped Orlanth in the same way that he had been worshipped at the
> beginning of time.
As opposed to Harmast's mode of worship, which dominated Dragon Pass,
Peloria and the backwater regions of Ralios?
> He also set his followers to guard all of the places on
> the heroplane and in the underworld where Chaos might seep in again.
A guard which was broken or bypassed by the God Learners...
> Saint Aeol was a companion of Harmast, and then Arkat, and when he returned
> home from Arkat's Dark Empire he brought with him Arkat's knowledge and
> taught it to us. Now that the Dark Empire is no more we are the last people
> who follow the correct form of worship according to Arkat.
Saint Aeol: I said this before... I feel that "Aeol" is a nom-de-guerre
rather than an actual name, maybe analogous to the Saulus -> Paulus
change. There has been an Aeolian school of Sorcery among the ancient
elemental schools of sorcery, which I believe to exist in Sog City to
this date. (As part of the college of alchemy?)
> In the Third Age Chaos has returned in the guise of the Red Goddess and the
> Red Emperor. We must fight her and seek a new Liberator who will unite the
> forces of the West, the Orlanthi, and the Trolls, in the correct worship of
> the Creator. Only in this way can Chaos be defeated!
Trolls and Kitori aren't really what the Aeolians would regard as
potential allies, as I see them.
And the Lunar threat is not that immediate to the Aeolians - their one
encounter with Fazzur's expeditionary force in 1605 ST (during the
Building Wall battle) didn't really touch their lands, and after this
trouble the Rokari take-over and the Kingdom of Malkonwal were foremost
in their mind, I'd guess. The Lunar Army under Fazzur came almost as
liberators in 1621, and given Fazzur's preoccupation with Esrolia wouldn't
have been in the focus of the magical attention as long as Whitewall
holds out. The conservative Brian will need some time to gain their
trust and help, and it will be Tatius who finally makes the Aeolians
fervent supporters of the Volsaxi king: Tatius, as a Dara Happan Yelmite,
will have no understanding about the gentle methods of treating Theyalans,
and will tax and regulate them rigorously, as if they were Lodrilite
or Dendaran peasants.
There is a new liberator on the horizon, though...
--
-- Joerg Baumgartner j...@sartar.toppoint.de
RQ Daily Discussion List
---------------------
From: lo...@hops.wharton.upenn.edu (Loren Miller)
Subject: Rules: GOONQUEST 1
Message-ID: <941020042...@Sun.COM>
Date: 19 Oct 94 20:28:22 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6668
GOONQUEST 1: An Almost Fully-Compatible RuneQuest Variant of
Ultra-Lite Rules
RuneQuest is a trademark of Avalon Hill
Glorantha is a trademark of Chaosium
Copyright 1994 by Loren J. Miller
All Rights Reserved
GOAL
I wanted GoonQuest 1 to be a rules-lite system of sleazy
shortcuts and time-saving guidelines that I as GM can use for
NPCs and Monsters et al (Goons) while players continue to play
their detailed PCs. Goons under this system should be 85%
identical (the Orlanthi "all") to fully detailed RuneQuest
characters in combat situations, which are the game situations
most closely covered by game rules. They approximate RQ
characters somewhat more closely in most non-combat situations,
where RQ characters are not described in such excruciating
detail. Magic is a problem, but I've attempted to find a workable
solution.
If I haven't hit close to my goals with these rules, let me
know how they can be improved.
EQUIPMENT
You will need a pencil, some dice (10 sided, 6 sided, and
others to taste), and a bunch of blank or lined index cards. I
use 3" by 5" cards which I can get in any stationery or drug
store in the USA. You could also use a pad of paper, or loose
sheets of paper, but they aren't as easy to index as cards are.
The whole goal of GoonQuest 1 is to make things easy for the
referee, and I've found over 17 years of GMing that a small file
box with index cards arranged alphabetically is the ideal place
to keep NPCs ready for quick reference. So I recommend that you
get a small filebox and a bunch of index cards, and start going
crazy with your pencil! Just don't put out any eyes with it...
CHARACTER DESCRIPTION STUFF
First off let's get the terminology straight. In GoonQuest 1
we don't call sentient gameworld entities "characters," as most
roleplaying games do. That's because GoonQuest 1 isn't a complete
roleplaying game. It's a method of describing non-player
characters succinctly while allowing them to be used in a game of
RuneQuest (RQ). So instead of calling them GoonQuest characters,
we will call them Goons. Got that? Now it's time to move on.
Every character has a defining ability. Some games call it a
character class. In RuneQuest the defining ability actually turns
out to be whichever skill or characteristic the character's
player rolls against most often. For most RuneQuest characters
the defining ability turns out to be a weapon skill or a
professional skill of some sort, though a shaman might be defined
by Fetch POW, a wizard by his sorcery skills, and a priest by her
ceremony or cult lore skills. In GoonQuest terminology the
defining ability will be called the goon's GoonPower (GP).
Choose the name for your Goon's GoonPower. If the Goon is a
fighter, then "Fighter" would make a dandy name for the
character's GoonPower. If the Goon is a thief, then "Thief" would
make a dandy GP name (funny how familiar that sounds). If the
Goon is a religious fanatic, then "Priest" would make a dandy GP
name (we're still playing RuneQuest, after all). Note that the
main GP is supposed to be very broad. It's a succinct description
of what the Goon does. It should not be narrow like a RQ skill.
It should be broad like a character class from The Other Game
(TOG).
Now write it down on something. An index card (the kind you
would keep in a small file-box) is a good place to write it.
Everything you need for a Goon should fit easily on a single
index card (a 3x5 card in american lingo). Choose a percentile
score for the GP. I'd suggest somewhere around 60% as a solid
score for average folks in society, 90% for expert opposition,
and 100% and up for really scary opponents. You probably know how
to gauge this pretty well already, being experienced RQ referees
yourself. Here is a table that I try to stick to with my own
NPCs. I find that if I don't then skill masters are always
popping out of the woodwork, yet nobody has ever heard their
names... a ludicrous situation you will admit (I hope).
GP% How Good Are You?
45% Talented Beginner, Apprentice
60% Journeyman, Normal unmotivated folks
75% Professional, Business Owner, a Specialist
90% Master, Locally Known
105% Master, Regionally Known
120% Grand Master, Nationally Known, a local hero
If one GP isn't enough to define the character then write
some more down. Call them GP2, and set them at about 30% below
GP1 (GP1 == Goon's highest GP). There should be no more than two
GP2 entries. If you need yet more then call them GP3s, and set
them at about 30% below the GP2s.
Finally, you may want to give each Goon a flaw, or something
distinctive that helps players (and you) to remember it. One
might be bald, another might have a high-pitched laugh at
inappropriate times, another might have a nasty scar across its
cheek, or smell like cheese. We will call it a GoonFlaw (GF).
GoonFlaws might have game effects, or they might not, it's up to
the GoonMaster (GM) to decide. So that's why I haven't assigned
percentile values to them. I suggest that if the PCs are getting
demolished and you figure they need a break then the GoonFlaw
makes itself obnoxious and gives them the break they need. Or if
they're having too easy a time of it the GoonFlaw doesn't have
any game effect at all.
Here's an example Goon. Note that I've tried to make
Koraloon more than just an enemy warrior. He has a personality of
some sort. It is actually possible to roleplay him as is. And
when the Index Card is filled out with all the stuff you need to
know (look in MORE CHARACTER DESCRIPTION STUFF) he'll be pretty
darn easy to use in a RQ session.
Koraloon the Goon
Tough Customer of Kolating Descent
GP: Mercenary Fighter 60%
GP2: Drinker 30%
GP2: Ancestor Worshipper 30%
GF: Stutters
Here's another example Goon, based at 90% instead of 60%.
Quite a different type of Goon, wouldn't you say? Note that this
Goon has a specialty in his main GP. See below for how to give a
specialty to a character.
Vangker the Tanner
Expert Tanner in Nochet
GP: Tanner and Leatherworker 82% (Huckster 98%)
GP2: Streetwise 60%
GP2: Initiate of Artisan God 60%
GP3: Poet 30%
GP3: Erotic Arts 30%
GF: Smells like blood, stained with dyes
And here's another, even weirder.
Brainbusterandeater the Broo
Feral Broo in the woods around Apple Lane
GP: Feral Broo 57% (Head Butt 63%)
GP2: Nauseating Body Odor 30%
GP2: Write Disturbing Runes on Object 30%
GF: Forgetful
MORE CHARACTER DESCRIPTION STUFF
You may want to elaborate the character description a
little. Or you may not... until it's too late. Following are some
sneaky shortcuts to derive practically everything you could ever
want to know from a Goon's GPs. Luckily, if you discover a
burning need to elaborate the Goon's index card at the last
minute (for instance in the middle of a game session) you can.
Just hurriedly follow these guidelines and put on your best Mona
Lisa face. The players will think something horrible is going on
as you roll dice and smile enigmatically.
GOALS AND STRATEGIES: Generally you will want to add a
sentence or so that describes what the Goon's goal will be in the
scenario, and what strategy it is likely to use to achieve its
goal.
SPECIALTIES: Many Goons are specialists in some particular
part of their GPs. A Mercenary Fighter might specialize with her
sword. To make a specialty roll 1d10 and add it to the GP for the
specialty skill, and subtract it from the GP for other related
skills. For example, say Koraloon is a Swordsman. I roll 1d10 and
get a 6. Now his GP looks like this: "Mercenary Fighter 54%
(Sword 66%)." Alternately, if you don't want to roll dice, you
can choose a number between 1 and 10 and modify the GP according
to the same rules.
COMBAT STATS: If the Goon has a tough-guy or combat-related
GP then divide that by 5 to get its HP. Compute location HP as
usual, or if you need a shortcut just divide HP by three and add
or subtract one for bigger or smaller locations. Double HP and
consult the Damage Bonus table for Damage Bonus. All combat
skills are at the appropiate GP, and if there are no appropiate
GPs written down, then add one at GP3 level (GP1 minus 60%, with
a minimum of 10%). Unless you want to work out SRs assume that
all Goons have a DEX SR of 3 and a Base SR of 5.
CHARACTERISTICS AND STUFF: If it becomes necessary in some
game situation to get the Goon's actual characteristics, roll 1d3
or 1d6 (your choice) and add or subtract from HP for SIZ. Do the
opposite for CON. Roll 2d4-5 and add to HP for STR, or 2d6-7
would work too. Base Dexterity off the most physically adept of
the Goon's GPs, if there are any. Divide the GP by 5 to get DEX.
Compute SR as usual. Base INT off any intellectual GPs, POW off
any magical GPs (with a minimum of 10), and APP off any
communication GPs (minimum 10, unless the flaw affects the Goon's
appeal). If you don't like any of these options for a particular
Goon, you should either pick a number or roll the dice. It's your
choice, GoonMaster.
MAGIC AND STUFF: Magic is the most problematic thing you
have to deal with because fully detailed RQ characters are
supposed to have so many spells. And since GoonQuest is designed
for GMs who make up Goons on the run, in the middle of a session,
the GM doesn't have much time to decide on spells. Also, spell-
users aren't rare in RuneQuest like they are in the world of
Glorantha. So... what can you do? I don't have any answer for
which spells to pick. You'll have to consult your ethnic and
social campaign resources for that. But I can tell you how much
magic the Goons get. If the Goon uses spirit magic from a shaman
or a divine temple, choose one of the Goon's GPs, whichever is
the magical one, and divide by 5 to get the points of spells the
Goon has. If the Goon's main GP is "Shaman" or a synonym, then it
also has a fetch of GP/5 POW. If the character is a divine magic
user, then the magical GP better be its main GP. If it is, then
it gets GP/5 points of divine magic. If it isn't primarily a
divine magic user, then each point of divine magic counts as two
points of spirit magic. If the character uses sorcery, then it
knows GP/5 sorcerous skills and spells. Sorcery-using characters
often have enchanted items. Each two points of enchantments
counts as one sorcerous skill or spell. If a Goon is a
sorceror/wizard/whatever with its main GP being sorceror, then it
also gets a familiar of POW GP/5. Henotheists and other users of
mixed magical systems combine all these systems. You're the
GoonMaster, you figure it out.
USING GOONQUEST IN COMBAT
Take the Combat Stats you derived above and use them in your
standard RQ combat. Goons lose Hit Points and inflict damage just
like RQ characters do. Use the Goon's combat-related GP for its
attack, parry or dodge, and maneuver skills, modifying
appropriately for specialties.
USING GOONQUEST IN SIMPLE SKILL USE SITUATIONS
Pick the appropriate GP, modify according to task
difficulty, and roll against it on percentile dice, just as if it
were a RQ skill. Contests of skills work just like they do in RQ.
So do special and critical successes and fumbles. Here's a simple
table of modifiers that I use.
Modifier Task Difficulty
+50 Ludicrously simple
+25 Simple
+5 to +10 Minor advantage
-5 to -10 Minor disadvantage
-25 Hard
-50 Very Hard
-75 Ludicrously Hard
-100 Impossible (I wouldna believed it if I hadna seen
it with my own eyes!)
USING GOONQUEST IN STAT VS STAT SITUATIONS
Divide the appropriate GP by 5 and use that in place of the
necessary stat. If the resulting stat is very low, you might want
to bring it up to 9 or 10. Or you may not. Or you could roll 3d6
or some other appropriate number of dice for the stat. It's GM's
choice. You will need this for POW more often than any other
stat, because of RQ's magic rules, so you may want to routinely
record Goons' POW when you first write them down.
USING GOONQUEST FOR CHARACTERISTIC ROLLS
Pick the appropriate GP, modify according to task
difficulty, and roll against it on percentile dice.
USING GOONQUEST 1 AS A STANDALONE GAME
It can't be done. That would have to wait for GoonQuest 2
(GQ2). I have some ideas on how to go about it, but the result
wouldn't be compatible with RQ anymore. RQ characters used in GQ2
would have to be completely reworked, not a difficult task, but
they would lose quite a bit of detail. The resulting game
(GoonQuest 2) would still be relatively freeform, but the rules
would be somewhat stricter since they'd have to handle PCs as
well as NPC Goons. If you really want to see GQ2 let me know and
I'll try to coalesce my ideas and write them down. Or you can
consult Over the Edge, a superb roleplaying game written by
Jonathan Tweet and published by Atlas Games, to get a hint at the
way I would develop GPs and the rest of the Goon description
system into a complete resolution system.
--
Loren Miller <lo...@hops.wharton.upenn.edu>
I can tell by your shoes that you are a lover of liberty
---------------------
From: ddu...@radiomail.net (David Dunham)
Subject: Tales of Ralios
Message-ID: <1994102006...@radiomail.net>
Date: 20 Oct 94 06:26:37 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6669
The following is a writeup of recent events in my campaign (after every
session I write these so we can all remember the next time we get
together). It illustrates a few things recently discussed, as well as being
an example of how I run things, and an Orlanthi scenario. This might be a
bit of a lengthy way to make a point, let me know what you think.
Year 19 of Ekel Field-Destroyer
When he discovered that Una was pregnant, Nath Brawl [1] had a
divination cast. He was upset when the seer's answer was, "Life begins at
night." [2] However, Ekel Field-Destroyer also had a divination cast for
his grandchild, and got, "Dark rage's sister sings, a child is born. The
waters cover all." The consensus was that the prophecies mentioned Xiola
Umbar, the troll goddess of healing. The obvious place to find her was in
the troll lands in eastern Corolaland, but Methe the Traveller said that
the Mokevogi clan's women worshipped Xiola Umbar to ease their childbirth
[3]. They decided to head east; they would at least go as far as the Ajim
tribe, and possibly on to Corolaland. They took some trade goods that
trolls might want, and Nath figured they could go on a cattle raid just
before they met the trolls.
Jornast wanted to talk to the Kolating shaman at the Orlanth
complex in Kilwin, so they headed for the city [4]. They decided to camp
outside, though they had trouble finding a spot, and ended up giving gifts
to a local farmer. [5]
Una was examined at the Chalana Arroy temple. They predicted she'd
have a girl, and recommended against Xiola Umbar as being coarse and
violent.
Korun visited the Lawspeaking Lodge, and learned a little about
trolls from Engorn the Head-Full, such as a drum beat to beware of.
Una spotted a man wearing a tall, red and white striped,
cylindrical hat, being followed by a man dressed similarly but with a
beret. The latter said he worked for Eleskorth of Noloswal, on the coast,
and that his master, a busy man, knew about trolls. He agreed to receive
them at the Seventeen-Point Moose Inn that evening after Una promised that
Konall would play his bagpipes
Una also talked to a newtling, who didn't much like trolls but had
traded fish with one for some gems. The newtling said that Kilwin was named
after the newtling hero who built it, and that the blue-green dome
currently underwater was their temple to Doskior and Pastoma, and would be
exposed in Fire Season when the river was lower.
At the inn, Eleskorth's lackey didn't extend any hospitality. Nath
entered a drinking contest and lost, possibly due to trickery. When the
lackey was again rude, pointedly refusing to offer food or an apology, they
decided not to see Eleskorth after all -- either he knew nothing of
hospitality, or didn't respect them, and in either case, they wanted
nothing of him. They returned to their camp in the dark with some
difficulty.
After several days, Jornast learned a Multimissile spell, and they
continued east. They stayed again with Denall Talvingi, who hadn't had any
trouble with trollkin since they'd last visited. [6]
As they entered Ajim lands, they were met by two chariots and five
men on foot who asked, "Are you friends or foes of the Kolorain clan?"
Although Korun tried to stay neutral, eventually insults were exchanged,
and they attacked. Several of the Olkoring warriors threw javelins great
distances [7]. One knocked Harmast off his horse, but he got up and
continued the charge on foot. Jornast used Multimissile on a javelin and
killed a horse, then Befuddled the driver of the other chariot. Una and
Konall took out its warrior, and Konall chased after the driver, who
managed to knock him off his horse.
Nath fought from the chariot yoke until he had taken several
wounds. Finally, only one of the Olkoring warriors was still standing.
Korun asked him to surrender. He hesitated, then agreed. Korun then took
off on his charger, caught up to the charioteer, and dispelled the Befuddle
spell on him. He then persuaded him to join his kinsmen in surrender.
They took the arms and armor, as well as the three surviving
horses, one chariot, and the wheels from the other one.
The Olkoring explained their feud with the Kolorain, who were also
of the Ajim tribe, and denied that any Ajimi worshipped a troll god.
They ran across several standing stones arranged in a straight
line, each covered with strange runes.
They arrived at the Mokevogi tula, and explained their mission to
the thane, Dorn Hundred Hogs. He gave Una a cloak, and had them escorted to
the Soothing Touch Grove. On the way, their guide pointed out Narent's Oak,
sacred to Narent Mudman who blessed their pigs, and told about Bowbreaker,
another local spirit. [8]
The circle of trees contained a crudely carved but obviously female
statue. Dailenn Curly Hair was the grove's tender. She denied any
connection between the local spirit Soothing Touch and the troll goddess
Xiola Umbar, although trolls sometimes visited the grove. She was unwilling
to let outsiders participate in a Mokevogi ritual - it was bad enough that
an outsider, Madur Great Valor of the Jaskori clan, had just last Storm
Season stolen the necklace which had hung on the statue.
At the feast that night, they learned that Madur Great Valor was a
Storm Lord, and was from the Narit tribe, so it was difficult to obtain
justice [9]. He'd stolen the necklace because of a geas [10]. The Mokevogi
had twice sent warriors to get the necklace back, and failed.
Intamorl the Noble's sister Kimne (Konall's aunt) had married into
the Mokevogi clan. Her granddaughter Ingkar introduced herself, and wanted
to hear all about her distant kin. She offered to intercede with Dailenn
Curly Hair, who eventually agreed to perform the childbirth ritual if they
returned Soothing Touch's necklace. Jornast swore an oath to do so.
Meanwhile, Konall hobnobbed with Akavran the Piper of the Lelvani clan, who
was a guest at the stead.
The Ozobo clan demanded a toll of one cow to cross their lands.
Harmast shamed them by pointing out how greedy this was, and they agreed to
let the group pass. Konall then offered a contest. Nath won a chariot race,
Korun defeated his opponent in a memory game, and Jornast won a javelin
toss.
They were met by warriors in finely decorated chariots, who
escorted them to Madur Great Valor's stead. Madur was busy giving craisech
instruction and other duties of a Rune Lord. [11]
At the feast that night. Una asked about the various items on the
trophy wall. Madur was glad to explain about the leather hat that had once
housed a sorcerer's familiar, the Telmori shaman's drum which still growled
every Wildday, and the necklace he'd stolen from a darkness goddess so that
he could join the Sandals of Darkness subcult. [12]
They slept in the great hall, but decided not to steal the
unguarded necklace while they were guests.
The next morning, Madur drove off on more cult business, and they
debated their options. Many people in Madur's stead seemed to have the
sniffles - Madur himself had a persistent cough. Although Harmast and Una
tried toplay it up, everybody seemed to think it was just an unusually bad
case of seasonal colds, though they had lasted quite a while. Jornast and
Nath were both willing to fight Madur, but everyone finally decided to try
another approach first. [13]
When Madur Great Valor returned, Harmast eloquently explained why
they needed the necklace. Madur gave it to them.
Comments:
[1] Una is the daughter of Ekel Field-Destroyer, thane of the Belovaking
clan. She's married to Nath Brawl, Urox initiate and son of Kerval Very
Tall, thane of the Karbaring clan of Keanos.
[2] Gotta love them Divinations.
[3] Methe the Traveller is the Talking God representative on the clan ring;
her tales have appeared on the Digest earlier.
[4] I'm allowing every character to learn one spell not normally available
from the pantheon -- one way around the fact that no Orlanth worshipper can
learn Multimissile (despite Odayla being in the pantheon -- Odayla isn't an
associated deity). The Kolating shamans who sometimes hang out at the Great
Temple in Kilwin are convenient for this.
[5] They wanted to camp outside Kilwin because, being good Orlanthi and
used to hospitality, they were uncomfortable at the idea of paying for it
at an inn.
[6] Denall of the Talvingi clan is a farmer they'd stayed with before; the
last time, they drove off a trollkin horde, but not before one had chewed
off Harmast's ear.
[7] The Olkoring clan heroquest ability lets them throw javelins at long range.
[8] Every clan worships several local spirits. It certainly appears that
the Mokevogi worship Xiola Umbar as one of theirs, though they deny this
(perhaps before Arkat betrayed the Orlanthi they would have agreed?).
[9] The Mokevogi clan is part of the Ajim tribe; the Jaskori clan is part
of the Narit tribe. In a dispute, they'd have to get justice from the King
of Delela, which is impractical in most cases.
[10] I haven't really decided whether or not Madur Great Valor was geased
to steal the necklace; in fact his Honest trait isn't that high, and he
might have been lying. It's true that he had to steal _something_ from a
darkness goddess [probably a troll priestess would serve], but not likely
someone placed a specific geas on him to go bother the Mokevogi spirit.
[11] I tried to show how a Rune Lord would have to spend his 90% time
requirement.
[12] Since Madur Great Valor merely took a necklace from a sacred grove,
instead of raiding a Kiger Litor temple, does he really deserve his
nickname?
[13] This scenario seemed perfect for Orlanthi, since the solutions were
all cultural: fight Madur, steal the necklace, or rely on the generosity of
someone sworn to Orlanth.
RQ Daily Discussion List
---------------------
From: PMic...@aol.com
Subject: Trickster
Message-ID: <941019115...@aol.com>
Date: 19 Oct 94 10:13:58 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6665
Given that some folks have mentioned Trickster recently, and
that the storytelling contest for RQ-Con 2 is "Trickster's Night
Out," I thought I'd share some of my recent thoughts regarding
this figure. I recognize that most of these ideas are God
Learner influenced, but then so is the whole idea of a Trickster
cult.
From the various Trickster aspects (as described in the
official cult write-up), I think the God Learners were further
able to discern or create what they called "meta-aspects."
These meta-aspects are believed to reflect the mythic roles
Trickster played during the various stages of Godtime
(according to the Jrusteli Monomyth). The Jester meta-aspect
is identified with the Creation, and includes the Imp and Comic
Fool aspects. The Deceiver meta-aspect is identified with the
Golden Age, and includes the Shapechanger, Rogue, Seducer, and
Fright aspects. The Desirer meta-aspect is identified with the
Storm Age, and includes the Thief, Mask, Truant, Glutton, and
Sexual Insatiate aspects. The Destroyer meta-aspect is
identified with the Great Darkness, and includes the
Dismembered, Murderer, and Destroyer aspects. The
Firebringer meta-aspect is identified with the Great
Compromise, and includes only the Firebringer aspect.
Here are a few new spirit spells for some of the aspects:
The Comic Fool -
Tickle/2 points/ Ranged, Instant
The caster must overcome the target's magic points with his
or her own. If successful, the target begins laughing the next
strike rank, and continues laughing for 1d10 strike ranks.
During this time the target is nearly incapacitated, and can
only parry or dodge at half normal effectiveness. If casting a
spell, he must make a Concentration roll for each strike rank
he is laughing while attempting the spell; a single failure will
ruin the spell.
This spell is often cast when the target has just taken a
drink, in an attempt to make the drink come out the target's
nose.
The Rogue -
Quicktongue/variable/ Self, Instant
For each point of this spell, the caster's skill in Fast Talk is
increased by 5%.
The Glutton -
Purge/1 point/ Self, Instant
This spell will cause the caster to immediately vomit his or her stomach
contents, with no discomfort or unpleasant
aftertaste. The caster can then resume experiencing the
pleasures of eating.
The Murderer -
Gets the Disrupt spirit magic spell (not the Destroyer aspect as in the
official cult write-up)
The Destroyer -
Damage/Ranged, Instant
This spell damages non-living, non-magical material, doing
1d3 points of structural damage to it. If the target item is in
use by a person aware of the spell caster, the user's magic
points must be over come on the resistance table. The spirit
spell Repair may be used to fix such damage.
New aspects:
All of the aspects described so far for the Trickster can be
described as "voluntary" in that a trickster initiate has to
voluntarily seek out a new shrine in order to contact a new
aspect. I think the God Learners also found what they called
"involuntary aspects." These are aspects which can manifest
and affect any worshiper of a Trickster cult, whether the cult
was influenced by the God Learners or not. Sometimes this
happens at a Trickster shrine, when an initiate is sacrificing
for the regular rune magic found for the regular aspect.
Sometimes they just manifest, affecting the initiate no
matter what he or she is doing, no matter where he or she is.
Some God Learners theorized that involuntary aspects were
parts of Trickster which not even Trickster can control.
Others God Learners said that they represent the fact that
Trickster is as likely to victimize himself and his worshipers
as he was anybody else. (A well known Trickster saying is the
Trickster's Lament: "No wonder they call me the Trickster! I
even play tricks on myself!")
Two involuntary aspects are the Outcast and the Scapegoat:
The Outcast - Trickster is often a disruptive force in the
community in which he lives. This is usually due to his
breaking of laws and standards of behavior. When this aspect
manifests, the community rises to drive the trickster initiate
away. This aspect can manifest anywhere a trickster initiate
may be found. At times, the trickster initiate will find that
the Scapegoat (see below) aspect has also manifested.
The Scapegoat - Trickster has sometimes had the sins of
people heaped upon him in order to remove their sins from
them. When this aspect manifests, the community performs a
ritual by which the trickster initiate becomes the focus for all
the spirits of reprisal, curses, spirits of possession, disease,
and bad luck that have been afflicting the people of the
community. The Scapegoat initiate is then usually
(mercifully) sacrificed, or is sometimes driven from the
community to die. This aspect is most frequently found in
Peloria and Kralorela, but can manifest anywhere a trickster
initiate may be found. Most communities will choose to
Scapegoat a trickster from another community over a trickster
they know. Some communities can perform the Scapegoat
ritual on anyone, and these usually prefer to Scapegoat
strangers.
I don't think Trickster has a chaotic aspect which is
worshipped by chaotic beings. Trickster understands that
Chaos rains on his parade, poops on his party, and otherwise
spoils his fun. He is no supporter of Chaos. However, I think
that perhaps some Chaos beings say that Creation was Glorani
Wasa playing the colossally bad joke of creating stability and
law amid the realms of Chaos. And some anti-Lunar Chaos
beings undoubtedly claim that the Red Goddess is "tricking
Chaos into becoming Lawful."
Here are two city Trickster spirits which I have adapted from
_A Field Guide to the Little People_ by Nancy Arrowsmith and
George Moorse. I place them in cities in Safelster, but think
they could just as easily be placed anywhere in the West.
Euraeuro
The Euraeuro is a worldly and waggish. He usually appears as
a two to three foot tall humanoid, but can appear smaller. He
wears elegant bright red clothes, including a cap. However, he
is also a shapeshifter and can appear as a piece of red thread.
Euraeuro is constantly fascinated by women. He will often
change himself into a thread in order to be made into the
bodice of a dress. Once he has reached his goal, he will spring
forth into his physical form (ripping the bodice apart in the
process) and run away screaming, "I'm a titty-toucher! I'm a
titty-toucher!" He is also fond of hiding in chamber pots,
tickling the pot's user when least expected. Euraeuro's
curiosity also extends to the bed. Slipping into a bedroom
through the keyhole, he will lift up or pull the covers off of a
couple making love. His most disliked feature, however, is
that he will often shout out comments from hiding. These
comments are always about the women he has spied upon, and
include rude remarks, comparisons of body parts with other
women, and critiques of love-making.
A manifestation of the Imp aspect, the Euraeuro is found only
inside the city of Drom and appears to be unable to extend
beyond the city walls. Euraeuro teaches the illusion spell
Phantom Touch to trickster initiates who find him. A
trickster initiate must first successfully learn something
intimate about a woman by voyeurism, and then use that
information to the woman's embarassment, before being able
to sacrifice for the spell.
(adapted from the "Barabao" spirit of Venice, Italy)
Eurmalindo
Eurmalindo is not only obscenely obese, but he is also rude,
lazy, and cruel to animals. He appears as a two foot tall
humanoid, wearing pointed copper shoes and a domed copper
hat. He wears dark blood red clothes. He usually manifests
physically walking down a road. As he walks along, his speed
and bulk increase. His fat spreads until he brushes the
buildings to both sides of the road, and he speeds up to a fast
run. He never steps aside for anyone, but barges ahead despite
whoever is in his way. Unfortunate travellers who are not
quick enough to take shelter in a recessed doorway are often
bowled into the sewage ditch, and have sometimes been killed
by being crushed against a building. He is also known for
kicking animals with his pointed copper shoes.
The Eurmalindo eats only the raw meat of cows, sheep, and
goats, which he steals from local farmers. With a whistle, he
can call these animals to him. Then he starts walking down a
road, gradually picking up speed, with the animals being forced
to follow him. He runs until he comes to a cliff, at which
point he tucks himself into a ball and bounces safely to the
bottom. The animals are unable to stop in time, and die on the
rocks below. The Eurmalindo then feasts on the carcasses into
the night, and his horrible laughter can be heard kilometers
away.
A story is told of a farmer who confronted Eurmalindo about
his lost livestock, to which Eurmalindo is said to have replied,
"Would you rather that I eat your children? I would if I could,
you know. You men have forgotten how I used to feast. I will
eat as I am able, until I am once again able to eat as I wish."
A manifestation of the Glutton aspect, the Eurmalindo is
found in the city of Dangk and can manifest anywhere within
five kilometers of the city. He will teach the spell Create
Size to a trickster initiate. (Create Size is a specific illusion
which will increase the SIZ characteristic of the caster. I
haven't worked out the spell specifics yet.) To sacrifice for
the spell the initiate must steal a herd of animals from a local
farmer, drive them over a cliff, and join Eurmalindo in his
feast.
(adapted from the "Pamarindo" spirit of Gemona, Italy)
Lastly, here are some suggested readings regarding Trickster.
Other suggestions to add to this list are welcome, and would
be greatly appreciated.
Gunn, Thom. (poem) "Street Song"
A poem for the Truant aspect.
Herrick, Robert. (poem) "To the Virgins, to Make Much of Time"
A poem for the Seducer aspect.
Lopez, Barry H. _Giving Birth to Thunder, Sleeping With His Daughter :
Coyote builds North America_.
A collection of sixty-eight wonderfully told stories about
Trickster from forty-two American Indian tribes.
Marvell, Andrew. (poem) "To His Coy Mistress"
A poem for the Seducer aspect.
Radin, Paul. _The Trickster : A study in American Indian mythology_.
A scholarly exploration of the Winnebago Trickster Cycle.
Robinson, Edwin Arlington. (poem) "Miniver Cheevy"
A poem for the Truant aspect.
Shirley, Jackson "The Lottery"
A (play? short story? I forget.) for the Scapegoat aspect.
Welsford, Enid. _The Fool : His social and literary history_.
Originally written in 1936, this is the history of the comic
fool from the Greek "laughter-maker" to Charlie Chaplin.
Thoughts and comments are welcome.
Peace,
Peter