Is a bow thruster on Sea Ray 290 practical? Please don't laugh...
Sadler Love
screws since it gets might crowded with two engines in the small engine
compartment. And I don't want to go to a larger boat if at all possible--I
love the ability to dry stack the 290 and its relatively compact size. So,
is it ridiculous to consider installing a bow thruster on this boat? There's
about 20 inches of vertical space in the bow under the front berth, just in
front of the air conditioner. Thanks in advance,
Sadler Love
Bryon Kass
line. They are electric and need lots of batteries to run them. One
drawback to electric is heat. I have seen one boat totalled from fire
due to an overloaded or overused bow thruster. The hydraulic ones
are less problems but are more expensive and need to be driven off
an auxilliary engine pump. I am not sure if any that small are
available.
There is another thruster based on a pump design with thru hull outlets
in a water jet. Also electric and very power hungry but cheaper to
buy and install. One could be made to run directly off the engine
with control valves either mechanical or electric.
Bryon Kass
Webmaster and Custom Design
The Engine Room http://getit.at/engineroom
150 Mechanic St.
Foxboro, MA 02035
508-543-9068 508-543-5127 fax or 508-384-2415 at the Foot Yard
Larry KN4IM
<Sad...@infoavenospam.net> wrote:
>I love my 290 Sea Ray and I do all my own maintenance, so I didn't want twin
>screws since it gets might crowded with two engines in the small engine
>compartment. And I don't want to go to a larger boat if at all possible--I
>love the ability to dry stack the 290 and its relatively compact size. So,
>is it ridiculous to consider installing a bow thruster on this boat? There's
>about 20 inches of vertical space in the bow under the front berth, just in
>front of the air conditioner. Thanks in advance,
>
>Sadler Love
>
Not on a planing hull, you don't. The drag of the thruster holes
would probably not allow it to plane! Thrusters are for DISPLACEMENT
hull.......like keel coolers.
Lemme know when you need a push. I'll bring the jetboat around and we
can use it like a tugboat on a cruise ship!
Larry.....no boating this weekend....sailing in race around islands
NEXT Saturday!!
Parade of Boats for Christmas on Dec 4th!
Joseph M Tyson
Larry KN4IM <kayenfo...@nations.net> wrote in message
news:382f8825...@corp.supernews.com...
: Not on a planing hull, you don't. The drag of the thruster holes
: would probably not allow it to plane!
Utter nonsense!
Thrusters are for DISPLACEMENT
: hull.......like keel coolers.
Wrong!
:
: Lemme know when you need a push. I'll bring the jetboat around and we
: can use it like a tugboat on a cruise ship!
Larry, if you don't have any idea what you are talking about, please refrain
from making a comment merely for making it. Bow thrusters work very nicely
on planing boats of this size class. In fact, many would consider a single
screw 28 equipped with a bow thruster easier to handle than a twin screw.
Joseph Tyson
jty...@iname.com
Bellport, Long Island
Michael Kallelis
A 290 SeaRay at our marina had one installed last year and it works fine.
As far as planing goes, that's not a problem either. The bow on the 290 is out
of the water when planing and does not interfere.
Handling a single screw 268-290 SeaRay is a chore. The thruster should help.
SCRA...@webtv.net
And the 13` Boston WHaler dingy too -- with a 75 hp MERC !
Gould 0738
>YAAA ---- & we RECOMMEND the open- array type for your backup RADAR !
>
>And the 13` Boston WHaler dingy too -- with a 75 hp MERC !
Scraabx7: If you're going to pose as such an expert, get your head out of your
pompous ass long enough to look up the correct spelling of "dinghy", 'lest the
rest of the NG be left to conclude that "dingy" may just possibly relate pretty
well to your posting.
The guy with the Sea Ray 290 asked a legitimate question. A bow thruster might
be a little bit of overkill on a boat that size,
but some people do things a lot more ridiculous than installing a bow thruster
on
a small boat. Heck, some people even make public sport of perfect strangers for
just asking a simple question.
You must have something besides criticism to contribute: What kind of boat do
you have? Where do you use it? What have you learned?
________
Chuck Gould
Float and let float.
Ron14th
hate to see a newbie ask a question and then get Flamed right out of the gate.
It tends to turn you off of the group. Keep up the good work Sir.
Happy Boating
Ron T.
SL
foot single screw solo into a slip at my Marina when the tide was running,
he'd wonder about a bow thruster too. So, thanks to all who responded in a
friendly manner. I've found a company that sells small hydraulic thrusters,
but the cost installed will be over $11,000. Probably not worth putting that
much money into my boat.
Sadler Love
Gould 0738 wrote in message
<19991124105352...@ng-da1.aol.com>...
JDavis1277
same thing at much lower cost with simple installation. They are generally
intended for use with smaller craft.
Butch
SL wrote: >Thanks, too. No offence from the knot head Scraabx7. If he had to
Infoave
current with no control. Would a stern thruster help this? Maybe it's like
having twin screws? Thanks,
Sadler
JDavis1277 wrote in message
<19991126093440...@ng-fl1.aol.com>...
JDavis1277
in the
>current with no control. Would a stern thruster help this? Maybe it's like
>having twin screws? Thanks,
>
Sadler, I believe a stern thruster could be useful for your situation. A stern
thruster is actually two thrusters, one for each side. The last one I saw was
electric and operated like a small jet drive. Only one side could be used at a
time. The skipper I observed using one while backing into a slip while a
strong current was setting him to the side used it in conjunction with his
single wheel and rudder. I would guess he practiced a lot when conditions were
less difficult.
I've also observed many professional watermen on theChesapeak Bay operating
largish single screw boats and docking in dificult conditions. These
professionals seem to be able to do it with only the help of a springline.
Certainly the price of a springline and some practice may be worth a try.
Deploy lots of fenders. :=)
Butch
john sipkens
was about 1-1.5 K that is right less than $1500.00. I saw the demo which was installed in a 24
Fiberform. did a good job. If someone is interested I can trace him down. He is a retired Boeing
engineer and a Boat surveyor
--
SFC John Sipkens,REHS
US Army Retired
JDavis1277 <jdavi...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19991127100236...@ng-da1.aol.com...
SL
circumstances. When I boat with my boating buddies, we have no problem using
a springline and it's a cinch. Here's my usual scenario though: I am
piloting with my wife and two year old aboard coming in to my own or
visiting a distant marina. The current is running and the marina is crowded
with only my slip open and the dock hands are all busy with other duties. My
wife is none too coordinated and somewhat skittish. A springline in that
situation is pretty tough to set.
My dream is to be able to nail it backing into the slip just like the big
boys with twins. The stern thrusters sound pretty interesting. Found a
pretty good site for hydraulic ones: http://dickson-thruster.com/
Sadler
JDavis1277 wrote in message
<19991127100236...@ng-da1.aol.com>...
MLopata
>My dream is to be able to nail it backing into the slip just like the big
>boys with twins.
Backing in a single-screw vessel (like a large sailboat) is much easier if you:
1) try to visualize the direction of the water flowing across the rudder and
compensate in your steering corrections; and 2) if you know which direction
your stern "walks" when the prop is turning. Most boats (of the size we would
be dealing with in a newsgroup) walk their stern to port when operating astern
propulsion (backing down). This will cause the stern to move to port when the
operator believes he or she is backing straight down - the higher the torque in
relation to boat speed, the greater the offset. If you go out and practice very
slow maneuvering where you have visual reference to shore, and you can tell how
the boat responds to different control commands, you may find that you can make
any reasonably sound small boat respond like it had thrusters.
... standing ready for the rebuttal,
- Marc
Cbdonospam
>boys with twins.
There are times when backing in is just plain difficult. Watched a 45' or so
sedan express trying to back in with a 15-knot or so breeze coming over the
starboard bow as he would lie once moored starboard side to the finger pier.
He wound up significantly sideways, and had to learn on the spot how to use an
after quarter spring to bring the boat alongside -- which, I suspect, was a
betrayal of the incomplete knowledge base that let him get into the spot in the
first place, even with a thruster.
Personally, I've never found a boat under 35 or so, other than a heavy
full-displacement type, that will stay put well enough to dock very elegantly
in non-
calm conditions. The real secret the big boys have (and I know from having run
them) is mass and draft; a 43 Hatteras doesn't move until you tell it to, at
least in comparison with a 27' Sea Ray!
Craig
JDavis1277
Also, I've found that the more cautiously and slowly you back into a slip the
more affected you are by windage and current. Makes sense, no?
The professionals I watched seemed to virtually zoom back into the slip and
shift into forward barely in enough time to stop rearward motion. Awesome to
watch these guys make the boat do anything they want!
IMO, hesitation is not useful when manuvering.
Butch
Marc wrote: >Backing in a single-screw vessel (like a large sailboat) is much
Gould 0738
discussion about "backing" into a slip.
Unless it is absolutely critical that the vessel be backed in, don't do it.
We must rely on the ability to steer with the stern on a single screw boat. To
my way of thinking, when the wind is acting up or there's a strong current (and
when are the conditons ever else when docking?) that last thing I really want
to do is to reduce my ability to steer the boat by inserting the stern between
a finger pier and a neighboring vessel. Once in that position, it is difficult
to recover should the wind or the current cause the bow to fall off.
As for somebody's observation that professionals "zoom" into a slip in reverse
and engage just enough forward to avoid slamming into the dock? May my boat and
I be saved from such "professionals".
Not using enough power in certain situations can be a mistake, true. I've had
to bring the bow through some pretty cranky breezes when close quarter
manuervering and there is little substitute for a generous use of the throttle
in such situations. In all but the most ridiculously extreme situations,
though, having to gun the engines and enter a slip at high speed is most likely
the result of poor planning.
My motto is: "Dock with your brain, but execute with the rudder and prop."
I wouldn't be surprised to discover that the percentage of single screw boaters
who
are absolutely convinced they "must have" a bow thruster is pretty high in the
first year of single screw ownership, but that the percentage drops off with
time and experience. When I dock a boat with a bow thruster, I usually don't
even use it. Not that I am "super docker", (I'm probably about average), but
it's just one more thing to think about and unless one has practiced a bit with
a particular installation, it's not as quickly predictable as prop thrust and
rudder response.
Michael Kallelis
power strategy". Not to take the advice too literally I am sure the author was
trying to say that being light on the throttles can be a mistake -- at times.
Speaking from my own single screw experiences (1985 268 SeaRay and 1996 250
SeaRay) with a two year old and wife aboard, take it slow, slow, slow. The
worse thing that can happen is you'll need to fend off another boat.
I was lucky since my wife learned to drive the boat as well (OK, at times even
better) than myself.
There seems to be some boating machismo about backing a boat into a slip. Why?
Just drive in bow first on those difficult days (which will be tricky enough in
a wind and current).
Now with a twin screw boat, my wife and I are learning all over again. Contrary
to popular dockside story telling, a twin screw is not as easy to handle as I
thought. Indeed, we were so comfortable with our single screw 25 footer that we
miss it dearly when docking. Determined as ever, we'll get it down.
The other thing that helped us was buying one of those wheels that attach to the
corner of the finger dock. Inevitably, you'll need it and can gently bump your
way in during those tough days.
SL wrote:
> You're right Butch, a springline is really the way to go under some
> circumstances. When I boat with my boating buddies, we have no problem using
> a springline and it's a cinch. Here's my usual scenario though: I am
> piloting with my wife and two year old aboard coming in to my own or
> visiting a distant marina. The current is running and the marina is crowded
> with only my slip open and the dock hands are all busy with other duties. My
> wife is none too coordinated and somewhat skittish. A springline in that
> situation is pretty tough to set.
>
> My dream is to be able to nail it backing into the slip just like the big
SCRA...@webtv.net