Rush Limbaugh accidentally endorses Obamacare
Cliff
http://trueslant.com/rickungar/2010/01/03/rush-limbaugh-accidentally-endorses-obamacare/
[
....
Released from the hospital with a clean bill of health, Rush instantly took the
opportunity to take a shot at the effort to reform the health care system while
effusively praising the Hawaiian hospital that had taken such good care of him.
I donīŋŊt think thereīŋŊs one thing wrong with the American health care system. I
got no special treatment other than what anybody else that would have called 911
and had been brought in with the same kinds of symptoms.
Via USA Today
Now, I suspect old Rush has a pretty good health insurance policy, even if he
does smoke cigars like a chimney and carry around about 100 extra pounds. So I
wondered if Limbaugh could bring himself to give some thought as to how it might
have gone for someone who was not so fortunate as to have quality health
insurance coverage.
Then, it hit me. Limbaugh was actually right. He was telling the truth when he
said he did not receive special treatment because, since 1974 when mandated
health insurance was instituted in Hawaii, pretty much everyone in Hawaii has
the same health care availability afforded to Rush.
It turns out that Limbaugh has not been keeping up with his current events. If
he had, he might have known he was lavishing praise on the most socialistic
medical system in the United States.
Not only is Hawaii the closest thing to a socialist health care system in the
nation, it was actually the model for the Clinton AdministrationīŋŊs failed effort
to institute universal health coverage back in the early 1990īŋŊs. Despite the
fact that the state has the highest costs in the country for just about
everything īŋŊ due to the necessity of shipping everything to the islands from the
mainland- Hawaiian comprehensive health insurance comes with some of the
smallest co-pays and premium charges in the country. WhatīŋŊs more, the costs per
Medicare beneficiary is the lowest in the United States.
Oops.
With everyone covered by primary care, emergency room visits tend to be for real
emergencies, not the non-emergent care mainland ERs dispense for people without
coverage. That reduces the costs of ERs and the costs of non-emergent medicine
since patients can be handled less expensively and more effectively by their
primary doctors. Hospitals have not overbuilt, acquiring expensive machines to
compete with their neighbors for patients. Insurance companies have instituted
screening and other measures to improve wellness among their covered
populations.
Via Fox4 TV Kansas City
And yet, there was Limbaugh standing before the cameras extolling the virtues of
his Hawaiian health care. No complaints about long waiting times to see a
doctor. No complaints about slow emergency room care. No complaints about
waiting lists to receive important tests. No complaints about aged or inadequate
technology.
Quite the contrary. It seems that, from LimbaughīŋŊs point of view, the
socialistic Hawaiian medical system, in practice now for over three decades, was
as good as it gets.
....
]
Paul Hovnanian P.E.
If we actually had death panels, his name would be at the top of the
list.
--
Paul Hovnanian mailto:Pa...@Hovnanian.com
------------------------------------------------------------------
Relax, its only ones and zeros!
Morton Davis
"Paul Hovnanian P.E." <Pa...@Hovnanian.com> wrote in message
news:4B4287AE...@Hovnanian.com...
> He debunked all that BS about 'death panels' at the same time.
>
> If we actually had death panels, his name would be at the top of the
> list.
>
>
write them out of the bills?
BTW: Limbaugh is a multimillionaire who can buy his own hospital wing if he
wants to.
Ed Huntress
"Morton Davis" <anti...@go.com> wrote in message
news:yYGdnZMebeyzXd_W...@mchsi.com...
>
> "Paul Hovnanian P.E." <Pa...@Hovnanian.com> wrote in message
> news:4B4287AE...@Hovnanian.com...
>> He debunked all that BS about 'death panels' at the same time.
>>
>> If we actually had death panels, his name would be at the top of the
>> list.
>>
>>
> Since death panels didn't exist - why'd they make a big fuss about having
> to write them out of the bills?
Because the rightards would keep yelling about it, and they'd scream
"Nothing has been done about the death panels!", and their sheep would stare
with their mouths hung open like the drones in Apple's "1984" commercial,
because none of them would know how, or where to look for it, anyway.
> BTW: Limbaugh is a multimillionaire who can buy his own hospital wing if
> he wants to.
He hasn't seen the bill yet. <g>
--
Ed Huntress
Gunner Asch
wrote:
And in fact..has done so.
Gunner
pyotr filipivich
<gun...@lightspeed.net> reported Elvis on Mon, 04 Jan 2010 20:52:30
-0800 in misc.survivalism:
>>> He debunked all that BS about 'death panels' at the same time.
>>> If we actually had death panels, his name would be at the top of the
>>> list.
>>Since death panels didn't exist - why'd they make a big fuss about having to
>>write them out of the bills?
>>
>>BTW: Limbaugh is a multimillionaire who can buy his own hospital wing if he
>>wants to.
>>
>And in fact..has done so.
I wonder if the progressives can tell the difference between
health care, and insurance? That what the Democrats in Congress have
passed is not about healthcare at all, but how to pay for it.
And if the Feds are going to be paying for it, they're going to be
the ones deciding just what it is they're going to pay for.
Damn, more idiots who have no idea what "He who pays the piper,
calls the tune." means.
pyotr
-
pyotr filipivich
Next Months Panel: Suicide - getting it right the first time.
Cliff
He got no special treatment per him.
They locked down the entire wing .... as if they had the Pope.
>Gunner
--
Cliff
Paul Hovnanian P.E.
> I missed the Staff Meeting but the Minutes record that Gunner Asch
> <gun...@lightspeed.net> reported Elvis on Mon, 04 Jan 2010 20:52:30
> -0800 in misc.survivalism:
>>On Mon, 4 Jan 2010 22:30:46 -0600, "Morton Davis" <anti...@go.com>
>>wrote:
>>>"Paul Hovnanian P.E." <Pa...@Hovnanian.com> wrote:
>>>> He debunked all that BS about 'death panels' at the same time.
>>>> If we actually had death panels, his name would be at the top of the
>>>> list.
>>>Since death panels didn't exist - why'd they make a big fuss about having
>>>to write them out of the bills?
>>>
>>>BTW: Limbaugh is a multimillionaire who can buy his own hospital wing if
>>>he wants to.
>>>
>>And in fact..has done so.
>
> I wonder if the progressives can tell the difference between
> health care, and insurance? That what the Democrats in Congress have
> passed is not about healthcare at all, but how to pay for it.
Correct. The entire emphasis has been on providing healthcare for the
uninsured or underinsured. Not its cost.
> And if the Feds are going to be paying for it, they're going to be
> the ones deciding just what it is they're going to pay for.
Or they'll be the ones who have enough purchasing power to force volume
discounts from the providers. That's the only was we're going to keep costs
under control. Particularly when they've just gone and increased the demand
for the current supply of services.
Doctors, hospitals and drug companies must be laughing all the way to the
bank right now.
--
Paul Hovnanian pa...@hovnanian.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Have gnu, will travel.
Paul Hovnanian P.E.
[snip]
>
> BTW: Limbaugh is a multimillionaire who can buy his own hospital wing if
> he wants to.
That won't help him if he's traveling in a different city when he gets sick.
Or if he gets mugged and his ID is lifted. Then he's just another hobo found
beaten up, lying in the gutter. Come to think of it, he does look quite a
bit like one of our "Will work for food" off-ramp beggars. He'd better hope
the city he's in has a damned good public health care program up to the
point where he regains consciousness.
Wes
>He debunked all that BS about 'death panels' at the same time.
>
>If we actually had death panels, his name would be at the top of the
>list.
He can pay cash.
Wes
Cliff
wrote:
>I missed the Staff Meeting but the Minutes record that Gunner Asch
><gun...@lightspeed.net> reported Elvis on Mon, 04 Jan 2010 20:52:30
>-0800 in misc.survivalism:
>>On Mon, 4 Jan 2010 22:30:46 -0600, "Morton Davis" <anti...@go.com>
>>wrote:
>>>"Paul Hovnanian P.E." <Pa...@Hovnanian.com> wrote:
>>>> He debunked all that BS about 'death panels' at the same time.
>>>> If we actually had death panels, his name would be at the top of the
>>>> list.
>>>Since death panels didn't exist - why'd they make a big fuss about having to
>>>write them out of the bills?
>>>
>>>BTW: Limbaugh is a multimillionaire who can buy his own hospital wing if he
>>>wants to.
>>>
>>And in fact..has done so.
>
> I wonder if the progressives can tell the difference between
>health care, and insurance? That what the Democrats in Congress have
>passed is not about healthcare at all, but how to pay for it.
Where was the Party of NO & lies?
> And if the Feds are going to be paying for it, they're going to be
>the ones deciding just what it is they're going to pay for.
You don't know what's going on, eh?
>
> Damn, more idiots who have no idea what "He who pays the piper,
>calls the tune." means.
IOW gummer is dead.
>
>pyotr
>-
>pyotr filipivich
>Next Months Panel: Suicide - getting it right the first time.
Wingers lay eggs.
--
Cliff
Cliff
>Paul Hovnanian P.E. wrote:
>
>>
>> Doctors, hospitals and drug companies must be laughing all the way to the
>> bank right now.
>>
>
>Try and tell the Mayo Clinic that:
>
>http://tinyurl.com/yewgto6
[
In order for the more then 3,200 patients on Medicare to stay with their present
primary doctor they will have to pay an annual $250 administrative fee, plus
appointment fees of $175 to $400 per visit.
]
If they are getting anything like $175 to $400 ++ for a visit to
a primary care doctor something stinks in AZ.
--
Cliff
Frito Pendejo
> http://trueslant.com/rickungar/2010/01/03/rush-limbaugh-accidentally-endorses-obamacare/
>
> It turns out that Limbaugh has not been keeping up with his current events. If
> he had, he might have known he was lavishing praise on the most socialistic
> medical system in the United States.
>
> Not only is Hawaii the closest thing to a socialist health care system in the
> to institute universal health coverage back in the early 1990�s. Despite the
> fact that the state has the highest costs in the country for just about
> mainland- Hawaiian comprehensive health insurance comes with some of the
> Medicare beneficiary is the lowest in the United States.
>
> Oops.
Whether Hawaii's health care system is socialist or not is
irrelevant, since it is constitutional.
According to that pesky 10th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution,
any powers not specifically granted to the federal government by
the Constitution or its Amendments are denied to it and reserved
to the States.
The Constitution and Amendments do not permit the federal
government to operate a government-run health care system. But
nothing denies states the right to operate their own
government-run health care systems. The people of Hawaii duly
voted for such a system and got it. But the only way to create
a national health care system is to amend the Constitution.
If national health care enjoys such widespread public support as
is claimed by the Democrats, amending the Constitution should be
no problem. But the ratification process would involve debate
and transparency, something the Democrats obviously don't want,
which is why the try to sneak an unconstitutional 2000-page law
through in the middle of the night.
Ed Huntress
"Frito Pendejo" <fr...@pendejo.com> wrote in message
news:i6qdnfAagYC_p9jW...@earthlink.com...
> Cliff wrote:
>> http://trueslant.com/rickungar/2010/01/03/rush-limbaugh-accidentally-endorses-obamacare/
>>
>> It turns out that Limbaugh has not been keeping up with his current
>> events. If
>> he had, he might have known he was lavishing praise on the most
>> socialistic
>> medical system in the United States.
>>
>> Not only is Hawaii the closest thing to a socialist health care system in
>> the
>> effort
>> to institute universal health coverage back in the early 1990�s. Despite
>> fact that the state has the highest costs in the country for just about
>> mainland- Hawaiian comprehensive health insurance comes with some of the
>> Medicare beneficiary is the lowest in the United States.
>>
>> Oops.
>
> Whether Hawaii's health care system is socialist or not is irrelevant,
> since it is constitutional.
>
> According to that pesky 10th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, any
> powers not specifically granted to the federal government by the
> Constitution or its Amendments are denied to it and reserved to the
> States.
No! They're reserved to "the states, or the people."
So, which is it? The states, or the people?
Next issue:
>
> The Constitution and Amendments do not permit the federal government to
> operate a government-run health care system. But nothing denies states
> the right to operate their own government-run health care systems. The
> people of Hawaii duly voted for such a system and got it. But the only
> way to create a national health care system is to amend the Constitution.
No problemo. See USSC, Wickard v. Filburn (1942), and the further details
established by Gonzales v. Raich (2005).
This one will easily fit within current case law regarding the Commerce
Clause. So you may have an argument you want to make about it, but you would
lose in court. Therefore, it's not going to be an impediment, if someone
tries to raise it.
--
Ed Huntress
Lookout
wrote:
>Cliff wrote:
>> http://trueslant.com/rickungar/2010/01/03/rush-limbaugh-accidentally-endorses-obamacare/
>>
>> It turns out that Limbaugh has not been keeping up with his current events. If
>> he had, he might have known he was lavishing praise on the most socialistic
>> medical system in the United States.
>>
>> Not only is Hawaii the closest thing to a socialist health care system in the
>> nation, it was actually the model for the Clinton Administration�s failed effort
>> to institute universal health coverage back in the early 1990�s. Despite the
>> fact that the state has the highest costs in the country for just about
>> everything � due to the necessity of shipping everything to the islands from the
>> mainland- Hawaiian comprehensive health insurance comes with some of the
>> smallest co-pays and premium charges in the country. What�s more, the costs per
>> Medicare beneficiary is the lowest in the United States.
>>
>> Oops.
>
>Whether Hawaii's health care system is socialist or not is
>irrelevant, since it is constitutional.
>
>According to that pesky 10th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution,
>any powers not specifically granted to the federal government by
>the Constitution or its Amendments are denied to it and reserved
>to the States.
>
>The Constitution and Amendments do not permit the federal
>government to operate a government-run health care system.
Uh..what do you call VA hospitals? It seems you are interpreting the
law wrong
> But
>nothing denies states the right to operate their own
>government-run health care systems. The people of Hawaii duly
>voted for such a system and got it. But the only way to create
>a national health care system is to amend the Constitution.
>
>If national health care enjoys such widespread public support as
>is claimed by the Democrats, amending the Constitution should be
>no problem.
Not necessary. You can continue to whine about it but you're wrong.
>But the ratification process would involve debate
>and transparency, something the Democrats obviously don't want,
>which is why the try to sneak an unconstitutional 2000-page law
>through in the middle of the night.
No sneaking at all. Again, you're wrong.
Cliff
>Cliff wrote:
>> http://trueslant.com/rickungar/2010/01/03/rush-limbaugh-accidentally-endorses-obamacare/
>>
>> It turns out that Limbaugh has not been keeping up with his current events. If
>> he had, he might have known he was lavishing praise on the most socialistic
>> medical system in the United States.
>>
>> Not only is Hawaii the closest thing to a socialist health care system in the
>> nation, it was actually the model for the Clinton Administration�s failed effort
>> to institute universal health coverage back in the early 1990�s. Despite the
>> fact that the state has the highest costs in the country for just about
>> everything � due to the necessity of shipping everything to the islands from the
>> mainland- Hawaiian comprehensive health insurance comes with some of the
>> smallest co-pays and premium charges in the country. What�s more, the costs per
>> Medicare beneficiary is the lowest in the United States.
>>
>> Oops.
>
>Whether Hawaii's health care system is socialist or not is
>irrelevant, since it is constitutional.
>
>According to that pesky 10th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution,
>any powers not specifically granted to the federal government by
>the Constitution or its Amendments are denied to it and reserved
>to the States.
>
>The Constitution and Amendments do not permit the federal
>government to operate a government-run health care system.
I guess you don't know anything about it.
Where is it prohibited in the US Constitution?
Have you informed all those on Medicare or getting VA health care?
--
Cliff
Cliff
>Paul Hovnanian P.E. wrote:
>
>>
>> Doctors, hospitals and drug companies must be laughing all the way to the
>> bank right now.
>>
>
>Try and tell the Mayo Clinic that:
>
>http://tinyurl.com/yewgto6
[
In order for the more then 3,200 patients on Medicare to stay with their present
primary doctor they will have to pay an annual $250 administrative fee, plus
appointment fees of $175 to $400 per visit.
]
If they are getting anything like $175 to $400 ++ for a visit to
a primary care doctor something stinks in AZ.
Update:
http://www.startribune.com/politics/80865647.html?elr=KArksLckD8EQDUoaEyqyP4O:DW3ckUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aUUl
"Mayo may see windfall from health bill"
[
The hospital and its coalition stand to gain millions in Medicare dollars under
a revised formula.
As House and Senate lawmakers reconcile their health care bills with an eye to
final passage, one provision is prompting celebration from a small group of
influential hospitals that stand to gain millions in Medicare dollars.
Language in both bills would reward hospitals for efficiency in their Medicare
spending, a dramatic change in the formula for parceling out the public dollars.
That could prove to be a windfall for some hospitals but a loss for others,
mostly those in big cities and the South.
A revised Medicare formula represents a major lobbying victory for a coalition
of hospitals based in the Upper Midwest, led by the Mayo Clinic.
.....
]
And cut costs too I expect.
--
Cliff
Paul Hovnanian P.E.
Not really. Some insurance plans (Medicare included?) place restrictions on
what a doctor can charge for a procedure, not just what the insurance plan
will pay. So one of the loopholes that hospitals and clinics employ is to
tack charges onto events not covered by the plan, such as walking in the
front door.
In my opinion, all insurance (not just health care insurance) should be a
private contract between an individual and the insurance company. Clinics
should post a list of prices per procedure, insurance companies post a list
of reimbursement per procedure for a given plan. If a patient walks into a
more expensive clinic than what their plan covers, they'll have to cough up
the rest. The insurance companies will perform a periodic review of their
plans vs various clinics/hospitals and provide customers a list of
establishments that are covered 100%.
Cliff
wrote:
>Cliff wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 05 Jan 2010 13:32:43 -0800, Garlicdude <pul...@garlic.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Paul Hovnanian P.E. wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Doctors, hospitals and drug companies must be laughing all the way to
>>>> the bank right now.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Try and tell the Mayo Clinic that:
>>>
>>>http://tinyurl.com/yewgto6
>>
>> [
>> In order for the more then 3,200 patients on Medicare to stay with their
>> present primary doctor they will have to pay an annual $250 administrative
>> fee, plus appointment fees of $175 to $400 per visit.
>> ]
>>
>> If they are getting anything like $175 to $400 ++ for a visit to
>> a primary care doctor something stinks in AZ.
>
>Not really. Some insurance plans (Medicare included?) place restrictions on
>what a doctor can charge for a procedure, not just what the insurance plan
>will pay. So one of the loopholes that hospitals and clinics employ is to
>tack charges onto events not covered by the plan, such as walking in the
>front door.
This seems to be a base charge just for a routine visit.
I don't get billed anything like that (I pay my own for routine
stuff). Though it's often steep enough as is IMHO.
And if really sick they would just tell you to go to an emergency room
anyway (plus bill you for the visit I suppose) ... IF you could get in to
see then without a resrervation made months in advance.
>In my opinion, all insurance (not just health care insurance) should be a
>private contract between an individual and the insurance company.
So why is gummer still alive, such as it is?
>Clinics
>should post a list of prices per procedure, insurance companies post a list
>of reimbursement per procedure for a given plan. If a patient walks into a
>more expensive clinic than what their plan covers, they'll have to cough up
>the rest. The insurance companies will perform a periodic review of their
>plans vs various clinics/hospitals and provide customers a list of
>establishments that are covered 100%.
CIGNA, as an example, may not cover YOUR doctor or hospital at all.
YOU pay.
--
Cliff