Vecna vs. Elminster
The Dude
After getting tired of reading the 240+ posts in the Elminster vs.
Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
I thought I'd begin a new munchkin vs. thread. So, who would win in a
fight, Vecna or Elminster?
--
Your friendly neighborhood Lurker,
Scott Ritchie
S.Ri...@juno.com
Daemon in the Darkness
The Dude <S.Ri...@juno.com> wrote in article
<351F61...@juno.com>...
> After getting tired of reading the 240+ posts in the Elminster vs.
> Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
> I thought I'd begin a new munchkin vs. thread. So, who would win in a
> fight, Vecna or Elminster?
>
That depends doesn't it , Vecna is a demi-god with a long campaign
history and Elminster is , well he's just Elminster.
Daemon in the Darkness
lv_d...@hotmail.com
Pinochet
The Dude wrote in message <351F61...@juno.com>...
>After getting tired of reading the 240+ posts in the Elminster vs.
>Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
>I thought I'd begin a new munchkin vs. thread. So, who would win in a
>fight, Vecna or Elminster?
Elminster...why? Simple if he offs Vecna, the benefit is obvious,
and if Elminster dies, well wouldn't his Evasion spell get him out
of Ravenloft?
Pinochet
Daemon in the Darkness wrote in message
<01bd5bc0$8f42a580$e24b67cb@default>...
> That depends doesn't it , Vecna is a demi-god with a long campaign
>history and Elminster is , well he's just Elminster.
Now, now....in Ed Greenwood's campaign Elminster has quite
a long history too....and a decent one...but once the marketing
machine got a hold of him, well he went through the wringer and
came out a little soiled..
Will Meister
The Dude wrote:
>
> After getting tired of reading the 240+ posts in the Elminster vs.
> Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
Come on. Way more than half were off topic.
Will Meister
wcm...@psu.edu
mark templeton
The Dude (S.Ri...@juno.com) writes:
> After getting tired of reading the 240+ posts in the Elminster vs.
> Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
> I thought I'd begin a new munchkin vs. thread. So, who would win in a
> fight, Vecna or Elminster?
>
>
> --
> Your friendly neighborhood Lurker,
>
> Scott Ritchie
> S.Ri...@juno.com
Elminster. He has both eyes and both hands. vecna can;t cast spells
without both hands.
--
mark templeton
e-mail=aj...@freenet.carleton.ca
url=http://www.ncf.carleton.ca/~aj217
"AUGH! HE'S GOT A SWORD!!!!!!. . . .You idiot. WE'VE ALL GOT SWORDS!"
Graey
Pinochet (nogra...@spam.sprintmail.me.com) posted:
>>Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
>>I thought I'd begin a new munchkin vs. thread. So, who would win in a
>>fight, Vecna or Elminster?
>
>
>and if Elminster dies, well wouldn't his Evasion spell get him out
>of Ravenloft?
>
No. Nothing short of a god (even then it's a tough call) can leave
Ravenloft w/o the plane's 'permission'.
- Graey
------------------------------
| sla...@luvewe.ops.usa.net |
| luvewe.ops.usa.net/~slayer |
------------------------------
Jason Brown
The Dude wrote:
>
> After getting tired of reading the 240+ posts in the Elminster vs.
> Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
> I thought I'd begin a new munchkin vs. thread. So, who would win in a
> fight, Vecna or Elminster?
Although Vecna is currently trapped in Ravenloft, he is still immortal.
If memory severs, I believe the Domains of Dread book says that all his
spells have a casting time of 1, and he only needs verbal components. At
any rate he is a Domain Ruler.
If Elminster got trapped in Vencas Domain, Elminster would be axle
greese. If Venca excapes from Ravenloft, and returns to Oerth -
Elminster would get his sorry excuse for a ass kicked all the way back
to the Forgotten Realms.
If Venca wanted to take The Forgotten Realms over, Elimster would have
home field advantage, and lots of lackies to throw at Venca. It would
probably be a long, and destructive fight. In the end about the only way
Elminster could win is if he enlisted the help of Kas.
In summary, Venca KICKS Elminster butt.
JMO -
Jason.
Sea Wasp
Jason Brown wrote:
>
> The Dude wrote:
> >
> > After getting tired of reading the 240+ posts in the Elminster vs.
> > Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
> > I thought I'd begin a new munchkin vs. thread. So, who would win in a
> > fight, Vecna or Elminster?
>
> Although Vecna is currently trapped in Ravenloft, he is still immortal.
> If memory severs, I believe the Domains of Dread book says that all his
> spells have a casting time of 1, and he only needs verbal components. At
> any rate he is a Domain Ruler.
>
> If Elminster got trapped in Vencas Domain, Elminster would be axle
> greese. If Venca excapes from Ravenloft, and returns to Oerth -
> Elminster would get his sorry excuse for a ass kicked all the way back
> to the Forgotten Realms.
Oh. Sure.
Elminster: "I teleport near Vecna."
Vecna: I fireball you. Twice.
Elminster: My "Save My Ass" contingency goes off... along with the
other contingency I cast earlier today.
Vecna: What contingency?
Elminster: Antimagic shell. On the ground at your feet.
Vecna: *sssssss* (sound of a pile of dust sifting to the ground, since
Vecna is nothing more than pure magical force bound into a body. No
magic -- no Vecna.)
--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
The Dude
Sea Wasp wrote:
>
> Oh. Sure.
>
> Elminster: "I teleport near Vecna."
> Vecna: I fireball you. Twice.
> Elminster: My "Save My Ass" contingency goes off... along with the
> other contingency I cast earlier today.
> Vecna: What contingency?
> Elminster: Antimagic shell. On the ground at your feet.
> Vecna: *sssssss* (sound of a pile of dust sifting to the ground, since
> Vecna is nothing more than pure magical force bound into a body. No
> magic -- no Vecna.)
>
What?! I have a problem with that. Vecna didn't make his 70% magic
resistance save against mortal magic? Anyway, I doubt someone with 25
Int would make such a foolhardy mistake battle.
The Demigod Strikes Back =)
Pinochet
Graey wrote in message <6foen6$1...@ns3.tecinfo.com>...
>No. Nothing short of a god (even then it's a tough call) can leave
>Ravenloft w/o the plane's 'permission'.
Well, see, Elminster qualifies.
The Dude
Threshold Online RPG wrote:
>
> In article <351F61...@juno.com>, S.Ri...@juno.com wrote:
> >After getting tired of reading the 240+ posts in the Elminster vs.
> >Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
> >I thought I'd begin a new munchkin vs. thread. So, who would win in a
> >fight, Vecna or Elminster?
>
Dead?! Vecna is a demigod! You haven't checked out VECNA LIVES. It's
followed by the upcoming adventure VECNA REBORN.
> DUH! *grin*
=->
>
> Also, when will you learn that Elminster can't be defeated. He has already
> slain thousands of DMs who are sick of him =)
>
No one is undefeatable.
Damien Vigar
On Mon, 30 Mar 1998, Sea Wasp wrote:
> Jason Brown wrote:
> >
> > The Dude wrote:
> > >
> > > After getting tired of reading the 240+ posts in the Elminster vs.
> > > Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
> > > I thought I'd begin a new munchkin vs. thread. So, who would win in a
> > > fight, Vecna or Elminster?
> >
> > Although Vecna is currently trapped in Ravenloft, he is still immortal.
> > If memory severs, I believe the Domains of Dread book says that all his
> > spells have a casting time of 1, and he only needs verbal components. At
> > any rate he is a Domain Ruler.
> >
> > If Elminster got trapped in Vencas Domain, Elminster would be axle
> > greese. If Venca excapes from Ravenloft, and returns to Oerth -
> > Elminster would get his sorry excuse for a ass kicked all the way back
> > to the Forgotten Realms.
>
> Oh. Sure.
>
> Elminster: "I teleport near Vecna."
> Vecna: I fireball you. Twice.
> Elminster: My "Save My Ass" contingency goes off... along with the
> other contingency I cast earlier today.
> Vecna: What contingency?
> Elminster: Antimagic shell. On the ground at your feet.
> Vecna: *sssssss* (sound of a pile of dust sifting to the ground, since
> Vecna is nothing more than pure magical force bound into a body. No
> magic -- no Vecna.)
<troll>
Now, now, let's not be logical about this...
</troll>
I want a lowdown, dirty fight with no holds barred! Now come out of
your corners flaming...
;-)
>
> --
> Sea Wasp
> /^\
> ;;;
>
>
Cheers,
--
Reality.sys corrupted. Reboot universe? (y/n/q)
Damien <Damien...@jcu.edu.au>
Threshold Online RPG
In article <6foen6$1...@ns3.tecinfo.com>, sla...@no-spam.luvewe.ops.usa.net (Graey) wrote:
>Pinochet (nogra...@spam.sprintmail.me.com) posted:
>>Elminster...why? Simple if he offs Vecna, the benefit is obvious,
>>and if Elminster dies, well wouldn't his Evasion spell get him out
>>of Ravenloft?
>>
>
>Ravenloft w/o the plane's 'permission'.
Well then Elminster should have no trouble.
-Aristotle@Threshold
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
VISIT THRESHOLD ONLINE! High Fantasy Role Playing Game!
Player run clans, guilds, businesses, legal system, nobility, missile
combat, detailed religions, rich, detailed roleplaying environment.
http://www.threshold.counseltech.com
telnet://threshold.counseltech.com:23
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Threshold Online RPG
In article <351F61...@juno.com>, S.Ri...@juno.com wrote:
>After getting tired of reading the 240+ posts in the Elminster vs.
>Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
>I thought I'd begin a new munchkin vs. thread. So, who would win in a
>fight, Vecna or Elminster?
Dude, Vecna is dead.
DUH! *grin*
Also, when will you learn that Elminster can't be defeated. He has already
slain thousands of DMs who are sick of him =)
-Aristotle@Threshold
MCarrasco
> Elminster: My "Save My Ass" contingency goes off... along with the
>other contingency I cast earlier today.
According to the WIzards Spell Compendiem. A person can only have 1 contingency
at a time. So only the last contigency would work, not a multitude of them.
Mr. Peabody
--------------------
Duct tape is like the Force, it has a dark side and a light side
and it binds the universe together
Pinochet
MCarrasco wrote in message
<199803310815...@ladder03.news.aol.com>...
>> Elminster: My "Save My Ass" contingency goes off... along with the
>>other contingency I cast earlier today.
>
>According to the WIzards Spell Compendiem. A person can only have 1
>contingency at a time. So only the last contigency would work, not a
multitude of >them.
Assume Elminster found a way around that problem, because you
know he can..
Sea Wasp
MCarrasco wrote:
>
> > Elminster: My "Save My Ass" contingency goes off... along with the
> >other contingency I cast earlier today.
>
> According to the WIzards Spell Compendiem. A person can only have 1 contingency
> at a time. So only the last contigency would work, not a multitude of them.
You poor sad man. You obviously haven't followed the Interminable
Elminster Debate. Ellie has the Save My Ass thing on all the time, and
if he wants more contingencies, he can do that. Elmonster does not have
to adhere to the rules in the books; in point of fact, he is IMPOSSIBLE
to create under the rules.
--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Pinochet
Sea Wasp wrote in message <3520E2...@wizvax.net>...
>Elmonster does not have
>to adhere to the rules in the books; in point of fact, he is IMPOSSIBLE
>to create under the rules.
You forget Rule 1: Any DM can do whatever he wants regardless of
any other rules.
It's at the bottom of pg 7 of the 2nd ed NR DMG.
StephenJ
The Dude wrote:
>
> After getting tired of reading the 240+ posts in the Elminster vs.
> Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
> I thought I'd begin a new munchkin vs. thread. So, who would win in a
> fight, Vecna or Elminster?
>
Whoever won initiative...
*********************************************************
"..i'm an asshole" - Terry (the idiot) Austin
"..and you're a Cowardly hypocrite as well" - StephenJ
*********************************************************
Jason Brown
> >>other contingency I cast earlier today.
> >
> >According to the WIzards Spell Compendiem. A person can only have 1
> >contingency at a time. So only the last contigency would work, not a
> multitude of >them.
>
> know he can..
Elminster can be Lord supreme cheese head, god of diary products all he
wants -- with his weasel ways - Vecna still kicks his ass. If he is
stupid enough to make lame ass tactics ( I fireball Elim Twice, opps
Elim has 'Save my Ass' thing plus 2 cont. spells ) - Just think of Venca
as as Obe - One - Knobe in Star Wars - 'You may strike me down, but
I'll only become more powerfull then you could ever imagine'
Case in Point: Venca and Kas both destroy Each other many moons ago on
Oerth. Venca comes back as a Demigod, and he is one bad ass Mother
F**ker. Venca gets trapped in Ravenloft ( not sure how or why ), but
his power is enhanced even more.
Summary: Venca is a much more interesting and dynamic character, he has
with stood the test of time -- to come back even more powerful then
ever. Elim could kick the bucket tomarrow, many would celebrate has
passing - and then forgotten ... because he is one dimensional.
JMO -
Jason.
Stephan Lemon
What about Elminster vs Zagyg (whichever spelling suits you)?
Lord BKis1
> Elminster: "I teleport near Vecna."
> Vecna: I fireball you. Twice.
>other contingency I cast earlier today.
> Elminster: Antimagic shell. On the ground at your feet.
> Vecna: *sssssss* (sound of a pile of dust sifting to the ground, since
>Vecna is nothing more than pure magical force bound into a body. No
>magic -- no Vecna.)
What happened to Vecna's long list of contingency(s)? (Even though you can
only have one)
Dave Harper
On 31 Mar 1998 08:15:58 GMT, mcar...@aol.com (MCarrasco) wrote:
>> Elminster: My "Save My Ass" contingency goes off... along with the
>>other contingency I cast earlier today.
>
>According to the WIzards Spell Compendiem. A person can only have 1 contingency
>at a time. So only the last contigency would work, not a multitude of them.
>Mr. Peabody
Elminster's Evasion is a 9th-level contigency variant
compatable with use of Contingency and Chain Contingency (which can
also be used together). All of them are official spells. All three
could work at a time; Contingency has one spell effect, CC two, and
EE...three? Can't remember.
Dave, who thinks Elminster is munchkin
Threshold Online RPG
In article <3520E2...@wizvax.net>, sea...@wizvax.net wrote:
>MCarrasco wrote:
>> > Elminster: My "Save My Ass" contingency goes off... along with the
>> >other contingency I cast earlier today.
>>
>> According to the WIzards Spell Compendiem. A person can only have 1
>> contingency at a time. So only the last contigency would work, not a
>> multitude of them.
>
>Elminster Debate. Ellie has the Save My Ass thing on all the time, and
>to create under the rules.
RULES? You cant handle the rules!!!!!!
Hehehhee
Actually, this is a good point. Elminster has shown time and time again he is
above the rules and can pretty much do whatever the hell he pleases =)
geryon
Graey wrote:
>
> No. Nothing short of a god (even then it's a tough call) can leave
> Ravenloft w/o the plane's 'permission'.
>
I've never played Ravenloft as a plane, has anyone?
geryon
mark templeton wrote:
> Elminster. He has both eyes and both hands. vecna can;t cast spells
> without both hands.
> --
>
Thats a matter of opinion.
James Adams
Forgive me if I refrain from quoting . . .
Vecna is dead. He is also a demigod - god of secrets and lies, I believe.
He is also in Ravenloft and beyond Elminster's reach, if Elminster knows
what;s good for him.
Even the mighty El had better not venture into the Mists . . .
--
Chris Adams.
Why, I can smile, and murder whiles I smile,
And cry "Content!" to that which grieves my heart,
And wet my face with artificial tears,
And frame my face to all occasions . . .
Rob Hertel
Stephan Lemon wrote:
>
> What about Elminster vs Zagyg (whichever spelling suits you)?
What about Greenwood vs Gygax? or Austin vs Jaros? I'd pay good
cash to see either fight. ;-)
Rob
jaso...@hotmail.com
In article <6fqav9$ntt$1...@newsfep2.sprintmail.com>,
"Pinochet" <nogra...@spam.sprintmail.me.com> wrote:
>
>
> MCarrasco wrote in message
> <199803310815...@ladder03.news.aol.com>...
> >>other contingency I cast earlier today.
> >
> >According to the WIzards Spell Compendiem. A person can only have 1
> >contingency at a time. So only the last contigency would work, not a
> multitude of >them.
>
> know he can..
>
>
okay, but right after he goes that The Simbul gets pissed, steps in, and kicks
Elminster's ass.
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
Neil J. Cooper
On Mon, 30 Mar 1998, The Dude let slip that
>Sea Wasp wrote:
<little snip>
>> Elminster: Antimagic shell. On the ground at your feet.
>> Vecna: *sssssss* (sound of a pile of dust sifting to the ground,
>since
>> Vecna is nothing more than pure magical force bound into a body. No
>> magic -- no Vecna.)
>>
>
>resistance save against mortal magic?
Elminster, mortal? Ha! :)
Chose of Mystra 'an all.
It only gets worse from here...
--
"Sleep, those little slices of death, how I loathe them"
Neil J.
Remove NoSpam. to reply.
cgla...@hotmail.com
In article <351F61...@juno.com>,
S.Ri...@juno.com wrote:
>
> After getting tired of reading the 240+ posts in the Elminster vs.
> Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
> I thought I'd begin a new munchkin vs. thread. So, who would win in a
> fight, Vecna or Elminster?
Heck, that's easy.
Vecna = full-fledged deity.
Elminster = one of the single most powerful mortals in his or any other known
crystal sphere, but still a mortal.
Elminster is going to lose.
I mean, about the only thing Elminster *can't* take is deities.
Now Vecna's *avatar* vs. Elminster... well, that's a stalemate. Elminster's
Evasion will keep him from being permanently destroyed, but by the same token
you cannot permanently destroy a deity's avatar.
--
Chuckg
cgla...@hotmail.com
In article <351F61...@juno.com>,
S.Ri...@juno.com wrote:
>
> After getting tired of reading the 240+ posts in the Elminster vs.
> Raistlin thread (Over half of which I thought were slightly off-topic).
> I thought I'd begin a new munchkin vs. thread. So, who would win in a
> fight, Vecna or Elminster?
I came into this thread late and skimmed it, and it seems that most people
seem to be unaware that according to TSR's module of several years ago,
"Vecna Lives", Vecna has undergone full divine ascenstion and is now a
demipower.
So even his avatar should be able to smear Elminster. First off, Vecna... as
the god of secrets... is one of the few entities I can believe that would
know where Elminster's Safe Hold is or would be capable of ripping the
knowledge out of his brain.
So here's a play-by-play of Elminster vs. Vecna's avatar.
Round one -- since a deity's avatar automatically gets the initiative on any
mortal ("Faiths and Avatars", look it up), Vecna gets one free shot. And he
only needs one.
*Time Stop*.
That's three free rounds.
Round two (first free round) -- "Wish" for Elminster's defenses against all
forms of mind-reading to be temporarily shut down for the turn.
Round three (second free round) -- "Rary's Mind Probe" or some similar such
spell. Brainrape the temporally challenged Sage of Shadowdale at will. What
we're looking for here is the location, defenses, and access codes to the
Safe Hold.
"What is your address there?" (strong Austrian accent).
Round four (last free round) -- A held or paralyzed character, according to
the DMG, may be automatically slain in one round. This is that round.
Dagger to the base of the skull. Dead Elminster.
Round five -- *bamf*. The contingency is back online now that the Time Stop
is over, so Elminster goes off to the Safe Hold for a quick reboot.
Unfortunately, since Vecna's avatar just gained the location and access codes
to the Safe Hold, Vecna is also "off to see the wizard".
Yo, Elminster... even Manshoon has enough brains to scatter his "reboot
sites" in *multiply* redundant locations. Unfortunately for you, you weren't
that clever.
And that's just Vecna's *avatar*. Since the deity itself has the ability to
cast any spell at will as often as it wants, imagine how messy and pointless
going up against the deity itself would be.
Dustman
Now who would win this - - my vote is for Factol Skaal, who actually has
a large following of Dustman behind him. Besides, what is this "Pact
With Death" thing anyhow... Hmmm....
S. Wilson
> Round one -- since a deity's avatar automatically gets the initiative on any
> mortal ("Faiths and Avatars", look it up), Vecna gets one free shot. And he
> only needs one.
This is an update from L&L, no? In there, it was the _deity_ that
automatically gained initiative.
[snip]
> Round four (last free round) -- A held or paralyzed character, according to
> the DMG, may be automatically slain in one round. This is that round.
Not the DMG2. (Maybe 2.5? or 1?) DMG2 says held/paralyzed characters may
be automatically slain, but gives no time frame.
> Dagger to the base of the skull. Dead Elminster.
>
> Round five -- *bamf*. The contingency is back online now that the Time Stop
> is over, so Elminster goes off to the Safe Hold for a quick reboot.
Does this even help? I thought Evasion was only a contingency transport
spell, not a full Resurrection?
Hemlock
jaso...@hotmail.com
In > I came into this thread late and skimmed it, and it seems that most
people
> seem to be unaware that according to TSR's module of several years ago,
> "Vecna Lives", Vecna has undergone full divine ascenstion and is now a
> demipower.
>
> So even his avatar should be able to smear Elminster. First off, Vecna...
as
> the god of secrets... is one of the few entities I can believe that would
> know where Elminster's Safe Hold is or would be capable of ripping the
> knowledge out of his brain.
>
> So here's a play-by-play of Elminster vs. Vecna's avatar.
>
> mortal ("Faiths and Avatars", look it up), Vecna gets one free shot. And he
> only needs one.
>
>
> That's three free rounds.
>
> Round two (first free round) -- "Wish" for Elminster's defenses against all
> forms of mind-reading to be temporarily shut down for the turn.
>
> Round three (second free round) -- "Rary's Mind Probe" or some similar such
> spell. Brainrape the temporally challenged Sage of Shadowdale at will.
What
> we're looking for here is the location, defenses, and access codes to the
> Safe Hold.
>
> "What is your address there?" (strong Austrian accent).
>
> the DMG, may be automatically slain in one round. This is that round.
>
>
> Round five -- *bamf*. The contingency is back online now that the Time Stop
> is over, so Elminster goes off to the Safe Hold for a quick reboot.
>
codes
> to the Safe Hold, Vecna is also "off to see the wizard".
>
> Yo, Elminster... even Manshoon has enough brains to scatter his "reboot
> sites" in *multiply* redundant locations. Unfortunately for you, you
weren't
> that clever.
>
> And that's just Vecna's *avatar*. Since the deity itself has the ability to
> cast any spell at will as often as it wants, imagine how messy and pointless
> going up against the deity itself would be.
>
> --
> Chuckg
>
> -----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
> http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
>
Elminster's Evasion isn't an 'no matter what happens to me I automatically
live and escape'. If you bring a character, any character (excepting the
Tarrasque) to -10, he/she dies. kaput. Whether or not he/she goes to some
safehold is immaterial. And even if we stretched ourselves even further and
said sure, there's an automatic spell "Raise" or "Resurrect" there, Vecna
would know where the safehold is anyway.
cgla...@hotmail.com
In article <Pine.A41.3.95b.980404100219.49230B-
100...@homer08.u.washington.edu>,
"S. Wilson" <sswi...@u.washington.edu> wrote:
>
> > Round one -- since a deity's avatar automatically gets the initiative on
any
> > mortal ("Faiths and Avatars", look it up), Vecna gets one free shot. And
he
> > only needs one.
>
> automatically gained initiative.
"Faiths and Avatars" did update it. It specifically states that a deity's
avatar shares *some* of the innate abilities that the full deity has, even if
it doesn't have all of them -- and the initiative bonus and teleport w/o
error innate powers were specifically mentioned has having been shared by the
avatar.
> [snip]
>
> > Round four (last free round) -- A held or paralyzed character, according
> > to the DMG, may be automatically slain in one round. This is that round.
>
> Not the DMG2. (Maybe 2.5? or 1?) DMG2 says held/paralyzed characters may
> be automatically slain, but gives no time frame.
It's been "one round" ever since the original 1st edition.
> > Dagger to the base of the skull. Dead Elminster.
> >
> > Round five -- *bamf*. The contingency is back online now that the Time
> > Stop is over, so Elminster goes off to the Safe Hold for a quick reboot.
>
> Does this even help? I thought Evasion was only a contingency transport
> spell, not a full Resurrection?
It's a multiple contingency spell... stage one is the transport of the body
back to the Safehold, stage two is triggering a pre-cast "Wish" spell to
restore Elminster to full life and health. It's in Elminster's "Hero's
Lorebook" character description.
Of course, since Vecna (in this scenario) would know where the Safe Hold is
and how to get in, the reboot doesn't help Elminster any... as soon as the
resurrected Elminster opens his eyes, who's he going to see standing there?
*zot*.
Elminster's Evasion has only *one* "bugout" location programmed... his Safe
Hold. If you take out the Safe Hold, he's gone. Elminster's lived this long
simply because nobody knows (or CAN know, given how strongly he's shielded it
against all known mortal divination magics) where it is and how to get in.
But keeping a secret from Vecna the demipower is a bit beyond even
Elminster's capacity. :)
Now Elminster vs. Vecna the *mortal* lich, from way back when in Greyhawk's
history before he became a demipower... *that* would be a tough fight to
handicap.
--
Chuckg
Orly Bayani Canlas
> Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.frp.dnd: 3-Apr-98 Re: Vecna vs.
> Elminster cgla...@hotmail.com (2503)
>> *Time Stop*.
>> That's three free rounds.
> That's if Elminster doesn't have his "Immune to Time Stop" spell up.
> I can't remember the actual name, but the spell is from the issue of
> Dragon Magazine (I think 219) where Elminster, Mordenkainen, and Dalamar
> are out on a picnic in the woods. An evil sorceress casts Time Stop,
> but Elminster is immune to the effects. (Note : Elminster couldn't even
> beat (i.e. kill) the sorceress, but instead has to trap her in a big,
strange helmet.)
Orly Canlas
Founder of the Frosted Total Coalition
can...@andrew.cmu.edu
http://www.contrib.andrew.cmu.edu/~canlas
Orly Bayani Canlas
> *Time Stop*.
> That's three free rounds.
That's if Elminster doesn't have his nifty "Immune to Time Stop" spell
(Temporal Freedom) from Dragon 219.
Rob Hertel
Vecna. The truce between dustmen and undead only lasts as long as
the dustmen leave the undead alone.
Rob
Driakos.
>
>> > Dagger to the base of the skull. Dead Elminster.
O My esteemed colleagues, that phrase has brought tears of laughter to my
eyes. ROFL. Every evil player I have ever had in my realms campaigns, has
wanted to off Cheeseminster.
Driakos.
Nick Mason
Orly Bayani Canlas wrote:
> >> *Time Stop*.
>
> >> That's three free rounds.
>
> > That's if Elminster doesn't have his "Immune to Time Stop" spell up.
Although...
Faiths & Avatars, p.16
"[All deities] may also invent new spells or try to improvise spell variations
in the blink of an eye."
Vecna's going to know *exactly* what Elminster's packing, and would
improvise a time stop to counter 'temporal freedom'.
I'll admit 'time stop' is already a 9th-level spell, but Vecna could always
make the material component something worth a hundred million billion
trillion gazillion kajillion gold pieces... he's a god, he gets to ignore
components,
so he can make them whatever he likes.
Just my 2 cents.
Nick Mason (wondering why I contributed to this thread.
*Sigh*.)
npm...@netspace.net.au
Darkmage76
Nick Mason <npm...@netspace.net.au> wrote:
> Orly Bayani Canlas wrote:
>>>> *Time Stop*.
>>> That's if Elminster doesn't have his "Immune to Time Stop" spell up.
> Although...
> Faiths & Avatars, p.16
> "[All deities] may also invent new spells or try to improvise spell
> variations in the blink of an eye."
> Vecna's going to know *exactly* what Elminster's packing, and would
> improvise a time stop to counter 'temporal freedom'.
> I'll admit 'time stop' is already a 9th-level spell, but Vecna could always
> make the material component something worth a hundred million billion
> trillion gazillion kajillion gold pieces... he's a god, he gets to ignore
> components, so he can make them whatever he likes.
Ya'know, every time I see this thread pop up, I just shake my head. How
pointless could the Elminster v. <insertname> be?
Elminster is...
29th-level
Carries manymany protections, items, and running spells.
Has manymany allies who are keen on keeping him around.
Is a major hand of a Greater Power of Magic.
and Intelligent enough to know better than to fight demipowers.
Vecna is...
a Demipower of Secrets
Carries manymany godly powers, protections, and spells.
Has no reason to be mucking around in Faerun.
and Intelligent enough to know better than to fight minons of a Greater
Power.
c (why did I respond? because I *like* the Old Mage :P)
--
Chris (darkm...@aol.com)
"Life is a Deal with Death, get a Contract Extension."
Die Spammers Die
Shaman
> Ya'know, every time I see this thread pop up, I just shake my head. How
> pointless could the Elminster v. <insertname> be?
And I tought I was the only one that believed that on this NG ...
Finally someone that instead of adding a thread over a
Elminster vs. (Blablah) message tries to stop it .. AND
sheds some light of why these encounters are absurd ...
.
Elminster:
> and Intelligent enough to know better than to fight demipowers.
Vecna:
> and Intelligent enough to know better than to fight minons of a Greater
> Power.
>
> c (why did I respond? because I *like* the Old Mage :P)
We are two now ...
Another guy that "likes" The Old Mage ... >:]
Shaman.
PD: Besides I don't know why people minds Elminster
that much ... If they really disregarded him or hated him,
they wouldn't even think or post about him ... I think that if
you constantly speak about something or someone it is
because you are interested in it ... :)
Peace!
Derek A. Weimer
I had Elminster garotted by a mere 3rd level thief in his sleep. The Thief
was a remnant of the Zhentarim. I loved it.
FR was ridded of that old _uber-monty_ mage. My campaign got WAY better
after that.
--
Derek A. Weimer
dwe...@one.net
"Everyone has a right to be stupid.
Some just abuse the privilege."
Shaman wrote in message <01bd6b72$8aeeee00$6ed500cf@lucaslui>...
Stewart
Hmm, in campaigns I am in, we just never meet Elminster. My last two
characters never even heard of him.
--
Zachary P. Stewart
Call me a joker, call me a fool
Right at this moment I'm totaly cool
Clear as a crystal, sharp as a knife
I feel like I'm in the prime of my life
Sometimes it feels like I'm going too fast
I don't know how long this feeling will last
Maybe it's only tonight -B.Joel
Derek A. Weimer
Well I'll be serious here. My last post was a joke. Myself and my gaming
friends jumped ship and went back to Greyhawk after the Realms got too much
of a "candyland" feel.
No offense to the serious FR gamer sout there ;-)
--
Derek A. Weimer
dwe...@one.net
"Everyone has a right to be stupid.
Some just abuse the privilege."
Stewart wrote in message <353BE8...@sgi.net>...
Darkmage76
"Shaman" <pu...@mika.net.fl> writes:
>> Ya'know, every time I see this thread pop up, I just shake my head.
>> How pointless could the Elminster v. <insertname> be?
> And I tought I was the only one that believed that on this NG ...
> Finally someone that instead of adding a thread over a Elminster vs.
> (Blablah) message tries to stop it .. AND sheds some light of why
> these encounters are absurd ....
I think it has to do with people reading the books and automatically thinking
badly of a NPC that is very powerful. Face it folks, he's there because, way
above in the lands of Very High-level Characters, lies that kind of Faerun-wide
intrigue and danger. Your first, fifth, or even tenth and twelfth level
characters -aren't- supposed to be playing around with him. Neither is he there
to toss meteor swarms around and show off. You gotta think of all these
high-powered NPCs as how Ed wove in Deus Ex Machina into the FR Campaign World.
*I* certainly don't have any characters that run into him, and if you do your
either playing a 18th-25th level character, or a twink campaign (or both?;).
Oh, and just remember: the books are meant to be "greater than life" and "grand
heroic adventures." That's why you see all these 20th+ people running around,
fighting and chatting with gods, and holding the entire might of kingdoms.
Normal campaigns never have any of that happen. Of course YMMV. ;-)
-c (who is reminded that Ravens Bluff is the exception and not the rule:-)
Galwylin
Darkmage76 wrote:
>
> I think it has to do with people reading the books and automatically thinking
> badly of a NPC that is very powerful. Face it folks, he's there because, way
> above in the lands of Very High-level Characters, lies that kind of Faerun-wide
> intrigue and danger. Your first, fifth, or even tenth and twelfth level
> characters -aren't- supposed to be playing around with him. Neither is he there
> to toss meteor swarms around and show off. You gotta think of all these
> high-powered NPCs as how Ed wove in Deus Ex Machina into the FR Campaign World.
> *I* certainly don't have any characters that run into him, and if you do your
> either playing a 18th-25th level character, or a twink campaign (or both?;).
>
> Oh, and just remember: the books are meant to be "greater than life" and "grand
> heroic adventures." That's why you see all these 20th+ people running around,
> fighting and chatting with gods, and holding the entire might of kingdoms.
> Normal campaigns never have any of that happen. Of course YMMV. ;-)
Great points, Chris. I've always enjoyed Elminster (and friends) but
have never ran into him in a game. I used to think he didn't like me
cause I kept hearing how he was ruining other games but wouldn't even
say hi in mine <g>.
--
This has been a Galwylin© Production
galw...@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972)
http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/
The Karameikan School of Magecraft
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