Dances with Keurig

[Christopher M.]

Cleaned my coffee machine with vinegar.

Must have been a little vinegar left over. It curdled my milk.

I know people sometimes add vinegar when poaching eggs. It helps to
coagulate.

Weird.


W. Pooh (AKA Winnie P.)

[Pennyaline]

On 2/6/2012 11:35 AM, Christopher M. wrote:
> Cleaned my coffee machine with vinegar.
>
> Must have been a little vinegar left over. It curdled my milk.
>
> I know people sometimes add vinegar when poaching eggs. It helps to
> coagulate.
>
> Weird.

You still had straight vinegar in your machine, even after running
rinsing cycles? Doubt it. Your milk was probably already sour.

[Dave Smith]

No, it was probably residual vinegar. It doesn't take much. I have had
the same thing happen after cleaning my espresso machine with vinegar. I
thought that I had rinsed it well enough, both through the coffee part
and the steamer part. I had filled the reservoir twice and run it about
half of each through each of the two modes. The milk curdled.

[sf]

On Mon, 6 Feb 2012 13:35:38 -0500, "Christopher M."
<nospam_...@floo.com> wrote:

> Cleaned my coffee machine with vinegar.
>
> Must have been a little vinegar left over. It curdled my milk.
>
> I know people sometimes add vinegar when poaching eggs. It helps to
> coagulate.
>
> Weird.
>

Stupid machine. I used one of those things this last Fall and failed
to understand what the big whoop is about.

Why did you feel the need to mention a brand name for this post? I
think it was for other brand name bandiers who just *have* to mention
the brand name of whatever it is they're using... like "I sautéed xyz
in my All Clad saute pan" or "I sliced xyz with my Wusthof Classic
chef's knife". Why did I need to know what brand it was other than
your ego just had to tell me that you spent a lot of money on one
item? You and your type need to get a room.

--
Food is an important part of a balanced diet.

[dsi1]

These Keurig machines have a big problem with water not being pumped
through the K-Cups. I have not been able to find out what the root of
the problem is. The symptoms are that the water starts pumping then
stops short. I suspect that the controller is shutting off the pump when
it senses an error condition. My suggestion is that you say a "Hail
Mary" right before pressing the brew button. Every time. :-)

[Dave Smith]

On 06/02/2012 3:40 PM, dsi1 wrote:

>
> These Keurig machines have a big problem with water not being pumped
> through the K-Cups. I have not been able to find out what the root of
> the problem is. The symptoms are that the water starts pumping then
> stops short. I suspect that the controller is shutting off the pump when
> it senses an error condition. My suggestion is that you say a "Hail
> Mary" right before pressing the brew button. Every time. :-)

I have limited experience with Keurig machines. I was at a friend's
place a couple months ago and the made me a coffee in their new Keurig
machine. I was not impressed. It was their their third or fourth
replacement machine in a couple months. The pumps kept failing.

[Nancy Young]

On 2/6/2012 3:40 PM, dsi1 wrote:

> These Keurig machines have a big problem with water not being pumped
> through the K-Cups. I have not been able to find out what the root of
> the problem is. The symptoms are that the water starts pumping then
> stops short. I suspect that the controller is shutting off the pump when
> it senses an error condition. My suggestion is that you say a "Hail
> Mary" right before pressing the brew button. Every time. :-)

Just from being nosy, I looked around and found a troubleshooting
section on the Keurig website. No idea if this helps, there are
other questions on the site.

Question How do I fix a short cup?

Answer
If your brewer is not brewing the full amount selected, it may be caused
by the following:
•The exit needle is clogged by coffee grounds or cocoa mix. Please refer
to the K-Cup™ Holder cleaning instructions.
•The brewer may need to be descaled. Please refer to the descaling
instructions.
•The removable water reservoir was removed during brewing. Place the
water reservoir back onto the brewer and perform a cleansing brew
without a portion pack.

[dsi1]

They probably haven't been keeping up with their pre-brew religious
rituals. The pump replacement is easy enough but the one on my machine
looks fine with no clogging and the impeller spins freely. I'm stumped.
I have an almost full box of Newman's Own K-Cups that I've got laying
around. The faces of "Nell" and "Pa" Newman printed on the box are
hideously grinning and they mock me! It's a bummer all around...

On the bright side, I'm been using a cheap 4-cup coffeemaker and right
now I'm enjoying a cup of Trung Nguyen coffee and boy is a smooth cup.
I'm pretty sure that those Vietnamese guys do something to their coffee
to make it so smooth with a distinctive chocolate taste - they may be
treating it with black tiger Chinese heroin for all I know. No matter,
I'm hooked!

[Dave Smith]

On 06/02/2012 4:14 PM, dsi1 wrote:

>> I have limited experience with Keurig machines. I was at a friend's
>> place a couple months ago and the made me a coffee in their new Keurig
>> machine. I was not impressed. It was their their third or fourth
>> replacement machine in a couple months. The pumps kept failing.
>
> They probably haven't been keeping up with their pre-brew religious
> rituals. The pump replacement is easy enough but the one on my machine
> looks fine with no clogging and the impeller spins freely. I'm stumped.
> I have an almost full box of Newman's Own K-Cups that I've got laying
> around. The faces of "Nell" and "Pa" Newman printed on the box are
> hideously grinning and they mock me! It's a bummer all around...

'

I think it was more his toy than her's, and he is into toys and cooking.
None of their machines lasted long enough or was used often to get
clogged up and worn down. They were lasting on a few weeks.

[Christopher M.]

"Nancy Young" <rjynly...@vverizon.net> wrote in message
news:4f30415d$0$24850$8826...@blocknews.net...

Thanks. Thats sounds like the problem I've been having.

[dsi1]

Thanks for the info. I've pretty much done everything posted on the
internet short of converting to Catholicism and I haven't ruled that out
either. All the needle ports and clean and I've run half a gallon of
vinegar through the machine. I'm writing a letter to the Pope if there's
no progress by tomorrow. Maybe he can help...

[dsi1]

They are an expensive way to make a single cup of coffee. You get a lot
of garbage for your local landfill too. They pretty much are the perfect
toy for our wasteful age of excess. I have one because I had a dream of
offering people that come into my office a cup of coffee. Mostly, I'm
betting that you're gonna say "no" but there are those pesky clients
that actually say "yes." I thought the Keurig would be the perfect
solution for that unlikely event. I was wrong.

[Doug Freyburger]

Dave Smith wrote:

> Pennyaline wrote:
>> Christopher M. wrote:
>
>>> Cleaned my coffee machine with vinegar.
>

>> You still had straight vinegar in your machine, even after running
>> rinsing cycles?
>

> No, it was probably residual vinegar. It doesn't take much. I have had
> the same thing happen after cleaning my espresso machine with vinegar. I
> thought that I had rinsed it well enough, both through the coffee part
> and the steamer part. I had filled the reservoir twice and run it about
> half of each through each of the two modes.

Residual vinegar is a bear to get rid of when you have a plastic water
resevior like so many coffee brewing machines. Maybe I'm more sensitive
to vinegar than most (I like vinegar in many contexts but not with
coffee or tea). I've put my resevior through the dishwasher and given
it a double rinse cycle after running vinegar through my coffee machine.
Even after running plain water a couple of times.

[Dave Smith]

On 06/02/2012 4:46 PM, dsi1 wrote:

> They are an expensive way to make a single cup of coffee. You get a lot
> of garbage for your local landfill too. They pretty much are the perfect
> toy for our wasteful age of excess. I have one because I had a dream of
> offering people that come into my office a cup of coffee. Mostly, I'm
> betting that you're gonna say "no" but there are those pesky clients
> that actually say "yes." I thought the Keurig would be the perfect
> solution for that unlikely event. I was wrong.

I long ago rejected a single cup coffee machine and an expensive luxury.
I had some Nespresso when I was visiting with our niece and I have to
admit that it was very tasty. I ruled out getting one for myself because
the machines are pricey and the coffee servings are expensive and hard
to find. The closest place that I can get them is 15 miles away and at
the time they were close to a dollar apiece. She had the same problem
with availability. She lives in Tallinn Estonia and while we were there
she ran out and could not find any more.

I have to say that I was impressed with the coffee from the Nespresso.
Not so with the Keurig. I will stick to my French press or my espresso
machine when I want one or two cups of good coffee. If we are going to
need more than that I will use the drip machine.

[dsi1]

I understand your point - I would never get a Keurig for home use. As
far as my owning one - it was the best solution I could come up with
where I could brew a single cup in a small office environment at a
moment's notice with no cleaning and no fuss. I'm open to suggestions.
As far as I know, there's really no alternative.

[BillyZoom]

On Feb 6, 3:08 pm, sf <s...@geemail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 6 Feb 2012 13:35:38 -0500, "Christopher M."
>

What crawled up your cunt, bitch? Keurig is a pretty well known
product and its mention helps with the context of the post. And I
happen to like them, although I don't own one. The big whoop is
getting a single cup of the type of coffee you want in seconds. In an
office setting they are a big hit. Also great for college students.
What was it you were trying to contribute to this?

[Kalmia]

On Feb 6, 4:08 pm, Nancy Young <rjynlynos...@vverizon.net> wrote:
> On 2/6/2012 3:40 PM, dsi1 wrote:
>
> > These Keurig machines have a big problem with water not being pumped
> > through the K-Cups. I have not been able to find out what the root of
> > the problem is. The symptoms are that the water starts pumping then
> > stops short. I suspect that the controller is shutting off the pump when
> > it senses an error condition. My suggestion is that you say a "Hail
> > Mary" right before pressing the brew button. Every time. :-)
>
> Just from being nosy, I looked around and found a troubleshooting
> section on the Keurig website.  No idea if this helps, there are
> other questions on the site.
>
> Question  How do I fix a short cup?
>
> Answer
> If your brewer is not brewing the full amount selected, it may be caused
> by the following:
> •The exit needle is clogged by coffee grounds or cocoa mix. Please refer
> to the K-Cup™ Holder cleaning instructions.
> •The brewer may need to be descaled. Please refer to the descaling
>

> •The removable water reservoir was removed during brewing. Place the
> water reservoir back onto the brewer and perform a cleansing brew
> without a portion pack.

Wow - this sounds all too complex for my pea brain. I'll stick with
my manual French press.

[Dave Smith]

On 06/02/2012 5:39 PM, dsi1 wrote:

>
> I understand your point - I would never get a Keurig for home use. As
> far as my owning one - it was the best solution I could come up with
> where I could brew a single cup in a small office environment at a
> moment's notice with no cleaning and no fuss. I'm open to suggestions.
> As far as I know, there's really no alternative.

From my limited experience..... given the disappointing coffee I had at
my friend's place, where they had been through four Keurlig machines in
less than two months..... vs my nieces's Nespresso that cost a lot more
and for which the coffee discs were more..... the Nespresso.

[merryb]

I just bought a Nespresso over the holidays, and I love it. I order
the capsules on line through their website- they are a bit cheaper and
deliver the next day. I admit that it's not that cheap, but I usually
have only one a day, so it's worth it to me.

[Pennyaline]

On 2/6/2012 2:54 PM, Doug Freyburger wrote:

> Residual vinegar is a bear to get rid of when you have a plastic water
> resevior like so many coffee brewing machines. Maybe I'm more sensitive
> to vinegar than most (I like vinegar in many contexts but not with
> coffee or tea). I've put my resevior through the dishwasher and given
> it a double rinse cycle after running vinegar through my coffee machine.
> Even after running plain water a couple of times.

Nonsense. I've been cleaning my drip machines with vinegar for years and
have never had a problem clearing it out if I run the rinses completely.
A family member cleans a Keurig with vinegar and gets it out with no
residual every time.

[Brooklyn1]

> "Nancy Young" wrote:
>> dsi1 wrote:
>>
>>> These Keurig machines have a big problem with water not being pumped
>>> through the K-Cups.
>>

>> Question How do I fix a short cup?
>>
>> Answer
>> If your brewer is not brewing the full amount selected, it may be caused
>> by the following:
>> •The exit needle is clogged by coffee grounds or cocoa mix. Please refer
>> to the K-Cup™ Holder cleaning instructions.

Nancy, if you need help with your K cups, any help at all, I'm your
man. ;)

[dsi1]

Thanks for the suggestion. I can't really say that there's much of a
difference between the two except that the Nespresso is even more
expensive. OTOH, I did see one of these machines at a ridiculous
discount about a month ago at Macys. The machine was beautiful and
selling for $65. Unfortunately (fortunately?), my bad Keurig experience
pretty much made me shy away getting my greasy little fingers on it,
although they did itch badly... Of course, I can't really use this at
the office.

[Nancy Young]

On 2/6/2012 6:48 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:

>> "Nancy Young" wrote:

>>> Question How do I fix a short cup?
>>>
>>> Answer
>>> If your brewer is not brewing the full amount selected, it may be caused
>>> by the following:
>>> •The exit needle is clogged by coffee grounds or cocoa mix. Please refer
>>> to the K-Cup™ Holder cleaning instructions.
>
> Nancy, if you need help with your K cups, any help at all, I'm your
> man. ;)

Oh, if they start being short, I'll definitely give you a ring!
(laugh)

nancy

[Ed Pawlowski]

On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 12:39:13 -1000, dsi1
<ds...@eternal-september.invalid> wrote:

>I understand your point - I would never get a Keurig for home use. As
>far as my owning one - it was the best solution I could come up with
>where I could brew a single cup in a small office environment at a
>moment's notice with no cleaning and no fuss. I'm open to suggestions.
>As far as I know, there's really no alternative.

That seems to be a logical use for them, plus the ability to offer a
selection of hot beverages. If you normally would stop at the coffee
shop and spend $3 for a take out, this is an economical alternative, I
guess, but compared to making a cup at home from really good ground
bean, it is quite pricey.

[dsi1]

There's a fast food place next door so I could always go over there and
buy a cup of coffee for $1.50. As it goes, the coffee ain't that great
but it would have been a lot cheaper for me to have done that rather
than having an expensive machine that just plum quit on me.

The K-Cups at Costco really shot up in price too. It used to cost $29
for 80, the last time I went there it was $39 for the same box. Such is
life.

[Steve Pope]

Pennyaline <norweg...@beatifulplummage.huh> wrote:

>Nonsense. I've been cleaning my drip machines with vinegar for years and
>have never had a problem clearing it out if I run the rinses completely.

One problem with vinegar is desensitization. A person who is cleaning
stuff with (or, cooking with) vinegar all the time will less notice a
vinegar odor than a typical person would.

Steve

[Pennyaline]

Okay. What's that got to do with milk curdling or not?

[sharkman]

--


"dsi1" <dsi...@hawaiiantel.net> wrote in message
news:4f303ac2$0$29778$882e...@usenet-news.net...

Mine failed after about 7 months... I called Keurig and after trying to
troubleshoot it, determined that it was truly dead. They
sent me a brand new machine. All they required was that after I received the
new one,
I send them back the removable basket, that the coffee pod sits in, from
the old one.

I was very happy with their customer service.

sharkman

[Dave Smith]

That would appear to be a problem with vinegar in the water, not being
oversensitive or desensitized.

[Pennyaline]

I doubt very much that there was enough residual vinegar in the machine
to acidify the water so much that it curdled good milk. I maintain that
the OP's milk was sour or nearly so to begin with, and that pouring it
into hot coffee did the rest.

[Dave Smith]

On 07/02/2012 9:56 AM, Pennyaline wrote:
>> That would appear to be a problem with vinegar in the water, not being
>> oversensitive or desensitized.
>
>
> I doubt very much that there was enough residual vinegar in the machine
> to acidify the water so much that it curdled good milk. I maintain that
> the OP's milk was sour or nearly so to begin with, and that pouring it
> into hot coffee did the rest.

I found out for myself how easy it is to curdle milk after cleaning a
coffee machine with vinegar. As I posted before, I had cleaned out my
espresso machine with vinegar. Then I rinsed the reservoir thoroughly,
filled it up and ran the water through both the coffee maker part and
the steamer....several times. When I was finished I made myself a latte
and the milk curdled.

[dsi1]

>Mine failed after about 7 months... I called Keurig and after trying to
>troubleshoot it, determined that it was truly dead. They
>sent me a brand new machine. All they required was that after I received the
>new one,
>I send them back the removable basket, that the coffee pod sits in, from
>the old one.

>I was very happy with their customer service.

>sharkman

Sounds like a good deal to me!

[spamtrap1888]

On Feb 7, 6:56 am, Pennyaline <norwegianb...@beatifulplummage.huh>
wrote:

> On 2/7/2012 7:34 AM, Dave Smith wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 07/02/2012 1:11 AM, Pennyaline wrote:
> >> On 2/6/2012 8:39 PM, Steve Pope wrote:

> >>> Pennyaline<norwegianb...@beatifulplummage.huh> wrote:
>
> >>>> Nonsense. I've been cleaning my drip machines with vinegar for years
> >>>> and
> >>>> have never had a problem clearing it out if I run the rinses
> >>>> completely.
>
> >>> One problem with vinegar is desensitization. A person who is cleaning
> >>> stuff with (or, cooking with) vinegar all the time will less notice a
> >>> vinegar odor than a typical person would.
>
> >> Okay. What's that got to do with milk curdling or not?
>
> > That would appear to be a problem with vinegar in the water, not being
> > oversensitive or desensitized.
>
> I doubt very much that there was enough residual vinegar in the machine
> to acidify the water so much that it curdled good milk. I maintain that
> the OP's milk was sour or nearly so to begin with, and that pouring it
> into hot coffee did the rest.

Before it has really turned, our half and half gives us an early
warning signal by clotting in the coffee. It's not really sour at this
point.

[Pennyaline]

I don't doubt that the milk curdled. I doubt that there was enough
residual vinegar in a system that had been properly cleared to curdle
the milk. If all was done properly, the vinegar didn't do it.

[spamtrap1888]

Did you ever look into espresso pods? Illycaffe makes them, among
others. They are a scaled down version of the coffee pack found in
hotel rooms, in that they are ground coffee surrounded by filter
material. Much less waste packaging, and more useful than a K-cup
machine, in that machines that use them is that they usually can also
brew from tamped grounds -- the pods have their own form-fitting
portafilter. Thus if the pod makers go out of business, the machine
still would be useful.

[Dave Smith]

On 07/02/2012 11:41 AM, Pennyaline wrote:

>> I found out for myself how easy it is to curdle milk after cleaning a
>> coffee machine with vinegar. As I posted before, I had cleaned out my
>> espresso machine with vinegar. Then I rinsed the reservoir thoroughly,
>> filled it up and ran the water through both the coffee maker part and
>> the steamer....several times. When I was finished I made myself a latte
>> and the milk curdled.
>
>
> I don't doubt that the milk curdled. I doubt that there was enough
> residual vinegar in a system that had been properly cleared to curdle
> the milk. If all was done properly, the vinegar didn't do it.

How much vinegar do you think it takes to start milk curdling? IN my
case, I had just cleaned the machine and I thought it had been
thoroughly rinsed. The milk was reasonably fresh. I dumped it out,
drained the machine machine's reservoir, rinsed it out and then ran ta
couple more liters of water through it and tried again, and there was no
curdling.

[Pennyaline]

I've curdled milk with vinegar, when I've needed buttermilk and didn't
have any. That's adding vinegar directly to milk. Small amounts of
vinegar do it very well that way, but it takes more than a couple of drops.

I've also curdled milk in coffee, milk that seemed to be okay but was
close to date and had been in the fridge for a while--smelled okay,
tasted okay, but it curdled in hot coffee. Had nothing to do with
residual vinegar as the coffee maker hadn't been descaled in a while.

I've enjoyed coffee with milk fresh from a newly cleaned machine, no
curdling.

If the machine is rinsed correctly after cleaning, given the dilutional
effect of water rinses on the vinegar plus dilution by the coffee
itself, it is very unlikely that residual vinegar, if there is any,
caused the milk to curdle.

[dsi1]

On 2/7/2012 7:31 AM, spamtrap1888 wrote:
> Did you ever look into espresso pods? Illycaffe makes them, among
> others. They are a scaled down version of the coffee pack found in
> hotel rooms, in that they are ground coffee surrounded by filter
> material. Much less waste packaging, and more useful than a K-cup
> machine, in that machines that use them is that they usually can also
> brew from tamped grounds -- the pods have their own form-fitting
> portafilter. Thus if the pod makers go out of business, the machine
> still would be useful.

I'm always on the lookout for single serve machines. I did have a coffee
maker that used pods and brewed single cups pre-Keurig. It was a deal,
$20 for the machine and a package of pods. The coffee was just so-so but
the box could have been sitting in a warehouse for God know how long. I
don't believe that there was an option for an external filter.

Unfortunately, I couldn't find a local source for the pods and the
postage to Hawaii for some pods through Amazon made that not practical.
Thanks for the thoughtful suggestions though.

[Jerry Avins]

Have you considered that your water might be slightly alkaline? The vinegar dissolves hard-water deposits. Hard water neutralizes vinegar.

Those who have difficulty with residual vinegar can be helped by a semifinal rinse containing baking soda.

Jerry
--
"I view the progress of science as being the slow erosion of the
tendency to dichotomize." Barbara Smuts, U. Mich.

[dsi1]

On 2/7/2012 5:31 AM, Dave Smith wrote:
>
> I found out for myself how easy it is to curdle milk after cleaning a
> coffee machine with vinegar. As I posted before, I had cleaned out my
> espresso machine with vinegar. Then I rinsed the reservoir thoroughly,
> filled it up and ran the water through both the coffee maker part and
> the steamer....several times. When I was finished I made myself a latte
> and the milk curdled.

It's a neat reaction. I've mixed milk and vinegar and used it as a
substitute for buttermilk. Pepsi mixed with an equal portion of milk
makes a surprising tasty drink but you have to drink that down fast or
it gets icky real fast.

[Doug Freyburger]

Since I only put dairy in my coffee a couple of times per year I have no
idea how much vinegar it takes to curdle milk in coffee. I just know
that after following the instructions for cleaning a either a Mr Coffee
or a Keurig with distilled white vinegar including the number of rinse
runs the next day I can still smell the vinegar throughout the house
when brewing and the vinegar smell is clear and obvious in my coffee. I
have taken up putting the resevior in the dishwasher.

If this means I'm more sensitive to the smell of vinegar than average so
be it. At places that offer malt vingar with fries I can smell it
several tables away. But I like vinegar on fries where I don't like it
in my coffee.

[Steve Pope]

Pennyaline wrote:
> Steve Pope wrote:
>> Pennyaline<norweg...@beatifulplummage.huh> wrote:
>
>>> Nonsense. I've been cleaning my drip machines with vinegar for years and
>>> have never had a problem clearing it out if I run the rinses completely.
>
>> One problem with vinegar is desensitization. A person who is cleaning
>> stuff with (or, cooking with) vinegar all the time will less notice a
>> vinegar odor than a typical person would.
>
> Okay. What's that got to do with milk curdling or not?

There are two possible problems with vinegar residue. One is odor,
the other is curdling. I was only talking about the odor problem.

The curdling problem is interesting; chemically, a vinegar reaction
might leave behind higher-molecular-weight acidic compounds, which
then can curdle something. So even if the vinegar totally evaporates,
you might get curdling.

It is also possible such compounds have an odor in some cases.

Lots of issues. Personally I dislike any use of vinegar for cleaning.



Steve

[Steve Pope]

Jerry Avins <rec.food...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

>On Monday, February 6, 2012 6:27:07 PM UTC-5, Pennyaline wrote:
>> On 2/6/2012 2:54 PM, Doug Freyburger wrote:
>>
>> > Residual vinegar is a bear to get rid of when you have a plastic water
>> > resevior like so many coffee brewing machines. Maybe I'm more sensitive
>> > to vinegar than most (I like vinegar in many contexts but not with
>> > coffee or tea). I've put my resevior through the dishwasher and given
>> > it a double rinse cycle after running vinegar through my coffee machine.
>> > Even after running plain water a couple of times.
>>
>> Nonsense. I've been cleaning my drip machines with vinegar for years and
>> have never had a problem clearing it out if I run the rinses completely.
>> A family member cleans a Keurig with vinegar and gets it out with no
>> residual every time.
>
>Have you considered that your water might be slightly alkaline? The
>vinegar dissolves hard-water deposits. Hard water neutralizes vinegar.

One of course should not be making coffee with other than filtered
water.


Steve

[Dave Smith]

On 07/02/2012 2:17 PM, Pennyaline wrote:

> I've also curdled milk in coffee, milk that seemed to be okay but was
> close to date and had been in the fridge for a while--smelled okay,
> tasted okay, but it curdled in hot coffee. Had nothing to do with
> residual vinegar as the coffee maker hadn't been descaled in a while.
>
> I've enjoyed coffee with milk fresh from a newly cleaned machine, no
> curdling.
>
> If the machine is rinsed correctly after cleaning, given the dilutional
> effect of water rinses on the vinegar plus dilution by the coffee
> itself, it is very unlikely that residual vinegar, if there is any,
> caused the milk to curdle.

Sure. That's what you would think. I sure did. Over the years I have
cleaned coffee machines many times with vinegar, and every time I do it
I make sure to run several pots of water through the machine to purge
the vinegar. Then one time I got a rude surprise. I thought I had run
enough water through to get rid of the vinegar. Apparently I had not.

[Pennyaline]

I have only ever run one full carafe of fresh water through a cycle
after descaling, and have never had a problem with residual vinegar. I
still believe that blame is being misplaced.

[Pennyaline]

On 2/7/2012 12:34 PM, Jerry Avins wrote:
> On Monday, February 6, 2012 6:27:07 PM UTC-5, Pennyaline wrote:
>> On 2/6/2012 2:54 PM, Doug Freyburger wrote:
>>
>>> Residual vinegar is a bear to get rid of when you have a plastic water
>>> resevior like so many coffee brewing machines. Maybe I'm more sensitive
>>> to vinegar than most (I like vinegar in many contexts but not with
>>> coffee or tea). I've put my resevior through the dishwasher and given
>>> it a double rinse cycle after running vinegar through my coffee machine.
>>> Even after running plain water a couple of times.
>>
>> Nonsense. I've been cleaning my drip machines with vinegar for years and
>> have never had a problem clearing it out if I run the rinses completely.
>> A family member cleans a Keurig with vinegar and gets it out with no
>> residual every time.
>
> Have you considered that your water might be slightly alkaline? The vinegar dissolves hard-water deposits. Hard water neutralizes vinegar.
>
> Those who have difficulty with residual vinegar can be helped by a semifinal rinse containing baking soda.

Yeah, I know what acids and bases do to each other, thanks. My water is
not "slightly" alkaline. At 37 grains, it's preposterously alkaline. But
I haven't lived here all of my life. I lived for decades in areas
without hard water and have had no trouble at all with "residual
vinegar" from a coffee maker curdling milk in coffee.

[jmcquown]

"BillyZoom" <meda...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a164ff21-f288-4641...@b23g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 6, 3:08 pm, sf <s...@geemail.com> wrote:
>> On Mon, 6 Feb 2012 13:35:38 -0500, "Christopher M."

>>
>> <nospam_flibb...@floo.com> wrote:
>> > Cleaned my coffee machine with vinegar.
>>
>> > Must have been a little vinegar left over. It curdled my milk.
>>
>> > I know people sometimes add vinegar when poaching eggs. It helps to
>> > coagulate.
>>
>> > Weird.
>>

>> Stupid machine. I used one of those things this last Fall and failed
>> to understand what the big whoop is about.
>>
>> Why did you feel the need to mention a brand name for this post? I
>> think it was for other brand name bandiers who just *have* to mention
>> the brand name of whatever it is they're using... like "I sautéed xyz
>> in my All Clad saute pan" or "I sliced xyz with my Wusthof Classic
>> chef's knife". Why did I need to know what brand it was other than
>> your ego just had to tell me that you spent a lot of money on one
>> item? You and your type need to get a room.
>>
>> --
>> Food is an important part of a balanced diet.
>
> What crawled up your cunt, bitch? Keurig is a pretty well known
> product and its mention helps with the context of the post. And I
> happen to like them, although I don't own one. The big whoop is
> getting a single cup of the type of coffee you want in seconds. In an
> office setting they are a big hit. Also great for college students.
> What was it you were trying to contribute to this?


Chill, folks! I didn't have a problem with the brand being mentioned
because I knew exactly what the OP was referring to. I wouldn't shell out
the $$ to buy one. Then again, I only drink coffee about once a month (if
that). At the office, the brand wasn't a Keurig but it was the same
concept. You could brew a single cup of coffee in about 30 seconds. They
shelled out extra bucks to buy different coffee packets and flavoured
creamers. They even had syrup dispensers in case someone wanted a shot of,
say, kalhua (non-alcoholic, of course!) in their coffee. IMHO, a huge
expense and a great waste of money for what is (essentially) instant coffee.
Thank goodness they also had a regular coffee machine (Bunn) and real coffee
:) Having said that, my neighbor has a double shot coffee machine (two
cups, side by side) similar to the Keurig. I'll have to ask her the brand.
I've never seen one quite like it before.

Jill

[Dave Smith]

On 07/02/2012 10:13 PM, Pennyaline wrote:

>>
>> Sure. That's what you would think. I sure did. Over the years I have
>> cleaned coffee machines many times with vinegar, and every time I do it
>> I make sure to run several pots of water through the machine to purge
>> the vinegar. Then one time I got a rude surprise. I thought I had run
>> enough water through to get rid of the vinegar. Apparently I had not.
>
>
> I have only ever run one full carafe of fresh water through a cycle
> after descaling, and have never had a problem with residual vinegar. I
> still believe that blame is being misplaced.

Yes yes, but someone here complained that the residual vinegar soured
his milk. You said it couldn't happen if had been rinsed. I recounted my
experience of giving it a good rinse and it happened to me.

[Doug Freyburger]

Nothing in the case of my post. That's how UseNet postings work. You
trim out the part you do respond to and keep in the part you do respond
to. I stated that after following the directions I can still taste the
vinegar. You responded with the word nonsense. Thus you claimed that
no one can taste vinegar in their coffee the first time after a
descaling as long as the printed directions are followed. It's not
nonsense. I've tasted the vinegar enough times I've taken up washing
the resevior in the dishwasher after a descaling.

[BillyZoom]

On Feb 8, 9:18 am, "jmcquown" <j_mcqu...@comcast.net> wrote:
> "BillyZoom" <medav...@gmail.com> wrote in message

Nobody was talking to you, hillbilly.

[Pennyaline]

On 2/8/2012 3:33 PM, Doug Freyburger wrote:
> Pennyaline wrote:
>> Steve Pope wrote:
>>> Pennyaline<norweg...@beatifulplummage.huh> wrote:
>>
>>>> Nonsense. I've been cleaning my drip machines with vinegar for years and
>>>> have never had a problem clearing it out if I run the rinses completely.
>>
>>> One problem with vinegar is desensitization. A person who is cleaning
>>> stuff with (or, cooking with) vinegar all the time will less notice a
>>> vinegar odor than a typical person would.
>>
>> Okay. What's that got to do with milk curdling or not?
>
> Nothing in the case of my post. That's how UseNet postings work. You
> trim out the part you do respond to and keep in the part you do respond
> to.

Uhhhhhh... I'm not sure about that.

> I stated that after following the directions I can still taste the
> vinegar. You responded with the word nonsense. Thus you claimed that
> no one can taste vinegar in their coffee the first time after a
> descaling as long as the printed directions are followed. It's not
> nonsense. I've tasted the vinegar enough times I've taken up washing
> the resevior in the dishwasher after a descaling.

I didn't say that no one could taste vinegar after descaling, did I? No.
You inferred it, which isn't the same. But no matter. Let's get back to
the gist of this, which is again:

>>> Okay. What's that got to do with milk curdling or not?
>>
>> Nothing in the case of my post.

That's what I thought. Your post had nothing to do with mine.

[spamtrap1888]

On Feb 8, 2:33 pm, Doug Freyburger <dfrey...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Pennyaline wrote:
> > Steve Pope wrote:

> >> Pennyaline<norwegianb...@beatifulplummage.huh>  wrote:

She thought you were addressing the main argument instead of taking a
little side path.

Apparent argument:

1. Is there enough vinegar present after cleaning a coffeemaker to
curdle milk?
2. Vinegar curdles milk.
3. Vinegar is used to clean out coffeemakers.
4. Water is used to flush out the vinegar to prevent curdling.
5. "I" can't taste vinegar in the rinse water, yet the milk curdles.
6. Maybe you're desensitized to the taste of vinegar
7. Then there could be sufficient vinegar to curdle the milk, because
your detection threshold is higher than the curdle threshold.

But you actually said the opposite of 5 and 7: You can always taste
vinegar in the rinse water. By the time you can no longer taste it,
there's not enough vinegar to curdle milk, thus your detection
threshold is less than the curdle threshold.

[99princ...@gmail.com]

I don't know If any of you have tried the Cuisinart keurig... but, this has been woking perfect for years.. not one have I ever even cleaned it.

[Hidalgo]

99princ...@gmail.com wrote:
> I don't know If any of you have tried the Cuisinart keurig... but, this has been woking perfect for years.. not one have I ever even cleaned it.
>

First president to try to make a difference in health care

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