NY Poker, John Hanley's Unlawful Operations
Keithandar
In the thread "John Hanley Threatens New York Poker" (originated August 8,
2002), Carriandra discussed the Hanley poker operations in New York and John
Hanley's involvement in a smear campaign. His latest Manhattan poker room
opened at a premises that has previously been busted by the authorities for
illegal use-this was after he was busted twice before for illegal poker
operations at other Manhattan locations nearby. After two weeks of operation,
customers say that this poker room is a replay of his earlier ones in
Manhattan-the ones that got busted. The Hanleys are once again flagrantly
flouting the law in a way that is sure to bring heat on themselves and every
other multi-table poker room in New York. Since John Hanley is sure to get out
there and blame someone he doesn't like, instead of himself, if he gets busted
again, I have taken over from Carriandra the chore of answering the RGP
writer who asked in the thread John Hanley Threatens New York Poker (originated
August 8, 2002) >Questions for the spinmeister: How do the Hanleys flout the
law any>more than the other clubs? It's time to point the finger where the
finger pointing is deserved-at John Hanley and his unlawful poker operations.
Let me introduce myself and tell you my position about John Hanley and his
poker rooms, before I answer this question. My name is Keith Andar Schwartz.
I'm not a spinmeister but I am outspoken about things that I believe in. I am
Carriandra's brother. I play poker in home games and occasionally in public
card rooms. I am totally supportive of Carriandra's position with regard to
John Hanley's New York poker operations, and am reviled by what I have learned
about his personal conduct in his poker room with people he does not like. John
Hanley has smeared someone who is very close to Carriandra and me. One of the
things I believe in is challenging a bully who not only attempts to get what he
wants by intimidation but smears people he cannot persuade to bend to his
needs. Let me add that I have learned that John Hanley also has a history of
attempting to turn the tables on his targets of abuse when he is under pressure
and held accountable for his actions; he simply shouts outlandish claims about
them in an effort to take the heat off himself. He has failed in this charade
miserably with NYC authorities who have twice booted his poker operations out
of the heart of the City. Carriandra has exposed his dirty pool tactics
publicly in her post of August 8th. Now he can no longer use his poker room,
with impunity, to disseminate false claims or as a conduit to build support or
encourage copycats to engage in mean-spirited commentary about others.
Having made myself clear on where I stand about this man's smear tactics, let
me move on to present a researched answer to the question that was posed on
this newsgroup on August 8th: How do the Hanleys flout the law any more than
the other clubs? There is substantial information in publicly available police
reports, legal papers and court transcripts, that John Hanley flagrantly
disregards the law in his poker rooms. Anyone who has seen John Hanley's
conduct with the police during their visits, or has listened to John Hanley's
rants about how his club is legal (when he knows otherwise) or has heard his
bravado claims of "friends" in the police department who will protect him from
prosecution and how he'll teach the rest of the cops a thing or two (by keeping
them from coming in under any conditions-even in emergencies- without a search
warrant), or has been privy to John Hanley's temper tantrums when under the
pressure of an investigation, or has learned that the Diamond Club was busted
in 2000 by the same guy who raided them three years earlier or finds out from
the local police precinct records that the Clover Club/Manhattan was done the
moment John got physical with a cop-- can figure out that John Hanley has no
one to blame but himself for his troubles with the authorities. Flouting the
law seems to come naturally to him as does pushing the envelope with people he
doesn't like. The Hanleys' have consistently "flouted the law in ways that make
it impossible for the cops or the City to ignore.
John Hanley distinguishes his poker operations by flouting the law more than
the other clubs would even dream of doing. For openers, the Hanleys have
broadcasted their disrespect for federal laws that relate to cash transactions
in excess of $10,000 and others that relate to "employee" obligations, among
others. They have willfully violated laws of the State of New York that relate
to gambling operations and promotion of gambling under the state's penal code,
among others. A profile that looked like an ad and solicitation for customers
within weeks after they were raided in 2000 was a unique way to diss the cops.
Their operation of an illegal lottery in the form of a "bad beat jackpot has
been similarly unique in the history of New York poker rooms for its brash
disregard of the law. The Hanleys have also distinguish themselves in
disobedience of the law by cutting the pots for the purpose of funding their
bad beat jackpots. The Hanleys have taken the undistributed player-funded
jackpot monies for themselves each time their poker room has been closed by the
authorities-and when they closed their last poker room, those customers got
shut out again-losing all the money they put into the bad beat jackpot, there
too. John Hanley has thumbed his nose at fire, health, and safety standards
required of places of public assembly. John Hanley has ignored basic
obligations for compliance with city regulations- of basic cleanliness and
sanitary conditions -as if there were none. John Hanley has resisted lawful
police entry to his premises. John Hanley has involved himself in at least one
physical altercation with a police officer in the course of a police
investigation at his poker room premises.
New York poker rooms that operate with a commitment to honesty, integrity and
fair mindedness and with sensible strategies to maintain harmless low-keyed
operations are deserving of "prosecutorial discretion;" I think that police and
politicians should leave those operations alone. On the other hand John
Hanley's operations flagrantly flout the law and therefore automatically draw
heat. Worst of all, he invariably attempts to shift the blame for his troubles
onto the shoulders of someone he doesn't like. The next time John Hanley points
an accusatory finger, consider the facts-- including his proven modus operandi
as a poker room operator who flagrantly flouts the law and defends the troubles
he causes himself by blaming others and smearing people he doesn't like.
Keith Andar Schwartz
Rob Oldfield
Larry W. (Wayno) Phillips
>Can I just check (that) I have this straight? You don't like him?
I'm seeing the words "smear", "spinmeister", "flagrantly", "basic
cleanliness", "smear" (second appearance), "thumbed his nose", and
"flouted"-- all major warning flags in the "don't like him"
department. Except for the part near the end about "donates to the
World Wildlife Fund", I just don't see anything here that would change
my vote to "Really Likes Him a lot".
Michael O'Malley
"Larry W. (Wayno) Phillips" <Larr...@charter.net> wrote in message
news:3d752ed5...@news.cis.dfn.de...
RMITCHCOLL
>
<rest of crapola snipped>
So Keith, where is that Media Liaison for Wendeen? We really miss her.
This is Posted for the Official RGP Record in Accordance with GAP.
Randy Collack
Marge registration is now open at http://www.conjelco.com/marge.html
Grand Casino-Biloxi, MS
October 31st-November 2nd
mailing list at http://www.conjelco.com/mailman/listinfo/marge
SumWunElse222
SHUT THE F*U*C*K UP!
Rob Oldfield
...no signs of the 'love' part of a love/hate relationship then?
Larry W. (Wayno) Phillips wrote in message
<3d752ed5...@news.cis.dfn.de>...
dave keiser
everybody from New York knows what you did and why you did it. Nobody
would play with you and you got barred from the Diamond and the Mayfair.
_________________________________________________________________
Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com
sally
Was John H. every an associate of the Mayfair Club?
Larry W. (Wayno) Phillips
<r...@oldfield100.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
>...no signs of the 'love' part of a love/hate relationship then?
I thought I saw something in there that may have been a very
oblique reference to the Make-A-Wish foundation but other than that,
no. Still looking...
Adam Schoenfeld
jackpot, that club is somehow less entitled to operate than the others
currently operating in New York?
We all know what this is all about. And we all know who is running the
smear campaign here. And might I recommend a paragraph break in the
future to Carriandra/Keith/Ellen Hote?
Adam Schoenfeld
RazzO
razzo
Keithandar wrote:
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steven berkowitz
capable of making my own choice, based upon a multitude of factors. So
if I choose to play in a place with dirty carpets and a bad-beat
jackpot, why does that bother you? Clearly all of the ny clubs violate
a multitude of laws-- gambling, labor, taxes. So what? So John got in
the cops face. So what? To me, it was just a bad business decision.
And, by the way, if you want to get technical, YOU are breaking the
law every time you play poker for money in any club in NYC.
If you don't wanna play there, fine. Why are trying so hard to screw
it all up for the rest of us?
Steven Berkowitz
keith...@aol.com (Keithandar) wrote in message news:<20020903155209...@mb-fp.aol.com>...
aap71
nit-picky crap these weasels come up with to knock John Hanley
(Cleanliness? Health Codes? It's a card room, not a kitchen) is
exactly what I attempt to escape by playing cards in the first place.
Doesn't the shrill, yapping tone and the officious quasi-legalese of
John's detractors remind you of the worst political pundits? You know
the ones: people like Anne Coulter and other conservative muck-rakers
when they tried to bring down Bill Clinton. They hated his essence and
popular charisma, so they go to great lengths to scream about and act
all offended by minor, penny-ante nonsense (sexual indiscretions and
whitewater) and wrongly suggest that these things prevent him from
doing a good job. It chapped their ass something fierce when the
country flourished under his leadership.
By the same token John Hanley (like Bill) is a charismatic, big
personality with a strong record of successful management. He
also(like Bill) has a brother who went to jail (although I'd feel much
more comfortable tangling with Roger than I would with Robert). Sure
his manner can be a little gruff, but that's just what poker needs.
His candor, blunt honesty and authoritative command are uniquely
suited to the quelling the chaos that public poker becomes when noone
is there to put the whiners and prima donnas and mouthy angle-shooters
in their place. Two qualities surround poker in a Hanley club:
certainty and fairness. Whether you're a doctor or a ditchdigger, you
receive the same qualified, evenhanded treatment.
Isn't that, after all, what poker has always been about? It's a
brutally fair game of the people. Social connections, academic homors,
professional position etc. mean nothing at the table. That's why
Wendeen hates the Hanleys. She LIVES for all those petty accolades
that John refuses to suffer. She can't stand that she doesn't rate
special treatment just for being her. I've seen her tolerated and
coddled and soothed by dealers, players and managers from Vegas to
A.C. - but never in a Hanley room. That's how it should be.
ALAN,LOURDES STEFFEN
game who seem to be in some jeopardy. alan
"steven berkowitz" <bez...@nyc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:f7a9d402.02090...@posting.google.com...
Patrick Luminello
the closing of the still missed Mayfair and Diamond Clubs. Now, years
later, we poker players in the city have some well-run, safe places to play.
And here come the naysayers and spoilers again, ready to destroy all the
clubs in their eagerness to harm someone they hate for no good reason. You
can use all the legalisms and smear terms you like to support the
anti-Hanley factions, but the bottom line is they just plain don't like John
and want to hurt him. If in the process, they also hurt all poker clubs and
players in the city, so be it. To my mind, that is just petty bullshit, and
the purveyors should give it a rest and leave us alone. I have no ax to
grind, I have never had a problem with John, or with Jay or Mike or any of
the other club operators. I just like to play and they provide a safe venue
to do so. I hope their operations are not ruined by this nonsense...
Carl
I happen to play at places other than the Hanley's club, but buddies
of mine play there, and they have absolutely no problem with the
place. If the customers are happy, why should anyone else complain?
Yeah, I know, they're making things bad for New York poker. Well, I
hope that's not true, but I don't see how yapping about it is going to
do any good.
Will posting messages attacking the Hanleys lower their patronage?
No.
Will they make the Hanleys close their club. No.
Will these posts do any good at all. No.
So, can't people just drop their egos and play cards?
bez...@nyc.rr.com (steven berkowitz) wrote in message news:<f7a9d402.02090...@posting.google.com>...
Gary Carson
<plu...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>So here we go again, pettiness and personal vendettas were
responsible for
>the closing of the still missed Mayfair and Diamond Clubs.
They were closed because they openly flaunted the law to an extent
that just couldn't be ignored by law enforcement.
Gary Carson
http:// garycarson.home.mindspring.com
RBlumen612
I have NEVER had to worry about Fifteen dollar drops in low limit games at
Hanley's clubs as I have seen at other places.
As far as the cost of the bad beats....I'm willing to pay a couple of dollars
to win the "lottery"
Mike Marone
Why the animosity and obvious jealousy. If the place is a little dirty
and loud, it's poker, so WHAT! Lighten and let this vendetta go.....
GO GET 'EM JOHN AND BILLY!!!!!!!!
Ellenhote
Media Liaison and Spokesperson for
Wendeen H. Eolis
Ms. Eolis' book in progress, Power Poker Dame will include her unique
experiences in the world of New poker. These posts do give one of the
flavors of the poker world that is sure to be considered. She appreciates the
input.
RazzO
razzo
Mike Marone wrote:
--
Ellenhote
Media Liaison and Spokesperson for
Wendeen H. Eolis
Ms. Eolis' book in progress, Power Poker Dame will include her unique
RMITCHCOLL
>Media Liaison and Spokesperson for
>Wendeen H. Eolis
Welcome back..we missed you. the other minions dont have your flair.
>
>Ms. Eolis' book in progress, Power Poker Dame will include her unique
>experiences in the world of New poker. These posts do give one of the
>flavors of the poker world that is sure to be considered. She appreciates the
>input.
>
>
Will it be written by her or you or Keith or that other lady..or does it
matter? you all seem so interchangeable.
By the way, i see you gave dropped your "for the official record" stuff. You
might still become a real RGPer...their is still hope.
Respectfully submitted
me
only ones that feel the way they do....hmmmmmmmmm
RMITCHCOLL
>only ones that feel the way they do....hmmmmmmmmm
>
"Whaddaya mean their funny?... Funny how? I mean, funny like a clown? They
amuse you?"
Tommy Devito
aap71
than single incidents or conflicts. Rational appeals to pipe down and
just play cards won't work in this case because the opponents are
natural enemies.
Each recognizes in the other a mortal foe. This goes deeper than
poker. If Wendeen and John were 6-year-olds on the playground they
would hate each other. If they were the same people but born into some
vastly different life (Japanese fishing village, Scandanavian
tulip-farming community) they would recognize each other and fulfill
their genetic imperative by locking horns. They understand themselves
better through engaging their nemeses.
The heat generated by their fight distills and reveals what each
stands for: John Hanley is good, Wendeen is evil. It's that simple.
They really are remarkably faithful to ancient dramatic archetypes
Eros and Thanatos. John is a natural force creating something from
nothing (Eros). He defends what he creates while it is fragile and
happily invites us to partake of his creation. When it gets destroyed,
he does the only thing he knows how - he builds it again from the
ground up. Wendeen is the evil jealous crone bent on destroying all
that John has wrought(Thanatos). Wendeen is shrill and haughty with a
strong sense of entitlement. She's unapologetically elitist - she
lives on 5th Avenue, all her press mentions her father and her
connections - and she can't help but perceive John and his family as
"ill-bred ruffians" who owe the likes of her some kind of obedience or
regard ("tug your forlock in homage to your betters, peasant!"). John,
for his part, is a self-made entrepreneur man of the people. His
popularity in a crowd irks Wendeen, as it would any snob like her who
deep down believes herself to be better than those with whom she
plays.
The thing is, poker is a populist game of social equals. In that key
regard John Hanley is the right fit for poker and Wendeen is the
destructive influence. Poker is the perfect game to knock the
self-impressed on there ass. As such, there's no place in poker for
Wendeen and people like her who want to sap it of its vitality by
making it "polite" and "respectable" and "refined."
Dehumanizer
Where is this NEW Poker Room in NYC located?
What are the games?
Is it open to the public?
Someone enlighten me...
-Dehumanizer
steven berkowitz
joint, there was at least one incident when they did...about 5 years
ago in Brooklyn.
A bunch of players along with the housemen spent the night in jail,
and all received ACD's. If you read the New York laws on gambling,
patrons of the New York clubs are clearly violating the law.
"ALAN,LOURDES STEFFEN" <aste...@nyc.rr.com> wrote in message news:<JBmd9.3369$hh.5...@twister.nyc.rr.com>...
Keithandar
and schoenfeld,
Carriandra, Ellen, and Wendeen stand behind my response here to various
posts and I want to answer some private e-mails that say, in common, that these
posts could cause problems for NY poker because of information they have
divulged.
Let me repeat what has been said elsewhere: Neither Carri nor I have given
any information on this newsgroup (except about the smear campaign) that would
be news to the authorities. We have referred to information on the Hanleys'
unlawful operations only from public documents, legal papers, and court
transcripts and other data already known to the authorities through others.
>From: rmitc...@aol.com to Ellen Hote
>Will it be written by her or you or Keith or that other lady..or does it
>matter? you all seem so interchangeable (adam Schoenfeld wrote similarly And
might I recommend a paragraph break in the future to Carriandra/Keith/Ellen
Hote?)
KAS:Power Poker Dame is being written by Wendeen with research and fact
checking help by Ellen hote.
Carriandra and I are both close to Wendeen, as is Ellen. Wendeen appreciates
what some RGP readers find annoying----our single-mindedness, forthrightness
and support of her in our posts, but let me say point blank we are not
"interchangable." And Wendeen does not hide behind our posts, either. She has
publicized the barring and challenged it as an integral part of a smear
campaign. She has been out front about John Hanley's unlawful operations, as
well, because he he has previously used her as a scapegoat for blame and if
he gets busted, he will undoubtedly try to shift the blame for his unlawful
operations over to someonone else's responsibility again.
It's too bad that some people have such a hard time accepting the fact that
Wendeen has stong support that the only way they can deal with it is by the
claim that everybody is the same body-----literally or figuratively. As has
been stated before, she is also considerate to her poker friends, recommending
that they stay out of the fray on this newsgroup to avoid getting themselves
skewered in the process. Wendeen does not hide behind us in this matter as
anyone who has spoken to her knows all too well.
From Gary Carson:> They were closed because they openly flaunted the law to an
extent that just couldn't be ignored by law enforcement.
KAS According to multiple sources including one of the defendants in the raids
and arrests and one lawyer from the Corporation Counsel's Office that is
precisely what the problem was.
From: aa...@aol.com
>Amen to that!
KAS: aap71 and I are on the same page in that statement! John Hanley could
have and should have acknowledged his culpability instead of wrongly blaming
Wendeen and her political connections for the raid and closing of the Diamond
Club..
aap71 then analyzes the controversy over his false claims and his smear
campaign as he sees it (high volume mean-spirited allegations snipped) saying:
>She's unapologetically elitist
KAS:If you are open-minded you are in for an awakening treat in Power Poker
Dame; her life has been rich with trials and triumphs---she examines the
lessons from both.
>(she) lives on 5th Avenue,
KAS:True, and she loves the park view!
> all her press mentions her father
Huh? Her father died when she was an infant-unknown to her. Her step-father
passed away a few months ago, but she had very little contact with him from the
time she left home (at fifteen) until a few years ago, and he was very rarely
mentioned in feature stories about her.
aap71 refers to the constant mention in press clips of >her>connections
KAS:She does have wonderful connections, and she uses them mostly to help
others. Plenty of NY poker players have benefitted from her help, in all kinds
of emergencies.
> and she can't help but perceive John and his family as>"ill-bred ruffians"
KAS: I don't know about that, but I do know that Wendeen had genuine affection
for Johns' late younger brother, Thomas, has always been cordial with his
brother Robert and continued to be friendly with his brother Billy even after
John stopped welcoming her at his poker room.
KAS:(In a prior post aap71 refers to Robert as a brother (of John ) who went
to jail and he goes on to say (I'd feel much more comfortable tangling with
Roger (Clinton) than I would with Robert). The purpose of that remark is
unclear but it was clearly inappropriate.
> aap71:who owe the likes of her some kind of obedience or regard ("tug your
forlock in homage to your betters, peasant!").
KAS: Please......no matter how erudite the references to ancient history, your
analysis of Wendeen's views is way off the mark except for part of your
last line as snipped below: .
>aap71:Wendeen and people like her who want to ...making it "polite" and
"respectable" and "refined."
KAS:Yes, I believe that is correct, and it does cause some problems with those
who like cursing and vulgarity at the table and "down and dirty" poker rooms.
From Steve Berkowitz: >Why are trying so hard to screw it all up for the rest
of us?
KAS:Presumably this was meant for Wendeen though it was addressed to me. This
question has been asked by other NY players, too, who are unconcerned about
anyone's playing options but their own.
When you decided to support John Hanley's tactics you served yourself while
ignoring the fact that John Hanley was denying the option you have, preventing
a person from playing in games she might like and using his poker room from
which he excluded her as a conduit for bogus claims and dissemination of
mean-spirited gossip about her. We all oppose these tasctics and are prepared
to take away his means of smearing her by challenging his smears here
KAS: (Paragraph break taken as per request) Finally, let me say to Adam
Schoenfeld, without hard feelings on Wendeen's part, while he is known to be a
bright man with a great sense of humor and a rising star on the poker circuit
that his innuendo, barbs, and ill presumtions are way off track in this
matter. She respects his right to think what he wants to think, but one or more
of us are going to continue to set the record straight and challenge John
Hanley's smear campaign as well as anyone's efforts to support it , here and
elswhere, as appropriate.
For those who will celebrate this week end, as we will, I wish you all a Happy
New Year.
Keith Andar
me
rmitc...@aol.com (RMITCHCOLL) wrote:
"Its just, you know, they're just funny. You know, the way they tell the
story and everything."
Henry Hill
steven berkowitz
gs...@cornell.edu (Dehumanizer) wrote in message news:<a002b4b8.02090...@posting.google.com>...
Carl
bez...@nyc.rr.com (steven berkowitz) wrote in message news:<f7a9d402.02090...@posting.google.com>...