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Kugler Colors in trouble
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JoJo
Aug 28, 2004, 11:39:16 AM8/28/04
to
Do you konw that those colors are very very toxic and some of them contain
over 30 % lead as well as Cadmium and Arsenic!!!Don´t inhale theire powders
and dusts !!!
They burn out as soon you stick them into the Glory Hole over 1200
Celsius!!!!!You might have smelled and seen the smoke ---these smokes can
kill a rat in a few hours !!
Many people start avoiding those colors already ,because they are not giving
correct information on their products no data sheets etc..
The USA customs will stop the import of such colors unless they give them
the exact recepies and formulars how they made with the correct data sheet
wich they must provide.There is a big lawsuit in Germany right now over 300
000 $ US against Friedrich the Kugler color maker.Wonder who is gonna be the
winner.
It is interesting say you make an inside color cup and you drink out of it
how long you will be in good health conditions.the fruit acid for example or
the vinegar if the wine you drink is eating a lot of this very toxic
materials out of the glass.Belive it or not the Family of Friedrich (
Kugler) ripped of some customers of them and they fight back
with the help of the German OSHA and other institutions .They searched there
company and found all this nasty stuff to make colored glass even they claim
it is lead free--
seems to be the bigges lie in the glass scene---- so wach out using this
scrap
Wonder how Reichenbach comes away with this.
over 30 % lead as well as Cadmium and Arsenic!!!Don´t inhale theire powders
and dusts !!!
They burn out as soon you stick them into the Glory Hole over 1200
Celsius!!!!!You might have smelled and seen the smoke ---these smokes can
kill a rat in a few hours !!
Many people start avoiding those colors already ,because they are not giving
correct information on their products no data sheets etc..
The USA customs will stop the import of such colors unless they give them
the exact recepies and formulars how they made with the correct data sheet
wich they must provide.There is a big lawsuit in Germany right now over 300
000 $ US against Friedrich the Kugler color maker.Wonder who is gonna be the
winner.
It is interesting say you make an inside color cup and you drink out of it
how long you will be in good health conditions.the fruit acid for example or
the vinegar if the wine you drink is eating a lot of this very toxic
materials out of the glass.Belive it or not the Family of Friedrich (
Kugler) ripped of some customers of them and they fight back
with the help of the German OSHA and other institutions .They searched there
company and found all this nasty stuff to make colored glass even they claim
it is lead free--
seems to be the bigges lie in the glass scene---- so wach out using this
scrap
Wonder how Reichenbach comes away with this.
nJb
Aug 28, 2004, 6:33:55 PM8/28/04
to
Moonraker
Aug 28, 2004, 10:20:01 PM8/28/04
to
"JoJo" <da...@fountainlost.com> wrote in message
news:cgq8s2$1733$1...@ulysses.news.tiscali.de...
> Do you konw that those colors are very very toxic and some of them contain
> over 30 % lead as well as Cadmium and Arsenic!!!Don´t inhale theire
powders
> and dusts !!!
While your allegations are interesting, you provide no independent source
for your comments. I suppose you could provide some documentation for this
long rant, eh?
Mike Firth
Aug 29, 2004, 1:26:43 AM8/29/04
to
Actually, the real question is why this person thinks this is surprising
and unknown.
I have known that Kugler (and other) colors for glass contain lead, arsenic
and cadmium since the day I started using them in my first glassblowing
class over ten years ago.
It has always been true that vessels to contain beverages or plates
surfaces made of glass using these colors must be cased with lead free
clear. Normally this is done by doing a gather of clear glass, picking up
a chunk of color and blowing the clear through the color so there is a thin
layer of clear on the inside.
Many colors can only be made with cadmium (yellow) and lead in glass make
the fit of different Coefficient of Expansions much easier.
and unknown.
I have known that Kugler (and other) colors for glass contain lead, arsenic
and cadmium since the day I started using them in my first glassblowing
class over ten years ago.
It has always been true that vessels to contain beverages or plates
surfaces made of glass using these colors must be cased with lead free
clear. Normally this is done by doing a gather of clear glass, picking up
a chunk of color and blowing the clear through the color so there is a thin
layer of clear on the inside.
Many colors can only be made with cadmium (yellow) and lead in glass make
the fit of different Coefficient of Expansions much easier.
--
Mike Firth
Hot Glass Bits Furnace Working Website
http://users.ticnet.com/mikefirth/hotbit46.htm Latest notes
"Moonraker" <moon...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:d3bYc.39491$%n4.1...@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
Henry Halem
Aug 29, 2004, 3:40:36 PM8/29/04
to
All reds and yellows are lead free and always have been and most every glass
regardless of where or who made has arsenic in it as a minute additive for
fining as well as antimony for the same reason. Neither of which has ever
been a problem except when those chemicals are handled in their raw state.
Reds and Yellows have always been problematic when it comes to fitting a
base glass because they do not contain lead. The problem for any glass
including lead based glasses and enamels is their relative chemical
durability. Chemical durability is in a nutshell the ratios of the alkali to
silica. If those ratios are out of wack then you can get levels of
solubility when the glass is exposed to the moisture in the air. The same
holds true for lead leaching for the same reason. If the ratios are correct
and the glass is tested for chemical durability then there is little to no
problem. If and when Cadmium and or Selenium reach their vapor point you
will not smell it, you will smell fluorine opals though. Been their! The
gassing of fluorine opals when being melted in the furnace and worked in the
glory hole is problematic as the fumes will turn to HF when they come in
contact with the moisture in the atmosphere as well as your lungs. There is
no problem for those of you fusing those type glasses as you are not at the
vapor point of the fluorine. Oh yes, it is never a good idea to breath any
vapors or dusts from anything found in the glass studio. 1200 C is 2192 F.
Also, what's wrong with killing rats? Don't over react to the posting as the
dangers from color rods, and frits are little to nil to none when handled
correctly as in always pick up powders in a powder booth that has a good
exhaust and wear an approved dust mask when using powders for projects.
Having said all of the above I would say it is my understanding that all the
rod companies are aware of the lead problems and have been working to get
the lead out of their rods as the European lead laws have come into
existence. The late great Klaus Kugler sold his company because he did not
wish to reformulate all the glasses he had in his catalog. One of the
problems with the rods is that fit for certain base glasses has now become
problematic as they have removed the lead from their products. Read Mike
Firth's posting as well. Why is this the wrong place for JoJo's posting?
Seems to me to be the perfect place for it.
regardless of where or who made has arsenic in it as a minute additive for
fining as well as antimony for the same reason. Neither of which has ever
been a problem except when those chemicals are handled in their raw state.
Reds and Yellows have always been problematic when it comes to fitting a
base glass because they do not contain lead. The problem for any glass
including lead based glasses and enamels is their relative chemical
durability. Chemical durability is in a nutshell the ratios of the alkali to
silica. If those ratios are out of wack then you can get levels of
solubility when the glass is exposed to the moisture in the air. The same
holds true for lead leaching for the same reason. If the ratios are correct
and the glass is tested for chemical durability then there is little to no
problem. If and when Cadmium and or Selenium reach their vapor point you
will not smell it, you will smell fluorine opals though. Been their! The
gassing of fluorine opals when being melted in the furnace and worked in the
glory hole is problematic as the fumes will turn to HF when they come in
contact with the moisture in the atmosphere as well as your lungs. There is
no problem for those of you fusing those type glasses as you are not at the
vapor point of the fluorine. Oh yes, it is never a good idea to breath any
vapors or dusts from anything found in the glass studio. 1200 C is 2192 F.
Also, what's wrong with killing rats? Don't over react to the posting as the
dangers from color rods, and frits are little to nil to none when handled
correctly as in always pick up powders in a powder booth that has a good
exhaust and wear an approved dust mask when using powders for projects.
Having said all of the above I would say it is my understanding that all the
rod companies are aware of the lead problems and have been working to get
the lead out of their rods as the European lead laws have come into
existence. The late great Klaus Kugler sold his company because he did not
wish to reformulate all the glasses he had in his catalog. One of the
problems with the rods is that fit for certain base glasses has now become
problematic as they have removed the lead from their products. Read Mike
Firth's posting as well. Why is this the wrong place for JoJo's posting?
Seems to me to be the perfect place for it.
JoJo
nJb
Aug 29, 2004, 6:50:53 PM8/29/04
to
Henry Halem wrote:
> Why is this the wrong place for JoJo's posting?
> Seems to me to be the perfect place for it.
>
>
Henry,
24 hours before making their "Kugler" post JoJo made this post:
=================================================================
Subject: sorry
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 18:35:58 +0200
From:"JoJo" <da...@fountainlost.com>
Organization: OSHAGERM
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.glass
sorry wrong group
================================================================
My comment was a dig at somebody feeling compelled to post a message
titled "sorry" that said nothing more than "sorry wrong group". Strange
post. Have you ever clicked on the wrong group when browsing newsgroups?
I have, but it never occurred to me to let the group know of my error.
--
Jack
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