How to use ascorbic acid in dough??
Richard
Anyone knows how to use ascorbic acid in dough?
How much is needed in say 3 lb of flour??
Is it save if use too much ??
What is it suppose to do for you?
Is there any substitute?
please email to rk...@interlog.com
Thanks in advance.
Andrew Grant
>Anyone knows how to use ascorbic acid in dough?
>How much is needed in say 3 lb of flour??
I use about 1/4 teaspoon for 6 - 8 cups (about 1 1/2 - 2 lbs) of flour
in recipes where I have lots of butter, fruit, eggs etc. I don't think,
based on my experience, that it does anything for a standard bread dough
made with a good quality flour. In fact you might look at the ingredients
in your flour and your yeast, ascorbic acid is sometimes added to one or
the other by the manufacturers
>Is it save if use too much ??
Depends on how much "too much" is. At some point I suspect you will
get too acid.
>What is it suppose to do for you?
Oddly enough although ascorbic acid is a reducing agent, it is
converted by enzymes in the dough to something else that makes it an
oxidising agent and it thus acts to improve the gluten in the same way
that ageing or bleaching does.
>Is there any substitute?
Ageing, bleaching or for a more direct substitute I suppose lemon
juice would work.
--
My email address in the header is altered to avoid junk mail. If you wish to contact me by email substitute "water" for "nospam"
Andy Grant
Chemcats
Ascorbic acid is in vinigar. It is that which makes vinigar "sour". I
have used vinigar in a recipe for a type of black bread....it called for
apple vinigar and it was qutie good.
Joan Mathew
adg...@nospam.waterw.com (Andrew Grant) wrote:
>>Is there any substitute?
>
> Ageing, bleaching or for a more direct substitute I suppose lemon
>juice would work.
How about orange juice? Some yeast breads are made very nicely with a
bit of orange juice substituted for water. I would not do this for
all the water, but maybe only 1/3 to 1/2 the water amount.
Try that and see what a nice flavor it adds!
For a lovely variation, try a regular yeast bread recipe but use the
OJ substitute I just mentioned, add a tiny bit of cinnamon to the
recipe, and chocolate chips. Yum!!!
Joan
Email: jo...@bigfoot.com (Remove "spamthis" from id above to reply)
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John McChesney-Young
No, ascorbic acid is not in vinegar, at least not in distilled or cider,
at least not in significant amounts.
Vinegar is sour from acetic acid (CH3COOH), produced traditionally by the
action of bacteria on alcohol in fermented liquids (cider and wine being
the obvious examples: _vin_ wine; _aigre_ sour).
Ascorbic acid is also known as vitamin C. The proportions recommended by
Elizabeth David in her _English Bread and Yeast Cookery_ are 25 mg. to
1-1/2 pounds/750 g. flour.
John
In article <19970608101...@ladder02.news.aol.com>,
chem...@aol.com (Chemcats) wrote:
--
Remove "nospam." from return address before replying.
Chemcats
Earlier I said that vinigar could be used because ascrobic acid is in
vinigar. Julian, very nicely pointed out that I was wrong. I was
thinking of ascetic acid. Sorry folks, I am feeling rather embarrased
right now! So never mind my earlier posting! (My face is red)
Andrew Grant
>Ascorbic acid is in vinigar. It is that which makes vinigar "sour". I
>have used vinigar in a recipe for a type of black bread....it called for
>apple vinigar and it was qutie good.
No - ascorbic acid is not in vinegar, you are thinking of acetic acid -
very different thing.
D.F.S.
Chemcats <chem...@aol.com> wrote:
> Ascorbic acid is in vinigar. It is that which makes vinigar "sour". I
> have used vinigar in a recipe for a type of black bread....it called for
> apple vinigar and it was qutie good.
Vinegar is mainly Acetic Acid and water.
I have some dough conditioner that is mainly Ascorbic acid.
They are 10 gram packets and are added to 100 Lbs of flour.
It makes to dough rise higher before the bubbles start to rupture
and collapse.
Marc
Susan Holguin
I don't want a lot of rude messages but I really need to ask the dumb
question here. Where do you get ascorbic acid? The only type I have
ever seen and (maybe this is my mistake) is the stuff in roach poison.
This CAN'T be the same thing can it? Please inform me. I have much to
learn about bread making. Thanks
Helen Watson
I thought acetic acid was in vinegar and ascorbic acid is Vitamin C.
Helen
Chemcats <chem...@aol.com> wrote in article
<19970608101...@ladder02.news.aol.com>...
Chemcats
OK -- one last time!! I posted earlier that someone (Julian I think)
nicely infromed me that I was wrong. I had a sever mental dump -- warming
up for senility. I was wrong. I am sorry. I am embarrased. OK?
I have appoligised for my mistake twice -- so I hope there need no more
postings. I really enjoy this group, I get alot of good info out of it. I
just hope I could pass some along to others once in a while without any
further mistakes. Sorry
Ken Cates
In rec.food.baking, on Mon, 09 Jun 1997 22:34:10 -0700,
Susan Holguin <su...@desoto-holguin.reno.nv.us> wrote:
> I don't want a lot of rude messages but I really need to ask the dumb
>question here. Where do you get ascorbic acid? The only type I have
>ever seen and (maybe this is my mistake) is the stuff in roach poison.
>This CAN'T be the same thing can it? Please inform me. I have much to
>learn about bread making. Thanks
Susan,
Ascorbic acid is vitamin c. I use one-or-two 100 mgm.
tablets of vitamin C in each loaf of bread that I make. It
doesn't do much for me. Maybe I'm doing it wrong or not
using enough, or something.
Ascetic acid is the main ingredient in vinegar. Some folks
add one-or-two teaspoonsful of vinegar to each loaf of bread
in the interest of producing or enhancing the sour flavor of
sourdough bread. Never admit to doing this. The purists
will give you hell. I have never done this, so I don't know
whether or not it works ;-)
Boric acid is sometimes used as roach killer.
Happy baking,
Ken Cates
--Ken Cates
<kencates at ix dot netcom dot com>
Tulsa, Oklahoma, USA
"... [N]ot by the color ... but by the content ...."
D.F.S.
Susan Holguin <su...@desoto-holguin.reno.nv.us> wrote:
> I don't want a lot of rude messages but I really need to ask the dumb
> question here. Where do you get ascorbic acid?
Look for dough conditioner or enhancer.
Maybe Vitamin C tablets, depending on what the filler is.
Drug store?
Fruit-fresh has combination of acids I think.
Oh, the REQUIRED response, "King Arthur".
> The only type I have
> ever seen and (maybe this is my mistake) is the stuff in roach poison.
> This CAN'T be the same thing can it?
That is probably boric acid.
Don't they use boric acid on people for eye problems or something?
> Please inform me. I have much to
> learn about bread making. Thanks
Marc
CHARLES C. LEBLANC
>In article <19970608101...@ladder02.news.aol.com>,
>chem...@aol.com (Chemcats) wrote:
>
>>Ascorbic acid is in vinigar. It is that which makes vinigar "sour". I
>>have used vinigar in a recipe for a type of black bread....it called for
>>apple vinigar and it was qutie good.
>No - ascorbic acid is not in vinegar, you are thinking of acetic acid -
>very different thing.
>--
>My email address in the header is altered to avoid junk mail. If you wish to contact me by email substitute "water" for "nospam"
>Andy Grant
>
Ascorbic acid is also known as vitamin C. I have no idea why it would
be used in bread dough.
Julian Macassey
In article <339CE7...@desoto-holguin.reno.nv.us> Susan Holguin <su...@desoto-holguin.reno.nv.us> writes:
>
> I don't want a lot of rude messages but I really need to ask the dumb
>question here.
A good reason to do your own research and have a good think
before posting.
> Where do you get ascorbic acid?
Some pharmacies and health food stores sell ascorbic acid
powder.
But you can also go the supermarket and in the section where
they sell jam making supplies (Either with the produce, or the sugar),
look for "ACM Ever Fresh" or some other form of ascorbic acid - used
to keep the colour in fruit when preserving.
> The only type I have
>ever seen and (maybe this is my mistake) is the stuff in roach poison.
>This CAN'T be the same thing can it?
You kill roaches with boric (boracic) acid. You can eat this,
but it doesn't taste good and won't help the bread rise.
--
Julian Macassey, N6ARE jul...@bongo.tele.com Voice: 415.647.2217
Garry Foster
On 9 Jun 1997 22:03:33 GMT, D.F.S. <d...@xmission.xmission.com> wrote:
Ascorbic acid can usually be bought in tablet form at chemist's /
drugstores(US)
Just crush half a tablet and disperse it in water .
If you want to get really good results have a hat with your local
baker and see if they will sell you some of their flour improver this
will contain ascorbic acid and other natural emulsifiers which should
make a dramatic difference to your home baking.
Lsrmk
I'm not sure it's ascorbic acid, but when my kitchen is cold I always put
a tablespoon or two of lemon juice in with the water in which I dissolve
the yeast. It doesn't change the taste of any bread I've ever made, and
it works very well to improve the rising.
Linda, Buffalo or Cortland, New York
Beth R. Jarvis
>D.F.S. wrote:
>>
>> Chemcats <chem...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>> Vinegar is mainly Acetic Acid and water.
>>
>> I have some dough conditioner that is mainly Ascorbic acid.
>>
>> They are 10 gram packets and are added to 100 Lbs of flour.
>>
>> It makes to dough rise higher before the bubbles start to rupture
>> and collapse.
>>
>> Marc
>
> I don't want a lot of rude messages but I really need to ask the dumb
>question here. Where do you get ascorbic acid? The only type I have
>ever seen and (maybe this is my mistake) is the stuff in roach poison.
>This CAN'T be the same thing can it? Please inform me. I have much to
>learn about bread making. Thanks
>
My Toastmaster bread machine book calls for 1 tsp. of lemon juice per
loaf of bread. This apparently provides the ascorbic acid that
functions as a dough conditioner. It's so easy; far easier than
crushing vitamin C tablets.
You might try it and see if it helps. I've made breads that don't
require it and they work ok as do the ones I've tried from my ABM book.
Hope this helps.
Beth Jarvis Hart
D.F.S.
Which does bring up another issue, The main reason for using it in the first
place, as described earlier, is to allow the dough to rise higher due
to better and stronger gluten formation.
It will take longer to make that final rise. You may see a finer texture
as the bubbles may not break and form larger holes, but if your automatic
bread maker does not allow the final rise to go LONGER for bread that
can rise higher without colapse, you probably never will see a difference.
Marc
Kenneth Sole
Howdy,
Why can't it be the same thing? People are not roaches...<g>
Ascorbic acid is Vitamin "C" . It does have the effects that you have
read about here, but, in addition is an anti-oxidant. It contributes
to the flavor, as well as the texture of breads.
Regarding sources: you can get it from baking suppliers (such as the
King Arthur Catalog, and also from brewing supply places. Those are
popping up all over so that might be the way to go. An ounce or so
will last several lifetimes (particularly if you use roach
lifetimes...)
Take care,
-Kenneth
Miche
In article <339e0055...@news.twave.net>
bri...@twave.net (CHARLES C. LEBLANC) writes:
> Ascorbic acid is also known as vitamin C. I have no idea why it would
> be used in bread dough.
It's a common dough conditioner.
Miche
--------------------
Miche Campbell <*>
Captain of the Starship Yentaprise
Remove <no-ads.> in address before emailing me.
My opinions are mine alone, not those of the University of Otago
You say Chaos like it's a *bad* thing!
Shankar Bhattacharyya
In article <19970610144...@ladder02.news.aol.com>,
No need to apologize too vigorously but you also need to get realistic
about the responses. Your post lives on forever. A year from now
people will be discovering it for the first time on dejanews and such
and responding to it.
I get the occasional message demanding that I retract some opinion I
tossed off a couple of years ago. I imagine lots of people do.
- Shankar
Helen Peagram
I must have missed the original post on this one. How is ascorbic acid
used in bread?
In <33a300be....@news.nh.ultranet.com>, so...@nh.ultranet.com (Kenneth
Sole) wrote:
KS> Howdy,
KS> Why can't it be the same thing? People are not roaches...<g>
KS> Ascorbic acid is Vitamin "C" . It does have the effects that you have
KS> read about here, but, in addition is an anti-oxidant. It contributes
KS> to the flavor, as well as the texture of breads.
KS> Regarding sources: you can get it from baking suppliers (such as the
KS> King Arthur Catalog, and also from brewing supply places. Those are
KS> popping up all over so that might be the way to go. An ounce or so
KS> will last several lifetimes (particularly if you use roach
KS> lifetimes...)
KS> Take care,
KS> -Kenneth
KS> >> > I don't want a lot of rude messages but I really need to ask
KS> the dumb
KS> >> >question here. Where do you get ascorbic acid? The only type I have
KS> >> >ever seen and (maybe this is my mistake) is the stuff in roach
KS> poison.
KS> >> >This CAN'T be the same thing can it? Please inform me. I have much
KS> to
KS> >> >learn about bread making. Thanks
KS> >> >
INET: m...@hwcn.org
--
m...@hwfn.on.ca
A. T. Hagan
jul...@bongo.tele.com (Julian Macassey) wrote:
> You kill roaches with boric (boracic) acid. You can eat this,
>but it doesn't taste good and won't help the bread rise.
Boric acid is used in some *external* medications I've seen, but everything
I've ever read has always said it was poisonous when taken internally. My
wife has a rather large bottle of the USP grade stuff and it says it's
poisonous if taken internally as well.
We've dumped the boric acid as roach killer and are presently trying the
non-heat treated diatomaceous earth.
...................................Alan.
From the House at Cat's Green Alan T. Hagan
Semper paratus NRA Life Member
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Miche
In article <33ac03e6....@nntp.a001.sprintmail.com>
ath...@sprintmail.com (A. T. Hagan) writes:
> We've dumped the boric acid as roach killer and are presently trying the
> non-heat treated diatomaceous earth.
Careful with this stuff if you have pets - apparently it doesn't do
them (esp. cats) any good.
Nicki
Helen Peagram <af...@james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca> wrote in article
<5o609m$m...@james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca>...
> I must have missed the original post on this one. How is ascorbic acid
> used in bread?
I will just quote "The Village Baker" byJoe Ortiz on this one.
" ....is used by French bakers to give their dough a property they call
'tolerance. ( how much rising time can a dough tolerate before it
collapses?) A wet dough that undergoes fermentaion of between fopur and six
hours is likely to collapse if it is not put inot the oven at the precise
moment it is ready. Vit C gives tenacity to a limp, weak bread
dough--providing the strength to permit the full develpoement of the loaf.
Ascorbic acid is added in the most minute quantaties, to a maximum of 50
milligrams per quintal of flour (Quintal=100 kilos) or in baking terns this
works out to about 1/8 teaspoon in 100 lbs of flour."
What I do is put the tiniest of pinches of ascorbic acid ( found it in
health food store) in my wettest doughs that I want long risings on, the
kind of French bread dough that is really sticky and you are dying to add
flour but you don't.
Dominique
William Kaufmann
This thread makes me wonder if ascorbic acid (vitamin C) can be used in
quick bread recipies that normally use buttermilk for the acid to react
with the baking soda. I have granular ascorbic acid purchased in the
area of a store where canning and preserve supplies are sold.
I don't like to use buttermilk because it is avalible only in quarts
and I can usually use only one cup at a time.
Bill in Reading, PA
Chemcats
I tried this with the last loaves of bread that I made this week and it
really works. I found the "collapsing" dough was really frustrating me.
So I would like to thank everyone for passing on this little trick! It
works!
Kenneth Sole
Howdy,
That ascorbic acid ration is VASTLY too much. (It won't hurt you - I'm
talking about the dough.) I do not know the precise quantities but 1/4
teaspoon is too much for 100 pounds of flour. Those yeasties are VERY
sensitive to this stuff.
-Kenneth
adg...@nospam.waterw.com (Andrew Grant) wrote:
>In article <5nc4ef$2...@news.interlog.com>, c0...@interlog.com (Richard) wrote:
>
>>Anyone knows how to use ascorbic acid in dough?
>>How much is needed in say 3 lb of flour??
>
> I use about 1/4 teaspoon for 6 - 8 cups (about 1 1/2 - 2 lbs) of flour
>in recipes where I have lots of butter, fruit, eggs etc. I don't think,
D.F.S.
Nicki <ne...@bigfoot.com> wrote:
> Helen Peagram <af...@james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca> wrote in article
> <5o609m$m...@james.freenet.hamilton.on.ca>...
> > I must have missed the original post on this one. How is ascorbic acid
> > used in bread?
> I will just quote "The Village Baker" byJoe Ortiz on this one.
> " ....is used by French bakers to give their dough a property they call
> 'tolerance. ( how much rising time can a dough tolerate before it
> collapses?) A wet dough that undergoes fermentaion of between fopur and six
> hours is likely to collapse if it is not put inot the oven at the precise
> moment it is ready. Vit C gives tenacity to a limp, weak bread
> dough--providing the strength to permit the full develpoement of the loaf.
> Ascorbic acid is added in the most minute quantaties, to a maximum of 50
> milligrams per quintal of flour (Quintal=100 kilos) or in baking terns this
> works out to about 1/8 teaspoon in 100 lbs of flour."
He then goes on to quote an oceanographer buddy that claimed this was 200 parts
per million, NOT.
I saw a book the others day called "The Village Bakers Wife" I wonder if this
is a version with more reasonable sized recipes for the home.
Anybody know?
Marc
Miche
In article <5ocmt3$l72$1...@news.ptd.net>
bil...@ptdprolog.net (William Kaufmann) writes:
> I don't like to use buttermilk because it is avalible only in quarts
> and I can usually use only one cup at a time.
Make lotsa buttermilk bread and freeze it.