OT: translation

[Bryan Simmons]

I was looking at a hotel's website. The hotel is in Guadalajara,
so I had the translation thing on. It translated "shower" as
"watering can."
https://www.flickr.com/photos/15522299@N08/51852128878/in/dateposted-public/

--Bryan

[Hector]

Since we're talking about a hotel in your price range, that's probably
correct.

[Harry]

Uhm Yes. Ghe Ghe Ghe :)))))))))))

[Bryan Simmons]

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Hotel_Review-g150798-d8742264-Reviews-Hotel_Y_Tu-Guadalajara_Guadalajara_Metropolitan_Area.html

--Bryan

[Gary]

Would be funny if you checked in to that hotel, went into the bathroom
and found a watering can hung on a hook over the tub.

[Bryan Simmons]

That would be among the best moments of my life.

--Bryan

[Thomas Joseph]

Translations are interesting. I mentioned before in this group that as a kid I got into reading lots of French short story writers and I liked them all. "Man, these French guys write good", I remember thinking. Then I got into reading Russian guys and other writers from non-English speaking countries, and I liked them all. Their writing was easy to read - the hallmark of good writing I believe. Then I realized one day it was the translations I liked more than the actual writing. It had to be. I'm picturing "watering can" coming up in context in a story, I'll bet it would fit in real nice. I always thought it would be interesting to write something short, then have it translated into another language by a profession, then back again to English by a second translator who knows nothing of the first. I'll be whatever you write will be improved by the simplicity of the translation. I don't know this for a fact, but I'll bet top translators err on the side of simple instead of digging around for too many words.

"It was a hot day in June. I stepped into the watering can and let it rain down cold. Getting enervated for a day of hard work in the fields of fruit."

[Mike Duffy]

On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 07:57:13 -0800, Thomas Joseph wrote:


> I don't know this for a fact, but I'll bet top translators err on
> the side of simple instead of digging around for too many words.

For google translations, (the 'top' translator worldwide), someone at
Google could probably tell you quantitatively exactly how much the err is
based on the change in Shannon entropy.

It would not be exact though, when you consider that many individuals can
generate a lot of words without conveying much information.

Maybe I should write a script to calculate the Shannon entropy of the
posters here, to see who is being semantically precise, and who is just
going on and on with big-sounding words.

[Thomas Joseph]

I know one thing for a fact, I found the writing of those non English speaking authors easier to take than stuff written in original English. That can't be coincidence, not totally anyway. So I'd call it fact even though I suppose officially it's just opinion. It would be interesting. An expensive hobby, having one's stuff double-translated by pro translators that don't know each other. The editing would be great. I am not a writer. I suppose anybody who can sling words together can be called a writer, so I'll take that back - I am a writer. But I do ramble. I have trouble getting to the point, usually because there is none. But I do believe having one's stuff translated is a good way to have it edited and improved at the same time.

"Pare it down - or better yet, don't read it at all." - Gandhi, 1921

[Dave Smith]

On 2022-01-31 10:57 a.m., Thomas Joseph wrote:
> bryang...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I was looking at a hotel's website. The hotel is in Guadalajara, so
>> I had the translation thing on. It translated "shower" as "watering
>> can."
>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/15522299@N08/51852128878/in/dateposted-public/
>
>>
>
> Translations are interesting. I mentioned before in this group that
> as a kid I got into reading lots of French short story writers and I
> liked them all. "Man, these French guys write good", I remember
> thinking. Then I got into reading Russian guys and other writers
> from non-English speaking countries, and I liked them all. Their
> writing was easy to read - the hallmark of good writing I believe.
> Then I realized one day it was the translations I liked more than the
> actual writing. It had to be. I'm picturing "watering can" coming
> up in context in a story, I'll bet it would fit in real nice. I
> always thought it would be interesting to write something short, then
> have it translated into another language by a profession, then back
> again to English by a second translator who knows nothing of the
> first. I'll be whatever you write will be improved by the simplicity
> of the translation. I don't know this for a fact, but I'll bet top
> translators err on the side of simple instead of digging around for
> too many words.

I am assuming that, unless you are reading them in the author's language
native language and then translated by a professional translator or team
of translators.

You should try reading some of the Swedish and Icelandic detective
mysteries like Jo Nesbo, Steig Larsson and Arnaldur Indiroason. Most of
them are excellent.

[Pythagoras]

Ghe? Uhm, can you go into more detail? I don't get it

[Catullus]

Uhm, Ghe Ghe Ghe. This is my not frogger. Yes. Ghe Ghe Ghe :)))))))))))

[Samson]

[Thomas Joseph]

Dave Smith wrote:

> I am assuming that, unless you are reading them in the author's language
> native language and then translated by a professional translator or team
> of translators.
>
> You should try reading some of the Swedish and Icelandic detective
> mysteries like Jo Nesbo, Steig Larsson and Arnaldur Indiroason. Most of
> them are excellent.

I believe you. But I have to admit I'm not very patient. When I was younger I read a lot of short story anthologies. Then I found a book called "Short Shorts" with about 100 stories, some fables, with none more than two pages long. I want a really good writer capable of paring 10 paragraphs down to one sentence, then one sentence down to one word. I want to read one word so eloquently expressed that it alone becomes my book for life. Will you be that writer? Maybe. Maybe not. I do know that if I go blind I don't care enough for reading to start taking braille lessons. I only speak English - or American - but still believe that translations make stories easier to read. I remember a few times sending letters to the editor of USA and a few local papers that had called to tell me they had accepted my letter but wanted to read me their version first. When they'd read it I'd feel miffed that they left out what I thought was the most pertinent part. But after I'd say ok, go ahead and print it and I'd see it in the paper their edited version was always better than the one l sent in.

I want to get a job at a newspaper and work my way up to editor, then paying a pro to translate my edited version of someone else's work into another language then back into English. Not only would I edit those whose works I read, I will have them double translated for an even more dramatic and hopefully artistic creative-sounding triple-edited version of their offerings. I call it "Editing the Editor."

[Leonard Blaisdell]

On 2022-01-31, Mike Duffy <mxd...@bell.net> wrote:

> Maybe I should write a script to calculate the Shannon entropy of the
> posters here, to see who is being semantically precise, and who is just
> going on and on with big-sounding words.

Do it, make it an app and post it to the Apple Store. Call it the "Duffy
Device", and I'll buy it for ten bucks or less. That's a promise.

[Menachem]