Is 22 too old for first foal???
Nicole Church
I have a 22 year old mare whom l love to death and today someone got me
thinking about putting her in foal. She's in perfect health, fit and l
still ride her every day on the flat and occasionally over jumps. l don't
know if she's ever had a foal before and was wondering if she would be too
old?
Thanks,
Nic :)
--
How much deeper would the ocean be if sponges didn't live there?
~~~~~~~~~~~~ chu...@minyos.its.rmit.edu.au ~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~ http://minyos.its.rmit.edu.au/~church ~~~~~~~~~
Cynthia Attar
Only comment is that I own a 31 year old gelding going strong...My
opinion is that 22 doesn't have to be as old as some humans think,
certainly depending upon the horse. Other folks comments for
breeding/foaling?...
Jason Todd Howland
the chance of tearing a uterine artery. But, this would be more common
in a mare that's had several foals (stretching of the uterus).
Since this would be her first foal, she shouldn't have any more
problems that what would be associated with a young maiden (you've just
got an old maiden! ;)).
Good Luck with it!
Jason (wanting more) & the Herd (screaming "No More!")
Elizabeth A Arnold
Have your vet do a complete breeding exam on her, then you can make
an informed decision. I bred my 17 year old maiden mare and we had
no problems. I did some reading on this and found several examples
of maiden mares in their 20's giving birth. The most important
thing is to work with your vet! Good luck!
Beth
Nicole Church (chu...@minyos.its.rmit.EDU.AU) wrote:
: I have a 22 year old mare whom l love to death and today someone got me
Dawn Lawson
>Have your vet do a complete breeding exam on her, then you can make
>an informed decision. I bred my 17 year old maiden mare and we had
>no problems. I did some reading on this and found several examples
>of maiden mares in their 20's giving birth. The most important
>thing is to work with your vet! Good luck!
>Beth
>Nicole Church (chu...@minyos.its.rmit.EDU.AU) wrote:
>: I have a 22 year old mare whom l love to death and today someone got me
>: thinking about putting her in foal.
<snip>
At a recent conference in our area, a vet specialising in equine reproduction
said that studies of colostrum show that older mares do not have the same
levels of antibodies in their colostrum. Something to think about.
Galikins
I'd talk toyour vet, he/she could tell you if she has had foals
before. Take your vets advice about the issue. But, I'd be careful
while 22 can be fine for a mare who has had several foals a mare who
has never foaled before may be risky. If she is as healthy as you say
AND if you must breed her you need to know the risks to her health and
well being. There are more foals out there than are needed, you can
find a good youngster if you want to raise a baby.
chu...@minyos.its.rmit.EDU.AU (Nicole Church) wrote:
>I have a 22 year old mare whom l love to death and today someone got me
>thinking about putting her in foal. She's in perfect health, fit and l
>still ride her every day on the flat and occasionally over jumps. l don't
>know if she's ever had a foal before and was wondering if she would be too
>old?
>Thanks,
>Nic :)
>--
> How much deeper would the ocean be if sponges didn't live there?
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~ chu...@minyos.its.rmit.edu.au ~~~~~~~~~~~~
> ~~~~~~~~~ http://minyos.its.rmit.edu.au/~church ~~~~~~~~~
Carol & the Herd
"a horse is a thing of such beauty...none will
tire of looking at him as long as he displays
himself in his splendor." Xenophon
Jill Peacock
I know this is only 1 case against many others but I used to work at a
horse rescue.
One day they bought a very sorry sight from a market, she was a small
piebald pony mare, very skinny and, in foal. She would not let anyone
near her let alone touch her as she had been beaten terribly.
Information from the groom informed us that she had had 6+ foals
previously, year after year.
When it was feeding time you literally had to open the stable door, put
it on the floor quick then shut the door as she would have kicked.
Gradually when it was time for supper, she would just stand in the
corner, but still scared as hell.
We all thought she was going to have twins, as she was unusually large
for a small mare in foal. There were also 2 other mares of roughly about
her size to compare to - she was enormous!!
And after many months of waiting, she gave birth to a very large colt,
he too was piebald like his mother, and his brother who the rescue also
owned.
It was a story with nearly a happy ending - the foal was healthy and
liked people, mum was safe now and never to be re-sold, but she would
still never let anyone near her.
Gradually, over the months, when she was out at grass, you could hold
out a big bucket of food, and she would take a big mouthful, but you
could still not touch her.
We noticed her hooves were getting terribly cracked and one day thought
it was too much. We got her sedated with darts and had them filed and
trimmed. While we had her unconcious, the vet took at look at her and he
surprised us all when he told us she was over 20. She had serious bowel
problems and that was why she wasn't putting any weight on. This was due
to worms in the past.
But now, mum and her 2 foals are living happy lives at least, and will
never be re-sold. I have now left the rescue and I am looking for work
with horses elsewhere.
When you sell your horse, PLEASE think very carefully to who and where
you sell it as it could end up like one of the poor souls I have met.
Think again if you are wanting to breed from a horse of 20+ as they
have lived their lived for you, putting in their efforts day after day
for you without complaining. It is only fair to give them the respect
and care they need when they are elderly. That means DON'T breed from
her, DON'T strenuously ride, if possible don't ride at all, your oldy
will enjoy just a walk out being lead on a rein. PLEASE consider this
case and all the areas I have pointed out.
THANKYOU
Jill
Jessica Jahiel
:
: You might have a very hard time getting her in foal due to her age.
: And, if you MUST breed her, I suggest doing it AI. I read something
: recently that older unbred mares like that have less elasticity in
: their vaginas and there is the possibility of serious injury or even
: death due to a perforated vagina during live cover.
:
: Sue
Sue makes a good point, and please do have the vet conduct a thorough
breeding-fitness exam before you arrange anything for this mare. Much
will depend on her skeletal conformation -- the risk of live cover
doesn't come CLOSE to the risk of foaling if an old mare isn't built
to make the process easy. If she'd had even ONE foal ten years ago, she'd
be a safer bet to breed now.
If you do put her in foal, it might be a good plan to arrange to have her
foal at an establishment that does a lot of foaling, so that she can have
around-the-clock attention before, during, and after foaling. Such
establishments also generally have supplies of good-quality, frozen
colostrum, and may even have access to a nurse mare if one is needed.
Good luck, whatever you decide!
Jessica
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Cass
In <5phnhc$3db$1...@aggedor.rmit.edu.au> chu...@minyos.its.rmit.EDU.AU
(Nicole Church) writes:
> >
> >I have a 22 year old mare whom l love to death and today someone got
> me
> >thinking about putting her in foal.
Having delivered my second child at age 37.5, I think it's a terrible
idea...8-]
Cass, old enough to have known better
Diana Maloney
A friend of mine successfully bred her QH mare at about the same age.
They did run into problems getting her to settle. If I remember
correctly they had to do a number of uterine washes (not sure that's
the right term) but once she was pregnant, no problems and a beautiful
half-Arab colt was the result.
Good luck!
Catja Pafort
<breeding old maiden mare - which I wouldn't recommend because of the strain -
snipped>
> When you sell your horse, PLEASE think very carefully to who and where
>you sell it as it could end up like one of the poor souls I have met.
> Think again if you are wanting to breed from a horse of 20+ as they
>have lived their lived for you, putting in their efforts day after day
>for you without complaining. It is only fair to give them the respect
>and care they need when they are elderly. That means DON'T breed from
>her, DON'T strenuously ride, if possible don't ride at all, your oldy
>will enjoy just a walk out being lead on a rein.
I think that as long as the horse has fun being ridden, you should ride.
Nothing is worse for a horse that *likes* company and is used to regular
attention to be thrown into a field. It's nice, but it's nowhere near as much
fun as being ridden. Riding means going out and doing new things, and lots of
variety. Most horses don't have that in a field.
Catja,
deeply grateful to the older horses I have ridde who have taught me such a
lot.
Elisa Davey
In article <5pph6t$1...@dfw-ixnews3.ix.netcom.com>, Diana Maloney
<dia...@ix.netcom.com> writes
Word of caution, a couple of older mares I know who have been bred from
have produced very backward horses. I did read somewhere it was the
same as with us, there are more risks of a handicapped foal with an
older mother. Its best to be aware of the risks. Is it fair to the
horse? I know how you feel I had a wonderful pony mare of 19 who I
thought about breeding from as I wanted another one like her, but the
Vet said it wasn't fair on the mare.
>
>
>
>
--
Elisa
Kim Likakis
I'm jumping into the middle of this thread without seeing the beginning,
so forgive me if I'm not getting it right.
I would breed a 22-yr-old broodmare in a minute if she passed her vet
check with flying colors and I had a good idea of what she'd been throwing
all these years and I knew it had value. There's no way I would breed a
22-yr-old maiden. Why, why is this horse being bred now? No one's seen
fit to breed this horse in 18,19 years, and plenty have had a chance to
see her amd what she can do. How is the stallion going to complement her,
and what is hoped for to raise the level of the breed in this particular
foal? If she throws a great foal, is the plan to then breed her on? Is
this a one-time shot for immortality?
I'm sorry to be blunt - please leave the old girl alone. Carrying foals
is work, even for broodmares in the groove. I guess the bottom line is:
If I bred this mare, she settled and in 11 months popped out a foal that
she welcomed and raised to weaning, I'd consider myself LUCKY. And I
don't want to be breeding mares under those conditions.
Kim L.
Nellie K. Laughlin
In article <lockp38-0907...@pm1a4.ben.sover.net>, loc...@nai.net
(Kim Likakis) wrote:
> Why, why is this horse being bred now? No one's seen
> fit to breed this horse in 18,19 years, and plenty have had a chance to
> see her amd what she can do.
> I'm sorry to be blunt - please leave the old girl alone.
>
hear, Hear. A horse of 22 has most likely done enough for the human
race, and deserves her rest. not to mention the likelihood of delayed
cycling, the age related thinning of the vaginal tract that could lead to
tears or ruptures during foaling or even breeding. There are plenty of
younger broodmares that could produce a nice foal for your purposes.
Instead, use the quiet old gal as a buddy for the foal when you wean
it.... kind of a grandmother.. :)
Cathy
Margo Hepner-Hart
in actual fact a mare can be bred at that age and doesn't hurt in the
least as long as she is fit....I bred my right up to the age of 25 and
she did very well.....she was a show horse all her life and the last
15 years off and on she produced babies....there has been mares bred
at 35 with no ill effects.....so as long as she is healthy....no
reason why not....however sometimes at that age they are unable to
produce......especially if she hasn't been bred in the recent
years.....
http://www.teleport.com/~mhhorses/mhhorses.html
Nellie K. Laughlin
> in actual fact a mare can be bred at that age and doesn't hurt in the
> least as long as she is fit....I bred my right up to the age of 25 and
> she did very well.....she was a show horse all her life and the last
> 15 years off and on she produced babies....there has been mares bred
> at 35 with no ill effects.....so as long as she is healthy....no
> reason why not....however sometimes at that age they are unable to
> produce......especially if she hasn't been bred in the recent
> years.....
I agree, but a FIRST foal is where my perspective was coming from.
There are MANY broodmares producing good foals from age 25 on... face it,
if some of these mares were'nt producing, they'd be meat....but they've
had proven reproductive capability. my conservative standpoint comes from
the fact that there is simply a much greater risk of problems in breeding
a maiden mare of this age, also that the original poster seemed to make a
point of this mare being a devoted old friend rather than a money
source....(I wish they all were!!!)
Cathy
Kim Likakis
In article <33ca4908...@news.teleport.com>, mhho...@teleport.com
(Margo Hepner-Hart) wrote:
> in actual fact a mare can be bred at that age and doesn't hurt in the
> least as long as she is fit....I bred my right up to the age of 25 and
> she did very well.....she was a show horse all her life and the last
> 15 years off and on she produced babies....there has been mares bred
> at 35 with no ill effects.....so as long as she is healthy....no
> reason why not....however sometimes at that age they are unable to
> produce......especially if she hasn't been bred in the recent
> years.....
> http://www.teleport.com/~mhhorses/mhhorses.html
You missed the beginning of the thread, the mare is a maiden. I stated I
would breed a healthy broodmare at 22 no problem, but there was no way I
would breed an older, unproven maiden mare. There is no good reason to do
this.
Karen-Maree' Kaye
loc...@nai.net (Kim Likakis) wrote:
We have bred older maiden mares with no problem at all. Management is
important though, as in one instance the mare (20 years and maiden)
had been to several stallions over a period of 6 years previously with
no luck. We got her in foal the first time with only one live cover,
with a planned programme, follicle testing etc.
The only reason an older maiden mare could be considered "no good
reason to breed with"was if she was not a quality animal with good
conformation and temperament, and it could not be seen that her foal
would be an improvement.
Karen-Maree' Kaye