Which Dressage Saddle Do You Use?
Irene Given
>
>Having bought an Albion I hoped my quest for the perfect dressage
>saddle was to be over. But no. My instructor confirmed that I
>do not really sit well in the saddle and that my half halts
>were not really effective. During a lesson we switched saddles
>and what a difference. Its a great quality saddle but not ment
>for me.
>
>Can you please share with me what saddle you ride in and
>how well you like it? The only prerequisit I have for a saddle
>is a wide gusset to fit my horses. Anybody have any experience
>with County Competitors, Niedersuss, Schuhmaker, and Passiers?
Which Albion do you have?
Albion has several different models - each with a slightly different fit
and seat.I was all set on the Style Dressage, but when I actually rode in
it and compared it to the Herbert Rehbein, there was a BIG difference.
I did a lot of reasearch before buying the HR, but kept coming back to
the Albion line. For my horse and me, this saddle has a super fit. I
also tried the Niedersuess, County WB, Kiefer, Crosby, Passier, Rosslie,
etc. but none fit as well as the Albion.
I would recommend talking to Performance Saddlery (distributor) about
your "issues". They gave me some very good advice and could possible
suggest another saddle in their line, since you seem to like the
overall quality of Albions. The # is 1-800-258-0006.
Good Luck! :)
-Irene
dressage
-Pfau,L.R.
I have a County Competitor - I love it - its so soft
and comfortable. It also happens to fit my mare perfectly.
They come in several different tree widths.
I am no expert, however, I did ride in as many dressage
saddles as I could get my hands on before buying this one.
Lynn
Naperville, Il
Kate Caldwell
> Having bought an Albion I hoped my quest for the perfect dressage
> saddle was to be over. But no. My instructor confirmed that I
> do not really sit well in the saddle and that my half halts
> were not really effective. During a lesson we switched saddles
> and what a difference. Its a great quality saddle but not ment
> for me.
>
> Can you please share with me what saddle you ride in and
> how well you like it? The only prerequisit I have for a saddle
> is a wide gusset to fit my horses. Anybody have any experience
> with County Competitors, Niedersuss, Schuhmaker, and Passiers?
I too cannot sit in an Albion - the Comfort, Modified Comfort and HR all
have too long a twist for me and sit me too far back in the saddle for a
comfortable drop through my knees. So I tend to grip with the knees and
forget about using my lower back for half halts since it's all scrunched
from having my bum shoved up (and I somewhat modestly say that I do not
have a large backside!) Albion has a new closer contact design coming to
the US soon (the Legend 2000 at $1895) which has a narrower twist and has
the deepest part of the saddle further forward and when I sat in it on a
demo horse I really liked it, so there's an option. But there's nothing
better than the underside of their saddle for horses - which led me on an
exhausive search for wide gullets, wide panels and wool flocked saddles.
Luckily, I think other manufacturers are catching on.
The best dressage saddle that I found was the Laser saddle, designed and
distributed by Jeremy Beale. It has a moderately deep seat, a narrower
but comfortable twist with the deepest part more forward, wide gullet and
panels and can be purchased either with an adjustable tree or conventional
wooden tree. Best of all is that they will customize the conventional
tree (from wither tracings) and have access to trees designed to fit the
wider, flatter backed horse. Price is in the $1500-1650 range and
materials are of high quality and you have choices (pigskin seat versus
panel hide, long flaps, shorter flaps, knee rolls larger or smaller, more
forward, etc.) My horse liked it best of all (demo adjustable tree) and
half halts through my back were a dream. The contact was close enough so
that I could feel my horse's deep breaths of contentment. I was all set to
buy one but my plans changed - i.e. car needed a new transmission. If you
are interested, give Valerie Geisseman a call at 610/678-3099 - she's very
nice and super helpful.
Another saddle that I found in my travels that fit the above criteria (but
unfortunately their widest wasn't wide enough for my extra wide boy) was
the British made Podhajvsky, imported by Bullion saddles of Canada. I
really liked the balance and close feel in it, and construction was very,
very good. Also the price was very nice - $1,300. I talked with a man
named Bob at Franklin Saddlery in Bloomfield Hills, MI and he was really
helpful in getting me a demo.
Concerning the other saddles you mentioned, the County put me in a chair
seat (and my horse's response to half halts was a little too extreme - a
halt from canter when all I asked for was down to a trot!). The
Neidersuss has a fiberglass tree which I'd ruled out as repairs in
fiberglass are harder since it doesn't hold the tacks like wooden trees.
Also, the twist was a little too wide for my tastes. Apparently the newer
model has a wide gullet and panels, so it satisfies those criteria.
Schumachers also have a fiberglass tree, and their gullet is narrow with
panels of only moderate width. Also, the flap didn't accomodate my long
leg (personal tastes there...). The Passier gullet and panels were too
narrow for my horse's taste, which says it all.
I really shopped around and was looking forward to the day I opened that
UPS box with MY saddle in it, but at least the car doesn't make grinding
sounds and I have fifth gear back!
Kate Caldwell
kl...@cornell.edu
dressage
I am short 5'2" and small 105 lbs. I have the HR
short european cutback. It also does not fit my horse well.
I think I have a tree thats too large. I only have 1 finger
clearance at best above the wither. My representative kept
telling me that till it touches it should be ok. I have
been calling her for 4 months to come and restuff the saddle
but she is always too busy. My instructor and I both feel that
I can't sit right in it. The pommel comes back for far and teh
cantle rises to fast to really give me room even tough its
a 17' seat. I also fell that the leather is so thick that
I loose contact with the horse. And, actually I have my
saddle now listed with Performance Saddlery for sale.They
recoginzed my problems and stated that they now have a newer
model that is thinner leather and has a longer seat.
Right now I am trying to get Michael STokes to come and make
me a saddle but he is hard to get a hold of.
Thanks again, Ruth
Kristine M. Wilhelm
> Having bought an Albion I hoped my quest for the perfect dressage
> saddle was to be over. But no. My instructor confirmed that I
> do not really sit well in the saddle and that my half halts
> were not really effective. During a lesson we switched saddles
> and what a difference. Its a great quality saddle but not ment
> for me.
>
> Can you please share with me what saddle you ride in and
> how well you like it? The only prerequisit I have for a saddle
> is a wide gusset to fit my horses. Anybody have any experience
> with County Competitors, Niedersuss, Schuhmaker, and Passiers?
I have a passier Grand Gilbert (Nicole) which I just love, and
so does my horse. I used to have a Lovett and Ricketts
Imperial, which was too hard on my horses back and also had
very flat side panels. I much prefer the Passier's slight
padding on the front of the side panels, easier to keep your
leg in place. Overall, the Passier is a very comfortable
saddle.
Kriso
--
***************************
* Kris Wilhelm *
* km...@Virginia.edu *
*Charlottesville, VA 22903*
Terri Provalenko
> distributed by Jeremy Beale. It has a moderately deep seat, a narrower
> but comfortable twist with the deepest part more forward, wide gullet and
> panels and can be purchased either with an adjustable tree or conventional
> wooden tree. Best of all is that they will customize the conventional
> tree (from wither tracings) and have access to trees designed to fit the
> wider, flatter backed horse. Price is in the $1500-1650 range and
> materials are of high quality and you have choices (pigskin seat versus
> panel hide, long flaps, shorter flaps, knee rolls larger or smaller, more
> forward, etc.) My horse liked it best of all (demo adjustable tree) and
> half halts through my back were a dream. The contact was close enough so
> that I could feel my horse's deep breaths of contentment. I was all set to
> buy one but my plans changed - i.e. car needed a new transmission. If
Ha! Saved me a lot of typing- I tried several saddles Kieffer, Rembrant to
name just a few and ended up loving Jeremy's Laser - I have the
adjustable tree version of the Laser - he has two versions currently and I
talked to Jan (his wife) a couple of weeks ago and they have a 3rd in the
works. The differences between his two versions came down to my
personal preferences, my horses were extremely comfortable in both, but
one saddle tended to give more support (which I needed on my ever
changing, mare) whereas the other tended to give the rider more
freedom. However, the supportive model is in no way restrictive or
molding. The seat is comfortable to ride in all day through several
personalities (horses) and the adjustable tree has been a dream.
The Rembrant with it's cut back pommel tended to be very
uncomfortable-- creating a very bulky feeling -
The County I find nice on some horses but a little to deep for my liking.
Another nice thing about the Laser is the panels are generously designed
to distribute your weight evenly and comfortably over your horse's back
looking almost a little Spanish in design... This saddle may not be for
everyone, a friend of mine who is very tall with a beautiful long leg, didn't
feel it fit her, but her horse went wonderfully.- she's still looking-
One of the best ways is to try friends' saddles- on your horse and see how
they feel - UPSing saddles back and forth is a real pain and takes the fun
out of shopping for such an investment!
================================================
============================
Terri Provalenko email- pro...@infi.net
Dallas, Texas http://www.infi.net/~provalt/
================================================
============================
jaz
Kate, You sure have done your homework on saddles, I'm Impressed. {Who
cares? <:)>}
Now why didn't you back and get a Jeremy Beale saddle if you liked it so
much? It sounds like you thought it was perfect for you. I think you
ought to go back and try seeing what is available now. You were on the
good feeling about this Beale saddle, go for it, girl.
Back to the others now: I felt the Albion was almost *theraputic*, it
had so much of everything. Big seat, big pommel, big cantle, and
massive panels.....I felt a jousting pole should be sold with every
Albion. Sorry...a joke, guys! It's just too much saddle for me.
I own a Rembrandt "Victor" and a Neidersuss, two different horses and
two very different backs. The Victor is my favorite seat, love it!
Just the nicest seat, in the center, and the cantle is not up against
your backside. (Hate that in a saddle.) Alas, it was not meant to fit
my very wide Paint mare. I had to hunt and search the seven seas to
find something that did not roll on her and that fit me. A hard find!
Thus was born the need to buy the Neidersuss, which in the beginning I
did not like the seat on it. Too shallow, so I thought, and I now like
it *A LOT*. It is very balanced and close to the horse, and fits a my
wide horse like a second skin. So now I can go ride my one horse in a
deeper seat, and the same day ride in the shallow one and like both
seats. Different strokes for different horses and I'm adjusting to the
two of them. It may even improve me going back and forth, who knows?
Just don't decide against something at first glance, you may like
something entirely different next year, next horse, next instructor,
take into consideration resale value too. A good saddle can be sold
anywhere, anytime, a custom may be hard to unload if you ever have to.
Regards,
jaz
kl...@cornell.edu (Kate Caldwell) wrote:
>In article <4dhua6$7...@crash.microserve.net>, dressage
><dres...@catamart.com> wrote:
>
>> Having bought an Albion I hoped my quest for the perfect dressage
>> saddle was to be over. But no. My instructor confirmed that I
>> do not really sit well in the saddle and that my half halts
>> were not really effective. During a lesson we switched saddles
>> and what a difference. Its a great quality saddle but not ment
>> for me.
>>
>> Can you please share with me what saddle you ride in and
>> how well you like it? The only prerequisit I have for a saddle
>> is a wide gusset to fit my horses. Anybody have any experience
>> with County Competitors, Niedersuss, Schuhmaker, and Passiers?
>
>I too cannot sit in an Albion - the Comfort, Modified Comfort and HR all
>have too long a twist for me and sit me too far back in the saddle for a
>comfortable drop through my knees. So I tend to grip with the knees and
>forget about using my lower back for half halts since it's all scrunched
>from having my bum shoved up (and I somewhat modestly say that I do not
>have a large backside!) Albion has a new closer contact design coming to
>the US soon (the Legend 2000 at $1895) which has a narrower twist and has
>the deepest part of the saddle further forward and when I sat in it on a
>demo horse I really liked it, so there's an option. But there's nothing
>better than the underside of their saddle for horses - which led me on an
>exhausive search for wide gullets, wide panels and wool flocked saddles.
>Luckily, I think other manufacturers are catching on.
>
>The best dressage saddle that I found was the Laser saddle, designed and
>distributed by Jeremy Beale. It has a moderately deep seat, a narrower
>but comfortable twist with the deepest part more forward, wide gullet and
>panels and can be purchased either with an adjustable tree or conventional
>wooden tree. Best of all is that they will customize the conventional
>tree (from wither tracings) and have access to trees designed to fit the
>wider, flatter backed horse. Price is in the $1500-1650 range and
>materials are of high quality and you have choices (pigskin seat versus
>panel hide, long flaps, shorter flaps, knee rolls larger or smaller, more
>forward, etc.) My horse liked it best of all (demo adjustable tree) and
>half halts through my back were a dream. The contact was close enough so
>that I could feel my horse's deep breaths of contentment. I was all set to
mortier
>
> dressage writes:
> > Having bought an Albion I hoped my quest for the perfect dressage
> > saddle was to be over. But no. My instructor confirmed that I
> > do not really sit well in the saddle and that my half halts
> > were not really effective. During a lesson we switched saddles
> > and what a difference. Its a great quality saddle but not ment
> > for me.
> >
> > Can you please share with me what saddle you ride in and
> > how well you like it? The only prerequisit I have for a saddle
> > is a wide gusset to fit my horses. Anybody have any experience
> > with County Competitors, Niedersuss, Schuhmaker, and Passiers?
>
> so does my horse. I used to have a Lovett and Ricketts
> Imperial, which was too hard on my horses back and also had
> very flat side panels. I much prefer the Passier's slight
> padding on the front of the side panels, easier to keep your
> leg in place. Overall, the Passier is a very comfortable
> saddle.
>
> Kriso
> --
> ***************************
> * Kris Wilhelm *
> * km...@Virginia.edu *
I tried many sadlles like KN: Very soft to sit in
County: is ok for the knees
BR: hate it
Wintec: Is ok for ponies but not for horses
Otto Schumacher: THE BEST, is only made in
Germany and special people come fitting thes saddles on your horse's
back. It's rather expensive $1500. I would recomance it to everyone who
likes riding dressage.!!!
<pub0...@innet.be>
GIFDA
Georges, which fits my TB perfectly, and a Kieffer Rhine which I
ABSOLUTELY LOVE. You've got to sit in one to be able to tell. A friend
of mine at the barn tried several Stubben dressage saddles....he let me
try them, too.....we both decided we didn't like any of them. I am tall
and slim, with no buns in the back, so maybe that's why I like the deeper
seat of the Kieffer. I have tried the Passier and find it hard as a rock.
It was an older one, tho....mayber they've softened up?
Lee
Imonics Corporation
>A friend
>of mine at the barn tried several Stubben dressage saddles....he let me
>try them, too.....we both decided we didn't like any of them. I am tall
>and slim, with no buns in the back, so maybe that's why I like the deeper
>seat of the Kieffer. I have tried the Passier and find it hard as a rock.
> It was an older one, tho....mayber they've softened up?
>
What does the size of your butt have to do with whether you like a
saddle with a deep or shallow seat? When correctly fitted so that there
is a hand's width between your butt and the back of the saddle the
depth of the saddle is a matter of personal preference. As for certain
saddles being hard as rocks, in my opinion to a certain extent it
depends on how much you bounce in the saddle. Its not like people are
doing endurance rides with them...
--
Michael Czeiszperger | "Those riders who seek exactitude and absolute accuracy
Imonics Corporation | destroy the courage of a brave horse and ruin the gen-
Raleign, NC | tility which nature has given him" -- La Gueriniere
cz...@imonics.com | http://www4.ncsu.edu/~lmbecker/www/czei.html
debbie
your serious about dressage its time for a dressage saddle.
i had rode hunters for years i loved my flat no knee roll close
contact saddle i hated all pupose saddles. well bit my lip
and bought the keiffer sent it off the be adjusted to my
horse's back before i ever rode in it. well a year later i
cannot remeber the last time i rode in my beloved close
contact saddle. the keiffer is great soft supple durable seat
and knee rolls are not extreme it's a great saddle ,
debbie and snip (who approves too)
jaz
>What does the size of your butt have to do with whether you like a
>saddle with a deep or shallow seat? When correctly fitted so that there
>is a hand's width between your butt and the back of the saddle the
>depth of the saddle is a matter of personal preference. As for certain
>saddles being hard as rocks, in my opinion to a certain extent it
>depends on how much you bounce in the saddle. Its not like people are
>doing endurance rides with them...
Okay, Michael, maybe a soft seat is nothing you have experienced yet.
They are not made so you won't bounce less! New saddles are being
marketed by the *softness* of their seat, haven't you been reading any
catalogs lately? Miller's catalog has saddles that are even called
*Soft Seat Saddles*. Page 35 the new Autumn/Winter Miller catalog has
the *NEW* Klimke-Miller dressage saddle and I quote "Deep, comfortable,
soft seat is suppostive but not constricting, allowing the rider to use
his seat aids and feel the horse." Plus a Reiner quote of " Classically
styled with deep, soft seat and extra close contact." Sounds like
*softness* in the seat area is of concern to saddle makers to me!
Now in the "Dover Catalog we have a fine Roosli saddle and in the
discription we have this: "Soft natural latex padding in the seat for
rider comfort and wool felt saddle cushions with wool inserts to ensure
perfect postioning on your horse's back". Softness again, gosh. Also
on the same page a new County is telling us about: "The new soft seat is
made with select preshrunken hides to give you comfort without
sacrificing durability."
Think again, the new word on saddles is to have the rider comfortable
and in a soft, durable seat. Older models of these saddles are harder,
go to tack store and sit in a few. The old Passiers are stones to sit
in, the new ones are softness for them, but not as soft as the others
noted above.
Then how your tussy is conformed does make a difference in your saddle
preference. Mucho....narrow pelvis fits on a narrow twist much better
than a wide one. A wide backside needs more room over the center of the
saddle to spread, so wider cantle and center areas. Some people feel
comfortable siting up against the cantle, and others can't stand that
feeling. Then the front of the pommel can hit you in the pubic bone if
it is not conformed to your body type there too. Why do you think
people go on agonizing saddle searches?
Two kinds of people are not bothered about the seat of a saddle: Either
the the very, very good rider who can ride in anything. But they really
do care about the saddle they ride in all the time, it has to be just
so. (And usually custom made.) Or the really new rider who can't find
his seat in any saddle, so they all look pretty much the same to him.
Riders in the middle struggling and having a good go at riding are
looking for the one saddle that will fit them, feel good in the seat,
and let them progress in their riding attempts. Every saddle makers is
making one for them, or at least trying!
Happy saddle sitting,
jaz
LMiller435
I was glad to hear the Roosli saddle mentioned. I had one made and when
it arrived, the very first ride I took the saddle felt like an old friend.
My horse's back no longer has bumps. And, the saddle only gets better.
I think you really need someone to measure who really knows what they are
doing.
Try one if you know someone who has one. I was lucky that I found one
near my size. After sitting in it a few minutes I knew it was for me.
Good searching.
EDD
warmblood quite well...the trees are on the large size relative to a Crosby
as an example. I also find the saddle very comfortable. It is not the type
of dressage saddle that "locks" you in place but rather allows more freedom
of seat which I feel is necessary when schooling more advanced levels. I have
ridden in County and Hopfner Aurlecht (I know I butchered the spelling of this)
and did not fall in love with either. I found they restricted my seat and
"locked" me into a position. This added "security" of sorts might be good
for a newer rider but I don't like it. Good luck!
Elizabeth
EDD
cyble
(luckily, it's fit every horse at the skidmore stables perfectly, so i
don't have to even _consider_ riding in a different saddle).
brooke
mortier
prefer an Otto Schumacher!!. I don't think you can buy them in America
'cause they are made to measure.(they cost $1500)in Germany!
pub0...@innet.be
Ronnie Taylor
>Subject: Re: Which Dressage Saddle Do You Use?
>From: mortier, pub0...@innet.be
>Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 21:46:10 -0800
>I use a Kieffer Udo Lange and i really like the saddle but I would rather
>prefer an Otto Schumacher!!. I don't think you can buy them in America
>'cause they are made to measure.(they cost $1500)in Germany!
>pub0...@innet.be
I use a *County* English saddle, It's light-weight narrow twist spring
tree and close contact thru the flaps too. Saddles are a bit like shoes,
you either like a certain style or you don't. I ride TB's Arabs & W/B's
and don't have problems with a County - so I'd recommend one if you like
a close contact ride.
Ronnie
eq...@geko.net.au
Elise Robocker
Over the years and different horses I have ridden and
loved a Passier Dressage (bought in the '70's), County
Competitor, a Lovett and Ricketts, and most recently one
from Schleese, the T.D..
My dressage has always been associated with eventing and
at Prelim and below - not exactly high level!
Elise and Owen (I love my new T.D.)
Gary Nijman
>
>Which dressage saddles?
>
A Passier Grand Gilbert and a Passier RJM, each custom fit by Schleese
to a particular horse.
Gary M. Nijman
Vancouver, BC
Canada
EileenW672
>Over the years and different horses I have ridden and
>loved a Passier Dressage (bought in the '70's), County
>Competitor, a Lovett and Ricketts, and most recently one
>from Schleese, the T.D..
>
>
After going through practically every make (well ... slight exaggeration)
of Dressage saddle made, my daughter loves her Neiderseuss.
Development Group
I started with a Kieffer Wein as a new dressage rider and got rid
of when I finally realized riding dressage didn't have to hurt!
Went to a Lovatt & Ricketts... it didn't "hurt" but left me with
very sore seatbones.
Just bought a Passier Grand Gilbert..I LOVE it, my horse doesn't.
Tried a Barnsby Anky Van Grunven... my horse liked it, I didn't.
Now trying a Rembrandt Integra AA... looking very promising, so far
we both like it.
Neidersuss was next on the "try" list.
(BTW, I have a Passier Grand Gilbert for sale..)
Linda
--
Software Development
Sir-Tech Canada
75162...@CompuServe.COM
BarbHorse
solved? I have been considering one.
Barbara
Adrienne Regard
>The Neidersuss would be next on my list to try.
I have a Courbette De Kunfy, and it suits me fine for the time being. I
don't do a whole mess of dressage.
Tried a County once, and like it for my level of riding, but I can imagine
it would become too constrictive in the upper levels.
Liked the Prix St Georges, too, by Crosby, because it was comfy, but I
don't know that I'd buy one. Felt a few feet above the horse.
If I had unlimited funds, I'd go after an Hofner Alerick - however you
spell it. Leg placement was just wonderful.
Adrienne Regard
Robert Markey
>In article <4gm6mp$kjo$1...@mhadf.production.compuserve.com> Development Group <75162...@CompuServe.COM> writes:
>
>
>>The Neidersuss would be next on my list to try.
>
>
>I have a Courbette De Kunfy, and it suits me fine for the time being. I
>don't do a whole mess of dressage.
I also have a Courbette de Kunfy. I came accross it REAL cheap ($200), I'm it's 3rd owner. I like it fine, I'm afraid actually to =
try anything else because it's probably not perfect... (Then again, neither am I.) One of the things I *love* about it is that it's=
the only dressage saddle I've seen that has a short enough flap for me.
Julie
Jane Kilberg
Anything I feel like using. It ain't the saddle, it's the ride.
down the sunny trails....
Jane Kilberg
Rocking Double J Ranch
Sundance 500 Newsletter € the appaloosa appreciation society
Lisa Crossley
offers the most leg contact than any other saddle I've ridden in.
I use to ride in a Rembrant Integra and developed painful sores on the
insides of my knees due to the thigh blocks. Also had a few sores on my
derrier due to the deep seat it has.
My horse is difficult to fit due to his high withers and this saddle fits
him perfectly. I couldn't be more content!
ev...@tir.com
heard great things about a Keiffer.
mortier
of my instructor (Otto Schumacher) and I think that's even better! But
you can't buy those saddles in America. They are made in Europe on size
to the horses back
pub0...@innet.be
Lisa Hennessy
different brands) I found the County Warmblood to be the best for me. I
know about 20 people in my area who ride in one, on everything from high
withered TBs to massive warmbloods. I am 5'4" tall, 140 lbs, and ride a
16 hand Trakehner/Pinto cross. My saddle is a wide tree (#4) with an 18"
seat. I love it!