Dislikes in Memento Mori
Djinni
There will be a followup to Memento Mori and it would be nice to know
what you all disliked about MM. It wouldn't be nice to do the same
mistakes again, if it could be helped. Of course, we won't garantie
anything.
We will be working on the themes though. And I will keep unmarked
secrets to a minimum ;)
Regards,
Jens.
/* ----------------------------------------------
Co-author of Memento Mori for Doom II. The 32 map
replacement for the critical Doom players!
Other pwads done for Doom II:
Corridors of Hell, single-death (cor_hel4.zip)
Walkabout, single,cooperative (wlkabot2.zip)
Check out my homepage for Hexen editing stuff:
http://www.geocities.com/hollywood/2298
---------------------------------------------- */
Doug Bora
: what you all disliked about MM. It wouldn't be nice to do the same
: mistakes again, if it could be helped. Of course, we won't garantie
: anything.
Only things I can say bad about it, are no levels with the stupid voodoo
dolls. They're a neat effect and everything, but have no place in a
serious level. And also some of the levels at around 23 or so seemed to
lack finesse, but simply tried to overwhelm the players with monsters.
I'd probably try to avoid that.
Other than that, a great set of levels!
--
Doug Bora
stig...@wwa.com
Adam Williamson
writes
>Only things I can say bad about it, are no levels with the stupid voodoo
>dolls. They're a neat effect and everything, but have no place in a
>serious level. And also some of the levels at around 23 or so seemed to
<yelling> TiC! Go slap whoever did that level's wrist! :)
--
Adam Williamson, D1M - ad...@scss.demon.co.uk
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/The_Williamsons/
"Muahahahahahahahahaha!" - Friday
Simon H. Garlick
Bora) write unto us:
>: There will be a followup to Memento Mori and it would be nice to know
>: what you all disliked about MM. It wouldn't be nice to do the same
>: mistakes again, if it could be helped. Of course, we won't garantie
>: anything.
>
>Only things I can say bad about it, are no levels with the stupid voodoo
>dolls. They're a neat effect and everything, but have no place in a
>serious level. And also some of the levels at around 23 or so seemed to
>lack finesse, but simply tried to overwhelm the players with monsters.
>I'd probably try to avoid that.
>
>Other than that, a great set of levels!
>
>--
>Doug Bora
>stig...@wwa.com
I'm with Doug on this - although that voodoo doll that gave you a SSG
out of nowhere on "The Inmost Dens II" was a nice idea. My main
criticism was that the levels were a _bit_ too oriented towards co-op
play. Some of the puzzles stopped being tricky and became a simple
pain in the ass in single-play mode.
Congratulations on MM - can't wait for MM II!
__________________________________________________________________________
|
Simon H. Garlick - s...@waikato.ac.nz | I may not be in the USA,
+64 7 834 2048 (vox) +64 7 834 3102 (fax/data) | but that doesn't mean I
3 Dillicar Street, Hamilton, NEW ZEALAND | don't DETEST the C.D.A.
________________________________________________|_________________________
"I do not find in orthodox Christianity one redeeming feature."
- Thomas Jefferson
__________________________________________________________________________
S. Widlake
per...@po.ia.dk (Djinni) writes:
>Hi all,
>There will be a followup to Memento Mori and it would be nice to know
>what you all disliked about MM. It wouldn't be nice to do the same
>mistakes again, if it could be helped. Of course, we won't garantie
>anything.
One thing that got us in Memento Mori was one of it's main features
- co-op mode...
I took it home and played about half way through... my fragbait (tm)
saw it and said "That looks way cool, can I play?". "Sure I'll give
you a damn good fragging!", I replied. He wasn't interested. "OKay,
I'll take you through it" ... "Huh, what's that pillar doing there.
Oi, press that button. Go to the <whatever>..." You get the idea.
BOTH players need to know their way through and learning the levels
all by yourself doesn't help much.
Anyway, fragbait got killed so often and wasn't too useful - level
04 was too much for him and that was that - back to single player.
>We will be working on the themes though. And I will keep unmarked
>secrets to a minimum ;)
And that too.
>Regards,
>Jens.
Thanx for asking. Now when is the #1 dude going to get back to me ?
S.;-)
- --
.sig II Found and Restored ...
rdr...@epix.net
> Hi all,
>
> There will be a followup to Memento Mori and it would be nice to know
> what you all disliked about MM. It wouldn't be nice to do the same
> mistakes again, if it could be helped. Of course, we won't garantie
> anything.
--- snip ---
Have all new music for each level. Don't repeat them. If your going to
have a separate .wad for the music, then make it worth it.
Also, that's great if you design it with "co-op in mind" (even if it does
suck), but at least have one deathmatch capable level. Other than that,
I can't wait for MM2.
Dave Kramer
MacDoom Review.
I really did *not* like Level 16 -- I had a really hard time getting
through some of the puzzles. I finally just idclip'd my way through,
after a point.
A few of the other levels were like this -- after a point, I just
stopped caring about solving the level.
Level 8 freezes Doom II on my Macintosh, right at the start of the
level. That's not cool.
I'm still working through some of the later levels...
Best,
Dave Kramer
editor, MacDoom Review
http://www.voicenet.com/~reeltime/mdr.html
<<MDR#5 is out -- check out the MacDEU and MIDI music tutorials!!>>
Stephen Oliver
>
>Hi all,
>
>There will be a followup to Memento Mori and it would be nice to know
>what you all disliked about MM. It wouldn't be nice to do the same
>mistakes again, if it could be helped. Of course, we won't garantie
>anything.
>
>secrets to a minimum ;)
>
Very nice WAD!!! I'm presently working my way through on UV and am
starting level 21. Please avoid those switches that open doors that
you have to run, around corners of course, to get through before they
close. For single playing, it's annoying and lame. Otherwise, except
for the occasional level crash, I think it's great.
MIL
net writes:>From: rdr...@epix.net
>Subject: Re: Dislikes in Memento Mori
>Date: Mon, 12 Feb 96 21:09:49 PDT
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> There will be a followup to Memento Mori and it would be nice to know
>> what you all disliked about MM. It wouldn't be nice to do the same
>> mistakes again, if it could be helped. Of course, we won't garantie
>> anything.
>
>
>Have all new music for each level. Don't repeat them. If your going to
>have a separate .wad for the music, then make it worth it.
>Also, that's great if you design it with "co-op in mind" (even if it does
>suck), but at least have one deathmatch capable level. Other than that,
>I can't wait for MM2.
>
Hi there. Well, only one Deathmatch level...
Why not create a Doom2 replacement of 32 levels like Memento Mori, and make
them all Deathmatch-able?? Different level styles, levels suitable for two,
three and/or four players, different 'settings' (like arenas, sniper alleys
and that sort of stuff, so that each player has a few levels to his
liking)?? How about that??
A suitable name might be 'Morituri Te Salutant'. (Which means, in case you
can't read latin 'Those who are about to die, greet you'.)
Any ideas/support for this one??? Post them here!
- Maurice van Mil.
(BTW: I didn't intend on creating this, I'm just suggesting something.)
lost
wrote:
>In article <MIL.34.8...@stpc.wi.LeidenUniv.nl>,
> M...@stpc.wi.LeidenUniv.nl (MIL) wrote:
>
>[Big-Snip]
>
>>Any ideas/support for this one??? Post them here!
>
>Well, TeamTNT is at it again, and we're just getting ready to make a big
>release. Here's the unofficial announcement that the WAD is coming.
>TNT2:Icarus is Right around the corner and all of its levels will be primed
>for DM play!!! Our focus here was to make GREAT DM levels while still
>maintaining excellent solo play. Well, the minds behind TeamTNT have done
>just that and expect TNT2:Icarus SOON!!!!
>
>Check out the Webpage below for more info-
>
> -MiKE-
> -TeamTNT-Member-
> -www.neosoft.com/~teamtnt-
gee the same TNT that strung us along waiting for the last
release? How much is this wad going to cost?
Mike Marcotte
[Big-Snip]
>Why not create a Doom2 replacement of 32 levels like Memento Mori, and make
>them all Deathmatch-able?? Different level styles, levels suitable for two,
>three and/or four players, different 'settings' (like arenas, sniper alleys
>and that sort of stuff, so that each player has a few levels to his
>liking)?? How about that??
>
>A suitable name might be 'Morituri Te Salutant'. (Which means, in case you
>can't read latin 'Those who are about to die, greet you'.)
>
Adam Williamson
<M...@stpc.wi.LeidenUniv.nl> writes
>Why not create a Doom2 replacement of 32 levels like Memento Mori, and make
>them all Deathmatch-able?? Different level styles, levels suitable for two,
>three and/or four players, different 'settings' (like arenas, sniper alleys
>and that sort of stuff, so that each player has a few levels to his
>liking)?? How about that??
>
>A suitable name might be 'Morituri Te Salutant'. (Which means, in case you
>can't read latin 'Those who are about to die, greet you'.)
>
>Any ideas/support for this one??? Post them here!
>
of each MM2 level to be good for deathmatch, and as long as the players
don't go out of this area you would basically have what you want.
--
Adam Williamson, D1M - ad...@scss.demon.co.uk
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/The_Williamsons/
Adam Williamson
<mm...@cornell.edu> writes
>Well, TeamTNT is at it again, and we're just getting ready to make a big
>release. Here's the unofficial announcement that the WAD is coming.
>TNT2:Icarus is Right around the corner and all of its levels will be primed
>for DM play!!! Our focus here was to make GREAT DM levels while still
>maintaining excellent solo play. Well, the minds behind TeamTNT have done
>just that and expect TNT2:Icarus SOON!!!!
>
>Check out the Webpage below for more info-
>
b) Is it free?
Mike Marcotte
>On Wed, 21 Feb 96 04:55:02 GMT, mm...@cornell.edu (Mike Marcotte)
>wrote:
>
>> M...@stpc.wi.LeidenUniv.nl (MIL) wrote:
>>
>>[Big-Snip]
>>
>>
>>release. Here's the unofficial announcement that the WAD is coming.
>>TNT2:Icarus is Right around the corner and all of its levels will be primed
>>for DM play!!! Our focus here was to make GREAT DM levels while still
>>maintaining excellent solo play. Well, the minds behind TeamTNT have done
>>just that and expect TNT2:Icarus SOON!!!!
>
>release? How much is this wad going to cost?
Alright, look. I'm not going to flame you because I am representing a team,
and my views do not necassarily match those of other individual's on that
team.
First off did we expect that id would walk up to us at the last minute and
purchase our product? No.
Would we have "strung [you] along waiting for the last release" if we knew
that id software would purchase out prodoct. No.
Would you do the same thing if someone walked up to you and said, "Here let me
buy that from you. You've worked your butt off to make this good, and we, the
makers of the game, would like to reward you for your toils and buy your
product from you."? YES YOU WOULD!
Now, I would like to apologize for anything that we could have done to upset
you. Frankly, I really do wish that we did release levels to the public and
you guys would be playing them still. I've seen TNT and I've seen MM. Even
though I like the initials of MM (a lot 'cause they're mine) TNT:E blows MM
out of the water. TNT:Icarus will be free and it will be at ftp.cdrom.com
soon. And yes, you will love it - DM'er, Co-op'er, or Solo'er!
-MiKE-
-TeamTNT-Member-
-www.neosoft.com/~teamtnt-
Steven Towle
>Well, I hope TiC don't mind me mentioning this, but the plan is for part
>of each MM2 level to be good for deathmatch, and as long as the players
>don't go out of this area you would basically have what you want.
Actually, the plan was to have a completely seperate part of the
level, that the only way to get in was via DM spanwing. BTW, that
would be the only area that would have DM spawnspots. This was more to
be able to tune the Net flag for things toward co-op, and not DM.
The way you interpet it, I had never thought of doing it that way. Oh
well, give me a while to think about it. :)
-Steve
| Steve Towle, D1M, D1SG, D2SG |
| ste...@ix.netcom.com (Dipstick on iFrag) |
| Steve's Gaming HQ: http://www.geopages.com/TimesSquare/3206 |
| Interactive sigs: "Insert quote here" |
lost
wrote:
>In article <3129cf5f...@192.156.196.2>, lo...@everthing.com (lost) wrote:
>>On Wed, 21 Feb 96 04:55:02 GMT, mm...@cornell.edu (Mike Marcotte)
>>wrote:
>> gee the same TNT that strung us along waiting for the last
>>release? How much is this wad going to cost?
>
>Alright, look. I'm not going to flame you because I am representing a team,
>and my views do not necassarily match those of other individual's on that
>team.
>
>First off did we expect that id would walk up to us at the last minute and
>purchase our product? No.
>
>Would we have "strung [you] along waiting for the last release" if we knew
>that id software would purchase out prodoct. No.
>
>Would you do the same thing if someone walked up to you and said, "Here let me
>buy that from you. You've worked your butt off to make this good, and we, the
>makers of the game, would like to reward you for your toils and buy your
>product from you."? YES YOU WOULD!
>
>Now, I would like to apologize for anything that we could have done to upset
>you. Frankly, I really do wish that we did release levels to the public and
>you guys would be playing them still. I've seen TNT and I've seen MM. Even
>though I like the initials of MM (a lot 'cause they're mine) TNT:E blows MM
>out of the water. TNT:Icarus will be free and it will be at ftp.cdrom.com
>soon. And yes, you will love it - DM'er, Co-op'er, or Solo'er!
>
> -MiKE-
> -TeamTNT-Member-
> -www.neosoft.com/~teamtnt-
OK you're right I was out of line by that post but I'm
sure I'm not the only one who feels this way. After all some of us
checked the TNT page a few times week and were quite dissapointed that
is was not going to be availible to all of us (some of us dont have
money for another DOOM add on)
As for would I sell something I said I would give way for free?
Thats a toss-up, I've put my ideals before money on more than one
ocassion.
It was'nt ment to be a personal attack, just a sentiment
ZlatkO ThE GoDFatheR
> In article <MIL.34.8...@stpc.wi.LeidenUniv.nl>,
> M...@stpc.wi.LeidenUniv.nl (MIL) wrote:
> [Big-Snip]
[ ... yeah, snip, me too! ... ]
> Well, TeamTNT is at it again, and we're just getting ready to make a big
> release. Here's the unofficial announcement that the WAD is coming.
> TNT2:Icarus is Right around the corner and all of its levels will be primed
> for DM play!!! Our focus here was to make GREAT DM levels while still
> maintaining excellent solo play. Well, the minds behind TeamTNT have done
> just that and expect TNT2:Icarus SOON!!!!
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
The same minds that came up with the brilliant idea to *sell* TNT:Evilution
rather than releasing it as freeware?
> Check out the Webpage below for more info-
> -MiKE-
> -TeamTNT-Member-
> -www.neosoft.com/~teamtnt-
Thomas
=---------------------------------=---------------------------------=
- ZlatkO ThE GoDFatheR - "trust and you'll be trusted" -
- aka Thomas Zajic - said the liar to the fool -
- Vienna/Austria - type 'o' negative -
= ------------------------------- = ------------------------------- =
- <thomas...@non-hp-austria-om1.om.hp.com> -
=-------------------------------------------------------------------=
Mike Marcotte
> OK you're right I was out of line by that post but I'm
>sure I'm not the only one who feels this way.
I know you're not. As I said, I kind of wish that we had released the thing
as freeware in the first place. I know that I would feel similarly if I was
in your position. But, look at it - it was an EXCELLENT opportunity for us,
and we couldn't pass it up. Selfish? Yes (sorry). As I said, I really kind
of wish now that we had released it.
> After all some of us
>checked the TNT page a few times week and were quite dissapointed that
>is was not going to be availible to all of us (some of us dont have
>money for another DOOM add on)
There will probably be plenty of warez sites that it'll have it once it
*finally* does come out. (COME ON id!) Not that I support warez in any way.
> As for would I sell something I said I would give way for free?
>Thats a toss-up, I've put my ideals before money on more than one
>ocassion.
> It was'nt ment to be a personal attack, just a sentiment
That sentiment is taken, and taken seriously. It's good to know how the
gamers feel. That's why we garuntee that TNT2:Icarus *will* be freeware. It
will also better support DM than TNT:E did (while still preserving large and
superb solo). You won't feel let down once this one comes out.
-MiKE-
-TeamTNT-Member-
-www.neosoft.com/~teamtnt-
-MiKE-
-TeamTNT-Member-
-www.neosoft.com/~teamtnt-
Mike Marcotte
ste...@ix.netcom.com (Steven Towle) wrote:
>Adam Williamson <Ad...@scss.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>Well, I hope TiC don't mind me mentioning this, but the plan is for part
>>of each MM2 level to be good for deathmatch, and as long as the players
>>don't go out of this area you would basically have what you want.
>
>Actually, the plan was to have a completely seperate part of the
>level, that the only way to get in was via DM spanwing. BTW, that
>would be the only area that would have DM spawnspots. This was more to
>be able to tune the Net flag for things toward co-op, and not DM.
>
>The way you interpet it, I had never thought of doing it that way. Oh
>well, give me a while to think about it. :)
This is a similar plan that TeamTNT has utilized and perfected. TNT2:Icarus
will not infringe on solo play, but will offer stellar DM play. Tune in for
more info later.
-MiKE-
-TeamTNT-Member-
-www.neosoft.com/~teamtnt-
ZlatkO ThE GoDFatheR
ZlatkO ThE GoDFatheR
[ I'm replying to this because Mike CC'ed his answer to me as well ]
On Wed, 21 Feb 96 22:52:23 GMT, Mike Marcotte wrote:
> In article <3129cf5f...@192.156.196.2>, lo...@everthing.com (lost) wrote:
> >On Wed, 21 Feb 96 04:55:02 GMT, mm...@cornell.edu (Mike Marcotte)
> >wrote:
> >
> >>In article <MIL.34.8...@stpc.wi.LeidenUniv.nl>,
> >> M...@stpc.wi.LeidenUniv.nl (MIL) wrote:
> >>
> >>[Big-Snip]
> >>
> >>>Any ideas/support for this one??? Post them here!
> >>
> >>Well, TeamTNT is at it again, and we're just getting ready to make a big
> >>release. Here's the unofficial announcement that the WAD is coming.
> >>TNT2:Icarus is Right around the corner and all of its levels will be primed
> >>for DM play!!! Our focus here was to make GREAT DM levels while still
> >>maintaining excellent solo play. Well, the minds behind TeamTNT have done
> >>just that and expect TNT2:Icarus SOON!!!!
> >
> > gee the same TNT that strung us along waiting for the last
> >release? How much is this wad going to cost?
> Alright, look. I'm not going to flame you because I am representing a team,
> and my views do not necassarily match those of other individual's on that
> team.
So you would have flamed me if you as a private person? For what valid
reason exactly?
> First off did we expect that id would walk up to us at the last minute and
> purchase our product? No.
> Would we have "strung [you] along waiting for the last release" if we knew
> that id software would purchase out prodoct. No.
> Would you do the same thing if someone walked up to you and said, "Here let me
> buy that from you. You've worked your butt off to make this good, and we, the
> makers of the game, would like to reward you for your toils and buy your
> product from you."? YES YOU WOULD!
You could be right here.
> Now, I would like to apologize for anything that we could have done to upset
> you. Frankly, I really do wish that we did release levels to the public and
> you guys would be playing them still.
I *do* appreciate the apology, though it doesn't change anything
unfortunately. You (read: TeamTNT) could at least have released a part of
it for free, and if it had been good enough, not that many people would
have had objections to buy the "full version".
Moreover, I happen to live in Austria. Do you really think TNT:E will ever
show up over here? Say "yes" and you're bloody well wrong.
> I've seen TNT and I've seen MM. Even
> though I like the initials of MM (a lot 'cause they're mine) TNT:E blows MM
> out of the water.
Dunno, can't judge, see above. However, at least I *do have* MM, which is a
clear advantage over TNT:E.
> TNT:Icarus will be free and it will be at ftp.cdrom.com
> soon. And yes, you will love it - DM'er, Co-op'er, or Solo'er!
I'll believe this as soon as it shows up in /pub/doom/newstuff.
Bye,
Thomas
PS: I don't really care that much. When I was posting my original
reply, I was just in the right mood for a cynical comment. ;-)
Alden Bates
Adam Williamson (Ad...@scss.demon.co.uk) writes:
><M...@stpc.wi.LeidenUniv.nl> writes
>>Why not create a Doom2 replacement of 32 levels like Memento Mori, and make
>>them all Deathmatch-able??
>Well, I hope TiC don't mind me mentioning this, but the plan is for part
>of each MM2 level to be good for deathmatch, and as long as the players
>don't go out of this area you would basically have what you want.
Erm, why should they mind? It's all advertising. :-)
The level I'm doing had a completely seperate DM section. IE, the
two sections aren't interconnected.
What do people think of co-operative exits? Only having played a
few DMs against my frag-bait brother, I find it immensely annoying
when he dives for the exit every level.
Of course, it's also difficult to get him to co-operate in the
co-op exit sometimes, ie, trying to explain what he has to do. :-)
Alden Bates.
--
/~~~|_|~~~\ The other day in my lunch break I re-wrote DOOM 10 times better.
/ _ _ _ < Then I woke up.
/_/ |_| |___.'
Alden Bates: al...@bates.wn.planet.gen.nz
Stephen Heaslip
You know, these TNT still get grief about this, but I haven't heard one author
say that they would turn id down if id wanted to sell their wad.
I personally would have jumped at it.
Maybe it's time to call off the attack dogs on this one.
--
blue
Magnanimously forgives team TNT ;)