Can a person live on only Ramen Noodles

[ret...@charter.nit]

With the present state of the economy, some people can no longer afford
both rent, utilities and food. The cost of rent and utilities keeps
going up, so the only place to cut costs is food. Ramen Noodles are
cheap. On sale they can cost as little as 20 cents a pack. If a person
eats two packs per day, their weekly cost for food is only $2.80, or
$11.20 per month. If purchased in quantity, a person might be able to
eat an entire month on $10. That is all some people can afford these
days. This is especially true for the elderly and disabled. The
question arises, is this a healthy diet. Or maybe not exactly
*healthy*, but can a person live on this alone?

[Julie Bove]

<ret...@charter.nit> wrote in message
news:kgn198pkg3jk5h42a...@4ax.com...

Not forever, no. There is very little protein in those noodles, far too
much sodium (IMO) and probably no vitamin C. Although they could probably
be the bulk of the diet, one would have to add in some nuts, fruit and veg
and perhaps occasional meat or fish.

I do know that plenty of college students have lived off of those things.
But they so also get occasional pizza and stuff.

We've been increasing our bean and rice intake. Particularly the beans.
Those are quite cheap. Not as cheap as the Ramen. But... I have only had
Ramen a few times in my life and I wasn't overly found of it. Yes, it will
do for me in a pinch or if I am sick which is why I foolishly bought more
than a case of it once. I had a really bad cold and found a Campbell's fat
free brand of chicken Ramen. I bought a whole shopping cart full for about
$3.00. Because I was sick and my nose was so stuffed, I couldn't really
taste it. So it was fine for about three days. And then? I never wanted
to see it again. I wound up donating it to the food bank.

What a person could do to make it a better meal would be to add a chopped
cooked egg or a bit of cooked meat and a small amount of cooked veggies.
Veggies like cabbage, carrots and onion are usually cheap. You could then
make a meal for the entire family out of that and it wouldn't be too bad
nutritionally.

Oh and did you know that a package of Ramen is more than one serving? Yep!
I think they have two servings. But people always eat the whole thing.
Just like the foil pack of Poptarts.

[Janet Price]

Not Likely....... Not enough vegetable matter,nor meat. Maybe by adding
a can of veggies and a can of meat every day or so. I understand it was
invented to keep people from starving.
If one eats noting but a tv dinner for a meal that also will cause
weight loss.
Vickie

[John Kuthe]

On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 23:34:28 +1100, John J <Jo...@invalid.net> wrote:

>On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 04:59:35 -0700, jpc...@msn.com (Janet Price)
>wrote:

>Vegetables yes, but do we need meat? How about vegetarians?

Humans need a diet composed of sufficient "essential" amino acids, not
all of which are in any single vegetable. Which is why beans and rice
is so popular among vegetarians. Beans AND rice provide a complete set
of all essential amino acids.

John Kuthe...

[pavane]

"Andy" <a@b.c> wrote in message news:XnsA0FD5E2...@216.196.97.131...
> To the OP,,
> .............................

> In the future kindly keep your stupid rhetorical quesstions to
> yourself.

... Andy, have you been eating too many Ramen Noodles??

pavane

[Julie Bove]

"John Kuthe" <John...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:mk8298t2sdrgl2o7g...@4ax.com...

That's actually a myth.

[Richard K.]

"Julie Bove" <juli...@frontier.com> wrote in message
news:k6rcc4$tnk$1...@dont-email.me...

If by myth you mean: they have to be eaten at the same time. It can be a
few hours apart... Hippos are vegetarian and seem to be very strong and
healthy. So is William Shatner.

Is it true that complementary proteins must be eaten together to count
as a complete protein source?
In the past, it was thought that these complementary proteins needed
to be eaten at the same meal for your body to use them together. Now studies
show that your body can combine complementary proteins that are eaten within
the same day.1

http://www.cdc.gov/nutrition/everyone/basics/protein.html

[Helpful person]

On Oct 31, 7:25 am, "Julie Bove" <julieb...@frontier.com> wrote:
>
> That's actually a myth.

Less than the myth of you're actual existence.

http://www.tichardfisher.com

[z z]

pure carbs and salt. better off eating eggs every day.

[Doug Freyburger]

For a month you likely won't get sick. For much longer go with grains
plus legumes. Rice and beans are the most common choice for this.

[Kalmia]

I think the food dollar would be better spent on real food i.e. bananas, beans, and other things which are less than 2 bucks a pound. I saw chickens on sale for 99 cents a pound. A little effort and ingenuity goes far.

As to the elderly, tho, I can see where the effort of cooking a chicken could be a hindrance. It's a tough call when food budget is limited.

[Brooklyn1]

Absolutely. No combination of just veggies supplies all the essential
amino acid... whole grain buckwheat groats comes closesest but not
quite close enough. People who claim to be vegeterians lie... they
all sneak some meat or they'd not live a year.

[George Leppla]

On 10/31/2012 11:11 AM, Kalmia wrote:
> I think the food dollar would be better spent on real food i.e. bananas, beans, and other things which are less than 2 bucks a pound. I saw chickens on sale for 99 cents a pound. A little effort and ingenuity goes far.
>
> As to the elderly, tho, I can see where the effort of cooking a chicken could be a hindrance. It's a tough call when food budget is limited.
>

In the early 70's in Wisconsin when I was working and going to college,
I would buy 10 loaves of frozen bread dough for $1 and 10 small cans of
Hunts tomato sauce for $1. The local cheese "factory" sold mozzarella
really cheap. I could make a pizza for well under $1 total.

I'll have to look around and see what it would cost today.

George L

[Kalmia]

> he early 80s

> I'll have to look around and see what it would cost today.
>
>
>
> George L

In the early 70s, I could get by on about 15 dollars a week for groceries. Granted, I did eat out a couple of times a week. I wish I had a typical grocery receipt for those times to see what all I bought. I do remember something called How Now Braun Cow, a hamburg 'n' rice stretcher. A big batch of this could supply me with supper for many a night. My money in those days went toward what would be today's Coach bags etc. Young and foolish with money was I and not too nutritionally focused.

[jmcquown]

"Brooklyn1" wrote in message
news:sfj298pdrdd4c66ib...@4ax.com...

I don't know about "sneak some meat" but they sure seem damned determined to
make vegetables *taste* like meat. Vegetarian sausages, vegetarian burgers.
What's the point? If you want it to taste like meat, eat meat.

Jill

[Cheri]

"Kalmia" <tween...@mypacks.net> wrote in message
news:0f024dab-823f-44f1...@googlegroups.com...

======

.99 cents a pound is not cheap where I am, they're usually on sale for .79
for the whole fryers, and today...10 pound bags of chicken leg quarters for
.58 a pound. I'm in CA. I think roasting a chicken is probably about the
easiest thing there is to cook, and unless disabled I can't imagine that an
elderly person couldn't do it since it doesn't take much effort.

Cheri

[jmcquown]

"Kalmia" wrote in message
news:0f024dab-823f-44f1...@googlegroups.com...

Roasting a chicken isn't difficult. And you don't have to get all that
creative. Sprinkle the chicken with S&P, brush on a little butter to crisp
the skin. Stick it in the oven in a baking pan and set the timer. Baste it
with the pan drippings a couple of times. No need to get more fancy than
that to make for good food and lots of leftovers.

Jill

[Pico Rico]

<ret...@charter.nit> wrote in message
news:kgn198pkg3jk5h42a...@4ax.com...

college students can, at least for a while.

[Brooklyn1]

On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 10:47:42 -0400, "Richard K."
<Rich...@netzero.com> wrote:

>"Julie Bove" <juli...@frontier.com> wrote in message
>news:k6rcc4$tnk$1...@dont-email.me...
>>
>> "John Kuthe" <John...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:mk8298t2sdrgl2o7g...@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 23:34:28 +1100, John J <Jo...@invalid.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 04:59:35 -0700, jpc...@msn.com (Janet Price)
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Not Likely....... Not enough vegetable matter,nor meat. Maybe by adding
>>>>>a can of veggies and a can of meat every day or so. I understand it was
>>>>>invented to keep people from starving.
>>>>> If one eats noting but a tv dinner for a meal that also will cause
>>>>>weight loss.
>>>>
>>>>Vegetables yes, but do we need meat? How about vegetarians?
>>>
>>> Humans need a diet composed of sufficient "essential" amino acids, not
>>> all of which are in any single vegetable. Which is why beans and rice
>>> is so popular among vegetarians. Beans AND rice provide a complete set
>>> of all essential amino acids.
>>>
>>> John Kuthe...
>>
>> That's actually a myth.
>
>
>If by myth you mean: they have to be eaten at the same time. It can be a
>few hours apart... Hippos are vegetarian and seem to be very strong and
>healthy.

Hippos are not strict vegetarians, they eat tons of snails and insects
that adhere to their water plant diet. Animals we think of as
vegetarian (deer, rabbits, horses, sheep, goats, etc.) are not, they
ingest a multitude of live meat as they graze, even earthworms.

>So is William Shatner.

Shatner has a black penis fetish and swallows, Obama is his favorite.

I had neighbors from India who claimed they were vegetarians (in fact
they complained when I grilled meat), yet one day I drove to a mall
miles from where we lived and there they were in their parked car with
their two kids, all of them chomping down Oscar Mayer bologna as fast
as they could. They could have at least got roast beef from the deli,
cheapo lying bastards. Everyone is a vegetarian, temporarilly... I
had a garden salad for lunch, followed by two fresh picked winesap
apples... but I have a potful of kielbasa and beans asimmer for
dinner.

[Chemo]

On Oct 31, 11:22 am, Brooklyn1 <Gravesend1> wrote:
> On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 10:47:42 -0400, "Richard K."
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

> <Richa...@netzero.com> wrote:
> >"Julie Bove" <julieb...@frontier.com> wrote in message
> >news:k6rcc4$tnk$1...@dont-email.me...
>
> >> "John Kuthe" <JohnKu...@gmail.com> wrote in message

> >>news:mk8298t2sdrgl2o7g...@4ax.com...
> >>> On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 23:34:28 +1100, John J <Jo...@invalid.net> wrote:
>

> >>>>On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 04:59:35 -0700, jpc4...@msn.com (Janet Price)

Does that mean we'll hear all about your farts tomorrow?

[notbob]

On 2012-10-31, ret...@charter.nit <ret...@charter.nit> wrote:

> *healthy*, but can a person live on this alone?

No, you freakn' moron. Go piss up a rope.


--
Definition of objectivism:
"Eff you! I got mine."
http://www.nongmoproject.org/

[notbob]

On 2012-10-31, Doug Freyburger <dfre...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> plus legumes. Rice and beans are the most common choice for this.

I finally got my red beans and rice recipe down. I may even add some
rice, this time. They're that good! ;)

nb

[Brooklyn1]

Kalmia wrote:
>
>I think the food dollar would be better spent on real food

>which are less than 2 bucks a pound. I saw chickens on sale
>for 99 cents a pound.

Chicken and all kinds of veggies are very good with ramen. I eat
ramen at least once each week, it's my go to consume left overs base,
a great way to use up that half a pork chop that was too much for my
cats. Simmer the bone, julienne the meat. Simmer sliced garlic,
onion, celery, some white pepper, parsley, sesame oil... check your
vegetable bin for more ingredients, lettuce and cabbage are good, that
last lonely carrot. Add ramen noodles, cook a few minutes, add meat
and seasoning envelop, sometimes I crack in a couple eggs. A
delicious meal. Sometimes add some ginger, a splash of soy sauce. I
buy ramen by the case, I like the chicken flavor best. Ramen
stretches the food dollar by not having to throw away left overs and
uses produce that will soon go bad otherwise. I don't eat plain
ramen, that's boring... I consider ramen a culinary pallete, exercises
creativity.

[Brooklyn1]

Kalmia wrote:
>
>In the early 70s, I could get by on about 15 dollars a week for groceries.
>Granted, I did eat out a couple of times a week.

Yeah, gals have always been able to negotiate a free meal for services
rendered. ;)

[Richard K.]

"Brooklyn1" <Gravesend1> wrote in message
news:f2q298preqqc6qpk6...@4ax.com...

> Hippos are not strict vegetarians, they eat tons of snails and insects
> that adhere to their water plant diet. Animals we think of as
> vegetarian (deer, rabbits, horses, sheep, goats, etc.) are not, they
> ingest a multitude of live meat as they graze, even earthworms.

Granted about hippos possibly accidentally eating insects, occasional snail
etc . No food is perfectly defect free from insect parts, mouse excrement,
miniscule "food defects", etc. I don't know about hippos eating snails, but
they are categorized as vegetarian. I believe chimps are too, but they eat
ants and termites with sticks, and rarely a small animal so they aren't
really but are most the time... But there is a world of difference between
accidentally eating an occasional insect or snail etc and not being a strict
vegetarian-- and not eating meat from factory farms which is why many
vegetarians are vegetarian... There really is no "strict vegetarian" by
your definition by examples. Although some Jains walk around with clothes
over their mouths to avoid accidentally ingesting an airborne small insect.
I think most people use strict vegetarian to mean vegan... Bill Clinton has
become a vegan. Hard to believe. He does look to be in good shape though.

> I had neighbors from India who claimed they were vegetarians (in fact
> they complained when I grilled meat), yet one day I drove to a mall
> miles from where we lived and there they were in their parked car with
> their two kids, all of them chomping down Oscar Mayer bologna as fast
> as they could.

Your neighbors are not any category of vegetarian if they eat bologna or
baloney. Neither are people that eat fish. The are pescians or
pescitarians or something. Lacto-ovo-pescian.

I'm craving split pea soup. With some added peas, and bit of carrot, with a
few oyster crackers.. Think I will see what Kroger has in low sodium
choices in the "health food" section.

[Richard K.]

"jmcquown" <j_mc...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:afd4pq...@mid.individual.net...

> No combination of just veggies supplies all the essential
> amino acid...

Of course you can combine incomplete protein foods that compliment each
other, to make complete protein foods. People do it all the time. The CDC
says: "In the past, it was thought that these complementary proteins needed

to be eaten at the same meal for your body to use them together. Now studies
show that your body can combine complementary proteins that are eaten within
the same day."

> I don't know about "sneak some meat" but they sure seem damned determined
> to make vegetables *taste* like meat. Vegetarian sausages, vegetarian
> burgers. What's the point? If you want it to taste like meat, eat meat.
>
> Jill

People want to eat things that taste good. Humans are omnivores and have a
history of eating things that taste like plants, and meat. But some people
don't want to eat meat (from factory farms, or raise and slaughter animals).

[Richard K.]

"Pico Rico" <Pico...@nonospam.com> wrote in message
news:k6rnd9$e35$1...@news.mixmin.net...

> college students can, at least for a while.

supplemented with pizza.

[Brooklyn1]

"Richard K." wrote:

Brooklyn1 wrote:
>>
>> No combination of just veggies supplies all the essential

>> amino acids.
>
>Of course you can combine incomplete protein foods.

Try reading again, this time for comprehension.

[dsi1]

On 10/30/2012 10:33 PM, ret...@charter.nit wrote:
> With the present state of the economy, some people can no longer afford
> both rent, utilities and food. The cost of rent and utilities keeps
> going up, so the only place to cut costs is food. Ramen Noodles are
> cheap. On sale they can cost as little as 20 cents a pack. If a person
> eats two packs per day, their weekly cost for food is only $2.80, or
> $11.20 per month. If purchased in quantity, a person might be able to
> eat an entire month on $10. That is all some people can afford these
> days. This is especially true for the elderly and disabled. The
> question arises, is this a healthy diet. Or maybe not exactly

> *healthy*, but can a person live on this alone?
>

It's a healthy alternative to starving to death. My recommendation is
that you get a small automatic rice cooker and make your ramen in that.

[John Kuthe]

On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 10:47:42 -0400, "Richard K."

<Rich...@netzero.com> wrote:

>"Julie Bove" <juli...@frontier.com> wrote in message
>news:k6rcc4$tnk$1...@dont-email.me...
>>
>> "John Kuthe" <John...@gmail.com> wrote in message

>> news:mk8298t2sdrgl2o7g...@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 23:34:28 +1100, John J <Jo...@invalid.net> wrote:
>>>

>>>>On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 04:59:35 -0700, jpc...@msn.com (Janet Price)

>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Not Likely....... Not enough vegetable matter,nor meat. Maybe by adding
>>>>>a can of veggies and a can of meat every day or so. I understand it was
>>>>>invented to keep people from starving.
>>>>> If one eats noting but a tv dinner for a meal that also will cause
>>>>>weight loss.
>>>>
>>>>Vegetables yes, but do we need meat? How about vegetarians?
>>>
>>> Humans need a diet composed of sufficient "essential" amino acids, not
>>> all of which are in any single vegetable. Which is why beans and rice
>>> is so popular among vegetarians. Beans AND rice provide a complete set
>>> of all essential amino acids.
>>>
>>> John Kuthe...
>>
>> That's actually a myth.
>
>
>If by myth you mean: they have to be eaten at the same time. It can be a
>few hours apart... Hippos are vegetarian and seem to be very strong and

>healthy. So is William Shatner.
>
> Is it true that complementary proteins must be eaten together to count
>as a complete protein source?

> In the past, it was thought that these complementary proteins needed
>to be eaten at the same meal for your body to use them together. Now studies
>show that your body can combine complementary proteins that are eaten within

>the same day.1
>
>http://www.cdc.gov/nutrition/everyone/basics/protein.html

I never said a complete set of essential amino acids needed to be
eaten together in a single meal. In the same 24 hour or week period,
maybe.

Hey! I need volunteers fior a long term nutritional study! You will
eat a diet that provides you with all needed essential amino acids
except the study will vary the time between consuming them together.
24, 48 hours, up to several weeks apart. This is for the rest of your
life BTW!! It's a longnitudinal study!

Then when all study volunteers have died we will determine the cause
of death and determine whether or not it had anything to do with
nutritionally obtaining the correct complete set of amino acids!!

Volunteers?

John Kuthe...

[Gary]

Andy wrote:
>
> From a ramen noodle thread here a few years back I bought a few
> packs to see what it was all about.
>
> I couldn't bring myself to add the flavor packets, with all the
> sodium and MSG. So I had a few pots of the plain noodles. I
> never went back for more.

I know some people that use the noodles only for other recipes.
They are good.

Gary

[Gary]

jmcquown wrote:
>
> I don't know about "sneak some meat" but they sure seem damned determined to
> make vegetables *taste* like meat. Vegetarian sausages, vegetarian burgers.
> What's the point? If you want it to taste like meat, eat meat.

That *is* funny to me too. heheh

[Richard K.]

"jmcquown" <j_mc...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:afd4pq...@mid.individual.net...

> I don't know about "sneak some meat" but they sure seem damned determined
> to make vegetables *taste* like meat. Vegetarian sausages, vegetarian
> burgers. What's the point? If you want it to taste like meat, eat meat.
>
> Jill

Jill,
Do you raise, slaughter and then butcher the animals you eat as meat?

[Julie Bove]

"Richard K." <Rich...@netzero.com> wrote in message
news:k6rdvd$8jv$1...@dont-email.me...

But it doesn't have to be rice either. One could eat popcorn or even pasta
at some point that same day and it would be complete.

[Richard K.]

"Brooklyn1" <Gravesend1> wrote in message

news:082398tuus2pmvkps...@4ax.com...

enlighten me. What am I missing?

[Julie Bove]

"Brooklyn1" <Gravesend1> wrote in message

news:f2q298preqqc6qpk6...@4ax.com...

It can be tough to be completely vegetarian. I would say in the past that I
was mostly vegetarian. Of course I ate that way at home, but if I went out
for Mexican food, I knew there was probably lard in the beans and chicken
broth in the rice. Some people might not know this and would just assume
that these things were vegetarian. One thing I would never do though would
be to chomp down on a lot of meat. I just don't like meat all that much.

[Richard K.]

"John Kuthe" <John...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:6m43985svmoejo2k4...@4ax.com...

> Hey! I need volunteers fior a long term nutritional study! You will
> eat a diet that provides you with all needed essential amino acids
> except the study will vary the time between consuming them together.
> 24, 48 hours, up to several weeks apart. This is for the rest of your
> life BTW!! It's a longnitudinal study!
>
> Then when all study volunteers have died we will determine the cause
> of death and determine whether or not it had anything to do with
> nutritionally obtaining the correct complete set of amino acids!!
>
> Volunteers?
>
> John Kuthe...

sign me up

[Julie Bove]

"Brooklyn1" <Gravesend1> wrote in message

news:sfj298pdrdd4c66ib...@4ax.com...

> On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 07:24:59 -0700, "Julie Bove"
> <juli...@frontier.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>"John Kuthe" <John...@gmail.com> wrote in message

>>news:mk8298t2sdrgl2o7g...@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 23:34:28 +1100, John J <Jo...@invalid.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 04:59:35 -0700, jpc...@msn.com (Janet Price)
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Not Likely....... Not enough vegetable matter,nor meat. Maybe by adding
>>>>>a can of veggies and a can of meat every day or so. I understand it was
>>>>>invented to keep people from starving.
>>>>> If one eats noting but a tv dinner for a meal that also will cause
>>>>>weight loss.
>>>>
>>>>Vegetables yes, but do we need meat? How about vegetarians?
>>>
>>> Humans need a diet composed of sufficient "essential" amino acids, not
>>> all of which are in any single vegetable. Which is why beans and rice
>>> is so popular among vegetarians. Beans AND rice provide a complete set
>>> of all essential amino acids.
>>>
>>> John Kuthe...
>>
>>That's actually a myth.
>

> Absolutely. No combination of just veggies supplies all the essential
> amino acid... whole grain buckwheat groats comes closesest but not
> quite close enough. People who claim to be vegeterians lie... they
> all sneak some meat or they'd not live a year.

Now that's just not true! Some people are even adamant vegans. The main
problem there is lack of vitamin B but that can be brought into the diet by
eating nutritional yeast if not taking supplements.

[Julie Bove]

"jmcquown" <j_mc...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:afd4pq...@mid.individual.net...

> "Brooklyn1" wrote in message

> news:sfj298pdrdd4c66ib...@4ax.com...
>
> On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 07:24:59 -0700, "Julie Bove"
> <juli...@frontier.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>"John Kuthe" <John...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>news:mk8298t2sdrgl2o7g...@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 23:34:28 +1100, John J <Jo...@invalid.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 04:59:35 -0700, jpc...@msn.com (Janet Price)
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Not Likely....... Not enough vegetable matter,nor meat. Maybe by adding
>>>>>a can of veggies and a can of meat every day or so. I understand it was
>>>>>invented to keep people from starving.
>>>>> If one eats noting but a tv dinner for a meal that also will cause
>>>>>weight loss.
>>>>
>>>>Vegetables yes, but do we need meat? How about vegetarians?
>>>
>>> Humans need a diet composed of sufficient "essential" amino acids, not
>>> all of which are in any single vegetable. Which is why beans and rice
>>> is so popular among vegetarians. Beans AND rice provide a complete set
>>> of all essential amino acids.
>>>
>>> John Kuthe...
>>
>>That's actually a myth.
>
> Absolutely. No combination of just veggies supplies all the essential
> amino acid... whole grain buckwheat groats comes closesest but not
> quite close enough. People who claim to be vegeterians lie... they
> all sneak some meat or they'd not live a year.
>
>
>

> I don't know about "sneak some meat" but they sure seem damned determined
> to make vegetables *taste* like meat. Vegetarian sausages, vegetarian
> burgers. What's the point? If you want it to taste like meat, eat meat.

Not all vegetarians do that. I didn't eat those products for many years
until I found some black bean patties at the health food store. I didn't
buy them because they resembled meat patties but because I like beans! They
were quite good.

I have been told by some vegans that they really *do* like meat and want to
make foods that look and taste like meat. That's not me. I really *don't*
like meat. When I eat it at home it is mostly cut/chopped up into little
bits and mixed into my food. I don't notice it so much when it is in a
casserole or a soup. I know it's in there. And I know for me that I have
to eat it once in a while or I will go anemic. I just don't like biting
into a big chunk of meat. My husband and a friend of mine are just the
opposite. They don't like vegetables but they do like big slabs of meat!

[Julie Bove]

"John J" <Jo...@invalid.net> wrote in message
news:5rv298lkbnshk7mqk...@4ax.com...

> Why? Where did you find that law? Maybe they like the taste of meat
> but have medical, ethical or political reasons not to eat it.

Yes. That is what I have been told. But also... I think the original
reason for making things look and taste like meat came about during the
depression when people simply couldn't get meat. I have plenty of cookbooks
from that era that have recipes for things like bean loaf.

[Julie Bove]

"Richard K." <Rich...@netzero.com> wrote in message

news:k6s15h$7n0$1...@dont-email.me...

Yep.

[Brooklyn1]

That's dumber than a rock... a rice cooker will cost more than many
months worth of ramen.

[meda...@gmail.com]

Did you hit your head, Johny? She said that your claim was bullshit. At least act like one of your 3 (snort) degrees is worth something. How's that imaginary $60/hr job in informatics (for someone who doesn't even know how spell Epic) going? I could point out the other lies you've caught yourself in, but it's getting boring. Here's a new idea! Why don't you buy some 65% Fair Trade chocolate and rave about it and post a link? You tiresome little monkey.

[jmcquown]

"Richard K." wrote in message news:k6s6rm$d8f$1...@dont-email.me...

Nope, that's what I pay the butcher to do. (I'm pretty sure they'd get
upset if I started raising cattle or sheep on the golf course in my back
yard.)

Jill

[jmcquown]

"l not -l" wrote in message news:k6s369$ku2$1...@dont-email.me...

On 31-Oct-2012, ret...@charter.nit wrote:

> With the present state of the economy, some people can no longer
> afford
> both rent, utilities and food. The cost of rent and utilities keeps
> going up, so the only place to cut costs is food. Ramen Noodles are
> cheap. On sale they can cost as little as 20 cents a pack. If a
> person
> eats two packs per day, their weekly cost for food is only $2.80, or
> $11.20 per month. If purchased in quantity, a person might be able to
> eat an entire month on $10. That is all some people can afford these
> days. This is especially true for the elderly and disabled. The
> question arises, is this a healthy diet. Or maybe not exactly
> *healthy*, but can a person live on this alone?

If a diet of nothing but Ramen didn't kill you, it would surely soon
make you wish you were dead.

Meals made from dried beans and brown rice would be a better choice at
not much more cost. Add hocks, shanks or neck bones and you still have
low cost; toss in some frozen or canned mixed vegetables and you have an
inexpensive, nutritious meal without all the sodium of Ramen "flavor
packets". Vary the type of bean, the cheap meat (those already
mentioned, low-cost chicken parts or smoked turkey wings) and the
vegetable mix to have a wide variety of nutritious combinations.


--

Change Cujo to Juno in email address.


I couldn't have said it any better. Thanks!

Jill

[jmcquown]

"dsi1" wrote in message news:k6s1p2$9bi$4...@dont-email.me...

There's nothing "healthy" about a diet of [unadulterated] Ramen noodles with
the sodium laden "seasoning packet" day after day. And why would someone
need a rice cooker to make soup?!

Jill

[John Kuthe]

On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 15:42:05 -0700 (PDT), meda...@gmail.com wrote:
...
>Did you hit your head, Johny? She said that your claim was bullshit. At least act like one of your 3 (snort) degrees is worth something. How's that imaginary $60/hr job in informatics (for someone who doesn't even know how spell Epic) going? I could point out the other lies you've caught yourself in, but it's getting boring. Here's a new idea! Why don't you buy some 65% Fair Trade chocolate and rave about it and post a link? You tiresome little monkey.

BillyBotulism is posting with the same error-ridden SW that Bryan
was/is using!

;-)

John Kuthe...

[Richard K.]

"jmcquown" <j_mc...@comcast.net> wrote in message

news:afdren...@mid.individual.net...

I have respect for people that raise and slaughter their own, but to just go
to the market and pay for someone else to do it-- to let someone else do
the dirty, disgusting work... well, I wonder how many people would opt for
vegetarianism if they had to do the slaughtering and butchering themselves,
of an animal they nurtured and raised... I've heard some people that work
in slaughterhouses go kinda nuts. Pollan says the job of butchering in many
societies is not done by just one person, but passed around to the community
so it's not just one person doing it all the time.

[jmcquown]

"Richard K." wrote in message news:k6shmr$ej0$1...@dont-email.me...

You know, I really don't care what you think. My ancestors certainly raised
and slaughtered their own animals. They were farmers. They ate what
animals they raised and what vegetables they could grow. They sold some at
market. If I had to do it today, if I'd been raised in that culture, sure,
I'd do it. Would I opt for vegetarianism? No. I'm a carnivore.

Jill

[Julie Bove]

"jmcquown" <j_mc...@comcast.net> wrote in message

news:afdrlu...@mid.individual.net...

True. However in order to get that stuff, you have to have some money to
start with. Yes some stores do sell bulk beans and rice. So a person could
buy a very small amount at a time.

But if a person truly has no money and finds a dime or a quarter (or gets
someone to give it to them) then they are limited to buying what that dime
or quarter will buy.

Many years ago I worked with a woman who was constantly asking people if she
could borrow piddly little amounts of money like that to buy Ramen, claiming
that they were very hungry and had no food in the house. Most people would
feel sorry for her and just give her the money and say that she didn't have
to repay it. But things were just not adding up. She and her husband were
middle aged. He worked somewhere. We didn't know where. She had a full
time job. She claimed that they lived in a one room apartment and didn't
even have money to buy furniture. So where did her money go? Turns out
that they had drinking and gambling problems. In the end she was fired for
stealing a candy bar. Turns out she had been doing this daily. She
admitted to it.

[Julie Bove]

"jmcquown" <j_mc...@comcast.net> wrote in message

news:afds35...@mid.individual.net...

I suppose that a person might be living in a rented room with no stove.
But... There are things one can buy that are far cheaper than a rice
cooker. I was once given an electric pot that costs about $10. I wound up
getting rid of it because I had no use for it. The person who gave it to me
said he thought I could use it in the microwave. I was like... Wha?
Ohhhhhhhh...never mind. It was an elderly person who gave it to me.
Something like that could be used to heat soup. Better still but perhaps a
tad more expensive would be a single or double burner device...can't
remember what they are called. But then of course you would need some sort
of pot or pan to put on it. That would be more versatile. But people can
make do with all sorts of things.

When I was in elementary school, there was a girl in my grade who frequently
complained that their electricity had been shut off again. Apparently her
parents weren't so good at paying their bills. She said when that happened,
they had to cook stuff in the popcorn popper. She said they made soup in
it. That always baffled me. I couldn't imagine what sort of device they
had that would work with no electricity! I know there are fireplace poppers
but that wouldn't work for soup. In those days we did have a corn popper
that was a gift. My dad regarded the thing as a joke. Yes, it popped corn
but so did a pan on the stove. The popper was huge and we didn't have a
place to store it. We got rid of it. The person who gifted it to us must
not have realized that one could just use a pan to pop corn. She used to
make it for us but she bought that stuff that comes in the foil pan. To
her, making it that was was a very exciting thing. She would always insist
that we watch it pop. We just wanted the popcorn.

[Richard K.]

"Julie Bove" <juli...@frontier.com> wrote in message

news:k6sobr$c6g$1...@dont-email.me...

> When I was in elementary school, there was a girl in my grade who
> frequently complained that their electricity had been shut off again.

My step mother in law says when she was growing up they moved 14 times in 16
months. Father was not very responsible and drank too much and didn't pay
the bills... I've never understood how moving gets you from paying bills.
And the pain of moving. And who rents to someone that hasn't been paying
their bills? But I guess in the 30s/40s the didn't do credit checks with
Experian or have computers to do background checks.

Back in the flood of 33 here she said their place was flooded and she got
sent off to some place in Indiana with her younger sister for a month
without seeing her family. She was only 10. Can you imagine going through
that? When they got back to their place the furniture was all ruined and
they had to shovel mud out of it.

[Richard K.]

"jmcquown" <j_mc...@comcast.net> wrote in message

news:afe0o8...@mid.individual.net...

> You know, I really don't care what you think. My ancestors certainly
> raised and slaughtered their own animals. They were farmers. They ate
> what animals they raised and what vegetables they could grow. They sold
> some at market. If I had to do it today, if I'd been raised in that
> culture, sure, I'd do it. Would I opt for vegetarianism? No. I'm a
> carnivore.
>
> Jill

actually, humans are usually omnivores... since you have to have meat,
perhaps you are a werewolf?

To not raise and slaughter your own meat, I think is dishonest, lazy and to
be a parasite off people that you let do the dirty work for you. If you
want to eat meat, then the honest thing is to butcher it yourself... I'm no
saint, but when I ate meat I didn't go around saying I like eating meat
because it tasted good... That is a low bar to set for human morals and
ethics. And to say animals such as lions and tigers kill other animals and
eat them, well-- do humans have the same morals as lions and tigers?

[Julie Bove]

Well I know how they can do it. Not that I have done it. The trick is not
to keep moving in the same city. You pay what you have to pay to get into
the place. Usually first, last and damage deposit. And then you just don't
pay again. This works best if you have an out of town or better still, out
of state landlord.

Then there are all sorts of tricks to buy you time on your your utilities.
First off, don't set up for automatic payments. When you get the late
notice, call and insist that you sent the check. Then when you get the next
notice, send a check but either don't sign it or mess up the amount in some
way so they can't cash it. These things buy you time. Another thing some
places will go for at least for a while is partial payments.

"Borrow" things from neighbors. Like food. And then never pay them back.
Get in with some churches and get them to give you things. Like oddly
enough a car repair for next to nothing. Yes! We actually had a neighbor
who did all of these things.

She called me in a panic one morning and said that her car had broken down.
She was freaking out. She had a little girl, a baby and a daughter who was
my daughter's age. The kids always looked like ragamuffins. Filthy bodies
and clothing and hair all matted. Begged me to come pick up the daughter
and take her to school. Why she was driving the girl to school, I don't
know. We did have a bus. However this girl was usually barely in time for
the bus, running out the door with a piece of food in her mouth because her
mom made her eat it.

So I took the girl to school and then shortly before school was out, the mom
begged me to take her to her mechanic so that she could get her car. Not
sure how she got it there but I do know that her husband had arrived at the
broken down vehicle at about the same time that I did. She said that the
mechanic was not far away. Sure, not far if you think Kirkland is not far!
Worse still she took me on backroads so I had *no* idea where we were going.
Then we arrived at some sort of a church or something with monks. She said
it was the only place she could go because they wouldn't charge her for the
repair. Oh whatever! That was not a fun time.

She complained to me about how she was overheating very badly and was
breastfeeding this baby. Even had to relactate for him because he was
allergic to everything under the sun. So I gave her a fairly new air
conditioner that we had. We couldn't use it in our house but her windows
were different and she said that they could. They never installed it. I
think they sold it.

They also had no computer. The husband was constantly calling me and asking
me to print off Mapquest and other things for him. Which I did. For a
brief while. He told me that he did have access to a computer at work. I
told him to use that one then.

Then there was the cat incident. They left to go to Disneyland. Just one
of the many extended vacations they took during the school year. Asked me
to feed the cat. It was winter. They left the cat outside in the freezing
cold with a small coffee can filled with cheap dry food. No water. They
said the cat could drink from the stream in the backyard.

I checked. There was no place for the cat to sleep. I probably should have
called some organization but instead I parked my van in front of their house
and took the cat into the van for as many hours as I could. I bought him
good food, provided water and even a litter box. Then they came home and
gave the cat away! He was such a sweet cat. I would have taken him except
that my cat at the time hated other cats.

There were more incidents. I finally had a talk with the mom and told her
that her kids could not come to my house any more. They trashed my house
and stole from us. And the one that was my daughter's age said that she
didn't have to listen to what I said. That was the last straw.

But my daughter wanted to still be friends with this girl. So I allowed her
to play at their house for an hour or two at a time occasionally. I didn't
know it but the girls would ask her to bring over specific toys. They stole
them. We eventually found them thrown into the backyard along with some of
her clothing that I didn't realize they had stolen.

There were more incidents. A lot more. The mom would set things up so that
there would be an emergency. She had no babysitter. Could I please help?
Well that didn't last long. I finally just said that, "no": I could not
help.

The last time I did anything for them was when they moved. The girl that
was my daughter's age ran over here and had a breakdown in my house. She
wound up staying here all day and I fed her lunch and dinner. I finally
told her that she had to go home when it got dark. They had finished
packing by then.

They moved to the next city over. They told me that they were living in a
huge pink house by this certain market. I don't think so. There is no such
house in that area. We did see them in a different market. They acted like
they didn't know us. Not that I really wanted contact with them again.

[Julie Bove]

l not -l wrote:

> On 31-Oct-2012, "Julie Bove" <juli...@frontier.com> wrote:
>
>> True. However in order to get that stuff, you have to have some
>> money to
>> start with. Yes some stores do sell bulk beans and rice. So a
>> person could
>> buy a very small amount at a time.
>>
>> But if a person truly has no money and finds a dime or a quarter (or
>> gets
>> someone to give it to them) then they are limited to buying what that
>> dime
>> or quarter will buy.
>

> Not the premise stated by the OP and that I responded to. OP was
> talking about buying Ramen for a day, a week or a month. OP even
> mentioned "If purchased in quantity..."

Okay then. I stand corrected.

[Julie Bove]

Oh really? So then... Do you cobble your own shoes? Make your own
clothing? Furniture? Cosmetics? Did you build your own car? Yes, I know
some people do these things. But there is no way that every one of us could
do all of these things. The world just doesn't work that way.

[Farm1]

"Richard K." <Rich...@netzero.com> wrote in message

news:k6srod$q7g$1...@dont-email.me...

> "jmcquown" <j_mc...@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:afe0o8...@mid.individual.net...
>
>> You know, I really don't care what you think. My ancestors certainly
>> raised and slaughtered their own animals. They were farmers. They ate
>> what animals they raised and what vegetables they could grow. They sold
>> some at market. If I had to do it today, if I'd been raised in that
>> culture, sure, I'd do it. Would I opt for vegetarianism? No. I'm a
>> carnivore.
>>
>> Jill
>
>
> actually, humans are usually omnivores... since you have to have meat,
> perhaps you are a werewolf?
>
> To not raise and slaughter your own meat, I think is dishonest, lazy and
> to be a parasite off people that you let do the dirty work for you.

What a ridiculous comment.

> want to eat meat, then the honest thing is to butcher it yourself... I'm
> no saint, but when I ate meat I didn't go around saying I like eating meat
> because it tasted good... That is a low bar to set for human morals and
> ethics. And to say animals such as lions and tigers kill other animals
> and eat them, well-- do humans have the same morals as lions and tigers?

Unless you grow everything you eat or wear and then process it/sew it
yourself then you are asking to be given the obvious label.

[Richard K.]

"Julie Bove" <juli...@frontier.com> wrote in message

news:k6t869$e6o$1...@dont-email.me...

would that could, but I can't so I don't.... For a while I thought about
getting non-leather shoes, but it's not practical in US society. I could do
without a car. And do not use cosmetics, though use shampoo and soap... I
did put together some shelves from Target once. But I did not grow the
trees nor lumber them and treat the wood, nor mine and smelt the metals for
the nails.

My point wasn't that one should create everything they use in their life,
but if you are going to flippantly say if you like the taste and smell of
meat-- then eat meat, rather than vegetarian things that are similar to
meat-- that there are many varied reasons why some people choose to not eat
meat... And that people who eat meat should butcher animals so they know
first hand what really happens and how meat gets on their plate.

I still think Jill may be a werewolf since she seems to have an
uncontrol-able bloodlust for meat. That her ancestors butchered meat and
that she could, is not the point. Everyone who eats meat should raise,
slaughter and butcher at least one animal. Though ideally, every animal
they eat... And not let some hapless Mexican immigrant do it for them-- day
after day-- wading through pools of blood, hearing sentient animals
fearfully, anxiously, being led to mass slaughter. Then taking the lifeless
bodies and carving them up, so others may enjoy the taste of fresh wholesome
complete protein meat.

[Richard K.]

"Farm1" <He...@there.sometimes> wrote in message
news:k6thcj$p08$2...@dont-email.me...

> Unless you grow everything you eat or wear and then process it/sew it
> yourself then you are asking to be given the obvious label.

I suppose not a union label.... Again that was not the point. Personally,
I feel there is a big difference between wearing cotton clothes others grow
and make, etc; and eating meat other people raise and slaughter and then
cook... I could build a car or house, etc given enough time and experience
and tools, but I don't think I would ever raise and slaughter a pig, dog, or
cow.

[Julie Bove]

"Richard K." <Rich...@netzero.com> wrote in message

news:k6tjaq$347$1...@dont-email.me...

What? I have plenty of non leather shoes. So does my daughter. Heck, my
husband even has some. Why is it not practical? We do sell vegan shoes
here ya know.

Shampoo and soap *are* cosmetics. And if you're not making your own well...

>
> My point wasn't that one should create everything they use in their life,
> but if you are going to flippantly say if you like the taste and smell of
> meat-- then eat meat, rather than vegetarian things that are similar to
> meat-- that there are many varied reasons why some people choose to not
> eat meat... And that people who eat meat should butcher animals so they
> know first hand what really happens and how meat gets on their plate.

What a bunch of BS! Most people don't grow their own veggies or especially
things like rice. Nor do they grind their own wheat.

Ever worked as a farm worker? I did. For one day. I wouldn't wish that on
anyone. And no, I'm not going to go recommend that you try it to see what
they go through.

>
> I still think Jill may be a werewolf since she seems to have an
> uncontrol-able bloodlust for meat. That her ancestors butchered meat and
> that she could, is not the point. Everyone who eats meat should raise,
> slaughter and butcher at least one animal. Though ideally, every animal
> they eat... And not let some hapless Mexican immigrant do it for them--
> day after day-- wading through pools of blood, hearing sentient animals
> fearfully, anxiously, being led to mass slaughter. Then taking the
> lifeless bodies and carving them up, so others may enjoy the taste of
> fresh wholesome complete protein meat.

My husband is a big meat eater. So is a female friend of mine. If they
have to go one day without meat, they get really cranky. I do not believe
there is any one diet that will work for every one of us. We each have to
find what works for us.

[Julie Bove]

"Richard K." <Rich...@netzero.com> wrote in message

news:k6tjrd$5fl$1...@dont-email.me...

I don't think there's a big difference at all. Was that cotton picked by
migrant farm workers? Was the clothing sewn in some sweat shop?

[Farm1]

"Richard K." <Rich...@netzero.com> wrote in message

> "Farm1" <He...@there.sometimes> wrote in message

>> Unless you grow everything you eat or wear and then process it/sew it
>> yourself then you are asking to be given the obvious label.
>
> I suppose not a union label.... Again that was not the point.
> Personally, I feel there is a big difference between wearing cotton
> clothes others grow > and make, etc; and eating meat other people raise
> and slaughter and then cook...

Your points all seem to be about 'feel' rather than 'thinking'.

Have you bothered to check the labels for the country of manufacture of any
of your clothes recently? It's all well and good to cite Pollan but he only
witters on about food where informed consumers can and do make reasonable
choices

Wearing cotton clothes where the cotton is grown, processed and sewn
together in third world countries and then exported to first world countries
is probably far more dishonest, lazy and parasitic than eating meat from
animals slughtered in abattoirs in the western world.

At least abattoirs in the first world are regulated and generally receive
regualr inspections and thus produce clean and safe food in a safe working
environment where injuries are compensated for, and where employees receive
reasonable wages, all workers are adults, receive meal breaks and don't work
for excessive hours.

I could build a car or house, etc given enough time and experience
> and tools, but I don't think I would ever raise and slaughter a pig, dog,
> or cow.

You stated in another post that you'd thought aobut getting non-leatehr
shoes but that was not practical in the US. Do you wear leather shoes or
leather clothes?

If you do wear leather in either shoes, clothes or belts or do you have
leather furniture or car seats, do you slaughter the cattle and then skin
them so that you know what is involved in getting the leather onto your
feet, waist back or seats? Or do you leave that job which you say is dirty,
disgusting and involves wading in pools of blood, hearing sentient animals
fearfully, anxiously being lead to mass slaughter to others?

[notbob]

On 2012-11-01, Farm1 <He...@there.sometimes> wrote:

> At least abattoirs in the first world are regulated and generally receive
> regualr inspections and thus produce clean and safe food in a safe working
> environment where injuries are compensated for, and where employees receive
> reasonable wages, all workers are adults, receive meal breaks and don't work
> for excessive hours.

Now you are being disingenuous, or worse, dishonest. Perhaps jes ignorant.

The sad state of our (US) slaughterhouse is near criminal. Our
getting "clean and safe" food is probably more a case of sheer luck than
competent oversight. But then, maybe yer not from around "here",
your being from "@there".

nb


--
Definition of objectivism:
"Eff you! I got mine."
http://www.nongmoproject.org/

[notbob]

On 2012-11-01, Richard K. <Rich...@netzero.com> wrote:

> My point wasn't that one should create everything they use in their life,
> but if you are going to flippantly say if you like the taste and smell of
> meat--

Give it up, Rich. You ate yer leather shoe, so jes move on to the next meal.

[George M. Middius]

Julie Bove wrote:

> > To not raise and slaughter your own meat, I think is dishonest, lazy
> > and to be a parasite off people that you let do the dirty work for
> > you.

> Oh really? So then... Do you cobble your own shoes? Make your own
> clothing? Furniture? Cosmetics? Did you build your own car? Yes, I know
> some people do these things. But there is no way that every one of us could
> do all of these things. The world just doesn't work that way.

Wow. That's the second time this year Julie was more cogent than
somebody else.

[George M. Middius]

Farm1 wrote:

> > I suppose not a union label.... Again that was not the point.
> > Personally, I feel there is a big difference between wearing cotton
> > clothes others grow > and make, etc; and eating meat other people raise
> > and slaughter and then cook...
>
> Your points all seem to be about 'feel' rather than 'thinking'.

Accurate observation. In America, we call people who behave that way
"conservatives". That label takes in a lot of territory, from
ultra-religious nutjobs to luddites to gun nuts.

[George M. Middius]

Richard K. wrote:

> I have respect for people that raise and slaughter their own, but to just go
> to the market and pay for someone else to do it-- to let someone else do
> the dirty, disgusting work... well, I wonder how many people would opt for
> vegetarianism if they had to do the slaughtering and butchering themselves,
> of an animal they nurtured and raised...

***** STONER ALERT*****

[dsi1]

I consider starving to death as being really bad for one's health. My
guess is that if you were starving to death, you'd be thankful for
ramen's meager nutritional values.

Nobody needs to cook soup in a rice cooker but I sure would do it. It's
just easier to cook using a rice cooker especially if I only have to
cook for two. Anything that requires boiling water I'd rather use my
small rice cooker. I also cook cornbread and instant mashed potatoes and
broccoli and canned soup. My assumption is that it will poach and cook
hard-boiled eggs just fine, although I have yet to try it.

I will be using my automatic rice cooker more and more in the future.
You can stick with a pan on the stove - I've found an easier, simpler,
and more efficient way to cook.

[Gary]

"Richard K." wrote:
>
> but I don't think I would ever raise and slaughter a pig, dog, or
> cow.

I also would have a problem killing animals but a pig? I could do that. I
saw a BBQ show once where one restaurant slow roasted a whole pig, then cut
up all parts and mixed them together.

I could go for that. I'd love to try that too. :)

G.

[jim stone]

"Julie Bove" <juli...@frontier.com> wrote in message

news:k6t81v$df1$1...@dont-email.me...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

I heard some time a lady with a mental condition and living by herself,
astounded doctors when they discovered she had eaten nothing but creamed
rice pudding from cans/tins for several years !

[Julie Bove]

I don't own a rice cooker and can't see myself ever getting one. For one
thing I have no place to store one. And the stove I own wasn't overly
expensive. I don't need a lot of bells and whistles but I did want a self
cleaning one. Rice cookers are pretty expensive, IMO.

[Brooklyn1]

Some rice cookers are just pretty:
http://mainlandhotties.com/2011/05/pan-shuang-shuang/

[dsi1]

On 11/1/2012 11:55 AM, Julie Bove wrote:
>
> I don't own a rice cooker and can't see myself ever getting one. For one
> thing I have no place to store one. And the stove I own wasn't overly
> expensive. I don't need a lot of bells and whistles but I did want a self
> cleaning one. Rice cookers are pretty expensive, IMO.

You're right - they're hideously expensive. OTOH, the 6 cup rice cooker
that I got from Walgren's was dirt cheap. Under 15 bucks.

[Farm1]

"notbob" <not...@nothome.com> wrote in message
news:slrnk953dd...@nbleet.hcc.net...

> On 2012-11-01, Farm1 <He...@there.sometimes> wrote:
>
>> At least abattoirs in the first world are regulated and generally receive
>> regualr inspections and thus produce clean and safe food in a safe
>> working
>> environment where injuries are compensated for, and where employees
>> receive
>> reasonable wages, all workers are adults, receive meal breaks and don't
>> work
>> for excessive hours.
>
> Now you are being disingenuous, or worse, dishonest. Perhaps jes
> ignorant.

Or perhaps I just get out more. Also perhaps I have a reason for knowing
something about abattoirs which is why I've spent some time thinking about
them, touring the slaughter line and looking at footage of them.

> The sad state of our (US) slaughterhouse is near criminal.

If you hold that view then you might just be able to imagine how bad
conditions are in third world countries.

I've seen footage of US abattoirs and I've toured Australian ones and if you
think that conditions are so bad in the US then you should avoid learning
how slaughter is done in third world countries.

Our
> getting "clean and safe" food is probably more a case of sheer luck than
> competent oversight. But then, maybe yer not from around "here",
> your being from "@there".

Yes indeed. Additionally, I'm a cattle producer which is why I know
something about abattoirs.

[Farm1]

"George M. Middius" <glan...@gmail.com> wrote in message

LOL. I guess such peeps have never heard of The Enlightenment but hope for
The Rapture.

[Julie Bove]

"dsi1" <ds...@eternal-september.invalid> wrote in message
news:k6vlgr$pio$1...@dont-email.me...

I can cook rice in the pan I already have. And I rarely ever have a problem
cooking rice. I don't need another device in my kitchen.

[dsi1]

I never said that you should. You shouldn't get another appliance for
your kitchen. I'm recommending this for people that want to live simply
and efficiently and cheaply.

[George M. Middius]

Julie Bove wrote:

> I can cook rice in the pan I already have. And I rarely ever have a problem
> cooking rice. I don't need another device in my kitchen.

That device was invented in Japan, I believe, a country where they eat
rice at every meal. In this country, we have many choices for starch,
so it makes little sense to buy a dedicated appliance just for rice.

Plus, every one I've seen is as ugly as Sheldon.

[Richard K.]

"Farm1" <He...@there.sometimes> wrote in message

news:k6tmh9$jgk$2...@dont-email.me...

> You stated in another post that you'd thought aobut getting non-leatehr
> shoes but that was not practical in the US. Do you wear leather shoes or
> leather clothes?
>
> If you do wear leather in either shoes, clothes or belts or do you have
> leather furniture or car seats, do you slaughter the cattle and then skin
> them so that you know what is involved in getting the leather onto your
> feet, waist back or seats? Or do you leave that job which you say is
> dirty, disgusting and involves wading in pools of blood, hearing sentient
> animals fearfully, anxiously being lead to mass slaughter to others?

I do not have leather clothes, but have sneakers that have some leather but
that is all they sell in stores here... And I try and at least wear my
sneakers as long as possible... It is a bit hypocritical, but I only buy
sneakers about once every two years. People that eat meat are eating it
just about every day.

I don't think I could kill an animal just so I could have sneakers... I
would like to be able to buy pleather ones or such.

[Richard K.]

"notbob" <not...@nothome.com> wrote in message
news:slrnk953dd...@nbleet.hcc.net...

> On 2012-11-01, Farm1 <He...@there.sometimes> wrote:
>
>> At least abattoirs in the first world are regulated and generally receive
>> regualr inspections and thus produce clean and safe food in a safe
>> working
>> environment where injuries are compensated for, and where employees
>> receive
>> reasonable wages, all workers are adults, receive meal breaks and don't
>> work
>> for excessive hours.
>
> Now you are being disingenuous, or worse, dishonest. Perhaps jes
> ignorant.
>
> The sad state of our (US) slaughterhouse is near criminal. Our
> getting "clean and safe" food is probably more a case of sheer luck than
> competent oversight. But then, maybe yer not from around "here",
> your being from "@there".
>
> nb

Well said... Also, Chi-Chi's went out of business because people died from
green onions being contaminated so being vegetarian has risks too. Many
restaurants aren't that careful about using the same knife to cut meat and
vegetables, etc.

Have you read the Omnivore's Dilemma? It's not for vegetarians, Pollan is
clear that he's not a vegetarian but an omnivore, and that all humans can do
better.

[Richard K.]

"Julie Bove" <juli...@frontier.com> wrote in message

news:k6ur5e$njj$1...@dont-email.me...

> I don't own a rice cooker and can't see myself ever getting one. For one
> thing I have no place to store one. And the stove I own wasn't overly
> expensive. I don't need a lot of bells and whistles but I did want a self
> cleaning one. Rice cookers are pretty expensive, IMO.

I had a $30 rice cooker from Target. Made ton of rice. We planned to make
a lot of rice for dinners when working; it was neat that you could use a
timer and it shut off when the rice was done and then had a warmer cycle to
keep it warm till you got home.

But I gave it to her when she moved. I didn't find it really necessary.
It's not that hard to cook rice in a pot, or microwave brown rice.

[Richard K.]

"jim stone" <tgh6h5t...@mail.invalid> wrote in message
news:k6uqsf$lql$1...@dont-email.me...

> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I heard some time a lady with a mental condition and living by herself,
> astounded doctors when they discovered she had eaten nothing but creamed
> rice pudding from cans/tins for several years !

That does not sound like a diet with complete proteins.

[Richard K.]

"Gary" <g.ma...@att.net> wrote in message news:5092F939...@att.net...

You would kill Babe? And Charlotte's friend Wilbur?

Pigs are just as smart as dogs, and given the choice prefer to be clean than
roll around in mud. They aren't exactly as cute as dogs, but apparently can
be affectionate, and a decent pet.

[Richard K.]

"Farm1" <He...@there.sometimes> wrote in message

news:k6vvoi$5ff$2...@dont-email.me...

> Yes indeed. Additionally, I'm a cattle producer which is why I know
> something about abattoirs.

I don't think we are going to agree on much regarding meat...

abattoir blues
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-IU5eINkve0

[Je�us]

On Thu, 1 Nov 2012 22:30:36 +1100, "Farm1" <He...@there.sometimes>
wrote:

>Wearing cotton clothes where the cotton is grown, processed and sewn
>together in third world countries and then exported to first world countries
>is probably far more dishonest, lazy and parasitic than eating meat from
>animals slughtered in abattoirs in the western world.

Cotton crops may well be the most environmentally damaging crop out
there, given the modern techniques used.

[Je�us]

On 1 Nov 2012 14:56:31 GMT, notbob <not...@nothome.com> wrote:

>On 2012-11-01, Farm1 <He...@there.sometimes> wrote:
>
>> At least abattoirs in the first world are regulated and generally receive
>> regualr inspections and thus produce clean and safe food in a safe working
>> environment where injuries are compensated for, and where employees receive
>> reasonable wages, all workers are adults, receive meal breaks and don't work
>> for excessive hours.
>
>

>The sad state of our (US) slaughterhouse is near criminal. Our
>getting "clean and safe" food is probably more a case of sheer luck than
>competent oversight. But then, maybe yer not from around "here",
>your being from "@there".

True. And probably won't improve much whilst industry lobbyists are
around. Australian abattoirs are at least a bit better in that regard.

[Je�us]

On Fri, 2 Nov 2012 17:55:14 -0400, "Richard K." <Rich...@netzero.com>
wrote:

Been there, done that years ago. And still doing it.

[Je�us]

On Fri, 2 Nov 2012 18:10:38 -0400, "Richard K." <Rich...@netzero.com>
wrote:

>"Gary" <g.ma...@att.net> wrote in message news:5092F939...@att.net...
>> "Richard K." wrote:
>>>
>>> but I don't think I would ever raise and slaughter a pig, dog, or
>>> cow.
>>
>> I also would have a problem killing animals but a pig? I could do that. I
>> saw a BBQ show once where one restaurant slow roasted a whole pig, then
>> cut
>> up all parts and mixed them together.
>>
>> I could go for that. I'd love to try that too. :)
>

>You would kill Babe? And Charlotte's friend Wilbur?

Absolutely I would.

>Pigs are just as smart as dogs, and given the choice prefer to be clean than
>roll around in mud. They aren't exactly as cute as dogs, but apparently can
>be affectionate, and a decent pet.

They can, as do sheep and many other animals, for that matter.

You just need to ask yourself some questions such as:
Do you really want to eat meat, and if so, can you despatch and
butcher an animal you may have raised for months or years?

I get attached to my livestock - I even talk to them daily - but you
just have to mentally compartmentalise empathy and practicality into
separate departments.

[Je�us]

On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 15:28:05 +0000 (UTC), Doug Freyburger
<dfre...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>ret...@charter.nit wrote:
>>
>> With the present state of the economy, some people can no longer afford
>> both rent, utilities and food. The cost of rent and utilities keeps
>> going up, so the only place to cut costs is food. Ramen Noodles are
>> cheap. On sale they can cost as little as 20 cents a pack. If a person
>> eats two packs per day, their weekly cost for food is only $2.80, or
>> $11.20 per month. If purchased in quantity, a person might be able to
>> eat an entire month on $10. That is all some people can afford these
>> days. This is especially true for the elderly and disabled. The
>> question arises, is this a healthy diet. Or maybe not exactly
>> *healthy*, but can a person live on this alone?
>

>For a month you likely won't get sick. For much longer go with grains
>plus legumes. Rice and beans are the most common choice for this.

A lot of ppl have gluten and phytate intolerances with some grains and
don't even know it... such a diet would make me very ill in short
time. Sadly, grains are so pervasive, cheap and available, that they
get grossly overused in the average diet.