[3.5] Help for blinded PC
Giuseppe A.
one of my players want to role-playing a blinded PC. In the DMG I find the rules
for a blinded situation, but there's in any book (WotC or D20) where I can find
rules (or also a template) for figure out a blinded humanoid from the birth?
Thanks in advance for any help.
Bye.
--
Giuseppe A.
Milano - Italy
laszlo_...@freemail.hu
Giuseppe A. wrote:
> Hi,
>
> one of my players want to role-playing a blinded PC. In the DMG I find the rules
> for a blinded situation, but there's in any book (WotC or D20) where I can find
> rules (or also a template) for figure out a blinded humanoid from the birth?
> Thanks in advance for any help.
Can't help you with that, but you should take a look at the Blind
Master prestige class in Quintessential Monk (Mongoose Publishing), if
you can. It's a Monk PrC with blindness as a requirement.
If you want "blind from birth" to be at all viable, I suggest a +20
competence bonus to Listen rolls. This will allow the character to
fairly reliably pinpoint by listening. It's not really realistic, but
hey, it's heroic fantasy, and blind heroes are invariably powerful. :)
Laszlo
Werebat
Make up a PrC for him, probably monk. Blindsense, and later Blindsight,
would be appropriate.
A blind character with 60' Blindsight would be interesting to play.
He'd be at an advantage sometimes and at a disadvantage others.
I had an idea for a mutant human with claws, blindness, and blindsight
who was a cleric of Pelor. Used a quarterstaff.
- Ron ^*^
- Ron ^*^
cop...@yahoo.com
coughZatoichicough
Brandon
David Johnston
wrote:
Of course the whole blind character bit doesn't work so well in a game
universe that has Cure Blindness unless you have a character who
deliberately blinded himself to gain some kind of supernatural
perception.
Matt Frisch
scribed into the ether:
>Hi,
>
>one of my players want to role-playing a blinded PC. In the DMG I find the rules
>for a blinded situation, but there's in any book (WotC or D20) where I can find
>rules (or also a template) for figure out a blinded humanoid from the birth?
>Thanks in advance for any help.
I doubt there is any sourcebook for that situation. There are feats that
the player can use in order to get around some of the restrictions of being
blind, but would still (of course) be incredibly hampered.
Werebat
David Johnston wrote:
IIRC there is a magic blindfold that grants 60' Blindsight in some
splatbook or other.
- Ron ^*^
Quentin Stephens
news:yZvxe.33597$yM4.5...@twister2.libero.it:
> one of my players want to role-playing a blinded PC. In the DMG
> I find the rules for a blinded situation, but there's in any
> book (WotC or D20) where I can find rules (or also a template)
> for figure out a blinded humanoid from the birth? Thanks in
> advance for any help.
What sort of campaign is this? If this is a city campaign with lots
of social interaction, you should be fine. Otherwise, unless you go
for a race with suitable compensation then you might want to try and
dissuade the player.
OTOH the blind seer is a well-worn stereotype.
cop...@yahoo.com
Or the blindness is a divine curse.
Brandon
Billy Yank
Stephens replied. Then he added:
> OTOH the blind seer is a well-worn stereotype.
>
But not as an adventurer. Unless you're talking about the wolf of the same
name.
--
Billy Yank
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freakybaby
news:q7Exe.148185$sy6.45555@lakeread04:
> IIRC there is a magic blindfold that grants 60' Blindsight in some
> splatbook or other.
Arms & Equipment. Blindfold of true darkness
Peter Knutsen (usenet)
Giuseppe A. wrote:
> one of my players want to role-playing a blinded PC. In the DMG I find the rules
> for a blinded situation, but there's in any book (WotC or D20) where I can find
> rules (or also a template) for figure out a blinded humanoid from the birth?
> Thanks in advance for any help.
This is really one of those cases where D&D is just the
wrong system to use.
Or the wrong system for this player. He wants something
which D&D cannot really deliver.
--
Peter Knutsen
sagatafl.org
Ed Chauvin IV
>Giuseppe A. wrote:
>> one of my players want to role-playing a blinded PC. In the DMG I find the rules
>> for a blinded situation, but there's in any book (WotC or D20) where I can find
>> rules (or also a template) for figure out a blinded humanoid from the birth?
>> Thanks in advance for any help.
>
>This is really one of those cases where D&D is just the
>wrong system to use.
Silly wabbit, D&D does this just fine.
Ed Chauvin IV
--
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Matt Frisch
<pe...@sagatafl.invalid> scribed into the ether:
Just being curious, but what system would be better? Blindness is extremely
debiliating in any game, just like it is in reality. My best objection to
D&D and blindness is that the penalties aren't harsh enough.
Michael Scott Brown
news:yZvxe.33597$yM4.5...@twister2.libero.it...
> one of my players want to role-playing a blinded PC. In the DMG I find the
rules
> for a blinded situation, but there's in any book (WotC or D20) where I can
find
> rules (or also a template) for figure out a blinded humanoid from the
birth?
And what rules do you think there should be? Take feats that make sense
for a blind person and get on with your life.
Oh, wait - I get it - you think that being blind should make the
character MORE POWERFUL?
-Michael
DougL
Blind fight is good. Skill focus listen very handy (you can localize
an opponent with a good enough listen check, once localized your
attacks
are much more effective with Blind Fight).
Consider seriously taking enough class levels to get uncanny dodge so
you retain your dex bonus even when unaware of your attacker.
Oh, yeh, and find a Cleric or Paladin able to cast level 3 spells
and get the condition cured. No components so it costs only 150GP
from a commercial cleric, and it works unless the eyes have been
physically destroyed in which case you need regenerate (level 7
so you need a large town or any city to find a level 13 cleric).
There is no good reason within the rules for any D&D character to
stay blind.
DougL
Justisaur
This might not necessarily work, a natural condition of having no eyes
would prevent it. Of course in the last couple campains I've been
running, they'd still cure that one of two ways - perminant polymorph,
or reincarnation.
One other thought for such a character would be to have them play a
Grimlock.
- Justisaur
Peter Knutsen (usenet)
Matt Frisch wrote:
> <pe...@sagatafl.invalid> scribed into the ether:
>>wrong system to use.
>>
>>Or the wrong system for this player. He wants something
>>which D&D cannot really deliver.
>
> Just being curious, but what system would be better? Blindness is extremely
> debiliating in any game, just like it is in reality. My best objection to
> D&D and blindness is that the penalties aren't harsh enough.
GURPS. Among other reasons because it actually compensates
the player for chosing to give his character such a severe
handicap.
Hero System would be the second best option, among published
systems.
My own Sagatafl is superior to Hero System and more or less
on par with GURPS, when it comes to support for blind
characters, but it isn't published yet.
--
Peter Knutsen
sagatafl.org
Matt Frisch
<pe...@sagatafl.invalid> scribed into the ether:
>
>Matt Frisch wrote:
>> <pe...@sagatafl.invalid> scribed into the ether:
>>>This is really one of those cases where D&D is just the
>>>wrong system to use.
>>>
>>>Or the wrong system for this player. He wants something
>>>which D&D cannot really deliver.
>>
>> Just being curious, but what system would be better? Blindness is extremely
>> debiliating in any game, just like it is in reality. My best objection to
>> D&D and blindness is that the penalties aren't harsh enough.
>
>GURPS. Among other reasons because it actually compensates
>the player for chosing to give his character such a severe
>handicap.
Ok, but really, there's no offsetting benefit for being blind beyond "my
other senses got sharper"...which isn't much. If we are looking for
blindness to be modeled, being able to spend character points elsewhere in
compensation isn't terribly realistic.
Kaos
<mister...@earthlink.net> dared speak in front of ME:
Perhaps he just wants to take advantage of the fairly large fantasy
trope of the Blind Master - not necessarily more powerful, but with
enough extraordinary or supernatural mojo to keep up with the sighted
players.
More common in wuxia type fantasy, though.
--
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Christopher Adams
>
> GURPS. Among other reasons because it actually compensates
> the player for chosing to give his character such a severe
> handicap.
Indeed. I used to be severely irritated by the fact that being, say, a humungous
white-supremacist bigot made you capable of being a better swordsman (in that
the points you got for choosing to be a bigoted fuckwit could be spent directly
on your Broadsword skill), but I've long since decided that it's easier just to
accept that it's supposed to be balanced in the overall picture.
Still irritates me a bit, though. Maybe you need some categorisation - points
from this type of disadvantage can only be spent on advantages and skills of the
same general type.
--
Christopher Adams - Sydney, Australia
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understand?
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SingingDancingMoose: There was, but we had to trade it in for the internet.
Berawler: That is quite possibly the best response to any question ever.
David Johnston
Unless you stop and consider that a blind man who goes out and
survives in combat zones, and does effective stuff in them, must
inherently be one hell of a formidable blind guy. It's not that he's
more powerful because he's a blind guy (necessarily). It's just that
he's so amazingly impressive that, even blinded, he can still hold his
own. If he wasn't, he wouldn't be there in the first place. He'd be
dead, or sticking to teaching literature or something.
DougL
> Peter Knutsen (usenet) wrote:
> >
> > GURPS. Among other reasons because it actually compensates
> > the player for chosing to give his character such a severe
> > handicap.
>
> Indeed. I used to be severely irritated by the fact that being, say, a humungous
> white-supremacist bigot made you capable of being a better swordsman (in that
> the points you got for choosing to be a bigoted fuckwit could be spent directly
> on your Broadsword skill), but I've long since decided that it's easier just to
> accept that it's supposed to be balanced in the overall picture.
>
> Still irritates me a bit, though. Maybe you need some categorisation - points
> from this type of disadvantage can only be spent on advantages and skills of the
> same general type.
The method I'm using for my homebrew is that if a disadvantage
inconveinences your character then it has increased the challenge,
which adds to EP awards.
No direct compensation at character generation, but really major
handicaps have a recommended bonus per adventure.
For I would consider giving some levels of negative LA, but then
I would reject the idea for anything that can be fixed or
compensated for by magic, which pretty well rules out blindness.
DougL
David Johnston
>> Still irritates me a bit, though. Maybe you need some categorisation - points
>> from this type of disadvantage can only be spent on advantages and skills of the
>> same general type.
>
>The method I'm using for my homebrew is that if a disadvantage
>inconveinences your character then it has increased the challenge,
>which adds to EP awards.
So your character really sucks at the start and then later all puny
mortals must cower before him?
DougL
Nope, he really sucks at the start and later reaches the point
of being comparable to other characters. Once he is comparable he
is not facing higher challenges after all and hence the awards
fade (actually that's automatic since high positive EP
result in diminishing returns in character capablilities).
Learn to read. Where does increased challenge imply that the
disadvantaged character EVER gets to be better than a normal
character started at the same time.
Being blind is a disadvantage, it should NOT ballance, the player
gets extra spotlight time which is already compensation for the
person who matters. The added points are a reward for good
roleplaying and for roleplaying a disadvantaged character (that's
the normal claim anyway), but in that case NO COMPENSATION is
needed or desirable prior to the PLAYER demonstrating the ability
to play the disadvantage and roleplaying the disadvantaged
character.
Additionally EVERY system I know of with the compensation at
character design system ALSO states explicitely that no
compensation is granted for disadvantages gained in play, so
appearently there is a magic moment where you need compensation,
but ten minutes later in the character's life you don't. Moreover
the justifications for compensation don't change one little bit
based on when the disadvantage occures.
DougL
David Johnston
>David Johnston wrote:
>> On 4 Jul 2005 20:13:52 -0700, "DougL" <doug.l...@tdytsi.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> >> Still irritates me a bit, though. Maybe you need some categorisation - points
>> >> from this type of disadvantage can only be spent on advantages and skills of the
>> >> same general type.
>> >
>> >The method I'm using for my homebrew is that if a disadvantage
>> >inconveinences your character then it has increased the challenge,
>> >which adds to EP awards.
>>
>> So your character really sucks at the start and then later all puny
>> mortals must cower before him?
>
>Nope, he really sucks at the start and later reaches the point
>of being comparable to other characters. Once he is comparable he
>is not facing higher challenges after all and hence the awards
>fade (actually that's automatic since high positive EP
>result in diminishing returns in character capablilities).
>
>Learn to read. Where does increased challenge imply that the
>disadvantaged character EVER gets to be better than a normal
>character started at the same time.
>
>Being blind is a disadvantage, it should NOT ballance, the player
>gets extra spotlight time which is already compensation for the
>person who matters.
It's pretty unlikely the blind guy will get any extra spotlight time.
I mean he's just blind. Big deal.
The added points are a reward for good
>roleplaying and for roleplaying a disadvantaged character (that's
>the normal claim anyway), but in that case NO COMPENSATION is
>needed or desirable prior to the PLAYER demonstrating the ability
>to play the disadvantage and roleplaying the disadvantaged
>character.
>
>Additionally EVERY system I know of with the compensation at
>character design system ALSO states explicitely that no
>compensation is granted for disadvantages gained in play,
Not true. You don't get more points to spend of course, but you can
trade in obsolete disadvantages for your new ones in Hero and GURPS.
so
>appearently there is a magic moment where you need compensation,
>but ten minutes later in the character's life you don't.
Character generation does not occur in the character's life.
Moreover
>the justifications for compensation don't change one little bit
>based on when the disadvantage occures.
The justifications for compensation are
1. Encourages players to work out the character's personality and
past history.
Does not apply once game play starts. The history that gives the
player his new Enemy or her loss of her hand was actually played out
in the game. There's nothing to work out.
2. Allows a player to run a character with an interestingly serious
handicap who won't be such deadweight that the other characters would
normally be reluctant to let him join the team when they could get a
computer hacker who is just as good but can walk unassisted.
Once the character is an established part of the team, people won't be
quite so eager to abandon him after he gets bunged up or in trouble
because he has been helping them, particularly if his experience
growth means that even with the handicap he'll be better than a new
recruit starting at base point levels. Also, that the handicap was
acquired through mischance probably means it wasn't part of the
character's concept and therefore there's no problem making the
handicap temporary. Handicaps that aren't bought with points after
all, can be taken away as freely as they are bestowed. So unless you
want to do some disadvantage substitution, that missing hand can be
replaced with ultratechnology prosthetic, that blindness can be
neutralised with the magic blindfold of sight, and that shattered
spine can be fixed with the help of a great neurosurgeon.
Justin Bacon
Matt Frisch wrote:
> On Tue, 05 Jul 2005 03:43:54 +0200, "Peter Knutsen (usenet)"
> <pe...@sagatafl.invalid> scribed into the ether:
> >GURPS. Among other reasons because it actually compensates
> >the player for chosing to give his character such a severe
> >handicap.
>
> Ok, but really, there's no offsetting benefit for being blind beyond "my
> other senses got sharper"...which isn't much. If we are looking for
> blindness to be modeled, being able to spend character points elsewhere in
> compensation isn't terribly realistic.
GURPS does *not* say: "Because the character is blind, it's perfectly
realistic for them to have these other nifty abilities as
compensation."
What GURPS says is: "This character is blind. That's a seriously
debilitating disadvantage. If this character is to be equal to the
other PCs in terms of power and effectiveness, then this characer must
have more nifty abilities than the other PCs."
The trade-off in points is a matter of meta-game design. It doesn't
model any sort of trade-off or compensation in the game world.
(Although it could. If you were designing Daredevil, for example.)
--
Justin Bacon
tria...@aol.com
cop...@yahoo.com
> On Mon, 04 Jul 2005 21:29:10 GMT, "Michael Scott Brown"
> <mister...@earthlink.net> dared speak in front of ME:
>
> >"Giuseppe A." <gambi...@libero.it> wrote in message
> >news:yZvxe.33597$yM4.5...@twister2.libero.it...
> >> one of my players want to role-playing a blinded PC. In the DMG I find the
> >rules
> >> for a blinded situation, but there's in any book (WotC or D20) where I can
> >find
> >> rules (or also a template) for figure out a blinded humanoid from the
> >birth?
> >
> > And what rules do you think there should be? Take feats that make sense
> >for a blind person and get on with your life.
> > Oh, wait - I get it - you think that being blind should make the
> >character MORE POWERFUL?
>
> Perhaps he just wants to take advantage of the fairly large fantasy
> trope of the Blind Master - not necessarily more powerful, but with
> enough extraordinary or supernatural mojo to keep up with the sighted
> players.
For example, the blind swordman Zatoichi is really only inconvenienced
by not being able to read -- but even then, as an experienced gambler,
he seems to not have a problem knowing what the dice roll up as. His
blindness is really more of a plot device than an actual disadvantage,
which may be the best way to play it for a PC.
Brandon
Kaos
Depends on what angle you're looking at. If you're looking at a
character talented enough to be classed a Hero, then blindness is
something which he must have made up for in other ways to meet that
status.
OTOH, if you're just modelling a random blind person... well, don't
bother balancing the points. Just give them the traits they exhibit,
and see where they end up.
Kevin Lowe
Matt Frisch <matu...@yahoo.spam.me.not.com> wrote:
In Feng Shui, the time someone wanted to play a blind martial arts
master we just ignored the usual penalties for being blind when it came
to that character and made up the rest as we went along. In RISIS you'd
just put four dice into the Blind Master Cliche, which would cover doing
everything Zatoichi et. al. do.
Blindness is only a hassle in relatively rules-heavy games like DnD and
GURPS where there are detailed rules for perception that matter
tactically.
--
Kevin Lowe,
Tasmania.
Beppe63
critics.
The blinded PC is an idea of the player and after that I have exposed my
perplexity he wanted play it same.
However, the blinded situation is a choice of the PC, that after a cruel
past he closed the "eyes" toward the world.
For this reason I decided to use as reference an entry in the Blinded
Master and give him a +1/level (the PC is 4th level) to Concentration,
Listen and Move Silently check. If the PC regain sight lose the mentioned
benefit.
Apologize for my english! ;)
--
Bye.
Giuseppe A.
tussock
>>"Giuseppe A." <gambi...@libero.it> wrote in message
>>news:yZvxe.33597$yM4.5...@twister2.libero.it...
>>
>>>one of my players want to role-playing a blinded PC. In the DMG I find the rules
>>>for a blinded situation, but there's in any book (WotC or D20) where I can find
>>>rules (or also a template) for figure out a blinded humanoid from the birth?
>
> an opponent with a good enough listen check, once localized your
> attacks are much more effective with Blind Fight).
There's a Blindsight 5' Radius feat lying around somewhere too,
with Blind-fighting and high Wisdom as a prereq IIRC.
> Consider seriously taking enough class levels to get uncanny dodge so
> you retain your dex bonus even when unaware of your attacker.
The real problem would be getting attacked from range, where you
can't make the listen checks due to large range penalties.
I'd be tempted not to bother with Dex, as ranged attacks won't work
anyway. Just tank up and get good Con and Wis.
> Oh, yeh, and find a Cleric or Paladin able to cast level 3 spells
> and get the condition cured. No components so it costs only 150GP
> from a commercial cleric, and it works unless the eyes have been
> physically destroyed in which case you need regenerate (level 7
> so you need a large town or any city to find a level 13 cleric).
Until then, get people that can cast fogs and darkness effects for
you, as with your listen and blind-fighting you'll rule on even terms.
Obviously don't bother trying to be a spellcaster (or ranged combatant)
yourself, as you can't target what you can't touch when you're blind.
> There is no good reason within the rules for any D&D character to
> stay blind.
Other than as an amusing plot device, leading to trying to find the
right words for that /wish/ once the various other options come up duds.
--
tussock
Aspie at work, sorry in advance.
Some Guy
>>for a blinded situation, but there's in any book (WotC or D20) where I can find
>>rules (or also a template) for figure out a blinded humanoid from the birth?
>
>
> Master prestige class in Quintessential Monk (Mongoose Publishing), if
> you can. It's a Monk PrC with blindness as a requirement.
>
> If you want "blind from birth" to be at all viable, I suggest a +20
> competence bonus to Listen rolls. This will allow the character to
> fairly reliably pinpoint by listening. It's not really realistic, but
> hey, it's heroic fantasy, and blind heroes are invariably powerful. :)
>
>
Speaking of unrealistic, you can use this for your research:
~consul
> Matt Frisch wrote:
>> Just being curious, but what system would be better? Blindness is
>> extremely debiliating in any game, just like it is in reality. My best objection to
>> D&D and blindness is that the penalties aren't harsh enough.
> GURPS. Among other reasons because it actually compensates the player
> for chosing to give his character such a severe handicap.
Why not just make it like ... crap, what's the word, the [FLAW] system that they give
wu-jen and other mages so that they can get extra feats. From what I remember of their
descriptions, blindness could easily be a [FLAW] that gets bonus to Listen, Tremorsense,
and whatever the feat that lets rogues diable traps in the dark with an 'enhanced'
feeling, Tactile something.
--
"... respect, all good works are not done by only good folk. For within these Trials, we
shall do what needs to be done."
--till next time, Jameson Stalanthas Yu -x- <<poetry.dolphins-cove.com>>
~consul
> laszlo_...@freemail.hu wrote:
>> If you want "blind from birth" to be at all viable, I suggest a +20
>> competence bonus to Listen rolls. This will allow the character to
>> fairly reliably pinpoint by listening. It's not really realistic, but
>> hey, it's heroic fantasy, and blind heroes are invariably powerful. :)
> http://tinyurl.com/72gor
House of Flying Daggers has some nice scenes with a blind girl. (I'm not going to spoil it)
C. Baize
> On Tue, 12 Jul 2005 14:25:10 -0700, ~consul
> <con...@INVALIDdolphins-cove.com> wrote:
>
>
>>Some Guy wrote:
>>
>>>laszlo_...@freemail.hu wrote:
>>>
>>>>If you want "blind from birth" to be at all viable, I suggest a +20
>>>>competence bonus to Listen rolls. This will allow the character to
>>>>fairly reliably pinpoint by listening. It's not really realistic, but
>>>>hey, it's heroic fantasy, and blind heroes are invariably powerful. :)
>>>
>>>Speaking of unrealistic, you can use this for your research:
>>>http://tinyurl.com/72gor
>>
>>House of Flying Daggers has some nice scenes with a blind girl. (I'm not going to spoil it.
>
>
> The girl in House of the Flying Daggers performs well past what is
> believable even for a "heroic" blind hero(ine). This is explained in
> the spoily bits.
>
> "Blind Fury" with Rutger Hauer might be a better example.
Or Stick from "Elektra".