Best way to cut vertical slots through round posts?
Wood Guy
x 6" pine or spruce boards.
He wants to cut slots through the center of the posts (3 slots) that are
just large enough to slide the boards through. There are going to be
lots of posts - maybe 100 or more.
How would you go about forming these slots? What sort of tool?
RonB
Oh My! That is a LOT of fence.
Need a little more detail on how the fence is going to be built. It
almost sounds like the 1x6's are being put into the slotted holes. Is
this a solid panel privacy fence or a post and rail fence?
RonB
Ron
Wood Guy
> Need a little more detail on how the fence is going to be built.
> It almost sounds like the 1x6's are being put into the slotted
> holes.
Yes.
> Is this a solid panel privacy fence or a post and rail fence?
The posts are going to be 8, or maybe 10 feet long, set 3 or 4 feet into
the ground (where the frost line is in this area). This would put the
top of the posts about 5 or 6 feet above ground. Posts would be set 8
or 10 feet apart.
The three 6" boards would be spaced out, probably starting 2 feet above
ground, with 1 or 1.5 feet between boards.
The purpose of the fence is to contain a few horses within a certain
area. Presumably horses rarely attempt to jump over fences that are 5
to 6 feet in height.
DJ Delorie
chain mortiser?
Ecnerwal
Well, you could get all tooled up with a hollow chisel mortiser, or all
burly with a mallet and a mortising chisel, but if you are more into
getting the job done fisrly fast and not buying fancy tools, a good
sized router with a carbide bit and a jig should get the job done,
albeit with rounded ends on the holes. Have to go in from both sides.
Pay attention to drainage or you'll have rotted boards in short order.
--
Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by
RonB
<MyNameForw...@ReplaceWithMyVices.Com.invalid> wrote:
This router approach is kinda what I had in mind when I asked my
question. I suspected it was a rail-type of fence. You probably
wouldn't have to go all the way through...just a couple of inches to
allow the boards to be inserted and fastened. At 10' lengths, you
should have some flexibility in the rails. You might try a couple of
lengths, even in the shop, before you commit to the entire job.
With hand-mortising 100 posts, the horses would be dead before I
finished the fence.
BTW: On 10' centers, are 1x 6 boards rigid enough to hold horses?
Might be with the ends fastened.
RonB
Wood Guy
> > Well, you could get all tooled up with a hollow chisel mortiser,
> > or all burly with a mallet and a mortising chisel,
> > but if you are more into getting the job done fisrly fast and
> > not buying fancy tools, a good sized router with a carbide bit
> > and a jig should get the job done
> This router approach is kinda what I had in mind when I asked my
> question. I suspected it was a rail-type of fence. You probably
> wouldn't have to go all the way through...just a couple of inches
> to allow the boards to be inserted and fastened.
I should have thought of that. No need to go all the way through the
posts, except that it means the slots are automatically aligned
properly.
I have a floor-standing drill press with a cross-slide vice, I also have
a relatively large router - but no router table. It would be more of a
hassle to set the router up to do these posts vs the drill press.
I suppose I could use a router bit on the drill press.
There are also drills that cut side-ways (don't know what they're called
exactly). If these are cedar posts, I suppose it's soft enough to try
one of those drills instead of a 1" diam x 2" deep router bit.
> > Pay attention to drainage or you'll have rotted boards in
> > short order.
I've had some good experience with using PL-Premium adhesive on exposed,
outdoor wood. Seems to hold up well under intermittent water exposure,
and winter/summer temperature swings. I'm thinking that using liberal
amounts of that glue to hold the boards in the slots (and sealing up the
slots in the process) might be the way to go. Yes?
-MIKE-
Rube Goldberg. This is a fence we're talking about, not shaker
furniture. :-)
All you need is a guy proficient with a chainsaw. I don't mean a
neighbor with a rusty saw who uses it once a year. I mean a guy who
earns a living with it (or used to). You're up north, so you might be
able to hire a logger or tree trimming guy who's an artist with the saw.
That kind of guy could cut those after the posts are sunk in the ground.
He could do three slots in a post in about 30 seconds and they'd be as
straight as if they were cut at a factory.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
mi...@mikedrumsDOT.com
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Rusty
then square of the hole with a chisel.
"Wood Guy" <Wo...@Guy.com> wrote in message news:4A816423...@Guy.com...
RonB
> All you need is a guy proficient with a chainsaw. I don't mean a
> neighbor with a rusty saw who uses it once a year. I mean a guy who
> earns a living with it (or used to). You're up north, so you might be
> able to hire a logger or tree trimming guy who's an artist with the saw.
>
> That kind of guy could cut those after the posts are sunk in the ground.
> He could do three slots in a post in about 30 seconds and they'd be as
> straight as if they were cut at a factory.
>
But, if you use a router, make a jig from plywood or similar material
that can be set on the post and direct the shape of the slot. Not
freehand.
SonomaProducts.com
long. Just make a u shaped channel that you can drop the posts into on
top of a table. Plunge and route. You can use a small level to draw a
line across one end of the post, then it is easy to rotate it 180
degrees and do the cuts from eaither side. Just mark the channel where
you want the cuts. You could even build stops for real accuracy.
Swingman
Being raised on a horse farm and having used many types of fences, he
may want to rethink the round posts and the rail dimensions, unless he
wants to put up electric wire on the inside.
Those proposed 1 x 6 rails will not hold up to the inevitable horse
shenanigans ... ideally they need to be 1 1/2" thick and that will
obviously impact your plans to cut "slots" in your posts.
I like square posts for a wooden horse fence ... it is easier to replace
the inevitable broken rails if you nail (galvanized) them on. It is
difficult to replace rails that run through a post. I've had to deal
with this very thing using concrete posts and through rails, so DAMHIKT.
That said, you usually have to make the mistake to realize the wisdom of
experience ...
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)
Bob
for a fence. Unless you're fencing land that has a perfectly straight
fenceline and no variations in elevation (highly unlikely), then
you'll have to allow for this in your slots. I thinking making the
slots in the shop will lead to a frustrating, if not impossible,
fitting experience in the field.
Bob
dpb
> RonB wrote:
>
>>> Well, you could get all tooled up with a hollow chisel mortiser,
>>> or all burly with a mallet and a mortising chisel,
>>> but if you are more into getting the job done fisrly fast and
>>> not buying fancy tools, a good sized router with a carbide bit
>>> and a jig should get the job done
>
>> This router approach is kinda what I had in mind when I asked my
>> question. I suspected it was a rail-type of fence. You probably
>> wouldn't have to go all the way through...just a couple of inches
>> to allow the boards to be inserted and fastened.
>
> I should have thought of that. No need to go all the way through the
> posts, except that it means the slots are automatically aligned
> properly.
This is a bad idea on several fronts--see swingman's posting.
Iterating some of his points--
First, 1x cedar isn't _nearly_ enough beef in the fence unless the posts
are going to be on 3-ft centers or less; they'll get pushed thru and
broken within months if not weeks or days.
Second, the idea of the inserted slats is a poor one also--first, it is
as noted labor-intensive in the making by hand; second, it'll be a pita
to build because if the pockets don't go through you have to insert one
end, then hold the post in place while setting it on the other end to
insert them, repeat..._BIG_PITA_!!! :(
Then even if it's done, any movement of posts can (and will) end up w/
boards falling out when a post gets moved (and they _will_ move unless
are set to such a depth and w/ such backfilling as to again make the
building and expense absurd over time).
And, besides that, as swingman notes, repair of the aforementioned
broken rails is going to be another royal pita if the posts _haven't_
moved (so your damned if they do and damned if they don't :) ).
And, as if all that weren't enough, the pocket is simply a
water-collection point to promote early failure of the post and rail
ends--they rest of the rail will be fine for years; the end inside the
pocket will rot and weaken in a much shorter time--perhaps as short as a
few years in really damp locales.
All in all, look at how typical fences in the Bluegrass horse country
are built for functionality as well as appearance and learn... :)
--
Artemus
"Swingman" wrote...
:
: Being raised on a horse farm and having used many types of fences, he
: may want to rethink the round posts and the rail dimensions, unless he
: wants to put up electric wire on the inside.
:
: Those proposed 1 x 6 rails will not hold up to the inevitable horse
: shenanigans ... ideally they need to be 1 1/2" thick and that will
: obviously impact your plans to cut "slots" in your posts.
:
: I like square posts for a wooden horse fence ... it is easier to replace
: the inevitable broken rails if you nail (galvanized) them on. It is
: difficult to replace rails that run through a post. I've had to deal
: with this very thing using concrete posts and through rails, so DAMHIKT.
:
: That said, you usually have to make the mistake to realize the wisdom of
: experience ...
I too was raised with horses and agree with every point Swingman makes.
Horses get bored, even in a pasture full of grass and other horses, and
will eat any wooden rails provided for their entertainment. They also love
to scratch their asses on the fence and I've seen plenty of rough sawn 2x8s
broken by them. Fence maintenance was a weekly task until we added a
hot wire along each and every rail.
No way would I ever consider mortising the rails into the posts on a horse
fence. Use really sturdy posts (we used old telephone poles) and spike the
rails solidly to them.
Art
Larry W
Chainsaw
--
There is always an easy solution to every human problem -- neat,
plausible, and wrong." (H L Mencken)
Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org
Mike Marlow
"Dave Balderstone" <dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca> wrote in message
news:110820091405002240%dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca...
> In article <4A816D18...@Guy.com>, Wood Guy <Wo...@Guy.com> wrote:
>
>> The purpose of the fence is to contain a few horses within a certain
>> area.
>
> up with broken rails and injured horses.
>
> This is a VERY BAD IDEA. I shudder to think about the kind of injuries
> those animals are going to suffer.
Penned in animals tend to respect their boundaries. 1 x X has been used to
pen in cattle, horses, pigs, and every other form of creature forever.
Sure, they can get through it, but they can blast right through barbed wire
too. And electric fences.
--
-Mike-
mmarlo...@windstream.net
dpb
...
> Penned in animals tend to respect their boundaries. 1 x X has been used to
> pen in cattle, horses, pigs, and every other form of creature forever.
Well, certainly not buffalo... :)
_Full_ thickness 1x ok altho no "real" working fence I can think of ever
seeing other than for pet-type pens were only 1" other than sheep, maybe.
Cattle, horses, etc., are just too rough on stuff.
As somebody else noted, virtually anything these days is welded pipe/rod
and/or cable because of a combination of longevity and cost. The
feedlots and working corrals use a lot of highway guard rail (by the
flatbed truckloads lot). Of course they're handling anywhere up to
perhaps 100k head, probably a few more than OP has in mind... :)
> Sure, they can get through it, but they can blast right through barbed wire
> too. And electric fences.
"CAN" is relative. The problem as somebody else (different somebody
though, iirc) is that smooth fencing w/o "bobweyur" :) or electric wire
suffers the fate of being rubbed against until they simply just push
thru whereas the hot wire or barbed wire stops that.
After a hot wire has been in place for a while, cattle in particular
will not willingly cross the location where it has been even if it's
taken down for quite some time. I'll never forget the time we added a
hot wire around the top of the bull pen because the bull would just push
over anything in place to achieve his objective of "visiting" even
though he was as gentle and tamed to follow as a dog his size allowed
him to even eventually push over railroad tie-built solid fences. We
finall did add the wire. When it was turned on, he sniffed around it
(any tiny arcing creates some ozone they can smell) and finally reached
out and licked that sucker...no fence pushing after that.
--
Lee Michaels
"dpb" <no...@non.net> wrote
>
> After a hot wire has been in place for a while, cattle in particular will
> not willingly cross the location where it has been even if it's taken down
> for quite some time. I'll never forget the time we added a hot wire
> around the top of the bull pen because the bull would just push over
> anything in place to achieve his objective of "visiting" even though he
> was as gentle and tamed to follow as a dog his size allowed him to even
> eventually push over railroad tie-built solid fences. We finall did add
> the wire. When it was turned on, he sniffed around it (any tiny arcing
> creates some ozone they can smell) and finally reached out and licked that
> sucker...no fence pushing after that.
> --
>
>with you.
One of the things we used to do to our city cousins was to talk them into
pissing on the electric fence. Which proves two things. Young boys do stupid
things. And we were easily amused.
Steve
>In article <4A816423...@Guy.com>, Wood Guy <Wo...@Guy.com> wrote:
>>A friend wants to build a fence using round, 6" diam cedar posts and 1"
>>x 6" pine or spruce boards.
>>
>>He wants to cut slots through the center of the posts (3 slots) that are
>>just large enough to slide the boards through. There are going to be
>>lots of posts - maybe 100 or more.
>>
>>How would you go about forming these slots? What sort of tool?
>
>Chainsaw
>
bills for patching up rips and tears. Three or four hot wires on metal "T"
posts with insulators is the common fence around here with heavily anchored
corners.. Some people put a white strapping tape about 1 " wide above the top
wire running the full length of the fence.. Horses and people see the tape a
lot easier and learn to respect the fence.
---
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Clay
>>
> BTW--Horses are not right bright. If you use barbed wire expect a lot of
> vet
> bills for patching up rips and tears. Three or four hot wires on metal
> "T"
> posts with insulators is the common fence around here with heavily
> anchored
> corners..
Some people put a white strapping tape about 1 " wide above the top
> wire running the full length of the fence.. Horses and people see the
> tape a
> lot easier and learn to respect the fence.
>
>
> ---
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Instead of the white tape --- hang a sign, Like this ! ( some people are
born stupid) LOL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tPK5HpfjkA
prb
to use it.
Lincolnshire fencing has been used for years to contain animals but its
mostly topped with an electric fence nowadays. The rails are cut in a
sort of wedge at each end so the the rails lock each other into the
slots. I reckon ten feet apart is too far, the rails will flap in the
breeze at that distance.
See http://www.klmfencingservices.com/index.cfm?sid=37806&pid=579084
for an illustration.
Hoosierpopi
Buy the finished poles at the Home Depot or Lowes. I believe they
call it a split rail fence and sell the posts and the fence boards,
too.
But, as many woodworking enthusiasts, my knowledge of fencing in
livestock is somewhat limited. Thus, I would suggest you might Google
"livestock fencing installers" to get an idea of what works before
"tooling up."
Artemus
"dpb" wrote
[snip]
: After a hot wire has been in place for a while, cattle in particular
: will not willingly cross the location where it has been even if it's
: taken down for quite some time. I'll never forget the time we added a
: hot wire around the top of the bull pen because the bull would just push
: over anything in place to achieve his objective of "visiting" even
: though he was as gentle and tamed to follow as a dog his size allowed
: him to even eventually push over railroad tie-built solid fences. We
: finall did add the wire. When it was turned on, he sniffed around it
: (any tiny arcing creates some ozone they can smell) and finally reached
: out and licked that sucker...no fence pushing after that.
Our horses figured out when it was off. I don't know if it was the ozone
smell or the sound of the corona arcs but when it was off they'd chew and
scratch ass on the fence rails. It didn't take long to cure that though as
we'd just wait for one of them to be doing their deed and we'd turn the
juice on. They learned real quick that that wire could bite all the time and
they then stayed away from it all the time.
Art
Jack Stein
> Penned in animals tend to respect their boundaries. 1 x X has been used to
> pen in cattle, horses, pigs, and every other form of creature forever.
> Sure, they can get through it, but they can blast right through barbed wire
> too. And electric fences.
Yes, I've seen this a million times. If it were me, I'd either use
Swingmans idea, which seems the cheapest and easiest to install, or I'd
buy posts with mortises already in them, something like this:
(http://www.postsaverusa.com/fence-posts.html
For sure, I would not make a zillion mortises with a router. A chain
mortiser would be a must.
I probably would seriously consider an electric wire along the fence to
keep those big galoots off the fence, so the fence would be more for
looks than to keep a ton of horse contained.
Between me and the golf course I regularly go there is an old homestead
that has horses. The front "yard" is about 50 acres that boarders the
road that takes me to the golf course. Occasionally there are several
horses grazing in the front yard. There is NO fence. About a foot or
less off the ground there is a wire, one wire with white ribbons tied to
it. It does not appear to be those buried sonic things that keep dogs
in, because one, it ain't buried, and two, I've seen horses grazing
right along side the fence. The road is very busy with a 45 mph speed
limit and the average speed is at least 50mph. The horses could just
step over the "fence" A two year old baby could step over the fence.
I've never seen anything like this and always wonder WTF? Apparently
these folks know what they are doing, but it always makes me nervous
when I drive past and a horse is near the "fence". It makes me crazy to
see this and not know what the trick is.
All I know about horses is what I used to see on the Saturday morning
cowboy shows when I was a kid, and that they are far harder to ride than
it looks...
--
Jack
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Martin H. Eastburn
Martin
Stuart wrote:
> In article <JUjgm.1729$Jg....@nwrddc01.gnilink.net>,
> Artemus <jnrg...@invalid.org> wrote:
>> They also love to scratch their asses on the fence and I've seen plenty
>> of rough sawn 2x8s broken by them.
>
> Perhaps you need to plane and sand them instead so they are really smooth
> and unsuitable for satisfying the horses' needs :-)
>
Frank K.
"Wood Guy" <Wo...@Guy.com> wrote in message news:4A816423...@Guy.com...
>A friend wants to build a fence using round, 6" diam cedar posts and 1"
> x 6" pine or spruce boards.
>
> He wants to cut slots through the center of the posts (3 slots) that are
> just large enough to slide the boards through. There are going to be
> lots of posts - maybe 100 or more.
>
Jerry - OHIO
Jerry
who...@muirwoods.com
all, and short of using a hot wire on the fence wouldn't discourage many a
horse from eating their way through them.
Lee
Jim Hall
on each end of the slot and using a saws-all to cut between them?..
Bill Noble
cutting saw to make the slots, then glue the posts together with a
waterproof glue. That will be much faster than any other means and will
give you nice square edged slots
"Jim Hall" <jim_...@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4b403ae8$0$5341$bbae...@news.suddenlink.net...