Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
AWood70928
you might find silly but what the heck. The instructions that came with the
lathe are not very clear. I would like to know if you can, and if so how, do
you attach a Jacobs Chuck or drill chuck to the tailstock of the lathe? I can
get the tail stock spindle out, and the center for the live center will pop
out, but after that I am lost completely.
Can any one help a complete newbie out here?
Thank You,
Al
Leo Lichtman
"AWood70928" wrote: (clip) how, do
> you attach a Jacobs Chuck or drill chuck to the tailstock of the lathe?
^^^^^^^^^
Does your Jacobs chuck have a Morse taper on it? That's what you need.
Just slip it into the tailstock the same way you insert your live center, or
any other gadget.
Chipper Wood
Jacobs or other chuck. Take your live center to any regular machine shop and
they can identify the taper No. in order that the one you buy will fit in
your tailstock. They may even cite you a source.
--
Chipper Wood
useours, yours won't work
"AWood70928" <awood...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040618141832...@mb-m05.aol.com...
Grandpa
should be a tapered piece (I'll call it a "morse taper" within the text
of this post so the purists don't beat me to death with the proper
term<G>). Sears (for example) sells a threaded morse taper that you can
install a Jacobs chuck on, then slide back into the tapered hole in your
Jet Mini tailstock. Take your old morse taper with you so you get the
right one, probably a #1 or #2 morse taper. I paid $12.99 for mine at
Sears & $4.99 for a Jacobs key chuck @ Harbor Freight.
Grandpa
patarini
and will look like the one in the picture
http://www.woodturnerscatalog.com/frames/frameset_centers.html
then it just slides in the tailstock or headstock!
from one newbie to another! greg
AWood70928
get the Live Center out of the tail stock spindle. Anyway, I got home from
work tonight and took another look at it and used a wood dowl and hit it with a
rubber mallet and it poped right out. Now I can go get a drill chuck. Thanks
again.
Al
Barry N. Turner
to retract the tailstock quill until the center drops
out...............Barry
"AWood70928" <awood...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040619002804...@mb-m04.aol.com...
I Hunt Predators
will give that suggestion a try. Sounds a lot easier on the equipment. Live
and learn. I always keep a rag handy to wipe the egg off my face.
Thanks.
AHilton
lathes. Not all of them have this auto-eject feature. Just a heads-up for
the new lathe owners out there.
- Andrew
"Barry N. Turner" <barr...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:%NXAc.209$5W5...@bignews5.bellsouth.net...
George
a bit of time with some brass or aluminum and a lathe will produce an
extension to make a non-ejector into an ejector.
"AHilton" <ahil...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:o6SdnSYd7ZG...@centurytel.net...
George
piece of wood is placed between the edge of the chuck and the tailstock,
popping it out as the wheel is rotated to retract.
"George" <george@least> wrote in message
news:40d46...@newspeer2.tds.net...
> Or with every taper. Some are not long enough to self-eject.
Fortunately,
> a bit of time with some brass or aluminum and a lathe will produce an
> extension to make a non-ejector into an ejector.
>
> "AHilton" <ahil...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:o6SdnSYd7ZG...@centurytel.net...
> > While this certainly does work for this brand lathe, it doesn't work for
> all
> > lathes. Not all of them have this auto-eject feature. > >
Barry N. Turner
"I Hunt Predators" <ihuntpr...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040619110313...@mb-m14.aol.com...
Barry N. Turner
"AHilton" <ahil...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:o6SdnSYd7ZG...@centurytel.net...
AHilton
work for this brand lathe" should have alluded to. At least I had hoped it
would have.
- Andrew
"Barry N. Turner" <barr...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:yK2Bc.2228$Z26....@bignews1.bellsouth.net...
-e-
on many NEW jet minis, backing out the live center using the hand wheel will
be a bit tough for the first time ... put the live center back in and try
popping it out with the hand wheel ....just keep turning and it will pop.
"AWood70928" <awood...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040619002804...@mb-m04.aol.com...
Mike
doesn't work on - The taper has to be long enough to reach
the eject device.
mike
http://mike.vorefamily.net/twr
AHilton
is that taper you're talking about?
I have a couple of tapers on devices for the tailstock that are too long.
Not that they don't auto-eject but that they take up an additional 1.5" of
tailstock travel that they really shouldn't have to. One of them is on a
Jacobs' chuck. When I get some more time, I'll hack off a bit of that taper
but I don't want to go too short either.
- Andrew
"Mike" <mv...@moc.mocten.xi> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.06.21....@moc.mocten.xi...
George
they'll lack the self-ejector.
That's why I mentioned two methods of extraction.
For example, the Nova is a non-ejector.
"AHilton" <ahil...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:LfOdnT9rhLW...@centurytel.net...
AHilton
concerning the length of a particular live center taper?
2) Why would the ability to bore through the tailstock negate the
self-ejector feature of a piece of equipment (live center for example)
inserted into it's morse taper? I personally have a few lathes where all
are designed to bore through the tailstock and some are self-ejectors and
some are not. No problems boring through the tailstocks on any of them. Or
are you talking about the live center itself? I don't see where that would
be relevant either as that piece of equipment doesn't have anything to do
(except, obviously, it's length) with a "self-ejector" feature. Please
explain yourself.
- Andrew
"George" <george@least> wrote in message
news:40d76...@newspeer2.tds.net...
George
an extension beyond the ~ 3/8 diameter portion of the #2 taper.
Now, read carefully - with some centers you can bore through the CENTER ,
not just the tailstock, gaining extra stabilization for the piece. I even
mentioned one of the type. This, unfortunately requires the center be
shorter to accommodate the hollow. I have already mentioned two ways to
overcome the (pun intended) shortcomings of such centers in this thread.
You also use the hole in the Nova to knock out the various end appliances.
There are also solid tapers, I think most I've seen are the 60 point degree
metalworking kind, with no self ejection which respond similarly to the
extraction methods I mentioned. The chuck which was the subject of this
thread - not Andy's offended sense of importance - was probably designed to
be used in one of the Taiwan drillpresses, and therefore lacks the ejection
tang.
"AHilton" <ahil...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:f6OdnfHQOst...@centurytel.net...
AHilton
been a couple of different self-ejector mechanisms that I've seen on lathes.
I'm mainly talking about the mechanism that fits into the female morse taper
in the tailstock. The female morse taper, as it is extended and retracted,
rides over/around the self-ejector which stays stationary deep inside. As
the tailstock-fitting device (live center in this case) is moving toward the
self-ejector, it hits it and causes the live center to stop ... but the
female taper of the tailstock keeps going back a slight bit depending on how
long the live centers' taper is. This process ejects the live center. Like
I said, there are a couple of other mechanisms that I've seen (albeit on
just a couple of older and fairly custom machines) so much of this talk may
not be relavent to your exact lathe. Just so there's no (or at least less)
misunderstanding in what we're talking about here.
Comments inline below...
> You probably have noticed, at least once, that the self-ejecting feature
is
> an extension beyond the ~ 3/8 diameter portion of the #2 taper.
Well, actually, no. Some tailstock fitting devices have this extension,
which isn't part of the taper of that device, and some do not. The live
center that came with my Jet Mini doesn't have any extension, for instance,
and it ejects just fine. As long as the taper OR the taper/extension is
long enough, then it'll self-eject in a tailstock designed for it. It's the
design of the tailstock AND the length of the tailstock fitting device (just
the taper or the taper + any extension on the end of it) that determines if
a device is going to self-eject or not. If the tailstock isn't designed to
self-eject devices, then it won't no matter how long of a devices' taper or
taper/extension. So, the "self ejecting feature" is a product of the lathe
itself and not the device that fits into it. But, again and for clarity
(not to mention repetition), the tailstock fitting devices' taper or
taper/extension MUST be long enough to hit up against that tailstock
feature.
"Now, read carefully..."
Ohhhh, I do try to and ask actual questions (that I, amazingly, would like
answers to) when I don't feel like I have understood what was being said.
Otherwise, misunderstandings and personal attacks (see below) can ensue.
> Now, read carefully - with some centers you can bore through the CENTER ,
> not just the tailstock, gaining extra stabilization for the piece. I even
Absolutely. I'm with you here.
> mentioned one of the type. This, unfortunately requires the center be
> shorter to accommodate the hollow. I have already mentioned two ways to
You lost me here. Why must the center (I assume you mean the taper of the
live center) be shorter in that case? Do you mean that the taper must be
shorter so that you can crank the live center closer to the tailstock and
not be sticking out so far? If so, then why would that matter? In many
lathes, you're only talking 1/4" of an inch difference between either
ejecting the taper fitting device (in this case a live center with a boring
hole) and fully seating the tailstock to full retraction.
Or perhaps (and I think this is it) you're talking about a tailstock that
will allow 3/8" diameter boring, for example. If the taper of a center that
allows boring through it had an extra long morse taper on it, then it might
not allow a 3/8" hole to be through it. You could fit the 3/8" bit in the
tailstock but it wouldn't fit into the centers' hole. So, to overcome this,
the taper on the center is shortened up to allow that 3/8" hole through it.
Is that right? Assuming that that is what you're talking about....
So what? That's just a design mistake of the lathe manufacturer by
mismatching the boring hole of the tailstock to the size of the female morse
taper of it (having a 1/2" boring hole with a morse taper #1 for instance
<g>) AND the length of the morse taper before it hits the self ejecting
feature of the tailstock when it's fully retracted if that's a feature of
the lathe (to make this more relevant to this thread). If the manufacturer
gets their design right, then any tailstock device with a boring hole that
matches the tailstock boring hole (say 3/8" for both) will both fit the
female taper of the tailstock AND the tailstock fitting device will self
eject (given that the tailstock itself has that feature in the first place)
AND be able to use the full boring diameter of the tailstock and the center.
You can certainly have a center with a boring hole of, say, 1/2" fitted into
a (properly designed as per above) tailstock with a boring hole of 3/8"
where the center will be shorter to accomodate that larger diameter
through-hole. And it might not auto-eject, that's true. It's not the fault
of the tailstock. It's the fault of the person using the wrong center for
the lathe! If you're not going to use a properly matching center to your
lathe, then you can't expect everything to work out. The auto-eject feature
of the tailstock might be that failure. You're not going to be boring a
1/2" hole through the 3/8" tailstock hole even if the center accomodates it.
<g>
So, assuming that I deduced what you were actually talking about in the
quote from your email above correctly, your answer to my question of...
"Why would the ability to bore through the tailstock negate the self-ejector
feature of a piece of equipment (live center for example) inserted into it's
morse taper?"
would be that of length of the centers' morse taper. And considering the
statement just after the one quoted above by me....
"Or are you talking about the live center itself? I don't see where that
would be relevant either as that piece of equipment doesn't have anything to
do (except, obviously, it's length) with a "self-ejector" feature. Please
explain yourself."
Those questions of mine were directed to you as per your statement of...
"Nope. Think about it. If they're designed to be able to bore through
them, they'll lack the self-ejector."
Reading your last statement of: "used in one of the Taiwan drillpresses,
and therefore lacks the ejection tang" got me to thinking (and coming back
up here to insert this) that because you believe that a lathe tailstock
"auto-eject" feature is the same as found on some drillpresses, the live
center/Jacobs Chuck/whatever it is must be the one with the feature instead
of the tailstock, right? Perhaps this is much of the misundertanding.
So, the centers' that I have that allow boring through them won't self-eject
as per the above quote of yours? Hmmmm amazing! Let's take a quick and
easy example of a Jet Mini with the live center that came with it. It's
right in front of me and many people have one so I'll use that. I pop out
the sharp point and put the center into the tailstock taper. I then slide a
12" long, 3/8" diameter bit through the tailstock and through the center.
So far so good. BUT, will the center self-eject?
Yep. It does. Need a picture to verify? Not being mean ... just don't
want there to be any misunderstanding.
Should I try a few more lathes and centers? I have no doubt that I can
find a couple of combinations where it won't work. But, by and large for
the standard equipment lathes that I have access to, they'll work just like
the Jet Mini in my test.
So, it does appear that not all centers that are "designed to be able to
bore through them" will lack a self-ejector feature. Of course, as I
explained above, it's not the tailstock fitting device (live center or
Jacobs Chuck in this case) that has that "feature" although it must have
enough length for that tailstock feature to engage it..
> overcome the (pun intended) shortcomings of such centers in this thread.
And those were fine recommendations.
> You also use the hole in the Nova to knock out the various end appliances.
> There are also solid tapers, I think most I've seen are the 60 point
degree
> metalworking kind, with no self ejection which respond similarly to the
> extraction methods I mentioned.
Yes, I have a few of those as well. No problems self-ejecting here.
Different models and lengths and tailstock designs are the culprits. As
long as they are long enough (taper or taper/extension on it) to hit that
self eject feature of the tailstock then it'll work.
"The chuck which was the subject of this thread - not Andy's offended sense
of importance -"
Yet more trolling by George. *sigh* My only sense of importance comes
internally from helping people and trying to give them the best information
possible whether it's from me or directing them to another resource. NOT
from just trolling newsgroups looking for a fight or lobbing personal
attacks and cowering away from real questions. If a person can provide
different opinions, evidence or experience then I am all for it. Just don't
expect to not get called on it. I am not easily offended and you've not
even come close. I've been through 18 years of Usenet, FIDOnet, Craig-soft,
GlassRoomnet, and other online forum trolls that were far far worse than
you. It still saddens me, though, that such things and people still exist.
I have nothing to prove and everything of myself to offer in what limited
areas of expertise that I have fought to learn. I have much to learn in
many many fields of study, not the least of which is woodturning. As much
as I wish the online forums to educate and inform me, I want even more for
those that are just starting out to have accurate and helpful information to
help them.
"was probably designed to be used in one of the Taiwan drillpresses, and
therefore lacks the ejection tang."
Perhaps this is where you are erroneously extrapolating your views from?
The ejection from most drillpresses is far different than from a
"self-ejection" feature on a tailstock. No need for that "tang" on the end
of some Jacobs Chuck morse tapers on a wood lathe tailstock. In fact, I'm
going to go cut the one on one of mine off because it's not needed on the
lathes I work on. It just makes the whole thing too big.
- Andrew
Ken Grunke
> Now, ALL of this self-ejector talk is assuming something big. There have
> been a couple of different self-ejector mechanisms that I've seen on lathes.
> I'm mainly talking about the mechanism that fits into the female morse taper
> in the tailstock. The female morse taper, as it is extended and retracted,
> rides over/around the self-ejector which stays stationary deep inside. As
> the tailstock-fitting device (live center in this case) is moving toward the
> self-ejector, it hits it and causes the live center to stop ... but the
> female taper of the tailstock keeps going back a slight bit depending on how
> long the live centers' taper is. This process ejects the live center. Like
> I said, there are a couple of other mechanisms that I've seen (albeit on
> just a couple of older and fairly custom machines) so much of this talk may
> not be relavent to your exact lathe. Just so there's no (or at least less)
> misunderstanding in what we're talking about here.
Just to clarify, and simplify matters here--
1.) The "self-ejector" you speak of is nothing more than the end of the
tailstock's feed screw which hits the end of the morse taper shank when
the tailstock ram is retracted.
2.) If a tailstock center is hollow, and the hole is bigger than the
screw, then of course it won't eject.
3.) The extension at the end of many morse tapers is called the tang, it
fits in a slot inside the drillpress spindle to hold the shank from
rotating in the spindle.
Ken Grunke
SW Wisconsin
http://www.token.crwoodturner.com/
Member, Coulee Region Woodturners AAW chapter
http://www.crwoodturner.com/
Ken Grunke
SW Wisconsin
http://www.token.crwoodturner.com/
Member, Coulee Region Woodturners AAW chapter
http://www.crwoodturner.com/
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AHilton
Well, sort-of <g> The way I read your description of 1 and 2 below is yet
another version of a self-ejector mechanism. Your description suggests that
the only part of the tailstock "screw", as you call it, that hits the end of
the live center (I'll just use this example from now on to make it easier)
is at the center (of whatever diameter) of it's end shank. Is that a
correct reading of your comments below? If you have a hole in the bored
live center that's bigger than that mechanism, then I can certainly see the
live center passing right over it. This, of course, doesn't mean that every
live center that has a hole bored through it will not self-eject as George
blanketly stated.
What I'm talking about is what's most often found these days and that's
where the self-ejector mechanism acts very much the same but makes contact
with the outermost ring of the live center end shank. It doesn't matter what
size hole is bored (within reason ... you *could* have a 1mm sliver of metal
ring and it might slip past the mechanism a little but eventually the taper
would catch up to it and hit the mechanism anyway <g>) into that live center
as long as the shank is long enough to reach that self-ejector mechanism
when retracting the whole thing.
The essence of it is the same (retracting causes what's inside the morse
taper to stop retracting with the rest of the female morse taper) but it's
the details that matter most and affects what will and what will not
self-eject. Can you provide a picture or drawing of the exact mechanism?
I'll do the same of at least one version of self-ejector tailstock mechanism
that I've worked with on wood lathes and post it on abpw. Then we can
compare.
- Andrew
Arch
protect the guilty) in the 9th inning of a tied Morse taper game at rcw
stadium.
*****: What ejects the tail center?
"""""": No: What's screwed on the ram
*****: No! Which is screwed on the ram, What is centered into the end
of the blank.
""""": Can't be, Which is in the Barrel.
*****: I told you, What goes into the barrel!
""""": You are plumb out of the chuck, The ram screws
on the barrel!
*****: Nah, you have too much runout, rams screw old U
gouges.
""""": No V's on that old bowl gouge eh".
*****: The bevel you say, a Ram actually
prefers a female taper.
""""": I just hope they take precautions to self eject.
*****: A dignified turning ng is listening to us and I'm
not gonna go there.
""""": Well, what does the hand wheel do?
*****: Now really, """"". You should be ashamed.
Next you'll bring up the tailstock.
"""""": You know that dead center has a hollow ring,
you dull spur.
*****: No worse than a short tang!
(the game was tied til the 17th when the umpire found that *****'s
spindle had been plugged with carnauba and """"'s bowl blank had been
soaked in LDD. Both turners were ejected along with the revolving
center. )
Your correspondent was later arrested for sniffing acetone by a ng
moderator. A very sad end to a civil thread with so much promise early
on. :( Arch
Fortiter,
Mark Hopkins
"Arch" <al...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:13257-40D...@storefull-3176.bay.webtv.net...
AHilton
todays' lathes) of tailstock design with the self-ejection feature. I'm
just using the common bored-through live center design in these pictures.
If needed, I can easily put a Jacobs' Chuck in there or anything else to
show what's going on. Also, I can do a drawing of some other tailstock
designs (that have the self-eject feature of course) to compare and
contrast.
The more I think about George's statement of "You probably have noticed, at
least once, that the self-ejecting feature is an extension beyond the ~ 3/8
diameter portion of the #2 taper." the more he's describing a completely
different tailstock design. And this statement of his ... "Nope. Think
about it. If they're designed to be able to bore through them, they'll lack
the self-ejector" really suggests that he's just thinking of that one kind
of tailstock self-ejection feature design. He's expecting that "tang" to be
there on the end of the male morse taper to hit the center-hitting device in
the tailstock to knock it out. In my mind at least, he's confusing that
tang as the self-ejection feature in wood lathes.
Hopefully, George will respond in order to clarify what he said and answer
my questions. I hate to assume but without a response, I am forced to until
then.
Anyway, if anybody has a problem with viewing or understanding the picture,
let me know. Also, like I said above, if there's some clarification needed
on other tailstock designs and/or different centers (jacobs chuck, etc.) let
me know and I'll whip up some pictures.
I have had to get some woodturning video editing done this weekend and
earlier this week so I was delayed in getting the picture done and posted.
Sorry about that.
- Andrew
George
Nova I mentioned, and you'll see that the entire is not long enough to butt
against the end as you retract the quill in a lot of tailstocks. Seems like
it needs about an extra half inch in length beyond the point at which it is
3/8 or so in diameter.
I still haven't the foggiest notion of what you're trying to prove. I'm
merely noting that shorter tapers, including those which come with Chaiwan
benchtop drill press chucks, like we have at school, might be the reason
they didn't self eject for the original poster, not his lathe. The metal
lathes at school also have short live centers which require help.
I also gave two easy ways to eject such types.
"AHilton" <ahil...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:T9ednXwUEcZ...@centurytel.net...
AHilton
> I'm describing the taper. Look at the overall length of the same, on the
> Nova I mentioned, and you'll see that the entire is not long enough to
butt
> against the end as you retract the quill in a lot of tailstocks. Seems
like
Yep, I'll grant (for the upteenth time in this thread) you that some
tailstocks and devices designed to fit into those tapers just don't go
together or are simply poorly designed in the first place. Some of those
devices' tapers just aren't long enough to hit the self-ejector in the
tailstock. That's why I mentioned to Mike originally.... "That must be a
pretty short live center taper! Good point though. How long is that taper
you're talking about?".
> I still haven't the foggiest notion of what you're trying to prove. I'm
> merely noting that shorter tapers, including those which come with Chaiwan
> benchtop drill press chucks, like we have at school, might be the reason
> they didn't self eject for the original poster, not his lathe. The metal
> lathes at school also have short live centers which require help.
I'm trying to get the point of the self-ejector mechanism discussion as
clear as possible to those turners out there that might be having problems
buying and using their centers and tailstocks. Poor and misleading
information is not good. I'd hate for someone to read your "Nope. Think
about it. If they're designed to be able to bore through
them, they'll lack the self-ejector." statement and think that if they buy a
live center with a boring hole in it, that their tailstock self-ejector
feature will be negated in all cases. I was confused in what you were
actually trying to say and wanted clarification so that those that might
still be following this thread could have the facts and opinions of those of
us posting in it clear. They can make up their own minds, then, as to what
they want to buy or try in order to fix their problems.
When you came up with those statements of having the self-ejector mechanism
as part of the live center, for example, and of having a bore hole in any
live center, again as an example, will negate the self-ejector feature, had
me wondering what you were talking about. You still haven't directly
referrenced your statements on those points, by the way. Do you still stand
behind them? If so, are you willing to clarify those specific statements?
Now, you're saying that it's the shorter tapers that might be the problem.
Which, of course, is what was being talked about before you started in with
these other statements.
I'm always willing and interested in learning and maybe you've run across
why those statements are true? Please help us to understand those
statements of yours.
> I also gave two easy ways to eject such types.
Yep. And as I've said before to you in this thread, they are good ways.
They're also useful on some lathes' headstocks when a taper fitting device
is stuck in there too.
- Andrew
George
through my previous answer.
Those who purchase chucks for their tailstock should be aware that if they
don't eject, it is not necessarily the fault of the lathe, nor is it reason
to panic. The length of the taper may not be sufficient, for which there
are two easy workarounds.
"AHilton" <ahil...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:wrqdnUTwifv...@centurytel.net...
AHilton
understanding of your statements. I'm also sorry for your interpretation of
my questions as "boorish 'challenges'". I'm not aware of any actual
accusations other than, perhaps, by your own conscience. You answered far
more than I expected already but not as much as I had hoped nor as clearly
as, at least I, needed. All I can do is stand by my own interpretations of
your statements (which I have outlined in my many previous posts in this
thread) as to your reasons behind them.
Even if you will stop searching for knowlege or accurately expressing it, I
will not. I will continue questioning; attempting to learn; and teaching
what I can to those that will really listen.
- Andrew
"George" <george@least> wrote in message
news:40e30...@newspeer2.tds.net...