Hand One from Last Night
Will in New Haven
LHO opens 2S (weak) and it is passed to you, you have:
VOID - AKQJTXX - AX - QXXX
What is your call?
There are some other issues on this hand, so scroll down when you have
answered the first question.
You have:
QTXXX - X - JXX - AKJX and RHO opens 2S, you pass, LHE passes and
partner bids 4S. It is passed to you. I presume you pass. What would
you have done if partner had bid 3H? What would you have done if he
had doubled?
Absent the 2S bid, would you and your regular partner have reached 7C,
6H or other?
Finally,
The 2S bid was made on AXXXXX - XX - XXX- XX
We had a kibbitzer (she was sitting out and had played the hand
before) and she was indignant that this "illegal" 2S bid had been
made. She had passed in first seat and she said that she had to
because 2S is illegal. _Her_ opponents had reached 6H.
We only reached 4H. The kibbitzer did not actually _mention_ calling
the director but she used the word illegal several times. We didn't
call the director. I don't even _know_ if there are grounds for
calling the bid illegal.
--
Will in New Haven
Adam Beneschan
wrote:
> No one is vulnerable at matchpoints.
>
> LHO opens 2S (weak) and it is passed to you, you have:
>
> VOID - AKQJTXX - AX - QXXX
>
> What is your call?
>
> There are some other issues on this hand, so scroll down when you have
> answered the first question.
>
> You have:
>
> QTXXX - X - JXX - AKJX and RHO opens 2S, you pass, LHE passes and
> partner bids 4S. It is passed to you. I presume you pass.
Yep, if partner is going to make a strange jump cue in the opponents'
six-card suit, he deserves to play there. And I'm giving him 5-card
support!! What more could he want?
I presume you made a typo... what did you mean to say? And what's
LHE stand for: "left-hand elephant"? Sorry, I'm not familiar with the
term. Anyway, if partner's bid was really 4H (as I would have done on
the above hand), then yes, I pass---I have nowhere to go. No, I don't
know how to bid these hands to 7C after the weak two.
> What would
> you have done if partner had bid 3H? What would you have done if he
> had doubled?
(a) Probably 3NT, but not really liking it, and (b) pass.
> Absent the 2S bid, would you and your regular partner have reached 7C,
> 6H or other?
Reaching slam with a normal system looks pretty tough to me. Either
opener has to know that his partner's club support is this good, or
responder has to know that opener's hearts are long and solid *and*
that opener has a club suit---otherwise slam isn't going to look good
from either side. Of course, you could always just blast and get
lucky.
> Finally,
>
> The 2S bid was made on AXXXXX - XX - XXX- XX
>
> We had a kibbitzer (she was sitting out and had played the hand
> before) and she was indignant that this "illegal" 2S bid had been
> made. She had passed in first seat and she said that she had to
> because 2S is illegal. _Her_ opponents had reached 6H.
>
> We only reached 4H. The kibbitzer did not actually _mention_ calling
> the director but she used the word illegal several times. We didn't
> call the director. I don't even _know_ if there are grounds for
> calling the bid illegal.
The bid itself cannot be illegal. In the ACBL, you may not agree to
use conventions over a weak 2 that can have a range of more than 7
HCP, which I think to them means 7 possible HCP counts. So if your
agreement is that a weak 2 can be 4-10 HCP, you're fine, but if it's
4-11 by agreement, you can't use conventions. There was at one time a
rule that the weak 2 could not be fewer than 5 HCP by agreement (for
you to use conventions over it), but that part of the rule was dropped
in 1996. Maybe your kibitzer hadn't yet gotten the memo.
In any case, no matter what the GCC says, you're still allowed to
violate your agreements, although someone who says their weak 2
agreement is 5-11 but regularly opens hands like that is probably
breaking the rules about secret agreements.
-- Adam
patri...@gmail.com
> partner bids 4S. It is passed to you. I presume you pass. What would
> you have done if partner had bid 3H? What would you have done if he
> had doubled?
Do you mean "partner bids 4H"? I think that's what you mean.
If partner bids 3H I might apply Hamman's Law and bid 3NT. But 3H is
not a sane bid with a solid seven-card heart suit and an outside ace.
If the 2S bid doesn't happen, I'm sure everyone on rgb would reach 7C,
although my partner and I would probably end up in 6H. (After
1S-3H-3NT, is 4C Gerber or natural?)
If playing 2/1 with weak jump shifts, a plausible uncontested auction
might be 1S-2H; 2NT-3C; 4C-5NT (GSF); 7C. Of course, it would suck to
end up in 6C when partner's hand is AQxxx x KJx Kxxx; but maybe
partner should rebid 3NT instead of 4C with that hand? I dunno.
I don't see why 2S is illegal. If 2S gets passed around to me and I
have the heart moose, I'm not particularly interested in defending
2Sx, so I don't think I'll double. I might bid 3S and then 4H after
the 3NT reply, but now it's going to be roughly impossible to find the
club grand. Plus partner might pass my 4H bid with the hand she
actually has. But that plan has got to be better than bidding 4H right
away. Preempts are hard.
Andre Asbury
like doubling with it because I know I want to play hearts and don't
want to defend 2SX, even when partner has 5 spades. 4H is a very
accurate bid for this hand.
2S is definitely not illegal at all. It is a bit light for some
people's idea of a weak two bid but well within the accepted range for
a weak2. The range for a weak 2 can be up to 7hcp for you to use any
conventions over it. It's for a NT opening that the range can be no
greater than 5hcp and show at least 10hcp for you to use conventions
over that. both rules, I believe, are still in effect in the ACBL.
I usually put 4-10 for my weak 2 range but I open almost all 11 point
hands.
After a weak two, it's very difficult to get to a slam but I think I
would get to 6H in an uncontested auction after I open 1S with the 2nd
hand you gave.
castigamatti
wrote:
2S is very smart and it is not a bad bid at all. A direct 6H in pass
out seat makes sense. I acknowledge however that it is a very risky
move, nevertheless with a void in their preempt and moreover in pass
out seat and with the given monster hand it is cowardly not to try, in
competition reaching 7 is often an illusion and 6 can sometimes be
made mostly on shape and controls.
I fully understand the pass of 4H, somebody is holding a singleton,
possibly a void, and the opponent did not raise his partner.
Nevertheless it is very likely partner is holding that singleton or
void when we are taking in consideration his 4H overcall, mostly being
made with a solid suit and strong shapely hand. Besides, raising to 3S
is not very wise when holding two spades only and is not something of
unexpected when it does not occur. Nevertheless the only problem is
that this is a 4H in pass out seat so possibly shaded. Dbl is risky
since partner can eventually pass. I would have probably bid a 6H in
pass out seat with that hand to tell you the truth. Reaching 7C is an
illusion.
B.R.
Will in New Haven
6H right away _was_ tempting. I almost did it. I can put enough total
strength in partner's hand to make it possible but
My RHO has not limited his hand at all. He knows his partner opened a
Weak Two and could have almost all of the remaining high cards and
still not have a bid.
Even if partner has a fair share of the high cards, his strength has
to be in the right places. KQXX in Diamonds and AXXX in Clubs leavs me
with a problem in Clubs, although the slam has a decent chance.
Partner could have AK of Spades (my LHO is not known for his KXXX of
Diamonds and I would have no play for a slam.
I have eight tricks in my hand and I decided to play partner for two
and not four. A Club contract wasn't in my mind.
castigamatti
This is all true, but consider your partner holding the spade king for
a moment. Can you find any valid reason for opener not to lead his
ace?
B.R.
Will in New Haven
So I ruff it and I lead over the the Diamond honor we place so
conveniently for an entry. And then I throw three Clubs on the King of
Spades and another Diamond honor. And still go down. Besides, when I
bid a suit and RHO leaps to after two passes the unsupported Ace of my
suit is not one of my first choices, although I might lead it if it
seems right.
jonathan23
<bill.re...@taylorandfrancis.com> wrote:
> No one is vulnerable at matchpoints.
>
> LHO opens 2S (weak) and it is passed to you, you have:
>
> VOID - AKQJTXX - AX - QXXX
>
> What is your call?
I must choose between a convertible Double, a forcing cue-bid of 3S
saying I've got something big, or some non-forcing number of hearts
(probably not less than four). I'm tempted to cue 3S and I'll bid 4H
or 5H over any response.
>
> There are some other issues on this hand, so scroll down when you have
> answered the first question.
>
> You have:
>
> QTXXX - X - JXX - AKJX and RHO opens 2S, you pass, LHE passes and
> partner bids 4S.
I'll go along with the others who assume "LHE" and "4S" oughta be"LHO"
and "4H".
> It is passed to you. I presume you pass. What would
> you have done if partner had bid 3H?
Poked around to see if they've finally added a puce "Oh, Bugger!" card
to the bidding box (Well, I'd use it if it was there).
Seriously, I would probably just bid 3NT to show that (1) we must have
enough HCP and (2) I can't support hearts. The diamonds don't give me
a warm fuzzy feeling but if my partner isn't willing to play 3N, [s]he
should pull it and show me something else - rebidding hearts should
then show a self-sufficient suit and I'd pass it as the least of
evils. I have a couple of tricks in my bag and I'm willing to let
partner play it if they really want to.
What would you have done if he
> had doubled?
Toss-up between Pass, 4C, and a 3S cue (there it is again) saying a
coy "No, you show me _yours_ first".
>
> Absent the 2S bid, would you and your regular partner have reached 7C,
> 6H or other?
Honestly, I think we'd end up in either of 3NT, 4H, or 6NT. We have
_way_ too much system to bid intelligently at our skill level.
>
> Finally,
>
> The 2S bid was made on AXXXXX - XX - XXX- XX
>
> We had a kibbitzer (she was sitting out and had played the hand
> before) and she was indignant that this "illegal" 2S bid had been
> made. She had passed in first seat and she said that she had to
> because 2S is illegal. _Her_ opponents had reached 6H.
>
> We only reached 4H.
I wouldn't go home mad. The weak 2 did it's job, and I've pre-empted
people out of their slams before so if I make a fuss, I'm pitching
rocks from the balcony of my glass house. Anyway, you must
occasionally get a good result from this person's weak twos to
compensate.
> The kibbitzer did not actually _mention_ calling
> the director but she used the word illegal several times. We didn't
> call the director. I don't even _know_ if there are grounds for
> calling the bid illegal.
Aren't kibbitzers supposed to be quiet, for the most part? Is it a
breach of the proprieties to remind them of this?
castigamatti
His partner did not support spades, he is reasonably hoping his
partner is holding a singleton spade and the ace comes down. I am not
saying that bidding 4H is a bad decision because the decisions are
often being made while taking in consideration many other factors, the
way your opponents bid, table feel and bla bla bla. Nevertheless 6H is
the pressure bid par excellence and this looks like the right hand and
moment for it. Of course it can go either way, you are gambling a bit
and you are hoping that the hand in question will give you the
opportunity of making 6, either because of your opponents miss defense
( reasonable to expect ) or because your partner is holding the right
cards ( not so unreasonable ).
B.R.
David W.
wrote:
Part A: Actual Auction
I think you were done in by the preempt. No matter how I try, I can't
come up with a nice sensible way to slam without guessing and absent
special agreements (not that I have any up my sleeve). Every sequence
I dream up admits to a guess on the part of the strong hand and in
some cases hearts aren't even mentioned! I believe 4H would get the
plurality vote in the MSC.
I think that pass would also be the plurality vote in the MSC for
advancer's hand after the 4H balance. Some, however, would make a
move. Style is important here as intervenor's aggresiveness would
factor into the decision to move or not.
Part B: What if we had a free run?
Well if 2nd seat would open then:
2/1 Auctions
=========
1S - 2H
2N*- 3H** *most require a better hand for a 3C bid here
**I don't think many if any responders would introduce
clubs here
3N - 4D* *a control bid
4H - P
1S - 3H* *strong jump shift (Soloway style perhaps)
3N - 4H* *confirming a strong single-suited jump shift
5C*- 5D *surely owes partner a control bid
6C - 6H
1S - 2H
2S*- 3C** *for some, this is the default rebid
**some would show clubs in an A-B-A suit-showing
sequence to show greater strength than an A-A-B sequence (which is
correct only if B is worth showing or if there are no other factors
such as great disparity in the strength of the two suits as here)
4C - 4H
5C - 5H* *the matchpoint bid; 5D is inconceivable given that club
holding
P* *it is not difficult to imagine being off 2 aces - but 6C
is certainly possible even if a bit of a guess.
So even if responder shows clubs, it is hard to reach 7C if 2nd seat
opens since s/he will forever be backpedaling from then on. I believe
that is the context of a big club, opener might be more aggressive but
then responder would reign it in a notch. IN either system, responder
will not view the spade void as favourable for slam.
If 2nd seat would not open:
2/1
===
1H - 1S
4H - P
1H - 1S
4H - 5C* *cuebidding in support of hearts. With a strong two
suiter, responder may need either to jump to 6C here or to respond 2C.
Not easy in standard methods.
5D - 6C
7C* *If partner has short clubs, he will correct. If he has
exactly AKxxx, he will surely correct to 7H (or 7NT with the spade ace
as well) since he will assume your 7C bid shows the Q (you would never
bid 7 with a doubleton). If he has AKxx he will have to guess but he
may hold chunky clubs (AKJT) and knows that he can ruff one or two
spades in dummy (opener's) hand since opener has shown a spade void
(no spade cuebid over 6C).
I wouldn't open the hand 2C but some would and probably do well if
opener can force a cuebidding sequence.
For big clubbers, there are many different possible auctions depneding
on agreements but a simple one may be:
1C - 1S
2H - 3C
4C - 5C
5N*- 7C *the lack of pointed suit cuebids is encouraging to opener so
5NT should be the GSF here.
Part C: Was Wk 2 Legal?
I believe Adam correctly cited the ACBL regs on weak 2 bids so, cries
of illegality notwithstanding, a director call was not going to get
you to 6H.
Cheers
David W.
Will in New Haven
>
> > We had a kibbitzer (she was sitting out and had played the hand
> > before) and she was indignant that this "illegal" 2S bid had been
> > made. She had passed in first seat and she said that she had to
> > because 2S is illegal. _Her_ opponents had reached 6H.
>
> > We only reached 4H.
>
> I wouldn't go home mad. The weak 2 did it's job, and I've pre-empted
> people out of their slams before so if I make a fuss, I'm pitching
> rocks from the balcony of my glass house. Anyway, you must
> occasionally get a good result from this person's weak twos to
> compensate.
I wasn't mad.
>
> > The kibbitzer did not actually _mention_ calling
> > the director but she used the word illegal several times. We didn't
> > call the director. I don't even _know_ if there are grounds for
> > calling the bid illegal.
>
> Aren't kibbitzers supposed to be quiet, for the most part? Is it a
> breach of the proprieties to remind them of this?
>
After the hand is over, and the round is over, her status changed from
"kibitzer" to "someone who happened to be there." She went on to play
the next round and so did we. However, she seemed to feel that _she_
should have some standing to complain that somone else "got away with"
and gained from making a call that she thought was illegal. I'm pretty
sure she went to the director and got nothing for her trouble.
Derek Broughton
> No one is vulnerable at matchpoints.
>
> LHO opens 2S (weak) and it is passed to you, you have:
>
> VOID - AKQJTXX - AX - QXXX
>
> What is your call?
>
> There are some other issues on this hand, so scroll down when you have
> answered the first question.
Double, then hearts.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> You have:
>
> QTXXX - X - JXX - AKJX and RHO opens 2S, you pass, LHE passes and
> partner bids 4S.
Leaping Michaels? Hearts and a minor. Bid clubs. Since I can't see what
else he could mean, clubs seems safest. But what level?
> It is passed to you. I presume you pass. What would
> you have done if partner had bid 3H? What would you have done if he
> had doubled?
I can't imagine passing. Whatever he meant, it wasn't to play in opponent's
suit.
> Absent the 2S bid, would you and your regular partner have reached 7C,
> 6H or other?
6C for sure - 7 if it's my partner setting the contract :-)
Most days, I'd open 1S, and we should find the club fit. If 2nd seat
passes, it goes:
1H - 1S
3H - 4C and we're off to the races.
> Finally,
>
> The 2S bid was made on AXXXXX - XX - XXX- XX
>
> We had a kibbitzer (she was sitting out and had played the hand
> before) and she was indignant that this "illegal" 2S bid had been
> made. She had passed in first seat and she said that she had to
> because 2S is illegal. _Her_ opponents had reached 6H.
Well, she's an idiot. It's not even a psych. Most people will play a 5+
weak 2, and that's not a gross misrepresentation of this hand. If they have
a tendency to shade that much though, I'm going to be doubling them often.
>
> We only reached 4H. The kibbitzer did not actually _mention_ calling
> the director but she used the word illegal several times. We didn't
> call the director. I don't even _know_ if there are grounds for
> calling the bid illegal.
Not afaik.
--
derek
Kieran Dyke
"Derek Broughton" <de...@pointerstop.ca> wrote in message
news:e0c6s6-...@morgen.pointerstop.ca...
> Will in New Haven wrote:
>
>> No one is vulnerable at matchpoints.
>>
>> LHO opens 2S (weak) and it is passed to you, you have:
>>
>> VOID - AKQJTXX - AX - QXXX
>>
>> What is your call?
>>
>> There are some other issues on this hand, so scroll down when you have
>> answered the first question.
>
> Double, then hearts.
Do you really think that there will be a 'then'? Are you happy defending 2SX
without bidding your hearts?
Tiggrr
> derek
Andrew
>
> LHO opens 2S (weak) and it is passed to you, you have:
>
> VOID - AKQJTXX - AX - QXXX
>
> What is your call?
4H.
> There are some other issues on this hand, so scroll down when you have
> answered the first question.
>
> You have:
>
> QTXXX - X - JXX - AKJX and RHO opens 2S, you pass, LHE passes and
> partner bids 4S. It is passed to you. I presume you pass.
I am willing to try 5C, which should be a cuebid for hearts and not a
suit.
> What would
> you have done if partner had bid 3H? What would you have done if he
> had doubled?
3NT and pass respectively.
> Absent the 2S bid, would you and your regular partner have reached 7C,
> 6H or other?
I think we could find 6H via a namyats auction
rich
3H is a severe underbid. 4H, imo, does not adequately show this
hand. I bid 3S, then 4H.
Rich Regan
Will in New Haven
So that's a Namyats hand these days. What happened to the idea that
Namyats distinguished between strong preempts and weak preempts?
KJTXXXXX - X - XX - X was, a pretty normal four-bid and Namyats, when
it came out, was for hands like KQXXXXXX - X - AJX - X, which is
somewhat weaker, more than a full loser, than the hand in question.
This also means that you would pass QTXXX - X - JXX - AKJX in first
seat.
Will in New Haven
In the methods being played, 3S is, temporarily at least, for the
minors. However, I think this is the only way to get the hand bid.
Didn't think of it.
castigamatti
Yes 3S followed by 4H, after partner's 3NTshows basically a very
powerful hand, partner will probably realize it is a void, probably
your opponents too. But I still think that a direct 6H does
necessarily imply only a spade void, perhaps a hand that is missing
two aces or a very unbalanced hand, but not necessarily a spade void.
The defender might decide in the end to play his spade ace, just to
look at dummy before deciding what to do next. After all isn't it a
proverb warning us against being too curious, if I am not mistaken it
is 'curiosity killed the cat'. Not without reason. In my opinion
bridge players are very curious people and they often fall to this
little trickery.
B.R.
David W.
wrote:
And what is partner to do with: Kx, xxxx, KQJT, Qxx after the 3S
bid? Wouldn't s/he bid 5D and then interpret 5H as a grand try?
(Wouldn't you?) On the given hand, what would you have done over a 5C
advance? Raise? Is it inconceivable to jump to 5C holding: QTxxx, xxx.
Kx, AKx?
Unless you have the specific agreement that pulling advancer's minor
suit bid to the other major is a correction and not a cuebid or
shortness-showing bid, you will have problems with this approach. And
even if you have that agreement, you are still going to be in trouble
because responder will not know what to do with his good minor hands.
Obviously your methods didn't allow for this hand type - oh well, you
can't win on every hand. I much prefer your 6H bash alternative over
the 3S-then-4H shuffle.
David W.
KWSchneider
1) My bid is 3S [ostensibly asking for stopper for notrump, otherwise
forcing] and then correcting 3N to 4H to show this type of hand [8.5-9
winners, similar to a Namyats opening]. At this point responder should
get excited about his hand [2.5 cover cards] and cue-bid 5C.
Overcaller then can then take the shot to 6H.
2) The 2S opening is far from illegal. As Adam stated you can have a
7pt range and still use conventions, so a nominal range of 4-10
[opening 11+ hands 1S] is totally acceptable. The kibitzer needs to
learn the rules of bridge.
Cheers,
Kurt
Andrew
Nothing.
> KJTXXXXX - X - XX - X was, a pretty normal four-bid and Namyats, when
> it came out, was for hands like KQXXXXXX - X - AJX - X, which is
> somewhat weaker, more than a full loser, than the hand in question.
9
A K Q 10 8 6 5 3
4
A J 7
9 tricks and a classic Namyats hand.
> This also means that you would pass QTXXX - X - JXX - AKJX in first
> seat.
It's a marginal opener. If you choose to open it, you should have no
problem getting to slam.
1S-2H
3C-5NT
7C
is one route.
Andrew
henry...@yahoo.com
I would have bid 3s, asking for a spade stopper, and then pulled 3nt
to 4h to show a solid suit and extra values. Because of the
possibility of 3 fast losers in diamonds, as advancer I would qbid 5c,
since I cannot construct a hand with 3 fast diamond losers that
qualifies for this sequence. Then overcaller would qbid 5d and
advancer could bid 6h.
Henrysun909
Rob Tamlyn
He must mean that he will try to cash as many H's as possible against 2SX.
Rob Tamlyn
Your A of spades lead scenario seems far-fetched against a good
opponent. You are suggesting that he play you for a small doubleton? Kx?
6H is overbid. With partner holding lots of spades on most layouts due
to no raise, RHO is likely to hold more of the key cards. If it comes
down to a club finesse, it is likely to fail.
4H is an underbid with the only alternative 5H IMO. I would still go
with 4H.
castigamatti
Ok, you are right, but what about the six heart bidder holding 1=8=1=3
and missing the spade and diamond ace, don't start with the spade ace
and slam makes if you don't find partner's ace, will he return back
spades then? 6H is not necessarily showing the spade void, that is
what I was trying to say.
Cheers
Boris
jonathan23
> On Nov 3, 1:52�pm, jonathan23 <campb...@yahoo.ca> wrote:
> > On Nov 3, 12:03�pm, Will in New Haven
> >
>
> >
> > > We had a kibbitzer (she was sitting out and had played the hand
> > > before) and she was indignant that this "illegal" 2S bid had been
> > > made. She had passed in first seat and she said that she had to
> > > because 2S is illegal. Her opponents had reached 6H.
> >
> > > We only reached 4H.
> >
> > I wouldn't go home mad. �The weak 2 did it's job, and I've
> > pre-empted people out of their slams before so if I make a fuss,
> > I'm pitching rocks from the balcony of my glass house. �Anyway, you
> > must occasionally get a good result from this person's weak twos to
> > compensate.
>
> I wasn't mad.
I didn't think you would have been...you seem to be more rational and
thoughtful than many bridge players I've encountered. But that's
comparing you to typical players here so you could breathe fire, eat
puppies for breakfast, and still look like a Boy Scout. I don't have
much time for the firebreathing act and don't like being partnered with
people that do it on the days I'm without my regular partner (who is a
patient soul, bless her).
>
> >
> > > The kibbitzer did not actually mention calling
> > > the director but she used the word illegal several times. We
> > > didn't call the director. I don't even know if there are grounds
> > > for calling the bid illegal.
> >
> > Aren't kibbitzers supposed to be quiet, for the most part? �Is it a
> > breach of the proprieties to remind them of this?
> >
>
> After the hand is over, and the round is over, her status changed from
> "kibitzer" to "someone who happened to be there." She went on to play
> the next round and so did we. However, she seemed to feel that she
> should have some standing to complain that somone else "got away with"
> and gained from making a call that she thought was illegal. I'm pretty
> sure she went to the director and got nothing for her trouble.
Said person is a twit, anyway, but I'm sure you know that. My
thought/belief is that while the _session_ is on throwing around words
that are tantamount to "you cheated" is improper whether or not any
particular round is being, or has been, played. IMO From the time the
director calls "start playing" til the last round is called everyone
should be civil even if it kills them (there are some I hope it would).
Maybe I have impossibly high standards for conduct. Or maybe I just
can't get worked up enough over losing at bridge. But then I'm at the
stage where people, if they don't like losing, stop coming. Me, I'm
just ploughing through the textbooks and doing all the exercises I can
lay my hands on between games.
But, hey, enough of the tangent. Thanks for posting an interesting
problem. I look forward to reading stuff like this.
Steve Willner
> LHO opens 2S (weak) and it is passed to you, you have:
> VOID - AKQJTXX - AX - QXXX
If 3S is agreed to show minors, I don't think you can bid it with this
hand. However, I think that's a poor agreement. Either 4S or 4NT (or
conceivably both) should show minors, leaving 3S to show a strong,
unbalanced hand without a spade stopper. Normally that will be a hand
prepared to pass 3NT if partner bids it, but here you will bid 4H,
showing a one-suiter slam try, probably with a spade control. (You have
leaping Michaels for the heart-minor two suiters.)
If 3S as above is unavailable, I think this hand is in the middle
between 5H and 6H. Before I read anything else, I had chosen 5H, but I
wasn't confident. I think the majority choice of 4H is a severe
underbid. You have to play partner for some values on this auction,
though of course sometimes that will be wrong.
> QTXXX - X - JXX - AKJX and RHO opens 2S, you pass, LHE passes and
> partner bids 4S. It is passed to you. I presume you pass. What would
> you have done if partner had bid 3H? What would you have done if he
> had doubled?
Like everyone else, pass the double or 4H or correct 3H to 3NT. Also
pass 5H. Partner is playing me for about this much already, and I have
no way to know whether the club values are fitting or not. Over 3S, 3NT
is obvious, and if 4H follows _then_, 5C (control bid, not a suit) is
fine. This route should get to 6H; 7C seems out of reach after the preempt.
> Absent the 2S bid, would you and your regular partner have reached 7C,
> 6H or other?
The normal course is for the spade hand to open, and the heart hand has
to hold back a bit because of presumed wasted spade values opposite the
void. A lot depends on detailed agreements. Some of the auctions
suggested don't strike me as sensible (no surprise), but I think good
bidders should get to 6H most of the time but 7C only if a bit lucky in
either methods or guesswork. (That C-J is a big card!)
> The 2S bid was made on AXXXXX - XX - XXX- XX
As others (especially Adam) have written, no problem if the system card
was properly marked, and the kibitzer had no business commenting.
From patri...@gmail.com:
> (After 1S-3H-3NT, is 4C Gerber or natural?)
Depends on your jump shift agreements. If playing Soloway js, 4C should
be a control bid. If a jump shift is acceptable on the heart hand (with
four clubs on the side), 4C probably has to be natural.
OldPalooka
> Will in New Haven wrote:
>
> > No one is vulnerable at matchpoints.
> > LHO opens 2S (weak) and it is passed to you, you have:
> > VOID - AKQJTXX - AX - QXXX
>
>
> If 3S as above is unavailable, I think this hand is in the middle
> between 5H and 6H. Before I read anything else, I had chosen 5H, but I
> wasn't confident. I think the majority choice of 4H is a severe
> underbid. You have to play partner for some values on this auction,
> though of course sometimes that will be wrong.
>
Partner's share is about 8HCP with spade length and wastage. So if
you catch partner with his average, you are sweating 5H or failing.
And if partner believes you only need 2 working values to peep over
5H, you may well be down in 6 when you could have made 5.
Yes, 4H is an underbid. But 5H is a bigger overbid.
-- bill Shutts
boblipton
> No one is vulnerable at matchpoints.
>
> LHO opens 2S (weak) and it is passed to you, you have:
>
> VOID - AKQJTXX - AX - QXXX
>
I check their card and see if they play Ogust. People who play Ogust
are not unlikely to open a weak two on Qxxxxx and out, which means
their partner would raise of three to the Jack and an ace and king,
and so eliminates a double, hoping to pick up the penalty pass.
If they are not playing Ogust, I check the vulnerability and their
faces. But in reality the choices are double and 4 Spades and given
the fact that I don't bring that much to the defense (about two and a
half tricks so partner has to bring five tricks to the party), I bid
4 Spades. Hoping we don't miss the slam.
Bob
>
> There are some other issues on this hand, so scroll down when you have
> answered the first question.
>
> You have:
>
> QTXXX - X - JXX - AKJX and RHO opens 2S, you pass, LHE passes and
> partner bids 4S. It is passed to you. I presume you pass. What would
> you have done if partner had bid 3H? What would you have done if he
> had doubled?
In all these case I pass.
>
> Absent the 2S bid, would you and your regular partner have reached 7C,
> 6H or other?
Well, we would likely have reached 6 Clubs (1S-2H-3C-4C-4D-4H-4NT-??)
but not seven
>
> Finally,
>
> The 2S bid was made on AXXXXX - XX - XXX- XX
>
> We had a kibbitzer (she was sitting out and had played the hand
> before) and she was indignant that this "illegal" 2S bid had been
> made. She had passed in first seat and she said that she had to
> because 2S is illegal. _Her_ opponents had reached 6H.
>
> We only reached 4H. The kibbitzer did not actually _mention_ calling
> the director but she used the word illegal several times. We didn't
> call the director. I don't even _know_ if there are grounds for
> calling the bid illegal.
I don't know if it's illegal, but as I consider it neither immoral nor
fattening, I don't.
Bob
Frisbieinstein
wrote:
> No one is vulnerable at matchpoints.
>
> LHO opens 2S (weak) and it is passed to you, you have:
>
> VOID - AKQJTXX - AX - QXXX
>
> What is your call?
>
> answered the first question.
>
> You have:
>
> QTXXX - X - JXX - AKJX and RHO opens 2S, you pass, LHE passes and
> partner bids 4S. It is passed to you. I presume you pass. What would
> you have done if partner had bid 3H? What would you have done if he
> had doubled?
>
> 6H or other?
>
>
> The 2S bid was made on AXXXXX - XX - XXX- XX
>
> We had a kibbitzer (she was sitting out and had played the hand
> before) and she was indignant that this "illegal" 2S bid had been
> made. She had passed in first seat and she said that she had to
> because 2S is illegal. _Her_ opponents had reached 6H.
>
> We only reached 4H. The kibbitzer did not actually _mention_ calling
> the director but she used the word illegal several times. We didn't
> call the director. I don't even _know_ if there are grounds for
> calling the bid illegal.
>
> Will in New Haven
There is a convention that a jump cue bid shows a self-sufficient suit
to be named later.
Eric Leong
2S Pass Pass 3S(1)
Pass 3NT Pass 4H(2)
Pass 5C(3) Pass 7C(4)
All pass.
(1) I have a solid suit somewhere
(2) My solid suit is hearts
(3) Concentration in clubs
(4) I can count 13 tricks.
Eric Leong
henry...@yahoo.com
And if the two hands are
--
AKQJTxx
Ax
Qxxx
QTxxx
xx
Kxx
AKx
do you really want to be in 7c?
Henrysun909
Eric Leong
wrote:
>
> - Show quoted text -
No, but why is partner going to leave 7C in when he knows I have a
solid heart suit?
If partner sensibly bids 7H, I would think your chances are excellent
to make 7H.
If clubs are not 3-3, LHO is most likely to control the club suit from
the bidding and you make 7H on a double squeeze.
Still, I would question bidding 5C with the hand you give. One would
think with both controls in each of the minors the better bid is 5H
which tells partner to bid on with a first or second round spade
control. In my opinion, bidding 5C shows not just good club honors but
also some club length as a potential source of tricks.
Eric Leong
henry...@yahoo.com
Your point about converting back to 7h is a good one.
Henrysun909
Steve Willner
>>> No one is vulnerable at matchpoints.
>>> LHO opens 2S (weak) and it is passed to you, you have:
>>> VOID - AKQJTXX - AX - QXXX
OldPalooka wrote:
> Partner's share is about 8HCP with spade length and wastage. So if
> you catch partner with his average, you are sweating 5H or failing.
...
> Yes, 4H is an underbid. But 5H is a bigger overbid.
You may be right that 5H is an overbid, but I don't think your "share"
is the right way to look at it. Instead, there are 14 non-spade points
in the deck, and partner's share of those -- based on vacant spaces --
is about 40% or 5.6 points. The question is which will happen more
often: bidding and making slam or going down in five. Given that I
didn't raise to slam with the actual hand opposite (QTXXX - X - JXX -
AKJX), maybe bidding and making slam is too unlikely for 5H to be
worthwhile. Or maybe I was wrong to pass 5H with that. Or both.