My boat is ready to go in the water

[Gunner Asch]

Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning

https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642

https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#

It only took 2.5 months..but I had to do other stuff along the way.

Late this afternoon..I moved the next refurb into the work area...

This one..gets a full custom cabin and lots of little tweeks and mods

https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Venture24


--
"Owning a sailboat is like marrying a nymphomaniac. You don�t want to do that
but it is great if your best friend does. That way you get all the benefits without any of the upkeep"

---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com

[dh]

On 12/2/2013 5:11 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
> Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642

500 INTERNAL_SERVER_ERROR

>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#

500 INTERNAL_SERVER_ERROR


>
> It only took 2.5 months..

It will take you another 2.5 months to learn how to post some pictures,
you incompetent fucking clown.

[Ignoramus7116]

Looks awesome, perfect love nest

i

On 2013-12-03, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#
>
> It only took 2.5 months..but I had to do other stuff along the way.
>
> Late this afternoon..I moved the next refurb into the work area...
>
> This one..gets a full custom cabin and lots of little tweeks and mods
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Venture24
>
>
>

[Richard]

On 12/2/2013 7:11 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
> Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#
>
> It only took 2.5 months..but I had to do other stuff along the way.
>
> Late this afternoon..I moved the next refurb into the work area...
>
> This one..gets a full custom cabin and lots of little tweeks and mods
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Venture24
>
>
> --

> "Owning a sailboat is like marrying a nymphomaniac. You don�t want to do that

> but it is great if your best friend does. That way you get all the benefits without any of the upkeep"
>
> ---

Looks pretty good, Gunner.
If the sails shape as well, you are going to be ok.

[Larry Jaques]

On Mon, 02 Dec 2013 17:11:05 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
wrote:

>Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning
>
>https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642
>
>https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#
>
>It only took 2.5 months..but I had to do other stuff along the way.

I thought you had already fixed the wooden runners on the trailer.
Those look like they're still indenting the fiberglass of the boat
pretty deeply (couple inches?) at the front now.

The dingus was probably a bracket for a deck light or sumpin'.

>Late this afternoon..I moved the next refurb into the work area...
>
>This one..gets a full custom cabin and lots of little tweeks and mods
>
>https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Venture24

--

Just as a picture is drawn by an artist, surroundings
are created by the activities of the mind.

[jon_banquer]

On Monday, December 2, 2013 5:11:05 PM UTC-8, Gunner Asch wrote:
> Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning
>
>
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642
>
>
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#
>
>
>
> It only took 2.5 months..but I had to do other stuff along the way.
>
>
>
> Late this afternoon..I moved the next refurb into the work area...
>
>
>
> This one..gets a full custom cabin and lots of little tweeks and mods
>
>
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Venture24
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>

> "Owning a sailboat is like marrying a nymphomaniac. You don�t want to do that

>
> but it is great if your best friend does. That way you get all the benefits without any of the upkeep"
>
>
>
> ---
>
> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
>
> http://www.avast.com

Now Wieber can sleep in his boat and rent out his bedroom to yet another roommate.

[DoN. Nichols]

On 2013-12-03, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#
>
> It only took 2.5 months..but I had to do other stuff along the way.

Pity that is it not reasonable weather to *use* it now. (Or at
least not so here, not sure about CA.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: <BPdnic...@d-and-d.com> | (KV4PH) Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

[Gunner Asch]

On Mon, 02 Dec 2013 19:51:53 -0600, Ignoramus7116
<ignora...@NOSPAM.7116.invalid> wrote:

>Looks awesome, perfect love nest
>

Maybe when it warms up a little...shrug..but Ill be sailing all winter
in warm clothes. I do have a Coleman stove and whatnot stocked in the
boat..I could hook up and take a sail from the coast to Frisco or
north..or down to Ensenada Mexico with no issues. Id have to put more
water on board and stock the pantries though.

--
"Owning a sailboat is like marrying a nymphomaniac. You don�t want to do that
but it is great if your best friend does. That way you get all the benefits without any of the upkeep"

[Gunner Asch]

On Mon, 02 Dec 2013 22:09:13 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>On 12/2/2013 7:11 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
>> Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning
>>
>> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642
>>
>> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#
>>
>> It only took 2.5 months..but I had to do other stuff along the way.
>>
>> Late this afternoon..I moved the next refurb into the work area...
>>
>> This one..gets a full custom cabin and lots of little tweeks and mods
>>
>> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Venture24
>>
>>
>> --

>> "Owning a sailboat is like marrying a nymphomaniac. You don�t want to do that

>> but it is great if your best friend does. That way you get all the benefits without any of the upkeep"
>>
>> ---
>
>
>Looks pretty good, Gunner.
>If the sails shape as well, you are going to be ok.
>

The original jib and main are about 35 yrs old...but still pocket
properly. I suspect the boat didnt get much time before I wound up
with it. Both sails are very light and not coated..about 5oz dacron.
I picked up an 150% genoa from a gal in Wisconson for $25 and $24
shipping..she had a good sail locker from a Balboa 20..same rig..but I
only wanted the genny and she sent it to me. A nearly new sail! Great
genny with good material..bout 8 oz and coated. The sail bag it came
in said "genoa, Balboa 20, # 666" ...which did give me something of a
twinge..but its a damned nice genny and since much of our wind is
lightish...will be greatly needed.

The V24 has 5 bags of sails and Ive not spread them out yet..though I
did notice one was marked "storm jib". Its been rigged for a
chute..but dont know if there is one in there or not. Next weekend Ill
lay out my sails and see what Ive got.

The Ensenada 20 is considered a slow but very very stable boat with
very little heel even in good gusts. I hope the genny makes up for it
and Im looking for a chute for it as well.

I know going into it..that the Venture 24 is considered tender and I
will be working the main a lot.

Gunner


--
"Owning a sailboat is like marrying a nymphomaniac. You don�t want to do that

but it is great if your best friend does. That way you get all the benefits without any of the upkeep"

---

[Gunner Asch]

On Mon, 02 Dec 2013 21:47:48 -0800, Larry Jaques
<lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:

>On Mon, 02 Dec 2013 17:11:05 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning
>>
>>https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642
>>
>>https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#
>>
>>It only took 2.5 months..but I had to do other stuff along the way.
>
>I thought you had already fixed the wooden runners on the trailer.
>Those look like they're still indenting the fiberglass of the boat
>pretty deeply (couple inches?) at the front now.
>
>The dingus was probably a bracket for a deck light or sumpin'.

Nope,,put new douglas fire 2x6s down, with the old bunk carpet on it.
The indentations were from the previous bad bunkers.

I had to raise the boat up with the engine hoist shown..then glassed
in a piece of PVC pipe after jacking out the dents. It made it quite
solit. My only serious fuckup was welding in a pair of mid bunk
supports..and forgetting that the boats stern was hanging from the
engine hoist. Which made the mid bunk supports the high spot..not the
lowest. Some of the ;later photos show the new wood with the old
carpets laid on them. Id not gotten my scraps handy yet.

>
>
>>Late this afternoon..I moved the next refurb into the work area...
>>
>>This one..gets a full custom cabin and lots of little tweeks and mods
>>
>>https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Venture24

--

[Gunner Asch]

On 3 Dec 2013 06:00:10 GMT, "DoN. Nichols" <BPdnic...@d-and-d.com>
wrote:

>On 2013-12-03, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning
>>
>> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642
>>
>> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#
>>
>> It only took 2.5 months..but I had to do other stuff along the way.
>
> Pity that is it not reasonable weather to *use* it now. (Or at
>least not so here, not sure about CA.
>
> Enjoy,
> DoN.

Today it was 71 with a variable wind around 10-15 knots, tonight its
down in the high 30s..chilly.

We have little to no snow here and winter tends to bring out the sail
gys and windsurfers because its not dust devil wints but true winds.

[John B.]

Funny. Over here in Thailand it is almost instantaneous to load either
of the photos.

Must be a crappy computer on your end.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[jazzbeaux]

On 12/2/2013 5:11 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:

> Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#
>
> It only took 2.5 months..but I had to do other stuff along the way.
>
> Late this afternoon..I moved the next refurb into the work area...
>
> This one..gets a full custom cabin and lots of little tweeks and mods
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Venture24

Only you would spend 80+ hours refurbishing a boat that you could sell
for $1800 at most. And it still looks like a nest of badgers has been
sleeping in it.

[Brian Lawson]

On Mon, 02 Dec 2013 17:14:39 -0800, dh@. wrote:

Hey dh@

Worked OK way over here. All of them.

Brian Lawson,
Bothwell, Ontario.

[dh]

On 12/3/2013 8:39 AM, Brian Lawson wrote:
> On Mon, 02 Dec 2013 17:14:39 -0800, dh@. wrote:
>
>> On 12/2/2013 5:11 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
>>> Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning
>>>
>>> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642
>>
>> 500 INTERNAL_SERVER_ERROR
>>
>>>
>>> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#
>>
>> 500 INTERNAL_SERVER_ERROR
>>
>>
>>>
>>> It only took 2.5 months..
>>
>> It will take you another 2.5 months to learn how to post some pictures,
>> you incompetent fucking clown.
>
>
> Hey dh@
>
> Worked OK way over here. All of them.

They do now, but they didn't for hours after the shitworm posted the links.

[jon_banquer]

Wieber's plan is probably to live in it and rent out his bedroom to another roommate.

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 07:44:54 -0800, jazzbeaux <crimefighters@world>
wrote:

Humm? Ive got bout 10 hours in it, here and there. Maybe 12..

80+? Oh...I didnt notice who you were. Sorry..its early yet and I
didnt catch the stench of your nym changing buffoonery. Morning sinus
issues.

What the fuck gives you the idea I refurbed it for resale? I
refurbed it to sail.

My total cost was about $250. Quart and a half of fiberglass
resin, fiberglass cloth, teak oil, paint, all new lines (Spectra) and
4 good Harken blocks. Bought a Apelco marine vhf radio and good used
deep cycle marine battery , two good used tires for the trailer, 2 new
taillights from HF and (2) 2x6 x10 douglas fire planks for the
bunkers. Bought the cleaning supplies from the 99c store as well as
the paint brushes. I have 3 gallons of 2 cycle oil for the outboard
and the new hoses cost me $3.27

The Venture 24 is going to be the expensive one..Im designing and
building custome cabinetry. Its going to be a vacation boat. What
with the price of marine plywood...it may cost me up to $500.
Gonna gut it and rebuild from the bilge upwards. Since I paid about
$75 for the boat and trailer and 9.9 long shaft Seamaster outboard, 5
bags of sails, a ton of misc accessories...I think I can do a fair
amount and remain under budget....dont you?

Snicker

You are one of those that calls in the plumber, the electrician and
the lawn care guy..arent you? Of course you are.

Gunner


I did mention that Ive got $75 in the boat ..thats what I paid for it.

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 11:39:30 -0500, Brian Lawson
<law...@ciaccess.com> wrote:

>On Mon, 02 Dec 2013 17:14:39 -0800, dh@. wrote:
>
>>On 12/2/2013 5:11 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
>>> Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning
>>>
>>> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642
>>
>>500 INTERNAL_SERVER_ERROR
>>
>>>
>>> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#
>>
>>500 INTERNAL_SERVER_ERROR
>>
>>
>>>
>>> It only took 2.5 months..
>>
>>It will take you another 2.5 months to learn how to post some pictures,
>>you incompetent fucking clown.
>
>
>Hey dh@
>
>Worked OK way over here. All of them.

Dhu is incapable of running his computer properly is what he is
admitting.

>
>Brian Lawson,
>Bothwell, Ontario.
>
>---
>This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
>http://www.avast.com

--
"Owning a sailboat is like marrying a nymphomaniac. You don�t want to do that
but it is great if your best friend does. That way you get all the benefits without any of the upkeep"

[Richard]

Something to think about, Gunner.
Adding "cabinetry" to a very light boat like the Venture is something I
would not do. And I LOVE making things for my boats.

I say that because it adds dead weight to the boat,
takes up interior space, and _can_ turn out to be
more in the way that useful.

Go slow and minimal for best results.

Marine plywood may not be necessary.
I've used a lot of baltic birch with good results
BECAUSE I use the West System system.
Three coats of resin to completely seal the wood.

It's not an extra expense for cheap wood because you really
need to do the same treatment to marine plywood too to keep
it from wicking up water.

But whichever wood you use, I strongly recommend that there
be no exposed end grain plywood. At bare minimum seal the
ends with epoxy. Better yet is to add solid wood stoppers
(also sealed with epoxy :) )

Well anyway...

At least you are right-side-up in both of them.


I'm still looking for a Capri 22.
Looks like that's going to be a bit more expensive.

[David R. Birch]

I suspect the error is in the chair/keyboard interface.

David

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:43:16 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>Something to think about, Gunner.
>Adding "cabinetry" to a very light boat like the Venture is something I
>would not do. And I LOVE making things for my boats.
>
>I say that because it adds dead weight to the boat,
>takes up interior space, and _can_ turn out to be
>more in the way that useful.
>
>Go slow and minimal for best results.

what..this may be a bit much?

http://macgregoryachts.com/search-details.cfm?y=94949

>
>Marine plywood may not be necessary.
>I've used a lot of baltic birch with good results
>BECAUSE I use the West System system.
>Three coats of resin to completely seal the wood.
>
>It's not an extra expense for cheap wood because you really
>need to do the same treatment to marine plywood too to keep
>it from wicking up water.
>
>But whichever wood you use, I strongly recommend that there
>be no exposed end grain plywood. At bare minimum seal the
>ends with epoxy. Better yet is to add solid wood stoppers
>(also sealed with epoxy :) )
>
>Well anyway...
>
>At least you are right-side-up in both of them.
>
>
>I'm still looking for a Capri 22.
>Looks like that's going to be a bit more expensive.

Capri 22s? Those are somewhat easy to find. That being said..they
started production in the mid 1980s and there arnt all that many out
there.

http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=166


I did mention the Yahoo group Freesailboats..right?

Sign up, and go through the ads at least once a week.

http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/freesailboats/conversations/messages


http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/freesailboats/photos/albums/1932465020
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/freesailboats/photos/albums/560509793

http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/freesailboats/photos/albums/818694451
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/freesailboats/photos/albums/1775233801

When reading the messages..you will notice I post about 2x a week with
up to 40 boats at a time.

whats your maximum price? How far are you willing to drive to pick
one up?

also keep your eyes peeled on Ebay.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1986-Catalina-22-22-Used-Sailboat-for-Sale-Texas-/111227268674

(The Cat 22 swing keels are FAST!!)

set up up a search on Ebay and check it once a week.

Btw...the Santana 22 and the S2 6.9 are head and heels faster than the
Capri..and Ive posted both for under a grand. There is one in
Phoenix for $500 (Santana 22) on a trailer that would need very little
fixing.

Want a family boat or a racer? The Capri 25 is much faster btw.

We are getting into less boats as the winter progresses.

Gunner

[Lloyd E. Sponenburgh]

Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com> fired this volley in
news:rnts99lrdm2lq6cs9...@4ax.com:

> http://macgregoryachts.com/search-details.cfm?y=94949

CRAP! Those peak tank racks really brought back some lousy PCF memories!

Lloyd

[Larry Jaques]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 17:10:12 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:43:16 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
>wrote:
>
>>Something to think about, Gunner.
>>Adding "cabinetry" to a very light boat like the Venture is something I
>>would not do. And I LOVE making things for my boats.
>>
>>I say that because it adds dead weight to the boat,
>>takes up interior space, and _can_ turn out to be
>>more in the way that useful.
>>
>>Go slow and minimal for best results.
>
>what..this may be a bit much?
>
>http://macgregoryachts.com/search-details.cfm?y=94949

It seems they're using a slightly larger dinghy than you for their
basic boat, bubba. You'll never get a queen size bed, let alone that
kitchen setup, in a 24. <giggle>

>>Marine plywood may not be necessary.
>>I've used a lot of baltic birch with good results
>>BECAUSE I use the West System system.
>>Three coats of resin to completely seal the wood.

Baltic Birch is bitchen, boy.

[Richard]

On 12/3/2013 7:10 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:

>>
>> I'm still looking for a Capri 22.
>> Looks like that's going to be a bit more expensive.
>
> Capri 22s? Those are somewhat easy to find. That being said..they
> started production in the mid 1980s and there arnt all that many out
> there.

About 1500 built, I believe.

> http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=166
>
> I did mention the Yahoo group Freesailboats..right?
> Sign up, and go through the ads at least once a week.
> http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/freesailboats/conversations/messages

>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/freesailboats/photos/albums/1932465020
> http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/freesailboats/photos/albums/560509793
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/freesailboats/photos/albums/818694451
> http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/freesailboats/photos/albums/1775233801
>
> When reading the messages..you will notice I post about 2x a week with
> up to 40 boats at a time.
>
> whats your maximum price? How far are you willing to drive to pick
> one up?

The "how far" part is more of a limit than the price.
And price, of course, depends on the product.
For instance:
This guy has $10,750 "invested" in his '89 Capri 22.
http://sailingtexas.com/201301/scapri22167.html
NADA says base price average retail $2700 to $3500. $7500 retail.
So he's going to keep it for a while.

But the newer ones (5 years old maybe?) are still bringing $15000 to $18000.

> also keep your eyes peeled on Ebay.

Two things there.
1) I don't DO Ebay. You can't make me.
So that's kind of a moot point.

2) I'm not interested in a swing keel boat.
Not even a FREE one!

> http://www.ebay.com/itm/1986-Catalina-22-22-Used-Sailboat-for-Sale-Texas-/111227268674
>
> (The Cat 22 swing keels are FAST!!)

OH Lord, give me patience.
Because if you give me strength, I just might use it wrong!

No, grasshopper, that's not "fast".
Not even from just a speed perspective.

And no bleeping way if you refer to the boat's "pointing" ability.

Pointing.
The ability of a Christian to sail INTO the wind - without guilt.

>
> Btw...the Santana 22 and the S2 6.9 are head and heels faster than the
> Capri..and Ive posted both for under a grand. There is one in
> Phoenix for $500 (Santana 22) on a trailer that would need very little
> fixing.

The Santana and that S2 are both swing keels.
Just not at all interested.

> Want a family boat or a racer? The Capri 25 is much faster btw.

We race now and then. As a family.
Kinda blurs the distinction somewhat.


Yes sir! The Capri 25 can go fast all right. It can PLANE!
So its not limited to hull speed of a displacement style hull.

But it's also 25 feet long.
It's LIGHTER than my Capri 26 (4500 versed 6000).
But that puts tow weight up near 6000 pounds.

Remember, I'm DOWN-sizing. And I have money.

My desires are thus:

Trailerable, yes. 3500 to 4000 pounds tow weight.

But high performance to windward. Because any old tub can go downwind!
That means a proper keel under the boat.
A wing keel is probably the way to go for this boat.

A deep fin would point best, but harder to float on the trailer.

The local lake (that still has any water in it) is down 8 feet.
Makes launching and retrieving a real issue. (ramp length)
Right now, I'd use the crane at the club to launch.
It has a 6000 pound limit.

Able to walk the mast up and down solo.
The Capri 22 is marginal there, but an A-frame system would solve that.
I could walk a 25 foot mast up without it (in my exuberant youth).

A decent cockpit! That's one of the best features of the Capri series.
Even the 18 had a huge, well arranged cockpit.

A cabin, yes, but that's not the reason for having the boat.
It's not a "motor home on the water" - at least not for me.


A good suit of sails. You motor heads will get this easily once you
understand that the sails are what powers the boat. (Well DUH!).
And the PULL the boat, so they literally "fly".
Shape matters.

Probably go "loose footed" this time - because it makes a better set up
for reefing. The fabric doesn't get caught between reefing line and
boom, where it chafes away (rapidly).

Two reef points - or maybe just two main sails. Large and small, with
one reef point each.

Storm jib, 100% working jib, and an asymmetrical spinnaker. Don't need
a lot of overlap on the jib because we are not racing to a design rule.
Yeah, I know they look cool and everybody has a big jib, but the Asym is
better in light air and the working jib better the rest of the time.

Remember, sails are sized to move the boat to hull speed in light air.
The rest of the time they are overpowered.


I could go on, but you probably get my drift.
I know what I want.
We'll find one.
That's all it takes

[Gunner Asch]

Tell us!!

[Richard]

Baltic Birch is wonderful to work with.
But it is more susceptible to rot.
Hence the epoxy seal...

[John B.]

I see. You were hovering over Gunners site just waiting till he posted
a new picture....

You know, I believe you must be obsessed with Gunner, spending hours
watching him and I can only assume that your Mommy and Daddy support
you in a manner that you have become accustomed to so you have the
time to lurk on line and watch Gunner.

Pitiful.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 10:28:16 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 11:39:30 -0500, Brian Lawson
><law...@ciaccess.com> wrote:
>
>>On Mon, 02 Dec 2013 17:14:39 -0800, dh@. wrote:
>>
>>>On 12/2/2013 5:11 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
>>>> Finished the refurbishment of the Ensenada 20 this morning
>>>>
>>>> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#5952954671013202642
>>>
>>>500 INTERNAL_SERVER_ERROR
>>>
>>>>
>>>> https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Ensenada20#
>>>
>>>500 INTERNAL_SERVER_ERROR
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> It only took 2.5 months..
>>>
>>>It will take you another 2.5 months to learn how to post some pictures,
>>>you incompetent fucking clown.
>>
>>
>>Hey dh@
>>
>>Worked OK way over here. All of them.
>
>Dhu is incapable of running his computer properly is what he is
>admitting.
>
>
>>
>>Brian Lawson,
>>Bothwell, Ontario.
>>
>>---
>>This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
>>http://www.avast.com

"Dhu" or "Dud"?
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:43:16 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

Ask and yee shall receive....

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/boa/4222627960.html

Hows that for service?

Gunner

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:43:16 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

http://seattle.craigslist.org/see/boa/4225825258.html

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:43:16 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

http://austin.craigslist.org/boa/4226234251.html
Catalina 22 Sailboat '85 - $1000 (Lake Travis )
Need it gone ASAP. Make me an offer. I will post pics when I have a
chance to get up to the lake. Its been on the water for the last year,
unused. Could probably use a good bottom clean, and a carb clean on
the motor. I redid the teak, recovered the cusions, added a stereo
about 18 months ago. Has a solar charger and battery (battery was good
last time I was up there). Seriously just need it gone.

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:43:16 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

http://austin.craigslist.org/boa/4226564423.html

21' Calkins trailer for sale or trade - $400 (NW Austin)
� craigslist - Map data � OpenStreetMap
80's 21' Calkins sailboat trailer for sale or trade. It's in decent
shape, fully operable, carried a 1200 lb sailboat no problem. Needs
repaint, I have the title. I'm looking for a smaller boat trailer for
a 12' outboard power boat, less than 500 lbs capacity needed. Trailer
is in NW Austin, near Parmer and Mopac.

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:43:16 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>
>

>I'm still looking for a Capri 22.
>Looks like that's going to be a bit more expensive.

http://corpuschristi.craigslist.org/boa/4221956646.html
Laguna Windrose 18 Sailboat, sale or trade - $1200 (Corpus Christi
Marina)
image 1image 2image 3image 4image 5image 6image 7image 8image 9
Ready to sail, great condition classic 1974 micro yacht with a solid
hull and heavily reinforced. I sail her daily in the Corpus Christi
Bay, race, anchor out, cruise to Port Aransas, and have even taken her
45 miles into the Gulf in severe weather. Though I wouldn't recommend
the latter, the boat handled very well and will easily heave-to under
a triple-reefed main or trysail alone. If new to sailing, an
instructional sail can be provided.

*500 lb swing keel with lock-down bolt, self-righting, can be anchored
in 1 and a half feet of water with keel raised.

*Mast can be raised/lowered in minutes by 2 people

*Self-bailing cockpit with positive flotation due to large foam blocks
under cockpit and sealed in v-berth.

*Extra-large cabin sleeps 4 adults comfortably with plenty of room for
storage beneath v-berth and in cockpit lockers.

*Through-bolted hull to deck seam

*Average speed 4 to 5 knots, have reached 5.7 beating to windward and
6.2 on a broad reach.

*Can be easily moved by 2 rowing or with trolling motor in light air

Upkeep and modifications:

*Bottom job, Jan 2013, cleaned weekly by myself.
*New main birch bulkhead, twice as thick as original, tabbed and
bolted top and bottom
*Backing plates installed on most deck hardware
*Mast compression post added
*Jib tracks with cars
*All new turnbuckle screws
*New spreaders
*New mainsheet tackle and line and trackless traveller with cam cleats
*Spare main halyard block installed
*Topping lift
*Bilge pump
*Solar panel hard-wired to marine battery for LED lighted interior,
running lights and car outlet
*2 danforth anchors and 100 ft of anchor line
*New keel pivot bolt
*Horizontal axis self-steering windvane
*VHF radio with 12 volt charger
*12 volt PC computer with ATX power regulator and multiple 12 volt and
USB outputs, including all nautical and pilot charts for the north
Atlantic, GPS, WiFi and chart plotter. (LCD monitor functional for
watching TV/DVD's, but will need to be replaced since the VGA port has
a short).

Includes genoa and tracks, working jib, small jib and main. Running
and standing rigging in great condition.

Includes trailer--new lights, leaf springs, tires and bunk boards,
needs paint job. Trailer located just north of San Antonio--will bring
to Corpus when boat sells (if trailer is wanted).

Trailer and boat registered and titled.

Slip paid for through the end of December.

Willing to trade for travel trailer/camper or small fishing boat with
engine and trailer

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:43:16 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>

>I'm still looking for a Capri 22.
>Looks like that's going to be a bit more expensive.

http://gulfport.craigslist.org/boa/4224947166.html
22 foot Sailboat - $500 (Gulfport ms)

image 1image 2image 3image 4image 5image 6image 7

500obo, great deal especially since it has sails and everything. I
have paperwork for it and it's been sitting in a boat slip for all
it's life. Needs a little love. Does not have trailer but it is in
bayou Bernard, call or text for more information or come take a look
at it. 228-669-2041 preferably text

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:43:16 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>

>I'm still looking for a Capri 22.
>Looks like that's going to be a bit more expensive.

http://bham.craigslist.org/boa/4224622988.html

Sailboat - $900 (Chelsea)

� craigslist - Map data � OpenStreetMap

Sailboat, 23' Gulf Coast, with trailer

Fixer Upper (get ready over Winter for Sailing in the Spring)


205/910-3110

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:43:16 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>

>I'm still looking for a Capri 22.
>Looks like that's going to be a bit more expensive.

http://sarasota.craigslist.org/boa/4226956341.html
Catalina Capri 25 sailboat - $4900 (Sarasota)
image 1image 2image 3image 4image 5image 6image 7image 8image 9
1984 Catalina Capri 25, serial 413. Fixed keel, 4ft draft
Recent Hood Seafurl-5 roller furling, forestay and life lines.
2003 Tohatsu 9.9hp outboard runs great.
Standard mainsail, 155 genoa, & spinnaker. All canvas in good
condition.
Spinnaker, pole, and lines rarely used. Additional whisker pole.
Bottom paint job 2 years old, maintained and cleaned by professional
diver.
Compass and depth gage. Nav and mast lights. Porta-potty.
Sailing regularly in Sarasota Bay.

Location: Sarasota
it's NOT ok to contact this poster with services or other
commercial interests

[Lloyd E. Sponenburgh]

Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com> fired this volley in

news:o27t99dpu6gmdae1b...@4ax.com:

> Tell us!!

There's not a lot to it; It's just a lousy way to live for six months at
a time.

On a Mark-1 boat, I slept in one of the forward racks, with my feet
toward the bow (tight up against the peak tank), and directly under the
pilot house.

The boats are 3/16" welded aluminum, so EVERY noise on the boat gets
transmitted to you in that position -- it's sort of a "focal point" for
noise. It's not the best place, physically, to rack out (hard to get in
and out of your rack), and if the boat is under way, you're lying head-
down while the boat is under power. There's really no room for a big guy
to sleep feet aft, because the forward racks are tapered narrower at the
bow end.



Lloyd

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 18:00:33 -0800, Larry Jaques
<lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:

>On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 17:10:12 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:43:16 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>Something to think about, Gunner.
>>>Adding "cabinetry" to a very light boat like the Venture is something I
>>>would not do. And I LOVE making things for my boats.
>>>
>>>I say that because it adds dead weight to the boat,
>>>takes up interior space, and _can_ turn out to be
>>>more in the way that useful.
>>>
>>>Go slow and minimal for best results.
>>
>>what..this may be a bit much?
>>
>>http://macgregoryachts.com/search-details.cfm?y=94949
>
>It seems they're using a slightly larger dinghy than you for their
>basic boat, bubba. You'll never get a queen size bed, let alone that
>kitchen setup, in a 24. <giggle>

(Grin)

>
>
>>>Marine plywood may not be necessary.
>>>I've used a lot of baltic birch with good results
>>>BECAUSE I use the West System system.
>>>Three coats of resin to completely seal the wood.
>
>Baltic Birch is bitchen, boy.

Its also expensive as hell here in California. Almost double the
price of marine plywood.

IRCC..its $65 a 4x8 sheet of 12mm

I can get 1/2" Marine for $32

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 20:07:42 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

Oddly enough..the guys here in California have been snagging the swing
keeled C22s because they are indeed..faster than even the Capris.
Fact. But its your cash..not mine.

>
>
>>
>> Btw...the Santana 22 and the S2 6.9 are head and heels faster than the
>> Capri..and Ive posted both for under a grand. There is one in
>> Phoenix for $500 (Santana 22) on a trailer that would need very little
>> fixing.
>
>The Santana and that S2 are both swing keels.
>Just not at all interested.

Ah..no. They make swing keels..but fixed are the more common variety.

>
>> Want a family boat or a racer? The Capri 25 is much faster btw.
>
>We race now and then. As a family.
>Kinda blurs the distinction somewhat.
>
>
>Yes sir! The Capri 25 can go fast all right. It can PLANE!
>So its not limited to hull speed of a displacement style hull.

Cool!

>
>But it's also 25 feet long.
>It's LIGHTER than my Capri 26 (4500 versed 6000).
>But that puts tow weight up near 6000 pounds.

Yes and?

>Remember, I'm DOWN-sizing. And I have money.

I wasnt aware you were downsizing.

>
>My desires are thus:
>
>Trailerable, yes. 3500 to 4000 pounds tow weight.
>
>But high performance to windward. Because any old tub can go downwind!
>That means a proper keel under the boat.

Not quite true. Skinny swings are out..but many...many come close to
the surface area of a wing.

>A wing keel is probably the way to go for this boat.
>
>A deep fin would point best, but harder to float on the trailer.

So its said by some.

>
>The local lake (that still has any water in it) is down 8 feet.
>Makes launching and retrieving a real issue. (ramp length)
>Right now, I'd use the crane at the club to launch.
>It has a 6000 pound limit.

Cool!

>
>Able to walk the mast up and down solo.
>The Capri 22 is marginal there, but an A-frame system would solve that.
>I could walk a 25 foot mast up without it (in my exuberant youth).

Im pondering a A frame after rigging the V24 the first time.

>
>A decent cockpit! That's one of the best features of the Capri series.
>Even the 18 had a huge, well arranged cockpit.

Many of them are all cockpit. I buy em to spend time on..not just an
afternoon.

>
>A cabin, yes, but that's not the reason for having the boat.
>It's not a "motor home on the water" - at least not for me.
>
>
>A good suit of sails. You motor heads will get this easily once you
>understand that the sails are what powers the boat. (Well DUH!).
>And the PULL the boat, so they literally "fly".
>Shape matters.

Very very much so!

>
>Probably go "loose footed" this time - because it makes a better set up
>for reefing. The fabric doesn't get caught between reefing line and
>boom, where it chafes away (rapidly).
>
>Two reef points - or maybe just two main sails. Large and small, with
>one reef point each.
>
>Storm jib, 100% working jib, and an asymmetrical spinnaker. Don't need
>a lot of overlap on the jib because we are not racing to a design rule.
>Yeah, I know they look cool and everybody has a big jib, but the Asym is
>better in light air and the working jib better the rest of the time.
>
>Remember, sails are sized to move the boat to hull speed in light air.
>The rest of the time they are overpowered.
>
>
>I could go on, but you probably get my drift.
>I know what I want.
>We'll find one.
>That's all it takes
>
>

[Lloyd E. Sponenburgh]

Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com> fired this volley in

news:168u99lahjo8u83g1...@4ax.com:

> IRCC..its $65 a 4x8 sheet of 12mm

Gunner, except for stuff that must support your weight, the rule in boats
and airplanes is about the same as in motor homes... Cabinets should have
light frames with THIN skins!

Most of what you build in there should be skinned with 5mm stuff. Cheaper,
too.

LLoyd

[Gunner Asch]

Ayup. And 4mm is 50 a sheet. Which is a bit odd..but you arent
paying for the wood as much as the glue and processing.

[Larry Jaques]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 04:52:38 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 18:00:33 -0800, Larry Jaques
><lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:

>>Baltic Birch is bitchen, boy.
>
>Its also expensive as hell here in California. Almost double the
>price of marine plywood.
>
>IRCC..its $65 a 4x8 sheet of 12mm
>
>I can get 1/2" Marine for $32

Wow! I'm paying $25 for 5x5' sheets of 1/2"/~12mm, $20 on sale. (bad
enough) I'd look around a bit more for a better price if I were you.
It should be had for less in HelL.A. Try hardwood stores as well as
lumber yards. Home Improvement stores tend to price it horribly.

I used some plain 3/4" birch ply for a closet shelf in an upper end
home last month. HD had it for $46 a sheet and it was pretty decent.
9-ply Baltic (or Russian or Finnish) is better, though.

[Richard]

What I've seen of the plywood and Home Depot and Lowes, I wouldn't use
it to build a shelf at home, much less anything on a boat!

Look, a MUCH better building material for marine use is - Fiberglass!
But it doesn't much lend it shelf to cheap construction.

[Richard]

Well, I've mentioned it before, but again...
I sold the Capri 26 late this summer and I stepped down as
fleet commodore.

WE loved sailing that boat on Texoma, where we could sail for
four to six hours before tacking!

But I had some serious health scares about the end of summer,
and was worried that if I passed, my wife would be stuck with an
expensive toy that she couldn't sail comfortably solo.

She learned to sail on our first boat, a Capri 18 named Spirit.
So we started looking for a smaller boat. And she really likes
Capris. So do I for that matter. We are looking for a Capri 22
or maybe even another 18. (That is still the handiest keel boat
I've ever sailed!) Not terribly fast in outright speed. There is
only so much you can get from a 16 foot water line length. But
we raced it (PHRA handicap) and finished well above the middle
of the fleet each year.

>>> (The Cat 22 swing keels are FAST!!)
>>
>> OH Lord, give me patience.
>> Because if you give me strength, I just might use it wrong!
>>
>> No, grasshopper, that's not "fast".
>> Not even from just a speed perspective.

>

> Oddly enough..the guys here in California have been snagging the swing
> keeled C22s because they are indeed..faster than even the Capris.
> Fact. But its your cash..not mine.

Only downwind, guns, ONLY downwind...
And as I said, any tub can sail downwind.
And MOTOR back!

Pass.

>> Trailerable, yes. 3500 to 4000 pounds tow weight.

Because any more than that and the boat usually doesn't travel much.

Like the guys who say they want to keep the boat on a trailer at home -
it doesn't get sailed much. We kept our Capri 18 in a slip year round
just because we could go jump on the boat and be under sail in 10
minutes. But as always, other people have other ideas...

>> But high performance to windward. Because any old tub can go downwind!
>> That means a proper keel under the boat.

Google up some pictures of a wing keel.

This arrangement adds an "end plate" to a fairly short low-aspect ratio
keel.

It also puts a lot of lead ( a dense heavy fairly soft METAL :)) way
down low, so the same righting moment actually weighs less.
Less weight means less surface area in the water and less drag.


But a deep fin will still point higher (sail closer to the apparent
wind). Even in California.

>> Able to walk the mast up and down solo.
>> The Capri 22 is marginal there, but an A-frame system would solve that.
>> I could walk a 25 foot mast up without it (in my exuberant youth).
>
> Im pondering a A frame after rigging the V24 the first time.
>>

Again, google is your friend. look for "mast raising systems".

[Richard]

Gun-Ner!!@&*

San Francisco is not exactly in trailer range - for a boat
with no trailer.

Try A-Gin.

[Richard]

On 12/4/2013 11:19 AM, no spam wrote:

> How well does the swing-down keel work on any of these boats. Typically
> first to leak and cause lots of problems that are hard or impossible to
> fix - including making noise as you come about etc.?

Well, that's pretty much true of older or poorly maintained boats.
But it doesn't have to be that way.

If the hinge is loose (worn) or there is slop between keel board and
the trunk it retracts into, it will bang around, wobble some, and maybe
have a tack (side) that it sails better than the other.

The pennant (cable that raises and lowers the keel) will sing sweetly at
any speed. But that's pure unadulterated drag.

Loading heavily enough to get the hinge pin under water can sink a boat.

And the slot for the trunk is not exactly what we call a streamlined
shape...

Another thing is that swing keels are usually cast iron - not lead.
With all the issues that come with iron in salt water.

And the trunk takes up a lot of room in the cabin - right where the
floor could be.

But - some people still like the idea...

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 09:19:49 -0800, no spam <nos...@holes.com> wrote:

>On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 23:56:14 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>

>>On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:43:16 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>I'm still looking for a Capri 22.
>>>Looks like that's going to be a bit more expensive.
>>
>>http://sarasota.craigslist.org/boa/4226956341.html
>>Catalina Capri 25 sailboat - $4900 (Sarasota)
>>image 1image 2image 3image 4image 5image 6image 7image 8image 9
>>1984 Catalina Capri 25, serial 413. Fixed keel, 4ft draft
>>Recent Hood Seafurl-5 roller furling, forestay and life lines.
>>2003 Tohatsu 9.9hp outboard runs great.
>>Standard mainsail, 155 genoa, & spinnaker. All canvas in good
>>condition.
>>Spinnaker, pole, and lines rarely used. Additional whisker pole.
>>Bottom paint job 2 years old, maintained and cleaned by professional
>>diver.
>>Compass and depth gage. Nav and mast lights. Porta-potty.
>>Sailing regularly in Sarasota Bay.
>>
>> Location: Sarasota
>> it's NOT ok to contact this poster with services or other
>>commercial interests
>
>

>How well does the swing-down keel work on any of these boats. Typically
>first to leak and cause lots of problems that are hard or impossible to
>fix - including making noise as you come about etc.?

Swing keels work very well..if they are designed properly. They
seldom leak, but maintainence of the swing keel bolt does need to be
done every 5-10 yrs. Which at worst takes about an hour or two.
Simply put a jack under the swing keel and brace the keel, unscrew the
nut and remove the bolt, look in the hole with a flash light to see
how oval the bronze/brass liner has gotten to be...replace the nut and
bolt along with new seals and add a bit of 5200 sealant, tighten and
your back in business. If the boat has been used heavily for 30 or so
years..one simply drops the 100-1000 lb keel, sandblasts and reglasses
it, replace the bronze or brass bushing, lifts it back into place,
installs a new nut and bolt, new seals and you are back in business
again. The cable used to lift and lower the keel should be replaced
every 5-10 yrs if used in salt water and about double that if used in
fresh water.

From another group...

If your boat is to be craned in and out (lifted by straps to the water
and then back to its cradle), a fixed keel will offer a bit better
performance. If you must launch the boat from a ramp with a trailer,
the swing-keel is the lone practical hull configuration of the two.
Check with the yard to find out how boats are launched/recovered, then
you'll know.
****

Re: Swing Keel vs Fixed
The problem with swing keels, vs center board boats, is all the
ballast is in that big swinging plate with a swing keel. In a
knockdown, the board can swing back up and the boat will no longer
have positive stability. The could leave you with the mast pointing
down and the part of your boat that should never see the sun blinded
by the light. Multiple deaths from a swing keeler that turned turtle
in San Diego Bay last year.

Center board boats have smallish keel and a largely unweighted board.
The board does not act as ballast. When it's down, it adds additional
resistance to sideways motion for better windward performance.

Keel boats come in all sorts of configuations and keel depths. Racing
boats will have a deeper, shorter keel. More cruising oriented boats
will tend to have shallower, longer keels. The deeper the keel, the
more resistance to healing and better able to stand up to more sail
area in stronger winds. A blessing for the racer, not so much so for
the cruiser.

What really will determine what you need is the launch ramps in your
area. If they get deep quickly, full keel boats are easy to launch
with an extendable tongue or even a rope to get the boat and trailer
into deeper water. If the launch ramps are shallow, you'll be forced
to go with a shallow draft fixed keel, centerboarder, or swing keel.
That is if there are no lifts in your area. Most of the Yacht clubs on
the Alameda Estuary have simple permanent cranes for launching keel
boats up to around 30' length and 6' plus draft. The boats are built
with a lift ring so it's just a matter of hooking to the crane,
hoisting the boat out, and swingine it onto it's trailer.
****

There are two big advantages of swing keel boats.
1. They are easy to trailer and launch
2. They are usable in lakes

The two negatives of swing keel boats
1. They have their ballast in a moving chunk of steel
2. They need some maintainence in the swing keel now and then

They arent "Quite"as good up wind as full keel boats..depending on the
design of the full keel.....that being said..a good swing keel will
sail better than a poorly designed fixed keel

http://www.goodoldboat.com/reader_services/articles/keeldesign.php

There are a number of boats out there that have full LIFTING
keels..that lift a decent sized (and ballasted) keel designed like a
fixed keel boat using a winch..and those are quite good..but they tend
to be found on boats 30' or longer simply because they take room away
from the cabin. When you lift 4-8' of keel..it has to go in the
cabin..somewhere....

Side photos of boats with swing keels on trailer....

http://triadtrailers.com/triad-trailer-gallery/sailboat-trailers/triad-trailers-under-24-feet/catalina-22/

http://blaine-wa.americanlisted.com/boats-yachts-parts/4785aquarius-23-sailboat-swing-keel-on-trailer-both-well-maintained_22141425.html

Notice that they sit low on the trailer? The first one..still has
12" of keel below the boat even when trailered..and on many lakes in
light air (wind)..thats all you really need..that 12" sticking out.
So you can go into very shallow water. Both of my current boats have
10-12" of keel hanging below the boat when retracted so I can gunkhole
(play in shallow water) easily and still sail into the wind with some
sucess.

Fixed keel boats on trailer...

The first below..is the same boat as #1 above...just a fixed keel
version

http://www.pbase.com/sinnettc/image/100839405/large.jpg

http://www.nauticexpo.com/prod/arEa/sailing-boat-trailers-2-axles-20032-44289.html

http://www.sailingtexas.com/piccatalina30va.jpg

This one...is a ballasted short keel with a swing
centerboard..probably the best for both worlds..assuming you are not a
racer

http://s174.photobucket.com/user/ewayneh/media/DSC00048.jpg.html

they packed 1680 lbs (on that boat) in the two sides of that
centerboard housing for ballast..which works fine when you are shallow
and keeps the boat stable even in deep water..and the
centerboard/swing keel provides sideways resistance.

The most common issues with swing keel boats..is going out in salt
water..cranking the keel down..and it doesnt move. Or having it down
and at the end of the season..cranking it up..and it only comes up
part way. Barnacles and similar sea life have made the housing in the
bottom of the boat home..and have lodged that 600-1500 lb chunk of
iron in place. That seldom if ever happens in fresh water...and since
most guys trailer to fresh water, sail for the day or a week..and then
trailer back up and go home..its really a swing keel world..fresh
water. Lake sailing. Great Lakes excepted..as they are inland
freshwater seas.

Now racing...having a well designed light boat with lots of sail and a
well designed fixed keel...they point higher into the wind by several
degrees than do most (not all) swing keel boats. The C22 swing keel
I posted first..has the reputation of being every bit as fast as the
fixed keel version..and one doesnt need a crane to put in the water
and to put it back on the trailer at the end of the day.

Cruisers..people who go places... like across the ocean...have
different needs and construction is much different than racers of
course. They need a boat that is tough enough and heavy enough to hit
the high seas in the worst weather and come to land on the far side
safely.

Us lake sailers...light boats, swing keels, a good trailer, a cooler
full of sodas and brauts..a good breeze and we are happy.

Gunner

[Michael A. Terrell]

Gunner Asch wrote:
>
> On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 07:19:03 -0600, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
> <lloydspinsidemindspring.com> wrote:
>
> >Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com> fired this volley in
> >news:168u99lahjo8u83g1...@4ax.com:
> >
> >> IRCC..its $65 a 4x8 sheet of 12mm
> >
> >
> >Gunner, except for stuff that must support your weight, the rule in boats
> >and airplanes is about the same as in motor homes... Cabinets should have
> >light frames with THIN skins!
> >
> >Most of what you build in there should be skinned with 5mm stuff. Cheaper,
> >too.
> >
> >LLoyd
>
> Ayup. And 4mm is 50 a sheet. Which is a bit odd..but you arent
> paying for the wood as much as the glue and processing.

I picked up a couple dozen 4'x8' sheets of Lauan plywood from a local
company that repairs large truck & trailer bodies. They get roll up
doors & parts bolted to them, but there is a lot of good clear lumber
left for my projects. I picked it up for free, and someone else paid for
the gasoline. :)


--
Anyone wanting to run for any political office in the US should have to
have a DD214, and a honorable discharge.

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 11:44:31 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

Materials can be cheap...its those pesky molds and things they are
made from that can get expensive.....

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 12:09:10 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>Well, I've mentioned it before, but again...
>I sold the Capri 26 late this summer and I stepped down as
>fleet commodore.

I missed that. Sorry.

>
>WE loved sailing that boat on Texoma, where we could sail for
>four to six hours before tacking!
>
>But I had some serious health scares about the end of summer,
>and was worried that if I passed, my wife would be stuck with an
>expensive toy that she couldn't sail comfortably solo.
>
>She learned to sail on our first boat, a Capri 18 named Spirit.
>So we started looking for a smaller boat. And she really likes
>Capris. So do I for that matter. We are looking for a Capri 22
>or maybe even another 18. (That is still the handiest keel boat
>I've ever sailed!) Not terribly fast in outright speed. There is
>only so much you can get from a 16 foot water line length. But
>we raced it (PHRA handicap) and finished well above the middle
>of the fleet each year.

One of the fastest small boats..is the Venture 17..yes..it is.

>
>
>>>> (The Cat 22 swing keels are FAST!!)
>>>
>>> OH Lord, give me patience.
>>> Because if you give me strength, I just might use it wrong!
>>>
>>> No, grasshopper, that's not "fast".
>>> Not even from just a speed perspective.
>
>>
>> Oddly enough..the guys here in California have been snagging the swing
>> keeled C22s because they are indeed..faster than even the Capris.
>> Fact. But its your cash..not mine.
>
>
>Only downwind, guns, ONLY downwind...
>And as I said, any tub can sail downwind.
>And MOTOR back!

Sorry pal..your bias is getting in the way of your knowledge base
again. Its quite true what I wrote.

>
>Pass.
>
>>> Trailerable, yes. 3500 to 4000 pounds tow weight.
>
>Because any more than that and the boat usually doesn't travel much.

Ayup.

>
>Like the guys who say they want to keep the boat on a trailer at home -
>it doesn't get sailed much. We kept our Capri 18 in a slip year round
>just because we could go jump on the boat and be under sail in 10
>minutes. But as always, other people have other ideas...

Ayup.

>
>
>>> But high performance to windward. Because any old tub can go downwind!
>>> That means a proper keel under the boat.
>
>Google up some pictures of a wing keel.

Im very aware of what they are. I was winning races in the mid 1980s.

>
>This arrangement adds an "end plate" to a fairly short low-aspect ratio
>keel.
>
>It also puts a lot of lead ( a dense heavy fairly soft METAL :)) way
>down low, so the same righting moment actually weighs less.
>Less weight means less surface area in the water and less drag.
>

Ayup

>
>But a deep fin will still point higher (sail closer to the apparent
>wind). Even in California.

Sometimes. And sometimes a faster boat will simply sail wider and
still clean your clock. Dont forget..Ive been racing since the mid
80s..and my last racer was a Thistle. So I do know a tinsey winsey
bit about sailing etc etc. A smideon.

>
>
>>> Able to walk the mast up and down solo.
>>> The Capri 22 is marginal there, but an A-frame system would solve that.
>>> I could walk a 25 foot mast up without it (in my exuberant youth).
>>
>> Im pondering a A frame after rigging the V24 the first time.
>>>
>
>Again, google is your friend. look for "mast raising systems".
>

Oh Im a member of a number of the Yahoo boating groups...I ve got
about 5 different "prints and pics" and Ill get around to building
something up before long. I just finished the E20..and thats easy to
hoist..even with the HEAVY 25' mast. On the V24..if the cabin wasnt
so tall..it would be easy too..but finding purchase to get up on the
cabin top..thats an issue. Its not the weight...it requires me to be
as agile as a monkey..and after 2 back surgeries..Im not as limber as
I used to be. So Im gonna cheat and build something to help.
I singlehand a lot..so I need something to help a tad.

Gunner

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 12:11:04 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

Sign up on the Free Saiboat group..find a $500 trailer and come and
get the damned thing.

You getting mighty picky when I find you a decent boat aintcha?

Damned young puppies want the moon and the stars! Spit...shuckens!

As you said..there are only 1500 of them in the entire
HewNItedStats...so ya strike while the iron is hott!!

And dont wait too long before calling the guy..it aint winter out
here..so someone will snag that pretty quick.

Hell..buy the boat and we can store it here until you can come get it.
Ill go get it for a hundred bucks to cover the gas. Or pay the slip
fees until you can come get it.

Know any truckers deadheading a flat bed back to Texas? Talk to a
broker. But buy that sucker! You wont forgive yourself if you dont.

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 12:21:35 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>On 12/4/2013 11:19 AM, no spam wrote:
>
>> How well does the swing-down keel work on any of these boats. Typically
>> first to leak and cause lots of problems that are hard or impossible to
>> fix - including making noise as you come about etc.?
>
>Well, that's pretty much true of older or poorly maintained boats.
>But it doesn't have to be that way.

True indeed.

>
>If the hinge is loose (worn) or there is slop between keel board and
>the trunk it retracts into, it will bang around, wobble some, and maybe
>have a tack (side) that it sails better than the other.

Ayup. Big " if" though.

>
>The pennant (cable that raises and lowers the keel) will sing sweetly at
>any speed. But that's pure unadulterated drag.

Not much..and the singing is the speedometer.

>
>Loading heavily enough to get the hinge pin under water can sink a boat.

Mine is always below the water line. On both boats.

>
>And the slot for the trunk is not exactly what we call a streamlined
>shape...

But its not drag..only a little turbulance.

>
>Another thing is that swing keels are usually cast iron - not lead.
>With all the issues that come with iron in salt water.

Lots of salt water in Texas lakes is there?

>
>And the trunk takes up a lot of room in the cabin - right where the
>floor could be.

In the E20..its 6", in the V24..its 4" 5" wide on the E20...3" on
the V24

>
>But - some people still like the idea...

Hard to sail a full keel on a lake. Really hard in most lakes. There
is shoal draft...but...thats like not having my swing keels down.

No cranes to unload the boats here either....we back the trailers into
the water and float em off. And never get the vehicle wet.


Gunner

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 10:38:00 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Multiple deaths from a swing keeler that turned turtle
>in San Diego Bay last year.

They went out on a boat with the keel UP..and had 18 people on a 24'
boat as I recall.

Bunch of drunk kids....

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 10:43:14 -0800, Mikie <nom...@noplace.org> wrote:

>On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 12:21:35 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
>wrote:
>

>I had an 18 foot sailboat with a swing keel 2'x4' 1/2inch steel plate if
>memory serves - that was nothing but a pain also. If any growth gets
>either into the trunk or box etc. then you have a 'conservation of space'
>problem (Only one object can occupy any given space at any given time.)
>
>Have a fixed keel and lift (with a crane) in and out of the water from a
>trailer - is the only way to go IMHO.

And if there is no lake suitable for a long fixed keel and no
crane...one simply doesnt bother with the sport. Right?

Now about that growth on freshwater boats..that would be..what? Alge?

Hummm?

Gunner

[Richard]

Not necessarily.
Not for one-off work and small production runs.

For instance...
(my most popular Instructible!)
http://www.instructables.com/id/Making-small-fiberglass-parts/

I make my own flat glass on a piece of waxed formica.

Coat almost ANYTHING with white glue for a mold release.

Plastic wrapping tape works well, as does duct tape.

And any shape that will allow a "peel" somewhere will work.

[Richard]

When the green flag drops, the bullshit stops.
Come out on the race course.

The fastest boat I've seem personally is a Melges 24 named
Rocket Science. I've seen her doing better than 20 knots
on a a reach.

I have been teaching for the local American Sailing Association
for a while now, gunner. And I got my first USCG ticket back in
1975.

So no, I'm not buying any of that "entertainment".

[Richard]

In poker, it's called a "call".


I left a message, but he hasn't called back yet.
It IS a fin keel.

[Richard]

On 12/4/2013 6:46 PM, Richard wrote:
>..

>
> In poker, it's called a "call".
>
>
> I left a message, but he hasn't called back yet.
> It IS a fin keel.

NADA says average retail is $2090. Just for reference.

So for a thousand more, we don't want to see stress cracks in the glass!
Corners of the cockpit floor are typical places where that happens.

Any cracks in the combing are a deal breaker.
As would be any soft spots in the decks.
These boats have plywood cores in the decks, and a soft spot meant rot.
I have a cleaver way of fixing that on a beater.
But I don't WANT a beater...

I wouldn't expect much gloss from the gel coat.
That's not a deal breaker because gel coat can always be brought back to
mirror finish (if there is any left and it hasn't been painted)

The Honda 6 is plenty for that boat.

Can't expect much from the sails at that price.
A good new suit would cost more than the boat. :)

[Richard]

And mussels.
Zebra mussels have invaded quite a lot of the fresh water systems.
Messes up water purification plants as well as centerboard trunks.

I thought you knew all this shit already!?!?

[jon_banquer]

On Wednesday, December 4, 2013 4:40:56 PM UTC-8, Richard wrote:

> When the green flag drops, the bullshit stops.

What Mark Wieber start typing the bullshit begins.

> I have been teaching for the local American Sailing Association
>
> for a while now, gunner. And I got my first USCG ticket back in
>
> 1975.

Real world experience where as per usual it looks to me like Mark Wieber has very little real world sailing experience and pretends to be an expert. Nothing unusual here. This is very similar to Wieber going on and on about CNC machining even though Wieber has never had a job as a CNC machinist in a machining job shop. He also has zero, and I do mean zero, CADCAM skills. What I really love is how Wieber pretends to have me in his kill file but when he can't take the pressure I put him under he starts responding to my posts calling him on his never ending bullshit / lies.

> So no, I'm not buying any of that "entertainment".

The only people who buy any of Mark Wieber's bullshit and lies are his clique of idiot members like Larry Jackass and those that think they can get something for nothing or dirt cheap from him.

[Richard]

Just talked to the fellow and this boat itself doesn't sound bad.
At least it's not all stress cracked and soggy.
Which is always a good thing.
New jib this year. but the main is old and kinda baggy.

But no trailer and _only_ 1800 miles away. (one way)

[Richard]

[Richard]

Sorry 'bout that... fumble finger syndrome strikes again.

What I was going to say, jon, was -
don't be so hard on him. As he has always said,
it's all just for entertainment...

Lots of people use the net to live vicariously,
and vent... ;)

[jon_banquer]

I liked your fiberglassing Instructable. Haven't spent anytime on that site.

Got any cool or helpful stuff you have viewed on Instructables that you think is well done?

[Richard]

I'm glad your enjoyed that one.
I would never have expected 40,000 viewers on that one, but...

It's probably the level of detail, and the transformation from raw
material, to fugly mess, to not half bad that appeals to people.

It was certainly fun to do. I made one that was just a bit too
small for the job. When I started the one in the presentation,
me better half came out to watch. I gave her my good camera (!)
and we shot it all in one afternoon. I think she did right well.

As for recommendations, man, name a topic first!
They kind of cover the entire spectrum of interests.

I watch a lot of the micro-controller offerings.
Specifically the Parallax Propeller projects.
Not that I want to build any/all of it.
Just looking for basic ideas, I guess.
And seeing what people have created.

[pyotr filipivich]

"Michael A. Terrell" <mike.t...@earthlink.net> on Wed, 04 Dec 2013
13:53:33 -0500 typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

>
>> >Gunner, except for stuff that must support your weight, the rule in boats
>> >and airplanes is about the same as in motor homes... Cabinets should have
>> >light frames with THIN skins!
>> >
>> >Most of what you build in there should be skinned with 5mm stuff. Cheaper,
>> >too.
>> >
>> >LLoyd
>>
>> Ayup. And 4mm is 50 a sheet. Which is a bit odd..but you arent
>> paying for the wood as much as the glue and processing.
>
>
>I picked up a couple dozen 4'x8' sheets of Lauan plywood from a local
>company that repairs large truck & trailer bodies. They get roll up
>doors & parts bolted to them, but there is a lot of good clear lumber
>left for my projects. I picked it up for free, and someone else paid for
>the gasoline. :)

I got some mahogany 2x3 from a shipping crate. Plus a fair amount
of presawn thin oak boards from the pallet collection. Real nice for
use in making small jewelry boxes and the like. Also scored a couple
skins of 3mm ply - but most that's been used for is to make a
"costume" for a guitar in a school play.
My "No! Really?" moment was pricing 4x4 at Lowe's - I'd scored a
dozen or so, in eight to fourteen foot lengths, from the shipping
department's scrap bin. Used to ship AL billets. What they wanted at
the store, highway robbery!
--
pyotr filipivich
"With Age comes Wisdom. Although more often, Age travels alone."

[Richard]

On 12/4/2013 7:52 AM, Gunner Asch wrote:
> On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 07:19:03 -0600, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
> <lloydspinsidemindspring.com> wrote:
>
>> Gunner Asch<gunne...@gmail.com> fired this volley in
>> news:168u99lahjo8u83g1...@4ax.com:
>>

>>> IRCC..its $65 a 4x8 sheet of 12mm
>>
>>

>> Gunner, except for stuff that must support your weight, the rule in boats
>> and airplanes is about the same as in motor homes... Cabinets should have
>> light frames with THIN skins!
>>
>> Most of what you build in there should be skinned with 5mm stuff. Cheaper,
>> too.
>>
>> LLoyd
>
> Ayup. And 4mm is 50 a sheet. Which is a bit odd..but you arent
> paying for the wood as much as the glue and processing.
>

And volume. The less there is, the more it cost.

[Michael A. Terrell]

I like the 12' x 4' crates they ship bulk plate glass in. Two nice
13' 2x12s and a bunch of other good lumber.

[Jim Wilkins]

"Michael A. Terrell" <mike.t...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:bKidnehI8Mqh-j3P...@earthlink.com...

I built two sheds out of ~4"x3"x10' hardwood stringers from the
pallets that kitchen counters come on. A 4' wrecking bar disassembles
pallets fairly easily.

Sometimes the big box store managers will give me a good price on
plywood damaged in shipping, like $8 a sheet for thin oak, when I had
gone in to buy Lauan underlayment to make small cabinets.

It bothers me to see useable stuff sent to landfills.
jsw

[Michael A. Terrell]

Jim Wilkins wrote:

>
> Michael A. Terrell wrote:
> >
> > I like the 12' x 4' crates they ship bulk plate glass in. Two nice
> > 13' 2x12s and a bunch of other good lumber.
> >
>
> I built two sheds out of ~4"x3"x10' hardwood stringers from the
> pallets that kitchen counters come on. A 4' wrecking bar disassembles
> pallets fairly easily.
>
> Sometimes the big box store managers will give me a good price on
> plywood damaged in shipping, like $8 a sheet for thin oak, when I had
> gone in to buy Lauan underlayment to make small cabinets.
>
> It bothers me to see useable stuff sent to landfills.

Me, too. That's why I have a couple hundred board feet of 1x6 and
larger 12' longer boards in storage.

[John B.]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 18:40:56 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

The trouble with go fast sailing is that it is a lot of work. If the
helmsman loses his concentration for a moment the speed drops off. If
the sheet tenders don't pay attention the speed drops off. If the crew
doesn't sit further enough out on the rail the speed drops off.

It is sort of fun for an afternoon but Gunner was talking about a trip
to Baja.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Brian Lawson]

On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 23:56:14 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>

wrote:

>On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:43:16 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
>wrote:
>

SNIP
>
>http://sarasota.craigslist.org/boa/4226956341.html

SNIP

Hey Gunner,

Now that's a NICE looking boat. I had decided to stay home this
winter, but maybe, just maybe, something like this would get me
interested to head on down to Florida for a month or so. We'll see.

Take care.

Brian Lawson

ps...the Capri 22 looked nice too, but too far to haul home.

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 18:40:56 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

The Melges boats are always screamers..and they dont have "cabins" and
a head either' Ive raced M and X boats a number of times, boh as
skipper and opponent. My Thistle came close to kicking that ass of a
24 on a number of occasions..and did several times.

Teacher! Cool!

As for the USCG ticket..my first one was dated 1970. Then there was
the Power Squadron stuff from 1967-68

Comes from growing up on the Great Lakes..and having far too many
Coasties in the family.

Sigh..and now I live in the freaking desert...sigh

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 21:37:13 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

Afterall...jonboi has nothing else to do except sit on that falling
down sofa, drink beer and post on Usenet.

(Grin)

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 18:46:00 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>

What is?

>
>
>I left a message, but he hasn't called back yet.
>It IS a fin keel.

Which is why I posted it to you..not to the sailboat group.

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 18:58:06 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

I would..would expect you to get a survey of some sort.

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 21:14:42 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

Check the trailers in the freesailboat group? Pick up one for $400
on your way west.

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 19:01:18 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>

We dont have many of them (as of yet) in California.. there are 24
known locations..all down south.

http://nas.er.usgs.gov/taxgroup/mollusks/zebramussel/maps/CaliforniaDreissenaMap.jpg

and they dont live very long once they have been trailered out and sit
in the hot desert son for a couple weeks.

https://nrm.dfg.ca.gov/FileHandler.ashx?DocumentID=43333

So about that alge?

[Gunner Asch]

http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/freesailboats/info

We get a few now and then in Canada as well, though we seldom search
up there.

go to www.searchtempest.com

enter x number of miles you wish to search in..then enter Sailboat in
the box..and let it run.

Its quite simple.

http://abbotsford.en.craigslist.ca/bar/4222960098.html
http://toronto.en.craigslist.ca/mss/boa/4219078976.html
etc etc

I cant recall which province you live in..so only gave an example

There are a literal shitload of boats available down the eastern
seaboard. Annapolis Maryland is normally a veritible hotbed of free
boats. Sign up on the freesailboat group and simply go through the
photos for an example..but using searchtempest will get you current
boats (check phone numbers on the old ads as well if you see something
interesting. Lots of Canucks going south about now..perhaps one could
haul one back north to you. No idea of what the import etc etc
is..thats up to you. Shrug.

This may be a good source as well

http://ca.zapmeta.com/ws?q=free%20sailboats&asid=aw_zm_ca_sp_c300

Gunner

--
"Owning a sailboat is like marrying a nymphomaniac. You don�t want to do that
but it is great if your best friend does. That way you get all the benefits without any of the upkeep"

[Richard]

On 12/7/2013 6:47 AM, Gunner Asch wrote:
> On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 18:40:56 -0600, Richard<cave...@earthlink.net>
> wrote:
>
>> When the green flag drops, the bullshit stops.
>> Come out on the race course.
>>
>> The fastest boat I've seem personally is a Melges 24 named
>> Rocket Science. I've seen her doing better than 20 knots
>> on a a reach.
>>
>> I have been teaching for the local American Sailing Association
>> for a while now, gunner. And I got my first USCG ticket back in
>> 1975.
>>
>> So no, I'm not buying any of that "entertainment".
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> The Melges boats are always screamers..and they dont have "cabins" and
> a head either' Ive raced M and X boats a number of times, boh as
> skipper and opponent. My Thistle came close to kicking that ass of a
> 24 on a number of occasions..and did several times.
>
> Teacher! Cool!
>
> As for the USCG ticket..my first one was dated 1970. Then there was
> the Power Squadron stuff from 1967-68
>
> Comes from growing up on the Great Lakes..and having far too many
> Coasties in the family.
>
> Sigh..and now I live in the freaking desert...sigh
>
>
>
>

Build a Land Sailer?

[Richard]

On 12/7/2013 6:51 AM, Gunner Asch wrote:
>
> I would..would expect you to get a survey of some sort.
>
> Gunner
>

On a boat like this, the only survey I would trust is my own.

[Richard]

> go to www.searchtempest.com
>
> enter x number of miles you wish to search in..then enter Sailboat in
> the box..and let it run.
>
> Its quite simple.
>

Very entertaining.

It turned up this Capri 30.
That's the next size UP from my old boat, so not really a good
candidate for down sizing.
But what a boat!


Capri 30!
http://kansascity.craigslist.org/boa/4216363072.html

Coast Guard documented; named Fast Forward

1984 Capri 30 Sailboat with BMW 7-hp Diesel inboard motor and Trail-Rite
trailer.

Sails:
155 Kevlar/Mylar racing cut jib (very little use), new 130 Kevlar/Mylar
racing cut jib (never unfolded), new 95 Kevlar/Mylar racing cut jib
(used twice), 95 Dacron heavy air jib (very good), several older racing
jibs that are fine for cruising, relatively new Dacron racing cut
mainsail, older Dacron racing cut mainsail that is fine for cruising, �
oz orange tri-radial spinnaker, red and blue reaching cut spinnaker,
older � oz. purple, blue and aqua tri-radial spinnaker, � oz. red and
blue light air spinnaker, rainbow-colored cruising gennaker, main

[jon_banquer]

On Saturday, December 7, 2013 4:48:59 AM UTC-8, Gunner Asch wrote:
> On Wed, 04 Dec 2013 21:37:13 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> >Sorry 'bout that... fumble finger syndrome strikes again.
>
> >
>
> >What I was going to say, jon, was -
>
> >don't be so hard on him. As he has always said,
>
> >it's all just for entertainment...
>
> >
>
> >Lots of people use the net to live vicariously,
>
> >and vent... ;)
>
>
>
> Afterall...jonboi has nothing else to do except sit on that falling
>
> down sofa, drink beer and post on Usenet.
>
>
>
> (Grin)
>
>
>
> Gunner
>
>
>
> --
>

> "Owning a sailboat is like marrying a nymphomaniac. You don�t want to do that

>
> but it is great if your best friend does. That way you get all the benefits without any of the upkeep"
>
>
>
> ---
>
> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
>
> http://www.avast.com

How many roommates does Wieber now have because you can't afford to pay his bills?

How soon before Wieber is living in his sailboat and renting out his bedroom?

[Gunner Asch]

On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 08:40:19 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

So do you do your own medical diagnostics as well?

[Gunner Asch]

On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 09:04:53 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

Run that search 2x a week..generally Sunday or Monday night..and
Friday night.

I just got done posting 18 boats, all under $1000...some free
ones..one particularly nice one for $200.00

Folks are moving around a lot..and they are having to leave boats
behind....with this economy...there isnt a lot of money for boats of
this sort..so they are cheap(er)..many by an order of magnitude.
Also with our graying population..the owners are dying off leaving the
boats to the kids or widow..and they dont want/need them..so they
often are simply given away.

I thought I told you about Searchtempest last week?

[Gunner Asch]

On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 08:38:15 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

Ive pondered it, seriously. The problem is the salt lakes are about
80 miles to the east..and while I can use them here ...one has to
watch out for barbed wire fences that are down, arroyos and so forth.

I keep looking at diagrams and prints..so Ill probably build one just
to try out the concept. They are simple enough and one can use a wind
surfer sail/mast to power them. Chrome molly tubing is easy to come
by...

[Richard]

On 12/7/2013 3:04 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 08:40:19 -0600, Richard<cave...@earthlink.net>
> wrote:
>
>> On 12/7/2013 6:51 AM, Gunner Asch wrote:
>>>
>>> I would..would expect you to get a survey of some sort.
>>>
>>> Gunner
>>>
>>
>> On a boat like this, the only survey I would trust is my own.
>
> So do you do your own medical diagnostics as well?
>
>

Nope. I'm not a doctor and don't play one on TV.

[Gunner Asch]

On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 17:11:36 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>

wrote:

>On 12/7/2013 3:04 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
>> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 08:40:19 -0600, Richard<cave...@earthlink.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 12/7/2013 6:51 AM, Gunner Asch wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I would..would expect you to get a survey of some sort.
>>>>
>>>> Gunner
>>>>
>>>
>>> On a boat like this, the only survey I would trust is my own.
>>
>> So do you do your own medical diagnostics as well?
>>
>>
>
>Nope. I'm not a doctor and don't play one on TV.

Just checking. So you are the Captain of the Loveboat then?

(Grin)

Guy call you back yet?

You did call any number..rather than doing the email
thing...........right?


Gunner

[Gunner Asch]

On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 08:38:15 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

Btw...have you used this yet? It might come in handy.

Odd how close in performance my pig of an Ensenada 20 is to the famed
Capri 22....

http://www.image-ination.com/sailcalc.html

<VBG>

Gunner

[Gunner Asch]

On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 08:38:15 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

OMG!! The Capri 22 weighs significantly MORE than my Venture 24
does..and is much slower!!

And you really want one??? Gasp!!

http://www.image-ination.com/sailcalc.html

What in Croms Name for?????

the Capri 22..is just another piggy E20 and is 2' longer!!

[Richard]

On 12/7/2013 5:52 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:

> Guy call you back yet?
>
> You did call any number..rather than doing the email
> thing...........right?

Yeah, he called me back.
On my electric telephone.
Sounds like a nice guy and a mice boat.
1800 miles from home.

[Gunner Asch]

On Mon, 09 Dec 2013 01:41:03 -0600, Richard <cave...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

So when are you going to get it?

Find a trailer yet?

If I can help, let me know.

[Michael A. Terrell]

What kind of mice? :)

[Richard]

On 12/9/2013 3:51 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:
>
> Richard wrote:
>>
>> On 12/7/2013 5:52 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
>>
>>> Guy call you back yet?
>>>
>>> You did call any number..rather than doing the email
>>> thing...........right?
>>
>> Yeah, he called me back.
>> On my electric telephone.
>> Sounds like a nice guy and a mice boat.
>
>
> What kind of mice? :)
>

:^)

[Larry Jaques]

On Mon, 09 Dec 2013 16:51:01 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
<mike.t...@earthlink.net> wrote:

>
>Richard wrote:
>>
>> On 12/7/2013 5:52 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
>>
>> > Guy call you back yet?
>> >
>> > You did call any number..rather than doing the email
>> > thing...........right?
>>
>> Yeah, he called me back.
>> On my electric telephone.
>> Sounds like a nice guy and a mice boat.
>
>
> What kind of mice? :)

Ratatouille.

--
I hate being bipolar ....... It's awesome!

[Michael A. Terrell]

Rats are on ships, not boats. ;-)

[Larry Jaques]

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 02:23:58 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"

<mike.t...@earthlink.net> wrote:

>
>Larry Jaques wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, 09 Dec 2013 16:51:01 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
>> <mike.t...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >Richard wrote:
>> >>
>> >> On 12/7/2013 5:52 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > Guy call you back yet?
>> >> >
>> >> > You did call any number..rather than doing the email
>> >> > thing...........right?
>> >>
>> >> Yeah, he called me back.
>> >> On my electric telephone.
>> >> Sounds like a nice guy and a mice boat.
>> >
>> >
>> > What kind of mice? :)
>>
>> Ratatouille.
>
>
> Rats are on ships, not boats. ;-)

Did you pronounce that "botes" or "bewts", Mikey?

[Jim Wilkins]

"Larry Jaques" <lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote in message
news:iefea999c654egh8d...@4ax.com...

Is it a ratamaran?