Craft Supplies/Hamlet tool ALERT!
#beaeye
ordered from Craft Supplies. When I opened the box I thought that there had
been an error in shipping and that they had sent a spindle gouge instead of
the bowl gouge. I re-checked their catalog and the various pictures of the
Hamlet bowl gouges appeared to be deep fluted. The gouge I received is
almost identical to my 1/4" Sorby spindle gouge with a very shallow flute.
When I called them I was very courteously treated but the person I talked to
checked their stock and said that it appears that I did receive the Hamlet
bowl gouge. One of the problems with mail order is not being able to see,
feel and evaluate an item before you buy it and the hassle to return an
un-wanted or incorrect item is a pain. Their representative did say that I
could return it and they would probably credit me with the return shipping
charge in addition to the cost of the item. There was of course a shipping
charge on the original order.
I feel that the pictures in the Craft Supplies catalog are misleading and
that other woodturners will be equally disappointed if they think they are
going to get what most of us think that bowl gouge should be. In the
meantime, rather than go through the laborious and painful return process, I
am going to keep my VERY, VERY, VERY expensive Hamlet Spindle (or is it a
bowl?) Gouge. This gouge was $59.95 and the 1/4" Sorby spindle gouge is
$25.95!
Woodturner Buyers BEWARE and especially if you order from a mail order
catalog.
Bob Ivey
Northwest Woodturners, Oregon
bea...@ix.netcom.com
Fred Holder
It sounds like you received a spindle gouge. Your description fits the 3/8"
Hamlet Spindle gouge that I purchased. I'm sure that Craft Supplie's Records
show that you were shipped a bowl gouge, but that doesn't mean that someone
didn't grab from the wrong bin when packaging your order. I would simply send
the thing back and request that they replace it with a bowl gouge, because you
feel an error was made.
The people at Craft Supplies are very reasonable and helpful, but you have to
give them a chance to make good. First they are people, and people make
mistakes. Send the tool back and see how reasonable and helpful they can really
be.
I've received the wrong item more than a few times from the various woodturning
supplies sources. They all make mistakes from time to time. So far, I've not
found one that will not make good when a mistake was made if you simply send it
back with a copy of your paperwork and ask them to send you the proper piece.
I'm not taking you to task for posting on the newsgroup, but I feel you should
have first given them a chance to correct the problem before posting to complain
to the world. The People at Craft Supplies are very good people, but remember,
like you, they are people and can make mistakes. Give them a chance to correct
that mistake before you complain to the world.
Fred Holder
<http://www.fholder.com/>
In article <8muleo$65j$1...@slb2.atl.mindspring.net>, "#beaeye" says...
Fred Holder
<http://www.fholder.com/>
Andyc
support person at Craft & Send it back. It should not cost you a penny.
Stand your ground.
Buying a turning tool without knowing the manufacturer's specs and part# is
risky since there are no standards for flutes and gouges. Best bet for bowl
gouges is not to buy sight unseen.
#beaeye wrote in message <8muleo$65j$1...@slb2.atl.mindspring.net>...
cyrusan...@my-deja.com
from Craft Supplies. It came in a plastic case labelled spindle gouge.
I knew nothing about turning and even though it didn't look like what I
thought a spindle gouge should look like: what did I know? I used it
and it cut.
More recently I took a class in pen turning and took my " spindle"
gouge along. I made a pen and when the class was over, I asked the
instructor why my gouge looked so heavy. He explained that I had a 3/8
" Sorby bowl gouge.
I guess I must owe Craft Supplies some money, but the statute of
limitation is over.I have since ordered many items from them and have
been very satisfied. Larry
In article <8muum3$e6h$1...@nirvana.soco.agilent.com>,
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Steve Tiedman
The group discussed the Hamlets a couple months ago pretty well, and it seems like
the consensus was positive on their quality and performance.
I just wanted to hear it from someone that has been using them for a while now- how
do you like your Hamlet tools after using them? Are you using 2030's or 2060's?
I'm particularly interested in 2060 tools, but any impressions will be helpful on
either the 2030 or 2060.
If you can believe the catalog marketing, it seems like the 2060's should give
Glaser tools a real run for the money, figuratively and literally.
Steve Tiedman
ste...@moscow.com
mhordam
Sorry to hear of your experiences of mail-ordering.
The tool you ordered, the Hamlet 2060 1/4" bowl gouge, should be
readily identifiable from the 1/4" spindle gouge. Due to the
different way of measuring spindle and bowl gouges the bar
section diameter of the 1/4" bowl gouge should measure about
3/8" whereas the spindle gouge will measure the 1/4" its title
suggests. The 1/4" of the bowl gouge refers to the flute width
measured across the tops of the flute walls. Also the length of
the two tools should identify one from another. The 1/4" bowl
gouge is 26" overall length with a 16" handle. I don't stock the
2060 1/4" spindle gouge but I do have the standard M2 high speed
steel model. This measures 17* overall with a 10" handle.
The 1/4" spindle gouge is an altogether lighter duty tool than
the 1/4" bowl gouge and not one you would want to tackle a bowl
with. If the tool you received is like this, then it would seem
almost certain you have been incorrectly supplied.
There must be many instances, in fact the majority, of perfectly
satisfactory service from mail order suppliers. I hope this one
experience won't put you or others off using what is an
extremely useful service. As others have advised, get back in
touch with Craft Supplies it's in their interest to make sure
you're a satisfied customer. If you decide just to keep a $59.95
"spindle" gouge you're never going to be happy using it.
You could always return it for a refund, as not being the item
ordered and for the sum of £20.95 plus £8.50 postage (a total of
about US$44.00 at current exchange rates) order one from me. As
you see from the above I know which tool to send!
For an explanation of the benefits of the steel used in the 2030
and 2060 ranges of tools take a look at
http://dss.comint.net/english/catalog/prdcts15.htm
The tools in these ranges are priced at a premium to Hamlet's
standard range but offer improved edge holding ability, good
grinding characteristics and should outlast ordinary tools by
11/2 to 3 times.
Regards
Brian,
http://www.molehillturnery.co.uk
Art & Craft Gallery-Woodturning Supplies
The best tools on the planet @ The best prices in cyberspace
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Joe Fleming
1 - 1/4" spindle gouge - 2030
2 - 3/8" spindle gouge - 2060
1 - 1/2" spindle gouge - 2030
1 - 3/4" round nose scraper - 2030
I bought 2060 when available in the desired sizes; otherwise I bought 2030.
I can really tell the difference on the 3/8" and 1/2" gouges. The edges do hold a lot
longer. I can use the 3/8" gouges a long time between sharpening as compared to my
older HSS gouges.
Be aware that not all gouges have the same profiles, however. The 1/2" gouge is just a
little deeper than my old 1/2". The 3/8" gouges are just a little more shallow than my
old 3/8". The 1/4" gouge is much more shallow than my Sorby 1/4" - almost to the point
where it is too thin to be useful (at least to me). My point is that the shape of the
tool is what makes it useful for the cut at hand - not if the edge will be there 20
cuts from now.
All that being said, I like the 1/2" and 3/8" tools, haven't used the scraper enough to
make a judgement, and find the 1/4" gouge too thin to be useful to my turning. What I
want next is a 1" spindle gouge with a very shallow flute. I have an old tool (carbon
steal I think), but doesn't hold an edge worth a darn. Craft Supplies doesn't carry a
Hamlet in that size with that profile. At least no the last time I looked.
Joe
Dan
>Bob,
You are correct, in that the Hamlet 1/4" Bowl Gouge that you received does have
a much more shallow flute than the Sorby or Henry Taylor version of the same
tool. However, the tool that he received is in fact a 1/4" Hamlet Bowl Gouge.
The 1/4" Hamlet spindle gouge has a 4 1/2" long flute, and an outside diameter
of 1/4". The 1/4" Hamlet bowl gouge has a flute length of 6 1/2" and an outside
diameter of 3/8" (bowl gouges are sized by the width of the flute, not the size
of the round stock used to make the tool). There is also a considerable
difference in the length of the handle, with the spindle gouge handle being 10",
and the bowl gouge handle being 16". Also, flute shapes will vary from
manufacturer to manufacturer. Henry Taylor bowl gouges have a very different
flute shape than Robert Sorby bowl gouges, and Hamlet's have a different shape
as well. The gouge pictured in the catalog is a 1/2" bowl gouge. We apologize if
this has caused any confusion. As always though, Craft Supplies offers a 30 day
money back guarantee on every item we sell, and we would be more than happy to
refund your money Bob (shipping included), if you're not completely satisfied.
The other option would be for you to send the tool back, and we can replace it
with either a Henry Taylor, or Robert Sorby 1/4" bowl gouge. As for the price of
the tool, Hamlet tools tend to cost a little more than the H.T.'s or Sorby's
because they are made of a different steel. This steel will hold an edge much
longer than any tool made from standard high speed steel, so it the long run, we
feel that the Hamlet tools are the best value for the money. You are also
correct that the nature of the mail order business makes it difficult to
purchase tools because the customer is not able to actually see the product up
close before purchasing it. However, if you have any questions, regarding any of
the products that we sell, we want you to feel free to contact either me
directly, or any of our techs, and we will do everything we can to answer those
questions before you purchase the item. I hope this helps to resolve the
problem, as we do value our customers, and we try to offer the best advice and
customer service available. Again, we apologize for any inconvenience this may
have caused.-------Dan, Craft Supplies U.S.A.
mhordam
Looks like you're going to be repeatedly sharpening that old 1"
spindle gouge for some time.
The Hamlet price list doesn't show a spindle gouge of that size,
in fact even though they list a 3/4" with prices etc., my latest
information is that even this size isn't yet available in the
2030 and 2060 tools.
I also have an old carbon steel 1" gouge which has a really nice
feel to it but like yours it doesn't hold an edge much beyond
turning the lathe on.
If you'd like a little background information on the steels used
in the 2030 and 2060 tools you might want to have a look at this
link.
http://dss.comint.net/english/catalog/prdcts15.htm
Regards,
Brian.
Paul Paris
Having just spent a week at Craft Supplies at their beginning turners class,
I thought I would throw in my $.50:
The staff at Craft Supplies (from the owner, Mr. Nish, his dad, Dan, Rachel,
etc.) are, in my opinion, people of the highest caliber. I say this not
because I am now friendly with them, but through many different phone calls
and faxes, they have always treated me, the customer, right. I have always
been able to call them with a question or two, and I ALWAYS get the help I
need or the question answered.
Yes, maybe like some of you, I have ordered something from them and have
received the wrong thing. One phone call or E-mail fixes the problem in no
time flat. During a break from the class, I went into their shop and
listened in on how they treated their customers. Dan, one of the guys in
the office , spent a quite some time helping someone choose a spindle gouge,
and then spent what seemed like a full lunch hour helping them choose a
chuck. It's not that Dan is a crappy salesman or doesn't know what he is
trying to sell; no, it was Dan trying to get the customer the right tool for
the persons use and preference. Try getting any service like that from Penn
State.
As to the price, you get what you pay for. I brought a set of Henry Taylor
tools to the class that I liked very well before starting the class. One
day into the class, however, I fell in love with the Hamlet stuff.
Excellent quality, nice heft to it, and it keeps an edge like the ads
profess.
If there is a problem with the tool you received, I implore you to call
them. They are reasonable and fair. They will not "sucker-punch" you like
some other woodturning outlets.
Paul
As to the Hamlet tools, I used them for over a week. It sounds like you did
receive a bowl gouge.
"#beaeye" <bea...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:8muleo$65j$1...@slb2.atl.mindspring.net...
> I just received the high priced ($59.95) Hamlet 1/4" Bowl Gouge that I
> ordered from Craft Supplies. When I opened the box I thought that there
had
> been an error in shipping and that they had sent a spindle gouge instead
of
> the bowl gouge. I re-checked their catalog and the various pictures of
the
> Hamlet bowl gouges appeared to be deep fluted. The gouge I received is
> almost identical to my 1/4" Sorby spindle gouge with a very shallow flute.
>
> When I called them I was very courteously treated but the person I talked
to
> checked their stock and said that it appears that I did receive the Hamlet
> bowl gouge. One of the problems with mail order is not being able to see,
> feel and evaluate an item before you buy it and the hassle to return an
> un-wanted or incorrect item is a pain. Their representative did say that
I
> could return it and they would probably credit me with the return shipping
> charge in addition to the cost of the item. There was of course a
shipping
> charge on the original order.
>
> I feel that the pictures in the Craft Supplies catalog are misleading and
> that other woodturners will be equally disappointed if they think they are
> going to get what most of us think that bowl gouge should be. In the
> meantime, rather than go through the laborious and painful return process,
I
Joe Fleming
though. It retails for around $200. I may take a look at it. I also
think Sears carries a 1" M2 HSS gouge. I might spring for one of those
until I find a 1" Hamlet.
Joe
John Lucas
Joe
I think that Robert Sorby has a 1" bowl gouge. John Lucas
Joe Fleming
Actually, I'm looking for a very shallow 1" spindle gouge.
Thanks,
Joe
==============================================
John Lucas
Joe
I'm not sure where it is sold but Rudy Osolnik is selling a spindle
gouge that is 1 1/2" or bigger. It is perfect for large spindles. I
think I saw one at Highland Hardware in Atlanta but I wasn't looking
for it.
You can probably find it in Packard or Woodcrafts catalog. The only
other one I'm familiar with are the Sorby Continental gouges but they
only come in 8 and 12 mm. They are perfect for small spindles. John
Lucas
George
get "detail" gouges and shorten the fingernail.
I too have an old carbon steel set I'm fond of. I also purchased one 2030
gouge from Packard which holds a splendid edge.
"Joe Fleming" <jf12...@ncr.com> wrote in message
news:39996E30...@ncr.com...
mhordam
Where you going with that money in your hand? You're going down to
http://www.shopsmith.com/wuoverstock1.htm 'cause I caught them messing
about with a 1" spindle gouge on their overstocked list.
Mighty bit cheaper than the 1" Glaser.
No finders fee!
Regards,
Brian.
http://molehillturnery.co.uk
The best tools on the planet @ The best prices in cyberspace