Lawful Neutral Thief?
Stephanie Z. Croom
I am preparing a female elven thief for a game. My DM wants me, as
a relative newbie, to stay away from doing any evil PCs. He also has
had bad experience with gamers playing the now controversial (at least
in this newsgroup) Chaotic Neutral alignment, so that area is off limits
for me also. According to the Players Handbook, the other alignment options
for a thief are True Neutral, Neutral Good, and Lawful Neutral.
I can figure out how to play a TN thief, and a NG thief sounds like Robin
Hood, but a Lawful Neutral thief? Somebody help me out.
Why would a thief care about using order and regulation to maintain the
balance of the universe? (my humble interprtation of LN)
Thank you.
Stephanie
--
Stephanie Zeloris Croom Bradley | bz...@cleveland.freenet.edu
AKA NEWBIE WOMAN !!!!! | disclaimer: i married mark.
The Grim Reaper
Hmm. LN, or any alignment for that matter, can be interpreted in many
different ways. For instance, a LN thief could be just someone with a
strong code of honor (no shooting in the back, no attacking an unarmed
person, etc), but they might see nothing wrong with robbing those who
can defend themselves. They could just rely on personal discipline, like
a monk. But I agree, LN and thieves don't really work too well together.
Marc Evensen
>In article (Stephanie Z. Croom) writes:
>>
>>I am preparing a female elven thief for a game. My DM wants me, as
>>a relative newbie, to stay away from doing any evil PCs. He also has
>>had bad experience with gamers playing the now controversial (at least
>>in this newsgroup) Chaotic Neutral alignment, so that area is off limits
>>for me also. According to the Players Handbook, the other alignment options
>>for a thief are True Neutral, Neutral Good, and Lawful Neutral.
>>I can figure out how to play a TN thief, and a NG thief sounds like Robin
>>Hood, but a Lawful Neutral thief? Somebody help me out.
>>Why would a thief care about using order and regulation to maintain the
>>balance of the universe? (my humble interprtation of LN)
>Hmm. LN, or any alignment for that matter, can be interpreted in many
>different ways. For instance, a LN thief could be just someone with a
>strong code of honor (no shooting in the back, no attacking an unarmed
>person, etc), but they might see nothing wrong with robbing those who
>can defend themselves. They could just rely on personal discipline, like
>a monk. But I agree, LN and thieves don't really work too well together.
One interpretation is a thief who has a strong belief in "honor
among thieves" and the Guild system. She may have been placed in the
role of thief in order to live (perhaps an orphan/escaped slave), yet
still believe in order. She might also see that the only chance for
escaping the "bottom rung" of society is to work within the Thieves'
Guild and gain power and influence.
Another way to run a LN thief character is to have her be a character
with thief skills, but not actually someone who uses these skills for
personal gain (not a burglar/pickpocket/etc.) If you use kits, this
might be a bounty hunter; if not, you might actually be an investigator
(a la "To Catch a Thief"); or pperhaps you are just an adventurer who
grew up with a shady past and now uses skills previously meant for
survival (eg thieving) for the benefit of your party.
Just a couple of possibilities.
-- Marc
Marc Evensen
E-mail: eam...@orion.oac.uci.edu
"Those who are skilled in combat do not become angered,
those who are skilled at winning do not become afraid.
Thus the wise win before the fight, while the ignorant fight to win."
Tamitha Carpenter
>I am preparing a female elven thief for a game.
[Snip]
>.... but a Lawful Neutral thief? Somebody help me out.
>Why would a thief care about using order and regulation to maintain the
>balance of the universe? (my humble interprtation of LN)
>Thank you.
>Stephanie
>--
>Stephanie Zeloris Croom Bradley | bz...@cleveland.freenet.edu
>AKA NEWBIE WOMAN !!!!! | disclaimer: i married mark.
AN interpretation of this was used by me in a game once.
The thief had a rigid code of honor (He woud have written it
down but he was illiterate) which included things like "Never
steal from those you would call friends," "Work within the
system to choose your targets (guild law)," and "learn the laws
of the land, for they can be used for profit."
He had an attitude a mile wide, because he was a peasant
trained as a thief, and so outside his town he would wear all
black, declare himself a thief to any and all who asked, but
would clearly explain that his specialty was stealing from tombs
and the like. Of course, they almost never believed him, but
the size of the party usually prevented the local authorities
from making a fuss... but every thieves guild tracked him
down right away.
He considered anyone dumb enough to flaunt jewelry and
gems to be a target, be they good or evil, and (I must admit)
purloined many items from fallen comrades' bodies... "they
wont be needing them, right?" So his outlook was neither
good nor evil, for he would cash in all of his loot to give to
unfortunates (peasants, urchins, etc.) like he was given by
the wandering thief who trained him.
He was very rigid in his thinking, to the point of if
he thought something was an illusion, even being hit by it wouldn't
shake his belief that it wasn't there. (Our cleric saved him many
times becaue of this... "I'm alive right, so it wasn't really there.")
Hope this helps,
Wizard of the 7th Circle --||-- David E. Wall
w...@donald.phast.umass.edu or this account.
Bonnie J. Wallace
>In article <21lk8r$j...@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> bz...@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Stephanie Z. Croom) writes:
>>
>>I can figure out how to play a TN thief, and a NG thief sounds like Robin
>>Hood, but a Lawful Neutral thief? Somebody help me out.
>>Why would a thief care about using order and regulation to maintain the
>>balance of the universe? (my humble interprtation of LN)
>>
>different ways. For instance, a LN thief could be just someone with a
>strong code of honor (no shooting in the back, no attacking an unarmed
>person, etc), but they might see nothing wrong with robbing those who
>can defend themselves. They could just rely on personal discipline, like
>a monk. But I agree, LN and thieves don't really work too well together.
Or you could just look at lawfulness in a new way. Give your thief
of personal codes on how certain things _need_ to be done (never
attempt to pick pockets without crossing herself five times, always
mutter certain words before trying to climb walls because it's
"luckier that way," or just "works better." Always stop by the
temple of the thieves' god(dess) in every town entered, etc.) Sounds
like a wonderful opportunity to play a minor fetishist to me.
That way you have a character who does believe in order (lawful)
but uses only the system of laws which works for her (neutral.)
-Bonnie
bon...@alumni.caltech.edu
Timothy Connal Delaney
>Why would a thief care about using order and regulation to maintain the
>balance of the universe? (my humble interprtation of LN)
Perhaps the thief belongs to an organisation such as the Mockers (from
Raymond E. Feist's Riftwar series). The thief could be completely loyal to
the Mockers and follow their dictates entirely (or at least not disobey
exactly ...) They would not necessarily have to obey the laws of the kingdom,
etc, as these simply do not apply in their personal situation.
Or maybe it's just a nation of thieves. It all depends on your
interpretation of the alignment.
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Tim Delaney u925...@wampyr.cc.uow.edu.au
Wes Contreras
Not only do you have to remember that there are a lot of interpretation
for alignments, there are a lot of different kinds of thieves. There are the
typical "I break into your house and rob you blind" thieves, which seem to
proliferate in most cities, but there are also the bounty hunters and
investigators mentioned by someone which would have the thief class. Also,
many scouts and merchants will also use the thief class. However, for a lawful
character, I would think that an assassin would work best. Probably someone
who claims to be a fighter, or is multi-classed and claims to be something
else. But he (or she, of course) is actually part of a shadowy assassin's
guild, which governs his life completely. He own total and absolute loyalty
to the Guild, and will do anything they ask, including a suicide mission or
even simply fall on his sword to prevent witnesses to a crime.
While on Feist's books, try the Hamoi Tong in the Daughter of the Empire
series. Tsuranni assassins. They had a rigid code of honor, and total obedience
to the Tong. Or the Arab Holy Slayers. Loyal to a man to the Grandfather of
Assassins, but still using the thief class. If you want AD&D stuff to look at,
check out the Complete Thieves' Handbook, scout, bounty hunter, and assassin
kits, try the Al Qadim sourcebook, and the Assassin Mountain set for Al Qadim.
All are excellent references. Good luck. And Enjoy!
Barbara Haddad
> > bz...@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Stephanie Z. Croom) writes:
> >
> > >Why would a thief care about using order and regulation to maintain the
> > >balance of the universe? (my humble interprtation of LN)
>
> Why would a person classed "thief" have to be a robber?
> How about a spy for the local king... private investigator... in the
> constabulary?
>
.....Or act as a professional guide? The euphamism that
dungeoneering thieves have taken to using in my gaming world is 'scout'.
Adventurers that meet someone who calls themself a 'scout' can be pretty
sure that this brand of thief has specialized in finding/removing traps,
opening locks, hearing and climbing.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Barbara Haddad - mel...@shakala.com
Shakala BBS (ClanZen Radio Network) Sunnyvale, CA +1-408-734-2289
Tony Mason
In article 88...@ut-emx.uucp, sil...@metonymy.ots.utexas.edu (silver Harloe) writes:
:-)> bz...@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Stephanie Z. Croom) writes:
:-)>
:-)> >Why would a thief care about using order and regulation to maintain the
:-)> >balance of the universe? (my humble interprtation of LN)
:-)
:-)Why would a person classed "thief" have to be a robber?
:-)How about a spy for the local king... private investigator... in the
:-)constabulary?
Excellent point. A thief need not be a thief. I have rolled up (though
never actually had a chance to play) such a thief -- Oswald, the Dragon Hunter.
He scouted, stalked, and basically hunted dragons (his motives were his own);
however, such a role meant he needed stealth rather than brute force.
"Bard" didn't really describe the character, so he became a Lawful Neutral thief.
As I recall, the RavenLoft boxed set included a Lawful Good thief, a scholar
who wanders about attempting to slay vampires (the equivalent of Von Helsing).
I would consider Indiana Jones a "thief" (in the D&D sense) in that he relies
on cunning, stealth and wits rather than brute force or magic; but *he* doesn't
fit the traditional mould of skulking about behind stronger characters and
frisking the dead, picking locks, backstabbing, etc.
Your limit is your imagination. Imagination is limitless.
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Nepolon Roduel
u925...@wampyr.cc.uow.edu.au (Timothy Connal Delaney) writes:
> Perhaps the thief belongs to an organisation such as the Mockers (from
> Raymond E. Feist's Riftwar series). The thief could be completely loyal to
> the Mockers and follow their dictates entirely (or at least not disobey
> exactly ...) They would not necessarily have to obey the laws of the
kingdom
> etc, as these simply do not apply in their personal situation.
> Or maybe it's just a nation of thieves. It all depends on your
> interpretation of the alignment.
Very good explanation. I am also VERY pleased to see another Riftwar veteran!
Seems that few read it and all like it, as I did. But, speaking of
midkemia... I have collected some of the house rules and optional rules and
such that I plan to use in PBEM games set on midkemia. I would be interested
in your opinion of the rules. If you would like to see them, I will Email
them to you if I recieve a reply to this asking for it.
NOTICE:
Don't send characters to me please people. The PBEM will be run on Fidonet,
EDANet, and Candynet. I do not have the facilities to run a PBEM on usenet.
Thanks
=-NepeloN RodueL-= ... Damnit! Does it look like Napoleon?
Fidonet 1:105/290.15
Candynet 42:3301/1002
Uucp nepolon...@p15.f290.n105.z1