Soffit, fascia and copper guttering

[John Kuthe]

https://i.postimg.cc/BvBdpsQF/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-1.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/XJNtDhpz/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-2.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/TYSG5RpY/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-2.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/MTdJ6wCw/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-3.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/52LcHLhn/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-4.jpg

John Kuthe, Climate Anarchist, Suburban Renewalist and Vegetarian

[Pamela]

On 15:52 27 Jul 2020, John Kuthe said:
>
> https://i.postimg.cc/BvBdpsQF/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-1.jpg
> https://i.postimg.cc/XJNtDhpz/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-2.jpg
>
> https://i.postimg.cc/TYSG5RpY/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-2.jpg

Are those two air con units on the right of the photo for your house? They
seem big.


> https://i.postimg.cc/MTdJ6wCw/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-3.jpg
> https://i.postimg.cc/52LcHLhn/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-4.jpg

[John Kuthe]

3 ton 100% electric high efficiency Bryant Heat Exchanger units!

They work wonderfully! :-)

Keep this place at 76F, very nice!

John Kuthe...

[John Kuthe]

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 10:37:26 AM UTC-5, Pamela wrote:

[Ed Pawlowski]

Wow, that copper looks very nice. And expensive.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 10:37:26 AM UTC-5, Pamela wrote:
>

> > https://i.postimg.cc/TYSG5RpY/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-2.jpg
>
> Are those two air con units on the right of the photo for your house? They
> seem big.
>

You should see the heat pump sitting next to my house for the addition I
had built onto the back of my house if you think those are big.

[GM]

John, you have to understand that UK'ers/Europeans simply do not understand the US concept of air conditioning. Very few of them have A/C, it is still a rare luxury for them...as Europe increasingly heats up it will become a necessity in many places.

In checking Amazon UK even the cheapest A/C units run at least $500 - 600...a search on Amazon Germany features "swamp cooler" types of cooling devices...here in the states you can get a basic window unit for well under $200...

St. Louis has summer weather that can be described as "tropical", stifling heat and humidity are the norm...your A/C set-up is perfectly normal for your climate...

Wiki [Jun 28, 2019]: "Until now, fewer than 5 percent of all European households have air-conditioning, compared with 90 percent in the United States. But Europe's air-conditioner stock is estimated to roughly double within the next two decades, according to the International Energy Agency (IEA), as record heat becomes more frequent..."

[But fret not, "Pamela/Fat Tony" and some other foreigners here will reply to this post, claiming how "wasteful" us fat Americans are...lol...]

During the 2003 European heat wave, about 70,000 peeps died in various places, France especially was hit hard. At that time IIRC only one French hospital - the American Hospital in Paris - was wholly air - conditioned, only operating rooms had A/C, hospital patients died from the excessive heat in their rooms. I remember discussing it then on rec.travel.europe and some other places, even then many Europeans on the group were disdainful of the benefits of A/C...their standard response was along the lines of "..open a window...use a fan...we don't need any of your silly wasteful Yank aircon..."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2003_European_heat_wave

"The 2003 European heat wave led to the hottest summer on record in Europe since at least 1540. France was hit especially hard. The heat wave led to health crises in several countries and combined with drought to create a crop shortfall in parts of Southern Europe. Peer-reviewed analysis places the European death toll at more than 70,000...

In France, 14,802 heat-related deaths (mostly among the elderly) occurred during the heat wave, according to the French National Institute of Health. France does not commonly have very hot summers, particularly in the northern areas, but eight consecutive days with temperatures of more than 40 °C (104 °F) were recorded in Auxerre, Yonne in early August 2003. Because of the usually relatively mild summers, most people did not know how to react to very high temperatures (for instance, with respect to rehydration), and most single-family homes and residential facilities built in the last 50 years were not equipped with air conditioning. Furthermore, while contingency plans were made for a variety of natural and man-made catastrophes, high temperatures had rarely been considered a major hazard..."

</>

--
Best
Greg

[Bruce]

On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:12:09 -0700 (PDT), GM
<gregorymorr...@gmail.com> wrote:

>John Kuthe wrote:
>
>> On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 10:37:26 AM UTC-5, Pamela wrote:
>> > On 15:52 27 Jul 2020, John Kuthe said:
>> > >
>> > > https://i.postimg.cc/BvBdpsQF/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-1.jpg
>> > > https://i.postimg.cc/XJNtDhpz/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-2.jpg
>> > >
>> > > https://i.postimg.cc/TYSG5RpY/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-2.jpg
>> >
>> > Are those two air con units on the right of the photo for your house? They
>> > seem big.
>> >
>> >
>> > > https://i.postimg.cc/MTdJ6wCw/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-3.jpg
>> > > https://i.postimg.cc/52LcHLhn/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-4.jpg
>>
>> 3 ton 100% electric high efficiency Bryant Heat Exchanger units!
>>
>> They work wonderfully! :-)
>>
>> Keep this place at 76F, very nice!
>
>
>John, you have to understand that UK'ers/Europeans simply do not understand the US concept of air conditioning. Very few of them have A/C, it is still a rare luxury for them...as Europe increasingly heats up it will become a necessity in many places.

They all have central heating, which is far superior to an A/C unit.
But they, generally, have no cooling because it doesn't get that hot
that often.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

I can't swear to it, but most all USA homes have central heating of some
type.

The addition on the back of my house has an electric heat pump and it does
a marvelous job. The original part of the house has gas central heat and
it does a marvelous job as well. I do prefer the gas unit over the heat
pump though.

[Bruce]

On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:35:53 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"
<itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:

>On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 1:27:22 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:12:09 -0700 (PDT), GM
>> <gregorymorr...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >John, you have to understand that UK'ers/Europeans simply do not understand the US concept of air conditioning. Very few of them have A/C, it is still a rare luxury for them...as Europe increasingly heats up it will become a necessity in many places.
>>
>> They all have central heating, which is far superior to an A/C unit.
>> But they, generally, have no cooling because it doesn't get that hot
>> that often.
>>
>I can't swear to it, but most all USA homes have central heating of some
>type.

And not through an A/C unit? What I was used to before Australia, was
a radiator in each room and a central thermostat with timer in the
living room. Warm water runs through the radiators and the pipes that
connect them.

>The addition on the back of my house has an electric heat pump and it does
>a marvelous job. The original part of the house has gas central heat and
>it does a marvelous job as well. I do prefer the gas unit over the heat
>pump though.

We have a fireplace and an airco. The airco works well, but dehydrates
everything. Us and the cats. Is that like your heat pump? Gas central
heat sounds good.

[GM]

itsjoan...@webtv.net wrote:

> I can't swear to it, but most all USA homes have central heating of some
type.

In colder climes, most all do...in southern states heating systems can vary...

> The addition on the back of my house has an electric heat pump and it does
> a marvelous job. The original part of the house has gas central heat and
> it does a marvelous job as well. I do prefer the gas unit over the heat
> pump though.

America is the land where former luxuries are affordable for most everyone...this case in point being HVAC...in the past was automobiles, appliances, plumbing, etc....

--
Best
Greg

[John Kuthe]

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 1:27:22 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:

These are 3 ton Bryant Heat Pumps. They work wonderfully!

John Kuthe...

[Sheldon Martin]

Those look like like overkill for such a small house... probably very
poorly insulated and all those moocher tenants are wasteful... opening
windows and doors constantly and don't draw the blinds to keep the sun
out.

[graham]

And stupid on a house of that value. There is a house a few blocks from
me that has copper gutters, but then it is worth over 3 million bucks.

[Cindy Hamilton]

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 2:44:31 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:35:53 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"
> <itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:
>
> >On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 1:27:22 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
> >>
> >> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:12:09 -0700 (PDT), GM
> >> <gregorymorr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> >John, you have to understand that UK'ers/Europeans simply do not understand the US concept of air conditioning. Very few of them have A/C, it is still a rare luxury for them...as Europe increasingly heats up it will become a necessity in many places.
> >>
> >> They all have central heating, which is far superior to an A/C unit.
> >> But they, generally, have no cooling because it doesn't get that hot
> >> that often.
> >>
> >I can't swear to it, but most all USA homes have central heating of some
> >type.
>
> And not through an A/C unit? What I was used to before Australia, was
> a radiator in each room and a central thermostat with timer in the
> living room. Warm water runs through the radiators and the pipes that
> connect them.

It varies quite a bit. The most common arrangement in my area is gas-fired
forced-air heat that pushes warm air through ductwork to each room. It
makes for fairly dry air in the winter. Many people add a humidifier that
adds moisture to the air before it's circulated through the house.

The summer air-conditioning is an aluminum coil filled with coolant, placed atop
the air handler in the furnace. A circuit of piping carries the coolant to an
exterior compressor that exhausts the heat exchanged to the coolant on its trip
through the pipe. The coolant then circulates back to the aluminum coil where
air blowing across it is pushed to each room.

This cooling system is fairly easy to retrofit into a house that already had
forced-air heat.

Some people don't like all that moving air. I enjoy it, and the sound of
the blower in the furnace is pleasant white noise.

In other areas, the most common forms of heating and cooling are different.

Cindy Hamilton

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 1:44:31 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
>
> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:35:53 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"
> <itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:
>
> >I can't swear to it, but most all USA homes have central heating of some
> >type.
>
> And not through an A/C unit? What I was used to before Australia, was
> a radiator in each room and a central thermostat with timer in the
> living room. Warm water runs through the radiators and the pipes that
> connect them.
>

That is a steam generated heat. What I have in the original part of the
house is natural gas heat provided by a split unit. The central furnace
is in the basement, actually suspended from the floor joists. There is one
thermostat that can be set to the desired temperature I want the house to
be. When the temperature falls below what I have set the gas will come on,
and the warm out is forced through the vents in the floor into each room.
Depending how well or lack of insulation in a house will depend on how many
time the furnace will kick on.

The a/c part of this unit sits outside on a concrete pad. In the summer
I set it, like the heat, what temperature I want the house to maintain.
Not only does this cool the house it will also draw out the humidity from
the inside air making it much more comfortable.

>
> >The addition on the back of my house has an electric heat pump and it does
> >a marvelous job. The original part of the house has gas central heat and
> >it does a marvelous job as well. I do prefer the gas unit over the heat
> >pump though.
>
> We have a fireplace and an airco. The airco works well, but dehydrates
> everything. Us and the cats. Is that like your heat pump? Gas central
> heat sounds good.
>

No fireplace here. But in the wintertime, the air is naturally less humid
but the gas heat can be a bit drying. My water heater is also gas-powered
and one thing about that is IF you run out of hot water it recovers VERY
quickly. Kitchen range is also natural gas and I certainly appreciated
that when the tornado roared through here back the first of March. No
baking but I was able to use the burners for cooking. The electronic
ignition on the stove didn't work but that's one reason I keep those
long 'barbecue' lighters on hand.

https://i.postimg.cc/RZ8ycjmR/Lighter.png

[John Kuthe]

Welch Heating and Cooling in STL suggested them, and they work WONDERFULLY!

Keeps the WHOLE HOUSE at 76F at ANY heat outside! Not like the terribly undersized A/C units Dr Luo and Chinese moneyed interest did when I moved in in 2016. Those poor cheap units barely kept things below 80F And ran CONSTANTLY to do it too!

These are much cheaper to operate, being properly sized.

John Kuthe...

[Bruce]

On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 12:04:17 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
<angelica...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 2:44:31 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:35:53 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"
>> <itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:
>>
>> >On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 1:27:22 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
>> >>
>> >> They all have central heating, which is far superior to an A/C unit.
>> >> But they, generally, have no cooling because it doesn't get that hot
>> >> that often.
>> >>
>> >I can't swear to it, but most all USA homes have central heating of some
>> >type.
>>
>> And not through an A/C unit? What I was used to before Australia, was
>> a radiator in each room and a central thermostat with timer in the
>> living room. Warm water runs through the radiators and the pipes that
>> connect them.
>
>It varies quite a bit. The most common arrangement in my area is gas-fired
>forced-air heat that pushes warm air through ductwork to each room. It
>makes for fairly dry air in the winter. Many people add a humidifier that
>adds moisture to the air before it's circulated through the house.

That sounds like the Dutch system, although they're switching from gas
to electricity, for sustainability.

>The summer air-conditioning is an aluminum coil filled with coolant, placed atop
>the air handler in the furnace. A circuit of piping carries the coolant to an
>exterior compressor that exhausts the heat exchanged to the coolant on its trip
>through the pipe. The coolant then circulates back to the aluminum coil where
>air blowing across it is pushed to each room.

>This cooling system is fairly easy to retrofit into a house that already had
>forced-air heat.
>
>Some people don't like all that moving air. I enjoy it, and the sound of
>the blower in the furnace is pleasant white noise.

I don't mind the sound, just the dryness. Our cats' fur's splitting on
their backs and they're walking around with dingleberries. Actually, I
should check the one I have on my lap right now.

[Bruce]

On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 12:07:44 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"

<itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:

>On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 1:44:31 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:35:53 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"
>> <itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:
>>
>> >I can't swear to it, but most all USA homes have central heating of some
>> >type.
>>
>> And not through an A/C unit? What I was used to before Australia, was
>> a radiator in each room and a central thermostat with timer in the
>> living room. Warm water runs through the radiators and the pipes that
>> connect them.
>>
>That is a steam generated heat. What I have in the original part of the
>house is natural gas heat provided by a split unit. The central furnace
>is in the basement, actually suspended from the floor joists. There is one
>thermostat that can be set to the desired temperature I want the house to
>be. When the temperature falls below what I have set the gas will come on,
>and the warm out is forced through the vents in the floor into each room.
>Depending how well or lack of insulation in a house will depend on how many
>time the furnace will kick on.

Sounds like what I was always used to, except the heat comes through
the floor.

>The a/c part of this unit sits outside on a concrete pad. In the summer
>I set it, like the heat, what temperature I want the house to maintain.
>Not only does this cool the house it will also draw out the humidity from
>the inside air making it much more comfortable.

It gets humid here too in spring/summer autumn. Just the winters are
dry.

>> >The addition on the back of my house has an electric heat pump and it does
>> >a marvelous job. The original part of the house has gas central heat and
>> >it does a marvelous job as well. I do prefer the gas unit over the heat
>> >pump though.
>>
>> We have a fireplace and an airco. The airco works well, but dehydrates
>> everything. Us and the cats. Is that like your heat pump? Gas central
>> heat sounds good.
>>
>No fireplace here. But in the wintertime, the air is naturally less humid
>but the gas heat can be a bit drying. My water heater is also gas-powered
>and one thing about that is IF you run out of hot water it recovers VERY
>quickly. Kitchen range is also natural gas and I certainly appreciated
>that when the tornado roared through here back the first of March. No
>baking but I was able to use the burners for cooking. The electronic
>ignition on the stove didn't work but that's one reason I keep those
>long 'barbecue' lighters on hand.
>
>https://i.postimg.cc/RZ8ycjmR/Lighter.png

We got rid of gas cooking. I hated horsing around with those big gas
bottles. They were always empty after dark and hard to attach
properly.

[Bruce]

Yeah, in Europe people can't afford those things. The majority sleep
under bridges and eat frogs that they catch.

[John Kuthe]

Hell YES expensive! $113,671 worth of expensive! Copper and Stainless Steel nails, bronze caulking although I told them since all they had was white that that would be fine too! Any caulk is better than NO caulk! :-)

[Ed Pawlowski]

One of the benefits here is that the AC does dry the air as it is a
humid region. Not sure how much St. Louis is by comparison but not real
dry. John says t is 30,000 Btu and that sounds about right for a 2,000
sq. ft. house.

The heat pump just reverses how AC things work and in moderate climates
very efficient. Cold here is 40F 4.5C Heat in winter is less than $1
a day. In CT is would be 8X to 10X that for oil. Gas was not available
on my steet.

[John Kuthe]

Gas is no longer available in my house either! I had Spire Gas come out and pull the meter out! This house is 100% electric now, and ready for the 21st Century!

[Ed Pawlowski]

That would be a PITA. We had two of them in CT and once a year a tank
truck came and filled them. Here we have natural gas piped from the
street. Hot water, dryer, stove, grill. Much better.

[Ed Pawlowski]

If they cook the frogs on an electric hot plate they pay on average 50%
more than the US. Germany is about 3X what I pay in FL
Turkmenistan citizens get free electric, water, gas.

[Bruce]

On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 16:19:14 -0400, Ed Pawlowski <e...@snet.xxx> wrote:

>On 7/27/2020 2:44 PM, Bruce wrote:
>> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:35:53 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"
>> <itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:
>>
>>> I can't swear to it, but most all USA homes have central heating of some
>>> type.
>>
>> And not through an A/C unit? What I was used to before Australia, was
>> a radiator in each room and a central thermostat with timer in the
>> living room. Warm water runs through the radiators and the pipes that
>> connect them.
>>
>>> The addition on the back of my house has an electric heat pump and it does
>>> a marvelous job. The original part of the house has gas central heat and
>>> it does a marvelous job as well. I do prefer the gas unit over the heat
>>> pump though.
>>
>> We have a fireplace and an airco. The airco works well, but dehydrates
>> everything. Us and the cats. Is that like your heat pump? Gas central
>> heat sounds good.
>>
>One of the benefits here is that the AC does dry the air as it is a
>humid region. Not sure how much St. Louis is by comparison but not real
>dry. John says t is 30,000 Btu and that sounds about right for a 2,000
>sq. ft. house.

It's humid here too most of the time, but not in winter.

>The heat pump just reverses how AC things work and in moderate climates
>very efficient. Cold here is 40F 4.5C Heat in winter is less than $1
>a day. In CT is would be 8X to 10X that for oil. Gas was not available
>on my steet.

Here neither. We're also not connected to sewage or water.

[GM]

STL is an absolute sweat box in the summer...no large bodies of water (a la the Great Lakes or the Gulf...) to provide some wafting breezes on hot days...it's also somewhat in a river valley...the A/C season in STL can last from March until October...

> The heat pump just reverses how AC things work and in moderate climates
> very efficient. Cold here is 40F 4.5C Heat in winter is less than $1
> a day. In CT is would be 8X to 10X that for oil. Gas was not available
> on my steet.

Heat pumps are good for your particular area, they do the job...

--
Best
Greg

[Bruce]

They can't afford electricity. They eat the frogs raw. Greg Sorrow has
the details.

[Sheldon Martin]

Could have had perfectly sufficient aluminum gutters for about $600.
And your copper gutters look like small capacity, during a heavy rain
will likely overflow. Your copper gutters are tantamount to an
undersized bra... like squeezing a D cup woman into a B cup bra.

[John Kuthe]

But they would not be traditional! And they are NOT undersized, just not installed yet!

John Kuthe...

[Hank Rogers]

John Kuthe wrote:
> On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 10:37:26 AM UTC-5, Pamela wrote:

>> On 15:52 27 Jul 2020, John Kuthe said:
>>>

>>> https://i.postimg.cc/BvBdpsQF/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-1.jpg
>>> https://i.postimg.cc/XJNtDhpz/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-2.jpg
>>>
>>> https://i.postimg.cc/TYSG5RpY/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-2.jpg
>>

>> Are those two air con units on the right of the photo for your house? They
>> seem big.
>>
>>

>>> https://i.postimg.cc/MTdJ6wCw/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-3.jpg
>>> https://i.postimg.cc/52LcHLhn/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-4.jpg
>
> 3 ton 100% electric high efficiency Bryant Heat Exchanger units!
>
> They work wonderfully! :-)
>
> Keep this place at 76F, very nice!
>

> John Kuthe...
>

3 ton 100% coal fired electric high efficiency Bryant Heat
Exchanger units are the best of the best!

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

Just get a humidifier and be done with the split ends.

[Hank Rogers]

Popeye, do they make special bras for wimmens with long thick
leathery nipples?

[Hank Rogers]

Was yoose peeping at his male tenants again Popeye?

[Hank Rogers]

I bet they left the pipe to the main buried in your yard. You're
not free from evil gas completely yet.

[Bruce]

We have one, but never use it. Might be a good idea.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 2:43:44 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
>
> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 12:07:44 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"
> <itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:
>
> Sounds like what I was always used to, except the heat comes through
> the floor.
>

The does come through the floor, sorta, it is delivered by vents in each
room.

>
> >> >The addition on the back of my house has an electric heat pump and it does
> >> >a marvelous job. The original part of the house has gas central heat and
> >> >it does a marvelous job as well. I do prefer the gas unit over the heat
> >> >pump though.
> >>

> >No fireplace here. But in the wintertime, the air is naturally less humid
> >but the gas heat can be a bit drying. My water heater is also gas-powered
> >and one thing about that is IF you run out of hot water it recovers VERY
> >quickly. Kitchen range is also natural gas and I certainly appreciated
> >that when the tornado roared through here back the first of March. No
> >baking but I was able to use the burners for cooking. The electronic
> >ignition on the stove didn't work but that's one reason I keep those
> >long 'barbecue' lighters on hand.
>

> We got rid of gas cooking. I hated horsing around with those big gas
> bottles. They were always empty after dark and hard to attach
> properly.
>

No gas bottles here. Natural gas is delivered through gas pipes through
a network underground, much like water pipes.

About 25 years ago the local gas company was going to lay new pipes down
my street. I saw the bright yellow arrows painted on the asphalt but saw
in front of my house there was a ?. At the time I didn't know what all
the yellow markings were for until there was no gas heat.

I placed a call and one of the service guys came out and said they didn't
know if I had gas heat or not since my meter was under the house. I bit
my tongue and refrained from asking what the hell do you think I've been
paying money to y'all for each month? He says I'll have you some heat in
just a few minutes and have a truck bring some tanks. I'm thinking those
small propane tanks used for gas grills but nope, what a surprise! A huge
truck shows up with boom on the back and neatly sits down a 'milk crate' of about 8 cylinders about the size of 5 or 6 feet tall acetylene tanks in my
front yard. After I saw those large cylinders and that heavy steel crate
my fears of someone heisting those tanks disappeared.

They showed up next week and removed the old gas meter from the basement
and installed a new one outside, next to the house.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 3:19:19 PM UTC-5, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>

> The heat pump just reverses how AC things work and in moderate climates
> very efficient. Cold here is 40F 4.5C Heat in winter is less than $1
> a day. In CT is would be 8X to 10X that for oil. Gas was not available
> on my steet.
>

The heat pump for the back of the house has performed quite well for a
heat pump, always warm back there. But it does have the switch for
'emergency heat' in case it drops below zero.

My gripe is the numerous repairs I've had to have done to it since the
day it was installed. I believe it fell off the assembly line so to
speak.

[Bruce]

Why do you need those tanks if you're connected to the city's gas pipe
system?

>They showed up next week and removed the old gas meter from the basement
>and installed a new one outside, next to the house.

It's too rural here to be connected to city gas. There's no sewer, no
water and we're on the edge for garbage retrieval. On the plus side, I
see more kangaroos than people.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 5:20:06 PM UTC-5, Hank Rogers wrote:

>
> John Kuthe wrote:
> >
> > Gas is no longer available in my house either! I had Spire Gas come out and pull the meter out! This house is 100% electric now, and ready for the 21st Century!
> >
> > John Kuthe, Climate Anarchist, Suburban Renewalist and Vegetarian
> >
>
> I bet they left the pipe to the main buried in your yard. You're
> not free from evil gas completely yet.
>

Yep, all they did was remove the meter and cap that pipe.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

It's good for your wood furniture, too.

[John Kuthe]

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 5:36:16 PM UTC-5, itsjoan...@webtv.net wrote:
> On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 3:19:19 PM UTC-5, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> >
> > The heat pump just reverses how AC things work and in moderate climates
> > very efficient. Cold here is 40F 4.5C Heat in winter is less than $1
> > a day. In CT is would be 8X to 10X that for oil. Gas was not available
> > on my steet.
> >
> The heat pump for the back of the house has performed quite well for a
> heat pump, always warm back there. But it does have the switch for
> 'emergency heat' in case it drops below zero.

Yeah, my first floor heat pump has a switch for electric "emergency heat" but not the one on the second floor, I think for obvious reasons. Heat rises!

John Kuthe...

[Bruce]

Doesn't that make him gas-free?

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 5:46:25 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
>
> Why do you need those tanks if you're connected to the city's gas pipe
> system?
>

I only needed them for the weekend. They had shut off the gas completely
to my house and it was late winter/early spring and I didn't need much
heat but I needed it and for the water heater as well.

At the time I was cooking with a flat top electric stove so gas was not
needed for that.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 5:53:01 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
>
> Doesn't that make him gas-free?
>

He's gas-free as far as not using it for fuel but it's still available
contrary to what he says or believes. Those gas pipes are still underground
in his yard.

[John Kuthe]

And removed the $20/mo usage fee on my bill! Even when we used ZERO gas!

John Kuthe...

[Alex]

John Kuthe wrote:

> On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 1:52:45 PM UTC-5, Sheldon wrote:
>> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 10:49:11 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"

>> <itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:
>>
>>> On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 10:37:26 AM UTC-5, Pamela wrote:
>>>>> https://i.postimg.cc/TYSG5RpY/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-2.jpg
>>>> Are those two air con units on the right of the photo for your house? They
>>>> seem big.
>>>>
>>> You should see the heat pump sitting next to my house for the addition I
>>> had built onto the back of my house if you think those are big.
>> Those look like like overkill for such a small house... probably very
>> poorly insulated and all those moocher tenants are wasteful... opening
>> windows and doors constantly and don't draw the blinds to keep the sun
>> out.

> Welch Heating and Cooling in STL suggested them, and they work WONDERFULLY!
>
> Keeps the WHOLE HOUSE at 76F at ANY heat outside! Not like the terribly undersized A/C units Dr Luo and Chinese moneyed interest did when I moved in in 2016. Those poor cheap units barely kept things below 80F And ran CONSTANTLY to do it too!
>
> These are much cheaper to operate, being properly sized.
>
> John Kuthe...

A single 5 ton does fine here in S. FL for 3000 square feet.  It's a 22
seer so it's about as efficient as you can get.

[Alex]

John Kuthe wrote:
> On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 12:41:13 PM UTC-5, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> On 7/27/2020 10:52 AM, John Kuthe wrote:
>>> https://i.postimg.cc/BvBdpsQF/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-1.jpg
>>> https://i.postimg.cc/XJNtDhpz/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-2.jpg
>>>
>>> https://i.postimg.cc/TYSG5RpY/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-2.jpg
>>> https://i.postimg.cc/MTdJ6wCw/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-3.jpg
>>> https://i.postimg.cc/52LcHLhn/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-4.jpg
>>>

>>> John Kuthe, Climate Anarchist, Suburban Renewalist and Vegetarian
>>>

>> Wow, that copper looks very nice. And expensive.
> Hell YES expensive! $113,671 worth of expensive! Copper and Stainless Steel nails, bronze caulking although I told them since all they had was white that that would be fine too! Any caulk is better than NO caulk! :-)
>

> John Kuthe, Climate Anarchist, Suburban Renewalist and Vegetarian

That's just dumb.  Is Home Depot closed?

[John Kuthe]

Of course they are. But not connected to or delivering gas to anything here!

John Kuthe...

[Bruce]

On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 15:49:14 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"

<itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:

>On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 5:22:10 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 15:11:19 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"
>> <itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:
>>
>> >Just get a humidifier and be done with the split ends.
>>
>> We have one, but never use it. Might be a good idea.
>>
>It's good for your wood furniture, too.

I found this in a cupboard:
<https://www.amcal.com.au/medescan-rainbow-mist-humidifier-p-9352570000074>

[Bruce]

Oh, I understand.

[Alex]

John Kuthe wrote:
> https://i.postimg.cc/BvBdpsQF/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-1.jpg
> https://i.postimg.cc/XJNtDhpz/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-2.jpg
>
> https://i.postimg.cc/TYSG5RpY/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-2.jpg
> https://i.postimg.cc/MTdJ6wCw/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-3.jpg
> https://i.postimg.cc/52LcHLhn/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-4.jpg
>
> John Kuthe, Climate Anarchist, Suburban Renewalist and Vegetarian

How in the hell did they get that big truck back to your garage without
crashing into your house?

[John Kuthe]

Depends on the airflow between the floors. This house does not have good airflow between the floors.

John Kuthe...

[Hank Rogers]

Spire gas co. still has their crap on your property.

Only solution is dig it up and remove it.

[John Kuthe]

I don't care. It delivers NO gas.

John Kuthe...

[John Kuthe]

I hit my house ONCE! Give it a rest!

John Kuthe...

[Hank Rogers]

And even then, it was the neighbor's fault. Remember?

[Bruce]

They'll never ever give it a rest. They'll perpetuate every little
morsel you give them. They're trying to fill the vacuum that is their
life. In vain.

[Ed Pawlowski]

That big plate of broccoli he had would give him plenty of gas.

[Sqwertz]

On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 07:52:39 -0700 (PDT), John Kuthe wrote:

> https://i.postimg.cc/BvBdpsQF/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-1.jpg
> https://i.postimg.cc/XJNtDhpz/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-2.jpg
>
> https://i.postimg.cc/TYSG5RpY/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-2.jpg
> https://i.postimg.cc/MTdJ6wCw/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-3.jpg
> https://i.postimg.cc/52LcHLhn/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-4.jpg
>

> John Kuthe, Climate Anarchist, Suburban Renewalist and Vegetarian

Whoever roll-formed those fucked up.

-sw

[Bruce]

I thought Hank would make that connection, but you beat him to it.

[S Viemeister]

On 27/07/2020 20:43, Bruce wrote:

> We got rid of gas cooking. I hated horsing around with those big gas
> bottles. They were always empty after dark and hard to attach
> properly.
>

We use bottled gas for the hob/cooktop, because when the power goes out
we can still cook, and heat water (we have a very large kettle). We have
two canisters, with an automatic switchover. A red flag pops up on the
empty one, giving us plenty of time to arrange for replacing it.

[Pamela]

On 19:12 27 Jul 2020, GM said:

> John Kuthe wrote:
>
>> On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 10:37:26 AM UTC-5, Pamela wrote:

>> > On 15:52 27 Jul 2020, John Kuthe said:
>> > >
>> > > https://i.postimg.cc/BvBdpsQF/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-1.jpg
>> > > https://i.postimg.cc/XJNtDhpz/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-2.jpg
>> > >
>> > > https://i.postimg.cc/TYSG5RpY/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-2.jpg
>> >

>> > Are those two air con units on the right of the photo for your house?
>> > They seem big.
>> >
>> >

>> > > https://i.postimg.cc/MTdJ6wCw/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-3.jpg
>> > > https://i.postimg.cc/52LcHLhn/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-4.jpg
>>
>> 3 ton 100% electric high efficiency Bryant Heat Exchanger units!
>>
>> They work wonderfully! :-)
>>
>> Keep this place at 76F, very nice!
>
>
> John, you have to understand that UK'ers/Europeans simply do not
> understand the US concept of air conditioning. Very few of them have
> A/C, it is still a rare luxury for them...as Europe increasingly heats
> up it will become a necessity in many places.

Hi Greg, I have lived in north Texas but never seen such large coolers for
domestic AC a John's. They look impressive and I think he's very lucky.

Actually I have two-part AC in some rooms here in the UK because I don't
tolerate heat well which is why John's units caught my eye. The one's I have
here are weedy by comparison.

> [But fret not, "Pamela/Fat Tony" and some other foreigners here will
> reply to this post, claiming how "wasteful" us fat Americans
> are...lol...]

There's no point propagating Ophelia's misunderstanding about Fat Tony.
Call me Fat Pammy, Fat Mary, Fat Jordan or whatever you like -- but I'm
not Fat Tony.

> During the 2003 European heat wave, about 70,000 peeps died in various
> places, France especially was hit hard. At that time IIRC only one
> French hospital - the American Hospital in Paris - was wholly air -
> conditioned, only operating rooms had A/C, hospital patients died from
> the excessive heat in their rooms. I remember discussing it then on
> rec.travel.europe and some other places, even then many Europeans on the
> group were disdainful of the benefits of A/C...their standard response
> was along the lines of "..open a window...use a fan...we don't need any
> of your silly wasteful Yank aircon..."
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2003_European_heat_wave

Very many French people have a fundamental belief that AC is particularly
unhealthy and refuse to contemplate it. Tant pis.

[Pamela]

On 19:51 27 Jul 2020, John Kuthe said:

> On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 1:27:22 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:

>> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:12:09 -0700 (PDT), GM
>> <gregorymorr...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >John Kuthe wrote:
>> >
>> >> On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 10:37:26 AM UTC-5, Pamela wrote:
>> >> > On 15:52 27 Jul 2020, John Kuthe said:
>> >> > >
>> >> > > https://i.postimg.cc/BvBdpsQF/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-1.jpg
>> >> > > https://i.postimg.cc/XJNtDhpz/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-2.jpg
>> >> > >
>> >> > > https://i.postimg.cc/TYSG5RpY/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-2.jpg
>> >> >
>> >> > Are those two air con units on the right of the photo for your
>> >> > house? They seem big.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > > https://i.postimg.cc/MTdJ6wCw/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-3.jpg
>> >> > > https://i.postimg.cc/52LcHLhn/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-4.jpg
>> >>
>> >> 3 ton 100% electric high efficiency Bryant Heat Exchanger units!
>> >>
>> >> They work wonderfully! :-)
>> >>
>> >> Keep this place at 76F, very nice!
>> >
>> >
>> >John, you have to understand that UK'ers/Europeans simply do not
>> >understand the US concept of air conditioning. Very few of them have
>> >A/C, it is still a rare luxury for them...as Europe increasingly heats
>> >up it will become a necessity in many places.
>>

>> They all have central heating, which is far superior to an A/C unit.
>> But they, generally, have no cooling because it doesn't get that hot
>> that often.
>
> These are 3 ton Bryant Heat Pumps. They work wonderfully!
>
> John Kuthe...

Lucky you. Apart from the 1960's basement, thats the best thing I've seen
in your house. Did you need extras air seals on your old-style doors and
windows?

[Pamela]

On 20:43 27 Jul 2020, Bruce said:

> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 12:07:44 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"

> <itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:
>
>>On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 1:44:31 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
>>>
>>> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:35:53 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"
>>> <itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> >I can't swear to it, but most all USA homes have central heating of
>>> >some type.
>>>
>>> And not through an A/C unit? What I was used to before Australia, was
>>> a radiator in each room and a central thermostat with timer in the
>>> living room. Warm water runs through the radiators and the pipes that
>>> connect them.
>>>
>>That is a steam generated heat. What I have in the original part of the
>>house is natural gas heat provided by a split unit. The central furnace
>>is in the basement, actually suspended from the floor joists. There is
>>one thermostat that can be set to the desired temperature I want the
>>house to be. When the temperature falls below what I have set the gas
>>will come on, and the warm out is forced through the vents in the floor
>>into each room. Depending how well or lack of insulation in a house will
>>depend on how many time the furnace will kick on.
>
> Sounds like what I was always used to, except the heat comes through
> the floor.
>
>>The a/c part of this unit sits outside on a concrete pad. In the summer
>>I set it, like the heat, what temperature I want the house to maintain.
>>Not only does this cool the house it will also draw out the humidity
>>from the inside air making it much more comfortable.
>
> It gets humid here too in spring/summer autumn. Just the winters are
> dry.

My friends in Perth say it get terribly hot. Where are you? Some parts of
the Eastern Ozzie states must get hot too.

[Janet]

In article <fa80f2c9-dc3c-44ec...@googlegroups.com>,
johnk...@gmail.com says...

>
> On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 12:41:13 PM UTC-5, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

> > Wow, that copper looks very nice. And expensive.
>
> Hell YES expensive! $113,671 worth of expensive! Copper and Stainless Steel nails, bronze caulking although
I told them since all they had was white that that would be fine too!
Any caulk is better than NO caulk! :-)

You were suckered, again.

Janet UK

[Dave Smith]

I am not a huge fan of home air conditioning. We have central air in our
house but I rarely use it. We have lots of trees around the house that
keep it shaded and it rarely becomes unbearably hot, I did have it on
for three days last week, and that could be close to a record for a summer.

[Ophelia]

"Bruce" wrote in message news:nr7uhf1l2flsordo7...@4ax.com...

On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:35:53 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"

<itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:

>On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 1:27:22 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:12:09 -0700 (PDT), GM
>> <gregorymorr...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>

>> >John, you have to understand that UK'ers/Europeans simply do not
>> >understand the US concept of air conditioning. Very few of them have
>> >A/C, it is still a rare luxury for them...as Europe increasingly heats
>> >up it will become a necessity in many places.

Not All Uk'ers Greg! I have lived in hot countries over the years.

>> They all have central heating, which is far superior to an A/C unit.
>> But they, generally, have no cooling because it doesn't get that hot
>> that often.
>>

>I can't swear to it, but most all USA homes have central heating of some
>type.

And not through an A/C unit? What I was used to before Australia, was
a radiator in each room and a central thermostat with timer in the
living room. Warm water runs through the radiators and the pipes that
connect them.

>The addition on the back of my house has an electric heat pump and it does
>a marvelous job. The original part of the house has gas central heat and
>it does a marvelous job as well. I do prefer the gas unit over the heat
>pump though.

We have a fireplace and an airco. The airco works well, but dehydrates
everything. Us and the cats. Is that like your heat pump? Gas central
heat sounds good.


We have gas central heating now, in Scotland:)

[dsi1]

A heat pump is exactly like your airco, which consists of a pump, refrigerant, and evaporator and condenser liquid to air heat exchangers. You use your airco for cooling, heat pumps will typically be used for heating.

Our condo uses heat pumps to heat water. Ideally, our system should be used for air conditioning and heating water since there is a need for both. That's not the case and cold air is ducted into the parking lot. When it's hot you can see dogs and humans standing/sitting next to the vents.

[Bruce]

On Tue, 28 Jul 2020 13:19:23 +0100, Pamela <pamela...@gmail.com>
wrote:

I'm on the east side. Summers are generally in the 30s and humid. It
gets hotter up north.

[Bruce]

On Tue, 28 Jul 2020 18:36:31 +0100, "Ophelia" <oph...@elsinore.me.uk>
wrote:

Central heating is the best, I think.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 2:48:11 AM UTC-5, S Viemeister wrote:
>
> We use bottled gas for the hob/cooktop, because when the power goes out
> we can still cook, and heat water (we have a very large kettle). We have
> two canisters, with an automatic switchover. A red flag pops up on the
> empty one, giving us plenty of time to arrange for replacing it.
>

These bottles of gas that you and Bruce speak of have me a bit confused.
Here, if you don't have natural gas delivered to you by underground pipes
then your option is propane. Sheldon has that but they are quite large
above-ground tanks only needing to be refilled once or twice per year.

Can y'all post a picture of what you are speaking of so I can grasp
this a bit better, please?

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 10:54:10 AM UTC-5, Dave Smith wrote:
>
> I am not a huge fan of home air conditioning. We have central air in our
> house but I rarely use it. We have lots of trees around the house that
> keep it shaded and it rarely becomes unbearably hot, I did have it on
> for three days last week, and that could be close to a record for a summer.
>

Although my neighborhood has many old, old trees my house is not shaded
by any except the crappy hackberry across the alley in the neighbors'
yard on the western side of the house. But presently it is 94°F here
and no clouds; the house would be unbearable without a/c even though it
is well insulated. Before Gary rushes in and tells me to fling open my
windows it would be for naught as there is no breeze. And if there were
it would feel like all I had done is open the oven door after baking.

[Bruce]

Something like in the first two rows:
<https://www.bunnings.com.au/our-range/outdoor-living/barbecue/accessories/gas-bottles>

[Ophelia]

"Bruce" wrote in message news:l9s0iflqc2mkaaa0h...@4ax.com...

===

It keeps us warm in winter!

[Bruce]

Sounds like my kinda climate.

[Ophelia]

"dsi1" wrote in message
news:33c6a624-8882-4296...@googlegroups.com...

====

Ooops!!! No! Our heating is not gas .... it's oil!!!! It seems to work
the same as it did when we had gas:)))) Sorry!!!

[Bruce]

On Tue, 28 Jul 2020 20:01:48 +0100, "Ophelia" <oph...@elsinore.me.uk>

wrote:

>
>
>"Bruce" wrote in message news:l9s0iflqc2mkaaa0h...@4ax.com...
>
>On Tue, 28 Jul 2020 18:36:31 +0100, "Ophelia" <oph...@elsinore.me.uk>
>wrote:
>
>>"Bruce" wrote in message
>>news:nr7uhf1l2flsordo7...@4ax.com...
>>
>>On Mon, 27 Jul 2020 11:35:53 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"
>><itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:
>>
>>>The addition on the back of my house has an electric heat pump and it does
>>>a marvelous job. The original part of the house has gas central heat and
>>>it does a marvelous job as well. I do prefer the gas unit over the heat
>>>pump though.
>>
>>We have a fireplace and an airco. The airco works well, but dehydrates
>>everything. Us and the cats. Is that like your heat pump? Gas central
>>heat sounds good.
>>
>>
>> We have gas central heating now, in Scotland:)
>
>Central heating is the best, I think.
>
>===
>
> It keeps us warm in winter!

We'd set it to 15C overnight and 20C during the day and not think
about it much for 9 months.

[Cindy Hamilton]

Ah. That's what we would call a 20-pound tank. It holds about 10 kilos (or
a little less) of liquefied propane?

When we bought our house, it had a 500-gallon propane tank:

<http://www.missiongas.com/500gallontank.htm>

That's more typical for cold-climate heating needs.

Cindy Hamilton

[Bruce]

On Tue, 28 Jul 2020 12:18:01 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
<angelica...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 3:01:20 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> On Tue, 28 Jul 2020 11:44:16 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"
>> <itsjoan...@webtv.net> wrote:
>>
>> >On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 2:48:11 AM UTC-5, S Viemeister wrote:
>> >>
>> >> We use bottled gas for the hob/cooktop, because when the power goes out
>> >> we can still cook, and heat water (we have a very large kettle). We have
>> >> two canisters, with an automatic switchover. A red flag pops up on the
>> >> empty one, giving us plenty of time to arrange for replacing it.
>> >>
>> >These bottles of gas that you and Bruce speak of have me a bit confused.
>> >Here, if you don't have natural gas delivered to you by underground pipes
>> >then your option is propane. Sheldon has that but they are quite large
>> >above-ground tanks only needing to be refilled once or twice per year.
>> >
>> >Can y'all post a picture of what you are speaking of so I can grasp
>> >this a bit better, please?
>>
>> Something like in the first two rows:
>> <https://www.bunnings.com.au/our-range/outdoor-living/barbecue/accessories/gas-bottles>
>
>Ah. That's what we would call a 20-pound tank. It holds about 10 kilos (or
>a little less) of liquefied propane?

"A 9kg gas bottle is considered the standard size BBQ gas bottle and
is roughly equivalent to a 20 lb propane tank."

I think we had one of those with a spare standing by. With a
connection against an outer wall of the house. It worked, but
electricity is easier.

>When we bought our house, it had a 500-gallon propane tank:
>
><http://www.missiongas.com/500gallontank.htm>
>
>That's more typical for cold-climate heating needs.

I never see anybody with a beast like that. Maybe it's also used for
heating.

[Ed Pawlowski]

We had two 100# like this.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Worthington-Pro-Grade-100-lb-Empty-Propane-Cylinder-303953/202034849
Piped together, a truck would come to fill them once a year for
cooking. You can get much larger too if you heat with propane.

[Ophelia]

"Bruce" wrote in message news:b6u0if18pr62ah9pr...@4ax.com...

===

Yep!

[dsi1]

Double oops. I assumed that "airco" was Brit for air conditioning i.e., cooling. Heat pumps can also be used for heating too. Running an electric pump to heat stuff up is more efficient than running current through a wire to heat it up. OTOH, a piece of resistance wire is a lot cheaper than an electric motor, pump, and heat exchangers.

[Ophelia]

"dsi1" wrote in message
news:3de691bb-1182-4d73...@googlegroups.com...

===

Okiedokie :)))

[Sheldon Martin]

Propane tanks can be installed underground too... ask your propane
company for suggestions for your situation.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

Ooooooooh ok! Those are the size that most people use for outdoor gas
grills and some of the teardrop trailers. I can't speak for everyone
in the USA that uses propane but generally, this picture below is the
type they use and this would be similar to what Sheldon has. I don't
know how many pounds his holds but here's a picture of what you normally
see when homes use propane for cooking and water heaters.

https://i.postimg.cc/Ghx2FzY8/Propane-Tank.jpg

[Bruce]

On Tue, 28 Jul 2020 14:05:37 -0700 (PDT), "itsjoan...@webtv.net"

LOL, yes those are complete submarines. You can probably get them here
too, but that was not the setup the previous owner had. Those small
gas bottles lasted us a few months because we only used them to cook
with.

[Alex]

Hank Rogers wrote:
> John Kuthe wrote:
>> On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 6:04:06 PM UTC-5, Alex wrote:

>>> John Kuthe wrote:
>>>> https://i.postimg.cc/BvBdpsQF/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-1.jpg
>>>> https://i.postimg.cc/XJNtDhpz/7-27-2020-Soffit-fascia-2.jpg
>>>>
>>>> https://i.postimg.cc/TYSG5RpY/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-2.jpg

>>>> https://i.postimg.cc/MTdJ6wCw/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-3.jpg
>>>> https://i.postimg.cc/52LcHLhn/7-27-2020-Copper-Gutters-4.jpg
>>>>
>>>> John Kuthe, Climate Anarchist, Suburban Renewalist and Vegetarian
>>>
>>> How in the hell did they get that big truck back to your garage without
>>> crashing into your house?
>>
>> I hit my house ONCE! Give it a rest!
>>
>> John Kuthe...
>>
>
> And even then, it was the neighbor's fault. Remember?
>
>

Of course it was their fault.

[S Viemeister]

On 28/07/2020 18:36, Ophelia wrote:
> "Bruce"  wrote in message

> We have a fireplace and an airco. The airco works well, but dehydrates
> everything. Us and the cats. Is that like your heat pump? Gas central
> heat sounds good.
>
>
>     We have  gas central heating now, in Scotland:)
>

No chance of that, up here. We have a 2500 litre oil tank.

[S Viemeister]

<https://www.calor.co.uk/gas-bottles/which-bottle-do-i-need/domestic-indoor-cooking>

We have a pair of the 19 kg ones. They're just for the hob/stovetop. The
ovens are electric, the heat and hot water are oil, and we have a
fireplace, too.

[dsi1]

I'm looking for a cheap-ass Asian butane stove that uses 8 0z cans of fuel. As an added bonus they come with a plastic carrying case. I'm expecting it'll be handy when a big hurricane hits and our electricity cuts our for a day or so.

https://www.webstaurantstore.com/choice-green-1-burner-high-performance-butane-countertop-range-portable-stove-with-brass-burner-8-000-btu/472BR1800GN.html

[Ophelia]

"S Viemeister" wrote in message news:hocnhq...@mid.individual.net...

On 28/07/2020 18:36, Ophelia wrote:

> "Bruce"Â wrote in message

> We have a fireplace and an airco. The airco works well, but dehydrates
> everything. Us and the cats. Is that like your heat pump? Gas central
> heat sounds good.
>
>

>    We have gas central heating now, in Scotland:)

>
No chance of that, up here. We have a 2500 litre oil tank.

===

LOL Yep!!!! I was dreaming LOL Sorry

[Ophelia]

"S Viemeister" wrote in message news:hocodi...@mid.individual.net...

====

Yep, but not a fireplace any more. I have asthma so can't deal with it:(

[S Viemeister]

Perhaps someday you could put in a glass-fronted woodburner?

[Gary]

Nothing to see here, move along. Even Gary doesn't open his
windows
when it's 94f and no wind.

[Gary]

"itsjoan...@webtv.net" wrote:
> https://i.postimg.cc/Ghx2FzY8/Propane-Tank.jpg

Back in the mid 1970's, I lived in a place that had a propane
tank for stove only. Maybe 100lbs? It was the size and
shape of a large (about 4' high) scuba tank.

[Ophelia]

"S Viemeister" wrote in message news:hod2ig...@mid.individual.net...

On 29/07/2020 10:05, Ophelia wrote:

> "S Viemeister"Â wrote in message news:hocodi...@mid.individual.net...

> On 28/07/2020 19:44, itsjoan...@webtv.net wrote:
>> Can y'all post a picture of what you are speaking of so I can grasp
>> this a bit better, please?
>>
> <https://www.calor.co.uk/gas-bottles/which-bottle-do-i-need/domestic-indoor-cooking>
> We have a pair of the 19 kg ones. They're just for the hob/stovetop. The
> ovens are electric, the heat and hot water are oil, and we have a
> fireplace, too.
>
> ====
>

>  Yep, but not a fireplace any more. I have asthma so can't deal with

> it:(
>
>
Perhaps someday you could put in a glass-fronted woodburner?

===

I don't know what that is, but I will certainly look at it! Thanks:)

[Ophelia]

"dsi1" wrote in message
news:4996ab8f-d6be-4610...@googlegroups.com...

====

I have one that looks exactly like that:))) I works great:)))

[Bruce]

On Wed, 29 Jul 2020 15:25:56 +0100, "Ophelia" <oph...@elsinore.me.uk>
wrote:

This type is common in Australia, in a few sizes:
<https://da28rauy2a860.cloudfront.net/completehome/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/22182302/Jindara1.jpg>

The fire and the smoke are behind glass, except when you have to open
the door, of course.

[dsi1]

The way I figure it, one of those cheap stoves will come in handy when the power goes off. Hopefully, my wok will fit that thing.