Would you like ketchup in your tea?

[Ed Pawlowski]

Close call this afternoon. When I make a cup of tea, while the water is
heating I put either sugar or honey in the mug, put the basket in, add
the loose tea. When heated, pour the water.

My cleaning lady came today and of course did the kitchen counter. In
the spot where the honey squeeze bottle usually is, she put the ketchup.
I just grabbed, squeezed, then looked.

Easy fix to rinse the mug. If I had the tea made first it would have
been quite different.

[S Viemeister]

I always use a teapot - helps to avoid that sort of thing.
You know, it might have been an interesting taste...

[Dave Smith]

On 2023-01-11 3:37 p.m., Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> Close call this afternoon.  When I make a cup of tea, while the water is
> heating I put either sugar or honey in the mug, put the basket in, add
> the loose tea.  When heated, pour the water.

Loose tea is indeed the way to go. I was not drinking tea for a long
time but over the years have started having it more often. It's actually
difficult to get loose tea here. There is only one local grocery store
that carries it. There is a tea shop in a mall not too far from here,
but it is pretty expensive and not impressive enough to warrant the trip
or the price. However, my wife got me a box of loose tea at Lee Valley
that is pretty good. I would encourage you to learn to drink tea without
sweetening. IMO tea really doesn't need to be sweet and I find it much
more refreshing without the sweetness.

>
> My cleaning lady came today and of course did the kitchen counter.  In
> the spot where the honey squeeze bottle usually is, she put the ketchup.
>  I just grabbed, squeezed, then looked.
>
> Easy fix to rinse the mug.  If I had the tea made first it would have
> been quite different.

Oh you poor boy. That must have been a terrible shock. Some people here
would be claiming PTSD after such an ordeal.

[Bruce]

Names and license plates, please!

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 1/11/2023 4:31 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2023-01-11 3:37 p.m., Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> Close call this afternoon.  When I make a cup of tea, while the water
>> is heating I put either sugar or honey in the mug, put the basket in,
>> add the loose tea.  When heated, pour the water.
>
> Loose tea is indeed the way to go. I was not drinking tea for a long
> time but over the years have started having it more often. It's actually
> difficult to get loose tea here. There is only one local grocery store
> that carries it. There is a tea shop in a mall not too far from here,
> but it is pretty expensive and not impressive enough to warrant the trip
> or the price. However, my wife got me a box of loose tea at Lee Valley
> that is pretty good. I would encourage you to learn to drink tea without
> sweetening. IMO tea really doesn't need to be sweet and I find it much
> more refreshing without the sweetness.

www.teatrader.com In Calgary. I've been buying from the for many years
now. Quite a selection but I tend to stick to black tea. The English
Breakfast is very smooth but this week Nilgiri BOP in the morning.

I've cut the sugar by half what I used to use.

>
>
>>
>> My cleaning lady came today and of course did the kitchen counter.  In
>> the spot where the honey squeeze bottle usually is, she put the
>> ketchup.   I just grabbed, squeezed, then looked.
>>
>> Easy fix to rinse the mug.  If I had the tea made first it would have
>> been quite different.
>
> Oh you poor boy. That must have been a terrible shock.  Some people here
> would be claiming PTSD after such an ordeal.

I'm recovering.

[Mike Duffy]

On 2023-01-11, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

> Close call this afternoon. [...]

> If I had the tea made first it
> would have been quite different.

I imagined lots worse before I
got to the end of your message.

It's probably my fault for not
looking at the subject line.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

I bet that would have been, um, er, ah 'tasty.' 😝

[Michael Trew]

On 1/11/2023 16:31, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2023-01-11 3:37 p.m., Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> Close call this afternoon. When I make a cup of tea, while the water
>> is heating I put either sugar or honey in the mug, put the basket in,
>> add the loose tea. When heated, pour the water.
>
> Loose tea is indeed the way to go. I was not drinking tea for a long
> time but over the years have started having it more often. It's actually
> difficult to get loose tea here. There is only one local grocery store
> that carries it.

I rarely drink tea, but I have some loose-leaf tea here which was sent
to me in the mail. It's far superior to bags of black tea.

>> My cleaning lady came today and of course did the kitchen counter. In
>> the spot where the honey squeeze bottle usually is, she put the
>> ketchup. I just grabbed, squeezed, then looked.

Couldn't happen here; I have a glass jar of catsup. Don't you keep your
catsup in the refrigerator? I don't know if it's necessary, but that's
what we've always done since I was a child.

[Bering Sea Bar & Brig@MarthaStewart.GoodThing]

On Wednesday, January 11, 2023 at 2:37:48 PM UTC-6, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

I'll sometimes spit the mouth wash into my coffee mug for it to work the mug stains on the bottom during the day. Mouth wash is not a pleasant flavor for the evening tea.

[Dave Smith]

My mother kept ketchup in a cupboard and it never went bad. There were 6
in my family and that included 4 boys, and a bottle didn't last very
long. I keep keep ketchup in the fridge to be on the safe side because
it is likely to be there for a year.

[Hank Rogers]

Ed, do you still Peek up her dress when she's cleaning?

I remember you used to check her out. It's nice to have servants.

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 1/11/2023 7:48 PM, Michael Trew wrote:

>
> Couldn't happen here; I have a glass jar of catsup.  Don't you keep your
> catsup in the refrigerator?  I don't know if it's necessary, but that's
> what we've always done since I was a child.

Never kept in the refrigerator. That goes back to when I was a kid.
Plenty of acid in it.

Can't recall the last time I saw it in glass either. A rarity these days.

[Ed Pawlowski]

I don't buy the Super Humungo size for that reason.

[Ed Pawlowski]

She changed my bed sheets too!

[Hank Rogers]

I like to buy things in 55 gallon barrels, or 4X4 pallets. That
way, I never run out.

And there's plenty to throw out my window for the critters.

[Sqwertz]

Be careful she doesn't swap the BenGay or Preparation H with the
Toothpaste.

I did the BenGay thing once, My first thought was, "Wow! This is
an extra-minty tooth paste...", then looked at the tube again.

-sw

[Bruce]

On Wed, 11 Jan 2023 21:45:11 -0600, Sqwertz <sqwe...@gmail.invalid>
wrote:

Must be some gay lubricant.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[Cindy Hamilton]

I had a friend who bought honey in the plastic bear-shaped bottle.
Someone in his household reused the bottle for chili oil (might have
been him). One morning he wasn't careful when preparing his tea.
It provided a quick wake-up, though.

--
Cindy Hamilton

[Gary]

In the spirit of "Just try one bite,"
Maybe "Just take one sip." heh heh

You never know - Ed might have accidentally discovered a new tea trend.
Even with a failed experiment, the cost would be minimal.

[songbird]

Cindy Hamilton wrote:
...

> I had a friend who bought honey in the plastic bear-shaped bottle.
> Someone in his household reused the bottle for chili oil (might have
> been him). One morning he wasn't careful when preparing his tea.
> It provided a quick wake-up, though.

i like hot sauce in hot chocolate. it's a pretty good
change of pace if you like some spicy/heat once in a
while.


songbird

[Dave Smith]

I discovered a tea trend I do not recommend. Our neighbour gave us a
gift basket than included to specialty teas. One was Rooibis, a South
African herbal tea that is not bad. The other was called Dirty Chai, a
combination of chai spices and espresson. Yech. I can't imagine that
someone tried that and thought it might be marketable. It was disgusting.

>

[Gary]

Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> I had a friend who bought honey in the plastic bear-shaped bottle.
> Someone in his household reused the bottle for chili oil (might have
> been him). One morning he wasn't careful when preparing his tea.
> It provided a quick wake-up, though.

I used to make a 16oz cup of coffee each morning to take to work.
My wife kept sugar and salt in the smaller canisters and one day, I
messed up.

First sip of coffee at work that morning certainly woke me up. lol

[Dave Smith]

For a while we were keeping bowl of salt on the counter near the stove.
Our son was home visiting. He poured himself a cup of coffee and stuck
the spoon into the bowl with the white crystals, stirred it, took a sip
and had a rude surprise.

[bruce bowser]

On Wednesday, January 11, 2023 at 3:37:48 PM UTC-5, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> Close call this afternoon. When I make a cup of tea,

"Teas have a type of flavonoid called catechins that may boost metabolism and help your body break down fats more quickly. And the caffeine in many teas increases your energy use, causing your body to burn more calories."

Could Tea Help You Lose Weight?
WebMD - Nov 18, 2022
-- https://www.webmd.com/diet/tea-and-weight-loss

[songbird]

if you are drinking water with a few flavorings and no
calories vs. stuffing your gob with all sorts of other
things that do have calories then sure it can help.

in the end though there is the equation which still
holds. calories in must be less than calories burned
to lose weight. no magic involved and you don't need
any special whatever to accomplish it other than
paying attention to what you're doing to yourself.


songbird

[Bruce]

On Thu, 12 Jan 2023 17:59:16 -0500, songbird <song...@anthive.com>
wrote:

Instead, people go on diets that tell them to eat 4 eggs for breakfast
and Fred Flintstone amounts of meat for dinner, but NO CARBS. That way
they can continue stuffing themselves as if it's going out of fashion,
while maybe, possibly still losing weight.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[songbird]

Bruce wrote:
...

> Instead, people go on diets that tell them to eat 4 eggs for breakfast
> and Fred Flintstone amounts of meat for dinner, but NO CARBS. That way
> they can continue stuffing themselves as if it's going out of fashion,
> while maybe, possibly still losing weight.

paleo/keto folks are ignoring the fact that humans are
omnivores and not strict carnivores.

eat more fiber and more vegetables and fruits (but not
fruit juices because they don't have the fiber either)
and just a bit of meat here and there. watch your over-
all calories going in and make sure to keep them within
range of what you burn.

i have to adjust quite a bit from summer to winter and
that can be a difference of 4,000 calories a day.


songbird

[Hank Rogers]

Exactly. Some people say they gain weight without eating. That is
bullshit. If no vittles are given to a prisoner, they loose weight.

It's a fundamental result of physics, thermodynamics, etc.

Perhaps others can explain with fancy science, but I know that if
you throttle back the grub, any organism looses mass.

[f...@sdf.org]

On 2023-01-11, Dave Smith <adavid...@sympatico.ca> wrote:

> Loose tea is indeed the way to go. I was not drinking tea for a long
> time but over the years have started having it more often. It's actually
> difficult to get loose tea here.

FYI; ive purchased quit a few different kinds of loose tea from Monterey
Bay Herb (formerly Spice) Company and have never been disappointed. i'd
much prefer to shop local and do get specific loose teas at Asian markets
(such as china black lichee and china special gunpowder green) but
Herbco as a nice variety in one place. suggest take a look.

https://www.herbco.com

--
SDF Public Access UNIX System - https://sdf.org

That which does not kill you makes you stranger.
-- Trevor Goodchild - AEon Flux

[Michael Trew]

It's not cheap to buy it in glass, but my grocer still carries Heinz
that way. I use very little of it, so that's what I buy. I don't like
the thought of plastic chemicals potentially leaching out into the
contents over months and months.

[Cindy Hamilton]

Plastics do most of their leaching at higher temperatures and into fats,
since they are lipophilic. Oh, I see they're working on bio-based
plasticizers (the part that migrates) for food packaging. Cool.

They're also developing biodegradable packaging from plant sources,
which is even better. I imagine I'll be sending my food scraps out
for composting within a few years, just as they already do in more
progressive cities. Ideally, that would include composting of
suitably biodegradable packaging.

It doesn't hurt to buy ketchup in glass, but I wouldn't worry about
you or your daughter eating ketchup from plastic once in a while.

--
Cindy Hamilton

[Michael Trew]

On 1/14/2023 5:56, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On 2023-01-14, Michael Trew<michae...@att.net> wrote:
>>
>> It's not cheap to buy it in glass, but my grocer still carries Heinz
>> that way. I use very little of it, so that's what I buy. I don't like
>> the thought of plastic chemicals potentially leaching out into the
>> contents over months and months.
>
> Plastics do most of their leaching at higher temperatures and into fats,
> since they are lipophilic. Oh, I see they're working on bio-based
> plasticizers (the part that migrates) for food packaging. Cool.

Interesting.

> It doesn't hurt to buy ketchup in glass, but I wouldn't worry about
> you or your daughter eating ketchup from plastic once in a while.

True enough. Despite my frugality, I spring for glass when I can. I
usually only buy the nicer olive oil in glass, as opposed to the store
brand in plastic. Same for cider vinegar, etc.

Part of me probably believes that they'll stop selling catsup in glass
bottles if no one buys it. It's been a long time since I've been to a
restaurant with a glass bottle of Heinz on the table.

[Cindy Hamilton]

On 2023-01-15, Michael Trew <michae...@att.net> wrote:
>
> Part of me probably believes that they'll stop selling catsup in glass
> bottles if no one buys it. It's been a long time since I've been to a
> restaurant with a glass bottle of Heinz on the table.

It's been about three years since I've been in any restaurant with a
bottle of ketchup on the table. Since COVID, the bar where we used
to get burgers is open only for dinner, and we don't like to eat so
much food that late in the day.

Most places we go to are ethnic or don't serve food that goes with
ketchup.

--
Cindy Hamilton

[Bruce]

On Sun, 15 Jan 2023 11:12:26 -0500, Michael Trew
<michae...@att.net> wrote:

>Part of me probably believes that they'll stop selling catsup in glass
>bottles if no one buys it.

Which part of you does not believe that?

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Sunday, January 15, 2023 at 10:48:02 AM UTC-6, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>
> Most places we go to are ethnic or don't serve food that goes with
> ketchup.
>

> Cindy Hamilton
>
I'm not a fan of ketchup and don't want it on my fries. But one thing I think
it's really good on is onion rings. Two different foods but for me, onion rings
sorta beg for ketchup.

[Bruce]

Ketchup is for adults with underdeveloped taste buds, just like apple
sauce.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[dsi1]

I microwaved some scrambled eggs the other day, which is not a good idea. Dumping some ketchup on it made it edible again by giving it lubrication. Thanks ketchup!

[Bruce]

Ok, but that's an emergency :)

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[dsi1]

It did save the day. I would normally remove eggs from a plate of food going into the microwave. But I was too lazy to open up the container. I'll go to hell for being lazy and heating up eggs like that.

[Cindy Hamilton]

To each their own. For a while I was eating onion rings with
cocktail sauce. Which is ketchup with stuff in it.

--
Cindy Hamilton

[Gary]

On 1/11/2023 9:07 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 1/11/2023 7:48 PM, Michael Trew wrote:
>
>>
>> Couldn't happen here; I have a glass jar of catsup.  Don't you keep
>> your catsup in the refrigerator?  I don't know if it's necessary, but
>> that's what we've always done since I was a child.
>
> Never kept in the refrigerator.  That goes back to when I was a kid.
> Plenty of acid in it.
>
> Can't recall the last time I saw it in glass either.  A rarity these days.

Isn't even the spelling, "catsup" an old spelling?

Anyway, not necessary to refrigerate that.
I always buy a 38oz bottle of "ketchup."
It lives on my kitchen counter and lasts for maybe 6 months or so.

[Dave Smith]

I remember seeing catsup on bottles when I was a kid. AAMOF for a long
time and the rare occasion that I had to write it, I always wondered how
I should spell it. Apparently Heinz started marketing it as ketchup in
the 1870s so that is what most people are accustomed to.

[Ed Pawlowski]

As a kid, my mother bought Ritter Catsup. a local brand.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/159358942@N07/48285977981

Why did catsup change to ketchup?
According to a Heinz spokesperson, Henry John Heinz first brought his
product to market as “Heinz Tomato Catsup,” but changed the spelling
early on to distinguish it from competitors. Del Monte did not switch
spellings until 1988, after it became clear that ketchup was the
spelling of choice for American consumers.

More than you want to know about Heinz

https://tinyurl.com/mpv9m2mv

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 1/17/2023 10:52 AM, Gary wrote:

[dsi1]

Catsup is pronounced differently from ketchup. Catsup is the old-fashioned pronunciation. Some people will say "catsup" and spell it differently i.e., "ketchup." It's quite an unusual situation. I like to say "catsup" because I'm a down home kind of guy.

[Graham]

On 2023-01-17 9:29 a.m., Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 1/17/2023 10:52 AM, Gary wrote:
>> On 1/11/2023 9:07 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>> On 1/11/2023 7:48 PM, Michael Trew wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Couldn't happen here; I have a glass jar of catsup.  Don't you keep
>>>> your catsup in the refrigerator?  I don't know if it's necessary,
>>>> but that's what we've always done since I was a child.
>>>
>>> Never kept in the refrigerator.  That goes back to when I was a kid.
>>> Plenty of acid in it.
>>>
>>> Can't recall the last time I saw it in glass either.  A rarity these
>>> days.
>>
>> Isn't even the spelling, "catsup" an old spelling?
>>
>> Anyway, not necessary to refrigerate that.
>> I always buy a 38oz bottle of "ketchup."
>> It lives on my kitchen counter and lasts for maybe 6 months or so.
>>
>>
>>
> As a kid, my mother bought Ritter Catsup.  a local brand.
>
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/159358942@N07/48285977981
>
> Why did catsup change to ketchup?

I thought "ketchup" was an anglicised Hindi word, from the British Raj.
So the question is:
when/where did "catsup" originate.
NB: I haven't bothered to google it.

[Bruce]

Yesterday, I heard a doctor say that ketchup consists, to a large
degree, of -very unhealthy- (Sheldon: unhealthful) corn syrup. But I
don't remember seeing that in the ingredient list.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[Ed Pawlowski]

Ketchup
Derivative of a Chinese word for fermented fish.

Why was it called catsup?
Origin of the Words Ketchup and Catsup

"Catsup", which dates to the same time, may well be a different
Romanization of the same word, trying to come closer to a sound that
doesn't really exist in English. In the 1800s, "ketchup" was most common
in Britain and "catsup" was most common in the US for reasons unknown.

[Bruce]

Some people write gaol or are called Iain.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[Bruce]

Also for Dutch and Australian consumers. I thought "catsup" was
deliberate retardation, at first.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[Bruce]

"Both words are derived from the Chinese ke-tsiap, a pickled fish
sauce. It made its way to Malaysia where it became kechap and ketjap
in Indonesia."
https://www.diffen.com/difference/Catsup_vs_Ketchup

Of course, ketjap/kecap is soy sauce with palm sugar and has no
tomatoes in it.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[Graham]

One learns something new every day:-)
Now, how did Beijing become Peking? :-)

[Dave Smith]

Possibly the same way that Bombay became Mumbai.

It's interesting the way different cultures name other countries and
their cities. Look at English and its European neighbours. We call
France France and in England they actually pronounce it a little closer
to the way the French do. We call their neighbour Germany, but the
Germans call is Deutchland

Norway....... Norge
Denmark.......Danmark
Netherlands...Nederland
Sweden ......Sverge
Poland......Polska
Hungary.......Magyarorszag
Slovenia.....Slovenska

[Bruce]

On Tue, 17 Jan 2023 13:48:09 -0500, Dave Smith
<adavid...@sympatico.ca> wrote:

>It's interesting the way different cultures name other countries and
>their cities. Look at English and its European neighbours. We call
>France France and in England they actually pronounce it a little closer
>to the way the French do. We call their neighbour Germany, but the
>Germans call is Deutchland

Deutschland

>Norway....... Norge
>Denmark.......Danmark
>Netherlands...Nederland
>Sweden ......Sverge

Sverige

>Poland......Polska
>Hungary.......Magyarorszag
>
>Slovenia.....Slovenska

Slovenija

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[dsi1]

My guess is ketchup does have high fructose corn syrup instead of sugar. Which one is healthier? Beats me. Manufacturers like it because it's cheap. That's another miracle of food science. You can get corn syrup, which is moderately sweet, break it down into simple sugars and get an intensely sweet product that can be used instead of sugar and is relatively cheaper than cane sugar.
I've got a can of Lyle's Golden Syrup - it's intensely sweet. Obviously, it's a high fructose sweetener made by breaking down cane sugar. As it goes, fructose is sweeter than sucrose or glucose - and the rest is history.

[Bruce]

I keep hearing/reading -without looking for it- how bad everything
corn related is. Something to do with diabetes. Maybe corn production
is sponsored by Big Pharma.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[dsi1]

Corn is king in America. I don't know why but it's probably a very cheap source of starch which can be made into many useful products. My guess is that cane sugar can't compete with sugar made from corn. HFCS might have devastated Hawaii's sugar economy back in the old days.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/bvXoo9ffCZJ95epx5

[Bruce]

On Tue, 17 Jan 2023 11:15:33 -0800 (PST), dsi1

There are still lots of cane sugar fields here and to the north of us.
I don't know how they're still economically viable.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[dsi1]

Here's a song about pot growers that grow their crops in cane fields. I guess the main problem with that is when the cane is harvested, the cane is set afire to burn off most of the foliage. Save the children!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlgEr1MalvU

[Bruce]

On Tue, 17 Jan 2023 11:52:10 -0800 (PST), dsi1

<dsi...@hawaiiantel.net> wrote:

>On Tuesday, January 17, 2023 at 9:32:59 AM UTC-10, Bruce wrote:
>> On Tue, 17 Jan 2023 11:15:33 -0800 (PST), dsi1
>> <dsi...@hawaiiantel.net> wrote:
>>
>> >On Tuesday, January 17, 2023 at 9:06:58 AM UTC-10, Bruce wrote:
>> >> On Tue, 17 Jan 2023 11:01:14 -0800 (PST), dsi1
>> >> <dsi...@hawaiiantel.net> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >On Tuesday, January 17, 2023 at 8:19:19 AM UTC-10, Bruce wrote:
>> >> >> On Tue, 17 Jan 2023 10:52:07 -0500, Gary <g.ma...@att.net> wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >Isn't even the spelling, "catsup" an old spelling?
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >Anyway, not necessary to refrigerate that.
>> >> >> >I always buy a 38oz bottle of "ketchup."
>> >> >> >It lives on my kitchen counter and lasts for maybe 6 months or so.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> Yesterday, I heard a doctor say that ketchup consists, to a large
>> >> >> degree, of -very unhealthy- (Sheldon: unhealthful) corn syrup. But I
>> >> >> don't remember seeing that in the ingredient list.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> --
>> >> >> Bruce
>> >> >> <https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>
>> >> >
>> >> >My guess is ketchup does have high fructose corn syrup instead of sugar. Which one is healthier? Beats me. Manufacturers like it because it's cheap. That's another miracle of food science. You can get corn syrup, which is moderately sweet, break it down into simple sugars and get an intensely sweet product that can be used instead of sugar and is relatively cheaper than cane sugar.
>> >> >I've got a can of Lyle's Golden Syrup - it's intensely sweet. Obviously, it's a high fructose sweetener made by breaking down cane sugar. As it goes, fructose is sweeter than sucrose or glucose - and the rest is history.
>> >> >
>> >> I keep hearing/reading -without looking for it- how bad everything
>> >> corn related is. Something to do with diabetes. Maybe corn production
>> >> is sponsored by Big Pharma.
>> >>

>> >Corn is king in America. I don't know why but it's probably a very cheap source of starch which can be made into many useful products. My guess is that cane sugar can't compete with sugar made from corn. HFCS might have devastated Hawaii's sugar economy back in the old days.
>> >
>> >https://photos.app.goo.gl/bvXoo9ffCZJ95epx5
>> There are still lots of cane sugar fields here and to the north of us.
>> I don't know how they're still economically viable.
>>

>Here's a song about pot growers that grow their crops in cane fields. I guess the main problem with that is when the cane is harvested, the cane is set afire to burn off most of the foliage. Save the children!
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlgEr1MalvU

You'd hope sugar cane and pot harvests are synchronised.

They search for pot crops in helicopters here. I think they'd spot
them in the cane fields. And I don't understand why they don't
legalise pot. There's a big ice (meth) problem here that's much more
urgent.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[Cindy Hamilton]

On 2023-01-17, dsi1 <dsi...@hawaiiantel.net> wrote:
>
> Corn is king in America. I don't know why but it's probably a very cheap

Federal government subsidies. Your tax dollars at work. $1.95 per
bushel. The price of corn averaged $6.94 per bushel in 2022.

> source of starch which can be made into many useful products. My guess is that cane sugar can't compete with sugar made from corn. HFCS might have devastated Hawaii's sugar economy back in the old days.
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/bvXoo9ffCZJ95epx5

Back in the old days, food production wasn't nearly as industrialized as
it is today. Cheap corn and cheap HFCS begat today's highly processed
food.

I recommend this book:

https://www.amazon.com/Omnivores-Dilemma-Natural-History-Meals/dp/0143038583

This was another good one by the same author:

https://www.amazon.com/Botany-Desire-Plants-Eye-View-World-ebook/dp/B000FC1H14

--
Cindy Hamilton

[dsi1]

Helicopters to hassle the people is pretty barbaric. They used to do it here years ago. I'll have to ask my pot growing buddy about the situation today. I don't think the cops are buzzing overhead these days.

[Bruce]

On Tue, 17 Jan 2023 13:00:16 -0800 (PST), dsi1

<dsi...@hawaiiantel.net> wrote:

>On Tuesday, January 17, 2023 at 10:15:53 AM UTC-10, Bruce wrote:
>> On Tue, 17 Jan 2023 11:52:10 -0800 (PST), dsi1
>> <dsi...@hawaiiantel.net> wrote:
>>
>> >Here's a song about pot growers that grow their crops in cane fields. I guess the main problem with that is when the cane is harvested, the cane is set afire to burn off most of the foliage. Save the children!
>> >
>> >https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlgEr1MalvU
>> You'd hope sugar cane and pot harvests are synchronised.
>>
>> They search for pot crops in helicopters here. I think they'd spot
>> them in the cane fields. And I don't understand why they don't
>> legalise pot. There's a big ice (meth) problem here that's much more
>> urgent.
>>

>Helicopters to hassle the people is pretty barbaric. They used to do it here years ago. I'll have to ask my pot growing buddy about the situation today. I don't think the cops are buzzing overhead these days.

They also use helicopters to check on trees that are about to take
down power lines. It's hard to say what's what.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 1/17/2023 2:32 PM, Bruce wrote:


>>
>> Corn is king in America. I don't know why but it's probably a very cheap source of starch which can be made into many useful products. My guess is that cane sugar can't compete with sugar made from corn. HFCS might have devastated Hawaii's sugar economy back in the old days.
>>
>> https://photos.app.goo.gl/bvXoo9ffCZJ95epx5
>
> There are still lots of cane sugar fields here and to the north of us.
> I don't know how they're still economically viable.
>

Economically viable is the key. Corn syrup is cheaper. Now you know
the rest of the story.

Heinz has a ketchup "Simply Heinz" that uses cane sugar and it does
taste better.
Ingredients
TOMATO CONCENTRATE FROM RED RIPE TOMATOES, DISTILLED VINEGAR, CANE
SUGAR, SALT, ONION POWDER, SPICE, NATURAL FLAVORING.ORTOMATO CONCENTRATE
MADE FROM RED RIPE TOMATOES, DISTILLED VINEGAR, SUGAR, SALT, ONION
POWDER, SPICE, NATURAL FLAVORING.

[S Viemeister]

On 17/01/2023 18:20, Bruce wrote:
> On Tue, 17 Jan 2023 08:59:13 -0800 (PST), dsi1

>> Catsup is pronounced differently from ketchup. Catsup is the old-fashioned pronunciation. Some people will say "catsup" and spell it differently i.e., "ketchup." It's quite an unusual situation. I like to say "catsup" because I'm a down home kind of guy.
>
> Some people write gaol or are called Iain.
>

I have a cousin named Eoghann (pronounced like Ewan).

[Bruce]

On Tue, 17 Jan 2023 16:29:42 -0500, Ed Pawlowski <e...@snet.xxx> wrote:

>On 1/17/2023 2:32 PM, Bruce wrote:
>
>>> Corn is king in America. I don't know why but it's probably a very cheap source of starch which can be made into many useful products. My guess is that cane sugar can't compete with sugar made from corn. HFCS might have devastated Hawaii's sugar economy back in the old days.
>>>
>>> https://photos.app.goo.gl/bvXoo9ffCZJ95epx5
>>
>> There are still lots of cane sugar fields here and to the north of us.
>> I don't know how they're still economically viable.
>>
>Economically viable is the key. Corn syrup is cheaper. Now you know
>the rest of the story.

Yes, corn syrup is cheaper, but there are still lots of sugar cane
fields here.

>Heinz has a ketchup "Simply Heinz" that uses cane sugar and it does
>taste better.
>Ingredients
>TOMATO CONCENTRATE FROM RED RIPE TOMATOES, DISTILLED VINEGAR, CANE
>SUGAR, SALT, ONION POWDER, SPICE, NATURAL FLAVORING.ORTOMATO CONCENTRATE
>MADE FROM RED RIPE TOMATOES, DISTILLED VINEGAR, SUGAR, SALT, ONION
>POWDER, SPICE, NATURAL FLAVORING.

So it's got "cane sugar" and "sugar". I wonder what "sugar" is if it's
not cane sugar. Beet sugar, corn?

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[S Viemeister]

And how does Peiping fit into the story?

[Bruce]

Those Gaelic names can be confusing. Like Siobhan also. I bet it's
pronounced something like Shopping.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[S Viemeister]

On 17/01/2023 21:57, Bruce wrote:
> <firs...@lastname.oc.ku> wrote:
>> On 17/01/2023 18:20, Bruce wrote:
>>> Some people write gaol or are called Iain.
>>>
>> I have a cousin named Eoghann (pronounced like Ewan).
>
> Those Gaelic names can be confusing. Like Siobhan also. I bet it's
> pronounced something like Shopping.
>

It's a bit like _sh'vahn_. Describing vowel sounds can be difficult in
print, people interpret them very differently.
The 'h' after the 'b' indicates that the b should be pronounced like a 'v'.

Gaelic grammar and spelling can be very confusing for Anglophones.

Names change spelling and pronunciation depending whether you are
talking _to_ people, or _about_ them. For instance, the name Mairi is
spelled_ Mhairi_ ()pronounced Vahree when addressing her, but _Mairi_
when talking about her.
My name in Gaelic is spelled Sile, but pronounced as shee-la.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Tuesday, January 17, 2023 at 3:57:35 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
>
> Those Gaelic names can be confusing. Like Siobhan also. I bet it's
> pronounced something like Shopping.
>

> Bruce
>
It's pronounced Shi-VAWN. The name is closely related to Joan, JoAnn,
Snead, etc.

[Bruce]

On Tue, 17 Jan 2023 22:23:28 +0000, S Viemeister
<firs...@lastname.oc.ku> wrote:

>On 17/01/2023 21:57, Bruce wrote:
>> <firs...@lastname.oc.ku> wrote:
>>> On 17/01/2023 18:20, Bruce wrote:
>>>> Some people write gaol or are called Iain.
>>>>
>>> I have a cousin named Eoghann (pronounced like Ewan).
>>
>> Those Gaelic names can be confusing. Like Siobhan also. I bet it's
>> pronounced something like Shopping.
>>
>It's a bit like _sh'vahn_. Describing vowel sounds can be difficult in
>print, people interpret them very differently.
>The 'h' after the 'b' indicates that the b should be pronounced like a 'v'.

Ah, I'd never have thought of that.

>Gaelic grammar and spelling can be very confusing for Anglophones.
>
>Names change spelling and pronunciation depending whether you are
>talking _to_ people, or _about_ them. For instance, the name Mairi is
>spelled_ Mhairi_ ()pronounced Vahree when addressing her, but _Mairi_
>when talking about her.
>My name in Gaelic is spelled Sile, but pronounced as shee-la.

Also not really what you'd expect based on the spelling.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[Bruce]

Yes:
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRApzemV0MM>

When you hear the name, it doesn't seem strange anymore, but when you
only see it in writing...

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[dsi1]

That's because it's spelled wrong.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9xCr6IQtYqk

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 1/17/2023 5:23 PM, S Viemeister wrote:
> On 17/01/2023 21:57, Bruce wrote:

>> Those Gaelic names can be confusing. Like Siobhan also. I bet it's
>> pronounced something like Shopping.
>>
> It's a bit like _sh'vahn_. Describing vowel sounds can be difficult in
> print, people interpret them very differently.
> The 'h' after the 'b' indicates that the b should be pronounced like a 'v'.

I like the name but would never give it to my daughter. I imagine she
would spend much of her life explaining the spelling and pronunciation.

>
> Gaelic grammar and spelling can be very confusing for Anglophones.
>
> Names change spelling and pronunciation depending whether you are
> talking _to_  people, or _about_ them. For instance, the name Mairi is
> spelled_ Mhairi_ ()pronounced Vahree when addressing her, but _Mairi_
> when talking about her.
> My name in Gaelic is spelled Sile, but pronounced as shee-la.

Had a friend years ago but it was spelled Shelia in the US version.

[Bruce]

>That's because it's spelled wrong.
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9xCr6IQtYqk

lol

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[Bruce]

On Tue, 17 Jan 2023 19:28:59 -0500, Ed Pawlowski <e...@snet.xxx> wrote:

>On 1/17/2023 5:23 PM, S Viemeister wrote:
>> On 17/01/2023 21:57, Bruce wrote:
>
>>> Those Gaelic names can be confusing. Like Siobhan also. I bet it's
>>> pronounced something like Shopping.
>>>
>> It's a bit like _sh'vahn_. Describing vowel sounds can be difficult in
>> print, people interpret them very differently.
>> The 'h' after the 'b' indicates that the b should be pronounced like a 'v'.
>
>I like the name but would never give it to my daughter. I imagine she
>would spend much of her life explaining the spelling and pronunciation.

If you go second nesting, just call her Shyvonne. I'm sure it's not
exact, but it's spellable for a non Gaelic speaker.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[dsi1]

Nobody pronounces my granddaughter's name correctly - including me. It's a Japanese name with only 4 letters. Her Hawaiian name is easy enough to read if you take it syllable by syllable but it's hard to remember. Her English name and Portuguese names are easy. That's how things roll on this rock.

[Michael Trew]

On 1/17/2023 10:52, Gary wrote:
> On 1/11/2023 9:07 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> On 1/11/2023 7:48 PM, Michael Trew wrote:
>>
>>> Couldn't happen here; I have a glass jar of catsup. Don't you keep
>>> your catsup in the refrigerator? I don't know if it's necessary, but
>>> that's what we've always done since I was a child.
>>
>> Never kept in the refrigerator. That goes back to when I was a kid.
>> Plenty of acid in it.
>>
>> Can't recall the last time I saw it in glass either. A rarity these
>> days.
>

> Isn't even the spelling, "catsup" an old spelling?

Same difference. Some people pronounce it more that way.

> Anyway, not necessary to refrigerate that.
> I always buy a 38oz bottle of "ketchup."
> It lives on my kitchen counter and lasts for maybe 6 months or so.

I thought it was odd that the Bunkers (All In The Family) kept a can of
Crisco in their refrigerator, but I suppose that it would help for it to
be cold if making pastry.

Perhaps catsup is just better cold. I don't plan to leave it out. :)

[Leonard Blaisdell]

On 2023-01-17, S Viemeister <firs...@lastname.oc.ku> wrote:

> I have a cousin named Eoghann (pronounced like Ewan).

That name smacks of Welsh, but there are too many vowels.

[Bruce]

On 18 Jan 2023 08:51:47 GMT, Leonard Blaisdell

You should talk, O'Leannain!

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[Leonard Blaisdell]

On 2023-01-18, Bruce <Br...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> On 18 Jan 2023 08:51:47 GMT, Leonard Blaisdell

>>That name smacks of Welsh, but there are too many vowels.

> You should talk, O'Leannain!

Lynyrd

[Cindy Hamilton]

I've seen that spelling once in a great while. Sheila is much more
common. Some of the more judgmental web sites indicate Shelia is a
misspelling of Sheila. The spelling appears to have arisen in the
South.

--
Cindy Hamilton

[S Viemeister]

It's definitely Gaelic, but Welsh and Gaelic are both Celtic languages.
Welsh has seven vowels...

[Gary]

On 1/17/2023 7:28 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 1/17/2023 5:23 PM, S Viemeister wrote:
>> On 17/01/2023 21:57, Bruce wrote:
>
>>> Those Gaelic names can be confusing. Like Siobhan also. I bet it's
>>> pronounced something like Shopping.
>>>
>> It's a bit like _sh'vahn_. Describing vowel sounds can be difficult in
>> print, people interpret them very differently.
>> The 'h' after the 'b' indicates that the b should be pronounced like a
>> 'v'.
>
> I like the name but would never give it to my daughter.  I imagine she
> would spend much of her life explaining the spelling and pronunciation.

Imagine all the explaining Frank Zappa's kids had to do.

[Dave Smith]

Those poor kids. It's cruel to give your children strange names. I had
some hippie friends who called their son Sunny Jim. If they insisted on
that first name they could have at least made it Sonny instead of Sunny.

[Cindy Hamilton]

On 2023-01-18, Dave Smith <adavid...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
> On 2023-01-18 10:59 a.m., Gary wrote:
>> On 1/17/2023 7:28 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>> On 1/17/2023 5:23 PM, S Viemeister wrote:
>>>> On 17/01/2023 21:57, Bruce wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Those Gaelic names can be confusing. Like Siobhan also. I bet it's
>>>>> pronounced something like Shopping.
>>>>>
>>>> It's a bit like _sh'vahn_. Describing vowel sounds can be difficult
>>>> in print, people interpret them very differently.
>>>> The 'h' after the 'b' indicates that the b should be pronounced like
>>>> a 'v'.
>>>
>>> I like the name but would never give it to my daughter.  I imagine she
>>> would spend much of her life explaining the spelling and pronunciation.
>>
>> Imagine all the explaining Frank Zappa's kids had to do.
>>
>
> Those poor kids. It's cruel to give your children strange names.

If you have enough money, it doesn't matter.

--
Cindy Hamilton

[jmcquown]

On 1/17/2023 5:23 PM, S Viemeister wrote:

> On 17/01/2023 21:57, Bruce wrote:
>> <firs...@lastname.oc.ku> wrote:
>>> On 17/01/2023 18:20, Bruce wrote:
>>>> Some people write gaol or are called Iain.
>>>>
>>> I have a cousin named Eoghann (pronounced like Ewan).
>>
>> Those Gaelic names can be confusing. Like Siobhan also. I bet it's
>> pronounced something like Shopping.
>>
> It's a bit like _sh'vahn_. Describing vowel sounds can be difficult in
> print, people interpret them very differently.
> The 'h' after the 'b' indicates that the b should be pronounced like a 'v'.
>

There was a regular RFC poster many years back named Siobhan Perricone.
And yes, she pronounced it sh'vahn.

> Gaelic grammar and spelling can be very confusing for Anglophones.
>
> Names change spelling and pronunciation depending whether you are
> talking _to_  people, or _about_ them. For instance, the name Mairi is
> spelled_ Mhairi_ ()pronounced Vahree when addressing her, but _Mairi_
> when talking about her.
> My name in Gaelic is spelled Sile, but pronounced as shee-la.

I find Gaelic interesting. I can't speak it or even sound it out based
on spelling, though.

Jill

[Bruce]

On Wed, 18 Jan 2023 20:37:19 -0500, jmcquown <j_mc...@comcast.net>
wrote:

>On 1/17/2023 5:23 PM, S Viemeister wrote:
>> On 17/01/2023 21:57, Bruce wrote:
>>> <firs...@lastname.oc.ku> wrote:
>>>> On 17/01/2023 18:20, Bruce wrote:
>>>>> Some people write gaol or are called Iain.
>>>>>
>>>> I have a cousin named Eoghann (pronounced like Ewan).
>>>
>>> Those Gaelic names can be confusing. Like Siobhan also. I bet it's
>>> pronounced something like Shopping.
>>>
>> It's a bit like _sh'vahn_. Describing vowel sounds can be difficult in
>> print, people interpret them very differently.
>> The 'h' after the 'b' indicates that the b should be pronounced like a 'v'.
>>
>There was a regular RFC poster many years back named Siobhan Perricone.
>And yes, she pronounced it sh'vahn.

Did RFC have audio in those days?

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>

[jmcquown]

I watched a PBS series some years ago about life on an island in a Welsh
fishing village:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_1900_Island

21st century people volunteered to live on an abandoned fishing island
off the coast of Wales and live as the inhabitants did around 1900. I
could not understand the people who spoke Welsh. The show had English
subtitles for when they were speaking Welsh.

Notably about the show, the fishing village had been abandoned because
no one was able to make a living there anymore once steamships came
along. It did not take long before the 21st century participants in
this experiment realized they could not live like that, either. Four
episodes. But it was fun to watch the show.

Jill

[jmcquown]

On 1/18/2023 9:11 AM, heyjoe wrote:
> Michael Trew wrote :

>
>> Perhaps catsup is just better cold. I don't plan to leave it out.
>

> Not sure what it says on your ketchup label. My store brand says
> "Refrigerate after opening to maintain freshness". Famous Dave's BBQ
> sauce simply says "Refrigerate after opening". I figure the
> manufacturer knows best. YMMV
>
It's been a long time since I had a bottle of Ketchup (aka Catsup) but I
do recall the label read "Refrigerate after opening" so that's where I
stored it.

Jill

[S Viemeister]

I can understand more than I can speak, but since most of the older folk
in my family who grew up with Gaelic as a first language have died, I
don't hear it much anymore, and I'm beginning to forget what little I knew.
The letters have different rules for pronunciation than they do in
English, and some of the letter groups are glided over.
One of my relatives (second cousin twice removed) had an encyclopedic
speaking knowledge of the language, as well as of local history, but
could only read English, not Gaelic.

[S Viemeister]

I'll put it on my list.

[jmcquown]

I hope it's still available for viewing.

Jill

[Michael Trew]

I can't say that I've ever read the label. My family has always put it
into the fridge. I just checked my bottle of Heinz, and sure enough:
"For best results, refrigerate after opening".

[Graham]

It's still spoken on Cape Breton.

[S Viemeister]

Years ago, I dated a native Gaelic speaker from Uist, who had lived in
Nova Scotia - he said he heard more Gaelic there than in Inverness,
which is the 'capital' of Highland Scotland.

These days, walking around Inverness, I hear lots of Polish, and little
if any Gaelic.

[Dave Smith]

Is it actually spoken socially or is it just sort of a hobby. I know
there are schools that teach it but its common use seems to have dropped
drastically over the years.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Most likely put there for the Food Police. Someone may have complained
their three year old ketchup tasted off.

[Leonard Blaisdell]

On 2023-01-19, S Viemeister <firs...@lastname.oc.ku> wrote:

> These days, walking around Inverness, I hear lots of Polish, and little
> if any Gaelic.

I just had a thought, which is rare for me.
How do "you" pronounce "your" name?

(1) She-la
(2) Shay-la
(3) Other

[Bruce]

On 20 Jan 2023 21:50:59 GMT, Leonard Blaisdell

Australians are the experts on this name: She-la.

--
Bruce
<https://emalm.com/?v=SQqZJ>