Charge Attacks in 2nd Ed.
Kolin Hand
Greetings all.
I had a situation come up the other evening. A player in my campaign began
arguing a point with me and it was not resolved nicely. The issue was the
damage modification when using a charging attack. The specific issue was
that he had a character weilding a spear, charging an orc. He claimed that
the rules in the PHB and the DMG state that the spear is similar to the lance
(being a polearm) so he should receive double the damage. Note however, that
his character was on FOOT, not on a mount. I claim that A.) only weapons
identified in the DMG as inflicting double-damage should receive this
benefit (which the spear is not one); and B.) that those weapons so
identified in the DMG (which by the way, happens to be ONLY various forms of
the LANCE) only recieve double damage benefits when employed in a charge
from a mount.
He is arguing that the reason for the double-damage is the momentum behind
the charge and that any polearm benefits from this even when charging on foot.
I find several things as unfortunate in the 2nd Ed. rule books.
#1.) Pg 96 (PHB) and Pg 59 (DMG) both have the same paragraph explaining
the charge attack and that this paragraph implies that even an attack
on foot receives the double damage.
#2.) The sentence in the above paragraph reads "Certain weapons (such as a
lance) inflict double the rolled damage in a charge." This implies
that other weapons benefit from this, yet none others are identified
in the weapons charts.
#3.) The footnote for charging attacks in the weapons chart in both the PHB
and the DMG read "@ This weapon inflicts double damage when used from
the back of a charging mount." This conflicts with the implication
in #1 above that weapons "such as a lance" gain this bonus even when
the character is charging on foot.
I am inclined to rule that only the lance (in its various forms), receives
double damage and then, only when employed in the charge from a mounted
position.
Any suggestions? Refutations? Help?
Kolin
+===========================================================================+
+ "Guilt Trip: The nuclear weapon of relationships." -- K. Hand +
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
+ Kolin E. Hand ha...@spc7.jpl.nasa.gov +
JAMES ZAKANY
>(Kolin Hand)
>The specific issue was...
>that he had a character weilding a spear, charging an orc. He claimed that
>the rules in the PHB and the DMG state that the spear is similar to the lance
>(being a polearm) so he should receive double the damage.
Well... a spear would do double damage if the ORC was charging the
character AND the character had set the spear for a charge (and this would
only work if you had a line of spears set or a suicidal orc). Saying that
the spear would not do 2x damage is certainly okay, but I would have
probably ruled differently.
I allow only a ROA (rate of attack) of 1/2 for charges. I also invoke a -2
penalty on the charger's AC. The charger DOES get a +2 on his initiative,
however. And the double damage.
'Course, arguing the point during PLAY is another thing, entirely.
James S. Zakany
Kintair of Hawkehaven MKA Bill Hately
(you are the DM after all). However, the simple solution is to say that a
*charge* is by definition from a mount (no need to say where you get the
definition from), and that a *rush* is on foot - the Idea behind a charge is
that the lance has the momentum of a running *large* object behind it. now if
your player has an incredible strength and a movement of 18-24 (and someone
riding him) they can do double damage with a lance style charge.
Bill
Kintair of Hawkehaven | Bill Hately | Talk (403) 381-1741
Shire of Windwyrm | Lethbridge AB | proct_...@hg.uleth.ca
Crown Principality of Avacal | Canada | Smile Dammit
An Tir (I wouldn't dream of subjecting any corp. or Educational Institution to
these opinions, so they certainly aren't the opinions of the UofL)
(And I'm not an officer of the SCA so I can't have an official opinion There
- even if I wanted to )
Life is a Sexually Transmitted Terminal Condition
Craig D. Beere
> double damage and then, only when employed in the charge from a mounted
> position.
>
> Any suggestions? Refutations? Help?
My ruling is that a charge attack is any attack where the attacker is using
more than usual momentum. A character running full-tilt at an opponent
certainly comes into this.
I also rule that any weapon can be used in a charging attack, provided it has a
bit of mass to give it the required momentum.
From memory, a charge makes you lose initiative, and gives you a +2 to hit. It
does nothing for damage. I also rule that a charge gives you a penalty of +2
to initiative on the next round (as you stop), gives opponents a +2 bonus to
attacks like Trip.
The double damage is a special ability of the lance when used in a charge from
horseback. A lance gets this by benefit of its weighting, its special
handgrip, and the fact that it is designed to operate from horseback (i.e. with
the momentum of a horse behind it) - thus a spear, etc does not get this bonus.
{*******************************************************************************
** Craig D. Beere (a.k.a. ++Byron)
** University of Waikato, New Zealand
** C...@waikato.ac.nz
*}
{$I standard_disclaimer}
{$I witty_quote}
Dave Woods
>
>Greetings all.
>
>I had a situation come up the other evening. A player in my campaign began
>arguing a point with me and it was not resolved nicely. The issue was the
>damage modification when using a charging attack. The specific issue was
>that he had a character weilding a spear, charging an orc. He claimed that
>the rules in the PHB and the DMG state that the spear is similar to the lance
>(being a polearm) so he should receive double the damage. Note however, that
>his character was on FOOT, not on a mount. I claim that A.) only weapons
>identified in the DMG as inflicting double-damage should receive this
>benefit (which the spear is not one); and B.) that those weapons so
>identified in the DMG (which by the way, happens to be ONLY various forms of
>the LANCE) only recieve double damage benefits when employed in a charge
>from a mount.
>
>I am inclined to rule that only the lance (in its various forms), receives
>double damage and then, only when employed in the charge from a mounted
>position.
>
>Any suggestions? Refutations? Help?
>
Well, I certainly agree with you concerning charging on foot with a spear,
(or spear type weapon), although rather than just a simple 'NO' set a limit
on the mininum speed at which 'charge' damage can be done.
Also take into account the momentum of the charging person. You might wish
to consider charges of say 36" or higher to do double damage, with the normal
dex and armour class penalties applying to the person doing the charging.
As for mounted spear (or awl pike for that matter) charges, I don't see why
this should be a problem, ALTHOUGH it wouldn't fall under the normal
proficiency for spear, so I'd rule non-proficiency penalties apply. Also,
spears usually aren't long enough (awl pikes on the other hand) and don't have
the hand grips/braces, therefore, the charger would almost CERTAINLY drop the
spear after impact. Of course, given these restriction, nobody would WANT
to charge with anything but a lance, but then, at least you are being flexable
right? :)
>Kolin
>
>+===========================================================================+
>+ "Guilt Trip: The nuclear weapon of relationships." -- K. Hand +
>+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
>+ Kolin E. Hand ha...@spc7.jpl.nasa.gov +
Dave Woods
dlw...@descartes.uwaterloo.ca