How to convert own (real world) abilities into DnD 3ed ability scores?
Lars Erlend Leganger
ourselves, and in the next campaign I'll be DM'ing, my players will do
just that. A bunch of almost-adult guys, grown up i a nice safe society,
are thrown into a world of danger and despair. I hope that'll give'em a
new perspective on our favourite gaming world, and perhaps on themselves
as well.
But I've run into a problem: How do I decide the ability scores my
players should write down on their own character sheets? A series of
tests I guess... But what kinds of tests should it be? Please give me
your suggestions!
- Lars Erlend Leganger
Masque
> players should write down on their own character sheets? A series of
> tests I guess... But what kinds of tests should it be? Please give me
> your suggestions!
In my opinion, that's just asking for trouble. Besides Intelligence (which
I remembering reading on this newsgroups is supposedly equated 10 points of
IQ=1 point Intelligence), they don't have any real world analogues.
For instance, should the test of Dexterity be one of manual dexterity or of
flexibility? What about Wisdom? Or Charisma (oh dear...)?
My best advice would be, if you're going to continue with this at all, is to
use a relative scale. "yeah, Jim's better than me in math, so he has a
higher intelligence." The problem there is that someone's going to feel
shafted. "What, I only have an 8 in Charisma?"
Summary: Tests will leave people feeling like they've been discriminated
against unless you've got a really good group of players, and a subjective
scale would be the same, if not worse.
--
Sarah
ICQ: 73089810
AIM: maskedquerade3
Toby Gray
group of 3) that the person who it was the character for got indirect
input, while the other two got the final choise on what his stats
should have been. Of cause this does mean your characters might be
weaker than normal, so Challenge rattings might need to be lowered,
and you do need to know each other out side of gaming well enough to
know what each person is competent in.
It is slightly easier with the Whitewolf system, (as each dot rating
has a description) but I surpose if you all work out, well he usually
is quiet good at sneaking up and scaring us in real life, but only
abotu 50% of the time, so would be about rank 5 (as DC for move
silently is 15, I think)
The one thing I would say you make sure you do is make sure you don't
hold grudges, but it is useful as u see what people really think of u,
and when the sheet is done make sure the people who the sheet is not
of ask if the person it is of thinks any parts are very unfair, and
then change them. It needs to be done in agreement, but as a DM u
might want to make sure that everyone excels in something, else they
will be left out of the group and feel annoyed.
If u choose a special character, IE Sorcerer, wizard, paladin (I
assume u don't have any religious spell casting people in yout group)
then I think the best way of deciding if u have special skills like
spellcraft, would be to give every one 3 free skill points.
NO forget that if they have just come into the world then they should
be like they are now, nothing changing, no spellcraft, no detect trap
skills, nothing not normal. Perhaps even no weapon profficencys, maybe
if tbhey do archery and the like.
If u do do the above then most people would be inate people like
sorcerers and bards, instead of rogues (which have got the advantage
of having lots of skill points, and not alot else except sneak
attacks) maybe have them starting off as class normal, nothing
special, adn then each has to work out how to use thier powers if they
are inate, or get apprenticed by someone to gain skills.
ALthough druid might eb a bit off enless u haev a hippy in your
group:-)
Thats all from me.
Toby
Sea Wasp
See "An American Gamer in Gondor", first part; I talk a bit about this.
Things to remember:
D&D3, like its predecessors, is intended to be played on a heroic
scale. Thus, it is wise to GIVE THE PLAYERS THE BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT. In
other words, unless the player in question has a CLEAR case of Munchkin
Ego, err on the side of giving them higher stats and abilities rather
than lower. It's a game, it's being played for fun. It's no fun to be
playing Wimp-Man in a world of Conans.
This is of course subject to how well you know them as players and how
much you trust them.
For Strength, there's explicit descriptions in the book of how strong
STRONG is.
For Int and Wis, you're kinda on your own, because everyone defines 'em
a bit differently.
For Dexterity, there's a number of physical tests you could attempt --
the dollar drop, balancing, etc.
For Charisma... that's mostly force of personality. And that's
something that can be judged best by others.
--
Sea Wasp http://www.wizvax.net/seawasp/index.html
/^\
;;; _Morgantown: The Jason Wood Chronicles_, at
http://www.hyperbooks.com/catalog/20040.html
Sea Wasp
>
> Well, I guess we've all dreamed about entering the a fantasy world
> ourselves, and in the next campaign I'll be DM'ing, my players will do
> just that. A bunch of almost-adult guys, grown up i a nice safe society,
> are thrown into a world of danger and despair. I hope that'll give'em a
> new perspective on our favourite gaming world, and perhaps on themselves
> as well.
Additional note: Some people play these games specifically to be
someone DIFFERENT from themselves, and playing "themselves" is either
too personal or otherwise annoying. I always gave my players a choice as
to whether they wanted to play themselves, or a regular character.
Sea Wasp
>
> Well, I guess we've all dreamed about entering the a fantasy world
> ourselves, and in the next campaign I'll be DM'ing, my players will do
> just that. A bunch of almost-adult guys, grown up i a nice safe society,
> are thrown into a world of danger and despair. I hope that'll give'em a
> new perspective on our favourite gaming world, and perhaps on themselves
> as well.
And one more: Beforehand, make up your mind EXACTLY how you're going to
handle the uses of modern-day knowledge (and especially gaming
knowledge!) in your game. Does technology work? How does it interact
with magic? How much stuff can I bring with me? How useful will it be
for me to bring the PHB, the MM, and the DMG along?
Mez
roleplaying, er, yourselves.
Mez.
no name
I remember doing something like this for a game called Melee and Wizard,
it was the precursor to GURPS. We did chin ups for strength, no. of
chin ups you can do = your str., we took some kind of test for
intelligence,
etc. It worked okay for that system, the system was just about combat.
If this is for a Cthulu type campaign it might be good, but for
adventuring
in a Fantasy campaign, this may not be good idea. What skills
will modern day people be able to bring into a fantasy world that would
help
them survive? Can they hunt with archaic weapons? Can they pick locks
or
fight with weapons from the era? Like one of the posts above points
out,
RPG's are about heroics, stories about real people are usually very
boring.
Eric Christian Berg
On Mon, 29 Jan 2001, no name wrote:
> I remember doing something like this for a game called Melee and Wizard,
> it was the precursor to GURPS.
Cool, there's other people out there still playing Melee!
--
Eric Christian Berg
System Administrator (Adeptus Minor), Amherst Systems
(716) 631-0088 ext. 199
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Egoslayer1
how he would 'rate' in game terms for statistics...although we never
actually played such a group...a couple of other things to point out no
one else has...
1)everything is relative...meaning just becaues you have a mediocre CON
doesn't mean it would be in the game world...maybe the game world are
all unhealthy people compared to us modern types (I suspect the
opposite is true but it's just an example) in which case giving a
high 'stat' might be perfectly reasonable...
2)Specifics...
INT is tricky...I have seen INT 5 = IQ of 50 frequently...you could use
this. The problem with this system is that the odds of having a 180IQ
are FAR LESS than the odds of rolling 3 6's on 3d6...if you want to
simulate the frequency of the IQ ranges, everyone over about a 140 or
150IQ here would be as statistically rare as an 18 is to roll...depends
on whether you want to generate generous numbers or not...either
approach is valid...
STR seems pretty easy to guesstimate useing the weights on the STR chart
WIS is basically totally subjective...try to think of who is thinking
AHEAD and predicting problems and solutions before they happen, that is
wisdom.
DEX I would jsut do group poll, if you have been playing together for a
while you probably know who trips over the chair legs and fan plugs and
who catched things thrown to them all the time, and otherwise reacts
quickly, thats reaction if you are 2E D&D, aim could be some other
tests like 'washers' or 'horseshoes', or darts
CON - guess who is never sick, and who is fit (HEALTH/FITNESS)
CHA - appearance might hurt someones feelings, so it might be best to
humor them...leadership should be relatively obvious after playing with
them a while...
if you want more generous scores discuss them openly, or just player
and DM, if you want scores that might sting, have all players BUT the
player in question vote and average the results. Do this with open
discussion and 'sales pitches' but secret voteing
Remember you only there to have fun, maybe the magic of the transition
gives them all bonus points to everything ?
other good points were made...how does thier knowledge work? in my
world the methods we use to make explosives (i.e. sulpher, charcoal,
etc...) simply do not work, the chemicals just don't mix that way so
knowing how to do it here would mean nothing...
--
Egoslayer1
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Sean MacDonald
Egoslayer1 <egosl...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> WIS is basically totally subjective...try to think of who is thinking
> AHEAD and predicting problems and solutions before they happen, that
is
> wisdom.
Everyone defines things differently. The above sounds more like INT
than wisdom to me. Before 3e, my take on WIS is that it represents
a person's stubborn-ness/fanaticism/close-minded-ness. While those
characteristics don't sound too wise, look at what WIS does:
(1) It's good for religious folks. (2) It helps you resist
mind-affecting spells. Closedmindedness sounds exactly like those
particular qualities.
With 3e, WIS is a bit trickier, since they threw perception
into it.
> if you want more generous scores discuss them openly, or just player
> and DM, if you want scores that might sting, have all players BUT the
> player in question vote and average the results.
Another possibility is to assign each player a number of points
to assign to his stats (or use something like the point-buy
method in the DMG). This way, nobody can feel too slighted,
since they "chose" to only buy a CHA of 8. The one drawback
I encountered with this system is that a person might feel
that he didn't have enough points to spread around, so that
a smart, strong person in real life has as many points as
a guy with no particular strengths. (This really happened
in a non-DnD game I ran using this sort of method. As a
consequence, the guy with no particular strengths* had
as high an intelligence score as the smart guy did.)
* Honestly, he wasn't smart, wasn't athletic, wasn't
coordinated (he fell down his stairs at his house),
wasn't perceptive (he got hit by a car while crossing
a street (against the light) in broad daylight),
wasn't healthy (often had a cold and had numerous
allergies)...
--
-SM
"Memories of things that never happened,
These always the hardest to forget.
All the old friends and the loved ones,
These are the people you haven't even met." --Toys, "The Mirror Song"
Michael A. Norville
First, nip the possibility of stat competition/speculation in the bud.
Explain to them how D&D characters are supposed to be heroic fantasy, ie
almost superheroes compared to normal humans.
Then explain to them that, in comparison, normal, modern, realistic humans
are probably far inferior to these fantasy, heroic, fictional creatures in
almost every way.
Then assign stats of 8 to all physical abilities, and 11 to all mental abilities.
Let them know that these stats will NOT remain static.
Then play the game.
Allow them to see, briefly (ever so briefly) for the sake of comparison, how
wimpy they all were in comparison.
Then buff them up. Somehow. Some get tutored by the local paladin in arms.
Maybe they start developing to their Ultimate potential because it's sink or
swim. Maybe they're buffed by the gods for some Great Quest. Somehow. So that
they're on the road to becoming Heroes.
Dispense with the standard stat gain table. Start with lower stats, and give
'em increases ~every~ level. Cap it at 10th level or so, to the normal rate.
Two a level if you think it appropriate.
I'd advise against trying to quantify each stat separately. It's a prime
scenario for friction when one person thinks that they're smarter that what
you think. And it's tough to swallow that these specimens of average modern
maledom can begin to compare to Heroic Fantasy characters, unless some or all
are Special Forces, Navy Seals, and the like.
Steve Eley
>
> Then assign stats of 8 to all physical abilities, and 11 to all mental abilities.
>
> Let them know that these stats will NOT remain static.
This is a *very* cool idea.
Have Fun,
- Steve Eley
sfe...@sff.net
Melantha
"Masque" <maskedq...@home.com> wrote:
> In my opinion, that's just asking for trouble. Besides Intelligence
> (which I remembering reading on this newsgroups is supposedly equated
> 10 points of IQ=1 point Intelligence), they don't have any real world
> analogues.
Strength is based on how much a character can lift.
-Melantha
Egoslayer1
game and use your own real life stats in it, that is almost always only
asking for trouble, BUT IF SOMEONE IS GOING TO DO IT ANYWAY, I was
providing suggestions on how to go about doing it...
As for WIS, I think closemindedness is counterproductive to being wise.
Mind you when we are talking about fantasy WIS scores for characters,
they are not the religious zealots of today. Often, in days of old, for
right or wrong stats were described as PHYSICAL STR and DEX, and MENTAL
STR (i.e. INT) and DEX (i.e. WIS). This places WIS as mentel dexterity.
(WARNING, my personal opnions), INT is deductive reasoning, WIS is
mental dexterity, similar to creativity.
Example:
The intelligent person goes to work and, while out on lunch, can deduce
from the clouds, wind and pressure change that is is likely to rain.
(involves calculations and weighing various factors) The wise person
tuned in to the weather channel that morning before ever leaving the
house and determined it was likely to rain that day. That is (IMHO) a
good example of the difference. There is no deductive reasoning
involved in watching the weather channel, but it is wise to think ahead
and be prepared for the day.
Since I'm on a roll...
Given a 10" diameter circle, divided into 6 'pie 'shapes' of 60 degrees
each, with alternating ones shaded...determine shaded area.
The intelligent person can calculate the total area of the circle and
then use a formula to calculate the area of a 60 degree slice of said
circle (area = (<degree of slice>/360) PI r^2), and multiply that by 3
to determine the shaded portion.
A wise person calculates the area of the circle and divides it in
half. :-P
I would go so far as to say that closemindedness will prevent one from
becoming wise.
--
Egoslayer1
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} {
{ Our species is suffering from }
} devolution, and a sad side effect {
{ is that it leaves us too stupid to }
} even realize it... }
} }
} Egoslayer1@[remove this]hotmail.com }
{_______________________________________{
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grimb...@my-deja.com
the_big_...@yahoo.com wrote:
> Lars Erlend Leganger wrote:
> >
> > Well, I guess we've all dreamed about entering the a fantasy world
> > ourselves, and in the next campaign I'll be DM'ing, my players will do
> > just that. A bunch of almost-adult guys, grown up i a nice safe society,
> > are thrown into a world of danger and despair. I hope that'll give'em a
> > new perspective on our favourite gaming world, and perhaps on themselves
> > as well.
> > But I've run into a problem: How do I decide the ability scores my
> > players should write down on their own character sheets? A series of
> > tests I guess... But what kinds of tests should it be? Please give me
> > your suggestions!
>
> First, nip the possibility of stat competition/speculation in the bud.
>
> Explain to them how D&D characters are supposed to be heroic fantasy, ie
> almost superheroes compared to normal humans.
>
> Then explain to them that, in comparison, normal, modern, realistic humans
> are probably far inferior to these fantasy, heroic, fictional creatures in
> almost every way.
>
> Then assign stats of 8 to all physical abilities, and 11 to all mental abilities.
>
To be just a bit more realistic every gamer would have a charisma of 5
when changed over to DnD. If they have ever GM'd for a camapign for a
year or more give them a big whopping charisma of 7 for being able to
draw in the other gamers on a regular basis.
Jeffrey Grower
anyone I game with is normal and has average stats across the board.
Probably no 18's but there are for sure some 12-16's and maybe even 17's.
Try looking up the stats from AD&D and AD&D2. They tell you strength scores
right on the chart. Its really not hard to figure out the rest. You may
bruise some ego's in working these out with people, but its really not that
hard.
--
"Michael A. Norville" <the_big_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3A76D4F7...@yahoo.com...
Macavity
vampirized version of themselves. I had everyone in the group rate there
own abilities as well as the other players. I then took the scores and
averaged them out (the players scoring of each other is done privately so as
not to cause hard feelings).
This kind of thing requires maturity and self honesty. Case in point---one
of the players who had an extremely high opinion of himself didn't need to
be a genius, which he rated himself, to realize that his opinion wasn't
shared by the rest of the group (after averaging all the scores he came out
just that---average).
Xeno
wrote:
>Well, I guess we've all dreamed about entering the a fantasy world
Have every player assign what ability scores they think every other player
has, treating 10 as average and 18 as legendary. The DM then averages the
results and adjusts as he deems appropriate. It is all still subjective
opinion but that's the best you're going to get. I think most players would
be justified in giving their "self-characters" somewhat above-average stats
compared to the average medieval person because of how modern-day
education, medicine, pace of life, and other factors have had an impact on
mankind physically and mentally.