I turn myself in, I have duped items.
Monk
How chessy and lame.
Is this another patchwork attempt to fix the game?
heh
well damn i guess i gotta turn all my money in
and my 5 castles
on each shard
and my regent stockpile
and all my armor
or wait did i give all that stuff away already?
lol
lame patchwork
wonder what happens after the amnesty week is up :)
PS. if u duped items just give them all away preferable to friends who
will hold them
Duper
They should have a 12 step program for dupers anonymous.
I'm addicted to duping and i cant stop. really
The Kellers
-=Simulation of a UODA (Ultima Online Dupers Anonymous) club=-
-Head Member- Okay, we would like to thank all those who have decided to
join the UODA. First, let us go around and ask those who have duped to
express their feelings. Your first.
-Person Number 1- Hello, my name is ------- (no name stated for security
reasons :) and I have duped. It used to be something casual that I
thought I could stop when I wanted, but then I started to dupe
everything I got. Now I own 9 castles, 24 houses, and have 123000000
gold. And now they want me to stop?! Well... I'll never stop! HEAR ME,
I'LL NEVER STOP! NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NE *umph!*
(unfortuneatly he had to be carted away)
-Head Member- Okay, thank you for your, umm, unique expresion of your
feelings. Next?
-Person Number 2- Umm, Hi, my name is ------ and I dupe. But i'm better
than the rest, for I know how to dupe PLAYERS!! Yes, I have even duped
myself! Now my copy is running around Britian looking for monsters to
kill so I can dupe the gold. I guess I should stop, but I can't! I'm
addicted to duping! Will someone please help me!? Someone? Anyone?!
-Head Member- Don't worry, we are hear to help. Now please get off that
table and sit down. Next?
-Person Number 3- Heh heh heh... I dupe and iT RuLeZ DooodZ. YoU LamAZ
CuNt UnDerStanD wHat DoopING DoeS FOr mE! AnD I'm ONly 2 yEarS olD
DooDz!
-Head Member- My god who let that kid in here! Security! Get this little
punk outta here! Ahh, thank you. Next?
-Person Number 4- I dupe, and I dupe because I like to dupe the stuff I
pull from your dead carcases when I fry them with my fireball spell. And
all you queers can go to hell for all I care!
-Head Member- Ohh great, a PK case... next?
-Person Number 5- Heh heee hee heee, I DUPE! ANF I"N ONJY 1 YETAR DLO!
-Head Member- My god, your all a bunch of freaks! Someone contact the
GM's, I got the worst dupers right here!
* * *
Okay, I couldn't help myself. I'll promise not to do this ever again.
Heh heh heh.
Kane Greysword, Master (or what OSI means, Novice) Swordsman, Novice
(and I can kill whatever I damn want with this skill) mage, Grandmaster
Lagger (why won't this Atrophy?!)
marc
Actually if you give away your duped items like one item to each person
your meet you could upset uo's economy. They would never it know it
was a duped item because the person would only have one of those items.
They aren't smart enough to have tags that say duped and not duped.
The only way they can tell an item is duped is if you have an unusal
amount of an item. So just trade and carry one item of each thing they
will never realize an item was duped. Oops I foprgot dupers are greedy
and would never think to only carry one item, let alone give away items.
Stop the spam join CAUCE
HTTP://www.cauce.org/
On Thu, 15 Jan 1998, Don Sheppard wrote:
> Yeah, good idea. Get your friends banned. Dipshit.
>
> Monk <chri...@erols.com> wrote in article <34BD55...@erols.com>...
Psycho Man
I'd love to see Judge Judy preside over the hearing of this case :)
Hell, make this thing pay-per-view!
K. Laisathit wrote:
>
> In article <34BD5A...@san.rr.com>, Courageous <jkra...@san.rr.com> wrote:
> >> PS. if u duped items just give them all away preferable to friends who
> >> will hold them
> >
> >This isn't a court of law. They are not particularly required
> >to present evidence to convict you. If you do this, and do not
> >turn yourself in, they may have already tried you in absentia,
> >my friend.
>
> Ah... but things could get sticky if OSI has to follow up on the
> threat of banning. Banning a few recalcitrant players for posting
> bugs on the net is one thing, banning *alleged* cheaters en masse
> is another. Even if the unilateral modified user agreement is
> in fact binding, OSI still has to prove that violation occured.
> Since all electronics data can be doctored so as not to leave any
> trace of tampering, I doubt that the so-called list of cheaters
> will be admissible in court.
>
> Not that I have a problem with banning cheaters. But, in reality,
> enforcing this type of agreement can be extremely sticky. If
> a couple of hundreds of players are banned for alleged cheating,
> without refunds of course, some legal action may ensue. It's
> probably not worth the legal fee, if just one or two are banned.
> But hundreds, with total billing + initial game costs of a couple
> of thousands of dollars may be good enough to compel someone to
> pick up the case. Heck, people are suing for less money than this.
>
> Later...
> --
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> K I R A T I L A I S A T H I T kir...@u.washington.edu
Chris
I've been a bad boy, i need to be spanked!
whahahhaaa
Crxbreed wrote:
>
> Sssssshhhhhhhhh!!!!! Don't tell him that! I love when abusers of the system
> get their just dues! =) Way to go Origins! I knew you had it in ya!
>
> >> PS. if u duped items just give them all away preferable to friends who
> >> will hold them
> >
> >This isn't a court of law. They are not particularly required
> >to present evidence to convict you. If you do this, and do not
> >turn yourself in, they may have already tried you in absentia,
> >my friend.
> >
> >GM's have been popping in invisibly to banks and other areas
> >to observe cheaters for quite some time now. If they saw you
> >duping, and you don't turn yourself in, you are gonna be
> >delivering us a goodbye message really soon.
> >
> >It won't matter if you don't have a single gold piece any more,
> >my friend.
> >
> >
> >
> >Courageous.
> >
> >
> >
JW
> trace of tampering, I doubt that the so-called list of cheaters
> will be admissible in court.
>
They don't have to prove a damn thing. They reserve the right to refuse
service to anyone. They will have to refund some of your money but thats
it. They can kick your cheatin ass out anytime they feel like it. And I
hope they boot every damn one.
--
Jeff & Tammy Wagner
http://www.proaxis.com/~jart
Don Sheppard
Yeah, good idea. Get your friends banned. Dipshit.
Monk <chri...@erols.com> wrote in article <34BD55...@erols.com>...
> How chessy and lame.
>
> Is this another patchwork attempt to fix the game?
> heh
>
> well damn i guess i gotta turn all my money in
> and my 5 castles
> on each shard
> and my regent stockpile
> and all my armor
> or wait did i give all that stuff away already?
> lol
> lame patchwork
> wonder what happens after the amnesty week is up :)
>
Courageous
> PS. if u duped items just give them all away preferable to friends who
> will hold them
This isn't a court of law. They are not particularly required
K. Laisathit
>> will hold them
>
>This isn't a court of law. They are not particularly required
>to present evidence to convict you. If you do this, and do not
>turn yourself in, they may have already tried you in absentia,
>my friend.
Ah... but things could get sticky if OSI has to follow up on the
threat of banning. Banning a few recalcitrant players for posting
bugs on the net is one thing, banning *alleged* cheaters en masse
is another. Even if the unilateral modified user agreement is
in fact binding, OSI still has to prove that violation occured.
Since all electronics data can be doctored so as not to leave any
trace of tampering, I doubt that the so-called list of cheaters
will be admissible in court.
Not that I have a problem with banning cheaters. But, in reality,
Crxbreed
Sssssshhhhhhhhh!!!!! Don't tell him that! I love when abusers of the system
get their just dues! =) Way to go Origins! I knew you had it in ya!
>> PS. if u duped items just give them all away preferable to friends who
>> will hold them
>
>This isn't a court of law. They are not particularly required
>to present evidence to convict you. If you do this, and do not
>turn yourself in, they may have already tried you in absentia,
>my friend.
>
Guerrino Suffi
Would you like to see Britannia rule again, my friend?
All you have to do is follow the Worms.
Jster
I wonder if OSI really has 273 names that are dupers? Or is that just
to threaten those cheating bastards?
On Wed, 14 Jan 1998 19:14:57 -0500, Monk <chri...@erols.com> wrote:
>How chessy and lame.
>
>Is this another patchwork attempt to fix the game?
>heh
>
>well damn i guess i gotta turn all my money in
>and my 5 castles
>on each shard
>and my regent stockpile
>and all my armor
>or wait did i give all that stuff away already?
>lol
>lame patchwork
>wonder what happens after the amnesty week is up :)
>
Fred Riley
I can't agree with you. I get as angry as the next person at some of the lame
crap that comes out of UO, but do you honestly think that they weren't
preparing for this ever since the dupe bug became known? I'll bet the last
patch added a flag to your character and if you duped the flag was toggled and
they know it.
marc wrote:
> Actually if you give away your duped items like one item to each person
> your meet you could upset uo's economy. They would never it know it
> was a duped item because the person would only have one of those items.
> They aren't smart enough to have tags that say duped and not duped.
> The only way they can tell an item is duped is if you have an unusal
> amount of an item. So just trade and carry one item of each thing they
> will never realize an item was duped. Oops I foprgot dupers are greedy
> and would never think to only carry one item, let alone give away items.
>
> Stop the spam join CAUCE
> HTTP://www.cauce.org/
>
> On Thu, 15 Jan 1998, Don Sheppard wrote:
>
> > Yeah, good idea. Get your friends banned. Dipshit.
> >
> > Monk <chri...@erols.com> wrote in article <34BD55...@erols.com>...
Courageous
K. Laisathit wrote:
>
> >This isn't a court of law. They are not particularly required
> >to present evidence to convict you. If you do this, and do not
> >turn yourself in, they may have already tried you in absentia,
> >my friend.
>
> Ah... but things could get sticky if OSI has to follow up on the
> threat of banning. Banning a few recalcitrant players for posting
> bugs on the net is one thing, banning *alleged* cheaters en masse
> is another. Even if the unilateral modified user agreement is
> in fact binding, OSI still has to prove that violation occured.
> Since all electronics data can be doctored so as not to leave any
> trace of tampering, I doubt that the so-called list of cheaters
> will be admissible in court.
There won't be any "court"; AOL banns people all the time.
You can get panned--like a thunderbolt--for just saying
"fuck" 3 times on AOL. It's unlikely, but I have seen it
happen.
As an AOL admin once said to me, "If you wouldn't here it
in a Walt Disney movie, don't say it on AOL". :)
Anyway, the point is, they can, and they probably will
bann these cheaters completely without worry about any
"lawsuit" or other legal wrangles. The idea is almost
ridiculous. To me, anyway.
Courageous.
Courageous
> I wonder if OSI really has 273 names that are dupers? Or is that just
> to threaten those cheating bastards?
It is quite possible to detect AUTOMATICALLY--by way of a simple
computer program--people using the "formula" for duping that was
made public to the message boards. Whether or not they implimented
this detection mechanism I do not know, but I do know, from
observing the formula for duping, exactly how they could detect
these cheaters (I could have written the program--fully debugged--
within an hour, I am quite sure; it's that simple).
It won't matter if you give away all your gold, reagents, and
other duped items if they wrote the program I am thinking of.
They will have caught you dead, read-handed and have a
more or less incontrovertible record of it.
If you didn't use the popular formula, you are still in danger
of having been caught without your knowledge. Someone might
have turned you in... a gm follows you around as you dupe...
they make a written record of it. End of story.
My advice, if you are a duper--TURN YOURSELF IN.
That is, if you want to keep playing UO...
Courageous.
Karl Schlipf
The Kellers wrote:
> -=Simulation of a UODA (Ultima Online Dupers Anonymous) club=-
>
> -Head Member- Okay, we would like to thank all those who have decided to
> join the UODA. First, let us go around and ask those who have duped to
> express their feelings. Your first.
>
> -Person Number 1- Hello, my name is ------- (no name stated for security
> reasons :) and I have duped. It used to be something casual that I
> thought I could stop when I wanted, but then I started to dupe
> everything I got. Now I own 9 castles, 24 houses, and have 123000000
> gold. And now they want me to stop?! Well... I'll never stop! HEAR ME,
> I'LL NEVER STOP! NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NE *umph!*
> (unfortuneatly he had to be carted away)
>
> -Head Member- Okay, thank you for your, umm, unique expresion of your
> feelings. Next?
>
> -Person Number 2- Umm, Hi, my name is ------ and I dupe. But i'm better
> than the rest, for I know how to dupe PLAYERS!! Yes, I have even duped
> myself! Now my copy is running around Britian looking for monsters to
> kill so I can dupe the gold. I guess I should stop, but I can't! I'm
> addicted to duping! Will someone please help me!? Someone? Anyone?!
>
> -Head Member- Don't worry, we are hear to help. Now please get off that
> table and sit down. Next?
>
> -Person Number 3- Heh heh heh... I dupe and iT RuLeZ DooodZ. YoU LamAZ
> CuNt UnDerStanD wHat DoopING DoeS FOr mE! AnD I'm ONly 2 yEarS olD
> DooDz!
ROFL!!! Ah! I'm being PKed by 2 year olds without messed up Caps Locks!
AUGH!
I just about died when I read this! :)
Karl, the Optimistic but Uninformed
Karl Schlipf
Chris wrote:
> I've been a bad boy, i need to be spanked!
> whahahhaaa
This is getting back into that whole "sex on Ultima Online" issue isn't it...
Karl, the Puritanical yet Wonky
> Crxbreed wrote:
> >
> > Sssssshhhhhhhhh!!!!! Don't tell him that! I love when abusers of the system
> > get their just dues! =) Way to go Origins! I knew you had it in ya!
> >
> > >> PS. if u duped items just give them all away preferable to friends who
> > >> will hold them
> > >
> > >This isn't a court of law. They are not particularly required
> > >to present evidence to convict you. If you do this, and do not
> > >turn yourself in, they may have already tried you in absentia,
> > >my friend.
> > >
Shiro
I would be extremely surprised if they had even one name, after how quickly they
banned other people from UO. Why would they stockpile the names? 273 isn't that big
in their customer base, so I'm almost positive it's just to catch people who have
duped and weren't caught.
Jster wrote:
>
> I wonder if OSI really has 273 names that are dupers? Or is that just
> to threaten those cheating bastards?
>
> On Wed, 14 Jan 1998 19:14:57 -0500, Monk <chri...@erols.com> wrote:
>
> >How chessy and lame.
> >
> >Is this another patchwork attempt to fix the game?
> >heh
> >
> >well damn i guess i gotta turn all my money in
> >and my 5 castles
> >on each shard
> >and my regent stockpile
> >and all my armor
> >or wait did i give all that stuff away already?
> >lol
> >lame patchwork
> >wonder what happens after the amnesty week is up :)
> >
John D. James
Courageous wrote:
> > I wonder if OSI really has 273 names that are dupers? Or is that just
> > to threaten those cheating bastards?
>
He he.
This is the funny part. All they had to do was add code to check the
character's location any time stackable itmes are added to their bank vault.
If the character is not near the bank when the loot is added......
If the duped stuff appears in the character's inventory, and the stuff that is
added is exactly the same amount as something already in there......
It's quite simple.
--
**** Omniversal Dragon -=={UDIC}==- in human form, John D. James
** **
** ** What a quaint little universe you have.
****
**
** mailto:jo...@premier1.net
******
** Spam, spam, spam, give me spam! It tastes soooo good!
** I'll take spam with a cream pie anyday!
George
Jster wrote in message <34bd9ca0....@news.earthlink.net>...
>I wonder if OSI really has 273 names that are dupers? Or is that just
>to threaten those cheating bastards?
>
I am sure they would not say if the did not. I am surprised they don't have
more than 273. Exploiting a bug like this is grounds on any MUD for banning
a character. And if that doesn't work and the offender keeps making new
chars. with a different name then they ban the site he calls in from.
Really neat, since then, anybody else who telnets from that site is also
banned. <only done in severe cases>
George
Monk wrote in message <34BD55...@erols.com>...
-snip-
>PS. if u duped items just give them all away preferable to friends who
>will hold them.
I do not know for sure, but I would imagine there is a way for OSI to
identify these items. They do not say that you will suffer only if you
duped the items. They say if you have duped items in your possesion. So,
if you suspect you have them then you are suppose to call a GM.
Sun Tzu 24
>Ah... but things could get sticky if OSI has to follow up on the
>threat of banning. Banning a few recalcitrant players for posting
>bugs on the net is one thing, banning *alleged* cheaters en masse
>is another. Even if the unilateral modified user agreement is
>in fact binding, OSI still has to prove that violation occured.
>Since all electronics data can be doctored so as not to leave any
>trace of tampering, I doubt that the so-called list of cheaters
>will be admissible in court.
>
>enforcing this type of agreement can be extremely sticky. If
>a couple of hundreds of players are banned for alleged cheating,
>without refunds of course, some legal action may ensue. It's
>probably not worth the legal fee, if just one or two are banned.
>But hundreds, with total billing + initial game costs of a couple
>of thousands of dollars may be good enough to compel someone to
>pick up the case. Heck, people are suing for less money than this.
>
>Later...
>--
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>K I R A T I L A I S A T H I T kir...@u.washington.edu
>
>
>
Hm...interesting but try to remeber this, UO is a copyrighted game. You are
playing on their "property" so to speak. Private property that they *allow*
the public to use for a small fee.. In the real world, if someone is on your
private property, you don't need a reason to kick them off so long as it is not
discrimination based on race, sex, religion, or sexual orientation. If in the
real world you break the rules of whomevers property you are on, they have
every legal right to ask you to leave. Failure to leave or returning to their
property is cause for legal action under most tresspassing laws.
In some cases you sign a contract with the people who own the property(ie.
renting something, joining a gym, ect), and violation of this contract is
enough to have you removed from the property. What people seem to fail to
understand is that just because you are paying for the use of something doesn't
mean you don't have to follow the rules you agreed upon when entering the
contract.
There would be nothing "sticky" about banning someone, whether not it can be
"proven" by technical records. A department store for examply has the right to
ban people from their store for shoplifting, *even if* it is only suspected
that the person did indeed steal something, so long as it is not based on the
aforementioned discriminations.
Jeremiah of MKB - sonoma
Ophidian Dragon
> >Ah... but things could get sticky if OSI has to follow up on the
> >threat of banning. Banning a few recalcitrant players for posting
> >bugs on the net is one thing, banning *alleged* cheaters en masse
> >is another. Even if the unilateral modified user agreement is
> >in fact binding, OSI still has to prove that violation occured.
> >Since all electronics data can be doctored so as not to leave any
> >trace of tampering, I doubt that the so-called list of cheaters
> >will be admissible in court.
No matter what, Origin has the right to ban anyone from their service for
any reason they see fit. It's in the user agreement.
-Ophidian Dragon
Ren Hoek
On Thu, 15 Jan 1998 00:37:53 GMT, Courageous <jkra...@san.rr.com>
wrote:
>> PS. if u duped items just give them all away preferable to friends who
>> will hold them
>
>This isn't a court of law. They are not particularly required
>to present evidence to convict you. If you do this, and do not
>turn yourself in, they may have already tried you in absentia,
>my friend.
>
>GM's have been popping in invisibly to banks and other areas
>to observe cheaters for quite some time now. If they saw you
>duping, and you don't turn yourself in, you are gonna be
>delivering us a goodbye message really soon.
>
>It won't matter if you don't have a single gold piece any more,
>my friend.
>
>
>
>Courageous.
and the best part for me is-----anyone I saw in a bank with
any/all/some of the "needed" ingredients for duping I called a GM on
immediately !
I recieved several messages on several occasions about them "watching"
so-and-so (after I reported my suspicions)
I know for a fact they have been "watching" for quite a while...and
YES even during their "holiday-vacation" !!!
hope they catch them all, and then post all of the character names
associated with every person....AND I think they should make all the
guilty parties wear a "tag" of some sort for at least a week, so we
ALL now they are the ones whom have/are trying to ruin our beloved UO!
Gary Figg
On Thu, 15 Jan 1998 15:48:44 -0500, Shiro <live...@together.net>
wrote:
>I would be extremely surprised if they had even one name, after how quickly they
>banned other people from UO. Why would they stockpile the names? 273 isn't that big
>in their customer base, so I'm almost positive it's just to catch people who have
>duped and weren't caught.
Duh. And when exactly did this bolt of lighting strike you? Of course
is a move to get those they haven't caught to turn themselves in. I do
believe they have some names, and 273 could be accurate. I'm sure it's
easy to spot bigtime dupers just from the endless stacks of goodies
they are hoarding. If your a big time duper, you have to be very
nervous about this. Like playing Russian roulette, it's all or nothing
baby. Feel lucky, punks?
g
Please remove one "i" from the email address to reply.
The Tick
Courageous <jkra...@san.rr.com> writes:
> As an AOL admin once said to me, "If you wouldn't here it in a Walt
> Disney movie, don't say it on AOL". :)
Does that include all their sub-companies as well? I was shocked to
learn what Disney puts out under other names...
--
mauftarkie http://www.nwnet.net/
@rocketmail.com ~brandon/tick/
M. Ashton Smith
>Ophidian Dragon <dev...@ix.takethisout.netcom.com> wrote in article
>> No matter what, Origin has the right to ban anyone from their service for
>> any reason they see fit. It's in the user agreement.
roger wrote in message <01bd22e4$066c7160$668185ce@rogermal>...
>No of that is neccessary if you bought the game and monthly service via a
>credit card. Just use the (Federal) Fair Lending Act. IF a consumer using
>a credit card receives bas quality service/product he dispute the charge.
>The buden of proff is then on the merchant to prove teh quailty was good.
>If you had you account canceled then the quailty is now worthless (all you
>have is a shiny CD.) Just call the credit card company and tell it why you
>got canceled (either posted a discription of an error in the program on a
>public forum or in the game play you cast a spell to give you more gold.)
>I hardly doubt a credit card company would take those as adequate excuses
>to cancel your account. Instead they would credit you back for all monthly
>fes and the cost of the game. The store would get debited for the game
>(and of course recoup costs from Origin) and Origin would get debited for
>monthly fees plus get a debit for the fee of teh credit card company to
>investigate the dispute.
Wow. I'm not sure what planet you're living on, but it must be a special
happy place where life is fair. If you dispute a charge on your credit
card, the granting bank will contact the company in question and ask them to
address the conflict. Very little "proof" of service is required, and
violation of an executed "terms of service" (a legally binding contract)
will suffice. OSI might agree to refund the charge for that month (they are
not obligated to, but why squeak over $10), but no way will the bank "credit
you for all monthly fes [sic] and the cost of the game". You received
service for ALL previous months. The cost of the CD is in the same league
as a "set up fee" at an ISP.
As to violating the terms of service, reporting a bug in a public forum was
not (at the time) a breach (it is now). Exploiting bugs has always been a
no-no, per the agreement you executed with OSI. You (we) are now a party to
a contract that VERY bad (for us), but in a captive market, you have little
choice. Personally, in real life, I would NEVER sign a contract with the
statement "we reserve the right to make shit up and hold you to it". But I
did here, since the absolute worst liability I have is that OSI can cancel
my account and deny me access to their service. Now, if they added "if you
break a rule, we get to come over to your house and set your cat on fire", I
would quickly and quietly cancel the contract (my account).
Ash Smith
San Antonio, Texas
John D. James
George wrote:
> Monk wrote in message <34BD55...@erols.com>...
> -snip-
>
> >PS. if u duped items just give them all away preferable to friends who
> >will hold them.
>
> I do not know for sure, but I would imagine there is a way for OSI to
> identify these items. They do not say that you will suffer only if you
> duped the items. They say if you have duped items in your possesion. So,
> if you suspect you have them then you are suppose to call a GM.
Geeez, guys. you people must have had a hard time in school with reading
and comprehension!
A quote from the Update page:
> 4:45pm
>
> A slight clarification to the amnesty message:
>
> If you have not duplicated items, then you do not have any reason to worry. If you have
> not accepted obviously duplicated items, then again you need not worry. (I.E. if someone
> gives you a million gold pieces or thousands of reagents, then there is a reason to be
> concerned. If someone gave you a helmet, then rest easy.)
>
> We are only concerned with the players, who have adversely affected game balance with
> the amount of duplicated items they possess.
>
Note the statement "If you have not duplicated items, then you do not have any reason to worry."
I suspect the slow-down and server lag lately has been caused by code they stuck-in to
detect duping. It seems as if the lag got much worse a week or so after what's-his-name got his
account cancel for posting the mechanics of "one" way to dupe.
roger
No of that is neccessary if you bought the game and monthly service via a
credit card. Just use the (Federal) Fair Lending Act. IF a consumer using
a credit card receives bas quality service/product he dispute the charge.
The buden of proff is then on the merchant to prove teh quailty was good.
If you had you account canceled then the quailty is now worthless (all you
have is a shiny CD.) Just call the credit card company and tell it why you
got canceled (either posted a discription of an error in the program on a
public forum or in the game play you cast a spell to give you more gold.)
I hardly doubt a credit card company would take those as adequate excuses
to cancel your account. Instead they would credit you back for all monthly
fes and the cost of the game. The store would get debited for the game
(and of course recoup costs from Origin) and Origin would get debited for
monthly fees plus get a debit for the fee of teh credit card company to
investigate the dispute.
Ophidian Dragon <dev...@ix.takethisout.netcom.com> wrote in article
<01bd2235$63049e20$0abddfcf@widdershins>...
>
>
> > >Ah... but things could get sticky if OSI has to follow up on the
> > >threat of banning. Banning a few recalcitrant players for posting
> > >bugs on the net is one thing, banning *alleged* cheaters en masse
> > >is another. Even if the unilateral modified user agreement is
> > >in fact binding, OSI still has to prove that violation occured.
> > >Since all electronics data can be doctored so as not to leave any
> > >trace of tampering, I doubt that the so-called list of cheaters
> > >will be admissible in court.
>
> No matter what, Origin has the right to ban anyone from their service for
> any reason they see fit. It's in the user agreement.
>
> -Ophidian Dragon
>
Silent Bob
>Wow. I'm not sure what planet you're living on, but it must be a special
>happy place where life is fair. If you dispute a charge on your credit
>card, the granting bank will contact the company in question and ask them to
>address the conflict. Very little "proof" of service is required, and
>violation of an executed "terms of service" (a legally binding contract)
>will suffice. OSI might agree to refund the charge for that month (they are
>not obligated to, but why squeak over $10), but no way will the bank "credit
>you for all monthly fes [sic] and the cost of the game". You received
>service for ALL previous months. The cost of the CD is in the same league
>as a "set up fee" at an ISP.
Actually, many credit cards feature a purchase protection program,
where YOUR dissatisfaction is all you need to reverse the charges on
the purchased item. Under those circumstances, all the "contract"
nonsense would not apply because you are disputing the price of the
product, (The UO Boxed package and the service with it). However,
most of those programs have a $250 minimum purchase value.
Jennifer Keenan
I have a theory about the 273 number. Let me outline it for you all, because
I know you care deeply.
1. Having an actual number to use in announcements lends an air of truth to
what they are saying. Frankly, I believe they DO have 273 names.
2. BUT, the 273 names they have are the only *documented* cases of duping.
Like a GM actually SAW a player cheating in this way, or it was reported by
another player, something like that.
3. They are using the 273 number to hopefully strike terror (or at lease
unease) into the hearts of the dupers. OSI is hoping that dupers they
*don't* know about will think they are one of the 273 and turn themselves
in.
4. There have *got* to be more than 273 dupers out there. If there are
thousands of people playing this game and only 273 of them are cheating in
this way, would it really affect the game world's economy all that much?
There are more of them than 273. (See point 3 above. <g>)
Well, there's my 273 cents.
Jennifer Keenan
Seattle, Washington
jennife...@sierra.com
http://www.geocities.com/~jenkeen
-------------------------------------------------------------
I do not want people to be very agreeable,
as it saves me the trouble of liking them a great deal. - J. Austen
George wrote in message <69npcp$l24$9...@nnrp1.snfc21.pbi.net>...
Shiro
I personally think that they just made the number up, to make it have an 'air of
truth' as you put it. I think that they just don't have enough dupers' names
so they're trying to manipulate them into confessing..otherwise, if they had the
names, they would've banned 'em as soon as they found out.
--
Lemur Dragon
www.udic.com
Let's play 'Save Those Lemurs!'
Doug Blatherwick
LOL, I see you guys aren't programmers! Its very simple to find who
has duplicated items. There is a database that stores all the items in
the game. (there is a reason why the sever has Gigabytes of Hard disk
space) Each item has a unique key number, when an item is duped the key
number is duped as well. All they have to do to find people who have
been duping is to do a database search for all the duplicate keys.
If you're going to now tell me that that would take to long to
program, trust me, if thier database is set up right it might take a
maximum of 5 min to write the program an maybe a min to do the check.
That is why they told people to be wary of what they buy while they
had the amnesty for dupers.
Simon F. Lacey
Doug Blatherwick (bla...@sprint.ca) wrote:
: LOL, I see you guys aren't programmers! Its very simple to find who
: has duplicated items. There is a database that stores all the items in
: the game. (there is a reason why the sever has Gigabytes of Hard disk
: space) Each item has a unique key number, when an item is duped the key
: number is duped as well. All they have to do to find people who have
: been duping is to do a database search for all the duplicate keys.
I see that you haven't been paying attention, old man.
As I gather, part of the duping process as posted in this group prior to the
amnesty involves moving the newly duped gold from one pile to another and
merging it with one (unduped) gold coin so as to create a brand new pile
which is seen by the game as a new object and has a new key number.
This new pile is indetectable after the fact as duped gold.
The only way they have/had of detecting duped gold was by finding overly large
amounts of it, or by detecting the act in progress.
Anyone dumb enough to duplicate plate or other non-mergeable objects
would indeed be detectable by a key search but I suggest that they were
in the minority of dupers.
I suggest you think about things a little more before you assume that other
people aren't programmers.
Unctious
> LOL, I see you guys aren't programmers! Its very simple to find who
>has duplicated items. There is a database that stores all the items in
>the game. (there is a reason why the sever has Gigabytes of Hard disk
>space) Each item has a unique key number, when an item is duped the key
>number is duped as well. All they have to do to find people who have
>been duping is to do a database search for all the duplicate keys.
If I'm not mistaken this is why it works. The servers, when faced with
duplicate numbers reconciles them by creating new IDs (optimistic). The
alternate (pessimistic) choice is ALWAYS lose items with identical IDs (and
you can't make that not happen given real world network troubles). Reconcile
all item IDs constantly? Sure, if Origin ponies up for Deep Blues(and paying
$200/ month server time) to replace the current servers otherwise quadruple
the daily downtime. Are you ready for these alternatives? I'm not, I'd
rather just not dupe and hope they find a sexy answer.
There's programming and then there is programming, sometimes it's not so
simple.
Unctuous
Jubilation Knoblock
This is exactly why the process works. In fact, if it were not possible
to create a "pile" with a new id number, duplication wouldn't even work.
Feral Knight
In article <34CD6643...@sprint.ca>, bla...@sprint.ca says...
>
> LOL, I see you guys aren't programmers! Its very simple to find who
>has duplicated items. There is a database that stores all the items in
That assumes the UO programmers are capable of progging such a utility. :)
*blush* What a terrible thing to say! They are doing the best they can.