YEAST : IS IT VEG OR NONVEG??

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asrini

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Apr 9, 1990, 2:51:23 PM4/9/90
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________________________________________________________________________________

I read the rec.humor newsgroup, and in one of the
articles it was given that while baking bread at
least 150,000 yeast are killed.

Now is bread veg or nonveg?

Since yeast is a bacteria, there is a school of
thought saying that when you breath you kill lots
of bacteria, so will you stop breathing?

It might be crazy but still i feel that vegetarianism
means minimal killing and not total nonkilling.

Any comments on this?


asrinivasan An eye for an eye
uvic, bc, ca. only makes the whole world blind.
MKGandhi.

________________________________________________________________________________

Mary Ann Melton

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Apr 11, 1990, 7:45:24 AM4/11/90
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> Yeast & bacteria exist is some kind of balance (or not) within the
> human body. If there's too bacteria, a bacterial infection can
> result. Many people take antibiotics, this killing off not only
> the "bad" bacteria, but the "good" bacteria, and cause an overgrowth
> of yeast. The result of an overgrowth of yeast can cause a variety
> of symptoms, including severe headaches, lethargy and/or depression.
>


If taking antibiotics (which for some people is a necessity) causes an
overgrowth of yeast, then what do you do after the fact to reduce or
control the yeast.

Any additional information would be appreciated.

Mary Ann Melton

John D. L. McBride

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Apr 11, 1990, 9:37:54 AM4/11/90
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Yeasts are microscopic _plants_ -- not animals.

--J.

What`s in a name?

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Apr 11, 1990, 11:19:35 AM4/11/90
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In article <10...@uvicctr.UVic.CA.UUCP> asr...@uvicctr.UVic.CA.UUCP (asrini) writes:
>
> It might be crazy but still i feel that vegetarianism
> means minimal killing and not total nonkilling.
>
> Any comments on this?


Does anyone really feel that vegetarianism means *no* killing? Are not
vegetables alive? Are they alive in your stomach after digestion? As far
as I'm concerned vegetarians whose sole reason for their diet is to avoid
killing animals are practicing animo-centrism (word???) as grossly as the
non-vegetarian practices humano-centrism. If anything more so because all
too often the philosophical vegetarian arrogates for him/herself a
high-and-mighty plane where killing is disdained. I'm not veg usually. But I
*know* I'm killing animals when I eat meat. Vegetarians don't usually worry
much about killing plants. When I ask, I usually get something like:
"Well, come on, we've got to eat something!" or "Oh, be reasonable!"

This sounds like a complete veg flame, but it isn't. I often practice veg,
when it is reasonably convenient to do so (like when I have my own kitchen
and time to cook everyday...). There are lots of other arguments behind
vegetarianism, purely humanocentric ones. For instance the amount of arable
land that goes into feeding meat vs. producing vegetables. It requires
eight times as much land to feed a cow as to produce the equivalent food
value in vegetables. The official veg figure is eighteen, but because of
protein usability factors and the fact that grasses are really easy to grow the
actual cost figure is more like eight.

Regardless of the figures one chooses to quote, I don't think anyone would
disagree that you get a lot more food out of the same land using it for
vegetable planting than you do using it for grazing. So vegetarianism is
good at conserving food. In fact, the claim that were the whole world
vegtarian our food problem would not exist is not so far from the truth,
despite the fact that nearly half the world is already vegetarian due to the
price of meat. Actually, the food problem would still exist but it would be
purely an economic balance problem as opposed to the general shortage that
exists now.

So there are valid arguments for vegetarianism beyond avoidance of killing
animals. Treating animals humanely is another good one. It's one thing to
hunt and kill, it's quite another the way it's normally done today. Anyone
who has visited a modern chicken or veal farm will be hard pressed to eat
those meats for a while afterwards. And Foie gras, no matter how wonderful,
is something I don't think I'll ever eat again. Killing is a lot different
from exploitation.

My point? Vegetarianism is perfectly reasonable but I question the grounds
of anyone who chooses it simply to avoid killing animals.

--mike


--
Mic3hael Sullivan, | "Who's paying 20 grand a year to go here,
Society for the Incurably Pompous | and who's calling whom *stupid*??"
University of Rot and Fester | --to someone calling UR admins stupid.
-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-

Ralph A. Picking

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Apr 11, 1990, 12:15:13 PM4/11/90
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Yeast is a fungus. Not plant or animal. Vegetarians may eat bread.
Nuff said.

Ralph

Bruce Smith

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Apr 11, 1990, 2:32:03 PM4/11/90
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In article <90101.093...@AUVM.BITNET> MCB...@AUVM.BITNET (John D. L. McBride) writes:
>Yeasts are microscopic _plants_ -- not animals.


Yeasts are little living plants
They're not like bees, they're not like ants
They're not even like an azalea
But without them, your bread's a failure

Bruce Smith
(with thanks to Margaret Cheskin-Nichols)

Ralph A. Picking

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Apr 11, 1990, 3:24:14 PM4/11/90
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In article <90101.093...@AUVM.BITNET> MCB...@AUVM.BITNET (John D. L. McBride) writes:
>Yeasts are microscopic _plants_ -- not animals.
>
>--J.

NOPE!! Yeasts are fungi. Neither plant nor animal. Just to set the
record straight.

Ralph

Roma Levy

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Apr 11, 1990, 4:17:33 PM4/11/90
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In article <10...@uvicctr.UVic.CA.UUCP> asr...@uvicctr.UVic.CA.UUCP (asrini) writes:
>________________________________________________________________________________

>
>
> Now is bread veg or nonveg?
>
> Since yeast is a bacteria, there is a school of

Yeast is not a bacteria -- it comes under the kingdom of Fungi.
Technically speaking, it is neither a plant nor an animal.

I suppose that makes bread vegetarian, since the remainder of
its components are derived from plants, unless you're making
an egg bread, like challah.

As for not killing anything to eat -- it's just not possible.
If you eat the root of a plant, such as a carrot, or the stalk
of a plant, such as celery, you're killing it. If you eat the
seed of a plant, such as the grain in bread, you're "aborting"
it's progeny. Even if you eat the leaves of a plant, preserving
the plant, you will be consuming all sorts of microorganisms that
live on the leaf.

Roma

Rich Geiger

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Apr 11, 1990, 6:27:31 PM4/11/90
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ra...@dale.acc.Virginia.EDU (Ralph A. Picking) writes:

>Yeast is a fungus. Not plant or animal. Vegetarians may eat bread.
>Nuff said.

I don't know about yeast being a fungus or not, but I do believe that
fungi are part of the plant kingdom.

--
- Rich Geiger
Ultra Network Technologies / 101 Daggett Drive / San Jose CA 95134
r...@ultra.com ...!ames!ultra!rmg (408) 922-0100 [w] (408) 739-7911 [h]

Deborah Brown

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Apr 12, 1990, 8:36:50 AM4/12/90
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In article <65...@ur-cc.UUCP> mis...@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (What`s in a name?) writes:

>Does anyone really feel that vegetarianism means *no* killing? Are not
>vegetables alive? Are they alive in your stomach after digestion? As far
>as I'm concerned vegetarians whose sole reason for their diet is to avoid
>killing animals are practicing animo-centrism (word???) as grossly as the

The point is to avoid the killing and eating of SENTIENT life. "Sentient"
implies the organism has some kind of nervous system, can feel pain, fear,
love, hate, etc. (I have Webster's New World Dictionary here and it says:
"sentient: adj. of or capable of feeling; conscious.") It also implies some
kind of intelligence.

Plants have no nervous system, only a circulatory system. They are not
sentient, therefor are safe for vegetarians to eat.

>non-vegetarian practices humano-centrism. If anything more so because all
>too often the philosophical vegetarian arrogates for him/herself a
>high-and-mighty plane where killing is disdained. I'm not veg usually. But I
>*know* I'm killing animals when I eat meat. Vegetarians don't usually worry
>much about killing plants. When I ask, I usually get something like:
>"Well, come on, we've got to eat something!" or "Oh, be reasonable!"

Well, statements like "you're killing PLANTS, aren't you?" are unreasonable,
and tend to put people on the defensive. See above paragraph about sentience.

Did you know there are people who are "fruitarians"? They only eat the
fruits of plants - not the plants themselves. These folks avoid killing
not only animals but the plants too.

>This sounds like a complete veg flame, but it isn't. I often practice veg,

[...]


>My point? Vegetarianism is perfectly reasonable but I question the grounds
>of anyone who chooses it simply to avoid killing animals.

I don't know if one's reasons for vegetarianism are ever that simple. Mine
aren't. The avoidance of killing animals would be sufficient for me if that
were the case.


***********************************Oh boy!*************************************
Ob quote: "'Horny' isn't romantic!" Dr. Samuel Beckett, QUANTUM LEAP
Disclamer: "Disclaim THIS, pal!" (my employer thinks I'm working)
I am: Debbie Brown cci632!jloda!deb -OR- deb%jloda@cci632
********** It's 1995: do you know where your quantum physicist is? ************

Ralph A. Picking

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Apr 12, 1990, 9:53:21 AM4/12/90
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I have to repeat myself. Fungus is no longer considered a plant. I don't
mean this as a flame, but I have to insist. It's its own kingdom now. I
have a degree in biology, and I promise!

Ralph

John D. L. McBride

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Apr 12, 1990, 2:04:38 PM4/12/90
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In article <35...@cci632.UUCP>, d...@cci632.UUCP (Deborah Brown) says:
>
> (portions of posting deleted throughout)

>
>The point is to avoid the killing and eating of SENTIENT life. "Sentient"
>implies the organism has some kind of nervous system, can feel pain, fear,
>love, hate, etc. (I have Webster's New World Dictionary here and it says:
>"sentient: adj. of or capable of feeling; conscious.") It also implies some
>kind of intelligence.

I'll grant that animals can feel pain, but you'd have a hard time convincing
me that they feel fear, love, hate, etc, and that people aren't just
attributing human emotions to the animals.

>
>
>Did you know there are people who are "fruitarians"? They only eat the
>fruits of plants - not the plants themselves. These folks avoid killing
>not only animals but the plants too.
>

Ahhh...but if you believe that life begins at conception, then these
"fruitarians" are killing the unborn children of plants. ;-)

--J.

John D. L. McBride

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Apr 12, 1990, 2:15:10 PM4/12/90
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In article <1990Apr12.1...@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>,
ra...@dale.acc.Virginia.EDU (Ralph A. Picking) says:
>
> (portion of posting deleted)

>
>I have to repeat myself. Fungus is no longer considered a plant. I don't
>mean this as a flame, but I have to insist. It's its own kingdom now. I
>have a degree in biology, and I promise!
>
>Ralph

The last time I had biology (which was, admittedly, some time ago) I was
taught that fungii were plants. If this has been changed, then I stand
corrected. Thanks, Ralph, for keeping us up to date.

--J.

Jim Scandale

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Apr 12, 1990, 2:33:42 PM4/12/90
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Vegetarians MAY eat anything they please. Very few people literally
"can't" eat certain foods. Most choose not to.
Nuff said.

Moira Mallison

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Apr 12, 1990, 4:28:29 PM4/12/90
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In article <7...@hutto.UUCP> mar...@hutto.UUCP (Mary Ann Melton) writes:
>If taking antibiotics (which for some people is a necessity) causes an
>overgrowth of yeast, then what do you do after the fact to reduce or
>control the yeast.
>
>Any additional information would be appreciated.


The problem stems from the fact that the antibiotics are nondiscriminating
and kill beneficial bacterial as well as the "bad guys". Acidophilus
will help restore the balance; it can be purchased in capsules or tablets
at the health food store, and taken during the course of the antibiotics.
This is not a medical prescription, and I don't know how effective it
is really.

If you suspect that you may have an overgrowth of yeast in your system,
The Yeast Connection by William Crook, MD is a good book to start with.
There's a self-test in the beginning and you can determine whether or
not your symptoms are likely caused by candida albicans.

The treatment I have used was nystatin (a prescription drug) taken in
both powder and tablet form and seradophilus, which is probably a
high quality cousin to the acidophilus (I got it from my naturopath),
coupled with a very restrictive diet. Specifically excluded are
all types of sugar and sugar-containing foods, fruit juices (except
freshly prepared), food supplements (except those labeled sugar-free
and yeast-free), alcohol-containing substances (including extracts
and medications), yeasts breads & pastries, vinegar-containing
foods, cheese, ferments & molds (soy sauce, mushrooms), peanuts,
melons and dried fruit. Some practitioners also suggest complete
avoidance of fruit; my only restriction is that I don't combine
it with other foods.

My experience has been that once I get "cleaned up", I can
include moderate amounts of these foods and manage the condition
with a daily dose of nystatin, which is a whole lot easier than
trying to eat this way all the time!

Moira Mallison

Barbara Chapman

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Apr 13, 1990, 3:58:57 AM4/13/90
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In article <43...@scorn.sco.COM> ro...@sco.COM (Roma Levy) writes:

{Discussion of yeasts deleted....}

>
>As for not killing anything to eat -- it's just not possible.
>If you eat the root of a plant, such as a carrot, or the stalk
>of a plant, such as celery, you're killing it. If you eat the
>seed of a plant, such as the grain in bread, you're "aborting"
>it's progeny. Even if you eat the leaves of a plant, preserving
>the plant, you will be consuming all sorts of microorganisms that
>live on the leaf.
>
>Roma

Not to mention the deaths of all the many cute bunnies,
gophers, field mice, etc. which are plowed under when the fields are
prepared for planting the plants you eat, or the deaths of all the water
fowl, fish, and amphibians whose habitat was destroyed when the marshes
were drained to create the fields where the plants you eat are grown....

Barbara Chapman

Amanda Graham

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Apr 13, 1990, 2:10:07 PM4/13/90
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In article <90102.140...@AUVM.BITNET> MCB...@AUVM.BITNET (John D. L. McBride) writes:
>In article <35...@cci632.UUCP>, d...@cci632.UUCP (Deborah Brown) says:
>>
>>The point is to avoid the killing and eating of SENTIENT life. "Sentient"
>>implies the organism has some kind of nervous system, can feel pain, fear,
>>love, hate, etc. (I have Webster's New World Dictionary here and it says:
>>"sentient: adj. of or capable of feeling; conscious.") It also implies some
>>kind of intelligence.
>
>I'll grant that animals can feel pain, but you'd have a hard time convincing
>me that they feel fear, love, hate, etc, and that people aren't just
>attributing human emotions to the animals.

Why does a dog cringe when a person raises his arm to hit him if he
feels no fear; why does a dog wag his tail and jump around excitedly
when his master comes home if he feels no love; why does a dog raise
his hackles and snarl at the meter reader who has used a zapper on him
if he feels no hate? You will probably say this is purely instinct.
Have you never seen an animal grieve for her babies who have been
taken away from her? Instinct or feeling? What does everyone else
think about this?

W. Lawrence English

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Apr 13, 1990, 2:33:12 PM4/13/90
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In article <10...@uvicctr.UVic.CA.UUCP> asr...@uvicctr.UVic.CA.UUCP (asrini) writes:
> Since yeast is a bacteria, there is a school of
> thought saying that when you breath you kill lots
> of bacteria, so will you stop breathing?

> [ more stuff that makes me cranky deleted ]

is it ok for vegetarians to KILL these dopey articles? they don't have a
nervous system, they don't have a face, and i don't think there is much
debate as to their intelligence.

wle.

ag...@p.cs.uiuc.edu

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Apr 14, 1990, 12:39:52 PM4/14/90
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/* Written 1:04 pm Apr 12, 1990 by MCB...@AUVM.BITNET in p.cs.uiuc.edu:rec.food.veg */

In article <35...@cci632.UUCP>, d...@cci632.UUCP (Deborah Brown) says:
>
> (portions of posting deleted throughout)
>
>The point is to avoid the killing and eating of SENTIENT life. "Sentient"
>implies the organism has some kind of nervous system, can feel pain, fear,
>love, hate, etc. (I have Webster's New World Dictionary here and it says:
>"sentient: adj. of or capable of feeling; conscious.") It also implies some
>kind of intelligence.

I'll grant that animals can feel pain, but you'd have a hard time convincing
me that they feel fear, love, hate, etc, and that people aren't just
attributing human emotions to the animals.

Read Charles Darwin, The Expression of Emotions in Man and Animals.
Since then the scientific evidence has continued to accumulate and is
quite overwhelming that the "higher" vertebrates (mammals and birds)
feel these emotions.

>Did you know there are people who are "fruitarians"? They only eat the
>fruits of plants - not the plants themselves. These folks avoid killing
>not only animals but the plants too.

Ahhh...but if you believe that life begins at conception, then these
"fruitarians" are killing the unborn children of plants. ;-)

No. Fruitarians don't consume the seeds. In fact, the Jain
fruitarians believe it was their duty to plant the seeds from fruits
that had naturally fallen the the ground (which is what they consume).

Peace,

Gul Agha

[Son Triew Luong]

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Apr 16, 1990, 4:21:48 PM4/16/90
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>> asr...@uvicctr.UVic.CA.UUCP (asrini) writes:
>>
>> I read the rec.humor newsgroup, and in one of the
>> articles it was given that while baking bread at
>> least 150,000 yeast are killed.
>>
>> Now is bread veg or nonveg?

This is getting to be a bit much !!

>> Since yeast is a bacteria, there is a school of
>> thought saying that when you breath you kill lots
>> of bacteria, so will you stop breathing?

Yeast is a fungus, which belongs in its own kingdom (neither animal nr
plant).

>> It might be crazy but still i feel that vegetarianism
>> means minimal killing and not total nonkilling.

Killing and total nonkilling of WHAT ?? Plant, yes. Animal, no.

Son L.

asrini

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Apr 17, 1990, 5:56:04 PM4/17/90
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> In article <65...@ur-cc.UUCP> mis...@uhura.cc.rochester.edu

> > >Does anyone really feel that vegetarianism means *no* killing? Are not
> >vegetables alive? Are they alive in your stomach after digestion? As far
> >as I'm concerned vegetarians whose sole reason for their diet is to avoid
> >killing animals are practicing animo-centrism (word???) as grossly as the
>

I would like to bring into notice, that in some parts of the
world people still do not eat roots / root vegetables like
carrots, beetroots, potatoes ( sweet as well as normal ) and
onions. I am stopping the list here as you know what roots are.

This is because, those people consider eating roots means killing
the plant in its totality. Most of the other vegetables and fruits
( for example tomatoes ) can be consumed without harming the plant's
life / existence, since after plucking the vegetable the
plant still continues to live.

I think the present day vegetarians have reached a compromise
between the two ( herbivorous & Carnivorous ), by eating roots
but not harming the animals. Whether it is good or bad is debatable.

My friend starts arguing (he is a non vegetarian, who feels
humans can eat anything that moves on Earth) that when people
eat tomatoes they actually consume the seeds which is the prime
source of the plant reproduction. He calls it Passive Killing!
Any takers, who can convince him?


> >*know* I'm killing animals when I eat meat. Vegetarians don't usually worry
> >much about killing plants. When I ask, I usually get something like:
> >"Well, come on, we've got to eat something!" or "Oh, be reasonable!"
>
>

> Did you know there are people who are "fruitarians"? They only eat the
> fruits of plants - not the plants themselves. These folks avoid killing
> not only animals but the plants too.
>

Most of the leaves too are got by killing the plants in their
totality. For example : Broccoli, Lettuce, Cauliflower and cabbage.

It is nice to note that most of the fruits are got by plucking
them from plants, but not harming them. ( I dont know whether
any fruit is got by killing the plant ).

I feel that vegetable kingdom, have enough selections where
we can get enough vegetables without killing the plants.

asrinivasan
uvic, bc, ca.

Ruchira S. Datta

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Apr 17, 1990, 9:39:12 PM4/17/90
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A long time ago (well, maybe not so long ago, but before my time) taxonomists
divided life into two kingdoms, plant and animal. However, in my high school
biology class, I learned that the former simplistic scheme has been rejected as
inadequate. There are FIVE kingdoms, plant, animal, fungus, protozoa, and --
um, um -- algae? (Well, I learned this four years ago!) Anyway, yeast belongs
to the fungus kingdom, as someone else has pointed out several times, but
apparently without getting through.

By the way, I am a vegetarian for religious reasons, and am not supposed to eat
yeast - because fungus is considered unclean. I don't eat mushrooms either.
(Yes, yeast and mushrooms belong in the same kingdom!)

-- Ruchira Datta

James THIELE

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Apr 26, 1990, 6:16:37 PM4/26/90
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In article <27...@lll-lcc.UUCP> mi...@lll-lcc.UUCP (mike hummell) writes:
>When you cut a tomato or an apple in half, it does not scream or cry out in
>pain, or bite you or try to run away. No eyes are filled with pain and terror.

It's too bad you are not sufficiently in tune with nature to understand the
hurt felt by a tomato plant when a tomato is torn from it. By the time
you cut most apples, they have been dead so long they won't make a sound.
Since vegetables have no mouths or legs your comparisons are useless.

And if you are a vegetarian because of the pain caused by slaughter,
there are ways to kill animals painlessly - the current methods are only
used due to their low cost.

>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>ARPA: mi...@spg.llnl.gov
>UUCP: { sun,lll-crg,rutgers }!lll-spg!mike
>U.S. MAIL: P.O. Box 2121; Livermore, CA. 94551-2121
>Phones: office: (415)422-3922 home: (415)449-9064
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James Thiele -- microsoft!jamesth
Go ahead and flame at me, I don't care.

Thomas Mark Swiss

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Apr 27, 1990, 7:00:44 PM4/27/90
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In article <54...@microsoft.UUCP> jam...@microsoft.UUCP (James THIELE) writes:
>In article <27...@lll-lcc.UUCP> mi...@lll-lcc.UUCP (mike hummell) writes:
>>When you cut a tomato or an apple in half, it does not scream or cry out in
>>pain, or bite you or try to run away. No eyes are filled with pain and terror.
>
>It's too bad you are not sufficiently in tune with nature to understand the
>hurt felt by a tomato plant when a tomato is torn from it. By the time
>you cut most apples, they have been dead so long they won't make a sound.
>Since vegetables have no mouths or legs your comparisons are useless.
>

They also have no nerve cells. No nerve cells => no pain.


================================================================================
Tom Swiss | "The time will come when men such as I will
fan...@wam.umd.edu |look on the murder of animals as they now look
"The truth will set you free. |on the murder of men." - Leonardo da Vinci
But first it will piss you off."| "Heisenberg wasn't certain; how can you be??"

kamale...@gmail.com

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Jul 3, 2015, 9:15:19 AM7/3/15
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Two eyes for an eye which makes new world.

aakashr...@gmail.com

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Jun 17, 2016, 12:57:15 PM6/17/16
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Yeast is a fungi and not a backteria.you can check this in web.

sakshi singh

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Jul 8, 2022, 1:36:38 AMJul 8
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